#134 The OnlyFans Myth: Why Only a Few Make Fortunes While Most Fail

0 (0s): How do you feel when you see creators that go out there and they're like, I made a million dollars in an hour, or I'm making 350 KA month. And they're like really braggadocious about these numbers and they're not giving any context to 1 (14s): It. I had somebody the other day create an OnlyFans account and say, they were like, where's the money at? I said, well where's your fan base at? Did you 0 (22s): Know that there are 500 creators or less that are making six figures a month? 1 (27s): I don't know anyone without a fan base that's making that. It's actually impossible. 0 (31s): I just, I didn't wanna be beholden to a clock or a boss and that felt suffocating. We're 1 (37s): Spending little to nothing to take a selfie, but the revenue we make from it is so high 0 (42s): That 1 (43s): Why would I ever end a business model that is this. Perfect. 0 (55s): Thank you for coming on the podcast. I'm 1 (58s): So excited to be here. 0 (59s): Me too. I, I've wanted to have creators on for a long time, but when I first started this, I felt like I wasn't allowed to in a weird way because I was trying to like prove something. Like prove that I'm able to do other things and take my clothes off. And for some reason I think once you make a decision to make any content that's sensual or sexual, even if it's not explicit that you don't have anything else to offer anymore people, nobody 1 (1m 23s): Can take you seriously doing anything else. Right. Which is 0 (1m 25s): So crazy because we're all of these different parts and that's a part of most people if we're being honest about it. But if it's something about like showcasing it or monetizing it, that makes it such a no-no. So I feel like I'm in this place now where I can actually just like lean into the whole spectrum of who I'm, who I am. Yeah. And like who I wanna talk to. 1 (1m 42s): So have you ever had any other creators on 0 (1m 44s): In the very, very beginning and that was comfort zone and the episodes did really well. But then I felt like I was getting a lot of pushback, like not taken seriously and if I wanted to have someone that was a neuroscientist on it kind of Right. Made that more 1 (1m 58s): Difficult. You know what's funny is anytime I post anything sexual or sensual, the comments, they love it. Everyone's such a fan, we love this. But as soon as I talk and have an opinion about anything, immediately you're wrong. I'm trying to prove you wrong. So many hate comments. So people hate when somebody that is used to posting aesthetics and sexual content have a voice about anything. 0 (2m 23s): Why is that 1 (2m 24s): They, they can't take us seriously or people in this space. Seriously. For what reason? 0 (2m 31s): I don't know. 'cause it's athletes I feel like are the same way in a lot of even mainstream actors. Like if they get political or share an opinion on something, it's immediately like shut up and dribble. Yeah. And someone in one of my comments even recently who was like, what would the equivalent be of shut up and dribble to her? Yeah. And like I've been doing the podcast for a really long time. And also I think when it comes to that kind of content, it's like such a small part of who you are. So like of you think that's all I do all day. Right. That's like the only thing I do all day. That makes absolutely no sense. 1 (3m 0s): I think people that are super opinionated about that, it's a problem they have within their themselves that they can't accept it. So I try not to dig too deep into why can't this person take me seriously? 'cause I know it has nothing to do with me and everything to do with them. So why waste my energy in my bandwidth trying to figure them out? It's their problem to solve within themselves. 0 (3m 24s): No, I totally agree. Do you feel like when you meet people, are you upfront with what you do or do you kind of dance around 1 (3m 31s): It? Absolutely. I have no shame. I feel so proud of how much success that I have created alone on my own. I just walk around with a sense of pride, to be honest with you. And I think the more pride you carry with what you do, the less judgmental people are towards you. Versus if you walked around kind of shy and oh well I I do do this on, on the side. If you have that demeanor about you mm. People are more likely to say, oh, she's uncomfortable with it. Like, like Then why are you doing it? So then 0 (4m 3s): I should be uncomfortable 'cause she's uncomfortable. Exactly. 1 (4m 5s): So I walk around just so happy, proud, confident, and people respect me and take me seriously. And I think because it is a business and I do take it serious, I I I love it. 0 (4m 19s): I always think it's funny when people challenge that and they say it's not a business or you are. 1 (4m 23s): I love that challenge. 0 (4m 24s): I'm like, if you knew the actual numbers and how hard it is to be successful and how hard it is to have a brand that's like sustainable Yeah. Then you would take it a lot more seriously. Yeah. And this kind of piggybacks onto one of the questions I wanted to ask. How do you feel when you see creators that go out there and they're like, I made a million dollars in an hour. Or I'm, I'm making 350 KA month. And they're like really braggadocious about these numbers and they're not giving any context to it. They're like, this is just what's on OnlyFans. 1 (4m 56s): I feel like my success has come from staying in my lane and not paying attention to what anyone else does. I think if you pay attention to what other people do and say you're not being authentic to yourself and your brand. So when somebody speaks like that, they could be telling the truth because I know what people are capable of and I've seen other people's numbers so I don't necessarily think that they're lying. I just know what I'm capable of. So I try not to put myself in a position of oh, why am I not achieving that also? But I also think it gives some people a lot of false hope. I had somebody the other day create an OnlyFans account and say, what do I do now? 1 (5m 37s): And I said, well, they were like, well where's the money at? I said, well where's your fan base at? What do you, you can't just like create an account. So a lot of work goes into it. 0 (5m 48s): Yeah. I get so frustrated because I think that the image that they're sending forward is that it's just waiting for you. You literally like create an account, right. And then buckets of money pour into it. Right. And it's not that. Yeah. And I was doing the numbers recently. Did you know that there are 500 creators or less that are making six figures a month And 1 (6m 5s): Those are and globally and those are celebrity status people with, with tens of millions of followers. Yeah. I don't know anyone without a fan base that's making that. It's actually impossible. So the, the goal should be to connect to fans, build an audience, and then share that side of you on the internet to make a living. 0 (6m 26s): Yeah. So I just wish more people were like, this is extremely rare. Like again, I don't think a lot of them are lying, but it's like this is a unicorn. Yeah. And that's great for them. But 1 (6m 37s): I feel like if I said, oh, what I do is rare, not everybody can do it. That's just as bragging. Yeah. That's just as braggadocious. 0 (6m 44s): But then you're not having someone sign up thinking that like it's immediate success overnight. Yeah. 1 (6m 49s): It's not success overnight at all. No. It took me years and it took anybody I know years or there are some people that just have that spark and they post once and they go crazy viral. Kind of like the who was the girl on Dr. Phil Bad. 0 (7m 5s): Oh my. Yeah. I mean 1 (7m 6s): Bad Bob, 0 (7m 7s): Bobby or Barbara. I don't know. Bad Barbara. 1 (7m 10s): Bad baby, 0 (7m 10s): Baby something. Yeah. Catch me outside that girl. 1 (7m 13s): Catch me outside. I mean you could be an overnight success, but you have to just have a ton of crazy views to do that. So 0 (7m 20s): Do you, in your journey of creating content and obviously really leaning into your sensuality, do you have tips for women who feel disconnected from that part of themselves? Like how to be able to have that confidence and like that kind of goddess I own this. Yeah. This space energy. Oh 1 (7m 37s): Well the first step is taking care of yourself. Like if I am, if I haven't been in the gym and I've been eating whatever I want, the last thing I wanna do is get on camera. So you have to be confident with yourself. And if I know I've done the best I can do for that day or that week and I'm feeling good, that's step one. Step two is to create something you're really interested in. So my favorite thing to do is like buy a new outfit, buy a new lingerie set that I'm really excited about. And also in like a really stunning, gorgeous, beautiful location. So you just have to like love what you're shooting. I feel like just jumping in front of a camera isn't very inspiring, you know? So that's how I am confident in front of the camera. 1 (8m 18s): I'm excited about what I'm shooting. 0 (8m 20s): How do you take that into your personal life? 1 (8m 22s): Being confident. 0 (8m 23s): Like, yeah, so if you're dating, so like if you are going out on a date and someone, and you're maybe a girl that hasn't done it in a long time or you feel like, I don't know, just like disconnected from that part of you. Like how do you bring like that confidence and like sensuality to like relationship or to dating or even to yourself? You, 1 (8m 42s): You have to for, okay. So confidence can mean a lot of different things to a lot of different people. And for me, dating sensuality is not what makes me feel confident. Mm. For me, what makes me feel really confident is my sense of humor and connecting on a conversation level. So I feel like I would have a really good date and feel really confident if I could connect with them and ha it has nothing to do with being sexual or sensual. So I think confidence means different thing to different different people. 0 (9m 14s): Have you actually been on a pet cat cab date since you posted 1 (9m 18s): That? Yes. I fell in love in the back of a petty cab. I love petty cabs. Yeah. I think dating is just, it should be fun, friendship based first. So if you're just having fun and connecting with someone on a friendship level and you're not trying to impress each other, it just, it's so free and light and you just have a good time. Right. I think you can lack confidence when you're trying to impress someone. You're stressing out to take 'em to a nice restaurant. We have to do this. It just easy breezy for me. Built confidence, you know? 0 (9m 56s): Yeah. It's a much more relaxed way to like see someone for who they are versus this facade that you're trying to do. But when I saw your petty cab thing, I was like, she's gonna a line of petty cabs waiting for her when she's done recording that. Well 1 (10m 6s): It's Austin, Texas and there's all petty cabs here. 0 (10m 9s): All petty cabs 1 (10m 10s): And they're expensive. I'm not kidding. I took a petty cab half a mile, I guess when you're pedaling it takes a while and the guy's like drenched in sweat. It is tough. It was a hundred bucks. 0 (10m 20s): Yeah. Easy. I did one in Manhattan, it was around Christmas time and the same thing. It was, I felt like a few blocks. It was just too much that I didn't wanna walk in heels. Exactly. So I was like, I'll do the petty cab. And then he's like, that'll be, I think it was like 150 bucks. I was like, this would, 1 (10m 35s): I should just caught cab 0 (10m 35s): 50 cab. Yeah. Oh my gosh. 1 (10m 37s): But you had fun though, right? I did have fun. Yeah. It was memorable. Yeah, yeah. 0 (10m 40s): Yeah. My other favorite petty cab moment was in Amsterdam and I was just baked because we went to one of, they call 'em cheese shops, right? So you go to the cheese shop and we smoked and then we, there's the petty cabs. Of course you're gonna take the petty cab. Yeah. And it was the best time. 1 (10m 55s): How can you not? It 0 (10m 55s): Was the best time. 1 (10m 56s): My best pedicab experience was Halloween night we went out and I was dressed up as an elderly woman. I had a gray wig, I had my my Goodwill church outfit on and I had my glasses and I was just, I had my pocketbook and I was in a petty cab. I whipped some cash outta my pocketbook. It was so fun. 0 (11m 16s): I loved that. I was like, I wanna steal this idea for a party that 1 (11m 18s): Is the most fun Halloween I have ever had in my life. Or if you're doing a bachelorette or a birthday party, party dress up in a group of elderly women. Yeah, women. We won $5,000 that night for the costume contest. 'cause we were like breaking it down as elderlys. It was so fun. 0 (11m 35s): It was at a club, right? Like a Yeah. Yeah. It was like very just 1 (11m 37s): Go to Goodwill, get like a a walker. I like bought a walker off of Facebook marketplace. We had canes, we won a con, we won. It was so funny. It 0 (11m 49s): Was so good. Yeah. I love that you showcase that in the content that you make. Like you may, you're not afraid to just be silly and be funny. Yeah. Like you don't put a lot of like pressure to just be like this perfect little 1 (12m 1s): Yeah. The, the content that I spend the most money on and is the most aesthetic and time consuming and the most creative actually gets, gets the least engagement because you're not connecting with fans doing that. So I try to shy away from doing too much of that even though it's so fun to create and you just get so much more engagement just being yourself. And some people probably think it's lazy 'cause I didn't spend any money on the content, on the wardrobe, on the location. You shoot a funny moment in two seconds and it kind of feels sloppy almost. But it does so well because fans can see you 0 (12m 41s): And that's the only thing that separates you from everyone else. Yeah. Do you think, so when people say that this kind of work can't be empowering or that it's a trauma response or that you're making the world a worse place? Yeah. Like what do you say to that? 1 (12m 57s): It's all situational because I do know women that do this that are completely, they have the best head on their shoulders. They're very business oriented. They have a strong work ethic. But I also know people that do this because of the way they were brought up trauma responses. So it, it depends on the person. There is no one size fits all. I personally got into this because it made me happy doing it. And the money that you can make doing it if you put the time and effort in versus, you know, I had a nine to five when I started doing this and I did this on the side and I made more money doing this on the side than I did at my nine to five that I went to college for. 1 (13m 40s): So tell me why, 0 (13m 42s): What were you doing before? 1 (13m 43s): I was a content curator for a website. Oh. So I worked on the, I was deep in those Reddit threads. 0 (13m 49s): There you go. That probably helped a ton. Yeah. And then you already, you had a, a fan base or you just were like an overnight? I 1 (13m 54s): Started with 10,000 Instagram followers. Wow. Yeah. 0 (13m 58s): That's 1 (13m 58s): Amazing. And I made $3,000 my very first month. Wow. Which is insane for only having 10,000 followers. 0 (14m 4s): Followers. 1 (14m 4s): Yeah. Yeah. 0 (14m 6s): That's very unique. 1 (14m 8s): So, but I had a really normal upbringing. Normal family went to church. I just saw this as a business. I think some people do start this because other reasons. So it just depends on the person. 0 (14m 23s): And do you find that like the people closest to you are okay with everything? Like has it caused 1 (14m 27s): I've never had anybody not be okay with it because that's awesome. Again, I walk around so confident about it and they see the freedom it's given me for my time and the freedom it's given me to help other people. Like I help friends, family, I'm generous, you know? So. 0 (14m 47s): Yeah, I think so too. I think for me, I was going to school when I kind of started getting into the space and I just, I didn't wanna be beholden until a clock or a boss and that felt suffocating. And then I also had some like health stuff come up and it caused me to miss a lot of work. Yeah. And that continued to like a really bad spiral. So I was, that's actually when I started Webcaming. 'cause I'm like, I can do this from home regardless of what my health is. 1 (15m 14s): Did it not help your mental health? It helped me to be able to be able to be productive, to make an income in the comfort of your own home without being stressed out by having to be at a nine to five when you're having health problems. 0 (15m 27s): Right. And then you're like, am I going to pay my bills this month? Yeah. That and then that stress makes you sicker. Yeah. And it's this endless cycle and then it's, it is when people are like, there's no way it's empowering. Like that's dependent on the person. Kinda like what you were saying. Yeah. It's so situational. 1 (15m 41s): Empowering can mean many different things to many different people. And for me independence is the most empowering thing. Yeah. I'm my own boss. I create my own schedule. I have days where I struggle with my physical health. It, I wouldn't be able to have a nine to five. You know? So very empowering. Do 0 (16m 2s): You think that that makes it harder to find love? So there's this narrative that like all these young people that have these OnlyFans accounts, 'cause I mean especially after Covid, I think it went from 1 million creators to 5 million creators. Yeah. So it skyrocketed. And then in, there's this narrative that they'll, they're untouchables now and they're unworthy of love and they're never gonna find anyone. Is that something that ever concerns you or are you believing that like the right person will come along? 1 (16m 32s): I think it depends on the person. Because there's so many women in this space that are in relationships. A lot of creators that I meet, they're like already married and their partner fully supports them. And I also feel like if you're dating and somebody doesn't think you're worthy of love because of what you do, then you shouldn't be dating that person to begin with. It almost like weeds out all the people that you shouldn't be around anyways. Absolutely. I don't ever wanna be with somebody that's not gonna support me because I am a very supportive partner. If, if my partner wants to go do anything, I would support it a hundred percent. So I would respect, or I would expect that in return. So I think it just weeds people out if they lack respect for what you do. 0 (17m 16s): I couldn't 1 (17m 16s): Agree. I wouldn't wanna date anyone like that. No. 0 (17m 18s): Or have those friends or Yeah. Even family members. Yeah. In my case that 1 (17m 23s): Have, yeah. Even outside of dating, just friendships and any sort of relationship. If you're gonna judge someone that aggressively, then you're not for me at all in any part of my life, you know? 0 (17m 34s): Yeah. Do you think that it's like, do you have plans to keep doing it? Do you, is there like a cutoff date? Is there do women, here's this thing is there is a creator, I think he's a former porn star, but now he's like a men's coach. I think his name's Sterling Cooper. And there was this clip around of going around and you know, I'm sure part of it is click beatty, but that women expire after 25. No, 1 (17m 58s): We just go into the mil category. 0 (17m 60s): It's like, whoa, that's really harsh. 1 (18m 2s): We go into the MILF category or the cougar category. I remember before I started this actually in college, I was really interested in finance and business and I did a lot of studying in that area. And one of the main things that they teach you is passive income. It's one of the most powerful things you can have, especially in real estate. It's how I, I do a little bit of real estate. It's passive income. This is the ultimate passive income because you, because of your ROI, your return on investment, right? Like we're spending little to nothing to take a selfie, but the revenue we make from it is so high that it, it's kind of any business owner's dream to have this sort of business model. 1 (18m 45s): So why would I ever end a business model that is this perfect with this hard high ROI? Right? So no, I'm going straight into the MILF category. 0 (18m 57s): And then after MILF or is there the guf category? Yes. Yes. 1 (19m 2s): I'm going into the guf and I already, of course me and my research, there's, there's an audience for it. I already see women doing it and they do very well. And as long as you're comfortable and happy, you know? 0 (19m 18s): Yeah. Get it cry. I, I 1 (19m 19s): Have like creators saved that are in the grandma category that I research and study what they're doing. And so I don't see any reason to not continue on. 0 (19m 31s): I love that you research everything and you've got all this data. 1 (19m 34s): I don't like wasting time but you 0 (19m 35s): Like, this is what performs 1 (19m 37s): And a lot of people, I do it because I'm, I don't consider myself an artist. I consider myself like more business minded. And so when I shoot it's what's gonna perform best, what's gonna do best? How can I spin it to where it feels like me and it's something I'm comfortable doing, but it's gonna work. Versus a lot of other creators, they just do strictly what they wanna do without any data behind it with no, no clear vision and their stuff doesn't perform well and then they end up having to quit, go get a real job or you know, it doesn't work out for them. So you kind of have to be into the numbers to be successful. No, 0 (20m 17s): I'm the opposite. So I feel like I'm like this kind of whimsy creator and I'm like, this is the vision that I have for the thing and I've done zero research if it's gonna perform or not. And what was so frustrating the other day is I posted something that was just a series of selfies. Just like lazy waiting selfies. Yeah. And then I posted this beautiful dreamy set that I really loved and the selfie had like 10 x the engagement from like the really be, 1 (20m 45s): I rest my case. 0 (20m 46s): You're 100% 1 (20m 47s): Right. I rest my case. So I would love to shoot those beautiful whimsy stunning. But is it gonna do well? It can sometimes if you figure, if you figure out why it will do well. So you just add that component into your shoot. 0 (20m 59s): Maybe I'll have to ask for some like research data driven points 1 (21m 2s): When I shoot my little beautiful, stunning little cottagey. I love it. Okay. I love it too. But there has to be a component in it, a little subtle aspect that you add into it that you know is going to make it go viral and get engagement so you can research what those little components are. So I, I never blindly shoot. 0 (21m 22s): I feel like I feel really unprepared now. Yeah. So unprepared. So would you say like, do you consider like sexual expression, sensual expression, is that a form of artwork or is there overlap where some is and some isn't? You don't think any is? It's not, you don't think 1 (21m 40s): So? Show me somebody that's making a sex tape based off a mood board that they made. 0 (21m 45s): I know people, okay, well 1 (21m 46s): That's 0 (21m 47s): Art. Yeah that's art. Yeah. Hundred percent I of people that do mood, I dunno. 1 (21m 49s): Anyone has ever done that? If you are doing that, then it's art. Yeah. Yeah. If you're creating a mood board and you're really setting a vision, it's, it's art. Right? Yeah. I personally don't know anyone that does that. And I think a lot of people can just say it's art. 'cause it's easy to say anything is art when it really isn't. What I do is not art. 0 (22m 9s): I think it is. I don't think it is. Yes. I absolutely think it is. 1 (22m 12s): Well I, so I'm very into interior design. It's really boring for the internet, so I don't really talk about it a lot. But to me that's art. Like I am putting my blood, sweat and tears in my soul into designing a space. It's design, right? So when I go to like shoot selfies, it's just such like a watered down, like thoughtless almost easy. I, I guess 'cause it's easy for me so it doesn't feel like art easy versus like interior design is very challenging and it, I really have to get my creative juices flowing versus when I shoot it, I don't think my creative juices are flowing. 'cause it's so 0 (22m 47s): Easy. That's so interesting. 'cause the outside looking in the way that you style everything, I'm, I'm, it's indisputable that it's our, I'm like that's really good. It looks beautiful 1 (22m 57s): I guess. I guess maybe I'm just really hard on myself. Yeah. That's like my toxic trait. I'm like, I like bully this shit outta myself. 0 (23m 4s): I do too. I try to be nicer. 1 (23m 6s): I'm so mean to me. 0 (23m 8s): Do you do anything to help with that or you just No. 1 (23m 10s): Do you like it works? That's what makes me good. I have to keep bullying myself in order to perform and produce. Because as soon as I'm like, oh, it's all like, if I wasn't as hard on myself, I feel like I wouldn't work as hard and I wouldn't produce content as good. Mm. 0 (23m 28s): Yeah. I tell myself the same thing. I'm like, I know there's a gentler way to do this though. 1 (23m 33s): No, I have to beat myself up. 0 (23m 35s): It's working. 1 (23m 36s): It does. It does work. 0 (23m 37s): It does. Yeah. 1 (23m 38s): I feel, I feel like our jobs are so easy. Like that's how I make it. My job is easy. A lot of people think it's hard and it, it is hard for some people, but it's easy for me. So I think that's a way of me making it harder. Only myself. 0 (23m 53s): Yeah. See I do vision boards so I try to put intention into stuff and then some of the sets I've done are, I've gone to like bigger scenes and they have like a whole thing that they want. And then Riley actually like that's what she does with all of her stuff, right? 1 (24m 8s): Yeah. Yeah. I guess it's art. 0 (24m 12s): Yeah. It depends. But that's not the same as like certain sites or certain, 'cause I see other things. I was like, oh no, that's not, oh 1 (24m 17s): That's what I'm saying. So, so, so I can find a location, find a set base my entire wardrobe off of the set and the props. You can't shoot without props. So you have all these components. Right. And I can produce a piece of content and that's art versus somebody else can just walk into a room and take a picture and say that's art. And they didn't put the work and vision behind it. So it's, it's just 0 (24m 38s): Sometimes I feel like that's what's at the met though, if we're being honest. Like if you go like there's something that someone literally just like walked out and like they painted a square on the wall and they're like, that is a masterpiece. Yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah. And we're like, we all know that that's not, I don't know why we're pretending that it is. 1 (24m 55s): I watched a YouTube video of a lady just took a mop on a canvas and sold it for who knows how much 0 (25m 2s): And then they'll justify it. It's art. It's like they'll say, oh the measurements and the mathematics and then the tone and 1 (25m 8s): Art is so ambiguous. So it's just kind of, yeah, it just depends. 0 (25m 12s): Yeah. I think it's just ma I think the main thing is it makes you feel something. Right. And even if that's just outrage, which there's plenty of that. So by that definition, I am an artist. What I always think is really interesting too is all of the people that are so quick to kind of chastise the creators and say like, what you're doing is bad. This is not good. You know, clean up your ways. And ev no one seems to watch porn. Like if you ask anyone, like no one watches porn. No one watches anything that's risque. But I was like, hmm, I'm gonna ask chat GBT how many visitors PornHub has a day. Hmm A day and it's 115 million a day. 0 (25m 53s): That is one website. So who are all these people that are not watching porn? I think 1 (25m 58s): People feel it's very important to walk around life being politically correct to avoid any sort of confrontation and to be on like the right side of an argument even though they consume things themselves. Right. Like it's bad to drink a lot, but we've all had a drink. Yeah. So like people just care to always make a good impression on other people and to always have like the best and most correct opinion. Even if they consume, we all consume it. 0 (26m 27s): Do you watch anything or 1 (26m 28s): Fast? Do you fast food, fast food's bad. Is fast food good? No. You're not gonna argue that, but have you ever had fast food? I have, yeah. 0 (26m 33s): Okay. 1 (26m 34s): For sure. So it's like we're, we all consume things that we know isn't necessarily the best, but I think things aren't the best if you over consume it. Right. Like one fast food meal, not gonna make a break. One cigarette, one porn video, not gonna kill you. If you're repeatedly consuming it to like in a, in a addictive way, then that's bad obviously. But yeah, those people that just complain and make us feel bad or anyone that consumes porn that's bad. They've consumed porn at some point in their life. So it's just hypocritical. 0 (27m 12s): Do you do anything to combat over consumption? Like with your fans or anything? Or do you not really have that issue? Like do you have anyone that maybe is like on all of the time and is asking for stuff all of the time? Yeah. And then you is like, how do you handle that? 1 (27m 31s): That's tough because I've never turned anyone down and not sold them content or not communicated with them for supporting my work. But the people that are really consuming my content to that degree, they want the companionship, which I don't have a problem giving because I know what it's like to be really lonely. And I also know what it's like to have mental health issues. So dealing with my anxiety and depression, which transformed into agoraphobia. It's a really lonely, dark place. So if somebody needs that companionship, I'm always gonna give it to them. 1 (28m 11s): So I've never really like turned anybody down. I've more so been there to help them. You know, 0 (28m 19s): That's a a really beautiful way to look at it though. Yeah. So like, if that's the way that you're approaching it, I think you can do the same thing from multiple places. Like different intentions or frequencies if you will. So if you're going to it and you're like, I'm gonna help this person with compan companionship and Right. And I'm actually helping their mental health, that's, 1 (28m 34s): You wouldn't believe people's wives have died. People have never been in a relationship in their life. I have people that have just never been in a relationship and they want to ask me how to approach a girl properly. And so that's just me like being there for them. I have turned people down for content if they're aggressive and rude and mean, I'll block you. You know? So those are the types of people that I don't engage with. The aggressive ones. 0 (29m 0s): Yeah. 1 (29m 0s): Which are plenty out there. 0 (29m 2s): Yeah. There's a lot. 1 (29m 3s): Like who hurt you? 0 (29m 6s): Somebody. Yeah. Yeah. That energy needs get channeled somewhere. Yeah. I've, I've worked with other girls where the way that they kind of saw it, one girl literally was like, I just want you to milk people dry. And I was like, whoa, that's, there are people out 1 (29m 21s): There like 0 (29m 21s): That. Yeah. That's a really aggressive way. And I, I don't know, I feel like a sense of responsibility for it. Yeah. So I would never approach anything that way. Right. And I think even it's gonna like come back and bite you in the butt. Right. Even if you wanna just look at it from a selfish standpoint. I don't think it's good. Yeah. But yeah, I think it's interesting 'cause I think a lot of people think there isn't any thought into it. It's just like we're mindless consumers and we're just trying to like take, take, take. 1 (29m 43s): Yeah. There's always a person on the other end. And I remember the first time it hit me, I was going back and forth with a guy and he requested some content and I sold him whatever he wanted and he in return said, thank you so much. His wife had just passed away. Mm. And he like thanked me for like helping him like have someone. And I thought, I never thought of it that way, that I'm like actually helping someone go through something and knowing that it's a human on the other end versus like a robot, you know? Yeah. I 0 (30m 16s): Was on this podcast recently and the guy was like, do you think that you've helped more marriages or hurt more marriages? And I was like, there, I don't have any data to give you an an honest answer. But what I do know is that for like the decade plus that I've been doing this, I 1000% have worked with men, with husbands and wives, a lot of guys that get deployed and they're like, well I don't know how to stay connected and giving like them exercises to do together and content to watch together. Right. Yeah. And making them something like for them to enjoy and like sending them a fleshlight while they're deployed. Like I for sure helped some people. I'm not 1 (30m 54s): Like, but it's like how people think that it's your responsibility Yes. To, to help someone else's marriage. Or like if someone's marriage falls apart because they're on OnlyFans, like you are responsible, it's, you don't have the commitment to the other person. So I hate when people ask stuff like that. They're just trying to stir up, making you feel bad about yourself for being in this line of work. And that's just somebody that I don't converse with. 0 (31m 21s): Yeah. And just passing the responsibility off. Yeah. To where it doesn't belong. 1 (31m 24s): Right. So like if somebody's relationship fails it's easier to point the finger at, oh well they were on OnlyFans consuming someone else's content versus oh was maybe I not a good enough partner that led them to cross my boundary that I clearly set and didn't want them to be on OnlyFans. Have you even set that boundary in a relationship? You know, 0 (31m 44s): Do you think that's a reasonable one? 1 (31m 45s): Yeah, I think every relationship can have B healthy boundaries. And if I was in a relationship and I didn't want my partner consuming other people's content, if I vocalize that and he crossed that boundary, then of course you know, but you just have to vocalize it upfront. I would never set that boundary 'cause I'm in this line of work and I think it's healthy and normal. But I think if it was against someone's morals then you have to respect that if you're with them 0 (32m 13s): And just get it out upfront. 1 (32m 14s): Upfront. Yeah. You can't get into a relationship wanting to change someone. 0 (32m 18s): So do you think, I feel like men think women like you don't exist. Like you're kind of like, I know Bigfoot, so you're like I wouldn't set that boundary 'cause I think it's healthy and normal. Yeah. And like I would respect honesty because to me all these things are okay. Totally agree 100% in alignment, but they're like, no one is like that. And I'm like, I've met so many women that are like that. So if you try just being honest upfront, you'll be surprised. 1 (32m 42s): You have to communicate up front. Yeah. Yeah. But I don't know, I don't know very many women that are 0 (32m 49s): Okay with it that, 1 (32m 49s): Yeah. I think because even before OnlyFans I did actual modeling for agencies and it was a lot of being in front of the camera and lingerie and bikinis. And so I've kind of always been in this line of work, so I don't know anything different. But I think women that are, if they work in insurance or if they work in healthcare like, and they're just not familiar with this work at all, it can be very intimidating and they wouldn't want their man consuming any of it. 'cause it just feels so crazy to them 0 (33m 24s): Because they think it's like a competition immediately. Yeah. Or the one thing I see a lot is if someone's watching someone or is liking someone on Instagram and it looks totally different than their partner, then they automatically take it personally. Like, well they're not attracted to me. And I'm like, it's the furthest thing from the truth. It's the opposite actually. Like men see a buffet of things that they find beautiful. Yeah. And it doesn't make anything less desirable. 1 (33m 47s): I think for any relationship to work, each partner has to just be fully confident within themselves. If I had a partner liking another girl's picture on Instagram, I don't care. I could care less like away, comment away, what do I care? I'm sorry. Right. But, but I feel like most women would care a lot. I don't care. I dunno. Yeah. 'cause I'm just, I would never be with a partner that wouldn't make me feel secure. So I think like if my partner wasn't responding to text messages or wasn't picking up the phone or wouldn't tell me where they were going, then it would cause like a red flag to raise. And then I would look into all the likes. 1 (34m 29s): But I would never be with a partner like that to begin with. If my partner is telling me where they're going, if they're answering my phone calls, like, then there's the trust. So what do I care what you're doing on social media? 0 (34m 43s): Yeah. I think you have to look at the whole picture. So it's all of the whole picture, it's all of the evidence. Are they the, is this person showing you any signs that they aren't invested in that they're going to leave? And if all of that's untrue, then you kind of have like this saboteur in your head that's just making you get anxiety for no reason. Exactly. And all the other of the, the other stuff is just kind of fluff. And then I feel like that makes your relationship so fragile too. Because if it takes one double tap of a picture, just erupt the relationship, 1 (35m 10s): Leave them you're in the wrong relationships are not that much work. That's one of my problems with society is everybody preach preaches that marriages are like tough and there's so much work and you have to put so much effort in and it's like actually you don't, like, there's a lot of easy, healthy relationships that you can just vibe with naturally. And if your relationship takes that much work and your nervous system is that triggered, you're with the wrong person. Mm. Like you don't have to be in fight or flight to be in a relationship. 0 (35m 39s): Yeah. And I think a lot of people, that's just their regular state, so, 1 (35m 42s): But they stay in it. Yeah. Because society says marriage is hard. No it's not. It's not. 0 (35m 49s): So do you believe a lot in thoughts become things so Oh yeah. Your mental outlook on things or perspective is gonna kind of create your reality. 1 (35m 57s): Definitely. Yeah. And I've done so much research on this because of my anxiety. Thoughts become things, anxiety is essentially a worry or a fear that's not even true yet. Right. So if I have all these thoughts and worries and fears, I can quite literally make them true. Because your brain will start to look for coincidences. So there's small coincidences that happen in life that will validate your brain is looking for validation. So thoughts become things are very real. 0 (36m 29s): Yeah, very real. I think so too. Yeah. I have this one friend and we have this other podcast together and he's the opposite. He thinks I'm just like this really woowoo witch. And I'm like, there is actually no, a lot of evidence to this, to this work. And the way that you, your mental outlook on life and how that affects you. Well 1 (36m 44s): It does. You study the brain a lot? 0 (36m 45s): No, definitely not. 1 (36m 46s): Oh, okay. 0 (36m 47s): Yeah, definitely not. Yeah, there's this, have you ever seen Inside Out it's a kid's like Pixar thing, but they just came out with Inside Out too. And basically what it is, it's this dashboard in your brain. Yes. Yes. Have you seen it? Have you seen the new one? No. So the character's going through puberty, so they just demolish the brain and in comes all of these new emotions and one of them is anxiety. And it's so funny the way that anxiety operates the brain. Like she immediately bottles up all of the other emotions and puts them into the subconscious and she's like, I'm here to worry about things that haven't happened yet. Yeah. And she has like all of these calculations of possibilities. But 1 (37m 24s): If you're worried about things that happen happened yet, or if you're worried or if you're excited about something, it's the, it goes both ways. So anxiety is worrying about things that haven't happened yet. But the opposite flip side is if you're in a good mood and you're excited about just life and in general and in a good mood, then you'll start to notice good things that happen and all of a sudden you had a good day. But because that's what you're paying attention to. So your brain is constantly looking for validation. Yeah. 0 (37m 53s): So do you do intentions in the morning or if you catch yourself in a negative loop, do you have an exercise that you do? 1 (37m 59s): I don't have an exercise that I do. I just, it, it's really hard because catching your brain throughout the day is a lot of work. But if I notice I'm in a negative loop, I try to focus on very small positive things. The sun, the clouds, nature, grass, my dogs coffee, my favorite treat. I will take the time to really enjoy that very small thing. And next thing you know, you're focusing on good things. It's really hard though 'cause if you're in a bad mood, you don't give a shit about the the sun. You know? So it's like, it sounds easy but it's really tough. And is that similar to how you got over the agoraphobia? 1 (38m 41s): Who said I'm over the agoraphobia? Well, you're here. You're here. The Lexapro. The Lexapro helped me over the, the agoraphobia. Mm. I'm big on medication. Sometimes your brain having a bad experience over and over again. Exposure therapy in a negative way can really generate a strong belief that you can't do something and it is really hard to get out of. So for me, Lexapro helped build confidence to do things that I was afraid of very slowly with a good experience. So I, I don't know why people have a problem with like medication because some people really need it. 1 (39m 28s): Mm. And it quite literally saved and changed my life. And I still struggle to day to day, but not to the extreme of the agoraphobia once was, I still don't drive. I haven't driven a car since 2014. Oh wow. Yeah. I can't drive. I wish I didn't have to drive though. It's like you don't have to. Yeah. That seems, that seems like a perk. Yeah. That that's a, that's what you know, it's like nice to be a passenger princess. But also the lack of independence. It gives me, weighs on me every day. I feel guilty about it. I feel like a burden. So it's something I want to get over, which I'm working on. 1 (40m 10s): Yeah. I had my blood work done actually. And all these years I thought I was struggling with anxiety. This is recent blood work by the way. And my blood work came back. They, my cortisol perfect anxiety, stress response response. Perfect. gaba nothing I have, my body doesn't produce GABA at all. Nor does it produce serotonin, which the combination can cause extreme anxiety. So here I am treating anxiety when I should all these years have been treating my GABA and lack of serotonin. So I got GABA prescription, which by the way, my psychiatrist says that all GABA on the market supplement form has no GABA in it at all. 1 (40m 53s): No way. Your body just the, what is it? It processes it so fast that it's, it doesn't get absorbed. No. Okay. That was a waste of money. So don't, don't go buy GABA supplements. You want an actual GABA prescription. Mm. And I've been taking it for literally a week and I feel I have energy, which I've never had before 'cause I don't have any GABA or serotonin in my body and I feel less panic and less stress. So the plan is to try to start driving with GABA because I've got my blood work done. So I highly recommend like again the research, the data, like don't just guess talk therapy is guessing in my opinion. How do you, I'm not a fan of talk therapy. How do you feel today? Yeah. 1 (41m 33s): Let's dig deeper into your feelings. Let's, 0 (41m 35s): Let's keep gripping open that wound. 1 (41m 37s): Yeah, let's rip it open and rip it open. Yeah, no, go, go go get your blood work done and go seek psychiatric help. And that has helped me more than anything because the goal for everybody is just to feel normal, right? 0 (41m 51s): Yeah. And I think some people don't know what that is because their normal is anxiety ridden or depressed Yeah. Or whatever the thing might be. Yeah. Super aggressive. So their normal is what they always like again, try to keep recreating because you're looking for patterns of recognition. Yeah. To your nervous system is like, oh this is where I'm at home. 1 (42m 9s): Some people's nervous system is regulated when it's at more of a state of aggression or panic. 'cause that's all they know. My psychiatrist calls it finding comfort and discomfort. They're comfortable when they're, when they're uncomfortable. Perfect example is my agoraphobia. Like I'm uncomfortable in my house all day with the fear of leaving the house, but I'm more comfortable being in the house. It's being comfort in your discomfort, which is very unhealthy. And I think people don't realize that they struggle with that. 0 (42m 42s): Yeah. I think when it comes to the medication, I think a lot of the pushback is the over-prescribing of it for a lot of people. 1 (42m 50s): Right. But I think that's like painkillers, it's everything. 0 (42m 53s): Yeah. No, 1 (42m 54s): Everything. Anything that doesn't make you feel normal like Adderall. Like that doesn't that jazzes people up, you know, 0 (42m 60s): Well it's an an amphetamine and we're giving that to children, you know? Right. 1 (43m 3s): Yeah. Right. So I think it depends on the medication again. Right? Yeah. So if the goal is to feel normal, you need to take what will make you feel normal. If Vyvanse, Adderall, opioids, if they don't make you feel normal, then that's not the point. You shouldn't be taking it, you know? 0 (43m 22s): Yeah. I just wish that it was like more like when you go into the doctor's office, it was like a, it's more personalized. Like I think a lot of times, at least in my experience, it's like, here's a prescription. Right. And they're not actually inquiring about anything. It's just like the quick fix that they're, and they're like, we'll just see how this works. I go, I don't know that that's necessarily what I wanna do. Yeah. 1 (43m 42s): I, I've had such a long journey and I learned unfortunately even like the best doctors that want to help you, you as an individual still have to do your own research. I had to push and say I want this exact blood work done and, and I want this saliva test done and I want this DNA test done and you have to do it yourself. You know. So with 0 (44m 5s): The gaba, does that automatically start increasing your serotonin or are you doing something else for the serotonin? 1 (44m 9s): Lexapro increases your serotonin. Okay. And so I can tell a huge difference in serotonin levels when I'm not on it. I was off Lexapro for two years. I took zero medication for two years. 0 (44m 24s): And then what made you go back on it? 1 (44m 26s): The amount of panic that I would feel just simply physically, my body just vibrates and trembles and I feel dizzy and I lose my vision, which is why I don't like driving. Yeah. Because if you're driving and your vision starts, you get tunnel vision and everything gets blurry, you just can't see what you're doing. So for me, I went back on medication because the physical symptoms, I couldn't even like go on a walk without feeling like I could just topple over my equilibrium was off. Yeah. And that's anxiety. Anxiety is so powerful, you know, could cause the craziest physical symptoms. Are 0 (45m 6s): You into any eastern work or any of the work that's with nerve nervous system? 1 (45m 10s): Yeah, I, my, and that's why I preach medication is because sometimes it's so strong and my negative experiences were so repeated that even western medicine, acupuncture, hypnosis, I've worked with two different mat naturopathic doctors and nothing helped because it was just that bad for me. So I, I think you could go that route if it was a very faint problem that just kind of arose every once in a while. But if it's absolutely ruining your life, something 0 (45m 50s): Need, they need something quicker, 1 (45m 51s): A little stronger. Yeah. Yeah. 0 (45m 53s): Have you ever considered or worked with psychedelics for any of that? Because what, with the way that you're talking about like the neuro pathways and how they get deeper and just more reinforced the more that you're, and this is both positive and negative. 1 (46m 4s): I know I just unfortunately know somebody that did psychedelics and they've never been the same since. And so I think just, I don't like dabbling in anything that could potentially have a negative outcome. I try to only do super safe methods. So what I did was neurofeedback. Okay, that's great. Which is where they kind of hook your brain up to some wires in a screen and they retrain your, they can read your brain waves and they retrain it that way. So I did neurofeedback work for about a year and a half. Yeah. And I didn't feel any different, unfortunately. 0 (46m 37s): So here's the thing with that. And there's this guy, he invented it. He, did you go to bio cyber or not? 1 (46m 44s): No, I went to the guy that invented it. 0 (46m 47s): No, he stole it all. Who? There's who, who did you go to 1 (46m 51s): Guys? How many, how many people think they invented it? This, by 0 (46m 53s): The way? No, no. I know that. The 100%. This guy 100% did his stuff got stolen by s stole it. He got sued for millions and millions and millions of dollars. And this guy that trained him did Biocybernaut. And he's got the place in like Arizona, Vancouver, Germany. But yeah, took everything from this dude. 1 (47m 14s): The doctor I went to is Dr. Kaiser in California and he developed his version of it because his son was born autistic. Mm. And he wanted to see if he could help people with that. And so he developed his version of it and he can now, if you catch it young enough, can no way fix children with autism. Whoa. And I hate using the word fix because, 0 (47m 39s): But it is because it's, it is a disorder I think. Like, yeah. So many people focus on like, oh, is that gonna hurt someone's feelings? So it's like, no, you wanna know, I hate being, 1 (47m 45s): We need to stop trying to be politically correct you guys. It's causing people to not be able to like, speak their truth and speak their mind. And this cancel, cul, cancel culture stuff is just too crazy. Like that's a whole nother topic. But yeah, it, it didn't, it didn't work for me, but it, it gave me light at the end of the tunnel. 0 (48m 4s): Think you saw it. 1 (48m 5s): No, it, it made me feel confident enough to tr try to drive, to try to do things on my own. Even though it didn't ultimately fix, but it did give me a little like boost of confidence. But it was very expensive and it didn't work for me. Yeah. 0 (48m 23s): I would try. So I would have to look at like dates and stuff. So this guy, Dr. Hart is, he claims that he did it and he's, I don't know how old he is 'cause he's like one of those, it's ambiguous. But the way that he describes it is that a lot of it, he calls it treatment resistant chlamydia, but what you're doing for your brain. So if you're doing biofeedback and it's anything less than like a very, and he owns the patents on all of this. So no one can use like these frequencies if it's not like the exact frequency and done with the right feedback, that it actually kind of makes it harder for your brain and you're making it harder to create new pathways and change. So it might work for a little bit, but it actually makes things worse. 0 (49m 5s): So I don't know. And also like he had that competitor that like took everything and they're doing it with like the wrong frequencies and he's just like, don't, you're better off not doing it than doing 1 (49m 15s): It. Yeah. So my doctor said he was like, there's a lot of people out there doing neurofeedback that don't know what they're doing. Yeah. And you know, it's a waste of your money. So I didn't, it was an adventure. It was a fun activity. Very expensive activity. Very, 0 (49m 30s): Very expensive. Yeah. Mine when I did it, I think it changed my life, but I, it was seven days and each day was like 16 hours. I was exhausted. You're in this black box. Yes. And you don't see daylight. Yeah. 1 (49m 43s): So that's an intensive session. I did. I went every single week for four hours a week for two years every week. That's committed. So it's a lot. Yeah. Yeah. 0 (49m 55s): But I like that you're not into the PC stuff because it's like you focus on renaming all of these things to like make it sound nicer but you're not actually solving any problems. So like one of the things that they've done and I only notice 'cause driving here, there's like so many homeless people under the underpasses now and I feel like every time I come to Austin it's a little bit more, but now you have to say like the unhoused. And I'm like, do you think that that's making them their situation better? Yeah. Like you're just putting this energy on something that's like not actually solving any problems. Right. So you're not virtuous. You wanna look like you're vir virtuous. Yeah. And when was the last time you volunteered or donated? Like please be quiet. Right, 1 (50m 31s): Right. Yeah. Yeah. 0 (50m 33s): Oh this was a fun one. Why is no one having sex anymore? So in the US 20 to 30% of people are sexless. And in Japan, 47% 1 (50m 46s): It's 'cause he mental don't know how to turn us on anymore. You think 0 (50m 48s): That's what it is? 1 (50m 48s): They're crashing and burning our estrogen levels 'cause we're so turned off and when you have no estrogen in your body, your vagina is dry as shit and we just don't wanna do it anymore. I had a phase where I had zero str sex drive and I'm like, what's going on? It was very bad. And it turns out my body had zero. Estrogen it in it. Zero estrogen. Zero. 0 (51m 15s): How'd you mitigate that lifestyle? Yeah, 1 (51m 21s): I was 0 (51m 21s): Stressed foods. I 1 (51m 22s): Was, I was stressed. Stressed. It was during a move across the country and I lost my period for a whole year. Whoa. And I don't know if you could tell, but like even my content, some of my pictures, I was like rail thin and it was 'cause I had no estrogen in my body. I was just like sick, to be honest with you. But that was a joke. Men need to have worked harder at turning us on. That's why people aren't having sex anymore. No, people are on their phones too much. It, it's causing us not to connect. And when we do finally connect with someone, we're so used to swipe, swipe, swipe, instant gratification, what's next? What's next? That we're doing it with people. Mm. It's like you'll meet a guy, Hey, how are you? 1 (52m 4s): What do you do? Okay, next. It's like there is no taking the time to like generate a relationship because you actually put effort into like getting to know someone. And that's when you're having the best sex is when you're really connected to someone and nobody's connected anymore. So I believe this, those stats of nobody's having sex is because we're all like lonely scrolling our phones. 0 (52m 30s): In a weird way too. I find that it's the easiest, most satisfying way to get a quick hit of feel good hormones. Yes. So then you're like, well, now I'm depleted and this other thing seems like it's more boring or it's not gonna be as pleasurable as your phone. It will be. It will be. But it just takes longer. 1 (52m 48s): It just takes longer to hit. I, I have days where I don't do any doom scrolling. My, what is it? The, the amount of time I sweat on my, my screen time. My screen time on my phone. Typically a day is about eight to nine hours, which is very bad. And I notice that I feel dead inside when I do that. So I'll have days where my max that I'm allowed on my phone, the lowest I've ever gotten it is three hours. And I try to do that as much as possible. And I feel so much more connected to just like the world. It's insane. Yeah. 0 (53m 24s): Eight is a lot. I, my typical is three to four. I know. And everyone always yells at me, so I never respond to anything. But I'm like, I'm just not on my phone. I can't do it because my, my threshold is much lower for what you're describing. If I, even sometimes when I get to three hours, I get that really numb feeling. Yes. And my eye, like I feel like this weird pain. Yes. And nothing is as enjoyable for me, 1 (53m 47s): But people don't notice it. 0 (53m 49s): I do. And it feels awful. 1 (53m 51s): It's took me years to notice like, oh, that's why I feel like shit. So I think there's a lot of people doing a lot of scrolling. They have bad relationships. They don't like their jobs. They're not connected to themselves. They don't realize these things and it's because they're on their phone. So if anybody feels numb, step number one, get off your phone. And it's really hard because I noticed the days that I don't, it's like, I wanna just do this. I'm like reaching, 0 (54m 15s): Have you seen that video? There's this little kid and he's half asleep kind of having a little tantrum, but like in a weird nap place and he's in his sleep scrolling. I've done that and I'm like, oh 1 (54m 26s): No, I've woken up to this. 0 (54m 28s): Oh no, 1 (54m 29s): I, I do this. I know. 0 (54m 33s): Yeah. That's not good. It's too 1 (54m 35s): Bad. Yeah. Yeah. But I enjoy being off my phone. The point is to do something, you're like, I love being at the park. So I'm off my phone. If I go to the park with my dogs, I'm off the phone. My phone if I'm like on the trail walking my dogs. So it's hard to be off your phone if you're just still gonna sit on your couch. The point is to like get up and 0 (54m 53s): Do something. 1 (54m 54s): Yeah. 0 (54m 55s): Yeah. That's a good, that's good advice. 1 (54m 57s): Get up and go have sex, get off your 0 (54m 58s): Phone. Right. And foreplay everybody. And that starts beyond the bedroom, which I've said before. Yes. But it is so true. It's like it 1 (55m 5s): Is Unload the 0 (55m 6s): Dishwasher. Baby vacuum. Yes. Slap her butt when you walk by. Yeah. Yeah. Some women hate that. I like it. 1 (55m 13s): Go run errands. Yeah. Do my errands. Do you have fold my laundry? 0 (55m 17s): Do you have, so is your love language acts of service? Sounds 1 (55m 20s): Like it. My love language is actually quality time. Okay. I love like sitting down and like playing a card game. I feel so like I love that I just get like so excited. I'm like, Ooh. Or like playing dominoes or just like dumb, like little things like that. Or like if I'm on a long car ride, I'll pull up questions on my phone and like, I even like pull up conversation starters even though they're dumb questions that you probably already know about your partner. I just love quality time. And quality time to me is not running errands together. It's not like doing tasks together. It's actually paying attention to each other and connecting. That's my love language. 0 (55m 57s): Do you have a favorite like prompt question or app that you use? Like I know there's Esther per has one. That's where, where do we begin? 1 (56m 5s): I 0 (56m 5s): Just Google. Oh, you just Google questions. I 1 (56m 7s): Just Google. And you can Google topics too, like best conversations, starters to deepen a relationship or you know, so you can kind of gauge the topic that way. 0 (56m 17s): One question someone submitted, they wanna know if you've ever been in a long distance relationship and if you have any advice. 1 (56m 25s): Yeah, I think if you enjoy being cheated on, you should definitely try a long distance relationship. You should. It's so fun. Love a long distance relationship. Yeah. I was in a long distance relationship once and guess where he lived? Las Vegas. Ooh, okay. So there is no telling how many women he railed through while I wasn't in town. But that lasted a year. But the trick was I didn't take it seriously. Like I was young in college. I knew I wasn't gonna marry this guy, but we were committed to each other. But I think when you're young and you're dating, the best advice I can give is to like, use it as practice. 1 (57m 5s): You're not gonna marry this person. That's the best way not to get a broken heart. Figure out what you like about that person knowing you're not gonna marry them so you can take it into the next relationship as you mature and grow. So when you're older, you can get married. So a long distance relationship, especially like when you're in college and you're younger, like it's just supposed to be fun. And if they cheat on you, you're supposed to say, oh, I knew that was gonna happen. So 0 (57m 33s): Accurate. I think that advice is great. I, that is similar advice I'd give my younger self too, is that you shouldn't take the dating so seriously when you're young because it's devastating. You have all your hormones. I've never, 1 (57m 43s): I've never had a broken heart. 0 (57m 44s): Really? Never. Oh, I've had so many. 1 (57m 46s): I've never, because I've never let myself, I've, I've been completely obsessed with guys before. Like I've literally loved guys before, but I just knew that like, we're too young to like really marry each other. So why put myself into a position of like really thinking it's gonna work out so young. When I was younger, I always went into relationships knowing they wouldn't work out, which allowed me to just have the most fun ever. 0 (58m 14s): Amazing. I had the 1 (58m 15s): Most fun. What was that? And I, I never had a broken heart because there was nothing to end because it was never a relationship. It would just kind of like fizzle or you would move away or grow apart and that was fine. You just had fun. And I'm on good terms with all of my exes. Whoa. Yeah. 0 (58m 32s): So is that something that your mom taught you as a young, that's just who you came to? The world 1 (58m 37s): That I just, that you can't, I don't think you can really teach that. I think I was so scared of being disappointed that I naturally didn't put myself into a position that would get me disappointed. That maybe that's like a trauma trigger response of mine as being disappointed. So I avoided disappointment by just focusing on having fun. 0 (58m 56s): Do you, are you taking that into, into relationships now as you're like single and dating or Yeah. Yeah. Same thing. Yeah. So it ends. It's like it was fun. I know. And onto the next, 1 (59m 9s): I, I think I grew up seeing a marriage that I knew I didn't want, that I knew I never wanted to get married from a very young age. I would be like four or five being like, I don't want kids and I don't wanna get married because I don't want anything that I'm seeing right now. Mm. So I think that also allows me to be really lighthearted about dating and having fun. I believe in like committing to someone and like a hundred percent being in a relationship. But I don't think you need to get your government involved with your relationship by getting married. I, I just don't want kids. I think it just allows me to like approach things more lightheartedly than like needing the white picket fence with the house and the wedding and the kids. 1 (59m 51s): Like I don't, I just genuinely don't need it or want that. So women that do really want that, I can see relationships being really hard 'cause it has to be so perfect and they just so desperately want it, you know? 0 (1h 0m 2s): Yeah. That actually makes a lot of sense. I, I agree with the marriage part. Not making a whole lot of sense if you don't want kids, but I think if you have kids it helps. It 1 (1h 0m 11s): Can get confusing with having parents with different last names like that. 0 (1h 0m 13s): Right. Of course. And then obviously like mitigating finances and having someone be accountable. Of course. Yeah. So kids I think is an exception to that, but I agree. I agree. Yeah, I totally agree. And people fail to realize that marriage actually was always kind of a legal binding agreement and then religion came in way later. Mm. So we often say, oh, it's this religious thing. And it can be absolutely. But like it did originate as just like a legal ceremony if, if you will, or just documentation. So it can be whatever you want it to be. But it was funny when you were talking about relationships being super easy and they're supposed to be fun. And I was like, ah, I used to think that too. But marriage can be, and I think it's the kid element. 0 (1h 0m 53s): It makes, it makes it really, 1 (1h 0m 55s): Which I don't want kids. I've never wanted kids. I'm not having kids. So I've never had to think too deeply about the dynamic. A relationship would be with kids. I can imagine parenting styles would probably cau cause a lot of arguments because that's my flesh and blood that I birth, but it would also be his flesh and blood and he has an equal Right. Of how he would wanna raise the kid. And I can imagine that just being so 0 (1h 1m 20s): Tough. Right. And you see 1 (1h 1m 21s): Things that I don't ever wanna sign up for. 0 (1h 1m 23s): Yeah. Do you feel you have to justify that ever? Like do you get shit for 1 (1h 1m 28s): Not No, I just, I like to preach it because I think women feel they have to have children and I like for women to know that they don't have to have children. And I like for them to know that they're not alone if they can't have children. I don't want them to feel bad or shame. So I like to be open and lighthearted about it because I think it's okay and it's normal. So 0 (1h 1m 48s): Yeah. The way that you do it, it's authentic, right? Yeah. And I don't think everyone's supposed to have kids and nor should everyone have kids. Yeah. And I think it's a really, like you have to know that that's the thing you wanna do. And then there's some women like Chelsea Handler, I can't stand, I used to love her when I was in high school. Her, 1 (1h 2m 3s): I've never liked her unfortunately. Sorry, 0 (1h 2m 5s): Chelsea. I used to, now I can't stand her. And the way that she approaches the topic, she grew 1 (1h 2m 10s): Up with a lot of trauma. 0 (1h 2m 11s): Did she? Yeah. I don't know her story. 1 (1h 2m 14s): I don't know her story verbatim, but I know that she had a really tough like family growing up. Mm. And I think she lost her brother at a young age. Oh. Like they were best friends. And so imagine you did you, do you have any siblings? I do. Yeah. Imagine like being like 10 and like they pass away. Yeah. So she has a lot of trauma. I don't think that gives you an excuse to be like a shit person, but so I, I try to give people grace if I'm not a fan of theirs. 0 (1h 2m 40s): Yeah. I mean there's always context, but at the end of the day, yeah. There's this saying there's no orphans after 21. So you're responsible for yourself. Yeah. After your adulthood. But yeah, when she come, when she talks about being childless by choice, it al it's like this, it feels like an attack on women that decided to have kids. Like it's a very aggressive demonstration of her lifestyle. And 1 (1h 3m 1s): That's her own, that's her own problem. Right. That she feels she needs to express herself that way. She's probably trying to, she's trying to justify her own choices by, by being that aggressive about it. You don't have to shove anything down anyone's throat. 0 (1h 3m 18s): Right? Yeah. It's not a, it's not a war between haves and have nots, it's just different lifestyles and different choices. Yeah. But anytime I see someone that's really aggressive, I'm like, you are not okay with your choices what I'm 1 (1h 3m 28s): Seeing. Right. Or people that are super, super opinionated. It's like I'm opinionated, but I'm fine with what I think. But I'm also fine with what you think. So if you have a different opinion, that's fine. I'm not gonna try to change it. That has nothing to do with me. I just live my life staying in my own lane. Just stay in your own lane. It's so peaceful. 0 (1h 3m 45s): It is. There's this thing in Adlerian psychology and it's separation of tasks. So it's knowing what is for you and what is for other people. And it's exactly that. I think 1 (1h 3m 54s): That's my 0 (1h 3m 55s): Superpower. It's not getting involved in other people's tasks. That's 1 (1h 3m 57s): My superpower. 0 (1h 3m 59s): Yeah. We'd all be better for it. Yeah, I think so. So one, what is the weirdest thing you've done to impress a crush? 3 (1h 4m 7s): Oh, 1 (1h 4m 11s): I wouldn't say it was weird, but to impress or crush. One time I bought him a motorcycle and then I actually really ended up falling in love with this guy. So I made him sell it later in the relationship because motorcycles are very dangerous and I thought if you die on me, I'll never be able to live with myself. So I impressed him by buying a motorcycle and then a year later I forced him to sell it. 0 (1h 4m 41s): It's because I love you. I don't want you to go. 1 (1h 4m 43s): I know. 0 (1h 4m 43s): Oh 1 (1h 4m 43s): My gosh. Because when you're first dating somebody, you're like, oh, I'm a cool girl. This is fun. I'm like, here's a motorcycle. And like, oh, I did like a scavenger hunt for him to find it. It was so epic. And then like a year into it I was like, you can't die on me now actually get rid of it. 0 (1h 4m 59s): How did he take it? 1 (1h 5m 0s): He sold it. He sold 0 (1h 5m 1s): It. Yeah. Good. 3 (1h 5m 2s): Oh my gosh. 0 (1h 5m 5s): That's hilarious. That is. Every guy's like, I hope she gets a crush on me. What is a red flag in relationships that you think people often overlook? 1 (1h 5m 15s): I think the little things like if he's leaving, leaving hair in the sink after he shaves, like absolutely not. You're lazy if you have a bad credit. Why aren't people talking about credit scores? Mm. If you have a bad credit score immediately you're not for me. You're irresponsible. I red flags to me are like little, little things like that. Yeah. Mine is how they keep a car. Like if their car is a mess. Yeah. Like just covered in stuff all the time. I'm like, ooh, the rest of your life is probably also like this. It's a direct correlation with what the rest of your life looks like. Yeah. Yeah. Do you have any other red flags? Well, so there's a quote. It's how you do anything is how you do everything. 1 (1h 5m 56s): So I think like the, the hair being laid around. Right. What else is jealousy is a number one thing for me. I know like control and jealousy, but that's not like outta world. It's not overlooked. Yeah. Some people have this weird toxic thing where they like jealousy in a partner because it makes them feel more wanted. And that's what I mean by relationships don't have to be that hard. Like you can find a partner that won't make you feel jealous, but will still make you feel wanted, you know? Yeah. So jealousy is a huge red flag. But some people are like attracted to that and then they play it off as like, I hate when people say I'm passionate, I'm so passionate. Like Mm, no. Mm. 1 (1h 6m 36s): You're not. That's work on that. Yeah. That's like the, but I have my own red flags. Like I don't take the trash out and if somebody comes to my house, they're like, you need to take the trash out. But everything else is pristine and spotless. Mm. So what are mine? Because you said it's a di, a direct correlation with the rest of your life. Yeah. Don't look at my trash can. Don't look at your trash can. The rest of my life is pristine. Trash can. Absolutely not. So then there's gonna be some area of your life where like everything else is in order, but one thing is just not Okay. Like the others. You're right. Right. So it's like that. So the car thing, you're driving that every day. I don't know, like I just, I don't like that. 1 (1h 7m 18s): I don't like just leaving things like throwing your shoes off or throwing your boxers in the middle of the floor and walking over that. I can't stand that. It's giving mature and grow up. Right? Yeah. If you clean, like if you actually like have cleaner in the house. Yeah. Dust. Like dust is like a no-no. Yeah. So all those things. Yeah. But cleaning stuff is, yeah. Other people's red flags are like other people's red flags are not my red flags. Like liking a girls' Instagram post. Like that's their red flag to me. Not for me either. Me not a red flag at all. No, no. Like a way. Yeah. Yeah. This was awesome. Oh, glad. Thank so much for coming on. Glad. Thank you for having me and have fun. 1 (1h 7m 59s): Can you tell everyone where they can follow you? Anything you're working on? Yeah. My Instagram is just Jenna Lee and my OF is Jenna Lee. And that's it. Follow me there. Yeah. 4 (1h 8m 10s): Thanks everyone. See you. Bye.