Wimbledon 2022 Preview

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Daniel Kiernan  00:09

Welcome to Episode 167 of Control the Controllables. And as always, it is such a pleasure to bring you Wimbledon Previews. And I talked to you after day two at Wimbledon, which is already seen some of the top men's players have to withdraw as COVID is starting to hit. We've seen Serena Williams maybe play her last ever match at SW 19 British tennis fans, already nine singles players through to the second round. And Harriet Dart is still to play. It really is set up to be a fantastic two week period. And as always, such an amazing, amazing Grand Slam. That brings us dramas. That brings us the unknown it brings us surprises and brings us new players that we haven't seen before. And tomorrow. Our panelists are all playing their first ever Wimbledon. When we lucked into this, we thought what a nice way this would be to do this time, you know to bring British players, players that have been to US college players that are experiencing Wimbledon for the first time, and they didn't disappoint. We had a great conversation. But firstly, I just want to introduce you a little to our panelists. Many of you will know Sarah ball well. She's been on the podcast before. Sarah was a top 100 doubles player former British number one top 200 singles player in the world, and has spent her last 15 years placing people into US college and making a massive difference to people's lives. In all five players that we have on our panel. Sarah did that with whether it was us college or UK university, Julian cash formidable partnership with Henry Patton. They've made three finals in a row of the last three ATP challenger events over the grass courts, winning two of them, both of them, US college players, and bring an amazing insight to our show today. And then we've got the amazing partnership of Alicia bonnet, and Olivia Nichols. Alicia went the route of the US college, Olivia at UK university, but they've come together to team up as they're both break the top 100 in the world this year and our last panelist NCAA winner at NC State in the doubles event this year, and rightfully gets a wild card into Wimbledon. We've seen a cartel and that is Nell Miller. And I'm gonna pass you over to these panelists before my voice completely gives way. I do apologize. I am working hard to make sure my voice is back for our next guest next week. Enjoy Wimbledon enjoy this amazing episode. Here is our Wimbledon 2022 preview and my amazing panel. So big welcome to all of our Wimbledon 2022 panelists and I've managed to get myself some first timers first time at Wimbledon for all apart from one older the voice that you will hear who has mentored them through the last few years whether it's US college whether it's UK university and and here the old stand I guess collecting your first passes at Wimbledon around your neck. How much money do you get to spend on it these days? Julian

Julian Cash  04:06

Well it's not too bad I'm used to a little bit more but paying 87 pounds a day which is which is not bad but inflation Yeah, it's it's not cheap out there. I'm trying to feed the whole coaching staff so

Daniel Kiernan  04:22

So Alicia What does 87 pound get you at Wimbledon?

Alicia Barnett  04:26

One bowl of pasta but a really good bowl of pasta. No, it's pretty good. Like you don't go hungry. That's for sure.

Daniel Kiernan  04:39

And I guess having you guys on is Sarah Baldock who I've worked with for many years and she used to beat me when we were eight years old as well. You know, it's it's, I think it's a really nice story to be able to say this is what the other people are doing. You know, we all hear of Iga Swiatek we all hear of Novak Djokovic. But the sport is full of people that have been gone out it for years and have gone through the whole. I'm just going to college route that so many parents and players saying, but you're not just going to college, you went to college and you developed your games, you develop your personalities, you got college degrees, I hope most of you. And now here you are moving moving into it. So how does that feel? Nell You know, you've, you've gone through so much to get to this point. How does it feel that now it feels like you're walking onto the biggest stage?

Nell Miller  05:38

Ah, I mean, it's pretty crazy. Because I mean, I still have to go back to college after this. So I'm still going back with it. Yeah, maybe? I don't know. But it's pretty, it's pretty wild experience having everything flipped on its head so fast, to be honest.

Daniel Kiernan  05:57

And you're the NCAA champion that I guess anyone that doesn't know us College, doesn't really know that I get asked that a lot. What does NCAA mean, you know, I did go to college. I know. It's an incredible, incredible achievement. But it's not normally an achievement that is recognized. Back in the UK. You know, back when I played, you won the NCAA as you got a wildcard at the US Open. It then changed to being if you were American. And And now, you know, you've done that and come back. Were you expecting it? Is that when you won the event? Did you think while I could put get my opportunity at Wimbledon now or is it all come as a bit of a surprise?

Nell Miller  06:38

Um, I mean, it was kind of a bit in the back of my head, like, oh, maybe. And then I was like, Wait, my dad was born as Americans. So she'll get the US wild. And I'll just kind of go back to state and be like, Okay, here we go. But I got a phone call. And we had some chat. So it worked out pretty well. For us.

Daniel Kiernan  06:58

She got a wild card then

Nell Miller  07:01

Yes, I believe so.

Daniel Kiernan  07:03

With who?

Nell Miller  07:06

I don't know, I believe that's up to her or the USTA?

Daniel Kiernan  07:11

And how how well you can um, with this girl, if it's up to her. She taking backhanders

Nell Miller  07:18

with my doubles, but I'm sorry, I get on very well with Jada is. Yeah, um, I'm not sure who she's gonna play with to be honest, because she's left handed. So she could switch it up and decide to go for the other side. So it could be anyone's game to be honest.

Daniel Kiernan  07:37

And bringing you in now, Henry, a little birdie, when I looked into it told me that your UTR was 11.2, before you went to US College, which is not a bad level, but you but you also went to my college roommate. Tom Hand, looked after you for four years. And I remember Tom reaching out to me and said a lot of good words about you early on. But But I guess what I'm trying to get at what would your message be to these juniors that are going thinking I'm going to maybe not the top college in America, or maybe not the top university in the UK? And here you are, those years later, you've had the chance to develop, you've had the chance to mature, what would your message be to everybody?

Henry Patten  08:26

I think I'm only one example of that as well. I mean, there are so many examples of people that have gone to a million different colleges, and aware where I am now. Or even better. And yeah, it's just about what you make of it. Really. I mean, I went there kind of with an open mind, obviously, Tom was my coach, which, which was the luckiest thing ever, you know, and well, and yeah, it's just about what you make of it. I mean, you just take your opportunities and and go for it.

Daniel Kiernan  08:54

Did you want to be a professional player? When you went to college?

Henry Patten  08:58

No. I mean, I wasn't even on my radar. To be honest. It was only to be honest, when I finished college, I didn't even really know that I wanted to be a professional player. But again, just took took took my opportunities when when they were given to me kind of just rode the wave and yeah, now we're here. So it feels pretty good.

Daniel Kiernan  09:18

And in terms of in terms of that from a mentality, and anybody, please jump into this question. What I see is those that go to college tend to have a different perspective. You know, when when you go on you play professional tennis, at the age of 18 you feel like the world is on your shoulders. If you're not a college Alkire as if you're not players that have that already at that level. It can be quite a dark, lonely place at that age, because it feels to me like college players go get their degrees, broaden their horizons, their networks, which are official CLAY emotionally all of those things, and then give you a little bit more longevity in the sport. I don't know if anyone's got any comments on that.

Julian Cash  10:09

Yeah, I mean, for me, like, I wasn't sure if I was gonna go to college. When I when I first went and like Sarah kind of helped me decide that it was a platform to still go pro, which was my goal at a younger age. And I think the biggest thing for me was, was honestly getting out the house, having a chance to not live at home, started, like truly understanding what it was like to work hard, what it was like to be independent. I was also fortunate to be at a school that had a lot of international players on the team. So so many cultures mixed into one which has helped me massively. Since since turning pro, constantly sharing rooms with people I don't know from from all kinds of different backgrounds. So for me, it was a was a massive learning curve, I grew up very, very quickly. And, and experiencing all those different things has helped me massively go on the tour and kind of be used to a lot of it already and be quite comfortable in my own skin in that type of environment.

Daniel Kiernan  11:13

And Julian, not on that. When I look at all of you guys and look at junior careers, you will top 70 in the world, as a junior, I believe had wins over berrettini TFO during a Wimbledon Junior campaign, you know, so you were you were someone that probably that choice was difficult, you know, somebody that maybe doesn't have that pedigree of her junior Korea, it then becomes Okay, well, that's my roots. You know, so how, how did you come to that decision? And how hard was that decision to make? And I guess on the back of that, what advice would you give to a top 100 Junior in the world that's looking to make that decision over the next 612 18 months.

Julian Cash  12:00

I mean, the biggest thing for me at the start was was awareness. I honestly didn't know enough about college. So when I was like 15, 16, it wasn't even on the radar, just because I didn't know what college could provide. I saw it as I think a lot of people do as kind of a way to maybe fade out your career, like you don't want to quit at 18. So you go there, get a degree, have some fun playing tennis. And then as some guys were sort of graduating when I was like 16, 17 started to see the level of them coming out. And along with that coaches started to message me and I kind of got into that world quite quickly, to be honest. But I think it's, it's really, I don't know, it's it's exciting to go there. I think, for me, I've been in education, my whole life, that had been a priority for me, it was big for my family, they always wanted to make sure that education was at the forefront. And if sport could follow then it did. And I kind of took those values and obviously financially, it makes a massive difference. I'd seen a few guys go on tour straight away, and they'd burn out like quite a young age to be honest, it's happened a lot over the years. Yeah, it's not easy. I think everyone assumes they're going to go on tour, especially if they have had a good Junior career and think it's all going to flourish and be amazing straightaway. And the reality is it's not that simple. So yeah, it just kind of, I think the my family helped made the decision massively, because I wasn't that into school. But I did start to understand the value as I got closer to going to university. And that along with with the seeing, seeing some other guys quitting that I was quite surprised about. For me, it ended up becoming quite an easy decision.

Daniel Kiernan  13:50

The one thing that hits me as well, though, Julian, when you say that is the average amount of time playing on the tour is six or seven years. And I just think, do do people want to have that time 18 to 24? Or do people want to have that time? 22 to 29? You know, and I think that's often quite a big question. And I guess my go to on it is if you're not making final winning futures already, then actually, you're going to be in that at that level for quite a few years. So you'd be better off developing yourself in all the different areas to then have that opportunity. And I want to bring you in Olivia at this point. Because you're our UK university girl and we're going to others obviously, US college, I think is now certainly got to the point where it gets the respect that it deserves. You know, and I think there's there's a lot of statistics. I think I heard there's like 31 players in Wimbledon, quote modifying this year from US college, you often see certainly in the doubles events, the last 16 of the men's and the women's. You see such a high percentage that are from US college. We're starting to see on the women's side, Jennifer Brady, you know, we've had Danielle Collins, you know, obviously on the main side, Cameron Norrie, flying the British flag on the US college flag, Kevin Andersen finalist at Wimbledon. But UK university, I don't think has that respect yet. And it was there's been certainly on the inside of the sport, we see it that there has been some, there's probably a little bit of as Johnny O'Mara really got to Sterling University. does Lloyd Glasspool really go to Loughborough University. I think we have to also be realistic, that it's not written. That's not the case. But you have legitimately gone through that process. So So tell us about, I guess your journey for the UK university.

Olivia Nicholls  15:56

Yeah, so I guess my main reason to go to Loughborough wasn't necessarily for tennis, it was more for the course. Similar to Henry, I wasn't thinking about going professional after my degree, it was it was more about another stepping stone towards maybe a career in sport. But it just so happened that in that time, I progressed really well. And yeah, when I finished, I was like, Okay, I'm gonna give this a shot. But I think I wouldn't necessarily like to say that the level of university tennis in the UK is as good as the US because to be honest, I don't think it is. But the advantage is that you can play all the British ITFs and that, that, for me was the biggest thing because that actually gave me a bit of a taste for it. And also a realisation that, oh, okay, I've just, like gone to a 25k in Bath. And, and one, it's like, okay, if I can do that, whilst I'm still at university, then then maybe there's, there's a career here for me afterwards. And that's how my journey kind of panned out.

Daniel Kiernan  17:05

And I guess, management of expectation, isn't it as well. You know, that's one thing that's coming through from all of you. That may be your expectation wasn't a have to be a professional tennis player at the very top and allows you then the mentality to be able to almost find your way through it. And Sarah, Sarah ball, I've got to bring you in. Because you sat there, you look like a proud mom, auntie, cousin, try not to insult you too much with your age. So it's gonna be a real proud moment for you, you know, when you've, you've set out with your vision of what you wanted to do, you know, and make a big difference to British tennis in the first instance, of giving people the opportunity to go further with their tennis, to educate, to bring awareness to what's out there and incredible environments. And now he was sitting in an alternate the only five, but you're sitting here with five players that maybe three, four or five years ago, we wouldn't be talking about his main draw Wimbledon players the greatest sporting event in the world. So how you feeling about it all?

Sarah Borwell  18:21

It's honestly amazing i in 2011, when I kind of presented all the pathways and and I just figured if if myself and Ken Skupski, we could all make Wimbledon that a girl from Middlesbrough who grew up and went to normal school and did a levels I were losing a lot of players who potentially could be a Ken skupski, a Dunkin and a Sarah borewell. So to see 11. To see 11 years later, and just how amazing all of these players have done, and they've all come from similar backgrounds with full time education, and they've had so many hurdles and battles, and they've made it onto the biggest stage in the world is it? It's absolutely amazing. So I'm proud of all of them. And, and the nice thing is, is that the true role models for the younger generation because we can access these players like a 12 year old can look up and see Julian and go and chat to Julian at the training base or go and see Henry and and that's what's so good about it.

Alicia Barnett  19:31

I think that's actually a massive thing for me was I saw players like Sam Murray, go through the whole system. And she actually went to the same university as me. And I remember thinking she just graduated and she was on center court at Wimbledon. And that was just a massive moment in for me, and I looked at it and I thought okay, well if Sam Murray can do econ at Northwestern, and then go play Professor tunnel tennis, then why can't I, and it may have taken a few years, but just seeing all these other players go through these different pathways is just is inspiring, as cheesy as it sounds, but you have like these amazing role models, and they're doing stuff that if they can do it, why can't you? So

Daniel Kiernan  20:20

Relatable, isn't it? I think it's the relatability. Like, who, who relates, in all honesty to Serena Williams, you know, she's a Serena Williams a role model? I'm not sure she is because she's untouchable. You know, you're a young kid, maybe young, young. But when you're 1415, you think, well, she's won 23 grand slams, I can't, I can't do that. You know, she's got all of these, all of these things. You have Carlos Alcaraz, as age 18, top five in the world, it's a bit too untouchable. Whereas when you've got people that are a bit closer to you, and then starts to feel like it's somewhat achievable, but I think that's what I don't know what you, Nell what year are you in? College? How many years have you done?

Nell Miller  21:08

I am a senior now. Yeah, the

Daniel Kiernan  21:11

Four year five year thing?

Nell Miller  21:12

I've been at college a long time. Yeah. I've done. I've done four years. But I got a year back for my for the COVID year. So I have one more year left at NC State. And yeah,

Daniel Kiernan  21:26

You're like the Scott Duncan of US college. Just keep, just keep on just keep on going. But you must have seen so many players that have been to college you've played against, you've watched, and then they've gone on to the pro tour through a pathway that you've gone. And that's going to open your eyes to that as well.

Nell Miller  21:48

Yeah, I mean, that's like a massive thing over and I've been to two colleges. Now. I first went to Texas Tech, and then I transferred to NC State. And just the number like the number of people you see, I mean, I've definitely been beaten pretty heavily, especially by some of them as well. But you see, people go to these colleges, and then they come out the other side, winning like massive tournaments and being in the qualifying of Wimbledon, like I know several people that are currently in the qualifying of Wimbledon, who used to go to college. That's quite inspiring, I think for anyone because anyone can do it, then you don't have to go to the best colleges out there. You can go to a college that just

Sarah Borwell  22:33

builds I think it's interesting as well, because I was talking to Dan about this before how I Dan was obviously one of the top Brits Julian was as well. But for me, I never had dreams of going pro it didn't even enter my mind that I would be anywhere good enough to do that. I just each each kind of hurdle in life. I just kept going along. And I ended up at university because someone knew someone who had a connection at Rice University. And then when I was finishing college at Nationals, or in Hambrook at UNLV, the head coach there was like i What are you doing, you're gonna go pro, and I was like, I'd never even really thought about it. And he goes, we'll come and base yourself in Las Vegas. And we'll, we'll help support you going pro. So that's basically how I began. And it's interesting how all of you it's kind of a similar thing. It's a lot of juniors I meet when they're 10, their whole dream is going pro. When in reality, it might be nice to have a dream of going to British university American University, which is attainable, and it's not anxiety ridden, and then I can be the next Henry or Julian or Liv or Alicia.

Alicia Barnett  23:49

I think that was a big thing for me as well, because you helped me get to the college that I wanted to go to. And you manage to find me a university that could like nurture my game and develop me as like a player and a person. And that was like, really important to me and my family. And I don't think I would have been cut out for the pro circuit whatsoever. Like the first three months of college I was so homesick because I've never traveled away apart from like with my dad. So being away from home, and being on the road with like, no other people from England was really tough to adjust to but I had coaches that you knew really well that had also gone to they were British and they'd gone to American uni and they'd all say one NCAA doubles crazy. And they really nurtured my game. So that actually really helped me so when I finished university I knew I didn't. I knew I wasn't going to be world number one or anything at that point. But I wanted to bet Wimbledon and now a few years Alma Right, that's actually a dream that is gonna come true in a few days. So it's just crazy how these things happen.

Sarah Borwell  25:08

It's funny as well, I remember checking in with you and your first fall it is September and you were just like, I'm just so busy. I don't have any time to do anything like I'm finding it quite overwhelming. And I was like, you'll get to grips with the classes don't worry in your like, class hasn't even started yet. And I can't, I can't fit everything in and and that's the college the time management skills, you get a being able to structure your day and do everything very well. All of you. The first semester is brutal. I cried to my mom every night, because while I was at Rice, and couldn't really keep up with the academics, but I cried every night to my mom, because it's so difficult and overwhelming. But that's something that you just get through, and you end up being better because of it. There's three

Daniel Kiernan  25:53

words I have in my head from just listening to you guys. What is normal, the tennis world isn't normal. You know, we are surrounded by a lot of abnormality, if we're being honest from, you know, quite a young age, yet. You guys have chosen the more normal route, which seems to be a lot healthier, I would imagine in the long run. Is that something that motivated you Olivia? To stay a bit more in a normal, normal sort of world? Or are you not in a normal world?

Olivia Nicholls  26:30

And I might, that was fine. It might have something to say about that. Definitely, boys been like a bit of a home girl as well, like, big Norwich City fan, dare I say like season tickets. So any opportunity. We'd like to go watch football, go home be with family and friends away from tennis. And yeah, I think is important to do that because sometimes the tennis world can be very consuming. And me unless you always make sure that when we go away on our trips, we'll have at least you know if there's going to be like a long stint of tolerance, we'll make sure that at least one day in that week is just spent, you know, going and having a look around the town or the city that we're in or just getting away from tennis because it can just yeah, it can be a bit overwhelming consuming if you spend 24/7 in that environment.

Daniel Kiernan  27:28

That's normal.

Olivia Nicholls  27:29

That's normal. But honestly, you speak to a lot of these girls, and it's normal for tennis, because you'll be in these incredible places. And you're like, oh, have you gone into town? Or have you had a look around and they're like, they just say that they don't want to they want to go back to their rooms and watch Netflix and chill. And it just seems crazy to us that they can go to all these amazing places and not actually see them. They're just in their hotel rooms all the time.

Daniel Kiernan  27:57

That's the emotional maturity as well. Isn't that the you're not gonna get many 17, 18 year olds that are rocking it to Heraclea on Greece and saying, let's rent a car and go and see little towns around the area. You know, and that's, that's, that's the bit isn't it? That's the that's the bit that I think you guys and we're here to celebrate. And you guys are here to showcase that route. That actually you can you can live a somewhat normal life in this sport, you know and still and still get to the biggest event in the world. However, my next word is in my head. I go back 2004 was my first Wimbledon and I think I was satisfied that I was playing at Wimbledon you know I was satisfied to have the thing around my neck satisfied to be able to get like four muffins at the end of the day. left on my left on my eighth he wasn't at seven quid at the time. I've never seen the Bryan brothers every night getting like seven muffins, packs of sweets and I was like you like multimillionaires, you tight bastards they want you doing? You don't have to spend every penny. But But I remember having just this feeling of like just taking it all in. And and I actually found myself serving for the first set six, five and the tie break and hit a serve about 22 mile an hour second serve. And Dominic a party to smacked it past me kind of laughing at me. But it will always be a woke up at that moment. But I was kind of satisfied with the experience. And it was Toby Smith actually. I'm sure you guys know Toby. Toby had a day talks about it. He I don't know the exact word he used. But he did it with Johnny O'Mara and Scott Clayton. And he said letter up I think you call it a Barney day. He said he said So my advice to you guys is have a bunny afternoon, or a bunny morning,

Olivia Nicholls  30:06

We went yesterday.

Daniel Kiernan  30:09

Absolute tourist pictures everywhere, you know, taking it all in, do all of that. And then I guess you're not gonna admit it if you do have that feeling. So it's more probably something that I'm saying that might might get something back, Sarah, you might have something to say on this. But don't be satisfied. Because there's, there's a hell of a lot of opportunity there. Don't set barriers, you know, because actually, first round of Wimbledon 64, draw 128 players, it could be just like 100k event could be just like, you know, events that you guys have played lots of.

Julian Cash  30:45

It's funny you say that, like when I when I played in juniors, I definitely was satisfied if I'm honest, I actually qualified my first year. And I felt like I had achieved basically everything. And it didn't take me long on the match court to realize that I was actually only in the first round. So it was Yeah, and to be honest, along with that, the nerves that came in was something that I was nowhere near ready for. I honestly still haven't experienced anything quite like it. And I was in the junior events. So I think what you said about the bunny Day is a great thing, I think to like normalize the venue. You know, when when someone goes, go pick the balls up from match court 14, like, just being comfortable knowing where things are, and all that stuff, and can certainly help with that side. Because it's something that is very difficult to prepare for. I could hardly serve in the warm up for my first round, let alone the first point of the match. So yeah, I think if you can control anything that you can, that's one of the few things that can help kind of settle it down and make you used to being at the event. And we're lucky that we're here early. You know, most of us have been up there the last couple of days. So we've actually going to get a full week in the grounds on the courts practicing and getting used to everything.

Sarah Borwell  32:10

Just all day. They're like I used to and at my first Wimbledon, I didn't have my but Well, I had 14 Barney days, I was very excited about being there. And I spent literally all day there. And five years later, when you start doing professionally and you go home and you sit at home and put your feet up, I realized how I was doing it incorrectly at the beginning. But it was fun. Gone Alyssia

Alicia Barnett  32:37

I think if if lift could move into Wimbledon, she would I think home. She has been that all day.

Daniel Kiernan  32:46

Yeah, I also think we're a little bit different. And this moves on to the bit where I'm gonna pick you guys up. We've you know, I think in the past, there has been British players that have got wildcards at 250 in the world and not necessarily had results at that level. You know, Nell you're an NCAA champion, you know, you should absolutely should be, you know, NCAA champion is Grand Slam level tennis, you know, that boys, and I'll bring you to this moment, because nobody knew Julian Cash and Henry Patton a few weeks ago, and then three massive events, you know, their, their ATP level events in absolute every single way. You know, the number of Top 100 Top 50 wins, you guys have had, in all the confidence that you've got going into that people are going to be looking at that draw thinking shit, these are the guys that don't really lose, you know, so. So Henry talk us through that, How's the last few weeks been? You know? It's it's it seems to be from afar, just that you've this incredible moment that I'm sure you guys are just taking taken in stride, but talk us through the last last few weeks.

Henry Patten  34:10

Well, yeah, obviously very good. Anytime you're winning tennis matches, you're pretty happy. I mean, the last few weeks.

Daniel Kiernan  34:21

Give us a smile.

Henry Patten  34:22

Yeah, the last the last few weeks were. Yeah, crazy. I mean, not least because I was actually in in North Carolina the week or the two weeks prior to Surbiton which was the first one. Well, I'll get to that, Julian, thank you. And we we were kind of, you know, rushing around kind of trying to figure out where we were going to play because we had effectively been told that we weren't going to get in, get in and play the challengers. We weren't gonna be given a wildcard so we were kind of planning on playing in the US. I went to the US for a couple of weddings for teammates. So anyway so so you had had a wedding on the Saturday and got a message on Sunday morning at 8am saying yeah, you're in Surbiton and it starts on Tuesday or whatever it was. And then yeah, we'll flew over I think that the British were that kind of saved us a little bit there. We ended up starting on Thursday I think. And yeah played cassava and could learn the first round which already is like massive names I've watched forever and yeah, I mean, then the rest of it was was kind of a blur to be honest. We we only started playing for a couple of months ago, we played those Nottingham 25ks we agreed to finally play with each other. We've been planning it planning on it for a while. Did well there. And yeah, just just took our chance to play the challengers. And yeah, just took everything in stride. I mean, we we both believe that in each other and that we have a good enough game to compete with them. It's obviously a different thing winning but but yeah, obviously after the first week the confidence the confidence grew a lot. And then yeah, obviously after the after the last one in LP we found that we were getting the win be wildcard so that was, yeah, that was a pretty special moment. But But again, we're now kind of competing at that level. And yeah, it's all it's all very exciting.

Daniel Kiernan  36:22

For the listeners at this point. There's certain tennis slang that some of you listeners might not know. So I'll try and help you guys out to Challies ATP challenger events, just for those listening. And when B is is is Wimbledon. So just think just for anybody. Anybody that's listening. And then to bring again, from that same kind of comment. Olivia and Alicia and and Olivia, we had a few text messages. We were waiting for you to come and train in Sotogrande when you were playing in my bear. And I think you know, I've told you a couple of times now that you are absolutely always for me going to be a topper a doubles player. But you girls, you've not done that you've you've done it the hard way. You've gone and had to play all of the events to legitimately get your rankings to that stage. So do you now feel like you belong at this level of event? Olivia?

Olivia Nicholls  37:22

Yeah, absolutely. It's funny because Henry's story about how they weren't expecting to play Surbiton, then they got the call up and then ended up winning it was kind of similar to our breakthrough event at the Leon WTA we were on the alternate list and we decided we were going to take a punt and go there and you know, sign in see if we get in. And if we didn't, we're gonna go play a 25k as a backup in France, but turned out we got in and then yeah, made the final of our first ever WTA 250 Which was, was pretty good going probably quite unheard of. I don't think anyone knew us at the time. But yeah, certainly now, you know, we got a lot of confidence from that, you know, regularly playing WTAs now and yeah, I mean, even today, like had a practice set with a couple of girls top 20 and feeling, you know, comfortable on the cord with them. So I think like you said, we've certainly done it the hard way. We decided to just, you know, stick together if it meant we weren't getting into tournaments, higher tournaments. We were fine about that. We just said that. We're going to work our way right from the bottom, all the way all the way to the top. And yeah, we've managed to do that to this point.

Daniel Kiernan  38:39

I have one more bit of advice. To me, make sure you wear comfortable clothing. So I I got the I got a new Head contract. I was always I used to wear this my LSU my college clothes. That's all I used to wear. And just before Wimbledon Head sent me some clothes well. I've never been great at fitting clothes, you know, even when I was even when I was a player. So we're playing against former Wimbledon champions at around the park. On the practice days we're playing a practice set and I got down for I formation. And all I heard was my shorts had gone. So that was my first embarrassing moment. The second one we were playing first round. And the tops were unbelievably tight and it didn't feel comfortable. It wasn't what I was used to wearing. Two sets the love down I actually pulled out of my bag and old LSU Reebok top that was was big on me but felt comfortable. I'd picked out the LSU so nobody could see the LSU on it. It was white it passed. It passed the Wimbledon colors to sets love down, went into the bathroom changed. Cut out of sorry, Ed if you're listening Get out of my Head top, put on my old LSU top. And we won the next three sets. And I swear to God, it was that because, you know, there's nothing worse in in the moment, this moment where you're already. And to go back to what you said Julian and it's the name of this podcast Control the Controllables. A controllable is also what you're wearing, how you feeling? You know, something that you might not even recognize if you're playing Nottingham indoor 25k. But all of these things are magnified on the big stage that is Wimbledon. so as to bring you in now have you had, are you able to take the prize money now?

Nell Miller  40:41

Um, I'm not gonna lie. I have absolutely no idea. No,

Olivia Nicholls  40:48

She's taking the £250 Gift Shop voucher though, that's for sure. Yeah,

Alicia Barnett  40:52

I'll take your prize money now if you want.

Daniel Kiernan  40:55

So So honestly, it's a serious question. Because the rules have changed in college. So I'm bringing you in Now Sarah, the rules have changed around being able to be commercially sponsored advertise. But can you still not take prize money? Could? Where could she wear patch on her arm?

Sarah Borwell  41:14

Yeah, she can wear patches. So the NLI the new things coming through, allows for all of that with like using it image, but it's still hasn't changed yet for taking prize money. So for that side, we're gonna speak to NC State, but you're gonna have Simon Earnshaw is gonna have to have some big expenses as a coach and stuff too. He can take enough to cover your expenses and everything,

Daniel Kiernan  41:40

essentially stand by

Sarah Borwell  41:44

You're getting a Rolls Royce there every day.

Nell Miller  41:49

Okay, it's gonna be unbelievable.

Daniel Kiernan  41:53

And on on the money on the money. And Julian, my third word was resilience. And you Julian again, I've not spent that much time with you good friends with your coach Barry. But I, I have watched your journey from afar. And I think you've all got unbelievable resilience, what you've been through I know. You've all been in some difficult places. I remember you're turning up to Heracleon Greece. And so Barry was looking forward to seeing him at dinner. He texts me said Julian's done his ankle again, in like the first like two hours that you were there. You know, so that the resilience that you've had to show and now this moment where whichever, where people look at Wimbledon, for, for the likes of us, and I would put myself and Sarah in it. The money that you are receiving at these events is absolutely monumental, to the part of your career that you're in. So what does that mean? And what will you now be able to do? Hopefully not just for first round prize money, but however far you go, what will that enable you to do with your tennis moving forward?

Julian Cash  43:02

Yeah, I mean, first of all, on that note, I'd like to say Barry got the flight home before me when I did my ankle. That was nice of him to take that one seat. But yeah, like the prize money is massive. It's no, no secret that that tennis is expensive. And it's no secret that the money is pretty poor, quite low down. So there's a massive imbalance and finding ways to find that is not easy. I know lots of lots of players coaching on the side me myself. I'm at Loughborough doing like the task player coach, which is helping me fund it at the moment. But it will, it will open so many doors for us like just the the ability to have a coach on the road. I mean, that week that you saw Barry was was the first week he traveled with me since leaving university and having the ability to get better. Well, first day,

Daniel Kiernan  44:00

the first day that he traveled with you, let's not call it a week.

Julian Cash  44:03

First day that is true. He actually arrived after the practice as well. So I was already foot in an ice bucket when when he saw me but yeah, just like those little things. And even if it's not the specific things that you can now like afford to do, I think having like ease of mind. It's not only tennis players that struggle with money and money is not an easy thing to struggle with. Because when you don't have it, you always wonder where it's going to come from. So so having a little bit, maybe saved up will definitely take some pressure off for me and know that I can do what I need to do and leave no stones unturned in the coming year. Basically.

Daniel Kiernan  44:44

What to get back to the word resilience, what has kept you going, why why would you, you know, because people listening again are gone. Well, how will how will you Julian 2425. Yeah, yeah. So you've gone through lots of injuries. is you've got your college degree, you're not making any money. Why bother?

Julian Cash  45:06

You're selling me? Well? I? That is a good question. I mean, it's multiple things. My love for the game is the bottom line. I did see myself having a career in tennis from a young age and I never lost sight of that. big part of why I didn't lose sight of that is the team around me, my family has been hugely supportive from the start. Obviously, Barry as well, I've had good coaches leading into college and then started working with bury through college, always having people to rely on to guide me through it. You know, like through the injuries, I almost quit twice, I almost quit after my freshman year, I didn't have the best experience there. Part of it was injury. And part of it was was the support team I had at university and then kind of got through that and then had a shoulder operation my senior year, and bas actually came out to visit me in the state. So just started hitting again after about six months, and kind of put me through the paces, like forced me to start serving harder when I basically was scared to do so. And just like having people to lean on, you know, those those small connections, just giving people almost the freedom to be honest with you, has helped me go along. But But yeah, underwriting all of it, it's just my love for the game, and I would do anything to stay in the game. And those moments honestly have given me a lot of perspective to like, after my shoulder operation, I was stood there serving thinking that I might even gonna be able to be an average coach. So always being able to go back to those moments, and then having gratitude now for actually where I am. And even the fact that I can step on a court. I know that sounds extremely dramatic, but there was a place I was once in. So it massively.

Daniel Kiernan  46:57

It gives you a good place now.

Julian Cash  47:00

Yeah, absolutely. It's those those dark moments give you a lot of a lot of perspective and a lot of drive to, to keep pushing on, you know,

Daniel Kiernan  47:09

can't give you talk upon. And I'm going to move on to you, Henry. Because, again, if I was listening to this, and we are celebrating US college UK universities, you know, going into playing your first Wimbledon, but you're all playing doubles. And I think that nobody can deny that the college route is an exceptional route to being a professional doubles player. And you know, the, the facts don't lie. You know, we see it time and time and time and time again. But the buy in is not there that it's done. It's fully there for you to be a singles player. What's your take on that?

Henry Patten  47:52

Well, I think a big difference with playing college is a lot more emphasis is placed on doubles. I mean, that's how it was, for me, at least obviously, obviously with Tom, he was a great doubles player, he probably prefers doubles over singles. So that's a big difference. And I think if you get kind of the very, very top juniors, that aren't going to college, those are the ones that are most likely to succeed in singles. Now, that's not to kind of say that singles in college isn't very important. Obviously, it's extremely important. More important than doubles. You know, more points in a dual match are our singles. But I mean, I really learned how to play doubles in college on 100%. I learned all of the patterns, all of the foundations that have kind of allowed me to get here. Yeah, I know. It's an interesting question. I don't really know the answer.

Daniel Kiernan  48:48

Are you quitting singles? If you go to college, Sarah?

Sarah Borwell  48:51

No, I think it just it's kind of like I played singles. When I came out. And I was relatively successful. I got to 199. But then I had a shoulder injury. And at that point, I was 27. And my body was starting to break down a little bit. So for me, the natural move if I wanted to be successful was to become a double specialist. But I think this year at Wimbledon, there's there's 21 former college players in the main draw, which is still a pretty amazing stat. If you were to look at college as a country, then that's a pretty good stat as well. 21 the doubles must be at least double that because we know how good all the double specialists are. So I think I think people just have to see it as another kind of pathway and that if if you're not quite ready at 18 to go pro and you and you can't be successful within those first two years or you don't have a you don't have half a million pounds in your bank account to really pay for it because that's what you need. Then you have to find other ways to get around that kind of first one. major hurdle but I don't know they don't do not percent credit cards anymore, do they? That's what I kind of lived off when I was the egg credit card that's I just kept juggling things until I made enough money,

Daniel Kiernan  50:14

I guess bringing you in Nell, because you're you're still current, you're like a 12 year senior or something, but you're still you're still currently US college as I've reflected on my tennis playing, and I think as human beings where we're guilty of this, we're guilty of achieving what we may be set out to achieve, but we're also guilty of setting ceilings and, and we quite often role model we mirror you know, we see what's going on. So US college, I remember like when I was 21 going, oh well I can be a doubles player, because this person's view doubles player and this person's been a doubles player. And then from that same college, then Ken Skupski, and Neal Skupski, you know, James Klasky, it became like, but our head coach was top 20 in the world in doubles. So so that was that was very attainable. I guess the point I'm trying to make and I'm gonna throw it to you now is, is the same level of belief there that you can go to US college, UK university, and come out of it as a singles player.

Nell Miller  51:25

I think for a little while, especially for me, my first university the belief it disappeared a lot due to many things that happened. When I transferred to state. It kind of just opened up doors really. I mean, if you told me five months ago, like my game would be like it is now I would have laughed in your face probably to me in all honesty. But I think like looking at where the place that I have now like the possibilities that you can go into college and come out as a singles player are endless. Like, truly we had two seniors who I never met there on the team before me. Anna Rogers and Adriana Adriana. I mean them to have gone out and played singles. I mean, one of them one a 15k One is I think currently in a quarter or semi of the 25 I mean, I know a lot of the Texas girls like Lulu Sung I think played Wimbledon qualifying. Both the Vandy girls qualified Astra Sharma qualified for Wimbledon. So I think all in all, everyone becomes a very good doubles player. I do think that because it is a big doubles part. Like if you go on the court in your match, and you're already one low down, everyone gets really, really tense for a little bit. But I think there's a massive opportunity if your coach allows you to develop the singles to come out and and try what you've got.

Daniel Kiernan  53:11

I want to move us to Wimbledon 2022. And this is the time where you give your predictions. I'm not going to ask for doubles predictions. I don't want you going against yourselves. But I am going to ask you about singles to start thinking who your picks are for winning Wimbledon 2022. But my first question, I'm gonna throw it to Alicia first. Who were some of the names. So somebody who's listening to this, that isn't a tennis nerd. They don't follow all of the accounts, they don't have results to know all of the names. You know, they just know the names that are thrown at us. The ones that are on the advertising boards, the ones that are the top seeds, give us a name or two and I'm going to commit to everybody have a name to watch in the women's draw and the men's draw not necessarily watched to win it. But someone who's looking to go for frowned quarterfinals.

Alicia Barnett  54:16

So we're looking for an underdog an underdog Well, big follower of tennis. I might go this this is such a Rogue One. I'm gonna go with my heart no one's coming here. Yeah, Lily Miyazaki. She's one of our really good friends and she also went college college route. She is British and has what she was playing in Sharm at the start of last year and in January in the 15k and has worked her way up and it's just brilliant. And her game on grass is just amazing. Like she's got all the tools So watch out for Lily Myazaki she is brilliant and such a down to earth girl. I'll go and Jodie Burrage as well. She's had an amazing start on grass. Another bread, of course. Really fiery on court. Massive serve, and has just had her first Top 10 win last week against Badosa she's doing really, really unbelievable. Unbelievable. So, so hopefully those guys just ride that confidence and that is their home Grand Slam So, and we're fully backing them and obviously all the other Brits but how best to get in the hands of your dogs.

Daniel Kiernan  55:40

Wouldn't mind a couple on the men's side as well.

Alicia Barnett  55:43

The men's side. Okay, well, if we're going down the theme of Brits, Jack Draper is obviously doing incredibly well as well. And our favorite Ryan Peniston. Oh, god that everyone's gone to college these days. He also went to college. I think maybe that's a sign people. But Penny Penny is just brilliant. He's had an incredible season. He's also just worked his way up and just got so much confidence. He's played so many matches. And going into it I don't know about everyone else that I thought he was probably not as suited to grass but he's just had some incredible wins like this last built out in the follow up to Wimbledon. So I'm backing those boys to do really well.

Daniel Kiernan  56:33

Very good. And Julian.

Julian Cash  56:35

I'm going for on the woman's side. Caroline Garcia, favorite woman to watch. I love how she plays. I also think that game is really suited to the grass. I know she's actually had some injuries but I think she she'll be one to watch and is really exciting. I watched her a couple years ago at wouldn't be as it happens. And yeah, it was it was a lot of fun a good match to get into and she's got a good personality on the court. And then on the men's side, I'm gonna go for Tommy Paul. One of the younger one of the younger guys again, great. He's got a lot of charisma on the court, big hitter moves well gets the crowd involves. He's not afraid of anyone. I'd say on any day he could take anyone out of any draw. So I think he'll relish his time at Wimbledon and really make the most of it.

Olivia Nicholls  57:27

Olivia? Um, well, I think in the women's you have to say, given her streak over the grass court season you have to give her admire and mention she wants what back to back to 50s in the UK and she's in incredible form at the moment on the grass. So you have to say she's going into Wimbledon with a lot of confidence and you have to say she's a real contender men's is difficult to be honest I don't think the men's is going to be as open in my opinion is going to be one of the top four and you can put Berrettini in there as well with his grasscourt record but I don't see an underdog coming through in the men's personally.

Daniel Kiernan  58:11

What about Andy Murray?

Olivia Nicholls  58:13

Andy Murray is always a contender because he is his spirit and determination is just absolutely incredible is complete inspiration to all of us I think yeah, I'd absolutely love to see him have a good run at Wimbledon fingers crossed his injuries settle down because it was great to see him back in and fired up again. So yeah, I'd love to see Murray have a good run because he's

Daniel Kiernan  58:41

He's an underdog that's the that's the thing,

Olivia Nicholls  58:44

Is he though?

Daniel Kiernan  58:47

He's 100% and underdog now. I mean, looking at his ranking looking at his form over the last couple of years obviously. He's got metal hip, you know he's there's there's nothing that says Andy Murray is one of the favorites at Wimbledon, so I think him going on a run. If Andy Murray makes quarterfinals or semi finals of Wimbledon, I think it's one of the greatest ever sporting achievements. Henry?

Henry Patten  59:22

On the women's side, I'm gonna go with people I enjoy watching. So on the women's side, I'm gonna go with Kasatkina Um, I actually saw hera few years ago stop Yeah. I said

Daniel Kiernan  59:37

Has anybody picked up the issue with the Kasatkina pick? Too good. Yeah,

Olivia Nicholls  59:44

there's quite a big one.

Henry Patten  59:48

Where she ranks where she ranks like 15

Daniel Kiernan  59:50

No further, do you have a rank? More Russian? Oh, you can't play? Oh 2.4 Available Henry. You think I'm gonna edit that out? I'm not

Henry Patten  1:00:10

No comment on whose fault it is?

Olivia Nicholls  1:00:15

Well about the what about the men Henry Medvedev?

Daniel Kiernan  1:00:20

One Olivia, you did say it's going to come from the top four. And the top two and the top two aren't playing Medvedev seeds. Okay, cuz

Olivia Nicholls  1:00:35

myself out.

Daniel Kiernan  1:00:36

The top two players in the world aren't playing. So, Henry, let's pretend that didn't happen. What's your pick on the women's side?

Henry Patten  1:00:44

Well, in that case, we're going to have to go for one of the Brits. I feel like that's that's a safe move after that blunder. I'll go to Jodie she's had some unbelievable wins in Eastborne. And she's on an incredible run. I think our game suits the grass as well. She has a big ball so definitely, definitely watch Jodie if you get the chance. On the guy side, I was actually gonna say Tommy Paul as well. Same as my doubles partner. On a great run at the moment. super talented guy but just for variety. I'll say van design shop. I hope I've pronounced that okay. man after my own heart is big guy doesn't move particularly well. But he's I think he's

Daniel Kiernan  1:01:27

He's playing in the event which is nice

Henry Patten  1:01:29

And he's pretty good at tennis. Yeah.

Daniel Kiernan  1:01:33

What about yourself now?

Nell Miller  1:01:35

I mean, I'll have to back my doubles partner, sonny. I think I think she can do some damage in this tournament. That really doesn't. And then does Serena count is a London underdog then. I mean, it's not played so

Daniel Kiernan  1:01:53

She has to be I think Serena has to be an underdog

Nell Miller  1:01:57

Yeah, wax them to win let them play quarterfinals, great fun to watch. And then the men's side. I'm not gonna lie. I had to look it up. Rune that much. The Danish guy

Olivia Nicholls  1:02:23

Got off to a great start to grass court season.

Nell Miller  1:02:27

Yeah. The guy that lost Orion

Daniel Kiernan  1:02:31

Absolutely. He's 28 in the world. He's had an unbelievable unbelievable last few months. You know? I wouldn't put it past him to to perform on the big stage at Wimbledon as well. And what about you Sarah?

Sarah Borwell  1:02:45

I think for the women Risky Business Alison Risks she always goes through the draw quietly but does very well. Great game for grass. I think Cameron Norrie might do well this year. I have a feeling I think it's time hopefully Andy though I'd love for I'd love for Andy to go all the way through along with Serena just make me feel a bit a little bit younger.

Daniel Kiernan  1:03:10

Are you gonna play mixed doubles again this year? Andy and Serena? What's the word?

Sarah Borwell  1:03:16

We need to sign in? Dan? Do you think the letters in

Daniel Kiernan  1:03:19

Well they didn't for about five years now

Sarah Borwell  1:03:21

made we've missed

Daniel Kiernan  1:03:23

It's unbelievable. And then the year I stopped you then got in the next year.

Sarah Borwell  1:03:28

I don't believe is got in it was that we lost to Jamie Murray

Daniel Kiernan  1:03:34

Have you any anybody in this room? Let's let's partnering up for the mixed doubles together.

Henry Patten  1:03:43

Me and Liv are going to give it a go. If we get in. We'll see if we get in but but yeah, she supports Norwich. I support Ipswich so

Olivia Nicholls  1:03:51

Didn't know you supported Ipswich. Yeah.

Sarah Borwell  1:03:57

You see him grimace when you said marriage. Yeah. I missed that. Driving.

Henry Patten  1:04:06

Yeah, hopefully we can put that put that behind us.

Daniel Kiernan  1:04:09

And moving now into your picks for the title. So I'm going to start with you Sarah. What's what who's your who's your pick for the women's title and for the men's title?

Sarah Borwell  1:04:24

The men's? I'm just gonna say Nadal. I feel it. When was that? When was the year when he had the marathon match with Federer and it went 2008 I can I'm feeling he's going to relive that

Daniel Kiernan  1:04:37

would be incredible if he did. I mean he had an operation 10 days ago. Yeah, he seems to be he's playing I guess you guys have seen him that the practice Gods he's he's out there is it looks the I think you'd beat stamper in q2 and two in hurling him yesterday. So he seems like he's ready to play.

Julian Cash  1:04:56

On mere five hours practicing today I saw so I think it'd be all right Oh, unbelievable.

Sarah Borwell  1:05:02

And then I'm gonna throw a real one that people wouldn't think about. I think Danielle Collins, a former college player, Virginia,

Daniel Kiernan  1:05:12

sticking with your college roots. Yeah. What about you, Julian? Who's your pick? Men side?

Julian Cash  1:05:19

men's side, I'm going Berrettini I think he's, I mean, obviously form would show that he's, he's ready to go. He's also just come back to the tour. But he's gone back to back titles and shows that his level on grass is pretty scary. And he can match those top guys. So I'm gonna go for him. If he could do the triple. That'd be pretty amazing. And on the women's side, it's tough to not go with Iga, I think she's pretty tough to beat doesn't seem to do many things wrong. I actually saw her hitting a little bit today and pretty scary what she can do on a tennis court. So I will be amazed if she wins. Well, although we're not allowed to do

Daniel Kiernan  1:05:54

I give her very little chance to win Wimbledon. I just, I just think, I think her forehand will get rushed. And she she's not comfortable on grass. She doesn't necessarily like it. I think she's too early in her career. I'm sure she'll find a way. But I think her mentality is she's unbelievably good unclench is. But I just think she gets exposed on a grass court. I think we saw Ons Jabeur take her apart only 12 months ago. I think there's there's players that will will rush her and put her in positions that she's not used to being in. And if she does win it, we're talking about someone who can go on and win 15, 20 grand slams, because that that will be absolute domination if she if she wins at Wimbledon as well. So my feeling is not that, hey, this is what it's about. It's about giving our opinions. So it'll be it'll be interesting to see how it unfolds. And what about you Nell who is our winner.

Nell Miller  1:07:19

For the men's side Alcaraz I could just see him just turning up and just Duffing people to be honest. Just going for it. He's got he's got some stuff to lose, but not as much as some of the others out there. And then the women's side Pliskova. She hits for so hard along grass. I mean, if she's on

Olivia Nicholls  1:07:46

good luck, and if she's off she's hitting for double faults in a game. Yeah, that's tough one

Nell Miller  1:07:51

but hopefully she's on

Daniel Kiernan  1:07:54

Henry view. It's your chance here to to make up make up for your horrendous plunder. We're not going to get into the political situation today. Yeah, I managed to do that appear and bolster with the French Open Preview and review that we did. Who's Who's your winner on the men's side? And then the women's side

Henry Patten  1:08:20

whilst I saw Rafa hitting today who definitely before time wouldn't have been a pick for me but he was kind of bouncing around the court like a kangaroo. I mean he was is unbelievable, supposed to be injured. And he was hitting with very teeny and I thought he was looking like the stronger player so I'm gonna say Rafa for the guys and I'm gonna have to go Swiatek for the women as well. I just don't see. Latency is going to be a plus I want to go against you that so that was that was

Daniel Kiernan  1:08:51

this this? This Whatsapp group is going to be flying lasers. First round it'd be tough. Who's not picked? Olivia?

Olivia Nicholls  1:09:05

I'm gonna go Berretini I'd like to see it. I'd like to see him win his first slam on good grass court form this this summer. So yeah, that's my pick for the men. Women I agree with you Dan. I don't seem to be attack winning Wimbledon. Someone said to me Oh, yeah, but she won juniors and I was like, Yeah, but But yeah, I think I think all the reasons you said that she might get found out and she even says it openly herself that she doesn't feel like she's completely figured out how to be on grass yet. So I'm gonna go someone who's won it before comfortable on the grass. In reasonable form. I'm gonna say Kvitova for the women.

Daniel Kiernan  1:09:46

Alicia

Alicia Barnett  1:09:48

Tough thing is with the women's is so open. I kind of agree with you about Shree attack, but I feel like her movement is more suited to clay and obviously she was taking players apart but on grass, she might get found out a bit more and overpowered a little bit but I don't know I think she is just an amazing player maybe she'll continue her streak here. So maybe our backer but I think it's Danielle Collins like I kind of backer as well like watching her in Australia just she is just an athlete like she just has she'd gotten determination. So I feel like she could probably back it up on the grass. And then Ursini I mean, I mean, we'll watch as many matches as possible of his anyway.

Daniel Kiernan  1:10:42

No that's all of us as well. That's not doesn't matter who you like, he's got something very charming about him as well. But he I'm amazed that such intelligent tennis players have got it wrong. Completely wrong. Like, like how, how have six have you not mentioned Novak Djokovic the winner of the men's more than 2020 22? The the clear winner, like that is Novak Djokovic I think will walk through Wimbledon this year. Berrettini can't beat them. Because Djokovic just gets the ball on his backhand and it's game over, you know, Berretini's already come out and said Novak Djokovic is almost impossible to beat. So, sorry to tell you all that you're wrong. But you are on the men's side. So we'll see on that on the women's side. I haven't said anybody yet. So I'm gonna give you three names. I didn't get my underdogs. They all could be underdogs, as well. But I think Ons Jabeur, I'm worried because she was my pick. But she pulled out of Eastborne singles and also pulled out the doubles today. So she's obviously not 100% If she is she is unbelievable on a grasscourt. Like her timing, her touch. I really think she could be a big big one watch Andreescu for me a couple of years ago, I picked her as being the world number one for the next few years, she has gone a little bit off the rails due to injury. So I think she's she's my second name. And the third one that I pick. And I will keep picking her until she wins the Grand Slam, because I believe she will. And I believe she'll win multiple ones she does is Anissimova. I think once she finds a way of believing in herself, I can't see many players. I think she's one of the only players on a hard court and possibly on a clay court that can hit through Iga Swiatek. And and she's a one if she's obviously got a couple of mental things that go on. But once she gets over that barrier, so those three if I was to pick one, if she was fit, I'd say if she's not fit, then I'll say Andreescu but I think I think the women's event is going to be spectacular. I have to ask you. And please put your hand up if you want to answer this because I know there's a few voices. can Emma Raducanu, and we haven't mentioned, you know, kind of around a car to do it at Wimbledon this year, obviously being very difficult, very challenging for her since she won the US Open. But she gets hot, over a couple of matches. She's someone that not many players will want to come across. Well, she's got Joanna Donahue helping so you never know. Henry, you want to take this one?

Henry Patten  1:13:53

Yeah, I think she can but I don't think she will. Obviously, she's unbelievably talented as all the ability in the world but I won't say that her head is in the right place. Obviously she has been struggling with injuries. I don't know if that is physical or mental or what it is. But obviously she hasn't been putting together kind of strong performances week in week out and it's a little bit different to her US Open Run I feel like there's there's obviously whether she likes it or not a lot more pressure on her now. So I mean obviously she can be anyone on her day and she might put together a few few really good performances as we've seen her do but I don't see her going all the way.

Daniel Kiernan  1:14:35

Any inside information Alicia.

Alicia Barnett  1:14:37

No I just think she is incredible. And she has the weight of the world on her and she went from being a very talented junior to having the whole world looking at her. And she's she's dealt with it. The really well like is everyone's looking at her. I hope I I think Jane is going to be there behind the scenes. I know she's going to be really massive support for her. Whether she's on court or not on court with her, whatever. But I just hope that Emma goes out there and enjoys it because she's so young and she's got so many years like, she's, she can win bloody 15 More if she wants. So she's, she's so young. So I think that's the main thing. I just hope that she goes up there and just puts it all out there and doesn't play like she's got any pressure because she doesn't. At the end of the day, she really doesn't. She's at the top of the game, she's got so many opportunities ahead of us. So I hate to say that show do well in the future. But I mean, there's no pressure on her whether she does well this year or next year or in 10 years.

Daniel Kiernan  1:15:46

But it's gonna be like, it's gonna be like the Spice Girls at their height, you know, coming to play at Hyde Park or at Wembley Stadium, because she, she hasn't really had that homecoming yet, since she's become such a global global superstar. I mentioned this when we had the French Open review as well, watching the Jubilee messages to the Queen wasn't Andy Murray. That was Emma Raducanu, you know, so she, she has become such a not a sporting superstar. She's become a superstar, like you say overnight. So for her coming back to the home of tennis, you know, her first match is going to be on center court. It's going to be an absolute circus, you know, every back page and probably front page of every newspaper leading up to Wimbledon is going to be Emma Raducanu. It's going to be a massive thing for her and for her to take on. You know, and I think it's going to be really interesting. I love what you said, I hope she can enjoy it. You know she can, she can get into the mindset of absolutely embracing it, which we know she has, because she's shown that incredible mental strength last year at Wimbledon and then moving into the US Open. But it is going to be one of the stories. I think it would have been wrong for us not to mention her in this episode. Because it's arguably going to be the biggest story of Wimbledon, Wimbledon this year once it all settles down from people talking about the political situation as well. Now, you guys have been amazing. Thank you for for your time. You know, I know you've you've got to go and have your Wimbledon breakfast and start spending 87 pounds as soon as you can get there tomorrow. But not getting your minds in the right place for this incredible achievement that you've all hot. But we never have a podcast on control the controllables without a quick fire round. Now, our quick fire round tonight is a Wimbledon quiz. As you know it's a Wimbledon. It's a Wimbledon quiz.

Henry Patten  1:18:01

Okay, can we pass? Yeah.

Nell Miller  1:18:03

Can we just put I don't know.

Daniel Kiernan  1:18:05

Absolutely. I will show you all up if you do, but you can already watch a number Wimbledon event is this. How many years has Wimbledon been happening?

Nell Miller  1:18:23

Where's that book when you need it?

Daniel Kiernan  1:18:26

Porter Henry.

Henry Patten  1:18:27

I said 150.

Daniel Kiernan  1:18:33

Olivia.

Olivia Nicholls  1:18:35

I put 125. I know it's 100 years of Centre Court, but I don't know.

Daniel Kiernan  1:18:41

So it's in between 150 and one to five. But it's 135. So, so that's 1 point to Olivia. Yes. Closest. How many years? Has Wimbledon been happening on its current site on Church Road? Julian

Julian Cash  1:19:09

15 years,

Daniel Kiernan  1:19:10

Sara,

Sarah Borwell  1:19:12

112.

Nell Miller  1:19:14

95

Daniel Kiernan  1:19:16

Olivia

Olivia Nicholls  1:19:18

100

Daniel Kiernan  1:19:19

She told you all she she told you all in the previous question. She said I know it's been 100 years. And you've still got it wrong. But Olivia has got it right to to two points to Olivia.

Julian Cash  1:19:36

Olivia well done.

Alicia Barnett  1:19:38

This is going to be smaller on the pub quiz team.

Nell Miller  1:19:43

I'll put the same answer twice. So I'm just gonna see Oh, Ramsay's

Daniel Kiernan  1:19:49

Something will be 95 at some point Nell. Keep going. What? What is the capacity of the grounds at Wimbledon during the champion? Ship.

Alicia Barnett  1:20:01

This isn't 95 People now,

Nell Miller  1:20:03

is it 95,000 Oh, no idea.

Daniel Kiernan  1:20:09

We're gonna have to put you on a counter.

Nell Miller  1:20:11

Now 195,000

Daniel Kiernan  1:20:17

And that was low.

Alicia Barnett  1:20:19

Oh, hello.

Daniel Kiernan  1:20:20

Oh, that's what she said. Sarah Borwell

Sarah Borwell  1:20:26

Well, I think I shanked it about I went 40,000 But that's probably just in Centre Curt

Daniel Kiernan  1:20:33

You didn't shank it you were 2000 away Gotta have some confidence in your answer.

Sarah Borwell  1:20:45

I'm feeling good now. Thanks. Well, that was thought

Julian Cash  1:20:47

40,000 security guards

Daniel Kiernan  1:20:53

That's that's the dog and Fox. They've got all of those. When was the last year so Roger Federer is missing the 2022 Wimbledon. What was the last year where we had a Wimbledon without Roger Federer? Sarah

Sarah Borwell  1:21:11

2021.

Daniel Kiernan  1:21:13

That's that would be a really clever answer.

Sarah Borwell  1:21:16

Thanks.

Daniel Kiernan  1:21:18

If that's what? So so I'm gonna give you a half a point for the clever answer. Olivia?

Olivia Nicholls  1:21:29

2015?

Daniel Kiernan  1:21:30

No, Wendy, I just wanted you to get one wrong.

Henry Patten  1:21:35

Henry 97.

Daniel Kiernan  1:21:37

The closest buy along with 1999 was the last was the last Wimbledon without Roger Federer. So it's 1 point to Henry.

Alicia Barnett  1:21:50

That's a fun fact.

Daniel Kiernan  1:21:52

Two more questions. And Olivia is in the front with two points. As Olivia told us earlier today, in our conversation, there's two of the top seeds in the men's event that are that aren't playing the event. The number one and number two in the world are not playing the men's event. When was the last time that that happened at Wimbledon?

Alicia Barnett  1:22:20

Trick question. No years.

Daniel Kiernan  1:22:25

Is that your final answer?

Nell Miller  1:22:27

Just figure 2021 Yeah, no,

Henry Patten  1:22:31

Absolutely mental. I don't want to say I'm just you know,

Daniel Kiernan  1:22:39

1923. And I don't think you any of you are close enough for me to give you this. But let me see. Let me just is anything

Nell Miller  1:22:49

with 95? I didn't put

Daniel Kiernan  1:22:53

Julian

Julian Cash  1:22:55

1995. I'm comfortable.

Daniel Kiernan  1:22:57

And Julian is the closest but not that close, because it was 1973. So he's 22 years away. But he's still, He's got a point.

Sarah Borwell  1:23:16

1986 isn't that classic?

Daniel Kiernan  1:23:19

Says Sarah is the closest steals a point of steals point off Julian. So is that your second point?

Sarah Borwell  1:23:26

I think I'm two and a half points now.

Daniel Kiernan  1:23:28

So you're currently winning on two and a half points. They like the last question. How many points will you get if you win the Wimbledon doubles title this year?

Henry Patten  1:23:40

I thought we weren't going into the politics Dan

Olivia Nicholls  1:23:49

win Wimbledon still outside top 100.

Alicia Barnett  1:23:53

Come on. No, no, it's

Daniel Kiernan  1:23:54

got an answer.

Nell Miller  1:23:56

1000.

Olivia Nicholls  1:24:01

under a rock you're on Qi right now. The buzzer would be going

Daniel Kiernan  1:24:07

Henry Henry how many points?

Henry Patten  1:24:09

That's a big fat zero Dan.

Daniel Kiernan  1:24:12

So I think everybody put now scores a point. So my last so Sarah is our champion with 3.5 points. Little Round of applause

Sarah Borwell  1:24:27

Thanks everyone. Some good guesses.

Daniel Kiernan  1:24:30

My last last last question as tennis players, professional tennis players. Does that have any influence on you? Or the tennis world about playing the event? Alicia?

Alicia Barnett  1:24:42

Absolutely not. It's it's a Grand Slam. We've just been walking around the grounds with without the competition going on. And it's just such an amazing feeling. I wasn't kidding about live moving into Wimbledon. She's got a suitcase. Friday, I guess it's just an amazing feeling. And especially for us, like British players like paying in front of our friends and family. It's just nothing like it. I mean, we haven't even played yet. And I'm excited. But I mean, look at the spectators, they have no idea how many points we're getting, or what, whether it's going to be ranking or not like that has nothing to do with that  So why would that affect anything, there's still going to be really competitive. And we play tennis, because we love it, like Julian said earlier. So I don't think especially for us like it really means too much.

Daniel Kiernan  1:25:42

42,000 people will be there watching. They don't care, of course. However, the word is I wasn't at Roehampton. But the word is that there was a significant number of people that turned up, didn't really prepare or necessarily give their best efforts in the first round of quallies, you know, picked up their paycheck. What did what what do you get for first round, qualifying these days? Yeah, so. So this could be good news for you guys. Because you would think there might be some people that are going to do that in the singles and the doubles, in order think it's not necessarily good for our sport. But by the time we get to the second round the third round, and people start dreaming about the possibility of lifting the trophy, that whatever event they're in, I'm sure that will all all disappear. You know, and obviously, you guys as Brits, this it's the first time it shouldn't have any cloud over it. We could be speaking in a couple of weeks to one of you, as Wimbledon Champion, the year that it was an exhibition. But again, I don't think it will mean any less to you. In that moment when you reflect on it.

Sarah Borwell  1:27:00

I think the nice thing is, well, you've you've all worked so hard to get there. on very small budgets. This sets you up for the next 2, 3, 4 years of your career. So this is the first Wimbledon, but it's going to springboard you to the next level because you do things well now, because you have well, I don't know what the first round is for doubles. But even back in the day, it set me up for the next year or so to keep me going. So that's what's exciting about it all.

Daniel Kiernan  1:27:31

My final thing says, big congratulations to you all. You know there's there's a lot of people that you won't even realize that are supporting you guys. There's a lot of people that are unbelievably proud of you guys inspired by what you're doing. You know, all of your stories are incredible. Don't be satisfied. Go out there, you know, have you buddy day, get your heads down, gone, gone rocket, go and win as many matches as you can go and make a name for yourself. Don't set your careers up even more. And thank you for giving us the time. I'm sure all the listeners have absolutely loved getting to know you guys a little bit more. As listeners get out there, show your support, whatever caught these guys are on, you know, shout from the rooftops and all the very best to you all. Thank everyone. Good luck. Good luck. And I have to start by saying a big Good luck to all of the panelists. You know, I'm sure, like we said in the episode, that they're ready, you know, they've had the results. They've earned their right to be on that stage. And I'm sure they will go out there and express themselves. Just as we talked about, with Jack Draper. Only last week, you know, British tennis is in a great place. The culture is changing the singles results in round one, a testament to that. And I wish everyone and all competitors, all cultures, all staff members at Wimbledon and amazing two weeks. It's a special place for me and for Vicki. It's where we met all of those years ago, as we were working for IBM during the match stats, and it's a truly magical place. And as I often say to people, make sure you keep your eyes open. Make sure you keep your best smile, because you never know what might happen. You might come away with a wife from the event. Vicki's not even here today to stick up for herself. But moving on to the tennis and the predictions. I can't believe none of them went for Novak Djokovic and since we spoke a couple of days ago, Barry Timi has been removed from the draw with his positive COVID test and it leads us could we get the joke of ich Nadal final the I think we all would love to see. Oh, is it time for one of the youngsters to come through? I find it hard to believe that our cameras can do it yet, on a grasscourt you know, is it going to be a surprise is someone like Cameron nori kind of sneak up? You know, he's he knows what he's doing on grass court. He's number 11 in the world, I can really see camera making a great run throughout the event. And on the women's side, every time I look at the draw, I think, Well, anybody, there's so many players that can come out of that drawer, it's going to be a really exciting one. I know I went quite strongly against eager, she makes a habit of proving things wrong. So let's see how she goes. Our relationship with eager at the Academy, I would of course love to see her do it. But it's hard to believe that she can dominate women's tennis so much, especially on a grasscourt ons Jubeir is the one I think to watch. You know, she keeps herself keeps herself healthy. She really has some incredible skills. She's come for a first round match. But I expect to see lots of upsets lots of matches, that we don't know which way it's going to go on the women's side. And I fully expect an amazing two weeks ahead. So enjoy. I am gutted not to be there, whenever we will do comes around. And if I'm not there as a coach, a player which is well gone now, or even as a supporter. It really does make me sad, but I will be trying to watch today at Wimbledon at the end of our long days at the academy and keeping up with it as much as I can. But eat lots of strawberries, drink lots of Pimms and have an amazing couple of weeks. But until next time, we'll be back next week. I'm Dan Kiernan and we are Control the Controllables