Wimbledon 2024 Review

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Daniel Kiernan  00:09

Welcome to Episode 228 of control the controllables. And as w 19 is over for another year. I'm sure you've all been either glued to your TV screens, or if you were lucky enough to get that golden ticket to get onto the site at Wimbledon to watch the most magical tennis event that there is out there. Then a big well done to you. And we got lots to talk about. We have a couple of special guests. So listen out very early in the show. Anyone that was watching the Wimbledon finals, and was watching the Wimbledon finals on Saturday, would would have witnessed one of the most incredible tennis stories and tennis matches that we've had in a long, long time. And they might have come on to talk about that as well. And then we've got a bit of a smaller panel, we've got the trusty Calvin Betten, who is now a Wimbledon champion tennis coaches. He coached Henry pattern and Harry heli Avara to their title. And then we got the 2012 Wimbledon doubles champion and Freddie Nielsen as well. A great opportunity to speak tennis as always with those guys, and everything that's happened over the last couple of weeks. So I'm gonna pass you over to our Wimbledon review panelists. So a big welcome to our Wimbledon review panelists. And Freddie welcome to you but you had your Limelight in 2012 So I'm going to hand it over first and foremost. Calvin Betten the coach of Henry Patten 2020 for Wimbledon champions calve. Amazing Well done my man. Yeah.

Henry Patten  01:53

Cheers. Cheers. I mean, Henry. Freddie actually won one. I coach, somebody won one. It's a little bit different. Take Freddie's our mind. But that's your job though. Right? Yeah. No,

Freddie Nielsen  02:05

don't underplay it.

Henry Patten  02:06

It was a great. I mean, I know the lads are going to come on in a minute. But it was a really special two weeks and a weekend that I'll never forget. I mean, I'd go as far to say it's the best day in my life that didn't involve money. Like, it might have been the best days,

Freddie Nielsen  02:20

though it's been a few years. So that's why it's so nice.

Henry Patten  02:24

It was just little, little bits like a message Henry I was on I got the train back up north. Yesterday. And I guess we've got this kind of thing going between us. But when he came down yesterday, because when he came down to the living rooms, we shared an apartment and Kevin at the living room that I was already in. And we both just laughed at each other for about 10 seconds that we just couldn't believe what what happened. And then I was on the train on the way back up today. And I just had my head and microphones on just listening to music and started thinking about it. And I just I on the train myself just crapped out laughing again. It's just funny. The people on the train were like, what's this not to do in vain you say I can't believe it's happened. But I was telling somebody else just before I came on here, can't let this happen. But I thought they would win every match they played as well. So

Freddie Nielsen  03:10

you have the tournament coming in. I thought they were really dangerous photos. That was as soon

Daniel Kiernan  03:15

as they won the first round. You could have fancy them for the first

Henry Patten  03:18

round. Okay, no, it's the you know, tournament. I know those guys have had a great season, but Thorn grass and profiles of players styles of play in that thought we got a real good chance here. But

Daniel Kiernan  03:28

talking of them. And before I let before we do, we've got Harry and Henry joining us. But the moment that we had as we were walking, because obviously a shout out to Gabby Dubrovsky and Aaron Routledge, who they just fell short in the final of the ladies doubles. But as we were walking to the court, and I'd been like Harriet had me in tears in the locker room. I mean, I was just like, look, just watching him, I just saw these tears were falling down my cheek. And so then as I'm walking up to the court, they were just sat on the chair with their trophies, and I went up to a hurry and to give them a hug. And then he just started crying again on my shoulder. And it was such a, it was this moment. And this sport is just so magical because it was like this, you get that capturing of of just ecstasy of what's happened. And then you get the camera going on to the losers. But this was different because it was that was happening and these boys and anyone that knows Henry Patton and Hariyali Avara they will like them. They are delightful men, you know and and fantastic people. And they were experienced in this but then there was the four women about to walk on the center court for their turn. And it was all in this little corridor. And it was an I was going to thinking a little bit as my job as the quarter of the girls. How much do I engage in this? How much is this going to affect them seeing this but actually they went up as well to Harry and Henry and gave them hugs as well as they were walking onto the court and it's certainly didn't have any any effect. So I am now going to bring the boys on so please you guys jump in, ask your questions carve, you might have some debriefing that you need to do as well. We've done that.

Henry Patten  05:14

The only match we've ever done we we take quite a bit pride in our debrief. You haven't done one. Here we have

Daniel Kiernan  05:18

the 2020 for men's doubles, Wimbledon champions, Harry and Henry A big welcome to control the controllables how's it feel?

Harri Heliovaara  05:28

Thank you. Thank you guys.

Henry Patten  05:31

So thank you very much. Yeah, can you hear me okay,

Daniel Kiernan  05:34

we can hear you perfectly we're just saying we carry has not done the debrief of the final yet so. So we thought maybe this could be the time hurry.

Harri Heliovaara  05:44

time yeah, there's some some mistakes we need to go through the toilet doesn't happen again.

Daniel Kiernan  05:48

And hurry, I have to throw it to you first, because you're responsible for me making a lot of grown men cry on Saturday evening with your What are now infamous reactions at the end of matches. You know, it's like it's almost like I can feel in some of my family. We're like Harry's about to finish we need to get there. We need to get to the TV to see. But just describe that feeling that that big surf is gone. It's gone right in I hope you called forehand body because that's where it went. It's gone right in at the right hip. And Jordan Thompson is is hit that edge, Henry, I'm sure you were relieved man as well that I didn't sneak over the net. But just explain how was that feeling?

Harri Heliovaara  06:35

Yeah, I mean, it is something that you dream of. I've gone through that moment in my life, in my mind many times before, like what would it feel to hit the last shot in a Wimbledon final or another final some something special shots so it didn't feel like I was in a completely new situation. But of course when it actually happens that you see the ball Jordan's forehand landing the net you this you don't have time to think the body the mind everything just reacts somehow new to try to stay stay with the body and stay with the mind and enjoy the moment. I don't remember what those first couple seconds but I've seen pictures that it looks like it was quite immediate that I started crying and screaming and doing all kinds of stuff but that just happens I don't try to control that and force the celebrations but it's pretty cool. Good to see and to hear from so many people friends family that and even even other people that they they really enjoyed the both the match but also what happened afterwards. And many people felt emotional. And that's I'm kind of proud about proud of that and like I'm sure you hear talked a lot about the future of doubles, but I'm not saying that I'm trying to save doubles by bringing seven motion there but I'm sure it it doesn't hurt.

Freddie Nielsen  07:53

I just want to say having seen all of that emotion I feel really let down because when we won love for a future in 2018 There was nothing even remotely close to that. So you led me down there.

Harri Heliovaara  08:04

But the last four singles final I wanted there were several people coming to say after the battle. Wow, that was a big celebration after receipt. So maybe I used it all in the single file of laughter

Daniel Kiernan  08:18

before I bring the coolest man at Wimbledon in in Henry Patton My first reaction was oh my god he's about to get naked because their reaction the top that was the top was about to come off. And I was like, oh god, what's happening here is that that certainly wasn't a conscious thought. But we know what you do when something exciting happens in your life the claws come offer

Harri Heliovaara  08:43

the hat always comes off the racket falls but maybe maybe luckily I remember that time on the on the center court winbuilder Maybe that's not the place to to rip your shirt so I'm happy happy i that only lasted for one second.

Daniel Kiernan  08:58

And Henry I need to bring you in and I say the coolest man and Wimbledon it's obviously what we see on the external and it's like it just looks and and I go back to actually what the commentator said at the time. He said this this man was doing the IBM statistics a few years earlier. And there you now are on center call a British player. You've had a good career so far, but you haven't found yourself in that situation before. And the same one I watched you in the semis the same when I watched you in the quarters. Same when I watched you on the mixed doubles court. It just looks like you were taking everything completely in your stride. What's actually going on you're beneath that calm exterior that you're showing us.

09:48

I think everyone that knows me and has known me for a while knows that I'm you know not not the same as Harry and I don't tend to get too emotional on court. I don't I mean, meet me and Harry was speaking about it and I think you really began sort of in our quarterfinal match against Arabella and cabbage. And yeah, I mean that obviously we were nervous in that final set tiebreaker as well. But I don't really know what happened is impossible to describe, but we kind of just go into a zone of I mean, basically, we were finishing every point and just kind of giving each other a wry smile. And I think, I think fully appreciating the moment that we were in, you know, whether it was on thing I was on court 12 that they caught one against Neil and Mike. And then, I mean, the atmosphere on center court was just phenomenal. To even be there was a dream. Yeah, I'd be lying if I said that. I didn't feel nerves, obviously. Yeah, well, I mean, Calvin, and Harry as well, worked incredibly hard to put ourselves into a position there. And anytime you do that, you know, you really, really care about it. And it was nice to let that go at the end. I think that probably shocked a lot of people I got pretty pumped both in the in the third set, tie Reagan also at the end just I mean, literally fell to my knees. I mean, I didn't know what was going on. Yeah, I don't know. Maybe I'm just disposed that way. Maybe. Maybe I'm more suited to being calm and caught. But yeah, I don't know. It was all a blur.

Freddie Nielsen  11:09

Yeah, Wimbledon doesn't bring out some emotions. What will?

11:12

Well, exactly I mean, that's what so many people came up to me afterwards and said and said, Look, you know, you, it was amazing to see that that level of emotion because Because quite often these days, you know, certain players, you know, making a point of not showing emotion or, you know, treating it just as a job. And yeah, I think obviously for Harry and his journey, he takes every opportunity to be as authentic as possible. I think most people celebrating like, that would really piss me off. Maybe it helps me that he's on my team. But I know that it's just from such a genuine, authentic place that. Yeah, it's amazing. And you can see that the crowd loves it as well. And everyone watching and even the players really respect that.

Daniel Kiernan  11:49

And I have to ask, because there was the moment when Roger Federer stopped playing tennis at the laver cup. And there was the picture of him sat next to Rafael Nadal as he was crying. And the dowel took his hand. And they were there was that momentary holding up the hands. That is obviously an iconic picture in tennis. But I really believe a probably bigger than tennis actually, I think there was an iconic moment in there. As you guys went back to your chair, and Harry was clearly highly, highly emotional still, but you'd had a nice moment. And Harry just put his head on your chest, and you just pulled him in. And I think it was such a lovely moment in the world that we live in, you know, because it was like this. Like, it. Just it's it's obviously it's even hard to explain. But watching it I think we all felt that emotion so strongly. What was said, what was said in that moment? Is that something that you can remember what what words were passed at that time?

12:48

No, I think nothing bad was that I think we were both just in utter shock. I think Carrie was I think we were both saying basically how on earth you know, what have we just done? What on earth we just done? I mean, and that's exactly what I was saying, as I was walking over to the box, like what what has just happened? It was just completely surreal. I mean, obviously Harry Harry kind of put his shoulder his head on my shoulder and was was in debt so I felt like I couldn't quite do the same to him or it would have been pretty ugly. He kind of took that role and I to comfort him, you know, be the wiser No, it's like any relationship isn't it? Yeah, it was really? Again, I mean, kind of like Harry said it was it was like it was just a really pure moment of emotion out there. And I think the crowd kind of shared in that as well which was really really special.

Harri Heliovaara  13:34

Yeah, I have to add there. I don't know if Henry when you remember this but we had to retire or I had to pull out from the French Open third round and that hurt mentally where we shared a similar kind of small hug in in Philip Chetry arena. And that same feeling I had after the final and what we said last night in the in the Champions gala where we saw the text that we treat winning and losing the same way that we are, we are doing the right thing and that's exactly what happened there. We we had to give a walk COVID friendship and we take together we gave each other hug. We won the Wimbledon, we do exactly the same thing. And I think that was that was truly special.

Daniel Kiernan  14:19

It moves me on to the next thing I want to just ask you guys because you both I guess you both at the towards the end of last year you both experienced breakups, which is very normal in the tennis world. We know in the doubles world. You both then tried new partnerships with which maybe didn't quite come to fruition. And then you found each other and I think you've almost answered the question already by what you've said, you know, that connection and that truly sticking together as a team. But Henry what what is it that makes obviously good tennis players when you're both bloody good tennis players, but you're also bloody good tennis players that haven't had the same results of other people. So what is it that made this partnership it so special because the first tournament you played together, you won the 250, ATP and Marrakech. It felt like it's been kind of quite an instant connection and instant hit. I don't want even get it your record, but I know you haven't lost a lot of tennis matches together. So what is it and what what's the magic so people listening can, whether they're down the club or they're playing junior tennis, they can try and help make sure that they pick the right partner for them going forwards. I

15:27

think at the very start, you know, even before we played matches in Marrakech, I think we we kind of sat down and had an honest chat about what we expected tennis wise. And also, I'm incredibly conscious that Harry is a dad. And he's 35, sorry, Harry, 35 years old, and you've got two two lovely kids that he asked to spend time with. And, you know, he knows that my girlfriend lives out in the States, and I'm really keen to spend as much time with her as possible. And I think we kind of got our values outside of tennis lined up, I think there's a, we have an amazing mutual understanding of each other's needs and wants, and, and also how that affects our tennis in different ways. You know, I mean, we we spoke in, where was it Madrid challenger. And I think we just won the tournament, and we were going to the next one, and Harry came to me and said, Look, you know, I know that tennis wise, I should probably get get on a flight with you and go to the next place. But you know, I'd really like to go home and spend a couple of days with my kids. And, you know, for me, that's just a non negotiable thing that is so much more important than tennis. And I think we're both very aligned on that. And that then gives us the freedom on court to really express ourselves and know that we're supporting each other. Same with tennis, you know, if Harry's not playing great, or I'm not playing great. I mean, I know in the final I, I mean, they were serving unbelievable, but I missed a few seconds serve returns, and it was really frustrating me, but I knew that it was all gonna be okay. You know, because because Harry Harry understands how I am. Is there for me supporting me. So? Yeah, I mean, in hindsight, I think we just did an unbelievable job of respecting each other, having a deep respect for each other and respecting each other's priorities and values. And, and that's allowed it to kind of blossom really naturally. It's

Daniel Kiernan  17:15

really an answer, like, I just I completely love that answer. And, and I couldn't agree with all of that anymore, you know, and it is, and you can see it, you can't you can't fake that either. You know, and that comes across with you guys. Massively on court. I am conscious of your time, guys, your Wimbledon champions, and I'm sure you've got a lot of various people jumping at you. And I am so appreciative that you've come on, but I do have a couple more small things. And you mentioned there, Harry about the future of doubles? You know, I know it's been talked about a lot. But this was very apt for me that we started on doubles today, because I think the doubles events this year at Wimbledon were absolutely brilliant. You know, I think there was there was so many amazing matches, even in the mixed doubles. You know, there's lots of lots of fantastic tennis played, maybe arguably, the singles was a bit boring. You know, in some ways. I know, there was a lot of five set matches, but I'm looking back and I'm not I don't know if that's because I'm working in doubles, if I'm being a little bit like that. But

Freddie Nielsen  18:16

can I add to that? Yeah, please. Because in Wimbledon in Denmark, it showed on baby basically our equivalent of BBC, which means that goes out to every house. So all of a sudden, people are watching the double final because it was shown and a lot of people spontaneously brought to me Whoa, what a match. Did you see that? So that just tells me that if you get the product out and see it, and give it give people a chance to watch it, people will enjoy it. And it was like they will they were like wow, this was really fun. What a match. Did you see that? Wow, all these things and that's obviously because they had a chance to watch it and that was really a a good thing for me to see you know maybe also for everybody else that doubles is out there every every tournament but the people the everyday people just don't get a chance to watch it.

Daniel Kiernan  19:03

So how do you want to see the future of doubles? Carry on the back of this?

Harri Heliovaara  19:07

Oh, that's not an easy question. Of course, from a selfish point of view, I want to see doubles they're even more on center court. And because we we had one more one more double center core to balloon Andy Murray played his last match. And that was also stents were completely packed. But that was the reason was of course Andy, but I'm sure the crowd enjoyed that match as well, even if it was doubled. And like, like Freddy said, we have had so many people from Finland to will shown on on our channel that everybody can watch and it was it was a massive hit. Imagine that it was a doubles match with zero. There is breaks and it still was the one of the most exciting matches of the tournament. There's something still there in doubles.

Henry Patten  19:50

I'll just jump in there as well, because I think there's been a lot of talk recently about how we need to make the rallies longer in doubles to make it entertaining. I think in that match there were probably about seven or Rate shots where the rally went past three or four shots, seven or eight rounds, seven or eight points where the round rally went past seven or eight, three or four shots. And there was still so much drama in there that you don't need to change the format of how it's played. It sport is created with drama and personalities. And there was a load of drama, and there were four personalities on the court. And that's what made the match. So interesting. It wouldn't have been any better if the rallies were longer. And

Freddie Nielsen  20:26

for a traditionalist like me, for me, the match also got so much better with regular scoring, like some of the games for me, like you guys save the match point and the second set six, five, I think it was and you save that and go to Deus. And normally there will just be another match point. And then one point here and there and it just becomes frantic where thought this format for me is so much more interesting to watch from the way I enjoyed. It builds, doesn't

Daniel Kiernan  20:52

it? I felt that through like that, because Gabby and Aaron had a couple of really long

Freddie Nielsen  20:58

are hunting on their first game. And the second set was like eight minutes. Yeah,

Daniel Kiernan  21:03

but as the game is going on, and you've got add juice, juice, add, add, you know, you can feel that the drama is building its building within the match as well. And so I think that's a really good point that you guys make on that because that is that is something that definitely adds to the to the viewer experience, I think, rather than maybe a lucky shank lob on Sudden Death juice, you know, you know, tactically How are you working it out, you know, you're winning the point every time on the Deuce side, but you don't know where to serve on the ad side and the ad side returners returning amazing and it's back to juice again, and then you managed to win one eventually on the juice side, or you're now able to capitalize and win the game, you know that? It's, it's, it adds a whole different dimension. It really does.

Freddie Nielsen  21:48

Yeah, that excitement doesn't get a chance to accumulate with with no ad scoring so that that's super tiring. And the third set is also played with the hindsight of all that's gone on between and all the long service games, the batch point being saved and all this and like you say, the one guy catches fire, the other guy kind of catches fire at different times. That's just how tennis was supposed to be, in my opinion. And I really enjoyed that. So it was a lot of fun to watch boys, and

Daniel Kiernan  22:13

Harry, and Henry, but over to you, Harry, your last question. What's next? Because I believe neither of you guys are off to Paris for the Olympics. So you get a little bit of time. But what's next? And what are we looking forward to in the next couple of months for Haley Avara pattern?

Harri Heliovaara  22:30

Yeah, unfortunately, Paris didn't happen this time. But now gives myself a very good reason to play for more years to have the chance to play the next Olympics. I

Freddie Nielsen  22:41

wanted to ask you about that, because that was basically your big goal for making a comeback, right? You really wanted to play the Olympics. It

Harri Heliovaara  22:47

was it was the reason I made a comeback to play the Tokyo Olympics with continent back then didn't happen what was one year off and now give myself a chance to Paris and then Emeril decided not to take part in the Olympics. So that went. So hopefully I'm top 10 in four years, so I can choose a partner. Then I forced someone to come with me.

Henry Patten  23:08

eight more years.

Daniel Kiernan  23:10

Well, rah, rah, rah, rah hands going up 44. You know, you'd be eight years.

Harri Heliovaara  23:18

Yeah, but if we take more short term as you're right, we were going to enjoy this Wimbledon a little bit. We were not going to Newport, which was super supposed to start tomorrow. We are not going to Atlanta either, which was original plan in one week. So we're starting in Washington, same time as the Olympics, but just different continent, different service, and more ATP points available.

Daniel Kiernan  23:40

And Henry, your final words we've got we've got a man here, who from Barnsley, who I've watched and admired for a long, long time, you know, someone who you don't, we don't have enough people in our sport to just get the head down and work for the player, you know, goes and learns these traders I've known for a long time. This guy's doing a brilliant job. He's obviously taken a bit of a chance on you. What's your final words for the cows?

24:08

Yeah, I mean, it's quite simple with cow. Look, he divided opinion like no one. I know. He speaks his mind. He's not not afraid to do that. And that's all fine for me. Because for me, he's just my tennis coach. And he's absolutely the best in the business at being a tennis coach in terms of the support he's given me the flexibility how loyal he is to me and how much of a supporter and how much he believes in me. Yeah, I mean, it's it's priceless. I feel incredibly lucky to have him as my tennis coach and he has grown on me a bit. I can't count him as my friend now as well. To be fair, look, I don't know anyone else that works as hard as him and it's as simple as that. You know? I mean that you know, we were a little bit we weren't disappointed by you know, getting nine and Davis Cup team. I think that would have been a massive bonus. But you know, the first thing cow said to me it was right, let's just crack on you know, Let's let's keep working hard and keep going at it and believe that that is going to take us all the ways. Yeah, calf massive thank you to you. And let's keep going. Yeah, it's exciting. I

Henry Patten  25:11

was saying to the lads that this is not a one off with them. This will be a one off. I do think now. And I've said it to them and make them feel a little bit awkward. I do think they're the best player in the world now. And we're going to win all the big stuff. We're going to try and aim to win all the big stuff. It's not just we've won Wimbledon it be it was a great day. But you know what, we're going to the States with the intention of winning everything out there as well.

Freddie Nielsen  25:39

Well, the proof is in the pudding. Right? Like Dan says, since they started playing together, the record is amazing. And you had this I had this feeling from following from the from the unfortunately, and we hadn't had the chance to watch you play until the Windland final, but you have this feeling on result that something's brewing here, you know that even in Paris, I was thinking, none of the SEAL teams want to play these guys. So these are dangerous photos. They're obviously not just having a hot couple of weeks. There's something consistent there. And anything less than that ambition, I think is pretty not interesting. When you find this, like Dan said, there's there's magic to a combination. Sometimes it's there for whatever reason. And when you have that, you gotta aim higher. So I don't think you're wrong and saying that,

Henry Patten  26:20

I think is what like what the lads have. And this is what I kept. I don't know whether I sent it to just myself, or whether it was sent to the people next to me, because I don't remember in the box is that the match the other day that you know that it was a bit of a struggle, it wasn't a great match. But it wasn't the best that the lads have played. I don't think it was the best of their mentality, I think. But I don't think it was the best that they've played just because Tommo and Max played so well or they served so well. But I just kept saying and I think I said it to Henry when he was on the court. And I said it to Louie was next to me just keep waiting, you will find a way and this is the thing with these lads is that in order to beat them, you better be focused on every single point. Because the minute that any opponent has slipped, and then the matches where we've been backs to the wall, and you think this is good, we're not winning this. And if the opponent just drops 1% Those lads are in there. And they turn a match round. So if you want to beat them, you're gonna have to be very, very good 100% of the time. And I think that's that's their identity as a team. And I think that that's pressure that the other teams feel and

Freddie Nielsen  27:29

I wanted to ask you, Henry, doesn't it rub you the wrong way that Cal has banded his local team to go for corporate glory with men united? It's embarrassing, though, isn't it? I

Henry Patten  27:39

support Liverpool. Let's 5000 miles away. Exactly.

Freddie Nielsen  27:42

I'm more than I'm one. That's more legit. Do you have a local team? I support my local team here in Denmark. We're not doing great, but we're doing good. Don't worry about us.

27:51

I'm not going to question cows loyalty to Manchester United either. I think if you asked if you ask anyone though, they'll give you the same answer. I think he's a pretty good fan.

Henry Patten  28:00

Even before you guys came on, I said to them that it was the best day in my life that didn't involve money united. But I didn't think it was actually probably along with Moscow is the best day in my life. Thanks.

28:12

That is an honor. That's as good as it gets.

Daniel Kiernan  28:14

Congratulations and my my closing remarks while you're here the last time not just myself, but I think the last time the tennis world was united in genuine happiness for good people was in 2012 when Freddy Nielsen and Johnny Murray won Wimbledon, you know and that I remember that extremely well. And there was there was a motion from myself on that day as many and I think what you guys have done on Saturday is exactly the same you know, and when good guys the good guys of tennis come together and do it the right way and thank you for opening up and sharing what was going on with you guys as well because we all love sport right? That's why we're all in this you know we all love these moments we talked about a lot on the podcast, those moments that that ability and Freddy talks about it a lot that ability to really get pumped and really have raw emotion so a big well done from all of us but from I'm sure from all of the tennis world and also only the start guys but thank you for those five minutes as I promised it would only be five minutes. Thank you for those five minutes that you've given us. Yeah, well

29:24

done. Anytime it's a pleasure.

Daniel Kiernan  29:27

Well done guys. We've got more tennis to talk about this still to Wimbledon so we're gonna let you guys jump in. We'll speak to you soon. All the best for the for the summer, guys. Love to the families.

29:37

Thanks. Thank you.

Daniel Kiernan  29:38

Take care.

Freddie Nielsen  29:40

So I just have one quick question. Tell it you say Moscow because you were there? Or did you genuinely enjoy that more than Barcelona?

Henry Patten  29:48

Now I went to I didn't go to Barcelona wasn't in I mean, that was a phenomenal day when we won the treble but I wasn't there Moscow. I actually went me and my mate when that was one of the things that you know from a personal point of view You won't remember Mike Ross is my best mate in the world. And we went to Moscow. And we saw the final there. And Ross came, he was there on Saturday. And we gave him a ticket. So that was a particularly special moment for me. Because, you know, it wasn't I know, Henry had all his best mates there as well. But I might my best mate was there as well, like one row behind me. And he came to the quarterfinals on the final. So it was particularly special on that, from that point of view, because our friendship is based on sport, essentially, he works in sport, I work in sport. And, you know, we were just saying afterwards, and I think it doesn't get said enough. I mean, another friend of mine has a great line. He's a journalist, and he said nothing other than intense sport and intense misery can completely consume a human being. I think that that's fair. That, you know, everybody in that stadium on Saturday, was completely consumed. I don't think anybody was thinking about anything else other than what was going on in that stadium that was in there. And only sport can do that.

Freddie Nielsen  31:01

100% I mean, how many things in life can actually make you, you know, celebrate, raise your arms, yell at something. I mean, I have a good pizza, I don't go down on my knees and do the chainsaw celebration. You know, I'm, I'm concerned. But I see a good sporting event. I'm enthralled. I react to it. My sometimes my heart starts beating up faster. It is just a different animal. I agree with you.

Henry Patten  31:25

And I said to my mate, mine was in America of the week and he didn't get to watch it. And he said he's going to come home and watch it. And I said, you know, watch the whole much. If you don't get chance to watch the whole match, watch the two first tie breaks. And then the last half hour of the match. Because the last half hour of the match. I don't think there will be any better sport this entire year. In any sport. The last half hour of that match for drama was unrivaled. That the things that went on there both in terms of level and standard. And like I say it wasn't it wasn't like it was like, you know, there's every point is a 20 shot rally. Most of the points were asis or unwritten cannibals are a great return that didn't come back. And there were a few longer rallies. But the drama that it created was, I've never experienced anything like it.

Freddie Nielsen  32:09

But that drama also, that kind of tennis also increases the stakes, right? Because when you step wrong one tiny inch, then that can have a really big effect.

Henry Patten  32:19

Yeah, that's I think what and again, some of the listeners might be interested in this that we have mount myself and Harry and Henry and Boris who's Harry's coach, we have a very specific way our we we scout opponents and how we prepare for matches in the lads will go and watch the matches. And from the knowledge that they have on them, they will both compare notes. I go and look at the data that we have in terms of where opponents serve where the where their patterns are and that kind of thing. And I'll compile a report on each player, I always send them four sheets and it's Player A Jew serving Player B do serving Player A ad serving player a player B ad serving we like to keep it simple so it doesn't go so long. So it's always on a one screenshot page. And it was only today when I came because I compile so many of them like one every night and I always send it at about nine o'clock the night before the match never before that they don't want it before that there's only today when I came back up I watched the last half hour of the match again on the phone on the train. And then after that I went to have a look at the scouting notes. And on so many of the big points the things that we spotted played out and I don't want to go into them because you never know who's listening to these things that we I'm sure that we'll play those two lads again, but it was amazing how the effort that we put into that swung the match at the big moments.

Freddie Nielsen  33:39

I have one question that I also asked it in the in the group chat. What did they make a mistake at nine oh,

Henry Patten  33:44

I'm sorry for I forgot to reply to you on that. I think I was doing something it was only I thought shit I forgot it was only when I watched the match today. I don't think they did Fred. I don't think they did because I watched the move that they made and tends to be that Purcell crosses on big points. I think what it was I don't I think Henry had great return. I don't think the bounce was great. And I think Purcell he'd gone to the lob a lot and he'd made great lobs and I think he just missed time the

Freddie Nielsen  34:13

lob but it seemed like he was kind of stuck coming out of the service waiting behind Joe to think

Henry Patten  34:17

as well you know what I thought was that he'd because he'd hit I mean that was a killer for us because Harry had got that we got as much point up and then we thought you know give us a chance here and Purcell hit I wide 131 mile now is the fastest serve the match. And I think jeez that was really clutch Yeah. And then he came out and I don't think he was planning although it wasn't he wasn't going big with the first server down that he was planning on having to play a return or not and I don't I think from what I know of them before I don't think they missed the move up. I think Purcell may be who'd been like you say being so clutch I mean the two lads had I mean, I can't give the other two enough credit to be honest like on how they served. It was impeccable serving from them. And then there was one point where Uh, I forget what stage it was. But it was a key moment. And Jordan Thompson hit a wide serve to Henry from I. And I think it was an ace. And I think it hit the service line less than halfway up the service line from I like a kicker wide. And it was one of the best sets I've ever seen. And they just kept and I think like, in win, the match has been played. I said this to the lads yesterday that I think I'm really don't want to sound like I'm blow my own trumpet. But I think one of the things I'm quite good as a coach is I can see things that are going on in matches, and then tell them how to adjust and that kind of thing. And I'll often say you know that they've hit this serve a lot. And I'll often go you know, given the t given the T but don't make it wide or vice versa. And that kind of thing. I was flummoxed in this much. I couldn't tell Henry any things I normally say that sit the same side of Henry, because they could hit both aces on any of the foremost they could I O Reg, they could hit ace try. And they did it with regularity. You know, Henry was looking to me for something I was like, Can I can't tell you anything tactically because these lines can hit any serve. And they can hit any move. But they just start missing a couple of first serves later on in the tie break and or missing a couple of verses, I'm missing a couple of spots. And that kind of let us in a little bit.

Daniel Kiernan  36:15

Interesting. Thanks. Now we do have a ladies doubles to talk about but probably not for 45 minutes. But obviously a one that one that I was very much very much a part of and actually listening to you there calve we had a similar one in the final of siniakova. Because again, our scouting will be again, without going into the detail similar but you know, I'll have a lot of back and forth with with one of the girls in particular. And, you know, I think we can nail the trends pretty much on every player. And again, I would say within the final we nailed it on Taylor Townsend, but siniakova just threw the whole trends out the window in the final. And it was like wherever you served a quality return came back to either direction. You know, I do think that flummoxed Gabby and Aaron a little bit. And I guess that pressure starts to build, right but I have to have to shout out siniakova For one the way she played the way she performed, but to that ninth ladies doubles title,

Freddie Nielsen  37:17

gonna say she might be the best player of this generation.

Daniel Kiernan  37:20

I mean, I think that goes quite under people who talk about su way all the time, who's obviously had a lot of success. With Sue, I think there's only one, I think she's already won five women's doubles, and siniakova. And she's aged 37. And siniakova has already won nine at the age of 28 and Olympics. And she's done it with different different partners. And you know, I absolutely tip my hat to her, and beg and beg slams with different partners and partners that she hasn't played a lot with as well. But I have to give a big shout out today because one of our girls has moved to world number one today. So Aaron Routledge is the new world number one today. And herself and Gabby Gabby has moved up to three. So they are they are the world's number one team as it currently stands. And that deserves a shout out because even 12 months ago, I know Erin was seriously considering her future in the sport. She was kind of all over the place for what was going to happen. Gabby wasn't having the best of times. But for them to now get to the top of the game is quite incredible. I know again, like what Cal says it's not let's get to the top and let's stop you know it's only it's only it's only the start but another really nice feel good tennis story because two more delightful, delightful people as well.

Freddie Nielsen  38:40

And you're not going to say it obvious I'm gonna say it so well done to you then. Because you've obviously played a big part in it. So you should give yourself some credit.

Daniel Kiernan  38:47

Yeah, no, thank you and also Bruce Lipka. And I want to say a few words of Bruce actually because coaching there's there's a tennis element to coaching but ultimately we're coaching people right. And Bruce a few years ago again took a took a chance on Aaron and has kind of thrown his heart and soul in but what he's done with Aaron, as he's letter absolutely categorically know that he's not going anywhere. You know, when we've got players that you know might have struggles in different areas to know that you've got an unbelievably loyal person by your side and someone who's going to be with you through thick and thin it's it's a massive thing for any tennis player to have. So Bruce, love you man if you're listening, and a big well done for all of the work that you have put in over the last few years

Henry Patten  39:36

on that kid I find it pretty interesting that since the last one the other day like loads of people have messaged me and gone Oh, this must open up so many opportunities for you and Calvin, this kind of thing. And to every one I've gotten. I have a job. Why would I care about any opportunity? I have a job that I love. I work with two lads and with Henry and Harry and I work with Luke as well. And I love working with him. Why would I care about any other opportunities? And I find that just a weird reaction that people have in that respect?

Freddie Nielsen  40:06

Don't you have a lot of good opportunities with them? Yeah, 100%,

Henry Patten  40:09

but winning grand slams, you're

Freddie Nielsen  40:11

most likely going to play and play the world's finals as well. So it's gonna be huge.

Daniel Kiernan  40:16

That was similar when the girls want us open, I think yeah, but it's yeah, it's a it is a weird response. Do you think? Do you think that it's I actually had this as well, from a couple of parents, a couple of parents of players at the academy, they said, Oh, my goodness, you just do an incredible, it's incredible what's been achieved? You'll crack the singles world soon? I'm sure you will. It was like this.

Henry Patten  40:38

One, there's that one? And the other one I've had is, surely you're gonna get some sort of national job. Now? I wouldn't want to do that. I wouldn't, I would want to do that. But no, I mean, you know, it's, I love doing the job I do. And they're great lads to work with the lads I work with. And I know that, you know, your two girls are great girls, you know, you can't like the, you know, what we're basically looking out for in this game is, you know, to make a living, but also to enjoy work and to win things, and win at the biggest stage. And that's Touchwood. And we're privileged to be able to say this, that's what we're currently doing. You know, it's, it's not a case of, well, I'm going to move on to the next thing and move on to the next thing. That's not how this game works.

Daniel Kiernan  41:22

Oh, absolutely. And my last thing, before we move away from doubles, is coaching doubles. There's more jobs as well. So when you're coaching a singles play it everything is about that player, whereas when you're coaching doubles, you have coaching to individuals, and they're all needs and wants and desires. But you're also coaching them the integration of those two players into a team. So there's actually technically three roles within it and but I think there's something magic about that as well when it goes right because you're bringing people together and you're you know, different personalities, as we see with Henry and Harry, we certainly see with Gabby and Aaron. But the magic of bringing those different personalities together to have a mutual love, admiration, respect for each other. And a way of working is something very special to be involved in. So I know the three of us the world of doubles has given us a lot. And I'm sure we're going to give us a lot more moving forward. I at this point as well. We're in a bit of a shout out more than but Craig garland, I'll tell a little story actually, I went one of my first ever international trips as a coach Kolomna life of the IETF grid for events in some rainy little town in France. I was in a bunk bed with this guy, and got stuck talking to him. He got stuck talking to me for a week and that was Craig garland and Craig Allen is the been the coach of Alfie Ewart over the last few years, and we've we've seen it we talked about abortion already today. But alpha you one is 29 van 30 of Grand Slams at Wimbledon, and sometimes it can be like if you were to run again, you know, and it's like if you stop and you watch one one the level of these wheelchair players but to the drama that was created through that because alpha you would have never won the singles at Wimbledon say to stopped and just watched the semi final that he played against Fernandez, this guy who's a strong boy from from Argentina. And again that was that brought some up incredible drama. I think that was on caught three packed caught three crowd, absolutely entertained, completely taken on board and I think what wheelchair tennis is doing and what Wimbledon is doing, actually, with the promotion of it, you know, I know they weren't caught one very early this year. The crowds were packed to watch the matches is something really special that we're seeing in our sport as well. And I think it's it goes back to this thing that we've always discussed. Get it out there, get it on the stage, get it on TV and show people and people absolutely watch it but a big shout out to Craig Allen and also to Alpha uutta for finally getting his Wimbledon singles title. And then partnering Gordon reed to win I believe it's something like this 1718 Grand Slam doubles title as well. Well done. Freddie. What was your When was your last Wimbledon

Freddie Nielsen  44:20

2019 I was there for 2021 but had Coronavirus and was in the hotel for 15 days instead of playing.

Daniel Kiernan  44:27

So 2019 What would you say about the court surface at Wimbledon in 2019? So

Freddie Nielsen  44:33

let me see where I played. I felt like back then. The one the courts in front of Center Court were a little bit slower than the ones in the back. But I would still say it was pretty slow. Yeah, I do remember. On the second round we did we played skupski and JP Smith and our three tiebreaker. I don't think there were any breaks. So it still plays a bit fast. But I did feel increasingly that it got slower and slower and slower.

Daniel Kiernan  44:59

What did you think? This year calve speed wise,

Henry Patten  45:01

I mean, it's definitely the slowest of the grass tournaments that I went to. It's noticeably slower than East balm. But East bone is rapid. I think I didn't I mean, I definitely people might not know I knock in my hand on Queens tournaments. So I basically didn't hit anything. Not that I ever usually hit loads of balls when the lads are together. But I think there was, like Freddie said, they're like a variation in the courts, like everyone wants to get on the match courts practice on the match courts the week before or the few days before, but they're notoriously don't cut those so much, because they want to protect them, so that the grass is longer on those courts that they let you practice on before. So then automatically slower. Because of that. There was a lot of rumors going around before the tournament that this year, the courts were faster than they have been. But from my experience, that wasn't the case. And we also heard somebody told me that the morning of the final that they'd been hearing that center was much slower than the other courts, but they were probably less rallies in the final than they were in any of the other matches. So it's kind of difficult to tell, but what I'd say is definitely slower than the other grass tournaments. But I still think you know, there's still grass cots fundamentally, I think, for me that the main difference is from now from a few years ago, the ball, the ball is noticeably bigger, and that slowed it down a bit, but it's still tough to return on them.

Freddie Nielsen  46:27

And especially in doubles, but I also feel like more and more people are getting more and more comfortable playing from the back now in doubles as well. And

Henry Patten  46:36

I've seen at the top 100 Apparently stay back seven statement. Oh, wow. Yeah.

Freddie Nielsen  46:40

And also the introduction of the kick serve on grass is highly efficient now. Effective. So I don't know if it's just because people haven't used it that much before but I felt like the last few years that got more and more effective like the kicker would really take off. And but I don't remember ever having played teams that really stayed back, but I see it now of course when they play that a lot of teams actually stay back a lot. Yeah. I mean

Henry Patten  47:04

those I mean interesting for someone Thompson they stay on return games, they went both back on both SERPs which I don't think we've experienced at all since this year. It's normally you know that a lot of players go both back on first return but these were the first ones that and they were doing all tournament we knew to expect that they were going both back on on both first and second you know I guess they knew that their strength were from the back but yeah, there are more pairs who were doing that I mean, there are still you know a lot of the top guys I'm saying that who I'm looking at the top 100 Like thereby EOS and granola so I guess mix it up a bit. Henry surf and volleys on both Serbs are 100% of the time Harry mixes it

Freddie Nielsen  47:44

1. I feel like the BIOS never comes in ways funny

Henry Patten  47:48

enough read. The BIOS and granos are strange facts. They're number one in the world, but we've only played them once. And we only knew we were playing like about an hour before we played them on the morning in Rome. And so I've actually scouted them, and I've never played them. So I haven't seen loads of them if you know what I mean. I've only seen them in passing in the odd point when I've watched them and I've always been thoroughly impressed with them. But I mean Pavich seven volleys on every serve, are evallo rarely serve and volleys although he's got one of the best serves in the game and even a guy like Neal skupski of

Freddie Nielsen  48:21

thing back a lot kneels down with that would never happen if back in the day.

Henry Patten  48:24

I mean, it's interesting because Luke, who I coach has over the last year has kind of changed to staying back a lot more. But that's because I mean with Luke get to that His strength is his groundstrokes. And I will do like we had discussions even over the course Wimberley in the warm up tournaments I you know, we'd suggested like looking at maybe staying because he was serving volume first day. Matt second, but I thought maybe that you know, we'd suggested him staying back a lot more on both but you know, I think in the end they end up mixing it up and doing it quite well. But

Freddie Nielsen  49:00

But I You asked him because you had any regulation when you were there. I

Henry Patten  49:03

just thought the courts were unbelievably slow. One of the things I always find interesting Keno is that when on any of the grass surface, you push, you go down, if you go down and touch the surface, if you put your finger in, like you can feel the ground has a bit of give on it. At Wimbledon, it genuinely feels like the grass is growing out of concrete. Like there's no give in the ground at all. It's rock solid underneath it. I don't know there must do something specifically for that.

Daniel Kiernan  49:32

It felt to me and what I thought to a couple of people on this because obviously the guys are serving maybe 1015 20% Faster, whether they're getting through I didn't see many, many of the women serving through the court that you know, it was it felt like there was a lot of balls that were that were sticking. They were hitting the surface and sticking. And the other thing that I observed is When it hit the line, so no, there's always a bit of a check when it hits the lines. I thought the check was quite dramatic. Yeah.

Henry Patten  50:06

100% that was more pronounced this year than I've ever seen it. And

Daniel Kiernan  50:10

it really caused people a problem. You know, it was that if you hit a line serve, it was almost you got the point, you know, because it was like, everyone was just sewing so incredibly early on the ball. But yeah, it's I thought that was I just thought it was quite interesting the way that it had gone. And it certainly didn't feel very grassy, very grass Corty as well,

Henry Patten  50:33

I mean, maybe played into that is they wasn't particularly hot.

Daniel Kiernan  50:36

And I think that's for sure. I think that's, I think that definitely, yeah,

Henry Patten  50:41

not only hot, but also overcast, which is always I don't know whether this, you know whether it makes any difference, but I like a little bit of dampness in the air. Like, you know, maybe slows it down a little bit more.

Freddie Nielsen  50:55

Thank you been able to get through the air and oh, yeah, definitely.

Henry Patten  51:01

A little bit of moisture. But yeah, probably, that may be countered with the car brand. I don't know, maybe that's just in my own head. Because I'm not saying like rain, and that kind of thing. You know, I'm more just like a little bit dampness pre cold. Like a lot of the time, it

Daniel Kiernan  51:14

was challenged, I said to Fred offline, I found the first few days really difficult, actually, I mean, the girls had made the final and eSports. Or looking back. Actually, I think this worked in our favor. But we turned up on the Monday morning. And a lot of people would have been there for like five days. But I think that meant we kept a freshness towards the back end of the second week. Whereas maybe if we'd been there for the five, six days before is beautiful as Wimbledon is you can get grand slams and Wimbledon out, you know being on the site the whole time. And going through that. Whereas I felt we kept a bit of a freshness. Even though we we had some quite late finishes. But the weather did massively impact and it impacted lots of people, I know that we're very close to going into an emergency contingency plan and moving the wheelchair tennis and also the juniors that we're going to maybe move that over to the SATs or Southland across the road. There, we're certainly getting to the point with Gabby and Aaron actually, they started a bit of a bit of a different experience. I don't know if you guys have had this experience. Their second round match started at about 3pm On Friday, and finished at 8:30pm on Sunday, and I sent this to a few people because then once that finished, they were then on the schedule the next day. And then it was like every day with women's doubles or mixed and then we had a couple more experiences where we were on the schedule of 11am but then got moved to call one to play at 9pm You know, like the whole thought the whole day. But the challenge that came for them is that people are totally doubles it's only a game of doubles. You know it's only like three sets but it's this state of readiness

Freddie Nielsen  52:55

that's also why my argument for the for the singles play and not playing doubles have not the physical aspect but you lose the ability to control your day. And you have to be on Yes, I

Henry Patten  53:07

think especially now as well with the majors in the because they've got roofs on the courts those guys in the top I guess if you're in the top eight, you know exactly when you're playing it's a big advantage when you're playing and you know exactly when you know exactly when you're practicing all the the tournament instead of Wimbledon because you can't practice on the center court and number one court you can't do a full practice session you can't let you have a hit but although they didn't let those other hit even on center, but you know exactly and like Freddie said I think with the double once you had the doubles into that they don't know exactly when they're playing golf. But I think there's you know there was other parameters as well like you know, the doubles practice went out to rains I guess maybe not for UK and actually turned up on Monday but all our practice was at range park before the tournament started so which was a bit different, a bit of a different experience not want to particularly enjoyed again, you feel like you're out of the tournament a little bit. Even though it isn't official practice club, but I think it's

Freddie Nielsen  54:09

the one thing I always enjoyed about Wimbledon distention Exactly. Didn't have to

Henry Patten  54:13

do that. And also like it's a nice facility there it rains. But if anyone who hasn't been it's very open, and it's therefore very, very windy. We

Daniel Kiernan  54:23

had one one session that we had actually by file were session at the championship there actually. Yeah, that was a bit concerned on that morning. Let's see. How's it oh my god, this is not going well. It's just not going well. A couple more little interesting things to mention. I think Wimbledon men's single set a new record for five set matches, which surprised me a little bit I I don't know how closely I'd followed it but I haven't worked out if it was 36 or 37 Because I don't know the quarterfinals. I know that the sinner quarterfinals was the 36 there against Medvedev, but then there was a Resetti Fritz I don't have that bit made up 37 of that was played before. It was 35. So, five set match matches are still living very strong. A

Freddie Nielsen  55:08

lot of two sets for love come back. Absolutely.

Daniel Kiernan  55:11

There's two players. I want to mention before we, we talked about the singles. It's quite nice that we're leaving the singles to last for once. You know, but there's two more players. We can't go without mentioning Sandy Murray, and obviously his final Wimbledon. And Freddie, I'll come to you on this as a as a an outsider, in terms of not being British, what did you think of emarat Accardo, signing on that dotted line to play mixed doubles with Andy. And then at the very last moment, she dropped out and all there was a couple of more than a couple a couple of words said amongst certainly the journalists in the UK, but maybe it's fair game when you're still going on the singles? I don't know. I think

Freddie Nielsen  55:53

it is definitely fair game, and having been in the game must have known that the same was gonna happen. I mean, I know that he knows that he's Andy, marry 30. Marry, and maybe that that have a special, special tool for her. And I don't know how it took place. The conversation was like, am I we're playing this. Otherwise, I'm finding somebody else to play. Or maybe Emma said, Yeah, I'll play but based on what happened, it didn't seem like that was the case. But yeah, I'd love to play but, you know, we can't account for the rain. Or maybe I go go deep and the scheduling. I mean, Andy would be the first to understand, You've obviously done the same and understand that I mean, a guy who has literally turned every stone and weighed every rice grain that he ate, will obviously understand that a singles player who was making a run, chooses to prioritize that instead of a nostalgic match, which was, yeah, let's, I mean, they're obviously playing to win. But it was, I mean, if you're being really harsh, it could be a match that was just there to be played for for goodbye. So I can completely understand from the outside. And he must have known that that was a risk. I'm

Henry Patten  57:01

a bit sort of split on it. Because, look, I didn't say if you're single is planning really be done the same. However, I think if you do that, you got to also be willing to take a few hits some criticism on it, you know, you're gonna you're gonna get some criticism for doing what you've done. And I think what was found a little bit strange is that the radical new camp didn't accept that either. And apparently, they changed the reasoning as to why she was pulling out and just say, you know, like, Yeah, I'm gonna have to pull out, um, I'm still in the singles. But there was the strange stuff, some of the strange rationale, like, she was disappointed about going on late mix, there was always on last, you know, we get mixed doubles. First on on center, it was going to be center, there's no doubt about that I was going to be sent to you might have caught one. Sorry, one of the shortcuts I mean, not. Not saying there's always gonna be one of the shortcuts I'm not gonna put on court too. So or anything below that, that in mind, because you know, it's mixed doubles. It's, it's not going to be on anything, but they're gonna have to get through the singles matches. So she was sort of saying that while she thought if she would have played if it could have gone earlier, but that was never going to happen. I also, apparently, I was told that they'd agreed when he agreed to do it, that he'd agreed with her that if she was that she would play regardless. Because I think he had a couple of other high profile options that were absolutely guaranteeing that they wouldn't pull out. And I'd heard and driver and Coco golf. Were both very interested in playing it. And Coco always played doubles. She wasn't gonna pull out. And

Freddie Nielsen  58:35

that's also what I was thinking about right now. Is that correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think we heard anything from Andy. So if there had been some kind of understanding that it's okay, he would probably come out to defend them. But since we haven't heard anything that also tells me that we heard from God. Astonishing, astonishing. Astonishingly, we heard from her Yeah. But, but that tells me that obviously, he was expecting to play and had been giving those reassurances. So that's why it's tough to talk on because from an outside, you can obviously understand that that would have been the case, but he must have been given assurances. So if there's an internal agreement that she breaks, obviously, don't find it. Nice, but it's tough to speculate about from the outside, right. But you can kind of insinuate by the reactions afterwards that he must have been given assurances that he was gonna get to play that match.

Henry Patten  59:24

Yeah. And I think as well, that, and driver was already out of the singles at that stage. So she basically said that she wanted to play and, yeah, it's not the big net. It's not the huge name that radical who is but Mira Andrade was gonna be a huge name, as well. And you know, she's hugely charismatic,

Daniel Kiernan  59:42

or they've got a funny story as well. Yeah. 100%.

Henry Patten  59:44

So, I think if that was the case, I mean, I'd heard a few people. It's, I mean, even then, though, and then a few people going like, well, you know, it's ridiculous that he couldn't get another partner but like, you can't, you kind of can't change the rules, but then I have to think about I thought, well, it's mixed doubles. You could actually They changed the rules. Like there's no ranking points or anything at stake. It's basically like in an exhibition event, if you know they could have maybe just gone all right, okay. Sunday morning. And would anyone have complained? Yes.

Freddie Nielsen  1:00:12

Why are these players complaining? Oh, never.

Henry Patten  1:00:15

I mean, that is to be fair, that is one of the things when you talking about we're talking about doubles earlier. And, you know, the debates that are going forward, that is one of the things that has really disappointed me this week, is that the doubles players, refusal to stick together on things and finding out what would be in their interests. I'm principled until the point that I think that that's not in my interest to be so so I'm not principled anymore. And that that is, that's been, you know, without going into any details about it. That's something that really disappointed me with a few players who I expected better off. Can

Freddie Nielsen  1:00:48

I say one thing real quick? Yeah, I think, for everybody, the last match was the match was with Jamie, I think the stuff was gonna be kind of a side bonus. But for everybody that sent a cord match with with Jamie, that was the main event anyway. Yeah,

Daniel Kiernan  1:01:02

it was not where it should have ended in my Exactly, yeah, called back to Henry and Harry. And I sat there just smiling at this, because it's, it's a big, big belief of mine, it was the first thing that I ever did when I worked with Gabby and Aaron, was sit down, get some hard, honest conversations on the table. And they don't, they don't have to be hard conversations. But people in general in this world don't communicate well. And when you don't communicate well, and you tend to base things on assumptions, or narratives that you make up in your own head. And I think we kind of live our lives like that, in lots of ways, because people aren't willing to actually sit there and have the right conversation, we certainly see it in the tennis world. And I think we see it in the tennis world, with coaches and players. And we see it in the tennis world with players and players, when they're when they're playing doubles together. For me, it should be a non negotiable if you're a coach and a player about to start off on a relationship, before any fun is signed. And I've asked a lot of top coaches about this. And this doesn't happen. And it amazes me that it should be an absolute sit down fully go through things get aligned with values get aligned with identities get aligned with the way you like to work, the expectations that so many of these things, that process absolutely should happen, because any relationship will be better for that. I can guarantee it. And this is not just a tennis thing. And it's the same with doubles partners, Harry and Henry to say two great guys and two guys that have got their head switched on, that have had a life outside of tennis as well. You know, they've learned how to live life outside of tennis. Aaron and Gabby absolutely did that US Open. And that's what I would always put their success down to is their ability to have these conversations and get aligned and understand understand each other mixed doubles isn't going to happen like that, really, because people are asking so late, you know, so it's a little bit harder for those discussions. And that might be a strange thing for people when they're playing for two grand slam. I know some people say it's not but it is well known within the sport of you winning mixed doubles, it's a Grand Slam goes down on the record, but the players are pretty much just turning up and signing up with anyone that's available, you know, other than a few that maybe get in touch. And even to the point where when Aaron so my my girls played each other first round, which was a potential disaster, they handled it very well. But walking on the court in the morning of with Aaron, she had warmed up her returns on the juice site, which is where she plays all of her tennis. And she won't mind me telling this story. And as they get to the court, Mikey, Venus turns down and says, Oh, by the way, which which side to play into, and our play do side. And she was thinking, well, he normally plays out with Jamie, but even say none and I've not hit, I've not hit any ad returns for like six weeks. I've been playing the last six weeks I've been playing on on the juice. And she said I saw this kind of panic in his face. And she was thinking, I've not had a bloody return on the outside for four years. But she said, That's okay. I mean, don't worry, I've got it. I've got the ad site. So that discussion was happening on the court. Same with Harry and Gabby they played together early on Harry bless them came to our practice court and they started talking about which side they were playing that is when that that is happening. So when we go now back to it's a long winded way of getting back to Emma and Andy, they would have been very little communication that took place there. You know, and my only thing I'd like to add in there and I don't know I wasn't a fly on the wall. I don't know exactly, but just reading between the lines it seems like there was not a discussion that took place between AMA and Andy when other decided not to play,

Henry Patten  1:04:51

I think was something that what what I found, you know, and it's more and more coming into it and the whole thing with like you say here No, no conversation there. And then Judy got involved and then retracted some what is that the whole thing just seemed to be discussed through agents. Yeah,

Daniel Kiernan  1:05:08

completely. There was poor communication because

Henry Patten  1:05:10

Judy said it, you know, I was being sarcastic, which, you know, come on, like, you know, and it's like, clearly somebody has gone Oh, the you know, this is not a great look for you, Judy. I think you know, let's go with the

Daniel Kiernan  1:05:21

she then put the story of Andean Serena playing mixed doubles up on her Instagram? Yes. And what the court that Serena had the greatest honor I've ever had is playing mixed doubles of Andy or something. Yeah.

Henry Patten  1:05:34

And, you know, it's just like, now the whole thing is just I mean, even in the players restaurant, the players lawn for me, there's too many agents around there. And it's like, the whole thing is, like, like you say, have a conversation go down and say, I mean, I was even told this is speculating. But the person who told me I think would know, that Emma didn't really want to play in the first place. She didn't want to agree to it. But somebody, somebody in a team said to her, and this is a quote directly from the person who told me who I think would know that she was told this could be another half million Instagram followers. And she agreed on that basis.

Daniel Kiernan  1:06:15

Well, Alka has got 250,000 Yesterday during his final so if that's how we're judging success, maybe right?

Henry Patten  1:06:24

There's actually an interesting Instagram story with Emirati cardi. I remember when she wouldn't US Open somebody had told me like, you know, I think I forget how we got round to it. But I don't know what what how many Instagram followers she's got now. But somebody said to me, like, oh, you know, think she's going to be the most popular Instagrammer on she's going to be the most popular female on Instagram. And at the time, I was like, she will not be having I just picked her out. She will not be having more followers than than Rihanna. Unlike No, no, she definitely will. And I'm like, Yeah, you people need to get a grip because as much as I love tennis, it's not that

Daniel Kiernan  1:06:55

big. But it could have been if she played mixed doubles of Andy Murray.

Henry Patten  1:06:59

Thanks for half a million she needed about another 57 and a half I think

Daniel Kiernan  1:07:03

who I would love Andy have played to have played with was and I'll get to it in a minute. I used to love when I was at Wimbledon when Federer a hit, or was that any tournament you'd go and you'd watch fared and he just like, oozed so much class and he was so smooth and everything he did, and the person I'm going to say here did the same when I when I saw her this year Wimbledon, and I can't help thank God if the women's game Mrs. Ash Barty. And she was there commentating but she was also playing the legends, but she's only like 28 or something.

Freddie Nielsen  1:07:38

But she played a mixed and the legends that would have been something that

Daniel Kiernan  1:07:41

would have been really cool because honestly, I watched her and she must have hit like four chip lobs live. And she they put one on the line one an inch from the line one two centimeters from the line. And it was a thing of beauty watching her. And yeah, I just couldn't help. I nearly did I had to bite my tongue when I was we were on the court next to and I nearly walked past and said, Look, I've been working on the WTO to the last 12 months and we miss Yash you know, like, get yourself back. But it was certainly good to see her in action, but I think she's like 28 Honestly, that's my guess I'm gonna check. What would you guys guess?

Freddie Nielsen  1:08:22

2627 28

Daniel Kiernan  1:08:23

she was 2090 9096 Yeah, look and all respect to her decisions and her personal life. But if she's traveling over to the UK for a few weeks to commentate and play the legends, it seems anyway, if it's a sport we love, I would love to still see. But let's we're move into into the women's singles event. Frehley and we were all wrong. I thought I was a definite I thought once sabalenka pulled out. We kind of we picked EGA cards you picked eager unless she plays rabac in ostapenko Danielle Collins, we all said and and I laughed I laughed when the draw came out because she was in that section. And she lost her putt NetServer but if she'd won, she was going to play ostapenko And then if she'd won again, she was going to potentially be a Danielle Collins and if you want to gain she was going to play Rebecca so that was never going to happen. Rebecca looked like she was cruising. My girls played for Bora cry Gjakova in the doubles quarterfinals the day before she played the semifinals against Rebecca. And I was like this. It was the most dramatic two hours, two hours 53 And I was like she is shooting herself in the foot. Big time here finished late. It was stressful. It was like we talked about that juice or juice or juice or juice add and eventually the girls sneak past and then I was like oh my god she's gonna go and recover and play a Wimbledon semifinal. Tomorrow. She has no chance against Rebecca. But she took her down and then she took polini down. She has won a French Open it's a second Grand Slam but just saw understated Freddie in everything she does as

Freddie Nielsen  1:10:06

a result, so I felt a little disrespected in the Encore interview after the qualifying like what is it going to be playing field? What do you think it's going to be like playing Rebecca Sierra positive head to hit I think two for two against her and had a Grand Slam title before. So I think what you're saying is right, because you kind of forget sometimes because she is understated, she's underplayed, she doesn't make headlines, she just goes about her business business and plays really good tennis. And it's, um, spectacularly efficient, I think. And the same with the final I think it wasn't like you didn't say, Oh, my goodness, what is happening here is just solid, decent serves very, very composed, played, played well, and she's, she's understanding her reactions and like, yeah, I quite like her. She kind of reminds me a little bit of a of a Davydenko kind of type goes under the radar, but it's just really, really good attendance.

Daniel Kiernan  1:11:03

And another winner from the Czech Czech Republic, tragical the use of the year before and it's, they just keep just producing, they've just got they've got such a line of line of players, which I think also helps keep that understated way as well. Their feet seem to be firmly on the ground because there's there's so many of them that there's there's there's not a big song and dance. We talked about Emirati carnage of it, we've been crying out in Great Britain for someone you know, you've probably got it with Holger Rooney. You know, because there's no one else really around. Then all of the attention from the media, all of the attention from everywhere it goes on these players. And I can't help thinking that the girls from Czech have this advantage that they can just keep their heads down and actually focus on what is actually important out there.

Freddie Nielsen  1:11:52

Exactly. And there's gonna be many many years like this for the checks, right? It doesn't seem like they're slowing down anytime soon.

Daniel Kiernan  1:11:59

And Carl's Did you Did we eyes on all your when we're there working? It's hard to sometimes be as locked into an ICL. I hardly watched the singles events this year. But did your eyes looking on much and I guess a little word maybe about polini as well, who? You know, it's just had this incredible Yeah, I saw her record that Wimbledon going into this year. I think she'd only ever won one first round men draw match at Wimbledon. And Her record was like qualifying first round loss qualifying first round loss, qualify. And second round loss, qualifying first round loss first round mandrel qualifying second round, you know, like and she's just kept going and what an incredible year she's putting together. Yeah,

Henry Patten  1:12:41

I mean, it's an interesting one, because probably going to be out of the tournament because Madison keys was five to up in the third and then pulled a hamstring. Yeah, that was in the second round. Quarterfinal for fourth round, fourth round fourth round for and I mean, I've got to be honest, I think he's a huge mess for rybakina. This one. Yeah, I thought that, you know, I thought for a huge Miss for her but also for women's tennis. And I said to somebody on the balcony wasn't you know, when it got to the semis that women's tennis really needs Rebecca to win this tournament, just because then you started to get to a stage where you've got a big three, who were kind of dominating. And I think that's always good for sport, you need rivalries. If you look at when any sport is successful, it's when you get rivalries. And I think that the problem with the women's game at the minute is they just keep having too many random slam winners, which is not the fault of the players winning them by any stretch but the bigger names than just Can

Daniel Kiernan  1:13:37

I challenge you a bill now how many how many Grand Slams as Rebecca no one was

Henry Patten  1:13:42

one but I think it's it's not easy, you know, tennis and not just slammed? Okay. No, she's, she's one more tennis matches this year than any other player Rabbana. And she's been you know, she's had a very, very good year, this year. And you know, she's the one player, she does have the winning record against Frontech as well. She's I think she's close to 5050 against Saba Lanka. And I think it's important that we do get three or four players and I don't think you just want complete dominance, but you get three or four players who are tend to be at the top of the game, whereas they've kind of got that but all those players only have one slam. Like you got to get back in and one slam Coco golf one slam. It's great to see Bianca Andreescu back and playing to a decent level. But we thought that she was going to be a superstar as well won slam. And it's only CyberLink had to slam it two or three slams to this year to slams. So you know, but she's been injured to be fair, I think she probably would have been very much in the mix for this one if she wasn't injured. But then again, we thought that Rebecca was very much in the mix for this one and by

Daniel Kiernan  1:14:50

chick cry chick over to slums. That's my challenge. Yeah, but cry Chekhov is now one of one one more than Rebecca.

Henry Patten  1:14:57

No, no, I don't disagree with that. But again, And throughout the year, it's not you know, she's just not doing anything. project ever. You know, it's and I think she's an excellent player that the year that she won the French she was very consistent and very good. She had a ridiculous record that year that think between like, a something between like March and like October she didn't lose before the semis or something like that, or, you know, the players, she was losing to win the top two three players in the world all the time. But, you know, this is just again, out of nowhere, you know, how many people would we have had to ask before this tournament? Who was going to win it before? It was correct? Ridiculous. And that's fine. That's fine to have the odd one. But, you know, it's like now we've got critical a last year as one of raver winning it, and was one of Avery winning last year, one from Jerusalem. You know, it's this kind of thing is just, it doesn't help the actual product of the women's game. And I know, there are people who disagree with pretty people who say, Oh, the thing, the reason why the women's game is so great is that anybody can win anything. But that's not the way that you build a legacy by doing that. That's not the way Yeah,

Daniel Kiernan  1:16:06

I understand that. I, I understand that for sure. I just think where Yeah, I think we do it on this podcast. We've been trying to create this big three, haven't we, you know, we've been keep on that we keep on saying it. But they're not. They're not quite backing it up. But I want to throw another little theory out there. I think that the bride should call that and also Jesper Gula would be one that will come on to this. I think they're also a victim of their own success playing singles and doubles. And I saw it at the year end finals in Cancun, great. Gjakova was tossed. She was done. She played so many singles and doubles matches that year preschooler as well completely done. And I think it's really hard for them, then those that are doing that particular when they're playing with singles and doubles, to be able to come ready because we know that as you're just appears kind of out of nowhere, especially if you're playing a tournament in the run up. And I just don't think it's enough time for them to get ready. And I think they probably probably corecore as well. I think unfortunately, as much as I love doubles, I think these top top top singles players, I don't think it works when they haven't success on the singles and the doubles all that I think it could work for a year or two. But I think it catches up because we're all human beings. And I go back to this thing, and I absolutely experienced it myself. This Wimbledon, this state of readiness, this constant state of readiness, I think pairs and ultimately causes causes stress and a lack of freshness for these players. And I just wonder if that's what's happened to krajcir Call because she has dropped off a little bit. And then maybe she's back on it back on the up. Now.

Freddie Nielsen  1:17:50

I just wanted to say also with these guys, girls, the top players, they play their singles on the roof courts, like Cal said, but in the doubles, they probably don't. But they'll have to wait around and get delayed matches and sit around and and they just lose so much ability to control their days.

Henry Patten  1:18:06

It's interesting as well. I think that you know, it used to be this theory about I think it was like legitimate as well like a few years ago, even up until the last seven or eight years that you would play doubles to develop your singles game more. But now when I watch it, there's so many they just play singles on the doubles cop not really developing anything. They're just doing the same as what they were doing. And you know, they're just getting crosscourt rallies. And, you know, no real development has been made, like, you know, look at Zverev, who's actually done quite well at doubles. But you know, somebody said to me the other days, I don't know why he's playing doubles, because it you know, it's not helping him in singles, and he was like, oh, to improve his volleys, as I believe he hasn't improved them at all. And he that's because he doesn't really hit any, you know, he sort of stands out in the tramline, when Melo is serving, and he might put a you know, he puts away a couple, but they're not the volleys that he's gonna get in singles, and he doesn't serve and volley. And he just plays basically crosscourt singles.

Freddie Nielsen  1:19:02

Completely different volley, right? Because of all these singles always come from running in and high speed.

Henry Patten  1:19:06

Exactly, yeah. And in so it hasn't really improved any of their singles. I don't think I've ever played it, which is weird, because like, you know, all the discussions that we're having last week with the ATP, this obsession that the way to make a better product of doubles is to get all the singles playing, not gonna work is not gonna work. I mean, I'm sure he won't mind me saying but I know that Jordan Thompson was saying last week in on Jordan's a very good singles player as well. I think he's top 30 in the world now. Or he has been recently and he was saying the singles guys are not going to play. The money's too big in singles. Now. This is not like in the early 90s where you think you know the singles prize money is excellent and top it up with a bit of doubles. They earn so much money in in singles now that there's no reason for them to be playing doubles. And all it's going to do is it's going to get situations like this, like we say you're going to find out dog courts and that kind of thing. So they're just not going to do it let that pipe dream go. This idea that and it astonishes me that people in the ATP thinking people who consider themselves to be intelligent people genuinely think you're going to get outta rosin veriff playing every doubles tournament right to the end pipe dream we

Daniel Kiernan  1:20:17

are going to get Carlos Alvarez in doubles in the Olympics with Rafael Nadal which is kind of cool. And we will then champion second second time in a row. If you're going to win a Wimbledon men's singles title, why not be to know that jurkovich In the final you know we saw last year that he had to suffer for that when he came from behind that was kind of for me the the real day that Carlos Alcatraz became a man because for him to beat jockey which on his own court Center Court at Wimbledon and jockey which was throwing the kitchen sink at him. It never had any stage felt like last year that Carlos Alcaraz was going to win that match this year. It never felt like he was going to lose the match Freddy

Freddie Nielsen  1:21:01

no I agree and actually I found it difficult this time around to see is something wrong with Novak or is Carlos just that good? Because it was so one sided that it was very it was not very common to see Novak being outplayed that much was it he almost only won games there was only because Carlos basically choked that game at five 440 Love otherwise he would have won eight games and three sets on grass and yeah by no by no means that he stone in the in the tournament Novak but he was playing well enough. I thought to be able to to be competitive against Carlos buts No, not at all. So I don't know if it's just because Carlos has done to have Novak's number. If he played outrageously good, I thought the work made some interesting tactical decisions. For Carlos certainly like to be a lot better. But if

Daniel Kiernan  1:21:52

we say these curls, Alex de Manila Yannick sinner, Luca Nardi, Casper Ruud Allah hander, or to Bill Thomas Majak, Casper Ruud. Okay, that was a walkover Carlos Alcatraz. And these are the players that have beaten Novak Djokovic to this year before Wimbledon. He was 17 and seven on the air. He's now 23 and eight but 17 and seven. This is not a one off, right. It's it feels like, you know, this is what we're now seeing on a on a fairly, fairly regular basis this year. 2024, maybe maybe know about jock riches, is starting to come to an end? Well,

Henry Patten  1:22:31

he hasn't been a top 10 player this year. And we're in July. He hasn't played a load of them. But he hasn't been entered as a few of the top 10s in that list that you've just given me and he hasn't been a top 10 player. And that's, you know, it's astonishing that we're in July, and that's the case. He hasn't played loads, admittedly, but that might be part of the reason. So something that I found interesting, and I'm just gonna throw it out there. But I'm not saying this is particularly my opinion, but I think it's worth discussing is this sort of late error of jurkovich Wimbledon where there's there's been this idea that, you know, This solidifies him as the greatest of all time. If you look at his last four Wimbledon titles, in the finals, he's beaten Kevin Anderson, the 39 year old Roger Federer and save save too much points in that berrettini and Nick Kiryas, not a great grasscourt period over the last six or seven years, I'd say. And I think he's kind of just taken advantage of it just by being who he is. But you think that as I'm talking about I think he's 37. Now, Roger Federer was 39 and taking close to peak jurkovich to match point you know, yeah, much point against him. I don't see jockey, which is still being out here in two years. I mean, Match point at Wimbledon. Now I'm

Freddie Nielsen  1:23:45

starting to lose faith in him as well. I mean, last year, the way he was winning, I was just thinking just because it didn't feel like the players chasing him. We're doing enough to challenge him, but the way it looked this year, I'm also starting to think that maybe we have seen the last slam. Well, it is now

Henry Patten  1:24:03

the same age. Just about I think almost exactly the same age as when Federer made that last unbelievable run of you know, he won the he won the Aussie Open against Nadal and had a tough draw and won Wimbledon then when the Aussie Open the year after. And I think that just highlights how ridiculous that was from Federer that Djokovic looks close to being shot now, at that level. But

Freddie Nielsen  1:24:26

also the way Norway plays I mean, he's not going to take three points the same way Roger could when he was on Yeah,

Henry Patten  1:24:32

no, but then again, Federer was like, I think that was one of the reasons why Federer came back so big that he basically said, I'm not slicing any backhand anymore.

Freddie Nielsen  1:24:39

I'm gonna take every backhand on the bounce. I'm not anything.

Henry Patten  1:24:43

And you know, and play like that. And I mean, jocks, which I still don't think can really do that. But it again just highlights how ludicrous that 18 month period of federal was that we got. He won. He won another three slams. Geography which, I mean, it's so difficult to read that we Don't know how serious this injury was, like, you know, he does this thing and he, he plays this sort of card all the time I saw somebody have

Daniel Kiernan  1:25:08

surgery, he didn't have surgery. Do you know from what I understand, I actually, I actually spent a bit random but I spent a lot of time with Nick carry Austria and Wimbledon, really random, but I was using the Indoor Tennis Center. If you're, if you're a male coach of a female player, there's never anywhere for you to go. This has been like a problem that like all the tournaments, the tournaments don't seem to pick it up. So our locker room was the indoor tennis analogue, which actually was really cool because I actually got stuck in there stuck. I was in there with Yannick cynic talking matches, like we, again a fun little story. It was just me and Yannick, just the two of us always quiet. And we were watching the bear ever against Nori, and it was in the third set, tie break. And he just he turned to me, we've been having a bit of a chat and he turned to me and he said to Where's you're going to serve here? And I said, Come on, you tell me. You've got the data. You must have the data on Zverev. Like come on. And I swear to God, he picked five serves in a row at the end of the tiebreaker. He goes, Well, he normally goes t here. It was really cool. And he was he was a delight. And then carry OS was in there a lot. And we were talking every day. And again, carry OS people, people love and people hate him. You know, he brings a certain value in different parts. He was he was a really good guy. We had a lot of chats, you know, reminiscing from juniors to talk about Andy Murray. But we were talking about jurkovich. And he said that he'd had a an INESC as operation and he was absolutely 100% adamant that you do not play tennis to three or four weeks after having he said I was after three or four weeks, I was nowhere near walking properly. Nevermind playing tennis.

Freddie Nielsen  1:26:54

Didn't tell a friend to have surgery after friends.

Daniel Kiernan  1:26:58

But apparently not, again, the word surgery I think's been used. Where shaving, isn't it? There's something but I I spoke to enough people I don't know. I'm not an expert on that. Maybe Nick Kiryas isn't an expert either. He's not my only source on that. But there was there was a lot of people saying there's nowhere that he had an operation that he actually had a surgery. He

Henry Patten  1:27:21

does this he does his loans though. geographies. Remember, like the Australian Open a couple years ago when there was time put it around that he had a six centimeter tear in his hands. Yeah. Anybody who's ever played any sport to any level will know that. It's impossibly not only like, you know, the guy just played through the pain though. It's not just with the hamstring. It's not just playing through the pain, your leg doesn't work without it and you don't have it. It's like trying to drive a car without the brakes. your hamstring is the brakes. You can't run with a 16 centimeter tear. That's absolute waffle. But he has this thing where he's, and I think it plays into all these Ollie's even Okay, Kaylee come out and confirm it. Yeah, it was crazy. And he does this thing. Somebody highlighted it on Twitter. And it was a great thread, but I've been thinking about it myself, are they gonna go through this, this range of going like, I'm injured, I have no chance I can play this. There's zero chance I'm going to be able to play but I'll do my best. I'll do my best. And I'm going to have surgery. But the surgery for this kind of thing. It's going to take six months. And this is only three weeks, but I'll I'm going to see what I'm just going to have it and see where I go. And then I'm turning up at the tournament. I'm turning up to hit but I don't think I'm going to be able to play. I don't think I'm going to be able to play and you know, I'll see I gotta hit I'm gonna play but I have no chance of winning this. And then he'll win and he'll go and once I can't believe these people are doubting me. I can't believe everybody doubted this like a day ago. You were saying you were you were gonna play? What are you talking about? People doubting you. You were telling people don't back mix. I'm not gonna play. And then the weird thing with the weird thing after the runer much. It was absolutely crazy. And the media on that we're interesting because you had John McAfee. They were not booing him. They were shouting room. Yeah, and

Freddie Nielsen  1:29:01

why why would they pick that one particular match to him? Why not? Every other match?

Henry Patten  1:29:06

Yeah. And then McEnroe is gonna you know, well, you know if they are booing him, I think he's right to do that. But no, they weren't booing him. Stone Room rune. But, again, he needs it. And he's, you know, you can go in Easter wind himself up and this kind of thing, but it's just a bit silly in it. It's just a bit silly.

Daniel Kiernan  1:29:22

But but you know, you guys know at that level. The mindset is every kind of how you prepare your mind and how you get into that place. And I guess these are all little tricks of the trade that he's picked up over the years of our positions himself within within, within the psyche of other Grand Slam tennis teams going

Henry Patten  1:29:44

fully nuts there. They'll keynote I don't know whether you saw you guys saw it afterwards in the press conference. Do you see the stuff about like, you just heard him saying that he'd been. This is where you think he's crazy was talking about how he'd been into the Lacoste store in London to see if they were selling this stuff and they weren't selling enough of his stuff so he's got in touch with them the head office and asking them why they're not why they're not selling his tennis shirts in the main liquor store in on Oxford Street or something. Can't you want 25 Simon How are you bothered about whether they're selling your gear in

Daniel Kiernan  1:30:17

your ego ego does funny things to people yeah it's

Henry Patten  1:30:20

phenomenal stuff but yeah I mean Jana tasty drawed in the

Freddie Nielsen  1:30:24

bottom half of the draw was very open.

Henry Patten  1:30:29

Emmys musetti in the seven was said it was that is an interesting one. I think that was said he's one of those players that I would wager now is just this level for the next five years

Daniel Kiernan  1:30:38

when I was shocked TPT threats actually, I was that that much shocked me. And you too, but he was never going to be Joker which no and and the final word has to be on Alcatraz but also sinner. I think Freddie as well at the center, I think was while he was he was genuinely sick going into going into that match. Not to take anything away from Medvedev. But that's the matchup I think we want to see now sinner, sinner Alkire, as we talked about the big three, the Big Four, the big that's the big two that to the next five years, I think is going to win a fair share of the grand slams. And I think Men's Tennis is in pretty good hands with those two characters. And I have to say this being a part of an amazing event and championship like Wimbledon. You get to know players on a very surface level. So you hellos and you may be a bit of eye contact. There wasn't one time that I went anywhere near Carlos Alka Raza Yannick synergy and Wimbledon where they didn't smile, say hello, how you doing? How's your day? The stuff that no one sees? They seem to be to really fantastic. We started with two fantastic genuine people in a hurry, Ali Avara and Henry Patton and I want to end on two fantastic young men who are going to lead our sport on the men single side for for a long time to come.

Freddie Nielsen  1:31:57

Absolutely. And you also have a contrast and temperament. You have a little bit of Fire and Ice Carlos will more outspoken than he is a little more introverted. I will say one thing though, just to highlight the one thing that made me think about sinner when when he was feeling bad is how ridiculous it is that Novak and even Rafa even though he was out more than the others and bracha. How do they stay healthy for that long? How did more tournaments not get affected by this? I mean, it's pretty normal to have fatigue or illness or what Yanik experience petite guys? Well, that just shows that their records is the the amount of tournaments they want is incredible. But yeah, I do. I do think they're in good hands. They're great ambassadors for the sports, obviously very, very respectful people. Maybe that's a good thing. Maybe that's a bad thing. I know. You mentioned carriers. He's been outspoken that he thinks that it's too boring. Now, I personally think that a lot of the guys are a little bit too boring. But but they did their rackets speak. And they're the kind of guys where, you know, if my son was watching tennis, and was aiming to be like that nobody pretty content will say, yeah, that was a really good role models. Well done there. I can't fault them for anything they do. And they play really good tennis in two different contrast. And yeah, I hope they'll they're going to be many more matches. And obviously, I have to say it being from Denmark, and I hope that he's gonna join them because he has a third and a layup to him. And he's gonna I do genuinely, regardless of where I'm from, believe that he can be a big factor in men's tennis and be very interesting for people to watch, because I do think that he's blocked off.

Henry Patten  1:33:34

I think it's an interesting one with that. And I agree with what Freddie said that some of the players are a little bit I don't know, if borings the right word. But I think again, that the agencies and the management companies haven't helped with this. And I say this through two of my best friends are in that industry. And we were in a WhatsApp group last night, just chatting. And one of them said after the speech, because Alcatraz can do with a bit of media training couldn't be, and I was like, What are you talking about guys a superstar. And he's like, it just needs to be a little bit more polished. And I was like, no, no, this is the last thing that any of these young guys need is more media training and to be more polished. Because all that happens when you do that is you end up with everybody the same. They have this sort of model of what they want the player or the athlete to be and they train them to talk and say, and do everything exactly the same coming from that I saw earlier on today. They were saying that the this next year that Netflix is doing the Alcatraz documentary, he's kind of a fly on the wall thing. And I don't know whether anybody saw the quotes from his agent after he won the French because he won the French and then he went on holiday to Ibiza for four days, I think with his mates. And the agent. I mean, my best mate is a is a sports agent. He said he was disgusted with the quote from Alcatraz as Agent where he said like you what really concerns me here is that he's not going to have me there to make sure He's saying the right things when he's away, and if anybody gets any quotes off him, I won't be there to stop the quotes going out. And another thing that concerns me, the thing that concerns me the most is the women. Because these girls are just now DMing him straight, and they're not having to come through me. And I was like, This documentary is going to be dreadful. It's going to be the one of the most boring six hours of footage, because that agent is going to absolutely snaffle anything that is even mildly and I don't even say controversial, mildly controversial. And I think that that's a problem that we have in in tennis and I think in sport in general. I think it's something that we have but again, like a mate said to me he was like when he said that he needs to be more polished. He was like, you know, but you look at Federer though. He was so charismatic. Is Federer charismatic, or was he just really good at tennis? I think he's eloquent and spoke. Well, I don't know if I've ever seen Roger Federer speak and be go like, you know, he's not like, I don't know, he's not Jamie Foxx is he? You know, you sit him down on a talk show and you think, jeez, this guy is eloquent. But I don't think he's charismatic. No, he

Freddie Nielsen  1:36:09

was humble, despite being a genius. Yeah, exactly. Yeah,

Henry Patten  1:36:13

he was a genius on the core. And like I say, he spoke well, he was eloquent, but I wouldn't have him as hugely charismatic, but Alper, as I think has it. I'm like, Keynote says then like, you know, even from two years ago, like he was walking around the ground with a bucket hat on then and you know, every time you see him is still the same now like, he nods and then Australia this year, I quite people know me know, I quite like my trainers. I'm quite into sneakers and that kind of thing. And I had a pair on when we were in Australia this year. He sort of looks down he's nice trainers. And I had like a 22nd chat with him about trainers. I think he's, I've seen him a few he loves. He loves them. Yeah, I think he's quite into himself. And you know, like, I actually didn't see him at this tournament. But the friends, you know, sort of had a look and said, Nice try, but ya know, I mean, and then at the ball last night, he gave his speech. And I thought then that like, you know, because they said they have this, they have this silly thing at the Women's ball where the two winners have to do a dance, they have to do that. And he's only 20 seconds, you seek Rijeka was a little bit awkward. And Carlos kind of like, pulled a few moves out and kind of led it and I thought, yeah, this kid's a superstar. Like, you know, we're talking about need some media training. zero chance this kid needs any media training. And I agree more. I hope it doesn't go that way. It's

Daniel Kiernan  1:37:29

it's a good place to end guys. And I want to end on I don't know what your DMS have been like gals over the last over the last few weeks from the from the women. Now that you're the last the last few hours now that you are a Wimbledon champion coach, you know, and that's, that's not no mean feat. It's very, very well deserved.

Henry Patten  1:37:49

And I mean, as a single lad, who got again, 280 messages on Sunday morning, zero from women have any facts on that for? Well,

Daniel Kiernan  1:38:02

it might have BBC just got their camera on you a little bit. Then it might be possible. But my final words, for you, Calvin and the boys. A big congrats, I've I've said it to you personally, but I mean it and I said on the podcast, I'm absolutely over the moon for you guys, and very, very well deserved. As ever, guys, thank you for your time. And we move on Paris Olympics next. And then we'll be back to talk about US Open beef before long as well. So a big, big thank you to you both for your time.

1:38:33

Thanks, Jason.

Daniel Kiernan  1:38:37

So there we have it, a brilliant episode. And as ever, I could speak to Calvin and Freddie about tennis all day, every day. Two great tennis minds two amazingly passionate guys. And just so happy for what Calvin and his team achieved. And how cool was that to have Henry Patton and Harry le Avara carbon, talk to us. So soon after their Wimbledon triumph on Saturday, less than 48 hours later, they're talking to control the controllables. And we're getting that raw motion coming through. And that was a real treat for me, you know, to players that I have strong personal relationships with are very lucky to work with Harry throughout 2023. And also, this was a partnership that I had no doubt was going to work. I tried to get them together at the end of 2023. But then eventually, after a couple of months of 2024 They took the plunge and went into the partnership and just for me, it shows into personal relationships, connections. It's what life is about in whatever form it is, whether it's a tennis coach player relationship, whether it's a doubles partnership, whether it's a business partner, whether it's something else in another world, or just your own personal relationships, you know, getting that communication strong, and having that strong alignment with the valid use magic and can truly truly happen and that's what I take from this year's Wimbledon. As with Greg Allen, and Alfie, you it. That's happened for so many so many years and Juan Carlos Ferreira and Carlos Alvarez, the same you know, these relationships is where great things happen and that's where I'm going to leave you for this time. But we will be back we got more lined up over the next few weeks or Look out for more, but until then, I'm Dan Kiernan, we are control the controllables