EP #048 - Concrete Combat

Seth: [00:00:00] And welcome to another episode of the Concrete Logic Podcast, and today I have Dirk Tharpe with Sakrete. Dirk, will you please give us a better intro?

Dirk Tharpe: Thank you, Seth. First of all, I am so pleased to be invited to be on your show. And it's an honor because I certainly know of Baker Concrete's reputation.

It's stellar. My name's Dirk Tharpe. I work for Oldcastle APG. And in our large family, we are on the dry mix side. We are Rete, which is the concrete and concrete product side. And then were Amerimix masonry and stuccos.

Seth: And we didn't get together to talk about Sakrete, but we did get together to talk about something really cool that you were a part of.

Which is the Concrete Combat Show. So we're gonna talk about something a little bit different. Usually on the podcast we talk about something really technical and [00:01:00] concrete. Sometimes we talk about the economics of concrete and that, that's thing. But today I brought Dirk on because this is fun.

It's he we've had a couple conversations and talked about the show that he did. And why don't you tell us a little bit about it, Dirk? What the show, how, what was the origin of it? How'd you come up with this idea?

Dirk Tharpe: Y yes, Seth. It's a really fun story.

In 2021, randomly my phone rings and it's my brother in arms, Dave Jackson. He is our brand manager for Sac Creed and Amer. And he said, I wanna pose a hypothetical. What if somebody said we were allowed to do a concrete game show? How would we do that? And I'm like, what? Is this for real?

And he goes, to be honest with you, I just got contacted from a marketing group that said in Y in the past year, right before the Covid had [00:02:00] started, a budget had been passed. Or there is talk of doing a game show. And I'm like, wow. So I said, let me think about it a week. Call me back. So we, I sat down and I just thought up, it's six episodes and it's a finale, and I just plotted out what each contest would be like, and then handed that back in.

And then I didn't hear about it for, months went by. All of a sudden I get a phone call and sets up a meeting where I'm to meet on I wanna say it was Zoom. And they said, Hey, we're gonna have you interview some possible host or hostesses for the TV show and see who you had the best rapport with.

So then I knew it was real and we did that. The lady that I voted for as I'm, I was certainly comfortable with was Brittany Goodwin. [00:03:00] She is an a seasoned actress, and so we had Brittany on board and then it was time to we were going to schedule and it just became the waiting game with Covid.

So you never knew if it was gonna happen or not. Covid got really tight and then out of the blue, Hey, can you be in Atlanta the week of April 12th? So it was real and it was on. So that's how the whole thing went. We got there and it was amazing, Seth. It was a gigantic sound studio just like you film, a movie scene in, and there was the S Creek Combat.

Set with all the props and the tools and the products, and it was it was a real thing with cameras everywhere wired for sound. I've not been involved in something that large before and it was a wonderful experience.

Seth: Yeah, I watched a few episodes. I watched the first couple and then I cheated and I [00:04:00] jumped to the end.

Cuz you were sharing with me that the end you all did it at the World of Concrete. And so I wanted to jump to the end. But anyways, could you talk about, so how many episodes did you do? And I guess first off, did you record all these last year as 2022? Is that right? It

Dirk Tharpe: was 2021. Okay. The week of April 12th, and the way you know, you, I didn't know this, but the way, I've always wondered when you watch game shows how it's just, how can they do that?

How can they film so much? What they actually do is they film them back to back. So for, we shot Monday through Saturday every day into the night to get those episodes in the can. And so that's sixth. So six episodes were the normal competition. And what we did, we set it up so it has a feel like an Iron Chef kind of thing where you have a host, [00:05:00] but then you've got your judges.

So they're separate duties and each episode takes. Two concrete or masonry or ref, whatever the profession. We had folks coming in and they were in groups of two, so they were used to working together and they would get the challenge and we'd unveil it by pulling a blanket or a curtain away, and then the timer starts and they have 30 minutes to do the episode.

Now, when we had a concrete, like concrete slab versus concrete slab, obviously. That became shooted in the morning. We had to let the concrete set cuz we actually did pour concrete inside the studio and then come back in the afternoon and start the finishing process. That's why, as I say, we filmed into the night every episode.

And then on that Saturday night, we were done. We all went home. And I remember the first episode came through [00:06:00] editing. And was unveiled on June 8th, 2021, which I remember that cuz it's my father's birthday. So that was a, an unusual birthday present. That's cool. The seventh final episode we held, so they timed it where it would release one a month and we made it all the way to the world of concrete.

And then at the world of concrete in our SARE booth. We actually filmed live in front of it. We had bleachers set up live audience, and the finale was right there. So it was really cool.

Seth: Yeah. So let's, how did they determine, did they have, so you were saying, so they bring in it's a competition.

So you bring in two teams of two. So it's a pair of folks versus another pair of folks. How did they determine who were the competitors? Was that already determined when you were there? Or did people like have that?

Dirk Tharpe: That was, yeah, that was the marketing company, your, I should say production, the [00:07:00] production company.

It's amazing all the jobs they have and all the things they handle. And they'll have people that just do nothing but search for the contestants. So that's how we got the contestants. And then what you did was you did contest contests until you got to semi-finals. So you now had two groups of two going against each other.

And then those winners became the finals to go to the world of concrete. So that was all done by the marketing department. W The challenge was Seth, we filmed this during covid. Now the vaccine was already out, but we were still having to do this protocol set by whatever governs studios, where they take your temperature and you show your vaccination card and all that stuff every morning.

Yeah. So we went through the challenges. You'll notice that we're not having to wear mask because everybody was vaccinated, et cetera. But everyone else out there that you can't see is wearing mask uhhuh. So with that challenge, [00:08:00] things happened I remember one crew was a masonry crew, didn't get to come cuz it turned out his son, or both of his, this guy's sons ended up in the hospital.

So on the fly you were constantly adjusting. Then that ended up happening in our judges too. So there's three on the judge panel. And what we decided to do was, the two studies were myself, I'm your Simon Cow of the show. And then we have a wonderful guy named Mike Day. And Mike Day of Day's concrete Floors is a he's a an influencer through like Instagram and YouTube, he's got many videos where he is constantly trying to teach concrete.

So that's the mindset we wanted. So you had Michael being the super nice guy on one side. I'm on the other side. And then we ended up picking a revolving judge. So every episode has a different middle panelists and it ended up being the right decision because then you had, you had new blood, new [00:09:00] thoughts, new backgrounds.

To, to inject into the judging. So it was really neat how that worked

out. Yeah. It sounds like you were. Dealing with the same stuff that we were dealing on the construction sites. So absolutely very li similar challenges there. And yeah. Could you talk a little bit about each episode? I get, I don't want to give it all away cuz we want to encourage folks to check it out, but I thought it was pretty cool because it's a unique way to promote.

The concrete industry they did they did a bunch of different they did six different challenges to get to the finals. And then, like you said, it was a tournament type situation. So if you won, you moved on and you waited for the winner of the other group. And then you would compete against them, against a competition.

The guy the winners had to win twice, is that right? They essentially had to win twice to get to the finals Yes. Doing that math, right? Yes. On a

Monday [00:10:00] morning. Yep. Yep. All right. So it, you, Seth, let's set the stage and you just made a phrase that that I definitely want to make clear to your audience.

Concrete Combat is entertaining. I am so glad that we weren't attacked and trolled by, because, in our world, we can get so technical, so nitpicky that you can't breathe and you can't have fun. So we honestly did not have that kind of response, and I was so glad to see that because that's not what this is about.

This is what concrete combat's about, and the way that Dave and I designed it is, I don't care if you're a seasoned professional or a one-time do-it-yourselfer. If you watch these episodes while you're laughing and being entertained, you're gonna learn two things per episode. One is you're gonna see some honest mistakes, what not to do, [00:11:00] and you're seeing them committed by real professionals.

So even the pros make simple mistakes. That's the first lesson. So the second thing is, You're going to learn how to do something that maybe wasn't in your repertoire. It wasn't in your bag of professions. So you can be a guy who's a floor guy and go, this is nonsense. I'm not watching it. But yet, you may never have done a dry stack wall.

So each episode, I encourage whoever's listening from, like I said, from beginners to seasoned veterans, is to set aside that we all have that ego chip about. I'm the best in all that. Set all that aside and give it a chance, cuz I'm telling you, you're going to see something that you've never done. Or some or see some technique that works well and you'll go, you know what, I'm gonna try that.

So that's what the show's about the show? Yes. It's Sakrete, it features all of our products. We, as we designed it [00:12:00] and got more and more into the meetings, we were like, we're just gonna have to use Sakrete because it wouldn't be fair to bring in other products. And then somebody lose and they used ours and liked it better.

They're gonna say, you rigged it. So we kept it just Sakrete for the record. And from there it was, so the decisions are, hey, behind you are all these different materials. You as a professional group decide what you want to do to tackle that challenge. So, all the answers are there, but we didn't guide you as to say, okay, you grabbed this and you guys grabbed that.

Everybody made their own decisions and that's what made it so educational, right? While it's being entertaining. Yeah. To just lightly go through some episodes, episode one, that's our first one, right? That's where Covid hit. We, our professional mason crew was not there and gosh we were grabbing folks to just to have the guts to [00:13:00] get on camera and do it, but it ended up being a wonderful exercise to learn how to do a dry stack wall.

The team that did that versus doing standard masonry really did a bang-up job. And I don't know who all, if you've not experienced surface bonding cement type of a dry stack wall, that's one to watch. Don't get hung up on s. One of the things I learned, Seth, for when we go forward is I'm gonna pay more attention to wording.

They did say we were building retaining wall. We weren't. It was just a freestanding wall. It's a partition wall. But cause they said that word more folks got focused on, hey, you didn't feel the cells, you didn't do this, you didn't do that. When we really were just trying to show, hey, this is how block, these are two ways to lay block.

Episode two. Episode two is fantastic. Old school versus new school. You get to see these two young contractors who were nice and sharp as they could be. They made some fundamental mistakes on how to do a resurfacing, where [00:14:00] my old school, the w the team out of Florida his name's Concrete Mike, he's a great guy.

Concrete Mike actually took an, the older method where you've got the like a sand mix, right? Everybody makes a sand mix. And he added his bonding agent like he should, and he created the low-cost alternate to how you do a resurfacing. And I think he did an inch and a quarter to an inch and a half on top of a busted-up sidewalk.

And it was beautiful. Some other things we did was we had a banged-up set of concrete steps that were just destroyed. And they had to really rush the two teams to make 'em look new. We did do a slab pour right where your mixer in there. Not the big mixer. This is one of those smaller, like three bagg max mixers and they had to pour concrete and we watched their techniques mimicking in an exterior sidewalk.

Another one that I think folks really will learn from is the shower pan episode. [00:15:00] Because if you're like me, I mean I'm a concrete guy. How many concrete guys truly are tile guys? To be honest, probably none of us, right? No. I mean we might know stucco, but tile, so this is where you get to see the old way to do a base of a shower pan and we use sand mix and those guys, they have to do it right, cause we're not telling them the steps.

And that one became who one was, the one that stuck absolutely to the correct steps. Like you're looking at it through the eyes of the T C N A, the Tile Council of North America. That was really cool. We did a post setting episode where we actually own a horse farm, and it was regular concrete and they did mix it.

Versus a faceting concrete mix. And that was a neat exercise. And at the end, we pulled out the facet and hit it with hammers to show that mass does become solid concrete in that particular design faceting concrete mix. And then, I don't wanna give the finale away, but it was a doozy. [00:16:00]

We pulled out some really big concrete pieces to fix there. So, all in all, that's what it's about, was have fun. And whether you admit it or not, you're gonna learn something by watching it or you're gonna learn something not to do. And that was the whole premise of this thing. Each episode for the record only runs around the 20-minute mark, and you'll notice it's precut for should the day come when it gets picked up.

We've already got the little, like the. Sac, the SAC Creek Concrete Combat sign slams together. That would be where a commercial could fit in there. So, it is set that way, but as is, they're on YouTube and free access to anyone. Yeah.

Seth: Yeah. And what was cool is the, like you told me before we were talking on the phone a week or two ago, you were saying everything on here is is not.

It's not like really produced other than the host, [00:17:00] these are regular guys competing here. These aren't guys that you got all dressed up or you picked out actors or something. These are guys that do this type of work day in, day out for a living. And the only person that was you can really tell when you start watching the episode, who hasn't, who's not in the industry.

It's the la the host. And she, the way you know, but like you said, you need that for a show like this. So that was really cool. And it she brought in I don't know if they wrote the questions for her or not, but she did ask good questions. She asked you guys, the judges on what was going on and what the teams were doing.

If, if you had any pointers or criticisms of what they were doing and who was doing better and things like that. She was bringing in those questions while the guys were competing. I thought that was pretty cool too.

Dirk Tharpe: Yeah, Brittany really, she was a trooper. The coolest and authentic thing about Sat Creek Concrete [00:18:00] Combat is it is.

Live and unscripted. So as Seth says, one person on that whole production had to remember lines and it was Brittany and bless her heart, she the, everything was scripted out. She had to, they would have her alone when lights, where she's doing a lot of these closeups. She was the only one in the pressure cooker.

But she could handle it cuz she's a professional actress. So, when she came back to us, The format's always the same. We start the contest, we unveil it. She says, go. They start doing it about Midway, you'll see me walk out into the audience where I'm looking at each up close, what each group's doing.

We don't wanna make 'em nervous, so it's usually just me. Then at the end and we have that conversation. So those questions are real, that she's asking. Those weren't scripted. And the conversations you hear with the judges is completely off the cuff as it happens [00:19:00] natural. And then at the end, you'll see the group of us go by and we just, we usually leave 'em with something kind, right?

It's kinda like at the end of a bacon show, you taste it and go your noodles were a little starchy, that's the feel. And then we come back to the desk and then we discuss who's gonna be the winner and then that's off camera, back on camera. Each episode at the end, she announces the winner, and they progress to the next level.

So that's the format. But what's, it sounds like I've heard that before. You have, but you've never heard of anybody doing it with concrete and masonry goods. And that was what was so unique and cool, is this is the world's first and only concrete game show. Yeah.

Seth: Yeah. It's really cool.

What's. Now that you got the one season down, are you guys looking at doing additional seasons or what's the plan?

Dirk Tharpe: Man, it's it's happening this summer. We are the, [00:20:00] this summer we're gonna find some contestants from out there in America where I'm doing four locations for Lowe's home Improvement, and we're teaming up with Marshalltown tool.

And Owens Corning because I'm gonna incorporate that pink fiberglass rebar into the repair. And we're simply gonna have a contest at these four locations. And what's gonna be neat is the, they're real contestants that shop at that store, they're gonna be pulled from folks who the pro desk are used to.

I say four for Lowe's. That is for sure. What is unclear at this time Home Depot. Old Castle for the record. Old Castle, a p g is one of the largest vendors for both of these retail stores. So, we are certainly gonna offer it to Home Depot, and they may do a couple, but it's un, no one's decided yet.

It, and it doesn't matter because when we do these contests this summer, [00:21:00] the winner of each four, so the four cities will have each a two-person team represented. In 2024, when we film Concrete Combat season two, whatever the le, the rest of filling it out will fall back to the production company and they'll do the searches across America to get the rest of the contestants.

But it's neat that we're teaming up with all these guys to find grassroots contestants. Each group is We'll get to be on there the same as anybody else. And I just don't, we don't have any details for season two. Of course. That's, I've not designed the the individual day contest yet.

That's a ways off. But I have designed what we're gonna do in the four cities and possibly the others with Home Depot. I do have that design that they've got to fix ready, and we'll film some of those, we'll, definitely. Get some coverage for all the folks that participate. So that'll be just a fun day.

[00:22:00] But the, but it does live on and season two will be coming.

Seth: Gotcha. And are you gonna announce those somehow so folks know what cities you're coming to or is this one of those things where. You might be happening shopping at Lowe's and then Dirk's over there with the film crew and

Dirk Tharpe: No, we've got a we will, I say we, Lowe's will definitely announce, and they're not gonna announce us wide.

It may be more you focus on the city you're coming to say, hey, come by here. I'm sure whatever the events are, we're gonna have some stuff happening. We'll do it out in a parking lot instead of making a mess in the store. And so, it'll be like a set that moves with us. It will be published that way.

And then of course you've got sacre.com. As far as us keeping national announcement, what's happening where.

Seth: Yeah. Yeah. That's really cool. I think this is a great way to promote concrete. I was [00:23:00] thinking someone needs to make Some kind of spinoff or something to get the younger kids involved.

I, we've I, we've struggled with that in the past and currently is to come up with, unique competitions to get kids involved with this. And I really like I really like the, this This way you set up the show really admire how you came up with the different competitions too. Something like this geared towards younger folks I think would be really cool, especially since you gamified it as well.

I think that would draw the younger generations into concrete the way that we're all trying to do. So we got people that'll, be in the industry after we're all done.

Dirk Tharpe: Oh, absolutely. You got to admire and take your hard hat off to all of the excellent work that the masonry associations have done with youth.

When I was a kid they were doing it and they're still doing it, so it is [00:24:00] just it is hard and frustrating that we really don't have a national program for youth to learn how to finish, but yet we can put up brick walls all day long, all across America and those kids end up going to national contests.

So I agree with you, Seth, that is something to aim for. But the roots I, you gotta start somewhere. And I was telling you when we talked a few weeks ago the way things were like going back to when I was in my early twenties, and my father in the concrete industry would say, don't argue with the finishers.

Just let 'em pour the concrete. The mindset was so different in that we as an industry, let folks ruin our product. And then go argue about it later, and so I love that. I've seen the evolution in our industry where we don't do that anymore. We go, no, you are [00:25:00] doing this wrong.

I am not paying for this. Commercially, it's always been regulated, but I'm talking more on the residential side. That things are changing. That's why I love what we are doing right now at Old Castle Sakrete promoting concrete education. Now it's not on the level like with you guys and epoxy injections and all that, you gotta start with the fundamentals.

And that's where I'm aiming this, these programs, is to get you used to concrete and understanding. What is the worst? Saying that we have in our industry that drives me up the wall, besides people calling cement. Concrete would be, it's just dirt in a bag. It's just dirt in a truck. And that just shows such a total ignorance of the science behind concrete.

That's where we have to start, is letting folks know that these are scientific. Chemical reactions happening. It's [00:26:00] amazing, if you think of it that way. It's such a unique product, right? It goes from powder to plastic to hardened. And so anyway, that, I don't wanna get on a soapbox, but that's where we're aiming is to try to create an atmosphere that lets you sh.

I do hope folks do that aren't in the industry. Look at this stuff and go, that's really cool. And give it a second thought. But Seth, you're a hundred percent right. After things get to this level of education, we definitely need to drill down and figure out how can we as maybe the on the national level, what can we do?

To get involved with high school teaching units like the Masonry guys. And I don't have that answer. And that's way above, that's at the national Association level. But that's something that all of us need to give a thought is how do we do that? It's just not as simple as pulling the kid outta school for 30 minutes, as Seth.

Cuz concrete has to set. It's just not[00:27:00] I'm happy that what we're doing is a beginning, but I agree with you sir. There's a lot more to do.

Seth: Yeah. No, this is an awesome, I think folks can check out this concrete combat, and like you said, even folks that aren't in the industry, your family you can show them this and say, Hey, this is.

This is what I do day in and day out. Cuz a lot of what we do out in the field, we can't share with our family and our friends. I think this is a, a good way to get them introduced into what we're doing. Cuz if you took 'em to a big commercial job site and say, Hey this is what we're doing.

That's way over most people's heads. Absolutely. So when you, when you get it down to this level and you make it fun cuz this is fun. This is, it was fun to watch it. And I think if this is the direction we need to go to promote concrete, I think this will get folks’ attention and that's why I wanted to bring you on the show today cuz this is, like I said, I think this is a great way to promote it.

Very unique way. [00:28:00] Not just going to the schools and trying to say, hey, I need some concrete guys, I need some finishers. I need you to go out and get in the dirt and get in the field. I think you show 'em this. And I also what was cool is that you did most of these inside too.

And I think if you get kids interested in doing this type of work inside first, instead of put 'em outside in the elements I think this might be the way to go as well.

Dirk Tharpe: Yeah. And in season two, who knows? Who knows? Yeah. We may pick some challenges out in the field, but I don't know yet.

I do wanna throw, I do wanna throw out though, on Seth, you've hit on where, what's this, what is the purpose of this? It's fun, but it's a learning opportunity disguised and fun. I also wanna let you know that anybody out there listening to this, if you have on the training side that's like Seth was hitting on, we have on sat creek.com.

You can type in Pro Tips. They're all on [00:29:00] YouTube, sat Creek Pro Tips, and I've got well over 24. At least 24 videos. And what I did was, when we do these, it's a how to, and it features a Sac Creek product, but it is not a Sac Creek commercial. That's the key to how we built our learning modules. So I'm saying along with Concrete com combat there's other resources out there such as Sac Creek Pro Tips, and they're as simple as how do you mix bag concrete in a wheelbarrow?

To how do you top a slab? So we're working on that level too, Seth to try to help you know, if nothing else like you guys, you're professional finishers and especially in the repair guys repair side. Think about all the work you don't have time to get to cuz it's too small. That's another focus here is there's so many folks who are used to working with their hands, like the remodeler crew.

Who could easily take in some concrete repair to add to what they offer. [00:30:00] It's just nobody's teaching them how to do it. So that's also where I'm aiming these things, is to help broaden our base of folks that aren't scared to get their hands in some concrete repair and mix it up.

Seth: Yeah. Yeah, that's great.

But. Yeah, I'm checking out. I'm sorry. I'm, as you're talking, I went to your Pro site here, Pro Tips and you got it's under the Pro Tips blog. If you go to the Pro Tips blog on that sakrete.com site that's where you'll see his videos and yeah. This is really cool.

Dirk Tharpe: Yeah. Yeah. And that's, and we're always adding to that, by the way.

That library is constantly, I'm filming new things and it just takes editing. It takes time. But yeah. Yeah we're growing that base all the time. Yeah.

Seth: You're a busy guy, Dirk. All right. I think this is a good place to in today's conversation. So how do we get an, get ahold of you keep track of what's going on with concrete Combat?

What's the best way?

Dirk Tharpe: [00:31:00] Definitely ww.sakrete.com. We'll, as the summer goes, there'll be some, like I said, there'll be some little episodes there, but then a big way, if you're having trouble getting to the website, just go straight to YouTube and type in Rete Pro Tips or SRE Concrete College and they're all there as well. If you're just not. If you're having trouble getting to the main website, it's okay.

You can direct access everything through the YouTube channel.

Seth: Yep. And I hooked up with Dirk through LinkedIn as usual, so you might want to check 'em out there as well. But yeah, I appreciate you coming on the show today, Dirk hope to bring you back. Talk about season two once we know where that's going and yeah.

Dirk Tharpe: Definitely Seth. I enjoyed it. And like I said, I'm on behalf of old Castle and Sakrete. We appreciate you inviting me and letting me speak about this fun little game show. And it's just, it's an honor and anytime I'll be glad to be on [00:32:00] your podcast anytime.

Seth: Thanks Dirk, appreciate it.

Dirk Tharpe: Yes sir. Thank you.