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In this episode of Chatting With Candice, Candice Horbacz and Bridget Phetasy engage in a thought-provoking discussion about the complexities of being a woman in today's society. They delve into the challenges women face in politics, feeling politically homeless and used as props by both parties. The conversation explores the evolving definition of womanhood and the alienation many women experience due to gender identity politics. They also discuss societal expectations surrounding women's sexuality, including the body count discussion and the double standards women face compared to men. The hosts share personal experiences and insights into navigating these issues, touching on topics such as abortion, pornography, and the importance of conscious decision-making. They challenge societal norms and encourage women to embrace their sexuality while advocating for informed consent and open communication. The episode concludes with a reflection on the challenges and opportunities of being a woman in a constantly changing world.
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0 (0s): We're not wife material though. No, we're, 1 (3s): We're not for, we're not for novice players. I'll say that. 0 (6s): Trolls are always right by the way, men will be like, oh these women and their body counts. I'm like the average woman, it's like five people, five or six I think is the number. 1 (16s): It's estimated about like 5% of women have a sex drive that's really similar to, to like a masculine sex drive. That's not a lot. So that doesn't help all of these women that are listening to massive podcasts like call her Daddy that are saying sleep with anyone, don't have any second thoughts. Just like there's no consequences to these actions. That's also not helpful. It's 0 (35s): Like a generation of women who can't even get pregnant anymore who are telling younger women this is the only thing that they should care about. These younger generations grew up under Me Too and the age. All of these like, you know, you've gotta be like, can I kiss you? Can it robotically? Like may I touch your hair? And there's nothing hot about that. 1 (59s): Bridget, thanks for coming back on the show. I'm so excited that it's just us this 0 (1m 3s): Time. No bro energy. 1 (1m 5s): No Broing. I was, it's so funny 'cause right before that episode, I don't know if you remember, I was like, what do you do when you feel that everyone's talking over and you can't really interject because you're a woman And then they're say she's a bitch and she's interrupting and you're like, I, that happened to me the other day and I was just so quiet and I was like, oh, you can do that. You could just sit there and be quiet. Yep. Yeah. And I feel like that happens. So I'm glad to like have girl time. 0 (1m 26s): Yeah. It's just, it is different energy too. I think. You know, women, women, it's always interesting on walk-ins welcome when I have women on the podcast, it just is a different energetic force field entirely. And women can go deep so quickly with one another if they just vibe. And so that, that was I think what was happening with us. But then you have two dudes and they're like, and they're jokesters, you know, like not just men too, just comedian men are like a different breed entire, I mean comedians I think are a different breed, but male comedians are just always, they're like, I'm uncomfortable. Let's make fun of it. 0 (2m 6s): Let's like for the joke, I didn't 1 (2m 8s): Stand a chance. 0 (2m 9s): No, no, no, no, no. That was not a fair, fair fight for you at all. Yeah. And they're quick, you know, they're just like, especially the when they get going and I mean even that one clip that I still think is the funniest one about the drag queen story hour, 1 (2m 27s): I didn't know how they just were pulling that. So for me as like a regular person that has zero ad-libbing or stage like presence or training or any of that, 0 (2m 38s): You have stage presence. It's 1 (2m 39s): Like, like you guys are doing magic in front of me and I'm just like, Ooh, 0 (2m 43s): This is amazing. You're like, how are they doing this? But they're, I mean those guys are good. They, they just are. Yeah. They're kind of in sync with one another. So yeah, it's, it's good to just be able to talk about girl stuff. 1 (2m 58s): I was trying to think about when I first started following you, it was, I feel like ages ago and I think it was you were in the middle of some kind of cultural shit storm. And I don't know what usual caused it as usual, but I noticed in your bio is talking about being politically home homeless. And I was like, oh what is that? 'cause that's how I feel. It's, I try to go into these different buckets or parties and I'm constantly getting kicked out for one reason or another. Right. And I was like, oh, someone gets me. Yeah, 0 (3m 24s): I, I think it's really hard to be a woman right now actually and feel like you have a party that cares about you politically. That's just how I feel because I wrote, I wrote this piece for Spectator and it was about how I felt like neither party really cared about women. You get kind of used as a prop one party. I'm kind of like, well the right has a woman problem but at least they can define what a woman is. So I might be a single issue voter on that. But the left has done, I, I feel like they know what a woman is when they need to know what a woman is and then otherwise gender doesn't exist and you can be a man or a woman or anything you wanna be. And those it it, the minute they, even just recently they kind of ended up making that male video like I'm a real man. 0 (4m 12s): Which was not real men trying to pander to mend the Harris. They weren't, it wasn't the Harris campaign. It was a vote Save America pac. But still 1 (4m 21s): I didn't see it. I just keep seeing this like the sp 0 (4m 23s): On this boost of it. So it was ridiculous and roundly mocked and deserved to be mocked. But the point, excuse me, the point that I was making was I love how quickly they suddenly know what men and women are. Oh, I'm like, oh we suddenly know men and 'cause they were saying things like, man up. I'm like, I thought this was internalized misogyny to even say this kind of stuff. And now suddenly, you know what a man is. But you rely on these ridiculous stereotypes in order to try and present what a man is. It's not, it, it's, it's such a weird, i, I don't know all that gender stuff is very strange to me. 0 (5m 5s): It seems like it's alienated a lot of women from the party. I mean I've been screaming women online for like I love that. 1 (5m 12s): I know. And all your merch. It was so good. 0 (5m 15s): I brought one of those sweatshirts actually the the just wondering like when they're gonna use birthing person or when suddenly they're like, I'm not afraid of women. Oh you know what a woman is. That's nice. Can you, how convenient of you to pick that up and use it when you need to. You know what a woman is when you're talking about Abortion sometimes. Sometimes. And sometimes men 1 (5m 41s): Can get them too. 0 (5m 42s): It's crazy how it's really infested everything too. Even when I was in my like birthing, it was a virtual birthing class 'cause it was during Covid and we were in California so of course everything was still locked down, but they were using like birthing person and you could see even in LA the people were just like rolling their eyes on the zoom. They're like, Ugh, that's good. Like birthing person. Really? That's 1 (6m 2s): Surprising to me. 0 (6m 3s): Yeah, no, they were just like, okay, well I guess we'll go along with this, but it's just like, or just women, you know. So yeah, I, I've felt very, and then you have the right wing stuff, which is like childless cat ladies, the Body Count discussion, which I think you and I are very familiar with. 1 (6m 27s): I was talking to this woman, I just, it's so funny my, my travels the last this month I went to Tucker Carlson event, then I went to rescue the Republic and then I went to a sexual health conference in Denver, which was like so left and so progressive and woke and I'm like, no one can accuse me of being in any kind of echo chamber. 'cause I just went to both extremes and I disagree with a lot on both sides. Yeah. And I agree with a lot on both sides, but the amount of times that like woman was refused to be used was crazy to me. And then the other side turned into a sermon and it's like, well if you haven't taken the Lord and Savior as your, or the Jesus as your Lord and Savior, then you're also condemned. 1 (7m 8s): And then you have these conversations around Body Count and the, when I went to this progressive conference, the woman was talking about sexual shame and they were also talking about sexual maturity. And if you have someone that's approaching you with that question, it's just a certain level of maturity that they're not ready to handle. Because it's like, well what are you really getting to with that question? Like, do you really wanna know, just like how many people I've been to first also define what sex is because that definition has changed just like every other definition. But this one I think is actually a good change because it used to be defined as intercourse with a husband and a wife where the male ejaculates, okay, 0 (7m 44s): So it has nothing 1 (7m 45s): To do with the woman's experience or her pleasure or her being in her body or anything that's supposed to be symbiotic. So like I actually am for that definition change. So they're like, why you are you counting kissing or heavy petting or oral or anal? Because some people think they're a virgin even though they've done that. So first let's define that Catholic and then also like what are you, like what are you really trying to get to? Is it just like this retroactive jealousy? Are you worried about how many people are better than you? Or do you wanna know what I like? 'cause that's an interesting question. Like what turns you on and what 0 (8m 14s): Is the, what is the argument that they have about Body Count 1 (8m 18s): The right, yeah. I think that it's the old cow and the milk analogy. So why would you buy a cow if you can get the milk for free? But then that's to say that the only value a woman has is her sexuality. And like that is a big part. Absolutely. But that isn't gonna be forever. And if you make a commitment to be with someone until you get old, that's gonna wax and wane. So you have to have something else that you're bringing to the table. And it's like, how often are you really spending, or how much time are you actually spending in bed with your partner too? Right. It's not, not even every day for most people. So it's a fraction of what you're bringing to the dynamic. So I think it's shortsighted to say the least. And 0 (8m 56s): Is it just that, like you, I've heard so much about this and it's been, yeah, it's been interesting because I was at Playboy, I have their nudies of me online. I was selling pictures behind Patreon before OnlyFans. I was like way ahead of the OnlyFans thing and then I just shut it down because I never really want, I, the reason I started selling them was because people kept demanding them from me. And I was like, no, I'm just going like, come sign up. I don't wanna do this. I might as well like put, put 'em behind a paywall. But then once that became a, I didn't want to become my income 'cause I didn't wanna have to do it. 0 (9m 37s): Mm. I was also writing and doing all kinds of other things. So I wrote like a whole piece about why I get naked online and what I was trying to work out. Some of it is just stuff I was trying to work out. Some of it is pushing against this idea that you can't be sexual as a woman and also be taken seriously. Which I, I have a, a big issue with. Only because men are just kind of perceived as sexual beings who, you know, they need to stow their oats and like they, it even back in the day, it was just kind of assumed that they would have a mistress or have affairs and you just let it slide. And so there's this idea, and I don't think it's talked about enough that men are just perceived as these sexual creatures and they get to do whatever they want. 0 (10m 22s): And women are, you know, the ones who have to pretend that they're not sexual. And, and, and if you are sexual that you're basically a whore and you aren't someone who's taken seriously. And this was something that always just rubbed me the wrong way. I've, I understand. I think I understand a lot of the arguments against it. I don't know that I disagree with a lot of them. Even I, and I also think people, you know, I I, when you look at like the Body Count discussion, men will be, men will be like, oh, these women and their body counts. 0 (11m 2s): I'm like the average woman, it's like five people, five or six I think is the number. 1 (11m 7s): That's what they say. Yeah. But that's also self-reporting. 0 (11m 10s): Self-reported. Yeah. 1 (11m 10s): They're like, and why is it always five? Because it's like, well a hand, you know, one hand looks good. Yeah. Once you start getting to the other one, you're like, Ooh, I'm a bad girl. And honestly like what changes 0 (11m 19s): It? Like the 9 99 theory. So you, it's Body Count 1 (11m 22s): Every time that you are used as somehow like you're diminishing your value. And how come it's only if it's with another person? It just doesn't make any sense to me. And then there's the conversation about like being loose, which is like a whole other problem. So it's like, is so 0 (11m 35s): Like physically loose 1 (11m 36s): Or, yeah, well they equate them together. Right. So you both, you would get physically loose and then obviously you're, you have loose morals if you're doing that as well. So then are we also saying that a mom now is lesser because she had a child? 'cause nothing's gonna make that change more than having a kid. And that's one of like the greatest things that you can do. It's tremendous. The like, the attacks that it takes on your body and the physical endurance to birth a child. So now we're gonna say, oh well you're gross 'cause you had a baby. Like get outta here. You're obviously a weak little boy and you're insecure. Yeah. That's all it is. 0 (12m 5s): I don't know many men who care about that stuff. You know, like actual men. 1 (12m 11s): Not in real life. No, 0 (12m 12s): Not in real life. That it is like a question. And if you do get that question, you're like, are you 19? How old are you? I feel like I haven't had that question since high school that it feels like a very high school question to ask. Like, how many people have you been slept with? And I, I also think women do this to each other too. Because long before men ever called me a slut, men ever slut shame me or called me a whore or whatever. Millions of names I get daily. Women were doing it to me in junior high and high school when I would move and I was a new girl and they would be like, you're a slut, you're a whore. 0 (12m 53s): And I had never even had sex. Same. And it was, it was weird because I was like, well I'm not, you guys have like boyfriends and you, you're having sex. I'm not even, I've never even like given a blow job or anything. So that was a weird thing to experience as a woman being policed like that by, and I do think women tend to police one another in that way, just in a more like shady way. I think it's overt when they're young, but it was very, I don't know, older. It does get a little bit weird. 1 (13m 28s): It's like asset protection, right? Mm. They're like, this is my security and I need to do whatever I can to make sure that he doesn't wander. And if I can say that like somehow attack your reputation or worth as a person, then maybe that's gonna protect it. Which the guy's gonna do it. The guy wants to do it, it has nothing to do with the other woman. And for some reason, rather than focusing on your partner, you're focusing on this perceived threat. 0 (13m 50s): Yeah. That, that inter, I think like Chris Williamson talks about a lot about like the intrasexual competition that happens among women and how it's, it's very insidious and they'll kind of undermine one another in weird ways and not be supportive. Even just the other day there was this whole discussion going on about podcasts. This woman tweeted, you know, how come Barry Weiss is the only person who has like a, a moderate ish podcast and and in this space? And then all these other women were like, no. And she went online on like one of these renik or something, one of these sites and was like, none of these people are getting 20,000 or more downloads. 0 (14m 34s): And somebody in the comments was like, yeah that's because women don't even listen to to women's podcasts. And I was like, truer words have never been spoken. A because I think women are listening to true crime primarily. It is just when you look at politics in general, women are not as interested in politics as men are. This is just a fact when you break down how many people are and unless it's like the Abortion issue and then suddenly they're very interested and men are generally more on YouTube, they're general. It's like they also just dominate these spaces naturally anyway. 0 (15m 14s): And women are just not that interested in that kind of stuff. And I don't think it's a thing of like women not listening to each other 'cause they're competing. I think it's just that women aren't just that as as interested. And then when men want to hear about politics, like they generally wanna hear from men. They might like to hear from a woman occasionally, but I, I think they like to you know, talk to each other and hear each other. It's just, that's been my experience. I could be wrong. 1 (15m 46s): No, there's not a lot. If you look at the charts, it's probably, I mean if I pull it up right now, it's probably almost all dudes. 0 (15m 52s): Yeah. Pull it up. Pull it up. Jamie. 1 (15m 55s): I know that, I know that with podcasts in general, I wanna say it's almost 70% men. Like men that consume on the consumer end. Oh 0 (16m 3s): Interesting. 1 (16m 4s): So it's already skewed. 0 (16m 5s): And the other 30% is women listening to true crime, 1 (16m 8s): Which I don't understand. I don't either. You are welcoming that into your life ladies, if you are listening to that, it's a matter of time. Number one is kill list. So there we go. Joe gans too. What's Kill list? I think it's probably a true crime. Crime. Oh it's a novel. Interesting. A novels number one. 0 (16m 26s): This is 1 (16m 26s): Overall NBC daily news call her Daddy's five. 0 (16m 32s): Oh weird. Which I don't, I've 1 (16m 33s): Never climbed junkie as Six Wiser than me with Julia Lewis. That's surprising. Dateline Pod Save America, Tucker. This is on Apple too. Okay. Me and Kelly. So there actually were a couple women. Okay. 0 (16m 44s): Megan Kelly's up there. That would've been my guess. Eat 1 (16m 47s): Our words. There's some women up there call 0 (16m 49s): Her da daddy. I would've guessed because they gave her $60 million. So yeah. So kind of putting she as an audience. Yeah. And that, yeah. And then they're gonna invest in making that. But I think she does capture the younger women, the 2023 to 28-year-old women. 1 (17m 6s): Did you watch any of her Kamala episode of or of the 0 (17m 9s): Clips of YiIVEM? I've tried to listen to her. I, I have nothing against her. It's just not my, it's just not my 1 (17m 17s): Stage of life. 0 (17m 19s): It was never my stage of life. It's just, it's like I never liked reality television. I never was into, it's just not, it's a little bit too vapid or like shallow or something. Like I've never been into like celebrity interviews. Yeah. I don't care. They always seem so boring. I wanna know like why you think the way you think and why and why you, what you've been through in your life. And maybe she does do that. I just, I've, I don't know. I haven't been able to really get into it. No. Yeah. And YiIVEM tried. 1 (17m 55s): Yeah. I've only ever seen clips too. Yeah. 0 (17m 58s): What did you think of it? 1 (17m 59s): So I saw the one that was going viral and it was talking about Abortion, which I don't understand the obsession over it, which I'd love to get your take on this. But she was, I 0 (18m 9s): Just love Abortion. 1 (18m 10s): She goes, we're gonna, we're gonna sit here and can you think of any example where the government has control over a man's body? And she's like, oh I'll wait. And then crickets are playing and then everyone's like the draft. 0 (18m 23s): Yeah. 1 (18m 23s): How about the draft? Yeah. Mean how about when you were man too? What about 0 (18m 26s): The vaccine bandaids? That too. 1 (18m 27s): That too. So it doesn't take a lot of like mental energy to come up with that answer. And those things I think are, I mean the draft should be illegal for Yeah I think that's insane if you have to draft people you already lost. But the obsession with Abortion is kind of crazy to me because everyone is saying Trump is anti-abortion. He's not, he's 0 (18m 45s): He's not. He's actually pretty squished. Yeah. 1 (18m 47s): And he even said that he just thinks it should be a state right rights issue. Which I agree with. I didn't, I wish that there were more rights for the states and like a smaller or like no federal government at all. I mean if I had it my way. But I think states rights issue is fine. And then what you actually saw when it got reversed, where you had these like deep southern states that were actually pretty moderate, like doing six, 12 weeks. Yeah, I know six sounds like not a lot but I mean I don't know this, this is my take. I cycle track 'cause I got off the pill soon as I realized how toxic it was. So I cycle track. I I both pregnancies I knew like right away. Yeah. And my second 'cause I was trying, I knew I was less than two weeks pregnant and I knew I was pregnant. Yeah. So I know that's not everyone's situation. 1 (19m 30s): I'm not like gonna debate like the whether or not it should be legal. But the obsession is crazy. 'cause when you ask most of these women, if they've ever had one, they say no, maybe they're not being honest but they say no. And it's like well would you ever have one? They're like, oh no, no, not for me. I would never do that. So it's like why are you so emotional over this thing that you've never had and you never see yourself doing because it's against like your own ethics or your own morality And like, I don't know, world War three seems a lot more pressing to me than whether or not you can abort a baby. 0 (20m 1s): Yeah. There that was something that Mary Catherine Ham, she was on my podcast this past week and we had a great, I love her. You would love her. She's just like such a normy whisperer. But we were talking, she was like, it always offended me that this is the only thing we care about. Because then it just once again assumes that we're just these like baby makers and it's not like we don't live in a time where you can take birth control or do things to make sure that you're not getting pregnant and take some responsibility for that. And you know, people will be like, well it's always held women back. I'm like, yeah, before the pill it did, before we had condoms and before there was a lot of things that held people back and also men died in huge numbers because they were out working in, you know, minds and fields with mercury and coal and Yeah. 0 (20m 52s): Yeah. There's a lot of things that that were really bad that affected people and now they don't. And the Abortion thing is, it was weird they did this six week heartbeat ban the literal week. I was six weeks pregnant and heard my daughter's heartbeat and I've always been pretty moderate on Abortion, I think in the first trimester. So much can go wrong. Anyway. I'm like I, I understand the pro-life argument. If you think it's a life that wouldn't even matter. I do, I do understand and respect that. And even I'm a little bit morally conflicted on that. 0 (21m 33s): You know, like when, well okay if it's a life at six weeks it it, why wouldn't it be a life at four weeks? Why wouldn't it be so I can back it up? But I still do think in that first trimester like, okay, I think that's a pretty moderate position most of the world takes. And then when you pull people, the more pregnant you get, the lower people have a tolerance for Abortion and third trimester. There was a great article actually in the Atlantic of all places that was talking about how you can't pretend that nine, like ninth, ninth month abortions aren't happening if you want to actually make these arguments because they do happen not just for medical reasons. 0 (22m 23s): And if you're going to, and the majority of the population is very against this when you poll people left and right. And so why not address this and try and make an argument for or against it or even back it up a little instead of just acting like it's not happening. Which is a lie. And I do think too that it's like a very strange psyop that they've managed to, it's, it's like a generation of women who can't even get pregnant anymore who are telling younger women this is the only thing that they should care about. And I can't believe we're still fighting for this. 0 (23m 4s): And I, I don't like seeing some of the stuff that's happening where providers are worried about being sued or losing their license because they helped a woman who is having a miscarriage. So this is where I think on the state by state level, you have to have very specific carve outs regulations so that doctors don't have to worry about that and they can give women the medical care that they need when they have a miscarriage or whatever. 1 (23m 30s): Is that happening though or is that like one of those urban legends where I like you have a medically necessary, what do they call like a DNC? Yeah. And they're like, we can't do that 'cause abor. 'cause it's not an ab it's not an Abortion. Yeah. Like there's no baby anymore. 0 (23m 44s): I don't, I I've seen that it's happening. I never know what to believe. What to believe. Yeah. Yeah. So I, and I try to again good faith, I mean it must happen. I don't know if it's a complete edge case. Wait, someone 1 (24m 0s): Wait, understand the law and then they're not doing what they're responsible to do. 0 (24m 4s): Yeah. And then there was that story that somebody, they said a woman died because she didn't have the right Abortion care but it was actually the Abortion pill that ended up killing her. Wow. So that was a weird story that was like going viral and then when you dug down into it you're like oh is actually the Abortion pill that she died from. And this was a, so yeah. Again, we live in a time where institutional trust and information is all, you're like, is this true? I don't know. 1 (24m 32s): How'd it kill her? Do you know? 0 (24m 33s): I can't remember the exact circumstances. I think it was something like, you know you can, those pills are crazy. You can like I 1 (24m 40s): Don't know anything about 'em. 0 (24m 42s): I just had a conversation with someone who had experienced this and I had no idea that they basically give you an Abortion pill and send you home and tell you like okay it'll be just like a heavy period and it's not like a heavy period. And a lot of people will have hemorrhaging complications. Like you could, you know, I'm not exactly sure exact how how. 1 (25m 8s): Yeah. 0 (25m 9s): But it's still not good. Even at like four or five weeks. It's still gonna be not more than a heavy period. Yeah. And I've had a miscarriage so I know and it, and I needed to go to the emergency room and so I think, I feel like it's a situation like that where it was you're essentially inducing a miscarriage and so, and it's cra I didn't know you could just like send people home with this to like do it at home. That seems like insane to me. It 1 (25m 42s): Does. Even from like the mental health care aspect of that. Totally. And then that 0 (25m 46s): Hormonally, 1 (25m 47s): That was the thing too when I saw the popup clinic that was at the DNC and this isn't even about the actual Abortion procedure of whether they were doing pills. I don't, I'm assuming it was pills. I think it was the pills. Yeah. But if you have someone that's walking there for a political conference and then they're like making an impromptu decision to now have an Abortion that seems a little bit unhinged, that does seem something that you would wanna plan. And then are you providing aftercare for that person mentally? Because that is a huge choice that you just basically put in front of them. There's 0 (26m 16s): No, there's no 1 (26m 16s): Responsibility there. 0 (26m 17s): There's no an like after Abortion That's 1 (26m 21s): Crazy to me. 0 (26m 22s): This is something that I got into with this woman and it will be probably be an episode that is never released. But it is, it's, it's a lot like when I talk to Detransition and they're like, oh there's all this support and mental health and everybody's willing to get you on the hormones and get you on the track to get the mastectomy and the minute you wanna detransition and you look around and no one's there and no one will pick up the phone and no one will take your calls. And you hear this story over and over and over again from Detransition who are like, once I got all of these surgeries, there was no mental health care to help me with the hormones and that transition. 0 (27m 4s): And then when I decided against it, there was no one around and they were basically just left alone. And I think that is the same thing I see with Abortion where it's very much a lot of propaganda to be like, oh you know like the shout your Abortion thing has always been so I hate the extreme, the extremes on both sides Me too are not helpful. Me. Yeah. Calling everybody a baby killer for doing this is not helpful. Neither is being like after I went to the club, I just got my Abortion and like I'm gonna write about it on, I'm gonna tweet about it and shout about my Abortion because now you're taking something that I think most women who go through this, they wrestle with this. 0 (27m 48s): It's not something that comes easily may, maybe some women it is easy, but I think the majority of women who have gone through this, it was a struggle for them. They wrestled with it, it was internally conflicted. A lot of people have regrets forever. A lot of women have had abortions and now can't have a child now that they want one. And have that regret of like, did I blow my one chance to have a kid because now I'm deciding at 45 that I wanna have a child. And also the culture has lied to you about that. So there, yeah, there's a lot, I worry a lot about the call her daddy audience because they, I was them and I feel like I was, was the first, I'm 40, almost 46 years old. 0 (28m 39s): So my mom was sexual revolution, you know, burn your broad generation if that was even a thing. And we were really the first generation that was kind of li like truly liberated. And I feel like there are so many of us that are kind of stumbling back from the war being like, you know, and I realize this is a weird conversation to have on the other heels of like the Body Count discussion. But I do feel like there are a lot of us who are kind of turning towards women being like, go back. Like turn around. It's not, it's not that sex is bad, it's just that I don't think, and I said this in my regret being a slut thing essay that I wrote on Substack. 0 (29m 28s): It's that I think like the idea that you can just sleep your way to empowerment and shout your Abortion and not pay any consequences for this is a lie. And it's a lie that has been kind of sold to these women and it's the false bill goods and at the end of it and this whole idea that like having kids is bad, that is just, it's so I wanna, I wanna shake all these young women and be like I, that is the, I wish I had never heard any of that growing up. I wish there had been because I was like kind of the boss, you know, I come from like the boss bitch. 0 (30m 12s): The evolution of that. Of like we're gonna go to work and like be like Carrie and fricking sex in the city and we can like none of us need to have kids and ew kids. 1 (30m 23s): Like we've gotta go to a baby 0 (30m 25s): Shower in the suburbs. And I don't know, there's a lot. I got lucky. I got very, very lucky. And you don't, the problem is you can't know what you don't know. So you'll never really know what you're missing because how can you, you can, it's, I was joking with someone the other day, I'm like having a kid and there were all these like young, younger la well not younger, they're like late thirties, early forties, young LA women and they were like, we're just maybe thinking about having kids. I'm like, you don't have fucking time. Like you need to do this now. Yeah. Whatcha talking about, I'm think, I know you live in a place where women are having kids at 45, but it is not easy. I was talking to somebody at Dissident Dialogues and he was telling me the stats are crazy. 0 (31m 10s): It's like one in six women who want to have a child ends up not having a child because they waited too long and it was past their fertility. Once you get over the age of 35, basically the geriatrics and these, I don't know, these women think that they can like wait until 41, 42 and just have a baby easily. It's not easy. And then you're lucky if you even have one. 1 (31m 35s): Yeah, they were, they were, they were told like if you could just freeze your eggs and then even freezing them, most of them don't make it through the, the thawing process. Like it just, there's lack of informed consent with pretty much everything. And it's so disgusting. Like you have to be able to say risks, benefits, alternatives. If you're not doing that, then you're a really shitty provider. And that goes with everything. It goes with the abortions, it goes with the shots, it goes with freezing your eggs and IVF. Yeah. But they don't do that 'cause they just want you to pay and sign up and be a repeat customer 0 (32m 2s): Most, I was reading some crazy statistic that's like 97% of eggs don't get u the frozen eggs never get used. That's wild. 1 (32m 12s): And it's so expensive. 0 (32m 14s): It's so expensive. And then you're just keeping those things on ice and you've gotta pay for it every month like a, like a storage fee and just the process is expensive. And I do kind of, there's a part of me that's wished I had done it because once I had one I was like, oh, if I had had some eggs, maybe I could have tried to have another, which would've been nice. But I also was never one to like force that. So I decided against doing IVF. So I understand why women do it, but it's so expensive. 1 (32m 45s): So 0 (32m 45s): Expensive. It's so expensive. Yeah. I don't know, it's, it's weird. It's like a very strange space you and I occupy I think in the culture of being women who have a very open sexual past. And I don't want there to be a lot of shame around sex because I don't think that it helps at all. And I think there women should be allowed to be as sexual beings as men are. But I also know the downsides of living a promiscuous life that was not, I mean a lot of, I have 11 years of sobriety today, so yeah. 1 (33m 30s): Congratulations. 0 (33m 31s): Thank you. That I think a lot if I was to, I could write a book about that piece, about regret being a slut because I think a lot of it, like a lot of it wouldn't have happened if I wasn't drinking and using and doing drugs. So it's hard to detangle that. And I think if I was, you know, there's a lot of women who are very conscious about having sex and I think that's when it can be healthy and empowered. But you have to be pretty conscious about it. You have 1 (33m 59s): To be so tuned in. Yeah. To your own north star. And I know there's gonna be so many people that say under no circumstance can you be in alignment or is that what you're supposed to do? And you have to remember just 'cause it's not for you doesn't mean that it's not for somebody else. And there's this discussion, and this is one of my biggest critiques when it comes to like the whole evolutionary biology like crew is Yes, that explains something, but it doesn't explain the whole picture. Like that argument is very thin. Right. It's a good starting point. So yeah, you can say that men have always been promiscuous and then even look at some women that have been in like poly relationships, like towards the, towards the Arctic, right? 'cause like resources were low, they needed multiple providers. 1 (34m 39s): Sure. But we also have this evolved beautiful higher brain and then you can use that executive function and agency then to make a different discussion. So it's like we use evolutionary biology to say like this is the roadmap for everyone, but we're, we're ignoring like the tail end and just addressing the middle of the bell curve. Which is important if you're trying to get information out to like the most people. But you can't say that just because most people are in the middle, that you both fringes are then to be denied or then said that they're like wrong in some kind of fashion. It's estimated about like 5% of women have a sex drive that is really similar to, to like a masculine sex drive. That's not a lot. So that doesn't help all of these women that are listening to massive podcasts like call her daddy that are saying sleep with anyone, don't have any second thoughts. 1 (35m 28s): Just like there's no consequences to these actions. That's also not helpful because what you're describing is a fringe behavior. And maybe that applies to like someone like me, but that's not gonna help the like average woman who then feels used or disgusted after a lot of like random sex. So you have to like tune into yourself and say, what do I want? Like what am I getting out of this? Can I consciously connect Fortnite and then disconnect or am I gonna be hung up on him and feel like I was re just trying to be the cool girl? So you have to make the the choice for yourself and like stop listening to these people with like microphones that are telling you this is the only way to live. Yeah. You know what I mean? If you're like letting someone else make all those decisions for you, of course it's gonna be out of alignment because they're not you. 0 (36m 6s): Yeah. How did you, how did you get into porn? 1 (36m 13s): So it sounds crazy. I was supposed to be like, it was part of my path. I believe in fate and destiny. I also believe in free will. So I think it's this delicate dance that they both do together. I think it's incap, it's inescapable to say that like culture doesn't affect you. Right? So I grew up with all of the, the playmates and penthouse and Carmen Electra and like that's what I was seeing. So that was obviously glamorized. And I was like, I wanna be one of these powerful women. My dad left. So I do think that there's an element of the love that you don't get is the love that you try to receive. So probably trying to chase like male attention that is part of it. 1 (36m 53s): But in a weird way, I like cut that part off of my myself for a really long time. Like I was not sexual at all. I was so shy. I was so cold. I was so scared to show any kind of affection or like confidence. And then I left a long term relationship like eight years and I was 19. So I was, my youth was taken up, which terrible parenting. I would never let my kid be in a relationship for that long as a minor. It's weird. 0 (37m 21s): So from like 11 to 19 you were in a relationship? Yeah. 1 (37m 24s): Basically. Whoa. 0 (37m 25s): That's nuts. 1 (37m 26s): It gets crazy. Yeah. Should have been cut off by a parent. If I had someone, I mean 0 (37m 30s): It's actually shocking. You weren't like a teen mom. 1 (37m 33s): I, he was really religious and I was not sexual at all. Oh, okay. Like at all. So I felt like I didn't know who I was. I, because those developmental years were spent with an older boy that was influencing me. How much older 0 (37m 45s): Was 1 (37m 46s): He? Five years. Oh shit. I think five years. Yeah. Wait, 0 (37m 49s): So he was 16 and you were 11? 1 (37m 51s): No, no, no. So not five years. So I was, we started dating when I was 12 and I think he just got his learner's permit. So yeah, four years. But okay, that's still 0 (37m 60s): A lot. Yeah, that's that 1 (38m 1s): Age that it's a lot. 0 (38m 2s): Yeah. 1 (38m 2s): So like heavily influenced by like him, his family and his friends. So we break up and I'm like, I don't really have like family so I'm totally by myself in South Carolina going to the university. And I felt like it was my first chance to figure out who I was. And for some reason I felt like really called to getting into like I got into nude modeling and then that kind of progressed into these other things 'cause I wanted it to. And I just felt like that's what I was supposed where I was supposed to be in a weird way. It was less vulnerable and less scary to be able to play with sensuality and sexuality if I had an alter ego doing it and I was on a stage and, you know what I mean? Or a set because it wasn't Candace doing it, it was this alter ego. 1 (38m 44s): So it's like, it's a safe, safer dynamic to kind of explore. And I'm glad I did because I'm a totally different person because of those experiences. I was toxically jealous of every relationship I was in. This challenged all of my ideas of like what love was, what possession was like, what scarcity was, attachment issues, abandonment issues, all of these things that I had to face head on. Wow. If I was gonna be in this industry and also try to make a relationship work. And some of the healthiest marriages I saw were actually in the industry. Wow. Which challenges so many people because your communication has to be topnotch, topnotch, anything that is bothering you. Like they bring it to the table right away. They don't hide it, fester it like nothing. It's like, we're gonna address this right now, we're gonna work through it and then come out the other side. 1 (39m 27s): So no gel, like, yes there's jealousy, but not like, not like that lingering all consuming. This is gonna threaten the relationship. It's like, oh this is a normal human response. Is there evidence that I need to be worried that you're gonna leave yes or no and let's work through it. So I don't know YiIVEM, I don't regret it at all. And I know that's shocking to a lot of people. There's a ton of consequences that I'm gonna have to deal with because of that decision and that my kids are gonna have to deal with. Mm. And that's not gonna be easy. But if I was gonna be a mom before or after porn, I'd pick the after mom, after porn mom all day. Because the one before would've been something like my mom and my boys did not deserve that at all. Mm. So like the person that I am on the other side is like softer and warmer and like I know who I am in like such a real way. 1 (40m 12s): And like I've now experienced unconditional love where I thought that was just a myth. I didn't know that that actually existed before. So I would definitely be one of those 5% fringe women. And it's just not okay to discount me or my experience or to say that somehow I've internalized the patriarchy because I wanna be seen as sexual or I have daddy issues. And that's why like, sure that might've been in the beginning a part of it. But now as a 30 5-year-old woman, I very much am consciously making my sexual decisions. And I think it's a life force. And to cut that off and say that you can either be the Madonna or the whore is just, that's not right. You're, you're all of these things, you know, you're all of these things at once. 0 (40m 51s): Yeah. That is the, that is the beauty and tragedy of being a woman I think in the, in the world is that it is, I see the way that they try and regulate women in, in like the Middle East and under Shaah where you have like eyes covered, hair covered, can't sing, can't dance. And I've been in those countries and you feel the, as a woman, a western woman, you're like, oh fuck, this really is the patriarch. I mean it is, I mean it is truly repressive and you feel the way that men look at you as a western woman because they know you're kind of a loose moral floozy or whatever. 0 (41m 34s): And it is, I feel lucky to have been raised in a culture that is so permissive and allows women to play with all of this stuff. Because I think right now in the culture, what we're seeing is on the heels of the sexual revolution, which is truly like Europe is like, get over it. You know, they've been doing, I always feel like Europe is so much more healthy about stuff like this because they, although they're probably in their own weird phase now too, but they, even growing up we just had a, my mom is more European so it was always, she just always had a more European mentality about things like nudity. 0 (42m 20s): And it was just like, I always feel like Europe's like yeah we've seen some titties in our time. We've been around for a while and, and America feels very much like a, you know, teenage a like adolescent who's just seeing boobs for the first time all the time to me. But I do think we're kind of on, you know, we're a couple of decades into that now where there's maybe some maturity happening or some balance, you know, I think you have to go like way overcorrect and now people are pulling back a little. What do you think about the, you know, regulation of porn in a state like Texas or, well not really regulating porn, they're just making, so you have to have an id. 0 (43m 4s): What do you think about porn on the, you know, male psyche now that it's so easily accessible? Do you think that it's affecting, you hear from kids like that men are like trying, you know, they're more like trying to choke and have these like unrealistic expectations. What, what are your thoughts on 1 (43m 25s): That? I have so many thoughts. So I guess starting with the restriction, 'cause it, it kind of is 'cause they know people don't wanna give their, it's bio bio, what do you call it? Biometrics. Yeah. So they're, you have to scan your face and then some places are making you show a government issued id. There have already been data breach breaches with that. So who's watching? And then are they holding onto it? And then are they also like watching what you are watching and then they're gonna use it against you in some weird, it's seems like a massive violation of the first amendment. Privacy 0 (43m 54s): Too Great. 1 (43m 54s): That as well. And it's, it is protected whether you like it or not. It's protected under freedom of expression. And then you have the right to not have the government in your bedroom. Like that's so odd to me. They use it under the guise of protecting children. That's not the case. 'cause kids are more tech savvy than all of their parents. Yeah. They just get a VPN you put a V pn. Yeah. And then even if that doesn't work, the only sites that are abiding by these regulations are the big ones that don't have illegal content on them. Yeah. So now you're pushing them to these honeypot websites that have really dark, really questionable and probably illegal content. So you're actually doing more harm. And it's like the, the arrogance of, of people in general. Like we think that we see a problem, we see a solution and we're going to implement it. 1 (44m 37s): And nothing like case closed, what ends up happening are always like second and third order consequences that we never saw and they end up being worse than the original problem. So I think that we should pay attention to that. I think it's comes the buck stops with a parent, make sure that they have a device that they're able to handle. Make sure that there's safety mechanisms on it. Check in going back to Europe, like they actually have PSA ads on regular cable reminding parents like there's this one, it's these really two famous like German porn stars. And they come and they knock on the door and they're naked holding a laptop and the parent opens and they're like, hello? And do you know where your kid is right now? And the mom's like, what? And they're like, he's up there. It's maybe a good time to talk to him about safe internet use. 1 (45m 18s): Mm. So like parents step up and take responsibility. No one is advocating for kids to watch this content. It is, it is so dangerous. Right. Like that you don't know what they're gonna fall stumble upon. It's just inappropriate. So no kids should not be consuming it as far as how it's affecting the brain. There's no way to tell. Obviously it's gonna have, it's gonna have some kind of, are we good? Yeah, no you're fine. It's gonna have some kind of effect. Episode is this thing. Yeah. You know what I mean? So if we're talking about dopamine drainage and like all of this fasting, I mean you get the same negative effects from scrolling too much. Yeah. Or watching too much TikTok or playing too many video games. So I think that's more a tech technology issue. And then they've tried to look at the brain before and after porn, but they can't do it because when they try to get all these 18 year olds, everyone has watched it at least once. 1 (46m 7s): Hmm. So if you look at how many people are actually having a problem with overconsumption, it's a single digit number. And that ends up being a lot of people when you consider it's hundreds of millions of views visitors a day on just one platform like PornHub, that is a lot of people. But if you say, well most people can eat ice cream and it's not a problem, but there's this single digit number five, we'll say 5% that overconsume and destroys their life and they become morbidly obese and they get di right. And then that tailspins, you don't then make ice cream illegal. Right. You say like, well how can I support this person and what is it that they're trying to get with this overconsumption of this product? And if it's not porn, it's gonna be something else. Like that is also true. So it'll show up in gambling food, other women, what they tend to think, 'cause it doesn't meet the DSM five, which it has kind of gotten off the rails in general, but it doesn't mean meet that STA criteria of being classified as an addiction. 1 (46m 57s): So it's more like a compulsion issue. It's more of an avoidance tactic. And then when it comes to the violent treatment of women after watching porn, there's also tends to be a tendency in those individuals to already have a, an antisocial personality disorder of some sort. Like narcissism or just being antisocial in general or already having misogynistic views of women. Right? Right. Like that was already there and then the porn kind of like was an outlet for them. And then they're bringing that into the bedroom as far as like what is rough sex? You'd have to define that because like is this rough sex or is it choking until the girl's like passing out? Is it spanking, is it slap? 1 (47m 38s): Like there's, so that spectrum is so massive and I don't know if you got into any like erotica yet. I'm in my erotica phase. I love it so much. But those books are filthy and they're violent. And the ones that have the most ratings, like 17,000 plus reviews, which is not an exaggeration. It's like the guy who was non-consensual at first and the guy is big and broody and forceful and slapping and choking and spiting and all of the things. And these women are gobbling it up. Wow. These housewives are gobbling it up. So I think a lot of it too is just women aren't, 0 (48m 11s): Is it housewives who generally Yes. Dude. 1 (48m 14s): Go It's book talk or smut talk, but you don't have TikTok. I'll have to show you some videos, but it's just regular 0 (48m 19s): Moms 1 (48m 19s): With their mom bun and their jeans and their coffee and like their kids in the background and they have their earphones in, they're just listening to Phil. So I think we've been sexual since 0 (48m 31s): Forever 1 (48m 31s): The dawn of time. Yeah. What has changed is the technology that we're using and the availability, but they found this, what they're considering to be like the first piece of porn. And it's was made out of a tusk and it was, it's like 18,000 years old is what they're thinking. So we've always liked it. It's always be, it's not going anywhere. It's just how do we use it in a healthy way and understand that it does have a powerful effect on us and our psyche. And I think that it would be just as much of an issue for me to expect, like any man that I'm with, to be the guy from my erotica novel, just like he, it would be a man, like expecting every woman that he's with to be like Jenna Jameson. Right, right. 1 (49m 11s): Like these are forms of entertainment and they kind of need to stay there. And if you wanna consent and play with that and the relationship, then you can do that. But these things like have to be a conversation. Right. And I think that's what's happening is there's so much shame still around sexuality that if a guy wants to experiment with something he saw or a woman wants to experience something that she read, it's, they're not having that conversation to make sure that they're both on board. Right. Because that's not hot. But you can do it in a hot way. Like you can do it in a playful way and without killing the mood. But like if you're doing something that's outside of missionary and normal, like you need to ask Yeah. Or like, or body language even. Yeah. And I think so many people, they don't know how to read nonverbal communication, which is like 90% of it. 1 (49m 51s): Yeah. So if you see that she's like kind of like closing off or like her face isn't like, it's not a full body. Yes. Maybe ask, is this okay, are you enjoying this? Is there something else you'd like to do? I 0 (50m 3s): I don't even know that they're having sex anymore. Like the younger generation. That's what's weird to me is you have the, you have this, all this talk about Abortion and it's the, the issue, you know, for this election in particular, I think I still think Kaa was gonna win. And I think it will. You think she's gonna win? I think it will. I mean, I, I've been wrong about every single one, so, so maybe I'll be wrong. Likely other than Trump, I knew he was gonna win in 2016. I thought he'd win in 2020 and I definitely was wrong about the red wave in 2022. I thought there would be a red wave. I thought people would punish their states and governments more for the bad decisions they made around Covid V and the vaccine mandates and all that bullshit that everybody just, 1 (50m 49s): They forgot. Yeah. 0 (50m 52s): But I think people were kind of traumatized by it and they just wanted to move on collectively. And then it was post Roe v. Wade. And I often joke, I underestimated how much bitches love Abortion. And I don't mean that in a derogatory way, even though it sounds that way. It's really just a joke. But I was like, bitches love would be, it's just like the only explanation I can come up with. But then when you look at the numbers, the, the younger generations are having less sex. It's the first time in the history that they're having less sex than the generation, like our generations. And so it's a weird, that's a weird dichotomy for me. You have like all of this kind of moral panic around porn. 0 (51m 32s): And maybe that's why they're not having as much, I would argue it's probably just they're getting stuff from their phones. They're, they're like getting that hit from their phones and they're having different kinds of relationships. But I also think these younger generations grew up under me too and the age. All of these like, you know, you've gotta be like, can I kiss you? Can it robotically? Like may I touch your hair? And there's nothing hot about that. Even to the point where they were trying, they have the apps where it's like, here, fill out this form, this consent app and sign it before we even engage in any kind of foreplay. 1 (52m 9s): And the problem with that too, and someone brought this to my attention, which seems so obvious 'cause it like to like putting, having it all on paper and in front of you. It's harder for my brain to understand it 'cause it's just like more in the moment. But he's like, can, you can't do consent before? Because if you're in the middle of it, like maybe what was a yes before is now a no. Maybe what was no before is now a yes. Yeah. So you, it's impossible to do consent before. It's a constant conversation when you're engaging. And that's why it's like these is this okay, is it doesn't work. Right? And then you're, it also takes away the right to say no in the middle. 'cause you're like, well you agreed in the beginning 0 (52m 43s): And you can't enforce it. Right? So even if you say yes and then say no, they're not gonna be able to enforce the she said 1 (52m 50s): Yes before 0 (52m 50s): She said yes in her consent app. So it's, it was, it's like the dumbest thing. But more importantly, I think it really tries to erase awkwardness and sex is awkward. Yeah. And I, I understand the desire to, and I, I really think this is a huge part of the trans movement is you're uncomfortable in your body. You're in puberty. I remember puberty, it was horrific. It sucks. We all go through it. It's a rite of passage of being a human, going through puberty and having it be awkward and stinky and smelly and horrible. And you couldn't pay me millions of dollars to go back and do it again. And we've just gotta go through it. 0 (53m 33s): But now we live at a time where everything's personalized, everything's convenient, everything's at the tip of our fingers. And there is this strong desire to, we don't ever have to stand and be bored anymore because we can just look at our phone and there's a strong just inclination to try and eradicate awkwardness and or 1 (53m 56s): Dis discomfort at 0 (53m 57s): All. Discomfort at all. And I think it's misguided. Just we ha you're still, you can't cheat that. You're still gonna end up feeling awkward and uncomfortable. And if you think sexuality is going to become less confusing when you swap genders, you are misguided. That's it's not going to be, and now you're gonna be on meds for the rest of your life. Which is the other thing that's even like, not to change topics completely, but even like the ozempic thing, I'm like, yeah, I understand we have an obesity crisis. We should probably do, do more talking about what's in our food and how Americans are just chill with everything being poison and less about how we can just take a pill to fix it. 0 (54m 44s): Because now you're on meds for the rest of your life. You can't go off of it. 1 (54m 49s): And it's so expensive. 0 (54m 51s): Right 1 (54m 51s): Now it's to 1500. Yeah. Right now it's, yeah, 0 (54m 53s): I'm sure it'll go down. But it's still like you are now signing up to be on a medication for the rest of your life and talk to the hairdressers about what Ozempic is doing 1 (55m 4s): To their To hair. Yeah. What's it doing? 0 (55m 6s): All the hairdressers I know will tell you they know exactly which clients are on ozempic because their hair is falling out because 1 (55m 12s): They're malnourished probably. I'm like, this 0 (55m 13s): Is not healthy. You can't cheat this. 1 (55m 17s): Whoa. 0 (55m 18s): Hairdressers always say this. They're like, I know when my client's lying about being on ozempic 'cause their hair starts falling out. 1 (55m 23s): Well no, you see it. So it's like your skin and your hair is the first thing the the biggest indicators of health. Mm. You know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah. So if that starts falling out or gets dull or your nails start breaking and it's all collagen 0 (55m 35s): And they get that like ozempic face is why 1 (55m 37s): College, which say the pillow face is in right now because everyone's on ozempic. So then they're fixing their ozempic face with pillow face. That's my theory. Oh, 0 (55m 46s): Interesting. 1 (55m 46s): Yeah. So just fill, fill up the gaunt. This 0 (55m 49s): Is all like on the, we're just on the trance human trajectory. You know, it's like we're, we're just like headed towards just like, give me a robotic arm and make me part dr like cyborg or whatever. And I do think even when my husband and I talk about like what, I never use Siri or any of those, I'm very like, I hate all those technologies and I, I just don't trust that bitch Siri. And he uses them very readily and he's like, give me all the technology. I'll do whatever, just like make it convenient and easy and turn off the lights with my voice and whatever. 0 (56m 31s): Like have a smart house and I'm like, oh it all sounds so creepy to me. And the one thing I would like is where you have some kind of chip that calculates like what, how much pro, how much actual stuff is in the stuff you're consuming? I'm like, I would probably be okay with that. I mean, there'd be bad uses of it and I don't want anyone to have access to that information, which would probably be impossible. But I would like something where it's like, you're dehydrated. You need to drink X amount of ounces of water and or, and like that that sandwich had, you know, here's the breakdown of what it, like you just ate seven grams of protein. 1 (57m 11s): See? But I feel like that creates more of the problem that we're seeing in everything else in our life right now. Which is becoming so detached from like our, from yourself, your own inner knowing. Like you know when you're thirsty. I know. So there's this thing with Dave, Dave Asprey, which I love him or hate him sometimes. He just has some zingers. And he was talking about, well how much water are you supposed to have in a day? And it's like eight glasses or it has to be a gallon. We 0 (57m 35s): Had no water growing up by the way. No. 1 (57m 37s): And he's like, no, you know how much water to drink. 'cause when you're thirsty you drink. 0 (57m 41s): Right. That's it. You're thirsty. Drink. But I went somewhere that when you're thirsty, you're already dehydrated 1 (57m 46s): Possibly. 0 (57m 47s): So it's already too late. You're actually already behind. 1 (57m 50s): Oh, then maybe Dave Basra is wrong. 0 (57m 52s): That's what I read somewhere. I mean, YiIVEM YiIVEM. No idea where I read that. But I remember, I feel like I learned that actually in pregnancy. A doctor was like, don't wait until you're thirsty. You're, because you have to drink so much water when you're pregnant. Yeah. As you know. And it's weird though. The kids are very on board with like their Stanley cups and they all walk around with, they're all 1 (58m 13s): Super hydrated. 0 (58m 13s): They're all very hydra. They're all into Sephora gift cards. All the young, I'm like my 9-year-old niece was talking about, you know, and she's has old school parents, not online. It's just in the culture and is like, I want a Sephora gift. I'm like, what do you need for Sephora? You perfect skin. Yeah. I I still barely have a skincare routine. Obviously mine's 1 (58m 38s): Toxic. It's not, not to she my skincare lady. 'cause she owns like a tiny little boutique and it's all like clean products, all that. She calls me a junkie 'cause I can in and I just, I was scooping 0 (58m 48s): Like, keep me young 1 (58m 49s): Forever. What do I need? 0 (58m 52s): Yeah. It's, and we live in that time too where it's like a youth culture that, that you're constantly chasing, you know, like youth forever. And I was, there's that whole idea of like, oh, if you're under the age of 45, you'll live to be 120. I'm like, that doesn't sound great, honestly. But 1 (59m 11s): What if you can do it? What if you can 0 (59m 12s): Do it? And then if I can do it like this. Yes. Sweet. Yeah. 1 (59m 16s): And maintain this level of, I 0 (59m 18s): Don't wanna be like Brian Johnson. 1 (59m 20s): Yeah. 0 (59m 20s): He's, he seems so creepy to 1 (59m 22s): Me. He so creepy. He looks better before I think. 0 (59m 24s): I think so too. 1 (59m 25s): Yeah. 0 (59m 27s): He's like, I look, I, my age is like all of these, like my, the age of my brain is now 35. Like a How do you calculate it? You don't, it is so weird to me. Yeah. But again, you have like, you have to like swap out your blood with like younger blood. This dude, you 1 (59m 42s): Have to get a blood boy. Yeah. 0 (59m 43s): This is like fucking, 1 (59m 45s): I don't make enough money to have a blood boy. So that's not even possibility. 0 (59m 48s): What you have one though. If you, if you, 1 (59m 50s): You could, I'd like do transfusion 0 (59m 51s): Young forever. 1 (59m 52s): Young. I don't know maybe. Honestly I've always kind of considered the idea of being a vampire. 0 (59m 57s): I love kind YiIVEM fucking outta control. Both of us are, there's like no consistency. We're like we can be sluts but also women be careful about being sluts. Just consciously 1 (1h 0m 9s): Make the choice. That's the thing. There's, you 0 (1h 0m 11s): Can be conscious about making a choice to have a blood boy Adam's you what the problem is he 1 (1h 0m 16s): Right. 0 (1h 0m 17s): It's probably better for you than ozempic. It's 1 (1h 0m 20s): Right. Yes. Probably 0 (1h 0m 22s): Like big farmer or a blood boy. I'll take the blood boy like just unhinged. 1 (1h 0m 32s): I would and I would feel, I would feel better about it as long as he was tested. I knew the blood was clean. Sure. Yeah. 0 (1h 0m 39s): Okay. 1 (1h 0m 39s): So he was happy to be there. He gave an enthusiastic Yes. 0 (1h 0m 43s): But does, can he consent to that? 1 (1h 0m 45s): Well then you get into a whole bunch of other things. Right. How do you feel 0 (1h 0m 47s): About, about surrogacy 1 (1h 0m 48s): Sell? I think for all of the talk that everyone has about exploitation and marginalized groups and vulnerable groups and using that for the porn discussion seems exclusively, why are we ignoring surrogacy? 'cause to me that is 0 (1h 1m 7s): The most 1 (1h 1m 8s): Intimate ma magical spiritual thing I've ever done is have a baby. Yeah. It is like trans. It's transformative. And they've done studies. If you have the baby like a surrogate and it, so it's someone else's egg, when the baby is born, the baby shows a preference for the birth mother, not the genetic mother. Oh. So there's something there like you are, they're with you for nine or 10 months hearing you, smelling, you, feeling you the energy that goes into that. And that's not woo. And everything is a wave of frequency. So there is something that's happening bonding in that relationship. And then you take that baby away and give it to this other new person that they have no idea who it is. 1 (1h 1m 50s): I don't know that that's consequence free. I think, I don't know that the government should get involved in that, but personally they 0 (1h 1m 57s): Did in Italy. Italy just 1 (1h 1m 59s): Banned it. Did they? It seems like you have to be in a really dire position to be taking money to carry someone else's baby. 0 (1h 2m 10s): Maybe. I mean the women who do it argue say that. Well one thing I didn't know is that when you talk about informed consent, you had to have had a child before 1 (1h 2m 20s): In this us that's a law in 0 (1h 2m 21s): The US you have to, you have to have had a child before you can become a surrogate. Okay. And I think, I'm pretty sure it might be a state by state, but I believe, I wish we had a Jamie. I believe you have to, I believe you have to have had a child in order to be a surrogate because you had you like again, you can't know what you don't know that. I could be wrong about that though. 1 (1h 2m 45s): But that wouldn't explain then all the women that have the baby and then they take it. So if she's having a baby for say a gay couple or a lesbian couple and the birth mom actually is like, no, I'm not gonna give you the baby. Yeah. 0 (1h 2m 56s): Whenever I see those videos online of like the, the, I don't know, I, I feel like it was one of the things that I got pretty, I have conflicting feelings about it, but I feel like the baby is really the last person who's taken into consideration in the, it's 1 (1h 3m 10s): Not a 0 (1h 3m 10s): Requirement. Oh, okay. Someone told me it was maybe it California. 1 (1h 3m 16s): I'd be Yeah, I'd be surprised. 'cause that seems responsible to say that. Yeah. But yeah. 0 (1h 3m 21s): Or maybe it wasn't some like another country. I feel like somewhere that is a requirement, but perhaps it's not. I mean I know it's not like Ukraine. 1 (1h 3m 29s): I just think it is, it's so gray and I understand why. Like I was told I was infertile at a really young age. I had endometriosis, I have Graves disease. So like a lot of autoimmune stuff. And that's actually what led me to breaking up with my ex. 'cause he wanted kids and they told me I couldn't. Mm. So that just like, that destroyed the relationship, thank God. But I know how devastating it is to want a baby and be told you can't have a baby. And I entertained that when I was younger. It's like I'll just, you know, I'll be a, I'll do a surrogate or I'll do IVF or I'll even adopt like I'm going to be a mom. But you have to say at what cost. Right. And it's affecting so many people. So I don't know that that is the highest vibration decision to make. 1 (1h 4m 13s): Like I don't, I don't know, again, I don't know that I want the government getting involved in it. And I saw that Trump was saying that he's gonna have insurance cover it because we need more people. Yeah, exactly. 0 (1h 4m 21s): So 1 (1h 4m 22s): That's the thing too. So like right now maybe based off where we are globally, it's just like let's be pro like human pro-life. 0 (1h 4m 29s): Yeah. 1 (1h 4m 29s): So if it's gonna create life, if it's gonna create more life, then let's support that for now. And maybe that is the greatest good. Yeah. I have no idea. 0 (1h 4m 37s): There are those situations of like, you can't have another one and you want another one. And you are, you had cancer and you had to like, right. You need, there's 1 (1h 4m 46s): So much nuance to it. 0 (1h 4m 47s): And should they be deprived of having a child? Because it's still, I was still, it's still very strange. It's a strange one. I was kind of radicalized when I had a baby. 'cause I was like, what? They take the, the, you see how much a baby needs you? Oh, 1 (1h 5m 3s): I could not, I could, I could not. I could not. I could never carry a baby. That was not gonna be my baby. Yeah. Because I would be, I would be broken fundamentally after 0 (1h 5m 11s): That. Well that was so much of the only thing that helped me in postpartum was being, and they say that this is like the most, you know, 'cause everybody comes over and they wanna take the baby, they wanna hold the baby. And holding the baby was like the most healing thing for all of those hormones. Like, I, I felt normal when I was with her. You know, it was like, okay, when they, when the grandparents were over and they were with her for too long of a time, I could feel the like darkness creeping in and the hormones. And I didn't have experience like postpartum depression. But a lot of it was just, I was just with her. And I know that that like symbiotic thing was healing for me in postpartum recovery. 0 (1h 5m 57s): It's like when you see the, what women go through when they have preemies and they're, they have to leave them at the ho It is just gut wrenching just to have to like leave your baby at the hospital and then you, you are experiencing all those hormones and you can't be with your baby. And they're still in there. It's, women are gnarly man. We just like, it's actually crazy how strong. I always, I was saying this on dumpster fire yesterday. I was like, we have carried this species on our backs and in our wombs and you, and it is wild what women are capable of. Even though, and I do wanna see more of a, and I and men have done so much to provide safety and, and I see the, you know, when you see this election, you see how damaged the rhetoric for men and women has been in our culture. 0 (1h 6m 47s): You see how much of the right has a woman problem if they're like, oh, the crazy cat ladies and the Body Count discussion and on the left you have a real man problem, which is all men are the scourge of the earth and they're toxic rapists. And they are all like, the patriarchy needs to be smashed. And, and that, and then you see birth rates collapsing and you see real political problems with this that aren't gonna resolve themself until the two sexes kind of come back together. 1 (1h 7m 20s): And then how do you facilitate that? 0 (1h 7m 23s): How do you facilitate it? 1 (1h 7m 24s): I think you try to get people offline because all of the things that we've mentioned that I'm sure the comment section is gonna be full of. And I'm, we're we're both gonna be called whores a thousand times over. And that's well hos that's fine. But that doesn't happen when we walk out of the building. Right. It's, it's yet to happen. And 0 (1h 7m 45s): Maybe we'll blow up and then people 1 (1h 7m 47s): Will just be like 0 (1h 7m 48s): Whores with their pitchforks. You fucking whores. I've had this reoccurring dream where people are calling me whores in a mall and I know that it's not gonna happen because malls don't exist anymore. But it is a weird reoccurring dream I have where like people are literally 1 (1h 8m 4s): Like, but is that like the worst thing either? 0 (1h 8m 7s): You know, I no, I, I I'll take it. I'll take it if it means that we have, I mean that's the thing about the regret being a slut piece that was, I heard from so many people and gay men just like the out it was, it's had like half a million reads. Wow. It's crazy. There's something there. You know, there's, there is a men and women responded to that piece. Gay men too. It, there's something 1 (1h 8m 32s): Surprising 'cause they are known for 0 (1h 8m 34s): And they have sleeping around some regrets about their promiscuity. And it's not, it's not, I I and I think our culture is so regret averse, you know, people had so many issues with me using the word regret. I was like, you're allowed to regret things in your life that's just being a human. And it's like, no, you've gotta, you know, I think it's this like, like yolo attitude that we all try to in inhabit and, and live with in our, you know, like Bed Bath and Beyond Pillow world that has the like, expressions on it where it's just like the meat, the, the platitudes that were like Yolo, we got this. 1 (1h 9m 17s): See, the thing that changed the most for me with how I look at sexuality and sex in becoming older is it's not, it's not like a number thing. It's not, if you keep it under this number, you're gonna feel okay about yourself. Right. Or if it's only in a relationship, you're gonna feel okay about yourself. 'cause I've been in a relationship where that I should not have slept with that person at all. I think it's who deserves to be in that intimate space with you. Right. And that can be someone that is casual that you met and you really deeply connected with and you know that they're gonna respect you and they're gonna take care of you in that space. Right. And then that can also be in relationship, but in the same token, you can be in a relationship with someone who does not deserve to be with you in that intimate space. So it's just looking at the individual and saying like, a is this a full body? 1 (1h 9m 60s): Yes. On my part? Do I want this even though I know it's gonna be fleeting? And then b, which is an important thing is does this person deserve to be in that space with me? And the answer's not always gonna be yes to that. Yeah. So if you are calculating those two things, I think you're gonna be in a good spot. And you could be with 10 guys, but if they were all like so conscientious of you and your pleasure and your safety and all of those things, then like Absolutely. I don't think you're gonna walk away with that feeling used or regret. I think that that happens when you're with someone who is not mature enough to be with you and they're gonna be self-centered and focused on only on their pleasure and they look at you as a thing to be disposed of. Well you shouldn't be interacting with that person at all. Yeah. 0 (1h 10m 38s): You know? But we live in a very disposable culture. 1 (1h 10m 41s): You can and you choose your like level you wanna play at, play at. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, so with pe with me, it's like you're, you would never find love. You're never gonna find someone who finds you desirable long term. Like it's only 0 (1h 10m 54s): Gonna, we're not wife material. 1 (1h 10m 55s): Yeah. I've had even like some of my close friends say not, 0 (1h 10m 57s): We're not wife material though. No, 1 (1h 10m 59s): We're not for, we're not for novice players. I'll say that. But if you, I 0 (1h 11m 3s): Have as the title of this episode for not wife material. 1 (1h 11m 8s): No, no, no, no. They were right. 0 (1h 11m 10s): But the trolls are always right by the way. And you just gotta wait. Yeah. Just wait long enough. Trolls will be right. Oh my gosh. No, I, it is, it is hard because you Yeah, I, the, I don't know. And then you go through like the phase of your life where you enter into like perimenopause, menopause. And my therapist is like, women burn their entire lives down in this phase because they go crazy. And I'm like, are they going crazy or are they just seeing things clearly that they didn't see before? Is it, how do you gauge that? 0 (1h 11m 53s): Are they just like entering into their giving zero fucks phase of their womanhood? And part of entering into that is seeing things that you may have lied to yourself about or things that you tolerated that are no longer tolerable entering into and you know, closer to the end of your life and realizing how precious it is. I, I mean I, I don't know. It's, it's, I think it's easy to, in our culture kind of make, make pathologize everything. Like, oh, this is something that's bad when it's like, is is it? But I, it's, it's very, 3 (1h 12m 33s): Hmm. 0 (1h 12m 35s): I do, I do think because you and I both come from essentially porn, I mean even if I wasn't doing porn, I was still selling it's porn. Right. You can turn that porn. I don't, but porn to me is penetration. Okay. Yeah. So then no, it's not porn. Sweet. A lot of the trolls would tell me that Less Less of a whore than you thought you were. Slightly less of a whore than I thought. Thank you. The horse ways. It's funny, like thinking about how many great horrors of your there were, I loved that movie Dangerous Beauty because have you ever seen it? 0 (1h 13m 17s): No. What? I'm gonna put up my movie list. Oh my God. You have to see that movie. You have to see it. I'm gonna, I have a movie. It's all about a cortisone. She was actually a real person. Oh really? And they got to go to the libraries and like learn all the cool stuff. What was it called again? Dangerous Beauty. Okay. It's a true, I think it's based on a true story. She was a poet poetess and she was also a cortisone, but they were the ones who are allowed to learn and go to libraries. And there's this great line in the movie about, and it's with a wife and she's like taking her through Venice, showing her how the horror, the cortisone end up and they're, it's not good. 0 (1h 13m 59s): And she, like, I would much rather live that than live a life of perpetual inconsequence that I do as a wife. And it's like, it's, well it's such a fascinating movie about exactly this dynamic that you and I are talking about that Madonna and the horror, which has played out for women forever and I'm not sure we'll ever be able to escape it. 1 (1h 14m 22s): See, to me, my perspective is it's actually kind of new. So that is it. Yeah. There's this f like this fallacy of the way you have to go do our shoot. I know this is this fallacy of how like things have always been the fallacy of tradition. But if you look at human existence, it's been hundreds of thousands of years. Mm. And it has been a blip that we've had this puritanical culture. It has been a blip that we've had a nuclear family, it has been a blip that we have been monogamous. Monogamous meaning man and a woman. And they're together for the rest of their lives. Monogamy used to mean even just shortly, not that long ago, it was until one person dies, which is about 10 years. So a lot of these things that we think are long held and must be true because of tradition are actually not tradition if you look at the whole scope of how we've existed. 1 (1h 15m 7s): So I think it's something that we're playing around with. I think it's something that doesn't work when you look at divorce rates and you look at infidelity rates because you can't just look at, well they've been married for 60 years. Well how much were they faithful for and how happy are they? Like those aren't metrics to be ignored either. And men cheat just as much as women cheat. So we can't pretend that women don't have sexuality and they don't have desire because they're cheating at the same rates as men. Are they within marriage? Yeah. Oh, I thought it 0 (1h 15m 31s): Was is was men 1 (1h 15m 32s): More? It's about 50 50. 0 (1h 15m 34s): Interesting. So 1 (1h 15m 35s): I 0 (1h 15m 35s): Think is it like physical? Physical? What do they consider cheating? 1 (1h 15m 39s): Yeah, physical cheating. Okay. Yeah, I think if you were to take into like texting and stuff, it would probably be the same because of social media and all of those things. But I think it, the whole, the whole point that I wanna get across with like my podcast and my work and this conversation is to just radically choose your life for yourself. Like make the decisions for you that are in, in alignment for you. And fuck everyone that's telling you that there's one way to live. Because, but what about the kids? What do you mean? Like your kids or like the kids? 0 (1h 16m 7s): The kid I for 1 (1h 16m 8s): Them? Yes. Like they have to figure out what kind of life that they want. 0 (1h 16m 11s): No, but I mean, what about, I think often you make decisions once you become a parent that are better for your kids than they are for you. 1 (1h 16m 19s): I think what tends to be good for you is probably good for your kids. 'cause more is caught than taught. Right? So if you are constantly in this place of self, self-sacrifice and you're not taking care of yourself and you're not following your dreams, you're teaching your kids to not follow their dreams or that, let's say you're having, you have boys, you're teaching them that the wife has to automatically give up on herself and her identity and that becomes just a mom. What happens when the kids leave, she goes into depression, she loses her sense of self. She ends up in a divorce or like a totally lifeless marriage because now her whole core identity, which was mom, has now been ripped away. So it's, I think it's so complex and it's like how can I be like the most whole person that I can be the, like the most alive, the most like the person that's con contributing the most. 1 (1h 17m 5s): Like all of these things that you would want for your kid and then that is modeled and then that's the important thing. But if you're in this marriage that like you're not affectionate and well you're, you're still married, well you're teaching 'em that they don't deserve affection. Yeah. Right. Like a marriage is just something that you get through. It's an agreement and I'm gonna do it. It's like, well no, I want more for my kids than that. So I think there's a lot of nuance and no one can tell you what decision is right for you because your life is entirely different. And how that's gonna be play out is yet to be seen. So make your decisions yourself, find your alignment and move fast forward. 0 (1h 17m 40s): I love that. 1 (1h 17m 41s): But we'll do this again. I'm bringing you to North Carolina. It is like my mission to bring it to North Carolina. Yeah. And I, 'cause I wanted to do it again. Do long format. Yeah. But let's go do our shoot. Okay. And then check out, we're gonna post it on social media. I think it's gonna go on your substack and you guys can come see com. Yeah. 0 (1h 17m 58s): And yeah, we'll do, we'll do lots of these things. 1 (1h 18m 0s): I'd love to, yeah. We'll probably be 0 (1h 18m 1s): Sister wives. Let's do it. 1 (1h 18m 4s): To be continued. Bye everybody. 0 (1h 18m 7s): Bye.
