CD129: BETTER TWITCH WITH KIERAN OF ZAP STREAM

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Transcription provided by Podhome.fm
Created: 4/30/2024 11:10:58 PM
Duration: 7395.733
Channels: 1

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Coin itself. I've heard you say this on a few,

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interviews or podcasts and on on the media. A $1,000,000

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for Bitcoin.

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Walk us through your thesis of how it could get there. I just don't think that enough people have a big enough imagination

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of this upcoming cycle I'm expecting.

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I mean, the bond market is in trouble,

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for really, arguably the first time in modern financial history. Bond holders are getting absolutely demolished and crushed. Now, David, who owns

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bonds? All of our banks. So our our bank deposits aren't there because the bonds that

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were purchased with my deposit is underwater.

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And so if central banks and government is going to try and save that market, the amount of liquidity

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that's needed is going to send assets

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very high. I mean, you can try and do napkin math, and I I joke, like, how many COVIDs are we gonna get if they try and bail out this market that we're in today? You may get 2, 3 COVID. So

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if that happens, it's impossible to speculate on an asset as scarce as Bitcoin, but I think 250,000

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to a1000000

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is the imagination I have in that range of just how big this can get, and that's based on all the liquidity that's gonna be required to make this market solvent.

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Is that based on,

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a steepening of the adoption curve, which we'll talk about in just a minute? Or is that just based on normal market action, like, more liquidity like you like you mentioned in the natural course of time just passing? Like, what what is the catalyst is basically what I'm asking. I think all the above. Well, you're we're talking about pricing

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Bitcoin in a piece of paper that's being actively debased. Right? So maybe more interesting question is, you know, how many houses can I get for my Bitcoins in a year? But

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given the fact that it is in dollars, I think that's where your imagination has to go insanely high because of the predicament that the government is in.

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On the other side of that, though, on the the talk of adoption and just the notion of it, I think price is the most accurate KPI we have into Bitcoin adoption. What price tells me is a rather accurate measurement of how much of the world is using Bitcoin as money.

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And so I expect more of the world to take on Bitcoin as money, whether it be for any form of use case or value to them because it is so appealing in solving so many different problems. So I expect

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adoption of Bitcoin as as a monetary unit to go up. And then against the dollar in particular, and other fiat currencies, I expect it to be violent to the upside.

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Happy Bitcoin Tuesday, freaks. It's your host, Odell, here for another Citadel Dispatch,

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the interactive

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live show focused on actionable Bitcoin and Freedom Tech discussion.

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That intro was our boy, Jack Maers

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Mallers. I always mispronounce his name.

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And I warned him not to make a public price call. I learned my lesson

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last cycle, but he did. So it was important to start

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this dispatch

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with it so we have a record of it going forward.

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No more price calls for me. Just stay humble, Stack Sats.

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It's been a big week. We had a great rip yesterday with Carlos.

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We have a great rip tomorrow

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with Ben Arc.

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Little blitz week blitz week of dispatch.

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But today's episode is going to be a great conversation. I'm really looking forward to it.

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We have our boy Kieran here,

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prolific Noster developer.

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Has his two main projects are ZapStream and Snort.

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How's it going, Kieran?

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It's going pretty good. Happy to be here.

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Thanks thanks for joining. I just wanna do a quick

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thank you to Kieran

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and to the freaks. I know I said that we were gonna start,

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like, 45 minutes ago.

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But I had ran into some babysitter issues, and my babysitter was late, and Karen was really good about it. So,

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life comes at you fast,

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but we're here, and we're gonna have a great conversation.

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Kieran,

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We have a lot to talk about. I know Kieran is one of those humble guys that, like, when I asked him to come first of all, I had to, like, seduce him to get him on the show.

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He

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refused. He He said we have nothing to talk about. What is there to talk about? I think we have plenty to talk about.

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But I would like to start with Zap Stream. It's a project that I rely on heavily.

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We've moved, you know, the the majority of of the of the dispatch audience,

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watches and interacts live with dispatch through our Zap stream. You can get to it at sitaldispatch.com/stream.

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It's got Bitcoin built in. It's got the nice live chat.

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First of all, thank you for building it.

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But how how do you think how do you think about ZapStream?

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Well, I guess ZapStream kind

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of was just like another random idea, you know, same as Snort. You know, it was more like

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I wanted to try and build something.

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I didn't really have any like grand vision in the beginning.

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Cause even originally the, like the live streaming stuff was kind of, it was actually embedded

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inside of snort originally.

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And then I'm like, maybe I should just make a real, like Noster client for live streaming. It's people seem to like it.

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And that's kind of where it started. And then it's kind of just been growing and growing, like

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all the different feature requests people have been asking for and

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kind of just aiming for,

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you know, feature

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parity with Twitch is basically where we're we're aiming for. And I think we're we're pretty much there, I guess, in a lot of ways.

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Yeah. I mean, I think,

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first of all, I think there's, like, a order of operations here, and I think you kinda nailed it.

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The the freaks are having fun. The the stream chat is literally just zaps right now except for one guy.

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I,

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it's there's an order of operations here. It's like you build out a really nice

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web video client that is it is literally going after Twitch. Right? I I had a lot of trouble naming this episode, but I just named it better Twitch even though we're gonna talk about a lot of things,

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because I do think it's significantly better Twitch,

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Twitch being the the video streaming platform,

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that Amazon bought.

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But then you start you start with that, a a client that is incredibly focused. And then, I mean, the dream for me

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and we see it in Amethyst. We see it in Snort. I I assume we see it in a couple other clients that are not on my radar. The dream is that it then gets integrated after the fact into all the major clients. Right?

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Yeah. Like, Nasrudl,

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I mean, they Hazard implemented it pretty quickly because he was like, this is great. So and he he also does that with a lot of other stuff, like the the torrents as well.

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So Nostradiol is like the the ultimate toolbox, Noster toolbox, because they pretty much implements everything.

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And yeah, Amethyst as well had it pretty soon after.

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I think that's the only

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the only the only major, like, social noster clients that have it. Not aware of any others.

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So,

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I mean, I had

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I had Hazard

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and Stew on,

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a couple weeks ago,

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and they were talking about the blossom spec.

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Do you have any thoughts on where ZapStream falls into that conversation?

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Well, funnily enough, I'm actually building a blossom server right now,

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in Rust.

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So I'm kind of trying to

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I'm trying to see where where where we can take it, you know, for at least from my project perspectives.

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Like with snort, we already support like NIP 96, which is very similar

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kind of file uploading spec to blossom.

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So, yeah, it would be cool to support it in Snort and on maybe on Zaps upstream as well.

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My goal with my kind of immediate goal with what's upstream is to build like this new backend in rust.

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And the goal, the main purpose of that is to obviously

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learn how to do like heavy media processing,

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you know, at a scale that

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at the scale of Twitch is out basically.

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Like, how do we, how do we scale upstream

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And also to kind of help with the

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decentralization of upstream.

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Yeah. I mean, this is obviously easier said than done.

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It's been a business that's been dominated by the big boys because it's quite expensive.

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Yeah. So the the angle that I'm I'm kind of going at here is is like

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a marketplace of

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a marketplace of ZapStream providers, pretty much.

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So this, this kind of backend will be hopefully

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anyone could run it and they can offer their own

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streaming back end on ZapStream.

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And then, obviously, there'll be, like, a a reputation that goes with that. That's pretty cool. So like if we had a falling out and you didn't like me anymore, I could still stream.

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Yeah. Because like right now I'm just beholding,

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beholding on you providing it. Well, I mean, you can always still you can still host your own stream. There's, like, the manual stream option. So Right. You can just link to some other platform.

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So it's basically that. It's basically the manual streams like

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but someone else's back end, you know, like a paid back another paid paid back end. That's not the

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the ZapStream back end.

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Well, let's so let's talk about this a little bit. So I one of the things

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that I've always been fascinated by is

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simple solutions to hard problems

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and the and, you know, or simple mitigations because

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it's almost never a full solution, but,

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but rather more of an improvement.

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And one of those things is

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this idea that one of the reasons I like Twitch, YouTube, you know, YouTube's owned by Google. Twitch is owned by Amazon.

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One of the reasons and, obviously, Spotify is the elephant in the room on the audio side.

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One of the reasons why we see

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these kind of media

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platforms and streaming platforms

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centralized is because of of the massive costs,

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massive costs associated with operating them. And what happens is the users are are used to uploading for free,

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so the platform has to then

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take on that burden early

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and forever.

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And then they try and monetize from ads or,

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user or data harvesting or something like that. But but you took a a distinct

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distinctly different approach.

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The user the broadcaster,

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me, in this situation, has to essentially load

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sats into my account,

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and then I pay for every minute that I broadcast.

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I think that is is quite clever, but I I am curious.

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Does that actually cover your cost, or are you charging too little?

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The way that I calculate the cost is, like,

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you know, I'm basically targeting for a certain number of 247

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streams.

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So, like, I say that

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if we can have because I only have a certain amount of capacity as well, like, in my actual servers that we're where it's deployed. Got it. Hopefully, that will be increasing. But in the current setup, it's like

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I can only like, one stream with with all of the different, like, qualities, like the the 720p and the 10 80p and the 480p

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that uses about, like, 1 CPU on average. It depends on the bit rate, but usually around 1 CPU.

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And I have around 30 or 40 CPUs.

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I can't remember.

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But, so basically I I worked it out like, okay, if I could have,

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you know, I didn't wanna have the full server, like, killed by stream. So I said, like, if I can have, like,

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10 or 15,

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247 streams, like, how much how many SaaS would that be to cover the server cost? And that's basically how I worked out the pricing.

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So obviously right now there's like

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like some of them are on the cheaper rates, like the the ones that are like 247, they usually use the the basic rate. So that's only like 1 sat per minute.

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But the this stream and, like, people who stream regularly,

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they usually use the the higher rates, like, the the good rate or the best rate.

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Wait. What rate am I on?

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This is the best rate. If you don't have recording, it's the best rate. Okay.

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Yeah. There's there's 3 different rates which people really get confused about because they're Dude, I'm a power user. I had no idea there's 3 different rates.

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Yeah. The basic rate is, like, no no transcoding. So, like, it doesn't use any CPU. So that's why I'm, like, just have it at 1 sat per minute.

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So it's pretty much pass through. So if you upload, like, a a 720p stream, that's what the viewers will get. Like, we don't actually transcode the video.

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So that's like a cheap way for people to run 247 channels like no good and

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lightning the jukebox one.

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Yeah. There's 3 rates, which you don't actually see now. Because originally, like, it used to have, like, all the rates on display, and people got really confused about the different rates.

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So we're like, okay. Well, just let everyone use the best rate,

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because, you know, maybe probably people don't want VODs maybe most of the time if they're just doing, like, random testing.

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So it defaults to the good right now.

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So that's the one you see. But if you go into settings, you should see the 3 of them.

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Yeah. I might have went into settings at one one point and saw, like, I was on best, and I was like, well, I don't want anything less than the best.

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That one has recording. Yeah. Wait. So do I have recording enabled?

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I'd have to check your last one. I I don't know, like, right now what you're using, but

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God. It's like a live tech support

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show.

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ZapStream.

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I'm checking.

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If they have a recording, basically, like, if you go into the old video and it it starts playing, then that's their guess rate. I'm on best. I see I'm on best.

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Yeah. If I'm on best, does that automatically record or no? Is that

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separate? Yeah. It does.

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So then it should be recording. Right? Yeah. Profile.

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Meanwhile, I just go and upload to satellite.earth

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afterwards.

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Anyway oh, yeah. They're all here. Yeah. So there there's, like, it's store like I said, it's

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storing, like, 90 90 days, I think. 1, 2, 3. 90 days, it gets deleted.

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Because I have, like, 7 terabytes of recording already.

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Yeah. That's insane. You have 23

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23 past episodes and 2 clips of of dispatch on yours on your servers right now. Yeah. I think it actually it might still show them even even if the, like, recording is deleted.

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Oh. Yeah. It does. Yeah. I think if you click onto it, it will it likes to say offline or or ended.

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Offline.

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Doesn't work. Okay. So maybe not.

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But this one says ended.

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So maybe they aren't recording.

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Do I have to toggle something?

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Well, I guess it depends what you set up in Restream. Like, it won't show you what you're currently using pretty much on the settings. It'll just it'll just say, like, these are the options.

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Wait. I'll restream, I can set recording?

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Yeah. You set, like, your the URL is, like, for the different variants, the different,

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plans.

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So the, if the URL ends with, like, the RTMP URL

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that ends with,

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slash

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live, I think. Yeah. Or live 2. Live 2 is good and live is, like, best.

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Oh, I I think I use live. Yeah. So that's best. But so then it should be recording, but it's not recording.

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And

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is it not?

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Maybe it's just slow.

216
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It's just that good. Yeah. Super long recordings. It might take a while to actually start playing. I mean, I am just I'm kinda DDoSing you,

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making you

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learn by fire.

219
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Okay. Well, enough of that. I mean, I think It is it is there. Yeah. The recording's there. Oh, they are? Yeah. I don't know why it should be playing that.

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What? Did you check the last one with Carlos?

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Yeah.

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This is great. I love the live tech support episodes.

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Thank you, Freaks, for,

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sticking with us. I mean so, I mean, that goes to my next question, though. How do you how do you feel about recordings? Like, I'm loading up your

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you have 7 terabytes. Like, the people don't realize this. Like, I went through this pain

226
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with Bitcoin TV.

227
00:17:14.080 --> 00:17:20.245
It gets expensive pretty fast, and then I guess I guess auto delete. Right? You said 90 days.

228
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Yeah. 90 days. Handles that.

229
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Well, that's the only reason Is that where the majority of cost is? Is on the actual recordings and people playing back to recordings afterwards? Well, I mean, I I have, like, a certain amount of capacity, so it's not really costing me anything for storage because I'm already paying, like, a flat rate. Okay. Got it. But then it it it would hurt concurrent streams if people are watching recordings at the same time or something?

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Not really. It's just served from, like, a different place. So it's like some some disk load but like not nothing Oh, because you don't have to do any transcoding at that point? Yeah. It's it's literally just like giving you the stream as it was recorded, like sent to the server. So it's like an identical copy

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of what you

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pushed to the ZapStream back end. Let me just save it and then replay it.

233
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Got it. I mean, I,

234
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I mean, so that's if we wanna talk about blossom to bring it back to blossom. Right? Like, that's

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the the beauty would be if that recording

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was then recorded per Blossom spec. So it was hashed,

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signed by my pub key,

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and then

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after the 90 days, maybe another server picks it up if it's a worthwhile piece of content. Right?

240
00:18:33.520 --> 00:18:41.415
Yeah. Like, we could have instead of, like, pointing to my recording back end, you could, like, point the recording to your Blossom server.

241
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Yeah. That's badass.

242
00:18:43.450 --> 00:18:45.710
Then I that that would be awesome.

243
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That would be awesome.

244
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If only somebody would build it.

245
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Well,

246
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I'm I'm not the builder. I'm the supporter, so I really have I have nothing I can say except, I would love it. It would be awesome.

247
00:19:00.530 --> 00:19:04.790
Yeah. I'm interested to to see what we can do at Blossom. That's why I'm I'm building something.

248
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Trying to add

249
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I'm trying to upgrade, basically. I have this file host void cache, which is like the default on zaps on

250
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Snort.

251
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And, yeah, I kinda wanted to it's built in c sharp, and I kind of wanted to make it, like, more efficient

252
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because it's not very

253
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it's not very efficient in how it's because we're doing, like, media compression.

254
00:19:27.029 --> 00:19:27.529
Right.

255
00:19:28.185 --> 00:19:32.445
But I wanted to do it, like, in a more efficient way, and I wanted to support Blossom. So

256
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I figured I'm I'm kinda on this, like,

257
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this rust learning

258
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mission right now to get better at Rust. That's the best way to learn is by doing. Right? Exactly.

259
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Awesome. Well, Freaks, as always I mean, now more than ever for this for this rip, but feel free to put any questions you have,

260
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for Kieran in the comments.

261
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I see a question from Cypher Citizen that I get a lot.

262
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Currently, there's no way

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to rewind a live show. Right?

264
00:20:05.895 --> 00:20:07.915
No. It only gives you, like, the last,

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like,

266
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I think 60 seconds

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in in the playlist.

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So,

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I mean, technically, you can. Like, the the segments are there, but the play the playlist only tells you that there's, like, one minute of video, so

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you can't actually go backwards.

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And that's a is that a technical limitation on how you have it set up? Yeah.

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I mean, because

273
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but right now, what I see a lot of freaks do is they

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they'll come in. They'll be like, oh, shit. I'm late.

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And then they leave the the chat for ZapStream up, and then they go to YouTube. They go back to the beginning on YouTube,

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and,

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they do, like, 1.5x

278
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or something to catch up,

279
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which I guess works. You know? Yeah.

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Hacks all the way down.

281
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Yeah. For sure. Maybe with the new back end, we could support that.

282
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So, anyway, Kieran, you make all this sound really easy,

283
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which I'm sure it's not.

284
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Are like, what are the biggest

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besides this back end that you're trying to make more performant,

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what are what are the what are the biggest hurdles that you're facing on ZapStream build out? Like like, where are the pain points?

287
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I think

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I mean, what we have right now is, like,

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it's pretty straightforward

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from

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that's how I feel about it anyway. But,

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like, we have the

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the stream events. We have this hosted back end. I mean, it's pretty pretty much straightforward.

294
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But if you wanted to do, like,

295
00:21:43.045 --> 00:21:46.265
more advanced things, and this is kind of the same problem we have across

296
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all areas of Noster is, like, how do you actually curate the the right content for the view like, the person?

297
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Or, like, how do

298
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you show relevant things to them? Right. Webs of trust.

299
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Well, yeah. Webs of trust is 1.

300
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But even, like, popular,

301
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like,

302
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popular

303
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games or popular categories is is something I wanna build as well.

304
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So,

305
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yeah, that's kind of where I'm I'm looking at right now is, like, can we show

306
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maybe can we follow categories or can we

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show

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categories which people are are used to watching and, like, who's who's streaming in those categories? And

309
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also for people coming to the site, like, how do they how do they know what to stream, like, what game to stream, for example.

310
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We could show, like, okay, this this category Unlike the broadcaster side you mean? Yeah. Yeah. Well it'll be on the you know the viewers will see it as well. It's like

311
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in this game you know the x amount of sats has been

312
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zapped basically. Oh you'll get more money if you stream this game. Yeah basically. So like if you go into like the categories

313
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I don't it doesn't actually show you, like, the whole game list right now,

314
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but we could do, like,

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a list of the people who are live right now and what games they're playing and then show, like, okay, this game has, like,

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10 ks SATs and this game has 5 ks SATs. And then you can kind of

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work out, like, okay, maybe I should stream that game because people seem to like it, you know? So it gives a bit of a feedback for the for people who want to stream, you know, they they can see, like,

318
00:23:17.980 --> 00:23:22.320
oh, I could earn 10,000 sats playing this game. You know? Yeah. I mean, I like that.

319
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I would I would also like,

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you know, I've been with dispatch. Dispatch is

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is a pure value for value show,

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and

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value for value, at least,

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for the way that Adam Curry,

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like,

326
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explains it

327
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and markets it, I guess, is is this idea, right, that that the user

328
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you're providing the value,

329
00:23:53.220 --> 00:23:56.200
and then the broadcaster provides the value, and then the user,

330
00:23:57.535 --> 00:24:01.475
after the fact, is kind of choosing what kind of value is provided.

331
00:24:02.575 --> 00:24:03.715
But one thing that

332
00:24:04.575 --> 00:24:05.075
which

333
00:24:05.400 --> 00:24:08.460
has has been a rough road, and I I think just in general,

334
00:24:08.920 --> 00:24:15.055
it's probably just really early. I mean, we don't have that many Bitcoiners, and then there's, like, a subset of that that are actually,

335
00:24:15.755 --> 00:24:20.415
you know, participating in the like, I always say, like, dispatch runs on the rider dies.

336
00:24:20.780 --> 00:24:21.440
You know?

337
00:24:21.900 --> 00:24:29.605
So that that's a a smaller subset of the overall listener base, and it's just gonna take time adoption wise. But one thing I noticed,

338
00:24:30.385 --> 00:24:31.525
that has found

339
00:24:32.065 --> 00:24:32.805
pretty good,

340
00:24:34.065 --> 00:24:36.805
fit, and he he gets a lot of stats for it,

341
00:24:37.470 --> 00:24:37.970
is

342
00:24:38.429 --> 00:24:44.210
is Guy Swan, like, has this niche, right, where he just, like, reads other people's articles and books.

343
00:24:45.225 --> 00:24:47.165
And he has, like, on his website,

344
00:24:49.145 --> 00:24:50.525
what should I read next?

345
00:24:51.465 --> 00:24:56.610
And people pay, like, a decent amount of sats, like, more than dispatch it makes

346
00:24:57.230 --> 00:24:58.529
to to,

347
00:24:59.230 --> 00:25:11.385
you know, to get up on that leaderboard to get him to read what they want him to read. And so it's it's a little bit different than, like, strictly value for value. It's it's value before value or something. I don't know.

348
00:25:11.789 --> 00:25:16.929
I don't have a term for it. But there's something there also with streaming, I think. Right? It's like,

349
00:25:17.870 --> 00:25:20.429
if if listeners could tell me what topics

350
00:25:21.325 --> 00:25:25.825
Like, right now, it's it's Odell chooses what topics he thinks are interesting.

351
00:25:26.365 --> 00:25:32.929
And I'm just, like, making a guesstimation on what the audience wants to talk about. But if if they had a way of

352
00:25:33.230 --> 00:25:37.570
essentially putting a bounty up, right, just like, if Odell gets Kieran on the stream,

353
00:25:37.950 --> 00:25:40.370
like, he gets 200,000 sats or something,

354
00:25:40.895 --> 00:25:43.775
that could be that could be really interesting. And then you could take,

355
00:25:44.735 --> 00:25:46.434
like, that's also another monetization

356
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path for whoever this app stream host is. I mean, if there's many of these app stream instances, like you're kinda suggesting,

357
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where they take a cut of

358
00:25:55.060 --> 00:25:55.880
of that,

359
00:25:56.365 --> 00:25:57.825
you know, pre revenue.

360
00:25:59.485 --> 00:26:01.505
I guess, yeah, you could have, like, a

361
00:26:02.125 --> 00:26:07.620
I guess you could have, like, a a broadcast goal because obviously you have, like, zap goals that are, like

362
00:26:08.100 --> 00:26:10.120
that you have at the top of the the stream.

363
00:26:10.420 --> 00:26:16.654
By the way, I when I went to my past streams to see if there recordings, there I've only done one Zap goal ever,

364
00:26:17.034 --> 00:26:21.990
and the name of the goal was not sure how this works, LOL. I remember that one.

365
00:26:22.710 --> 00:26:25.130
It's the only time I've ever used zap goals. But

366
00:26:26.070 --> 00:26:28.170
Yeah. Zap goals are are pretty cool. Do that.

367
00:26:28.550 --> 00:26:35.995
Like, I could put a zap goal up right now. Like, what do you want the next? Do you want the next episode to be 2 things? Right? I could put 2 zap goals.

368
00:26:36.855 --> 00:26:43.980
It only shows 1 at a time. Oh, okay. Well, I can't do do that. But on your profile I mean, profile that shows all of your zap goals. So, like, people could go to your profile

369
00:26:44.519 --> 00:26:47.485
and see, like, a zap goal for, you know, pug

370
00:26:47.865 --> 00:26:50.605
rip with x and rip with y, and they could zap

371
00:26:50.985 --> 00:26:51.885
the goals individually.

372
00:26:53.789 --> 00:26:58.990
Got it. I could put it on my profile. Yeah. So something like that. Right? I mean, obviously, you wouldn't want it to be

373
00:27:00.429 --> 00:27:08.495
in in Guy's case, it's not even it's not custodial or anything. Like, you're literally just zapping Guy. Like, if he doesn't read the article, like, he just rugged you. Yeah.

374
00:27:09.195 --> 00:27:12.415
And it could be the same it could be the same setup. It could just be

375
00:27:13.500 --> 00:27:19.200
use that me ahead of time if you want a topic. And then whatever has the most stats, like, I have a,

376
00:27:19.715 --> 00:27:26.455
you know, essentially a a reputation agreement with the listeners that I will actually do the topic that they vote to the top.

377
00:27:27.140 --> 00:27:27.640
Yeah.

378
00:27:27.940 --> 00:27:29.400
That's a cool idea. Yeah.

379
00:27:30.660 --> 00:27:35.560
Okay. Cool. And then the other thing I'm curious about on your opinion here in terms of discoverability

380
00:27:36.255 --> 00:27:37.235
and monetization,

381
00:27:38.735 --> 00:27:48.330
because I just love the idea of, like, open source projects that have some kind of SaaS flow. Right? And it's one of the cool parts about you charging up front for those streams

382
00:27:49.030 --> 00:27:50.650
and potential zap splits,

383
00:27:51.590 --> 00:27:54.730
as as maybe a revenue source for that, like, kind of

384
00:27:55.554 --> 00:27:58.695
choose your choose your adventure, what topics you want.

385
00:28:00.035 --> 00:28:01.174
How do you feel about

386
00:28:01.715 --> 00:28:03.575
me, like, paying Satch

387
00:28:04.290 --> 00:28:07.430
to have, like, the dispatch stream highlighted?

388
00:28:09.490 --> 00:28:33.485
Like a fee paid feature or a promote promoted streams? Yeah. Like a exactly. Like, you're saying, like, I don't know what streams to show new users that come onto the on on onto the website. Well, I want them to see Cibele Dispatch. So I They're pretty much gonna see it because, like, there's hardly anyone streaming. Yeah. But let's say let's say our dreams become reality. Right? And there's a 1,000 concurrent streams. Right? Yeah. Is that

389
00:28:35.039 --> 00:28:35.539
is

390
00:28:35.919 --> 00:28:39.039
how do you feel about that? Is that is that taboo? Or

391
00:28:40.080 --> 00:28:43.220
Maybe. I mean, we are we have, like, the the ZapStream

392
00:28:43.705 --> 00:28:48.765
short URLs, which are which are, like, paid. It's pretty much the the NIP five for for ZapStream.

393
00:28:50.105 --> 00:28:56.840
It's not really you can't actually buy them on ZapStream. You have to go to Snort because it's, like, it's part of the Snort back end that manages all of

394
00:28:57.140 --> 00:28:58.679
the the NIP five handles.

395
00:28:59.860 --> 00:29:05.625
But, yeah, if you buy, like, the NIP five, you get, like, the short URL. So for for yours for this stream, you could go to, like,

396
00:29:06.005 --> 00:29:06.505
zap.stream/odell,

397
00:29:07.684 --> 00:29:12.170
and it will just redirect to, like, the latest stream. And you just gave that to me because I'm your boy. Right?

398
00:29:12.570 --> 00:29:16.030
Yeah. I I actually bought it, so I paid myself. And then, like,

399
00:29:16.410 --> 00:29:18.750
on Snort, on the back end, you can actually transfer

400
00:29:19.785 --> 00:29:28.765
an a hoster addresses. Like, you can transfer it to another end pub. So I just transferred it to you. Well, thank you. Yeah. I just got a message from Kieran one day, and it was just

401
00:29:29.400 --> 00:29:31.820
it it was just my link. I was like, oh, nice.

402
00:29:33.320 --> 00:29:36.460
I don't know if I did it for or HR as well. I I don't remember.

403
00:29:37.825 --> 00:29:40.645
Yeah. I mean, I just at this point, I just do the redirects.

404
00:29:41.345 --> 00:29:43.765
So Yeah. I think I think one of the

405
00:29:44.280 --> 00:29:48.780
one of the highest, like, referrals to ZapStream is, like, the Citadel dispatch link.

406
00:29:49.800 --> 00:29:53.875
That's awesome. Yeah. Well, proud proud to be of service and,

407
00:29:54.415 --> 00:29:55.955
you know, I I

408
00:29:57.055 --> 00:29:59.075
I I, like, I feel like ZapStream

409
00:30:01.770 --> 00:30:07.550
ZapStream was built for me, and I never had to talk to you about it. I only discovered you as a person till afterwards.

410
00:30:08.170 --> 00:30:08.670
Yeah.

411
00:30:10.355 --> 00:30:12.295
It's kinda surreal as well that, like,

412
00:30:12.995 --> 00:30:19.820
you're you're streaming on this thing that I just, like, made randomly and and even we had, like, some conferences showing on here.

413
00:30:20.200 --> 00:30:21.400
And when I was in, like,

414
00:30:22.120 --> 00:30:27.195
Nostra, Asia, and it was, like, live streaming on ZapStream. I'm, like, they didn't even tell me they were gonna live stream on ZapStream.

415
00:30:27.655 --> 00:30:32.395
And then I was in I was at the thing, and I'm, like, it's on ZapStream with, like, a 100 viewers. I had no idea.

416
00:30:33.015 --> 00:30:34.875
And it was kind of surreal to, like,

417
00:30:35.840 --> 00:30:38.020
to see it grow, like, so quickly. You know?

418
00:30:39.520 --> 00:30:41.040
Yeah. I mean, look. I just,

419
00:30:41.760 --> 00:30:45.060
real recognizes real. You know? I I I always

420
00:30:46.005 --> 00:30:48.184
I always pride myself in,

421
00:30:50.085 --> 00:30:54.325
I pride myself in in trying to use the best that's out there regardless of,

422
00:30:55.750 --> 00:30:57.210
direct financial incentive,

423
00:30:57.510 --> 00:31:01.770
which is one of the reasons why our HR never has many ad deals because

424
00:31:02.755 --> 00:31:05.335
it doesn't matter how much you pay me. I'll just recommend the best.

425
00:31:05.875 --> 00:31:14.140
And, for for me, like, that's what's app well, as soon as I saw his app stream, I was like, I just I'm just gonna switch the whole stack over to his app stream.

426
00:31:14.520 --> 00:31:25.645
And I, like, I kind of rugged the freaks because they were in the matrix chat, and we were using the matrix chat. And then we have, like, a few rider dies that still use the YouTube chat, and no one sees what they say.

427
00:31:27.065 --> 00:31:29.085
And I just I just did it.

428
00:31:30.050 --> 00:31:30.950
Oh, yes. See?

429
00:31:31.250 --> 00:31:37.735
I have I just checked the YouTube chat, and one of the only comments in the YouTube chat is, why don't you put this app stream in the YouTube

430
00:31:38.215 --> 00:31:39.755
description? Never mind. Found it.

431
00:31:40.775 --> 00:31:45.434
Yeah. But, yeah, they have to do a little bit of proof of work to figure it out. Okay. I mean, I think

432
00:31:45.740 --> 00:31:48.080
I think that's enough on ZapStream.

433
00:31:49.180 --> 00:31:51.680
And this is a this is a ZapStream

434
00:31:52.875 --> 00:31:56.415
conversation on ZapStream, which is kind of cool with the creator of ZapStream.

435
00:31:58.395 --> 00:32:04.470
It's rabbits all the way down. But, you I mean, you're doing more work on Gnostr besides just ZapStream.

436
00:32:04.850 --> 00:32:10.550
How what I guess Snort is the is the other big is Snort take up more of your time than ZapStream?

437
00:32:11.495 --> 00:32:12.155
It must.

438
00:32:13.175 --> 00:32:15.815
Well, actually, I haven't really done anything on ZapStream in a while.

439
00:32:16.615 --> 00:32:18.955
The last thing that I've added was, like, the categories.

440
00:32:20.090 --> 00:32:23.790
And I added the withdrawal function recently, but it seems to be missing. I don't know how.

441
00:32:24.250 --> 00:32:25.630
So I need to look at that.

442
00:32:26.010 --> 00:32:36.975
Well, like, I load up stats for my credits and, like, I can't get them out? Yeah. Like, I added withdrawals, but then I tried to, like, look for the withdrawal button and it wasn't there anymore. I think I might have rolled it back by mistake.

443
00:32:39.160 --> 00:32:42.380
But on snore You know, why do you need withdrawals? Fuck withdrawals.

444
00:32:43.800 --> 00:32:51.235
I mean, people could. If people come to ZapStream and they're, like, earning a lot of sats, you know, like, because if when you initially when you sign up to ZapStream,

445
00:32:51.910 --> 00:32:54.890
like, if you create an account on ZapStream, it gives you, like,

446
00:32:55.750 --> 00:32:56.730
a lightning address.

447
00:32:57.190 --> 00:33:04.985
It defaults It goes to their ZapStream account if they don't have a lightning address already. Yeah. Like, if you create a new account on ZapStream, it defaults to, like, their

448
00:33:05.365 --> 00:33:09.065
yeah. So, like, basically, you can, like, come to ZapStream if you if you never use Nostr,

449
00:33:09.845 --> 00:33:15.510
create an account, and then, like, start streaming and you can get zapped straight away. Okay. So you're both should have withdrawals.

450
00:33:16.130 --> 00:33:21.335
Yeah. That's that's kind of why I added it because obviously, if you're coming and loading Sats, it's different. But

451
00:33:21.875 --> 00:33:25.735
Yeah. Like, I always brought my own lightning address to my ZapStream experience.

452
00:33:26.310 --> 00:33:30.970
Yeah. Which is cool that you can do either. I mean, I I one of the coolest parts

453
00:33:32.230 --> 00:33:33.770
of of of how you built,

454
00:33:34.390 --> 00:33:35.290
how you built

455
00:33:36.295 --> 00:33:40.955
the site is that when I tell, like, non Nostra users, like, go to cildispatch.com/stream,

456
00:33:42.615 --> 00:33:47.990
they don't have to have actually have even to have a Nostra account. Like, they can just do it in the browser,

457
00:33:49.250 --> 00:33:51.429
when they when they come in, and I

458
00:33:51.970 --> 00:33:57.295
Yep. I I like that approach in general. So that makes sense that on the broadcaster side, it would be the same thing.

459
00:33:58.075 --> 00:34:03.135
Yeah. I mean, you just come in, make a random account, and troll the chat. You know?

460
00:34:04.940 --> 00:34:14.205
Look. We got we got the guy the guys in the from the YouTube chat is now in the this app stream chat. Let's go. Shout out you freak. New ant pub.

461
00:34:14.625 --> 00:34:16.885
Yeah. He made one on the fly. There you go.

462
00:34:18.865 --> 00:34:21.505
Okay. Well, let's talk about Snort, but with the

463
00:34:22.420 --> 00:34:24.040
I think I've told you this personally.

464
00:34:27.700 --> 00:34:33.234
Like, dude, I ZapStream is it. Like, I I I'm I'm glad you're focused on other things too,

465
00:34:33.775 --> 00:34:36.835
but, like, ZapStream is one of the killer apps of

466
00:34:37.280 --> 00:34:40.340
of Nostr. It's it's gonna bring in a shit ton of new users.

467
00:34:40.640 --> 00:34:44.260
It's way better than the status quo. It's 10 x better than the status quo.

468
00:34:45.375 --> 00:34:47.155
And I I think it is, like,

469
00:34:47.695 --> 00:34:49.075
one of the most

470
00:34:50.095 --> 00:34:51.075
exciting projects

471
00:34:51.455 --> 00:34:52.195
on Noster.

472
00:34:53.070 --> 00:34:55.470
It's it's hard it's hard to compete with it. Like, I I

473
00:34:56.270 --> 00:34:56.770
it

474
00:34:57.230 --> 00:35:05.315
you don't ever have to you don't even have to be a Noster user to appreciate it. I mean, even in the way I have it set up. Right? It's like people watching the YouTube

475
00:35:06.175 --> 00:35:07.555
never even go to ZapStream,

476
00:35:07.935 --> 00:35:09.795
but they are consuming the ZapStream

477
00:35:10.690 --> 00:35:13.990
chat. Right? They're they're they're viewing the ZapStream chat.

478
00:35:14.610 --> 00:35:15.670
I think it's just

479
00:35:17.330 --> 00:35:20.455
simply profound in a simple way. That's the cool part.

480
00:35:22.035 --> 00:35:29.180
But let's talk about snort. Okay. I was gonna, like, continue this upstream conversation, but okay. What what else do you wanna talk about with Upstream?

481
00:35:29.720 --> 00:35:38.285
What I'm what I'm gonna talk about? Gonna say, like, it's only gonna get better. I mean, I'm trying to make it better, but it's it's kind of hard to to build all these things and and maintain them.

482
00:35:38.745 --> 00:35:40.765
That's what I'm saying. Like, focus.

483
00:35:42.745 --> 00:35:46.125
I spent, like, a month on the the news app stream back end.

484
00:35:46.740 --> 00:35:50.440
And I got, like, stuck at some point, and I'm, like, I need a break. You know?

485
00:35:51.140 --> 00:35:53.720
Because I like That's fair. Yeah.

486
00:35:54.905 --> 00:36:01.805
But, yeah, there's there's that. It's difficult. It really is difficult to build this. The thing I'm trying to build, it's it's not gonna be, like,

487
00:36:02.500 --> 00:36:06.040
a few weeks or a few months. It's gonna it's gonna take a while to build this because

488
00:36:07.059 --> 00:36:07.799
it's, like,

489
00:36:08.260 --> 00:36:11.265
much harder than what I have. You know? Like, what I have right now is, like,

490
00:36:11.664 --> 00:36:14.964
it's it's all it's all, like, prebuilt software pretty much.

491
00:36:15.744 --> 00:36:20.005
Like, I'm using this streaming streaming system. It's open source as well,

492
00:36:20.470 --> 00:36:25.290
but it's like a streaming back end. And that that handles, like, all of the transcoding and the,

493
00:36:26.070 --> 00:36:31.005
like, the delivery of the the stream. So So it's pretty much like I have a few hooks around that system,

494
00:36:31.385 --> 00:36:33.244
and that that's what does all of the accounting.

495
00:36:34.505 --> 00:36:36.630
But, yeah, hopefully, it it gets,

496
00:36:37.010 --> 00:36:41.109
like, way more advanced because I there's a lot of things I can't do with that system.

497
00:36:42.934 --> 00:36:43.674
Like what?

498
00:36:44.615 --> 00:36:46.474
Well, the clips is one obvious

499
00:36:47.095 --> 00:36:49.275
piece of crap feature that we have right now.

500
00:36:49.654 --> 00:36:52.950
It's, like, it's just really difficult to make clips work well,

501
00:36:53.569 --> 00:36:56.309
and it's, like, it's really hacky the way it's built right now.

502
00:36:58.835 --> 00:37:01.815
Yeah. Clips clips are big. People like clips.

503
00:37:02.275 --> 00:37:02.775
Yeah.

504
00:37:03.714 --> 00:37:08.970
I know there's a lot of things that I could I could build to make it, like, the experience way better because Enclips is one

505
00:37:09.350 --> 00:37:11.770
of them. Like, you can share a clip now, but, like,

506
00:37:12.550 --> 00:37:14.250
clips don't really work yet.

507
00:37:14.630 --> 00:37:18.155
Like, we have a clip event on Nostra. Like, you could share that on on another

508
00:37:18.935 --> 00:37:20.235
on another platform,

509
00:37:20.855 --> 00:37:23.275
and they should be able to play it because it's just a video link.

510
00:37:25.490 --> 00:37:25.730
But

511
00:37:26.690 --> 00:37:29.410
yeah. Yeah. We needs more work. We have to take

512
00:37:30.690 --> 00:37:33.829
this is something that, like, Freedom Tech devs have trouble with.

513
00:37:34.885 --> 00:37:38.345
And I I'm not to single you out because I think you actually

514
00:37:40.005 --> 00:37:42.825
are a bit of an exception to the rule, but we have to take

515
00:37:46.170 --> 00:37:47.150
we have to take,

516
00:37:48.089 --> 00:37:48.589
inspiration

517
00:37:48.970 --> 00:37:54.095
from the the dominant slave tech platforms. Right. And like what works and what doesn't.

518
00:37:54.555 --> 00:37:56.815
And then try and do it in an ethical way.

519
00:37:57.515 --> 00:38:00.460
And maybe some things you can't do in an ethical way, so you just don't do

520
00:38:01.180 --> 00:38:03.359
them. But clips is a big one.

521
00:38:03.660 --> 00:38:05.520
The other thing I see is,

522
00:38:06.859 --> 00:38:09.359
raids. Right? Like, that's like a Twitch feature.

523
00:38:10.495 --> 00:38:14.515
How does raids work? I was first of all, I named this better Twitch.

524
00:38:15.215 --> 00:38:23.170
I barely use Twitch. I've never consumed on Twitch. I've just previously broadcasted to Twitch. Now I don't anymore because AppStream exists.

525
00:38:24.910 --> 00:38:32.195
But Raids is a Twitch concept. Right? Is it how does that work? Yeah. It's I mean, I used to watch a lot of stuff on Twitch, so

526
00:38:32.895 --> 00:38:34.275
I'm pretty familiar with it. But,

527
00:38:35.215 --> 00:38:39.360
yeah, raids is basically where let's say, like, you finish your stream and,

528
00:38:40.140 --> 00:38:46.320
like, you wanna share you want your viewers to, like, stay on the site. I think it's it's basically like Twitch trying to keep people on the platform.

529
00:38:46.665 --> 00:38:49.005
So they they created this thing called raids where

530
00:38:49.865 --> 00:38:51.965
after your stream has ended, like, you can

531
00:38:52.425 --> 00:38:57.530
redirect your viewers to some other streamer who's live right now so they can, like, continue watching something else.

532
00:38:58.070 --> 00:39:02.490
And maybe it's your friend and maybe you know that person and Oh, like, we can all go into no goods,

533
00:39:03.270 --> 00:39:04.570
radio after this.

534
00:39:04.875 --> 00:39:05.855
Yeah. Like, it instantly

535
00:39:06.475 --> 00:39:10.095
redirects you to, like, whatever you're rating. And so how do I do that?

536
00:39:10.395 --> 00:39:19.620
If you go to the dashboard, it's there. But if I click it right now, do I lose all my viewers and we just all go to no good node? Yeah. Don't don't start the rate right now. Okay.

537
00:39:21.015 --> 00:39:30.700
I've I've kind of been too too scared to figure that out. Okay. Yeah. I I usually raid, like, someone if someone is online, if like, because I stream, like, programming almost every day on ZapStream.

538
00:39:31.480 --> 00:39:31.980
Yeah.

539
00:39:33.400 --> 00:39:35.420
Well, not every day, but most days.

540
00:39:35.934 --> 00:39:43.714
And, yeah, I usually raid someone. Yeah. But I don't really have that many viewers, but when there is some viewers, like, I'll try to raid someone too. Where do I see it?

541
00:39:44.450 --> 00:39:48.950
If you're on the stream dashboard, it should say there should be, like, a raid button on the Okay. Click stream.

542
00:39:49.250 --> 00:39:54.875
Oh, shit, dude. The stream dashboard is dope. I've never been here live. What the hell, dude?

543
00:39:55.735 --> 00:40:00.875
Well, you got, you know, you gotta message this to people. I told you to check out the stream dashboard.

544
00:40:01.255 --> 00:40:03.880
You know, I got a lot of things going on. This is

545
00:40:04.260 --> 00:40:15.125
awesome. It's even better when you when you when the stream is over, it shows you the summary as well. So it shows you, like, everything that happened. I didn't know that. Yeah. And the dashboard, like, got a whole new revamp as well for new for new people.

546
00:40:15.745 --> 00:40:21.109
So, like, it it brings you through this, like, step by step process on, like, how to set up a stream if you've never streamed

547
00:40:21.650 --> 00:40:34.295
before. This is awesome. I can I I can censor people on this? Yeah. You can mute people. Chat users. I can mute them. Yep. I'm not going to such a huge freak. I I have I never have because I didn't know I could until just now. But,

548
00:40:35.954 --> 00:40:47.575
damn. Okay. So if I press this raid button at the end of the show, we can all go to Yeah. Like, it will show, like, a a dialogue, and it'll give you, like, a list of who's live right now. And you can, like, click the name, and it'll pre fill

549
00:40:48.115 --> 00:40:53.095
the the address, like, raid this stream. It put basically puts it's like an Oster event. So

550
00:40:53.555 --> 00:40:56.455
you basically have a 2 a tags, which is, like,

551
00:40:56.870 --> 00:41:05.210
the from and the to. So you have, like, a from, which is this stream, and the to is, like, the other stream that you're rating. Awesome. Well So, like click That's bad. Let's continue.

552
00:41:05.895 --> 00:41:18.440
So, like, both streams can see in the in their chats, like, if you're rating from someone or to someone, they can both see. Okay. You were rated by Odell, pretty much. Or you're rating you're rating no good. So it'll show kind of links the 2 streams together.

553
00:41:20.020 --> 00:41:21.880
Yeah. I've seen people raid me.

554
00:41:23.025 --> 00:41:25.285
Yep. And I was like, I don't know what that is.

555
00:41:25.825 --> 00:41:30.565
And by the way, freaks, I know it's fun to troll Odell on his own show,

556
00:41:32.490 --> 00:41:33.230
but, like,

557
00:41:33.770 --> 00:41:47.095
Kieran builds very quickly. He's just, like, constantly shipping shit. It's hard to keep track. Yeah. Sorry. I actually don't announce a lot of stuff for ZapStream as well. I'm I'm an OG ZapStream user. It was a very basic website when I first started using it. Yeah. It's still pretty basic.

558
00:41:47.900 --> 00:41:51.680
And usually, I don't mess with things when they're not broken, so I don't, like,

559
00:41:52.060 --> 00:42:01.734
look at but this is awesome. I'm gonna always keep the stream dashboard up now. Yeah. It shows it shows the zaps in the center as well, so you can kind of Yeah. The zaps are awesome. I see which freaks are

560
00:42:02.515 --> 00:42:05.720
participating in value for value and which ones aren't. I see you guys.

561
00:42:06.119 --> 00:42:08.380
Yeah. I think you I think you guys asked about, like,

562
00:42:09.000 --> 00:42:11.500
the top zaps comments as well. Right?

563
00:42:12.359 --> 00:42:18.795
Because, like, you guys are reading out the the top zappers from the last stream. Yeah. On the top. Yeah. And you couldn't see the comments.

564
00:42:19.575 --> 00:42:22.340
Yeah. I couldn't see. Do you did you add it? No.

565
00:42:22.720 --> 00:42:23.220
No.

566
00:42:23.600 --> 00:42:25.780
But that's one place you could add it is, like, the dashboard.

567
00:42:26.240 --> 00:42:30.260
Yeah. Like, you could show, like, the top Yeah. It'd be nice to see it in the dashboard.

568
00:42:30.734 --> 00:42:35.555
Yeah. Oh, I see it I mean, I see it right now in the dashboard, but when the stream ends, I won't see it anymore.

569
00:42:36.095 --> 00:42:38.435
No. You'll see the top zappers, like, in the summary.

570
00:42:38.790 --> 00:42:47.530
So you have, like, the the top chatters Yeah. This center the center zap thing that I see? No. That whole layout's different. Like, when a stream is over it's, like, different completely.

571
00:42:48.285 --> 00:42:53.185
Got it. So it'll show you, like, the the activity over time. So it'll show you, like,

572
00:42:53.565 --> 00:42:57.860
chats and zaps on, like, a timeline. So you can see kinda when your stream is most active.

573
00:42:58.560 --> 00:43:00.180
And then it'll show you the,

574
00:43:01.200 --> 00:43:09.135
like, the some like, the top chatters, like, counts basically who who chatted the most and who's app the most. And you can also see the shares and how many

575
00:43:09.755 --> 00:43:12.475
how many, like, likes those shares got. So if you click, like,

576
00:43:13.260 --> 00:43:14.079
share on Nostr

577
00:43:14.780 --> 00:43:16.559
Did you see I'm I'm I'm streaming

578
00:43:17.260 --> 00:43:23.985
the I'm streaming the dashboard now. Look how cool this dashboard is, guys. I just discovered it. Sorry. If you if I press share on Noster

579
00:43:24.445 --> 00:43:34.920
Yeah. If you're on the stream and you shared a stream, it shows on the summary as well. So you can see, like, if someone shares your stream you can see like oh that person shared my stream and it got like 10 likes. So you can kind of see

580
00:43:35.619 --> 00:43:36.119
like

581
00:43:36.635 --> 00:43:41.855
who like, where your viewers may be coming from, basically. So if you're a new streamer, you can kind of share the stream,

582
00:43:42.475 --> 00:43:46.720
and people will, when you finish your stream you can see like oh this person like oh Odell

583
00:43:47.100 --> 00:43:50.080
shared my stream and like 10 people reposted it so like

584
00:43:50.945 --> 00:43:54.005
you know, maybe maybe in the future we could also do, like, a kind of

585
00:43:54.385 --> 00:44:06.420
zap splits thing to your people who are sharing your stream. So you were like, okay. Thanks for sharing my stream. Here's a zap. You know? Like, I okay. I earned, like, 20 k sats from that stream, and, you know, I'll zap them a couple 100 or whatever

586
00:44:06.720 --> 00:44:07.700
for sharing it.

587
00:44:08.954 --> 00:44:19.860
That's awesome. Okay. The sky's the limit. We're just getting started. This is we've barely scratched the surface. Yeah. There's there's so many things I wanna build. I kind of forget. It's mostly on the, the GitHub, like, all the issues.

588
00:44:20.480 --> 00:44:20.800
And,

589
00:44:22.240 --> 00:44:34.560
Carnage, Carnage has a lot of ideas as well. So there's there's so many ideas. Helps you with the design a lot. Right? Yeah. And a lot of the yeah. Like, a lot of ideas as well. Like, can we try this, or should we do that? And

590
00:44:35.740 --> 00:44:38.400
there's just there's so much to do. You know?

591
00:44:40.255 --> 00:44:43.535
That's what I'm saying, though. Like, the focus has gotta be ZapStream. Like, it's

592
00:44:44.655 --> 00:44:53.170
Yeah. But I can't, like, just ditch, you know, the other stuff as well. Like, the other ones are kind of mostly in in maintenance mode, you know, trying to kinda do, like What's the other stuff?

593
00:44:53.790 --> 00:45:05.535
Well, Snort is is came first. So it's like the it's my first project. I kinda just abandoned that one. Yeah. But just because it's the first kid doesn't mean you have to love it more. Okay. I guess. Yeah. You let him be the fucked up one. No.

594
00:45:07.580 --> 00:45:10.060
Yeah. I'm actually I am working on Snort at the minute.

595
00:45:10.700 --> 00:45:12.000
I try to make it, like,

596
00:45:12.940 --> 00:45:15.120
try to make it faster and kind of more

597
00:45:16.414 --> 00:45:20.434
less bogie, I guess, you know, more polished. It's mostly polished. I don't really want to add anything

598
00:45:21.295 --> 00:45:26.529
to snort, you know. It's kind of it's it's got everything it needs. You know? It just needs, like, a lot of polishing.

599
00:45:27.869 --> 00:45:28.930
I saw someone

600
00:45:29.309 --> 00:45:29.809
ask,

601
00:45:30.269 --> 00:45:32.130
in the comments if ZapStream,

602
00:45:34.244 --> 00:45:36.585
if you're the recipient of an Open Sats grant.

603
00:45:37.684 --> 00:45:44.990
I believe I believe you are. You got an Open Sats grant for a combination of ZapStream and Snort? Yeah. For the 2.

604
00:45:45.369 --> 00:45:45.869
Yeah.

605
00:45:46.970 --> 00:45:48.670
So there you go. There's the answer.

606
00:45:50.085 --> 00:45:55.145
Dude, we have I mean, we've gotten over 600 applications. We have over a 100 grants outstanding.

607
00:45:57.500 --> 00:45:59.520
A lot of the times, I have to go and check.

608
00:45:59.900 --> 00:46:00.880
Praise Gigi.

609
00:46:01.500 --> 00:46:02.480
Gigi's amazing.

610
00:46:04.155 --> 00:46:05.615
God bless that individual.

611
00:46:05.915 --> 00:46:06.815
What a dude.

612
00:46:08.635 --> 00:46:09.135
I,

613
00:46:10.075 --> 00:46:12.655
and what what is your open sats experience been like?

614
00:46:14.800 --> 00:46:24.595
Good. I mean, I You can talk shit. Like, I'm not gonna I first of all, it's designed so I can't single handedly stop you even though I'm probably your biggest advocate within the org.

615
00:46:25.135 --> 00:46:28.275
Yeah. Odell, I really I really don't like all of these very

616
00:46:28.930 --> 00:46:35.750
these direct messages you're sending me telling me not to do this and not to do that. It's Dude, this is how conspiracy starts. Fuck you.

617
00:46:36.244 --> 00:46:40.825
We're ending the stream. No. I literally have received I'm gonna use Twitch from now on. It's over.

618
00:46:41.605 --> 00:46:53.015
I've literally received 0 messages from OpenStance. So when I was wondering, I don't get, like, told what to work on. Our bigger our bigger issue is that we probably should be sending more feedback and stuff. Yeah. Maybe.

619
00:46:53.795 --> 00:46:56.915
It's Like, internally, one of our number one goals is,

620
00:46:58.195 --> 00:47:04.340
our number one goals is is getting, like, proper feedback out, especially for the declined applications.

621
00:47:05.040 --> 00:47:08.180
But, also, like, part of the long term vision of OpenSats

622
00:47:09.265 --> 00:47:11.285
is that we want them to be,

623
00:47:15.025 --> 00:47:20.020
obviously, like, we want them to be renewed and long standing. Right? And so, like, there's gonna be all

624
00:47:20.900 --> 00:47:26.040
we're we're only really, like, a year into we're we're, like, starting to hit a year into

625
00:47:26.975 --> 00:47:28.195
open sets being,

626
00:47:29.775 --> 00:47:32.435
like, really serious business, which was when we got,

627
00:47:33.535 --> 00:47:37.109
the Jack Dorsey donation, and and Grant started rolling out like crazy.

628
00:47:37.490 --> 00:47:43.270
And so that involves a whole review process. So, like, where does the grant recipient stand? Where does the project stand?

629
00:47:44.655 --> 00:47:49.475
And, like, we're gonna need to provide, like, real feedback at that point. Like, what's going on? And

630
00:47:49.855 --> 00:47:55.240
Yeah. And I don't know if we're quite there yet. Like, that's our biggest that's our our big that's funny because, like, the conspiracy

631
00:47:55.620 --> 00:48:02.725
the biggest cons one of the biggest conspiracies is that we're, like, dictating what people should do. And one of our biggest pain points is that we're, like, not

632
00:48:03.665 --> 00:48:05.365
telling people what we think enough.

633
00:48:05.825 --> 00:48:06.325
Yeah.

634
00:48:07.265 --> 00:48:08.725
It's a funny dichotomy.

635
00:48:11.840 --> 00:48:14.340
But yeah. I mean, yeah, I guess it would be kinda cool to

636
00:48:15.520 --> 00:48:17.680
to have some, like, direct feedback. Like

637
00:48:18.404 --> 00:48:18.904
Exactly.

638
00:48:20.085 --> 00:48:22.744
Yeah. Instead of just, like, an opaque, like,

639
00:48:23.125 --> 00:48:24.664
the board has decided.

640
00:48:25.045 --> 00:48:31.380
You know? It's like, you did not get your 5 of 9 votes. You did get your 5 of 9 votes. Like, that is currently,

641
00:48:32.079 --> 00:48:35.244
like, the amount of feedback people get. Yeah.

642
00:48:35.625 --> 00:48:36.845
And, obviously, OpenSats

643
00:48:37.145 --> 00:48:38.685
I guess, just because

644
00:48:39.625 --> 00:48:44.365
there's always new people, it's important to constantly repeat. OpenSats is a 5 0 1 c 3

645
00:48:44.890 --> 00:48:45.950
nonprofit organization.

646
00:48:47.130 --> 00:48:52.965
None of the board members except for Gigi get paid, and that's because Gigi's full time and, like, runs the whole ship.

647
00:48:54.405 --> 00:48:57.145
And he gets paid from a separate operations fund.

648
00:48:57.445 --> 00:48:58.905
So if you donate to operations,

649
00:48:59.365 --> 00:49:01.065
that goes to Gigi's salary,

650
00:49:01.900 --> 00:49:06.960
A few other part time people underneath him so Gigi doesn't completely get burnt down and lose his mind.

651
00:49:07.339 --> 00:49:13.265
And, hopefully, actually, a couple more part time people because it's a lot of work. A lot more work than people realize.

652
00:49:14.765 --> 00:49:17.185
But but if you donate to the general fund,

653
00:49:18.125 --> 00:49:22.940
or the Noster Fund, that's a 100% pass through. So everything goes to open source contributors.

654
00:49:23.720 --> 00:49:24.540
And, obviously,

655
00:49:24.920 --> 00:49:27.660
we get no financial benefit out of

656
00:49:28.359 --> 00:49:29.420
out of their projects.

657
00:49:33.045 --> 00:49:34.345
Okay. So Snort.

658
00:49:34.645 --> 00:49:39.065
Should we should we talk about Snort? We're, like, we're, like, an hour in, and I know your time is precious.

659
00:49:40.360 --> 00:49:49.180
I feel like we should talk about Snort. A lot of people use Snort. If you click a damas dot io link a lot of people use damas. Right? And, like, you share a damas link. I think it goes to Snort.

660
00:49:50.335 --> 00:49:51.155
Not anymore.

661
00:49:51.455 --> 00:49:54.355
I think Wow. The implementation How does that make you feel?

662
00:49:55.775 --> 00:49:57.235
I don't mind. Okay.

663
00:49:58.720 --> 00:50:01.860
I mean, it was cool when he had when he added it, he was like, I'm just gonna redirect

664
00:50:02.320 --> 00:50:05.540
everything to Snort because I'm not building a web client. You know?

665
00:50:06.075 --> 00:50:06.575
But,

666
00:50:08.155 --> 00:50:09.695
yes. Snort is,

667
00:50:10.075 --> 00:50:15.180
like I said, it's mostly maintenance. So I'm trying to make it faster, and I'm kind of less buggy at the moment.

668
00:50:16.300 --> 00:50:18.240
There's a lot of things that we could improve.

669
00:50:21.579 --> 00:50:25.795
Like, with with Primal gaining a lot of popularity, there's a lot less people using

670
00:50:26.495 --> 00:50:28.115
Snort than there used to be.

671
00:50:28.415 --> 00:50:33.315
So I'm trying to kind of keep up. You know? It's not Primal has this this better,

672
00:50:34.369 --> 00:50:37.430
well, I don't know if it's better, but some people think it's better than

673
00:50:38.130 --> 00:50:41.109
than Snort or Coreacle or kind of any of the other clients.

674
00:50:41.655 --> 00:50:47.995
So I'm trying to improve the kind of the bugginess and the lagginess and the speed overall. It's kind of hard to compete with a

675
00:50:48.615 --> 00:50:51.115
centralized system, but, yeah, we'll see.

676
00:50:54.330 --> 00:50:58.350
So where did Domestar io links go? Does does he do end jump now?

677
00:50:59.095 --> 00:51:03.515
He has something that renders the notes. I'm not sure what it is. I think they built something.

678
00:51:04.055 --> 00:51:06.875
I mean, you talk about, like, how how do you do

679
00:51:09.340 --> 00:51:10.619
how how do you do,

680
00:51:11.420 --> 00:51:15.760
how do you compete with, like, centralized alternative or whatever? Like, most of the time, if I get

681
00:51:16.984 --> 00:51:19.244
a non primal link, I just put primal.net/e/n,

682
00:51:21.545 --> 00:51:23.224
and then I do the note, and then I just

683
00:51:23.945 --> 00:51:25.645
yeah. It just pops up in my browser.

684
00:51:26.090 --> 00:51:39.535
Like, if you're if you're not sharing an an event link as well, you're basically not a Nostra user, just so you know. Oh, is that true? Yeah. You have to have relay hints or else it's like, why use Nostra at all? Yeah. I've been I've been told that I'm not a Nostra user many times.

685
00:51:41.915 --> 00:51:49.660
It's one of the one of the beauties of using Nostra is you're never a nostr user. You just gotta you gotta keep improving your setup. You gotta keep up.

686
00:51:52.285 --> 00:51:57.245
So snorts in maintenance mode, like, you're not you don't have long term plans for that. What what about

687
00:52:00.170 --> 00:52:02.030
I mean, I saw Marty Malmi,

688
00:52:02.490 --> 00:52:04.510
one of the earliest contributors of Bitcoin.

689
00:52:05.050 --> 00:52:09.550
He has his Iris client. It it seems like he just gave up on Iris, and now he's

690
00:52:10.045 --> 00:52:13.505
co working with you on Snort. How what is what is the deal with that?

691
00:52:14.045 --> 00:52:22.070
Yeah. So he's, like, he joined Snort, so he works on just the same code base as on Iris right now. It's kind of like a slight variation of Snort.

692
00:52:22.770 --> 00:52:30.625
So he added, like, support for basically white labeling. So it's like you can you can roll your own snort, you know, and you can, like, toggle all of the different features,

693
00:52:31.645 --> 00:52:33.185
on and off in the build config.

694
00:52:33.950 --> 00:52:37.570
And so he has a build config for Iris, and I have one for, like, snort. And

695
00:52:37.870 --> 00:52:44.454
I also launched another one recently called Miku app. It's like, it's supposed to be for, like it defaults to, like, Japanese relays, and

696
00:52:44.915 --> 00:52:46.535
it defaults to Japanese. So

697
00:52:46.994 --> 00:52:49.335
We have a lot of Japanese people. Right?

698
00:52:49.795 --> 00:52:50.295
Yeah.

699
00:52:50.820 --> 00:52:54.600
And I bought this domain, like, a long time ago, and I'm like, I might as well use it.

700
00:52:55.060 --> 00:52:57.240
So, I I just deployed domain?

701
00:52:58.180 --> 00:52:58.680
Meku.app

702
00:52:59.445 --> 00:53:02.025
How do I spell that? M e k u.

703
00:53:02.325 --> 00:53:03.545
Okay. That's what I thought.

704
00:53:03.845 --> 00:53:04.345
Yeah.

705
00:53:05.285 --> 00:53:06.825
To Grindr in the comments,

706
00:53:07.420 --> 00:53:09.520
saying primal is the Coinbase of Noster.

707
00:53:09.820 --> 00:53:11.200
I resent that metaphor.

708
00:53:11.980 --> 00:53:13.280
I'm a big fan of metaphors.

709
00:53:14.220 --> 00:53:14.720
Obviously,

710
00:53:18.935 --> 00:53:20.635
it's important to disclose

711
00:53:20.935 --> 00:53:22.875
that my venture fund, 1031,

712
00:53:23.655 --> 00:53:25.755
has made 2 Noster Investments,

713
00:53:27.690 --> 00:53:30.589
2 direct Noster Investments. 1 is is,

714
00:53:31.369 --> 00:53:32.750
primal, and 1 is mutiny.

715
00:53:35.125 --> 00:53:39.545
And then OpenSats really started taking off, and and we've been through OpenSats.

716
00:53:40.005 --> 00:53:42.665
I think over 21 clients are funded through OpenSats.

717
00:53:43.530 --> 00:53:44.030
And,

718
00:53:44.570 --> 00:53:48.090
I you know, if if you look back, I mean, I think,

719
00:53:48.570 --> 00:53:49.050
I

720
00:53:49.530 --> 00:53:56.494
primal's never taken an Open Sets grant. I think, you know, if Open Sets existed at the time, like, he might have taken an open SaaS grant instead of venture funding.

721
00:53:56.875 --> 00:53:58.575
And there's a there's a lot of benefits

722
00:53:59.194 --> 00:53:59.934
to having

723
00:54:00.480 --> 00:54:02.740
these no strings attached grants out there.

724
00:54:03.760 --> 00:54:06.820
But the reason I I I dislike that metaphor

725
00:54:07.505 --> 00:54:11.365
is because Milan is taking great pains to not be the Coinbase of

726
00:54:11.665 --> 00:54:12.165
Noster,

727
00:54:13.425 --> 00:54:18.440
where you can run your own caching server. Unity actually runs their own caching server. Users can switch

728
00:54:18.819 --> 00:54:20.039
between caching servers.

729
00:54:20.740 --> 00:54:23.309
If you broadcast, it broadcasts directly to,

730
00:54:24.555 --> 00:54:29.295
your relays on your relay list. He doesn't mess with your relay list. He's implementing the outbox model.

731
00:54:31.195 --> 00:54:45.095
The the long term vision involves, you know, you checking relays to to make sure the caching server isn't lying to you. Basically, the trust you have in the caching server is is that it might not be showing you all the notes that exist. It might be lying through a mission.

732
00:54:46.675 --> 00:54:53.080
So the long term dream is, like, if you catch one of the cache whatever caching server you're using, if you catch it omitting something

733
00:54:53.460 --> 00:54:58.920
by by doing, like, a sample of your relays, then you switch automatically switch to another caching server.

734
00:55:00.494 --> 00:55:08.170
On the wallet side, like, I do think it's really compelling having a wallet built into a client. I think that's where all the clients are going.

735
00:55:08.970 --> 00:55:10.349
It makes sense to me.

736
00:55:11.450 --> 00:55:16.270
Obviously, his has lite KYC because it's powered by strike. It requires email verification.

737
00:55:17.954 --> 00:55:22.375
But, ultimately, you can use any lightning address you want to receive zaps on primal.

738
00:55:22.755 --> 00:55:23.974
So I I think,

739
00:55:25.155 --> 00:55:29.960
to compare him to the the naked mole rat, Brian Armstrong, it's a little bit

740
00:55:31.140 --> 00:55:41.275
disheartening to see. I think he's trying to do better, but at the end of the day oh, and, also, at the end of the day, like, you can just take your private key out of primal, which is, like, the ultimate freedom aspect of Noster,

741
00:55:41.575 --> 00:55:44.315
and move it to Snort, move it to Amethyst, move it to Damas,

742
00:55:44.700 --> 00:55:45.680
move it to Nostrudal,

743
00:55:46.700 --> 00:55:49.440
move it to whatever clients you want to move it to.

744
00:55:50.460 --> 00:55:57.855
So I think he's he's he's trying to be better than that. I do understand it's a provocative metaphor. So I appreciate provocative metaphors because,

745
00:55:58.715 --> 00:56:05.089
those are the ones that that get the most action, and I have I have I have respect for you in that regard.

746
00:56:07.315 --> 00:56:10.935
I just have respect for you in general, not just in that regard, but,

747
00:56:11.475 --> 00:56:13.895
yeah, that's my that's my 2 stats on

748
00:56:14.195 --> 00:56:15.015
that metaphor.

749
00:56:16.190 --> 00:56:17.730
I guess I kinda, like, sidelined

750
00:56:18.190 --> 00:56:18.690
snort.

751
00:56:19.309 --> 00:56:25.815
What are you working on anything else beside you don't have to be working on anything else besides and Snort, but are you working on anything besides

752
00:56:26.195 --> 00:56:26.855
and Snort?

753
00:56:28.515 --> 00:56:33.575
Yeah. I'm working on this torrent thing as well, although I haven't really What is the torrent thing?

754
00:56:34.660 --> 00:56:35.880
It's called dtan.xyz.

755
00:56:39.620 --> 00:56:45.615
Dtan, d t a n? Yep. It's like a distributed torrent archive on nostr.

756
00:56:45.995 --> 00:56:47.055
It's like an acronym.

757
00:56:47.995 --> 00:56:50.415
And, wait. Wait. So is it an o or an a?

758
00:56:51.100 --> 00:56:51.600
A.

759
00:56:52.540 --> 00:56:53.760
How is it distributed

760
00:56:54.060 --> 00:56:56.160
torrent on Noster if it's an a? Archive.

761
00:56:56.460 --> 00:56:59.040
Oh, archive. Okay. Yeah. And then the on is excluded.

762
00:57:02.455 --> 00:57:05.435
I'm glad we got that sorted. Yeah. That's big confusion.

763
00:57:05.815 --> 00:57:06.555
Bad marketing.

764
00:57:07.580 --> 00:57:10.160
I've only really done, like, 2 major updates to that.

765
00:57:10.620 --> 00:57:13.760
I'm in the process of, like, merging the NIP for Terence. So

766
00:57:14.140 --> 00:57:20.135
there will be, like, another round of updates needed for that because there's some changes in the in the the NIP, which are not implemented on d ten.

767
00:57:21.315 --> 00:57:22.595
But, yeah, it's basically like,

768
00:57:23.315 --> 00:57:26.770
there's like a new kind for torrents, which lets you search for torrents on master.

769
00:57:27.790 --> 00:57:32.530
And they have, like, the like, all the information that you need to basically download the torrents.

770
00:57:34.005 --> 00:57:35.385
And you get basically

771
00:57:36.484 --> 00:57:36.984
decentralized,

772
00:57:38.005 --> 00:57:40.505
torrent index, which I don't think has ever existed.

773
00:57:41.839 --> 00:57:44.500
And there's a lot of cool things you could do with D10, but, again,

774
00:57:45.520 --> 00:57:47.460
time time constrained it. So,

775
00:57:50.160 --> 00:57:51.060
that's awesome.

776
00:57:51.875 --> 00:57:56.775
But Nostradiol Nostradiol already supports torrents as well. Like I said, he pretty much supports everything.

777
00:57:58.355 --> 00:58:01.015
So you can search for torrents on on Nostradiol as well.

778
00:58:02.099 --> 00:58:06.680
And I'm in the middle of making a PR to this, like, this other system called Prowler.

779
00:58:07.619 --> 00:58:08.359
It's like,

780
00:58:09.045 --> 00:58:11.385
it's kinda like a scraper, like a torrent scraper.

781
00:58:13.045 --> 00:58:18.345
It's used in a bunch of other systems for, like, automated downloads of different stuff, like TV shows.

782
00:58:19.160 --> 00:58:19.660
So

783
00:58:20.119 --> 00:58:23.099
having, like, a Nostra integration there would mean that people can

784
00:58:24.040 --> 00:58:28.700
can find the the torrents on Nostra and and use those instead of the ones on those

785
00:58:29.315 --> 00:58:31.174
other centralized torrent indexes.

786
00:58:31.634 --> 00:58:35.950
Historically, the trackers, right, which is, like, what we call the centralized torrent indexes

787
00:58:36.670 --> 00:58:43.570
that's the central point of failure. Like the Pirate Bay or something like that. Yeah. Those are the indexes. The tracker is something else. Oh.

788
00:58:43.985 --> 00:58:55.230
Well, I've been using I've been using torrents for over a decade and got that wrong. That's great. Well, they're usually I think I think they're usually bundled together. Like, you can run a tracker and an indexer together and, like, people will

789
00:58:55.690 --> 00:59:00.829
use that tracker, you know, with the torrents on that index pretty much. So what is a tracker?

790
00:59:01.285 --> 00:59:03.545
A tracker basically keeps track of all the clients.

791
00:59:06.565 --> 00:59:08.085
So, like, if you're running, like,

792
00:59:08.990 --> 00:59:12.850
if you're running a torrent client, you you ask the tracker for, like, peers, basically.

793
00:59:13.550 --> 00:59:21.424
I I wasn't laughing at you, by the way. I was laughing at the grinder saying that he respects me too, just doesn't always agree with me, and he hates the caps.

794
00:59:22.204 --> 00:59:24.145
What do you Kieran, what do you think about the caps?

795
00:59:26.310 --> 00:59:29.930
I decline to comment. You decline to comment on the caps.

796
00:59:30.790 --> 00:59:33.290
I'm I I'm indifferent to the caps, really.

797
00:59:33.605 --> 00:59:36.665
I'm personally committed to doing caps forever at this point.

798
00:59:37.125 --> 00:59:40.744
So, like, Monster is my last social media. I have nothing else,

799
00:59:43.140 --> 00:59:45.160
and I think I will just die in caps.

800
00:59:46.180 --> 00:59:50.359
But I've I've had some second thoughts lately, and I'm trying to

801
00:59:51.285 --> 00:59:51.785
reinvigorate

802
00:59:52.085 --> 00:59:53.945
my my conviction because

803
00:59:56.005 --> 00:59:57.945
there are occasionally things I say

804
00:59:58.540 --> 01:00:11.845
that get taken out of context because they don't know I I only I only note in caps. So they think I'm just noting that note in caps. And they're like, holy shit. Like, that really hits. Like, why is he being so aggressive about it? Right.

805
01:00:13.025 --> 01:00:19.240
But maybe that's the point. I don't know. Maybe you need, like, another n pub, like Odell Odell no caps.

806
01:00:19.859 --> 01:00:21.640
No. I I mean, I have NIMS.

807
01:00:22.100 --> 01:00:38.310
Right. K. NIMS exist. You go? They're not in caps because then you would know it was me. True. If some if I see someone on Noster in all caps, I'm gonna be like, that's Odell's name. Yeah. Exactly. But there are names that are in all caps that get accused of being me. Those are me. Okay.

808
01:00:39.090 --> 01:00:42.390
We have to But that's what I would say if they were me. You know? True.

809
01:00:43.295 --> 01:00:43.795
Yeah.

810
01:00:45.055 --> 01:00:51.075
No. I do I do actually have a lot of plans for Snort. I know we're getting continually sidetracked, but, Sorry. Sorry. Sorry.

811
01:00:52.450 --> 01:00:53.089
We have this,

812
01:00:53.890 --> 01:00:58.950
we have this community leaders program, which I started building and then I kind of went on to something else.

813
01:00:59.565 --> 01:01:01.425
But basically idea of community

814
01:01:01.805 --> 01:01:02.945
leaders is like,

815
01:01:04.045 --> 01:01:04.685
you know, this,

816
01:01:05.565 --> 01:01:07.265
it's called like 21 bitcoin.world

817
01:01:07.885 --> 01:01:10.290
or something like that. It's like these,

818
01:01:11.150 --> 01:01:14.130
it's basically like a Bitcoin community building thing.

819
01:01:14.670 --> 01:01:15.730
Have you heard of this?

820
01:01:17.384 --> 01:01:19.365
Is is this is this g g too?

821
01:01:20.785 --> 01:01:25.205
I don't remember. But, anyway, it's it's similar idea, but it's for it's for, like, Nostr.

822
01:01:26.210 --> 01:01:29.670
So basically you could be like a community leader, it's like someone who

823
01:01:30.450 --> 01:01:35.589
who's like a kind of like a spokesperson for Nostr or someone someone who likes to

824
01:01:36.125 --> 01:01:39.025
like, get others to use Nostr, to tell people about Nostr.

825
01:01:40.525 --> 01:01:43.505
And the idea with that is, like, we have subscriptions.

826
01:01:44.549 --> 01:01:45.049
So

827
01:01:45.349 --> 01:01:48.490
if you have a ref code, you can, like, earn a certain amount

828
01:01:48.869 --> 01:01:52.170
of stats from people who use your ref code if they subscribe to Snort.

829
01:01:52.685 --> 01:01:56.385
So the idea is like to, it's not really to get like more people on Snort but

830
01:01:56.925 --> 01:01:59.025
it's it's kind of an incentive for people to

831
01:01:59.700 --> 01:02:02.600
to use nostr in a way or to get more people to use nostr.

832
01:02:04.900 --> 01:02:05.640
That's awesome.

833
01:02:06.180 --> 01:02:10.655
It's still in progress, you know, as with pretty much everything I'm working on.

834
01:02:10.955 --> 01:02:19.789
But if you go to It's forever progress. That's what you learn. That's that's that's what becoming an adult is, is you realize that you never finish anything. It's just constant forever.

835
01:02:20.250 --> 01:02:20.750
Yeah.

836
01:02:22.809 --> 01:02:23.690
But if you go to,

837
01:02:24.375 --> 01:02:27.895
if you go to community, that's North Social. That's, like, the landing page for

838
01:02:29.415 --> 01:02:31.915
and a lot of people have, like, applied to be become

839
01:02:32.339 --> 01:02:34.520
leaders, community leaders, but I haven't actually

840
01:02:35.059 --> 01:02:38.119
built the, like, the payout system for the referrals. So

841
01:02:38.819 --> 01:02:42.555
it's, like, a lot of people waiting to become community leaders.

842
01:02:43.175 --> 01:02:50.410
But there's other reasons to do it as well. Like, we want, you know, more direct feedback with certain communities. So there's like a really big thigh

843
01:02:50.790 --> 01:02:51.530
like Noster

844
01:02:52.310 --> 01:02:53.050
user base

845
01:02:53.670 --> 01:02:54.570
because of this,

846
01:02:55.350 --> 01:03:07.115
the guys that are running the Bitcoin Thailand they they have, like, so many people from Thailand using ZapStream and using Noster in general. And I'm, like, we need a way to because we had a very similar thing, like, back in

847
01:03:07.930 --> 01:03:09.310
maybe February or March

848
01:03:10.010 --> 01:03:10.650
last year,

849
01:03:11.050 --> 01:03:20.174
with the Japanese users. There was, like, so many people from Japan signing up. Right. And that was because, like, certain people, like, I I don't know, you call them influencers or something, but

850
01:03:20.474 --> 01:03:22.494
People with large audiences in Japan.

851
01:03:22.795 --> 01:03:24.815
Yeah. Basically, like, they had a bunch of people

852
01:03:25.275 --> 01:03:27.295
that were coming to Nastr, but then, like,

853
01:03:27.595 --> 01:03:31.680
you couldn't actually, you know, get feedback about what they liked or disliked because

854
01:03:32.300 --> 01:03:35.760
maybe they they didn't know how to communicate that or

855
01:03:36.455 --> 01:03:39.755
there was no, like, communication channel basically for people to give feedback.

856
01:03:40.455 --> 01:03:46.075
So another reason to do the community leaders is to have this kind of direct communication with those community communities.

857
01:03:46.760 --> 01:03:49.660
So like if you have someone that speaks your native language you're probably going to be

858
01:03:50.040 --> 01:03:54.140
much more open to like giving feedback to that person and that person can relay it to us.

859
01:03:54.520 --> 01:03:55.980
So it's another way to basically

860
01:03:56.825 --> 01:03:57.325
get

861
01:03:58.185 --> 01:04:01.405
more feedback from different regions in different native speaking languages

862
01:04:01.705 --> 01:04:04.445
to, like, improve master and overall, I guess.

863
01:04:06.390 --> 01:04:08.570
Have you talked to Huddl bot about this at all?

864
01:04:08.950 --> 01:04:09.450
No.

865
01:04:10.390 --> 01:04:13.130
So every anytime someone says communities to me,

866
01:04:13.725 --> 01:04:15.585
I ask them if they've talked to huddlebot.

867
01:04:17.005 --> 01:04:19.025
That is true. That is my,

868
01:04:20.605 --> 01:04:21.105
that

869
01:04:21.850 --> 01:04:24.110
my it was my unspoken promise to.

870
01:04:24.810 --> 01:04:27.550
I never told him I was gonna do this. I just kinda do it.

871
01:04:27.850 --> 01:04:30.110
But do you know you know his vision. Right?

872
01:04:31.645 --> 01:04:34.865
I explained this to Will, like, 3 episodes ago. Not entirely.

873
01:04:35.165 --> 01:04:42.900
I think I had to miss I think I missed that episode with Will, actually. Dude, you gotta listen. I have to go back and watch it because You don't have to listen. Get your work done. You know? But,

874
01:04:46.775 --> 01:04:47.275
Hadalabad's

875
01:04:47.575 --> 01:04:48.075
dream

876
01:04:49.015 --> 01:04:49.515
is

877
01:04:49.974 --> 01:04:52.474
that he can get his church group off of

878
01:04:53.015 --> 01:04:55.755
Facebook Messenger. Yeah. I heard that part. Yeah.

879
01:04:56.520 --> 01:05:01.900
Yeah. So, like, that's where he so he's, like, thinking hyperlocal. Right? Like, he's not thinking a country.

880
01:05:03.160 --> 01:05:12.654
He and he's not even thinking a state or a nation or a town. He's thinking the the church one of the 20 churches in his town

881
01:05:12.954 --> 01:05:13.934
get them over.

882
01:05:15.170 --> 01:05:16.950
But I think it all kind of

883
01:05:17.410 --> 01:05:19.270
like, Nasser's perfect for this.

884
01:05:20.450 --> 01:05:24.865
I think it's a little bit different than than, like, what I'm trying to do with the community leaders.

885
01:05:25.724 --> 01:05:27.505
Like, I guess he's trying to

886
01:05:28.205 --> 01:05:31.585
trying to use NOS Noster for his community versus, like,

887
01:05:32.410 --> 01:05:36.829
the community leaders as a way to get just more people on Noster in general. You know?

888
01:05:39.365 --> 01:05:51.680
I mean, I don't. I can we can we go like, where where are we diverging here? Well, I mean, his his goal is to basically have, like, community relays and things like that. Like like, isolating that community. But this is just to bring

889
01:05:52.460 --> 01:05:55.440
more people onto Noster, like, globally. You know?

890
01:05:55.900 --> 01:05:57.020
Well, he's not actually

891
01:05:58.215 --> 01:06:01.755
see, one of the things I do on dispatch is I speak for other people Right.

892
01:06:02.615 --> 01:06:05.355
Which is not great situation because I usually

893
01:06:06.619 --> 01:06:08.240
I usually fuck it up. But,

894
01:06:10.140 --> 01:06:12.160
like, his idea is kind of

895
01:06:12.779 --> 01:06:15.279
the cool part about Noster is you can have,

896
01:06:16.484 --> 01:06:19.305
like, the best of both worlds. Right? So, like, you can have,

897
01:06:21.924 --> 01:06:25.660
Thai people, people from Thailand that that that speak Thai,

898
01:06:26.600 --> 01:06:29.580
they can get the benefits of the global Nostra ecosystem,

899
01:06:30.145 --> 01:06:32.244
but they can also get the benefits of

900
01:06:32.785 --> 01:06:33.285
consistently

901
01:06:34.065 --> 01:06:35.925
smaller and smaller communities.

902
01:06:36.625 --> 01:06:37.125
But

903
01:06:37.690 --> 01:06:38.430
it's like

904
01:06:39.370 --> 01:06:41.850
a it's a permeable wall. Like, some of the

905
01:06:42.730 --> 01:06:45.630
if that makes sense. Like like, some of the content

906
01:06:46.215 --> 01:06:51.515
should not pass the wall. Right? It's like if you're talking about certain things in your church, you don't want,

907
01:06:52.775 --> 01:06:54.875
Kieran or Odell to read it.

908
01:06:55.369 --> 01:07:03.390
But at the same time, like, people in the church do wanna see things that are coming from the rest of the world, and they wanna interact with the rest of the world. And it's like, how do you

909
01:07:05.625 --> 01:07:20.829
interact with that? But are you thinking of community leaders more like just a referral system? Yeah. Basically just a referral. Yeah. Okay. So you're thinking like way simpler. Yeah. Like, I don't want to to isolate those people. I I want I want Snort to be, like, as it is now, but I just want I want a way to incentivize,

910
01:07:21.210 --> 01:07:21.710
like,

911
01:07:22.410 --> 01:07:23.390
people to

912
01:07:23.915 --> 01:07:27.135
get people to use Nostra by giving them, like, a split of their

913
01:07:27.675 --> 01:07:28.175
subscriptions.

914
01:07:29.275 --> 01:07:30.095
Got it.

915
01:07:30.800 --> 01:07:32.980
Okay. So you just you just want a

916
01:07:33.280 --> 01:07:33.940
a global

917
01:07:35.359 --> 01:07:37.460
distributed set of of nostrils?

918
01:07:38.644 --> 01:07:39.144
Yeah.

919
01:07:39.605 --> 01:07:43.464
Okay. I'm I mean, people like rufflinks as well. I hate rufflinks.

920
01:07:44.164 --> 01:07:46.984
I mean, some people. I said people. I didn't say Odell.

921
01:07:48.950 --> 01:07:50.410
Odell. I'm speaking for Odell.

922
01:07:51.990 --> 01:07:54.490
I hate I've never used a ref link.

923
01:07:55.110 --> 01:07:56.985
Well, there are a lot of people who like them.

924
01:07:57.785 --> 01:08:00.765
The one of the funny things is I really like Silent Link,

925
01:08:03.145 --> 01:08:09.020
the eSIM for Bitcoin service. Yeah. I use that. And, he made me a ref link.

926
01:08:09.640 --> 01:08:14.460
Okay. And we have, like, an automated matrix spot that, like,

927
01:08:15.025 --> 01:08:20.005
says how many people use the ref link. He insisted on it. I was like, I don't wanna ref I don't like ref links.

928
01:08:22.200 --> 01:08:23.980
And it just constantly just says

929
01:08:24.360 --> 01:08:24.860
0.

930
01:08:25.720 --> 01:08:32.175
And I just have to constantly tell them. I'm like, look. I'm telling so many people about it. I'm just not giving them my ref link. It's like, it's not

931
01:08:33.114 --> 01:08:34.974
it's it's doing like the opposite.

932
01:08:35.275 --> 01:08:44.530
You just it's like, I'm telling everyone, like, this is a great service. I'm just telling them to go to the website and not giving them the ref link. For whatever reason, I just think it's like

933
01:08:46.804 --> 01:08:54.025
it's like a cheap there's too many people that have ruined ref links. You know? It's like you give them $5 back or you give them,

934
01:08:54.550 --> 01:08:56.570
you know, 5,000 sats back,

935
01:08:57.110 --> 01:09:03.210
and they will just shill whatever garbage is out there. So, like, as soon as I see a ref link, I just think less of the person.

936
01:09:04.375 --> 01:09:09.915
True. But I'm maybe I'm wrong. Like, I I did say earlier. Right? We gotta take the best of Slave Tech.

937
01:09:10.455 --> 01:09:12.554
And ref links do work. They work.

938
01:09:13.250 --> 01:09:16.790
If you're gonna share a link to, you know, to someone else, like,

939
01:09:18.290 --> 01:09:22.949
they're gonna be more inclined to share it if if they're potentially gonna get something out of it. You know?

940
01:09:24.594 --> 01:09:33.670
Yeah. I mean, I'm like the crazy person that, like, everything after the question mark, like, I backspace it out Right. Hang on all the the tracking links and stuff. Yeah.

941
01:09:34.530 --> 01:09:35.990
I don't know. Maybe I'm

942
01:09:36.690 --> 01:09:37.430
a masochist.

943
01:09:40.505 --> 01:09:46.045
What else on Snort? Do you have anything else on Snort besides community leaders? Well, we have, like, subscriptions in general,

944
01:09:46.425 --> 01:09:49.005
which is not doing too great. So I need to, like,

945
01:09:50.110 --> 01:09:57.890
I need to expand on referral or the subscriptions in general. Like, there isn't you don't get a lot with this the subscriptions right now.

946
01:09:59.355 --> 01:10:04.175
Like, you get the you get automatic translations which is really useful but that's only in the pro

947
01:10:04.875 --> 01:10:12.630
the pro tier. Automatic translations make sense to me. Oh, god. It's so good. Oh, my god. It's so useful. Because I I follow, like, a bunch of the Japanese users.

948
01:10:13.330 --> 01:10:14.550
And, like, they're just

949
01:10:15.105 --> 01:10:23.525
sending, like, so many notes, like, every day. But I can actually read them. Like, it's perfectly readable because they're auto translated. What about auto translations in the opposite direction?

950
01:10:23.905 --> 01:10:29.150
Yeah. Yeah. It works in every direction. So, like, you're No. But, I mean, but they need to have it. What if I am a subscriber

951
01:10:29.530 --> 01:10:32.270
Right. And I wanna I wanna post a note in Japanese?

952
01:10:33.725 --> 01:10:40.865
Like, it should be I should be I should be able to just press a button and snort and just send out a Japanese note.

953
01:10:41.480 --> 01:10:45.980
Oh, you mean, like, translate before sending? Yeah. Right? The opposite.

954
01:10:46.840 --> 01:10:56.605
I mean, you can't even send out. Right? If they're, like, a pro subscriber and and they see your note, it'll auto be it'll be auto translated to the I know. I'm saying the opposite, though. What's the point of that, though?

955
01:10:57.730 --> 01:11:00.790
Do you don't you don't think people would use it? I mean,

956
01:11:02.449 --> 01:11:07.265
well, I mean, you can just do that manually. I don't know. I guess. Yeah. I I I mean

957
01:11:08.865 --> 01:11:11.685
I mean, when are you ever gonna wanna send a note in Japanese?

958
01:11:12.065 --> 01:11:21.360
Maybe I do. I mean, I have. I when we had, like, all the Thai people join, I, like, manually went and and did, you know, shitty machine translation

959
01:11:21.980 --> 01:11:28.635
Yeah. Into Thai. And then I fucked it up, actually, and I said the wrong thing. I didn't mean to say what I said, but

960
01:11:29.895 --> 01:11:30.875
I did do it.

961
01:11:32.489 --> 01:11:36.590
I did it once, and then I learned my lesson in English only from that point on. Right.

962
01:11:37.449 --> 01:11:41.390
But I guess if if they had a pro subscription, they would auto translate it anyway. So

963
01:11:41.695 --> 01:11:47.635
I think it was stay humble stacks asset, and they did something else, and then it got really bad. I said something completely wrong.

964
01:11:48.015 --> 01:11:50.115
Yeah. The humble I think humble got,

965
01:11:50.610 --> 01:11:51.110
mistranslated

966
01:11:52.050 --> 01:11:53.670
Right. If I recall correctly.

967
01:11:54.850 --> 01:11:55.590
Yeah. Unfortunately,

968
01:11:56.050 --> 01:11:57.909
DeepL doesn't support thigh, so

969
01:11:58.290 --> 01:11:59.590
you gotta use something else.

970
01:11:59.935 --> 01:12:02.195
What is DeepL? Is that one of these

971
01:12:02.735 --> 01:12:06.835
AI LLM things? Yeah. It's like the I actually don't know who makes that, but

972
01:12:07.560 --> 01:12:15.260
Is it open source or is it I think it's OpenAI. I don't know if it's an open source thing. So it's closed? Yeah. It's the oh, it's totally closed. It's paid.

973
01:12:15.635 --> 01:12:21.655
Okay. So that's what you're using? Yeah. I I I'm paying for that. How do you live with yourself? Why aren't you using an open solution?

974
01:12:23.040 --> 01:12:26.020
Because I don't have a GPU to run it on. Okay. Fair enough.

975
01:12:26.640 --> 01:12:27.700
I don't have the resources.

976
01:12:28.160 --> 01:12:30.580
Okay. I'm like, I won't blame you for that.

977
01:12:31.455 --> 01:12:33.955
Yeah. Maybe maybe I like, I am using some,

978
01:12:34.655 --> 01:12:37.475
like, I do, like, a pre check on all of the notes

979
01:12:37.935 --> 01:12:40.920
that are being translated to, like, make sure that it's not

980
01:12:41.480 --> 01:12:44.940
the target language already. Because, like, you could, like, waste a lot of

981
01:12:45.560 --> 01:12:48.265
money, like, translating from English to English, you know?

982
01:12:48.745 --> 01:12:51.165
So I basically do, like, a a check. I'm like,

983
01:12:51.465 --> 01:12:56.125
is this lang is the lang I have another, like, layer in front before I call DeepL.

984
01:12:56.530 --> 01:13:01.590
It's like, what is the language of this? So I have, like, another AI thing, which I am running myself.

985
01:13:02.210 --> 01:13:04.310
So it it checks and it detects the language.

986
01:13:04.770 --> 01:13:09.215
And And then it's like, okay. It's already Japanese. So why would I translate it to Japanese? You know? Right.

987
01:13:10.635 --> 01:13:14.815
And I think I think Will had that that problem. He was paying because he's using DeepL as well.

988
01:13:15.340 --> 01:13:19.520
But he was paying, like, a ridiculous amount. I'm only paying, like, $5 a month for it.

989
01:13:20.219 --> 01:13:24.425
Well, I think Semisol figured it out for him. Right? He was Yeah. He wasn't doing a pre check.

990
01:13:26.505 --> 01:13:30.684
Yeah. I like the auto translate in damas for purple pro subscribers.

991
01:13:31.465 --> 01:13:33.565
Auto translate makes sense as a thing.

992
01:13:34.410 --> 01:13:37.950
You see Sashin in the comments? I I accidentally said stay humiliated.

993
01:13:39.210 --> 01:13:44.455
That was the I mean, I said stay humble in the translation. Right. And then it it it

994
01:13:44.835 --> 01:13:47.635
got it got it got lost in translation. It's a

995
01:13:48.915 --> 01:13:50.855
Happens. It's a it's a thing.

996
01:13:51.970 --> 01:13:56.710
So what else for do you have anything else in mind? I mean, you said subscriptions aren't really

997
01:13:58.415 --> 01:14:07.635
working, I guess. You know, the nib five thing is actually great. Like, that's where you want nib fives. They're still paying, and it's, like, it's really expensive, but they still pay. So I'm like, okay.

998
01:14:07.980 --> 01:14:08.640
Go ahead.

999
01:14:09.660 --> 01:14:17.645
Like, that's bringing in a decent amount every month. So I don't I don't that's why I haven't really invested that much time in subscriptions because, like, the net five thing is

1000
01:14:18.205 --> 01:14:26.490
it's already doing pretty well. Yeah. It's kinda weird. Will's been hesitant on the NIP five stuff. Oh, man. Like, people would pay for, you know, 3 letters at damas.io

1001
01:14:26.950 --> 01:14:30.810
or whatever. Yeah. I I told him because he was they were asking me, like,

1002
01:14:31.510 --> 01:14:39.385
oh, like, how is your subscription system doing? And and I'm like, yeah. Just just sell Net Fives because, like, people are buying them, like, way more than subscriptions.

1003
01:14:40.885 --> 01:14:44.880
Are you, are you familiar with Skiff Mail? They just got bought by Notion.

1004
01:14:45.420 --> 01:14:46.719
Nope. Never heard of it.

1005
01:14:47.100 --> 01:14:48.640
But they were like a privacy

1006
01:14:49.445 --> 01:14:49.945
email.

1007
01:14:50.245 --> 01:14:52.345
They were crypto bros, which should have been

1008
01:14:53.605 --> 01:14:56.825
the sign that we were they were fucked, but they're closing it down.

1009
01:14:59.440 --> 01:15:06.475
They're closing it down. They got bought by Notion. They're doing, honestly, they're doing the respectable thing. Like, it was it was supposed to be,

1010
01:15:07.495 --> 01:15:12.795
you know, client side encrypted email and drive and all you know, they were competing with Proton, basically.

1011
01:15:13.340 --> 01:15:21.040
And there were there was no way to continue that under a notion agreement, so they instead they're they're closing it down. But the reason I bring them up is because

1012
01:15:21.415 --> 01:15:23.275
they charge more if you did

1013
01:15:24.135 --> 01:15:26.635
a, like, sub 5 character email.

1014
01:15:27.094 --> 01:15:30.560
And I think there's something there. I mean, it sounds kinda fucked up. I'd

1015
01:15:31.360 --> 01:15:32.980
you know, I'm an open book.

1016
01:15:35.040 --> 01:15:39.380
But I think there's something there, like, charge more if you wanna if you want a 3 character

1017
01:15:40.085 --> 01:15:40.745
nip 5,

1018
01:15:41.765 --> 01:15:48.265
you should pay more for that. If if you have a if you have a 10 character nip 5, that's less scarce. There's there's way more combinations.

1019
01:15:49.200 --> 01:15:51.720
Yeah. Yeah. We do that. So if you get, like, a Awesome.

1020
01:15:52.160 --> 01:15:58.980
If you do, like, less than 3 characters, it's, like, 90 k. But if you do, like, more than 3, it's, like, 50 k. In dollars or sats?

1021
01:15:59.345 --> 01:16:00.565
Sats. Okay.

1022
01:16:02.785 --> 01:16:04.245
Dollars. Yeah. It's $50,000.

1023
01:16:07.420 --> 01:16:11.440
Okay. So you already did my suggestion. Yeah. And I and,

1024
01:16:12.380 --> 01:16:13.520
what's it called again?

1025
01:16:15.075 --> 01:16:20.775
What's the other one called again? I forgot the name. I don't know what we're talking about. The other nib 5 service that you buy.

1026
01:16:21.270 --> 01:16:23.929
Noster Plebs? Noster Plebs, yep.

1027
01:16:24.469 --> 01:16:27.130
Lost the name there. It's not even a great domain.

1028
01:16:27.590 --> 01:16:30.810
They do that as well. They do like the length based thing.

1029
01:16:31.495 --> 01:16:33.835
Yeah. Length makes sense to me. Yep.

1030
01:16:35.735 --> 01:16:36.475
I like that.

1031
01:16:36.855 --> 01:16:49.280
So I mean Yeah. I mean I could tell you that there's been over a 1000 NIP 5 handles sold. Holy shit. Yeah. That's legit. And I have 3 domains now, so there's, like, more options for people. What are the other ones?

1032
01:16:49.675 --> 01:16:54.575
So you can get Snort Social, ZapStream, or Nostra gg. Nostra dot gg.

1033
01:16:55.355 --> 01:16:58.095
Okay. Wait. So I only have Odell at ZapStream?

1034
01:16:59.700 --> 01:17:00.200
Yes.

1035
01:17:01.780 --> 01:17:03.400
Okay. Well, what about impersonators?

1036
01:17:04.340 --> 01:17:08.820
Well, if they buy it, that's it. You're screwed. Well, I'm not gonna buy it. So

1037
01:17:09.685 --> 01:17:12.744
Thank you. Thank you for your honesty. The the person

1038
01:17:13.364 --> 01:17:15.304
the only real one is Odell at SapStream,

1039
01:17:15.605 --> 01:17:22.690
just for the freaks to let you know. There's too many. Like, I can't buy all of them. There's gonna be Odells at all the things. Right.

1040
01:17:23.470 --> 01:17:29.284
I'm fine with that primal gave you one for free. Yeah. But I don't use primals. I use my own domain, like a sovereign individual.

1041
01:17:32.704 --> 01:17:33.204
So

1042
01:17:34.150 --> 01:17:38.010
there's that. And I was actually using my own node until yesterday

1043
01:17:39.030 --> 01:17:45.454
where I switched to to primal's custodial wallet because my zaps the zaps weren't showing up on the zap stream. It was just for you mostly.

1044
01:17:45.994 --> 01:17:49.295
I was like, I can't have I can't do the zap stream

1045
01:17:49.755 --> 01:17:50.655
zap stream

1046
01:17:51.619 --> 01:17:53.239
without the zap showing up.

1047
01:17:53.860 --> 01:17:57.000
Yeah. There's actually a bug a bug as well with, like,

1048
01:17:57.915 --> 01:17:59.375
if you're using, like, the ZapStream

1049
01:17:59.915 --> 01:18:04.094
lightning address, it doesn't actually show the zaps. It's kind of messed up, like,

1050
01:18:04.715 --> 01:18:08.030
the ZapStream. Wait, really? ZapStream, Zapper doesn't show.

1051
01:18:08.570 --> 01:18:09.070
Why?

1052
01:18:09.370 --> 01:18:11.469
Fix it. There's a bug. Yeah.

1053
01:18:11.770 --> 01:18:16.110
You should fix it. I should. Let me let me just end this right here, and I'll go fix it.

1054
01:18:17.594 --> 01:18:20.155
I know I'm being kind of addict. I would say that

1055
01:18:21.275 --> 01:18:23.375
and I'm not gonna ever argue this again.

1056
01:18:23.914 --> 01:18:24.414
But

1057
01:18:25.120 --> 01:18:33.140
10/31 is an investor in primal and an investor in strike. So if I use the primal wallet, it's not really custodial for me.

1058
01:18:33.455 --> 01:18:33.955
I'm

1059
01:18:35.055 --> 01:18:36.115
I'm a small

1060
01:18:36.575 --> 01:18:37.795
piece of the custodian.

1061
01:18:38.575 --> 01:18:46.510
Right. Yeah. It's, like, kind of stuff I just keep telling yourself that. Yeah. I'm never gonna use this argument again, but I felt like it needed to be used once.

1062
01:18:47.130 --> 01:18:50.429
Well, it's it's used. It's burned now. There we go.

1063
01:18:51.925 --> 01:18:54.425
Dude, this has been fucking awesome. Thank you for joining.

1064
01:18:55.284 --> 01:18:58.744
I know you didn't think there was a lot I I think we could go on for hours.

1065
01:19:00.330 --> 01:19:03.950
We're not finished. We have to keep talking. Okay. What what else do you wanna talk about?

1066
01:19:04.330 --> 01:19:05.469
I know I'm the host.

1067
01:19:05.850 --> 01:19:12.655
I know. I was gonna say that we also have the the Snortdec as well. That's part of the pro plan. What is Snortdec? Is that, like, the tweet deck?

1068
01:19:13.115 --> 01:19:13.615
Yeah.

1069
01:19:14.075 --> 01:19:16.495
Dude, you gotta talk about this stuff more. Like,

1070
01:19:17.020 --> 01:19:27.545
Will is Will is, like, everyone's excited about note deck from Will. So am I. I'm I'm actually hoping to to help him out there. Okay. So you have Snort Deck.

1071
01:19:28.005 --> 01:19:29.625
How do I access Snort Deck?

1072
01:19:30.565 --> 01:19:31.945
If you're a pro subscriber,

1073
01:19:32.700 --> 01:19:38.080
If you go to I'm not one. Right? No. If you go to if you go to snort dot social slash

1074
01:19:38.380 --> 01:19:40.640
deck Okay. Snort dot social

1075
01:19:40.940 --> 01:19:41.840
slash deck.

1076
01:19:42.165 --> 01:19:45.785
I think it'll show you, like, a link that's, like, you need to be a pro subscriber,

1077
01:19:46.085 --> 01:19:46.745
I believe.

1078
01:19:48.085 --> 01:19:48.985
Let me see.

1079
01:19:50.380 --> 01:19:52.560
You must be a pro subscriber. Subscribe.

1080
01:19:54.060 --> 01:19:54.560
Okay.

1081
01:19:54.940 --> 01:19:55.440
Subscribe.

1082
01:19:56.975 --> 01:19:59.555
Alright. Okay. I'm I'm subscribing on air.

1083
01:20:03.455 --> 01:20:07.330
But, I mean, now I can't use Phoenix, so I'm gonna wait for my Tor

1084
01:20:08.590 --> 01:20:10.370
node. It's gonna take a minute.

1085
01:20:15.745 --> 01:20:17.525
Thank you. Thank you, Kaludis,

1086
01:20:18.465 --> 01:20:18.965
Evan,

1087
01:20:19.665 --> 01:20:21.445
for for making Zeus

1088
01:20:21.780 --> 01:20:25.160
and making it so I can easily connect to my Tor node.

1089
01:20:26.100 --> 01:20:27.160
Are you using LNC?

1090
01:20:28.180 --> 01:20:29.775
What? Are you using LNC?

1091
01:20:30.715 --> 01:20:36.495
Which one is that? There's so many Yeah. And lightning node connect. Yeah. I'm using lightning node connect. Yeah.

1092
01:20:37.270 --> 01:20:39.830
We have that on Snort as well, actually. We have You can

1093
01:20:40.469 --> 01:20:44.730
Yeah. Give me connect, like, your your node directly over LNC in the web.

1094
01:20:47.985 --> 01:20:50.085
Oh, it's it's saying that I didn't subscribe.

1095
01:20:51.505 --> 01:20:54.165
You did. You got my stats you got my stats, bro.

1096
01:20:55.580 --> 01:20:57.280
Yeah. The number went up to 36.

1097
01:20:57.660 --> 01:20:59.440
We now have 36 subscribers.

1098
01:21:01.340 --> 01:21:11.764
Like, that's all you have? Yeah. It's not. We're so early. Yeah. No. I think there was more in the beginning where people just stopped paying it. Wow. I only paid a 7 Sats fee on that. That's dope.

1099
01:21:12.440 --> 01:21:21.980
And that's going to my note as well. I'm using it. I Okay. Now it says I already have a subscription. Let's try again. Yeah. It might take a second to, like because it has to publish the subscription on Noster.

1100
01:21:23.515 --> 01:21:28.415
Okay. So, like It still it says I'm a subscriber on the subscribe page, but not on the deck page.

1101
01:21:28.715 --> 01:21:30.050
Yeah. So if you don't see

1102
01:21:30.530 --> 01:21:39.975
pro, like, at the very top next to the Snort name, then it hasn't, like, published the event yet. Well, when are you gonna publish it? It's automated. I it's I should publish it right away.

1103
01:21:40.935 --> 01:21:42.315
It's asking me to donate,

1104
01:21:42.695 --> 01:21:44.155
and I've just subscribed.

1105
01:21:45.175 --> 01:21:46.155
Well, while we're waiting,

1106
01:21:47.430 --> 01:21:48.250
there's conspiracies

1107
01:21:48.710 --> 01:21:53.770
that because, 10 30 1's an investor in primal that I'm on the top of the trending feed all the time.

1108
01:21:54.550 --> 01:21:59.675
What's your excuse for why I'm on the top of Snort Social's trending feed all the time?

1109
01:22:00.215 --> 01:22:01.114
Blame Nosterband.

1110
01:22:02.695 --> 01:22:03.195
Okay.

1111
01:22:03.575 --> 01:22:10.260
Yeah. Don't blame me. Always be on someone else. We're using the Nastorban feed for trending and for, like, trending people,

1112
01:22:10.720 --> 01:22:11.540
trending posts.

1113
01:22:13.120 --> 01:22:15.940
Okay. So you're just you're just outsourcing that to Nastorban?

1114
01:22:16.305 --> 01:22:16.805
Yep.

1115
01:22:17.505 --> 01:22:20.325
And what do we know what Nasturband's algorithm is?

1116
01:22:20.785 --> 01:22:21.525
No idea.

1117
01:22:22.465 --> 01:22:23.445
It's closed source.

1118
01:22:23.985 --> 01:22:25.925
So Primals is open, I believe.

1119
01:22:29.090 --> 01:22:35.110
But I'll just say it out loud. I mean, the majority comes down to replies. That's why the good morning ones are always

1120
01:22:35.945 --> 01:22:36.605
higher up.

1121
01:22:39.305 --> 01:22:43.645
And you can't, though, you can't verify zaps. So, like, a zap is,

1122
01:22:44.010 --> 01:22:47.310
you know, a zap is a zap. It doesn't matter how much was zapped.

1123
01:22:48.730 --> 01:22:51.150
Right. Did you see that post from Ocean?

1124
01:22:52.305 --> 01:22:57.205
Yeah. With Bold 12? Yeah. Didn't they say that it's verifiable? Can we not use that in zaps,

1125
01:22:57.825 --> 01:22:58.805
the Bold 12?

1126
01:22:59.590 --> 01:23:02.570
Honestly, I'm so disenfranchised about bolt 12.

1127
01:23:02.870 --> 01:23:05.610
I believe that when I see it, that bolt 12 happens.

1128
01:23:08.695 --> 01:23:11.114
Because what be, like, huge for zaps.

1129
01:23:11.415 --> 01:23:18.200
Yeah. I mean, I think I think you can do verifiable with with charm and e cash. Like, I think that's where we're actually going.

1130
01:23:18.680 --> 01:23:25.420
Right. Yeah. I'm I'm in the middle of its own controversies, but, like, I think I think in 5, 10 years, like, the majority

1131
01:23:25.960 --> 01:23:27.820
of zaps are gonna be eCash.

1132
01:23:29.305 --> 01:23:32.205
Yeah. I mean, I would like to default to, like,

1133
01:23:32.665 --> 01:23:34.125
Cashew wallet on Snort.

1134
01:23:34.665 --> 01:23:37.305
So, like, as soon as you log in to Snort for the first time, you can

1135
01:23:38.110 --> 01:23:39.090
you'll have a cashew,

1136
01:23:39.869 --> 01:23:42.050
or you can pick, like, a cashew mint, and

1137
01:23:43.150 --> 01:23:47.555
maybe there'll be a recommended one, and you can have a balance, and you can start zapping right away.

1138
01:23:48.995 --> 01:23:51.495
Yeah. I like that. I think that's the future.

1139
01:23:51.955 --> 01:23:54.455
Especially, like, on chain fees, are are you

1140
01:23:55.639 --> 01:23:58.540
are you are you living in denial of 1 sapper bite?

1141
01:24:00.840 --> 01:24:01.980
What what do you mean?

1142
01:24:03.034 --> 01:24:06.335
Am I in denial? Like, you know fees are gonna go up. Right?

1143
01:24:06.715 --> 01:24:07.215
Yeah.

1144
01:24:08.394 --> 01:24:10.655
Oh, this is weird. I'm, like, logged in

1145
01:24:11.330 --> 01:24:15.590
to my serial dispatch handle on Snort even though my extension is

1146
01:24:17.170 --> 01:24:20.070
Oh, you might need to log out first if you were logged in before.

1147
01:24:20.375 --> 01:24:23.995
So did I just did I just subscribe to Pro on the wrong end pub?

1148
01:24:24.935 --> 01:24:27.995
No. It should've it should've signed an event with your extension.

1149
01:24:29.100 --> 01:24:34.720
So you would've subscribed with whatever your extension is set to. Dude, everyone's a fucking scammer.

1150
01:24:35.500 --> 01:24:38.795
Sign in with nostrils. I think you're gonna have to subscribe twice though.

1151
01:24:39.594 --> 01:24:40.094
Really?

1152
01:24:40.795 --> 01:24:41.295
No.

1153
01:24:42.875 --> 01:24:49.180
Oh, no. Now I'm in pro because I switched. Right. Yeah. I think it's Okay. So I subscribed I subscribed under Odell.

1154
01:24:49.960 --> 01:24:55.135
Yeah. It should it should sign because whenever you request, you know, the server, it uses the

1155
01:24:56.094 --> 01:24:59.394
NIP 98 auth, which is like a an Oscar event.

1156
01:25:00.894 --> 01:25:03.315
So you prove who you are, and then you can subscribe.

1157
01:25:03.860 --> 01:25:05.400
Okay. Now I'm in deck.

1158
01:25:06.180 --> 01:25:06.680
Cool.

1159
01:25:09.060 --> 01:25:11.400
I see still dispatch is live.

1160
01:25:11.715 --> 01:25:13.575
The grinder and one other zapped.

1161
01:25:16.915 --> 01:25:20.055
Yeah. Notifications. Yeah. Let's see if I can

1162
01:25:21.075 --> 01:25:28.410
Yeah. There's a lot of stuff we can do with that as well. Like it's Okay. So why is this broken? Do you see this? Why is it totally empty? Yeah. What's going on here?

1163
01:25:33.635 --> 01:25:35.255
Well, how many relays do you have?

1164
01:25:36.380 --> 01:25:40.239
I'm, I I didn't listen to Fiat, Jeff. I only use the big relays.

1165
01:25:41.579 --> 01:25:47.415
Okay. It shouldn't be like that. Mine looks totally Is it gonna show my is it gonna show my

1166
01:25:48.114 --> 01:25:52.054
and say on the screen? No. No. Just click on readings. There you go.

1167
01:25:52.730 --> 01:25:54.750
See, I only use the big ones plus bitcoinpark.com.

1168
01:25:56.170 --> 01:25:56.670
Okay.

1169
01:25:57.450 --> 01:25:58.990
I mean, it shouldn't be that slow.

1170
01:26:00.245 --> 01:26:02.185
Well there you go, it needs work like I said.

1171
01:26:04.325 --> 01:26:06.665
That's what I need to make it better

1172
01:26:07.125 --> 01:26:09.110
overall. And this is, like, incognito

1173
01:26:09.490 --> 01:26:12.870
Chrome. You know, it's, like, what the web web runs on.

1174
01:26:14.690 --> 01:26:15.590
K. So

1175
01:26:16.050 --> 01:26:20.635
if I press load more, does that help? Yeah. Why is it all empty, though? Nope. Nope.

1176
01:26:21.014 --> 01:26:21.514
Nope.

1177
01:26:22.375 --> 01:26:25.675
It thinks it's loading shit. And if you go to the home page, does it work?

1178
01:26:26.250 --> 01:26:33.310
Let's go to the home page. Why is that empty? Why is it empty? What's going on here? Reload the page? Let's see if I'm trending.

1179
01:26:35.665 --> 01:26:38.324
That's not too bad. You want me to reload the page? Yeah.

1180
01:26:41.440 --> 01:26:43.060
That's weird. I just reloaded.

1181
01:26:44.080 --> 01:26:47.940
And, look, you're, like, you're asking me to donate above an empty feed.

1182
01:26:49.315 --> 01:26:50.855
Donate for more bugs.

1183
01:26:53.235 --> 01:27:00.900
Yeah. We have this this zap splits thing as well. So, like, you can see that I mean, I didn't mean I didn't mean to put you on the spot. I was excited about deck.

1184
01:27:01.440 --> 01:27:03.860
I'll go back to I could share my screen, I guess.

1185
01:27:04.615 --> 01:27:09.915
I don't think you can. I don't think this allows you to. Disabled. Yeah. It doesn't allow you to.

1186
01:27:12.570 --> 01:27:17.790
Oh, I can let's see. There we go. Oh my god. It's beautiful. Well, how do I get that?

1187
01:27:18.170 --> 01:27:20.095
I don't know why it's not loading for you. That's weird.

1188
01:27:20.575 --> 01:27:30.409
Maybe maybe you need, like, a terabyte of RAM, like like Ryanair says. Yeah. But you can scroll here. You can scroll here. I have 32 gigs of RAM. I'm in the top one percent. I have 64.

1189
01:27:32.389 --> 01:27:37.929
You're also in the top 1%. Like, there's there's crazy people now that have a lot more than that. That's true.

1190
01:27:38.595 --> 01:27:42.295
But, yeah, you can get you also get, like, a modal video. It's beautiful, dude.

1191
01:27:42.915 --> 01:27:47.415
You can get the the long form posts here. Wow. I didn't know a guest could

1192
01:27:48.580 --> 01:27:49.480
stream their

1193
01:27:49.940 --> 01:27:51.320
that makes it so much easier.

1194
01:27:51.700 --> 01:28:01.165
Thanks. You can you got, like, a modal view basically whenever you click on anything here. I I used to love tweet deck. Tweet deck was my shit. I'm gonna put it in it. Something went wrong.

1195
01:28:02.265 --> 01:28:10.430
Well, it's a work in progress. Everything's in progress. It's always a work in progress. But, see, your home feed loads. Why doesn't my home feed load? I don't know. I guess you just need to be me.

1196
01:28:10.810 --> 01:28:12.270
Everything works for me.

1197
01:28:12.784 --> 01:28:14.244
Everything works on my machine.

1198
01:28:14.545 --> 01:28:15.045
Noted.

1199
01:28:18.304 --> 01:28:21.204
It's zappy too for you. It's quick. Yeah.

1200
01:28:22.550 --> 01:28:27.449
Maybe because you haven't used it before. Because like this all comes from the cache pretty much. I'm a subscriber.

1201
01:28:28.310 --> 01:28:28.969
You are.

1202
01:28:30.095 --> 01:28:33.475
But like I said, there's there's a bunch of things actually if you go to

1203
01:28:34.575 --> 01:28:38.790
subscribe. You could you should also see your Noster addresses here. You know the ones that you I transferred

1204
01:28:39.409 --> 01:28:42.230
to you? You can, like, manage them here. Let me check.

1205
01:28:44.130 --> 01:28:44.630
So

1206
01:28:45.250 --> 01:28:46.389
Noster address.

1207
01:28:47.065 --> 01:28:48.125
Oh, download zap.stream.

1208
01:28:48.505 --> 01:28:52.365
Let's fucking go. And you can transfer it, and you can we have, like, a

1209
01:28:52.905 --> 01:28:57.909
It's cool that you can transfer it. Yeah. I'm not sure how many people actually use that.

1210
01:28:59.489 --> 01:29:00.790
But we just transfer?

1211
01:29:01.170 --> 01:29:17.620
Yeah. I mean, it's like the dream of all domain hoarders everywhere. They're like, oh, I'm just gonna sell my domains. And no one ever does. You can just hold on to them. Back in February when, like, there was a huge, like, amount of people from China joining, they bought so many, like, handles, like, everything. Like,

1212
01:29:18.080 --> 01:29:29.785
all the all the brand names, like, they're all taken. That's awesome. They just bought up so many of them. Yeah. And that's subscription. Right? Like, they have to keep paying? No. It's once off. Dude, what? It's once off.

1213
01:29:30.360 --> 01:29:36.540
But if you if you pay for the subscription, you get the NIP 5, and that one's You should have learned from Namecheap and

1214
01:29:37.159 --> 01:29:39.635
DNS and shit. Like, you gotta No. No.

1215
01:29:40.355 --> 01:29:41.255
9.99 a year.

1216
01:29:43.875 --> 01:29:51.770
No. Why? It's not. If if you pay the this one, the fan rate, that includes an address. So you get one if you're a subscriber, but you have to pay every month.

1217
01:29:52.150 --> 01:29:58.365
But why wouldn't you make NIP 5 a subscription thing? Like, it should be a subscription thing. Am I crazy?

1218
01:29:58.825 --> 01:30:01.565
Well, it's like a one soft thing. It's, like, 10 times more than

1219
01:30:01.865 --> 01:30:04.845
this the like, the bay the lowest subscription.

1220
01:30:06.110 --> 01:30:07.889
So, like, you pay it once off, and then,

1221
01:30:08.510 --> 01:30:11.810
like, you're good. Whereas this one, you have to pay every month to keep it.

1222
01:30:12.270 --> 01:30:36.645
I mean, someone's asking me in the comments what extension I'm using. I'm using no s two x. Like, I don't think that changes anything. Right? Yeah. I'm using that as well. It's so clean. It's so I know that. So simple. Yeah. And they added NIP 44 as well. So, hopefully, we can do the the new NIP 17 DMs soon in in Snort. I was working on that the other day. Oh, did you see what Jeff came up with? Oh, yeah. His double ratchet DMs?

1223
01:30:37.025 --> 01:30:40.304
Yeah. It's like it's a lot of words, but I'm about halfway through. So

1224
01:30:41.460 --> 01:30:44.760
yeah. That's really interesting. I didn't read it. I just zapped and repost.

1225
01:30:45.060 --> 01:30:46.200
Of course.

1226
01:30:46.739 --> 01:30:52.345
I'm gonna have to implement it though, so I kinda need to read it. Fair enough. Fair enough. I figured I'd read it eventually.

1227
01:30:54.645 --> 01:30:58.905
But DMs are sort like, that's bad. It's really bad right now. Yeah.

1228
01:30:59.510 --> 01:31:02.570
Well, the the NIP 17 DMs is, like, much better.

1229
01:31:03.989 --> 01:31:08.010
So that's that's Do you wanna go through that? What NIP 17 is gift wrap. Right?

1230
01:31:08.389 --> 01:31:16.155
Yeah. It's like the it's gift wrap with, like, a different encryption scheme as well. Okay. I'm removing your screen share, and we're going back to the chat. K.

1231
01:31:17.655 --> 01:31:17.895
The

1232
01:31:18.540 --> 01:31:21.360
it's actually some of the gift wrapping some of the

1233
01:31:21.660 --> 01:31:25.040
schemes used in in the 17 DMs are used in the new

1234
01:31:25.500 --> 01:31:26.800
proposal as well. So

1235
01:31:27.825 --> 01:31:29.685
it's kind of sharing some of those

1236
01:31:31.025 --> 01:31:32.245
parts, you know,

1237
01:31:33.505 --> 01:31:34.565
for the new DMs,

1238
01:31:35.025 --> 01:31:36.810
for the ratchet DMs.

1239
01:31:37.590 --> 01:31:40.730
Yeah. It's like a it's like NIP 17 plus plus. Right?

1240
01:31:41.110 --> 01:31:44.010
Basically. Yeah. Yeah. I like that. Yeah.

1241
01:31:45.245 --> 01:31:50.705
We just iterate. We improve over time. That's it. That's the one. Never ending. Never finished.

1242
01:31:54.489 --> 01:31:55.870
Awesome. Well, I mean,

1243
01:31:56.410 --> 01:31:58.989
I think Snort Deck could be dope if it worked.

1244
01:31:59.610 --> 01:32:00.110
True.

1245
01:32:00.815 --> 01:32:07.715
Like I said, there's there's a lot of cool things we could do. And, also, I didn't know it existed, first of all. I found out on air.

1246
01:32:08.690 --> 01:32:13.670
There you go. We also have this I never tend to keep up with everything, but I think I'm, like, in the top.

1247
01:32:14.530 --> 01:32:19.315
Yeah. It's it's hard to keep up. Top 1% of of, like, keeping up with shit.

1248
01:32:21.615 --> 01:32:22.655
You can also use your,

1249
01:32:23.215 --> 01:32:25.715
your Noster address as, like, an email address.

1250
01:32:26.175 --> 01:32:26.675
Why?

1251
01:32:27.360 --> 01:32:31.300
Yeah. So if you don't wanna, like, if you don't wanna sign up to an email provider, you can use

1252
01:32:32.000 --> 01:32:34.500
the the nostr one. Odell, it's app dot stream?

1253
01:32:35.200 --> 01:32:36.660
Not that one. The Snort ones.

1254
01:32:37.355 --> 01:32:44.735
And then where does it go? Into my DMs? Yeah. DMs you the email. Do people actually use that? Yeah. A good few people use it.

1255
01:32:45.590 --> 01:32:48.010
But then anyone with my end pub could just

1256
01:32:48.790 --> 01:32:50.810
see which emails I'm getting. Right?

1257
01:32:52.605 --> 01:32:55.825
Well, I mean, it just shows that Snort is DM ing you, basically.

1258
01:32:56.445 --> 01:32:59.905
So it's just it's just a bunch of Snort DMs in my emails.

1259
01:33:00.420 --> 01:33:02.679
Yeah. But then how do I re can I reply?

1260
01:33:03.139 --> 01:33:04.360
No. Not yet.

1261
01:33:04.980 --> 01:33:10.985
So it's for, like, verification codes or something. Yeah. Yeah. Like, if you don't wanna use, like, Google or Gmail or whatever.

1262
01:33:12.645 --> 01:33:15.305
Muni is telling me I have to log out and log back in.

1263
01:33:15.685 --> 01:33:16.665
Is that a thing?

1264
01:33:17.960 --> 01:33:19.340
Let's see. Maybe.

1265
01:33:19.719 --> 01:33:20.460
Log out.

1266
01:33:21.480 --> 01:33:23.560
Yeah. If you haven't used it in a while, sometimes it can

1267
01:33:24.795 --> 01:33:28.255
it holds on to the cache, you know, for the for the older versions.

1268
01:33:28.875 --> 01:33:33.980
By the way, you don't have a login button. You have a sign up button, and then after that, it's like login.

1269
01:33:34.380 --> 01:33:34.880
Tell.

1270
01:33:35.820 --> 01:33:36.320
Okay.

1271
01:33:37.260 --> 01:33:39.760
He he wanted it like that, so that's how it is.

1272
01:33:41.745 --> 01:33:43.925
Okay. I logged out, logged back in.

1273
01:33:44.625 --> 01:33:46.565
I can't close the browser because

1274
01:33:47.425 --> 01:33:48.245
we're live.

1275
01:33:48.750 --> 01:33:51.170
Yeah. It still doesn't work. Muni, you're wrong.

1276
01:33:52.350 --> 01:33:59.735
That's weird. I I didn't trust. I verified, and you were wrong. I could log in as you, See what it looks like. Yeah. Do that.

1277
01:34:02.275 --> 01:34:04.775
Do you need my n pub? It's n pub 1qny.

1278
01:34:06.730 --> 01:34:08.350
I don't know any of the other ones.

1279
01:34:08.890 --> 01:34:12.990
Just type Odell. It's upstream and log in. Really? Oh, wow. That's clean.

1280
01:34:14.305 --> 01:34:16.165
This is why I don't use Nostra DMs.

1281
01:34:19.345 --> 01:34:24.520
By the way, he's logging in with the pub key, so it's a view only mode. It's he he's not able to

1282
01:34:25.860 --> 01:34:27.000
post a humiliated

1283
01:34:27.860 --> 01:34:31.715
Yeah. It's not loading. I guess we'll look. What the fuck's going on?

1284
01:34:32.335 --> 01:34:33.715
Crappy code. You know?

1285
01:34:34.415 --> 01:34:37.074
Okay. Well, I can't complain. I appreciate you.

1286
01:34:39.900 --> 01:34:42.320
Dude, do you have anything else you wanna talk about?

1287
01:34:42.700 --> 01:34:54.185
I tried to wrap this, like, 30 minutes ago. Yeah. Sorry. I just thought we should just keep going. You know? Yeah. You're right. You're right. I I mean, you were the one who told me originally we have nothing to talk about, and you were absolutely wrong about that.

1288
01:34:55.330 --> 01:34:58.710
Well, I didn't say we had nothing to talk about. I said it's I'm not very interesting.

1289
01:34:59.090 --> 01:35:02.230
That's what I said. Is that actually what you said? Yeah.

1290
01:35:03.235 --> 01:35:04.135
Let me check.

1291
01:35:13.050 --> 01:35:15.550
Oh, you did say you weren't very interesting. You're right.

1292
01:35:16.650 --> 01:35:18.510
Do you remember what my response was?

1293
01:35:18.810 --> 01:35:19.310
Yep.

1294
01:35:20.695 --> 01:35:21.195
LMFAO

1295
01:35:21.655 --> 01:35:22.155
bullshit.

1296
01:35:23.255 --> 01:35:26.074
Yep. And I think I was correct. Shout out me.

1297
01:35:29.489 --> 01:35:34.630
Well, I think this has been a great rep. What I would like to do, Kieran, is I would like to have you on more often.

1298
01:35:35.090 --> 01:35:36.390
Would you agree to that?

1299
01:35:37.295 --> 01:35:41.395
Sure. As long as it's early. Have you ever been on a podcast before?

1300
01:35:43.375 --> 01:35:46.275
Yes, I think. I was on one of the What?

1301
01:35:46.890 --> 01:35:51.070
I was on Gladchain Radio. I was on Not a podcast. Okay. Whatever.

1302
01:35:51.530 --> 01:35:52.170
I was on,

1303
01:35:52.970 --> 01:35:55.150
I was on another one, like, really early.

1304
01:35:57.895 --> 01:36:01.034
I forgot the name. I love the PBR guys. I'm not trying to be an asshole.

1305
01:36:01.574 --> 01:36:03.275
Oh, let's talk about that actually.

1306
01:36:04.040 --> 01:36:07.980
Alright. Yeah. I also built Noster Nests 2.9 You rebuilt Noster Nests?

1307
01:36:08.760 --> 01:36:10.460
Yeah. That was a Nest. So

1308
01:36:10.935 --> 01:36:12.934
I was on Noster Nests for people.

1309
01:36:13.335 --> 01:36:14.875
Competitor to Spaces

1310
01:36:15.335 --> 01:36:16.954
and Clubhouse. Right?

1311
01:36:17.655 --> 01:36:18.554
Audio only.

1312
01:36:18.855 --> 01:36:20.520
Yep. Direct streams.

1313
01:36:21.059 --> 01:36:22.360
Yeah. I mean, it existed,

1314
01:36:22.820 --> 01:36:24.920
but it wasn't really like an Oster client.

1315
01:36:26.099 --> 01:36:28.040
It was just like a centralized website

1316
01:36:28.824 --> 01:36:33.965
that you Well, yeah. You just kind of prove who you are, basically Yeah. On Nostr.

1317
01:36:34.344 --> 01:36:49.945
But this one is like an actual like, everything's Nostr apart from the the audio. Same exact same setup as AppStream pretty much. It's like audio's AppStream. Right? Basically. Yeah. So it's very similar. That's why it was it only took me, like, a month to build it because it was, like, a lot it was, like, a new back end. It's not the same back end as AppStream.

1318
01:36:50.405 --> 01:36:53.205
It's, it's on another platform, which is also open source called,

1319
01:36:54.230 --> 01:36:54.730
LiveKit.

1320
01:36:55.590 --> 01:36:56.090
LiveKit.

1321
01:36:56.870 --> 01:37:02.295
It's for audio, but they also support video as well. But it's mostly for, like, audio rooms, like,

1322
01:37:02.935 --> 01:37:05.355
group calls and video calls, that kind of thing.

1323
01:37:05.735 --> 01:37:07.675
But, we're using it only for the audio.

1324
01:37:08.935 --> 01:37:18.980
Yeah. That it worked pretty well. And, again, there's still so much you can do with that. But, again, I don't have that much time. So it's hard to, like, prioritize things when you have all these different projects.

1325
01:37:19.375 --> 01:37:24.755
So how did that work? I mean, I'm my understanding is Derek Ross was, like, the man behind Nostra Nests.

1326
01:37:25.455 --> 01:37:26.355
Yeah. Basically.

1327
01:37:26.895 --> 01:37:33.580
Did he just reach out to you and was, like, can you rebuild Nastr Nest for free and then you did it? No. There was a bounty actually.

1328
01:37:33.960 --> 01:37:34.460
Oh.

1329
01:37:34.840 --> 01:37:37.435
Yeah. So there was a bounty but it's been around for like a year.

1330
01:37:37.995 --> 01:37:38.495
And,

1331
01:37:39.595 --> 01:37:40.495
I guess whenever,

1332
01:37:43.195 --> 01:37:48.100
whenever Frog Talk was on, it's like a 24 hour thing they do every year. When it was on the 2nd time,

1333
01:37:48.640 --> 01:37:50.980
I was like Every year for 2 times.

1334
01:37:51.440 --> 01:37:55.860
I just, like, I I tuned into that. I'm like, this sucks. Like, we need to build

1335
01:37:56.605 --> 01:37:59.105
We need to build a new one. It's kind of painful.

1336
01:37:59.485 --> 01:38:05.824
Yeah. It's been our it's been, you know, asked for for so long for someone to like step up and try and build it.

1337
01:38:06.420 --> 01:38:07.159
And then

1338
01:38:07.619 --> 01:38:10.679
Fia Jaff, like, also messaged me or messaged Derek

1339
01:38:11.060 --> 01:38:15.480
a few days later and was like, someone needs to build this. Come on. Like, what's going on?

1340
01:38:15.985 --> 01:38:16.465
And then,

1341
01:38:17.025 --> 01:38:20.164
I messaged Derek around the same time, and I was like,

1342
01:38:20.864 --> 01:38:24.960
I think I might, you know, try and build this thing because, you know, the current one sucks.

1343
01:38:25.440 --> 01:38:40.310
And then eventually, FHF ended up remind kind of reminding me, but also being like, why aren't you building it yet? And then I just started working on it. So He's aggressive in the best way possible. Yeah. Derek Derek always thanks Fijaf, the the Nostra CEO, for for getting me to build it.

1344
01:38:41.590 --> 01:38:45.610
Well, thank you for building it. I think that could also be one of the killer apps for

1345
01:38:46.230 --> 01:38:48.730
Nostra because, I mean, Twitter Spaces sucks.

1346
01:38:49.344 --> 01:38:50.485
Clubhouse is bullshit.

1347
01:38:52.065 --> 01:38:54.645
And, obviously, there is demand for that type of

1348
01:38:56.180 --> 01:39:06.445
product. Yeah. I I really like it as well because it's like a little it's a it's, like, way more I know it's AppStream, like, you don't have as as great of a kind of connection with the other people that are watching, so

1349
01:39:06.825 --> 01:39:09.565
maybe you just wanna, like, chill and and talk. It's like

1350
01:39:10.265 --> 01:39:16.579
it's, like, it's got a little bit more connection to the people that are there because you're just like, like, zap stream. I, like, can't pull people up. Right. Exactly.

1351
01:39:17.360 --> 01:39:19.699
So it's kind of like it's in the middle between, like,

1352
01:39:20.095 --> 01:39:20.595
ZapStream

1353
01:39:21.335 --> 01:39:21.835
and

1354
01:39:22.575 --> 01:39:31.489
and somewhere else, like, text chat, I guess. Like, a better text chat for a group group chat. But what I do like is that, like, you made text chat a first class citizen, like ZapStream,

1355
01:39:32.030 --> 01:39:37.650
which is like what Twitter space is missing. Like, the overwhelming majority of people in the Twitter spaces

1356
01:39:38.695 --> 01:39:41.675
shouldn't be contributing via audio. They should be contributing

1357
01:39:42.455 --> 01:39:44.795
via text, and they can't. Yeah.

1358
01:39:47.120 --> 01:39:51.300
Because, like, you know, the problem is is, like, you bring up, like, a rando in a Twitter spaces,

1359
01:39:52.560 --> 01:39:56.420
and they just go on and on and on and on. It's derail the whole conversation.

1360
01:39:57.114 --> 01:39:58.735
But if if you have them, like,

1361
01:39:59.435 --> 01:40:05.535
test their thesis and, like, do some proof of work in the text chat first before you bring them up, like, you can have a better conversation.

1362
01:40:06.074 --> 01:40:06.574
True.

1363
01:40:07.140 --> 01:40:09.800
No. It's it's actually identical, like, in terms of noster,

1364
01:40:10.500 --> 01:40:11.640
events to ZapStream.

1365
01:40:12.180 --> 01:40:13.960
So, like, nests and

1366
01:40:14.435 --> 01:40:22.455
and streams on ZapStream are identical. Yep. This is why you're prolific. There's gonna be 2 of the main killer apps, I think, of Nasr over the next 5 years.

1367
01:40:23.810 --> 01:40:25.110
We'll see where it goes.

1368
01:40:25.410 --> 01:40:26.390
You're so humble.

1369
01:40:27.330 --> 01:40:30.630
You I mean, you gotta build. You gotta build something, or else you'll never know.

1370
01:40:31.570 --> 01:40:32.390
Damn right.

1371
01:40:34.535 --> 01:40:36.475
Well, I oh, one more thing.

1372
01:40:37.095 --> 01:40:39.355
I you know, we could just go on forever.

1373
01:40:41.520 --> 01:40:42.740
So you know how, like,

1374
01:40:43.840 --> 01:40:44.660
we have

1375
01:40:45.840 --> 01:40:49.265
the last comment in the live stream is this n pub one x

1376
01:40:49.825 --> 01:40:50.325
dlnqtt.

1377
01:40:52.385 --> 01:40:55.205
He's asking a question. The question is irrelevant right now.

1378
01:40:56.385 --> 01:40:58.165
The names don't pop up

1379
01:40:58.480 --> 01:40:59.780
unless I close

1380
01:41:01.360 --> 01:41:03.380
the window and open the window again.

1381
01:41:05.615 --> 01:41:09.295
Yeah. Why is that? Is this a a support call? Or

1382
01:41:10.015 --> 01:41:10.515
Yes.

1383
01:41:12.175 --> 01:41:13.955
I loved another stream with

1384
01:41:14.350 --> 01:41:17.490
with Mutiny. You were like, I was asking a ton of questions.

1385
01:41:18.510 --> 01:41:25.905
Yeah. You were on the opposite you were on the opposite side of that. Yeah. Yeah. I didn't expect you to actually read them out, though. Well, we got where we're at. Could, like, help me.

1386
01:41:26.445 --> 01:41:32.860
I mean, we were talking about, like, NAS versus streams. Like, dispatch First of all, dispatch existed before Clubhouse existed.

1387
01:41:33.400 --> 01:41:37.579
But it's like it, like, straddles the middle ground between, like, a heavily added

1388
01:41:37.985 --> 01:41:40.965
p Peter McCormick or Stefan Lavera podcast.

1389
01:41:41.425 --> 01:41:42.804
Like, we're live. We're unedited.

1390
01:41:43.185 --> 01:41:46.804
We have a text chat, but we're not Nostra Nast. We're not Twitter Spaces.

1391
01:41:47.280 --> 01:41:53.060
Like, it's like, dispatch is, like, kinda in the middle, but the the audience interaction is, like, a key aspect of it.

1392
01:41:53.920 --> 01:41:55.140
Yeah. So you're welcome.

1393
01:41:56.145 --> 01:41:57.525
It it doesn't load because

1394
01:41:58.225 --> 01:42:00.085
of bugs, basically.

1395
01:42:00.705 --> 01:42:05.330
But it's I see it. Because I'm, like, actually run it's like a noster client in the web browser. Right?

1396
01:42:06.210 --> 01:42:08.790
Yeah. What what is this thing you have, by the way, the window?

1397
01:42:09.410 --> 01:42:12.470
What do you mean? Like, the one that you're sharing on the stream.

1398
01:42:13.785 --> 01:42:14.665
See, like, I just

1399
01:42:15.465 --> 01:42:20.045
wait. I reloaded it, and now his name popped up. Let's see. Share.

1400
01:42:21.980 --> 01:42:23.040
So this is,

1401
01:42:23.660 --> 01:42:24.880
if you go to wiz.biz/citadel.

1402
01:42:27.100 --> 01:42:30.080
Okay. So it's like a like a page for your stream?

1403
01:42:30.415 --> 01:42:32.895
Yeah. Wiz Wiz made it for me Okay.

1404
01:42:33.295 --> 01:42:34.755
Because I asked him politely,

1405
01:42:35.935 --> 01:42:39.660
and I said that Noster is the future, and I need my Noster live chat.

1406
01:42:40.860 --> 01:42:42.640
And I was talking to you actually

1407
01:42:43.020 --> 01:42:46.675
at the same time. I was like, I need the Noster live chat to be a permanent link

1408
01:42:47.795 --> 01:42:53.494
so that I can embed it with iframes into this page. Right. And so, like, at any point, if you go to wiz.biz/citadel,

1409
01:42:55.080 --> 01:42:57.420
you get what I'm screen sharing.

1410
01:42:58.520 --> 01:42:59.020
Yeah.

1411
01:42:59.719 --> 01:43:01.820
And then he also made this clock thing

1412
01:43:02.415 --> 01:43:06.915
because the regular mempooled out space didn't look nice next to the chat. Yeah.

1413
01:43:07.455 --> 01:43:14.080
And, like, you you mentioned, like, there's a lot of ideas out there. Like, I'm the ideas guy. K. You know, I don't actually

1414
01:43:14.780 --> 01:43:15.500
I support

1415
01:43:16.675 --> 01:43:19.495
I build things that support people who build things,

1416
01:43:20.195 --> 01:43:22.855
and then I also overload them with ideas.

1417
01:43:24.650 --> 01:43:26.510
Well, I can tell you that I'm already

1418
01:43:26.810 --> 01:43:35.295
overloaded with ideas. Yeah. That's but that's what I do. I'm I've been good with you. I I don't think I've overloaded you with ideas. I'm I'm not What was that one idea, though? Positive.

1419
01:43:36.635 --> 01:43:38.015
The Bitcoin TV one?

1420
01:43:38.955 --> 01:43:48.150
Yeah. That I mean, I didn't overload you with it. I just mentioned it. I'm I'm wondering what's what's happened to that idea. And the idea remains. Like, Bitcoin TV should be ZapStream.

1421
01:43:48.929 --> 01:43:50.469
Like, that's what it should be.

1422
01:43:51.925 --> 01:43:55.545
But, like, we stopped like, Bitcoin TV okay. Let's talk about it.

1423
01:43:56.405 --> 01:43:57.305
Bitcoin TV

1424
01:43:58.165 --> 01:44:00.105
was this idea that, like, we needed

1425
01:44:01.340 --> 01:44:03.120
a place that did this was prenoster,

1426
01:44:05.020 --> 01:44:05.840
and and

1427
01:44:06.380 --> 01:44:08.800
I was afraid my content was gonna get censored

1428
01:44:09.225 --> 01:44:13.324
off of YouTube. I'm still amazed that I haven't been kicked off of YouTube yet.

1429
01:44:14.505 --> 01:44:17.645
I'm really amazed that Marty hasn't been kicked off of YouTube.

1430
01:44:18.780 --> 01:44:26.800
But, like, Bitcoin TV was the idea, like, okay. Let we need a place where, first of all, you can't get kicked off because it's Bitcoiners hosting the content.

1431
01:44:27.515 --> 01:44:30.895
Completely centralized, obviously, but Bitcoiners hosting the content.

1432
01:44:31.915 --> 01:44:38.120
Second of all, you don't get recommended shit corner videos. Right? Like, you go to your favorite corner on YouTube,

1433
01:44:38.820 --> 01:44:43.239
and, like, the next video they recommend is a shit corner video. So that doesn't happen.

1434
01:44:44.100 --> 01:44:49.845
And then third of all, like, really wanted, you know, Bitcoin payments built in, like, value for value lightning stuff.

1435
01:44:50.225 --> 01:44:52.645
And we built it all on on peer tube,

1436
01:44:54.010 --> 01:44:58.190
because open source is amazing, and you should use, like, the predominant FOSS project.

1437
01:44:59.849 --> 01:45:03.675
And I'm like, oh, I only have love for peer 2 maintainers and developers,

1438
01:45:04.055 --> 01:45:06.795
but, like, that project is a fucking mess.

1439
01:45:07.175 --> 01:45:08.155
And then we

1440
01:45:08.510 --> 01:45:12.690
had Bitcorders upload terabytes of content onto our peer tube instance.

1441
01:45:13.630 --> 01:45:20.594
And it's just been a real mess. And then I discovered ZapStream, and I just I don't even use bit I I maintain Bitcoin TV.

1442
01:45:21.295 --> 01:45:23.554
I'm one of the 3 maintainers of it.

1443
01:45:24.040 --> 01:45:24.540
But,

1444
01:45:24.840 --> 01:45:27.980
I mean, I only use ZapStream. Like, ZapStream is fucking awesome.

1445
01:45:31.000 --> 01:45:31.900
But I think

1446
01:45:32.855 --> 01:45:33.355
bitcointv.com's

1447
01:45:33.975 --> 01:45:40.075
a stronger domain. So that's basically where I stand. Right. I actually I tried to I requested to mirror

1448
01:45:40.390 --> 01:45:50.085
Bitcoin TV before because I'm like How did you do that? Through peer tube? Yeah. On peer tube. I was running a peer tube. Did we agree to your did we agree to your request? It was like

1449
01:45:50.785 --> 01:46:01.090
a activity pub thing. Yeah. I I don't know how it works, but I I requested. I'm like, I have, like, 50 terabytes of space, and I'll be happy to mirror this stuff for you. I don't know how how it works, but, like, I requested

1450
01:46:01.790 --> 01:46:06.930
it. I think it was 10 terabytes at the time. It was so I'm not gonna throw Wizz under the bus,

1451
01:46:10.725 --> 01:46:13.705
but Wiz is in charge of that aspect.

1452
01:46:14.965 --> 01:46:15.465
And

1453
01:46:16.910 --> 01:46:22.370
he strongly believes that any mirrors we have degrades performance because he runs, like, 4 ISPs.

1454
01:46:22.989 --> 01:46:23.489
Right.

1455
01:46:24.195 --> 01:46:27.415
Yeah. That makes sense. He doesn't let anyone mirror our content.

1456
01:46:28.195 --> 01:46:28.695
Yeah.

1457
01:46:29.235 --> 01:46:32.455
He has, like, you know, jurisdiction he has

1458
01:46:32.820 --> 01:46:36.520
ISPs around the globe. So, like, depending on where you hit,

1459
01:46:37.460 --> 01:46:39.880
you go to his servers in that region.

1460
01:46:41.025 --> 01:46:44.324
But, yeah, Bitcoin TV is garbage. Like, don't use it.

1461
01:46:44.704 --> 01:46:49.284
But, yeah, I mean, that's why I brought it up is because, I mean, ZapStream is so is is

1462
01:46:49.840 --> 01:46:51.380
in my mind,

1463
01:46:51.680 --> 01:46:55.300
ZapStream is what I wanted Bitcoin TV to be at some point.

1464
01:46:55.920 --> 01:46:59.380
Yeah. I think we can do it. I mean, we have designs for, like,

1465
01:47:00.304 --> 01:47:02.485
like, regular videos and, like,

1466
01:47:04.145 --> 01:47:06.085
not live streams, but I'm

1467
01:47:07.910 --> 01:47:14.890
kinda reliant on this, you know, system to process videos. But I guess if you're just linking them, you know, like Flair Pub does.

1468
01:47:15.350 --> 01:47:16.730
Well, Flair is done.

1469
01:47:17.545 --> 01:47:20.445
Is is it down? I think he's I think he

1470
01:47:20.825 --> 01:47:23.965
discontinued it. It's no longer I don't even think it's

1471
01:47:24.400 --> 01:47:27.300
it's not even you can't even say it's not oh, it's still there.

1472
01:47:28.160 --> 01:47:35.205
Didn't say flare is done? I I think he was just he said that a bunch a bunch of different projects and Oh, Flare's

1473
01:47:35.745 --> 01:47:44.870
awesome. Yeah. Well, we could we could use the same spec as Flare. I think I think Bookmark supports it as well. Yeah. I like that Flare doesn't actually try and host everything.

1474
01:47:45.410 --> 01:47:45.910
Yeah.

1475
01:47:47.410 --> 01:47:49.270
No. We we have designs for, like,

1476
01:47:49.730 --> 01:47:50.950
a a YouTube type

1477
01:47:52.065 --> 01:47:52.565
kind

1478
01:47:53.185 --> 01:47:54.405
of recommended bar

1479
01:47:55.025 --> 01:47:58.485
and the comment section underneath the video and and stuff like that, but

1480
01:47:59.930 --> 01:48:00.590
we kinda

1481
01:48:01.210 --> 01:48:02.670
try to keep it, you know,

1482
01:48:03.210 --> 01:48:05.630
the Twitch killer first approach, and then

1483
01:48:06.325 --> 01:48:08.585
maybe we can add this these kind of,

1484
01:48:10.245 --> 01:48:11.625
pre rendered video uploads

1485
01:48:12.565 --> 01:48:16.000
later. So we're not not quite there, but I think we could totally do that.

1486
01:48:16.400 --> 01:48:20.020
You know, have because then you basically have Bitcoin TV, right? You would have

1487
01:48:20.560 --> 01:48:23.940
just a place to see all those Yeah, the YouTube competitor.

1488
01:48:24.560 --> 01:48:25.060
Yeah.

1489
01:48:25.795 --> 01:48:33.255
You can do both. I mean, you can do both on I wanna be able to send I wanna be able to send people to a place where they can watch, like, good Bitcoin Nostra content.

1490
01:48:34.110 --> 01:48:34.610
Yeah.

1491
01:48:35.630 --> 01:48:39.010
But I think it it's ZapStream is very close to it already.

1492
01:48:40.270 --> 01:48:41.650
It is. Yeah.

1493
01:48:42.395 --> 01:48:43.594
I mean, I would just

1494
01:48:44.235 --> 01:48:45.054
since we're

1495
01:48:45.514 --> 01:48:47.695
an hour and 50 minutes into the

1496
01:48:48.074 --> 01:48:52.770
into the show, we only have the rider dies now. So I give you guys a little bit of context.

1497
01:48:56.990 --> 01:48:59.170
Like, the the the real context happens

1498
01:48:59.515 --> 01:49:01.375
this late in in the shows.

1499
01:49:02.795 --> 01:49:10.220
Like most people that left the fiat world and went into the Bitcoin world and wanted to surround themselves with Bitcoin, and now Nasr,

1500
01:49:11.400 --> 01:49:12.140
full time.

1501
01:49:16.315 --> 01:49:18.735
Like, I make way, way, way, way less money

1502
01:49:19.515 --> 01:49:21.135
than I did in the fiat world.

1503
01:49:22.610 --> 01:49:29.829
Most of my projects lose money. Bitcoin Park has lost a tremendous amount of money. Bitcoin TV has lost slightly less money.

1504
01:49:31.765 --> 01:49:38.745
Open stats makes me no money by design, which is actually, like, quite successful because it's it's 0. I don't

1505
01:49:39.364 --> 01:49:47.619
lose money. I don't make money on it. It was, like, a little bit personal contributions that I made in the beginning. But besides my time, I haven't lost money on open sets.

1506
01:49:48.800 --> 01:49:50.100
Rabbit hole recap,

1507
01:49:51.905 --> 01:50:02.550
basically doesn't make me much money even though it's got ads because I just recommend the best product. So it doesn't matter if you pay me an ad or not. So the people that make the best products don't pay for ads,

1508
01:50:03.250 --> 01:50:08.150
and the people that make the bad products don't pay for ads because they know I'm gonna tell people not to use them regardless.

1509
01:50:08.635 --> 01:50:11.855
And then 10:31 is, like, barely making me

1510
01:50:12.475 --> 01:50:12.975
money,

1511
01:50:13.755 --> 01:50:16.015
but it's like a long term play that

1512
01:50:16.680 --> 01:50:20.540
if you invest in the best of Bitcoin and Noster, like, hopefully,

1513
01:50:21.320 --> 01:50:22.540
long term, it should

1514
01:50:23.080 --> 01:50:23.580
pay

1515
01:50:23.960 --> 01:50:25.660
good equity value,

1516
01:50:26.824 --> 01:50:34.284
which I think is true. But in in the short term, it hasn't really made me much money. And I think this is a trend that you see with almost every person

1517
01:50:34.989 --> 01:50:35.969
that is operating

1518
01:50:36.910 --> 01:50:37.410
ethically

1519
01:50:37.790 --> 01:50:42.370
in the Bitcoin space or trying to operate as ethically as possible in the Bitcoin space, which is

1520
01:50:42.915 --> 01:50:47.415
and and especially the nostril space, which is even more nascent, which is that

1521
01:50:48.034 --> 01:50:52.054
there's not much money to go around, and it's a fucking grind.

1522
01:50:52.980 --> 01:50:55.880
But you're paid off in the dividends of of freedom

1523
01:50:56.500 --> 01:50:58.040
and feeling fulfilled, and

1524
01:50:58.580 --> 01:50:59.960
that's what keeps us going.

1525
01:51:01.795 --> 01:51:05.735
But, yeah, Bitcoin TV has just been a fucking money sink, I guess, was my point.

1526
01:51:08.650 --> 01:51:14.750
Which is I warned you about. Right, Kieran? I did warn you about. I was Yeah. You you were you're trying to scare me away from that idea.

1527
01:51:15.210 --> 01:51:21.375
Well, I was I was trying to, like, Twitch. One of the big things that Twitch did was not 90 days. It's like a week.

1528
01:51:22.074 --> 01:51:28.520
Like, they store your video. I think it's a month. No? They, like, barely store your video. Right. Right?

1529
01:51:29.700 --> 01:51:32.520
Can you even download the video from there? I don't think so.

1530
01:51:34.554 --> 01:51:43.454
Yeah. But they, like, made an active point. They were like, we're not YouTube. Like, you're we're not an archive for your content. Like, people come here to watch you live,

1531
01:51:43.880 --> 01:51:51.980
and we will not continue hosting it and and delivering it to people. Yeah. Like, what what a lot of people can do on ZapStream as well is, like,

1532
01:51:52.725 --> 01:51:56.665
you can use this restream feature. We have a restream feature that's included

1533
01:51:57.285 --> 01:52:04.820
where you can, like if you stream to ZapStream, you can automatically, like, restream to any number of other platforms. Right. Because I pay Restream, like, $600

1534
01:52:05.120 --> 01:52:08.739
a year or something. Right. So you can do that for free on on ZapStream.

1535
01:52:09.895 --> 01:52:17.275
You can, like, push your stream to YouTube or Twitch or any anywhere else. And so what you can do is, like, don't pay the ZapStream

1536
01:52:17.800 --> 01:52:19.180
best rate to have recordings

1537
01:52:19.720 --> 01:52:31.684
and just use the and just use the forwarder to, like, send it to YouTube and have them save it for you. So, like, you use use a That's what I do. Oh, exactly. I mean, but I don't use I I pay Restream because I like

1538
01:52:32.929 --> 01:52:37.510
I don't know. Their interface is great. Like, you see my nice banner on the bottom and shit? Yeah.

1539
01:52:38.289 --> 01:52:40.449
Like, it's just dependable. But, like, YouTube

1540
01:52:41.025 --> 01:52:47.765
like, I'm a 100%, like, as much as I shit on Slave Tech, whatever, like, YouTube has the full archive. Right? Absolutely.

1541
01:52:49.140 --> 01:52:54.040
And you better make a backup because they can do it. The backup. I have everything. Yeah.

1542
01:52:54.740 --> 01:52:59.344
I the for a while, I was putting torrents up, actually. You could download a torrent of everything.

1543
01:53:00.445 --> 01:53:01.425
Because I believe

1544
01:53:02.605 --> 01:53:05.505
I believe all this should be available to everybody.

1545
01:53:06.320 --> 01:53:08.900
And if they don't find it helpful, then don't listen.

1546
01:53:09.679 --> 01:53:12.260
But, it should be available to everyone for free.

1547
01:53:13.040 --> 01:53:15.300
And then if they find value, they should donate.

1548
01:53:15.815 --> 01:53:17.915
I'm wondering how we can get the the ZapStream,

1549
01:53:18.695 --> 01:53:21.755
like, chats in these applications because some people have been using

1550
01:53:22.215 --> 01:53:24.795
StreamYard, and they're like, how can I get my ZapStream

1551
01:53:25.370 --> 01:53:26.430
chats in StreamYard?

1552
01:53:28.410 --> 01:53:29.630
That would be kinda cool.

1553
01:53:30.090 --> 01:53:34.110
Well, that's why I'm, like, using the screen sharing basically is how I'm doing it. Right?

1554
01:53:34.475 --> 01:53:51.320
Yeah. But they they they show those, like, comments on the screen, and they, like, go through them, and they're, like, probably more. Choose. They pick and choose, like, who they like. Right? Yeah. Like, one of the beaut I mean, I honestly think that is not a feature people want because I think most streamers don't have the balls

1555
01:53:51.775 --> 01:53:55.395
to have the live unmodified chat on screen.

1556
01:53:55.775 --> 01:53:57.075
Because, like, if you're

1557
01:53:58.335 --> 01:53:59.315
if you're like

1558
01:54:03.070 --> 01:54:08.610
like a Peterson or something where, like, the trolls are, like, destroying you and you just can't handle, like, cyberbullying,

1559
01:54:09.615 --> 01:54:20.330
like, you're not willing to there's a reason why most shows are not live unedited shows with a live chat display. Like, I to this day, I don't think anyone has

1560
01:54:21.510 --> 01:54:24.010
tried to replicate the model of of dispatch.

1561
01:54:24.775 --> 01:54:29.835
And it's because it's a little bit masochist, but also it's, like, a little bit too free for most people.

1562
01:54:31.335 --> 01:54:44.925
I think on StreamYard, like, they're, like, selecting, you know, which ones to show. Yeah. That's what I'm saying. They're picking and choosing their favorites. But they're basically asking me, like, how do I get the the ZapStream comments in here so I can get them on screen? Right. Because on StreamYard

1563
01:54:45.304 --> 01:54:46.284
and on Restream,

1564
01:54:46.745 --> 01:54:51.965
like, it pulls in YouTube and Twitch and the other large ones, and so then you can choose

1565
01:54:53.370 --> 01:54:56.590
you can choose which ones you pull in. Right.

1566
01:54:57.690 --> 01:55:01.310
I don't know if it's possible, though, with with with StreamYard and

1567
01:55:01.895 --> 01:55:05.515
and recently they do it. I think there's, like, some kind of chat API.

1568
01:55:06.135 --> 01:55:14.110
Yeah. They're pretty locked down. You have to ask their permission. Like, StreamYard like, you have to reach out to StreamYard and be like, here's my API. Like, pull in my chats.

1569
01:55:14.570 --> 01:55:15.070
Yeah.

1570
01:55:16.585 --> 01:55:22.205
Like, I used to if you go back on dispatch, like, you can see the evolution of it. Like, it used to be,

1571
01:55:22.745 --> 01:55:23.645
like, matrix.

1572
01:55:24.510 --> 01:55:30.690
First of all, it used to be that Twitch and YouTube were the only ones shown because that's what Restream allowed me to do.

1573
01:55:31.365 --> 01:55:36.025
And then I, like, figured out a way to do screen share to bring Matrix in.

1574
01:55:37.285 --> 01:55:44.070
And then I figured out a way to do screen share to bring Noster in, but I was still doing the Twitch and

1575
01:55:44.850 --> 01:55:50.574
the YouTube comments, but they were larger than the Noster comments. And I didn't like that they were larger.

1576
01:55:51.435 --> 01:55:55.035
You know? I I can I can do it right now? Most people don't comment because

1577
01:55:55.675 --> 01:55:59.670
but see, like, see how much larger it is? Oh, yeah. That's ridiculous.

1578
01:56:01.250 --> 01:56:07.910
Like, they they don't deserve that. They're not in the lost nostril live chat. So I I pulled them out, and now I just do the nostril live chat alone.

1579
01:56:09.675 --> 01:56:12.175
There is no second best. But that's

1580
01:56:12.635 --> 01:56:14.575
that's the evolution of

1581
01:56:15.595 --> 01:56:17.580
of of me playing around with,

1582
01:56:18.140 --> 01:56:19.520
the large streaming providers.

1583
01:56:20.060 --> 01:56:22.880
Bro, don't you even sign every single comment you write?

1584
01:56:23.420 --> 01:56:25.200
I do. Most most usually.

1585
01:56:26.145 --> 01:56:28.245
Oh, no, sir. You do. That's for sure.

1586
01:56:29.025 --> 01:56:34.645
I do wonder about that. I mean, before we wrap I mean, we've just been gone. I told you we had a lot to talk about.

1587
01:56:35.620 --> 01:56:37.320
You are very interesting, sir.

1588
01:56:39.220 --> 01:56:40.040
I do

1589
01:56:42.260 --> 01:56:43.560
there is, like,

1590
01:56:44.045 --> 01:56:47.025
there's this, like, privacy concern that we're, like, we're not considering

1591
01:56:48.764 --> 01:56:56.030
or that we are consider some of us are considering, but most of us aren't considering. That's like we're broadcasting all this stuff,

1592
01:56:56.650 --> 01:56:57.630
all this text,

1593
01:56:57.930 --> 01:57:00.510
specifically on Noster, all this text that is signed.

1594
01:57:01.364 --> 01:57:04.264
It gets it's literally just like, this is definitely me.

1595
01:57:04.565 --> 01:57:15.230
And we're broadcasting it's a whole world. You can't delete it. Like, there's a nip for deletes. Like, you're not you're not actually really deleting stuff. I mean, you could never if they're just scraping everything in real time, there's

1596
01:57:15.850 --> 01:57:17.870
you have no you have no chance, you know?

1597
01:57:18.475 --> 01:57:28.429
They have proof that you you said it even if you try to delete it. I think it's important for people to realize that. It's like it's a public broadcasting. Like, people will know you said this. Exactly. Yeah.

1598
01:57:28.770 --> 01:57:30.230
And when you said it.

1599
01:57:30.850 --> 01:57:31.350
And

1600
01:57:33.570 --> 01:57:39.335
and and I hope people realize that's what they're doing when they're out there. There's a risk that comes with all this freedom.

1601
01:57:43.074 --> 01:57:44.695
Yeah. Yeah. Freedom isn't free.

1602
01:57:47.930 --> 01:57:50.030
Okay, dude. This is fucking awesome.

1603
01:57:51.450 --> 01:57:53.150
So we're gonna do this often.

1604
01:57:53.555 --> 01:58:01.815
Or, I mean, not it doesn't have to be like, depending on what your definition of often is, but, like, I would like I would like to have you on in a reoccurring basis. Are we cool with that?

1605
01:58:02.360 --> 01:58:02.860
Sure.

1606
01:58:03.160 --> 01:58:04.460
Awesome. Thank you, Karen.

1607
01:58:05.320 --> 01:58:08.620
Do you have any final thoughts, for the listeners before we wrap?

1608
01:58:10.385 --> 01:58:11.364
Watch this space.

1609
01:58:11.985 --> 01:58:12.804
Always shipping.

1610
01:58:13.665 --> 01:58:14.645
Thanks for watching.

1611
01:58:15.905 --> 01:58:17.605
Some people watched, that's great.

1612
01:58:19.969 --> 01:58:21.750
Yeah. I'm I'm excited to just

1613
01:58:22.210 --> 01:58:28.150
try out new things, try out Blossom, try out this, try out that, and kill as many centralized platforms as possible.

1614
01:58:28.675 --> 01:58:33.574
Let's fucking go. Well, I appreciate you, Kieran. Thanks for joining us. Thanks for everything you're building.

1615
01:58:35.680 --> 01:58:37.860
Whether you believe it or not, you're a fucking legend.

1616
01:58:40.400 --> 01:58:47.475
Huge shout out to the freaks who joined us in the live chat. You guys make the show unique. It would not be possible without you.

1617
01:58:48.255 --> 01:58:52.035
And huge shout out to the freaks who continue to support the show

1618
01:58:52.810 --> 01:58:59.310
using Bitcoin, whether that's through podcasting 2 point o apps, like Fountain or Breeze or through ZapStream itself,

1619
01:59:00.015 --> 01:59:01.875
which we discussed at length here.

1620
01:59:03.535 --> 01:59:05.395
Your sets do not go unnoticed.

1621
01:59:06.495 --> 01:59:07.795
They keep me going,

1622
01:59:08.335 --> 01:59:11.400
particularly the messages. Fucking awesome. Our largest,

1623
01:59:12.660 --> 01:59:14.840
donations this week were from 8 Mythrender

1624
01:59:15.540 --> 01:59:21.425
with 48,000 sats, Pringle Stacks with 22,000 sats, Gary Krause with 20,000 sats, and JPAK

1625
01:59:22.045 --> 01:59:22.864
with 15,000

1626
01:59:23.165 --> 01:59:26.145
sats. That's combined through podcasting 2.0

1627
01:59:27.210 --> 01:59:27.870
and ZapStream.

1628
01:59:30.730 --> 01:59:32.510
I appreciate you. Thank you, guys.

1629
01:59:33.210 --> 01:59:34.750
Thank you, Karen. Keep building.

1630
01:59:35.915 --> 01:59:37.055
You're a fucking boss.

1631
02:02:30.125 --> 02:02:31.025
Love you, freaks.

1632
02:02:32.205 --> 02:02:36.225
That was that track was For What It's Worth by Buffalo Springfield.

1633
02:02:37.520 --> 02:02:38.980
Originally recorded in 1966.

1634
02:02:39.920 --> 02:02:40.900
That was a remaster.

1635
02:02:43.679 --> 02:02:47.139
You know, it's easy to get caught up in the day to day, but

1636
02:02:48.405 --> 02:02:54.505
this fight that we're a part of is a fight that has been going on for many fucking years, decades decades.

1637
02:02:55.205 --> 02:02:56.985
I hope you guys enjoyed this trip.

1638
02:02:58.150 --> 02:02:59.050
I sure did.

1639
02:02:59.510 --> 02:03:02.170
I got a great rip lined up with Ben Arck tomorrow.

1640
02:03:03.350 --> 02:03:08.385
Talk Ellen Bits. Talk Noster. We're gonna talk about all the things. Who the hell knows what we're gonna talk about?

1641
02:03:08.845 --> 02:03:11.665
That's at 1700 UTC, our usual time.

1642
02:03:13.448 --> 02:03:15.388
I love you all. Stay on.