Karen Dittman On Faith, Family & Beating Life’s Biggest Trials

Rich & Wendy 0:00
Hey, everyone is Rich Bennett. Can you believe it? The show is turning ten this year. I am so grateful for each and every one of you who've tuned in, shared an episode, or even joined the conversation over the years. You're the reason that this podcast has grown into what it is today. Together, we shared laughs, tears and moments that truly matter. So I want to thank you for being part of this journey. Let's make the next ten years even better. Coming to you from the Freedom Federal Credit Union Studios. Harford County Living presents conversations with Rich Bennett. 

Today, I'm going to get kind. 

No, no, no. The truth is. 

Rich Bennett 1:00
Today on Conversations with Rich Bennett. We have an incredible guest joining us, Karen Pittman. Karen is an author, speaker and wellness advocate who has spent more than 25 years navigating the five big A's. Your rewrite, the five big A's. And I know what you're saying, Rich. What in the world are the five big A's adoption anxiety, ADHD, autism and addiction while raising her children and even stepping into the role of parenting a grandchild? She and her husband, Michael co author Thrive in and Grace Unleashing Wellness from a biblical perspective. Well, read it lips here. A book that explores how we can move beyond simply surviving life's challenges to truly thrive and through faith, grace and wellness. Karen's journey has been one of resilience, transformation and learning how to find peace in all the chaos around us. Today, she's here to share her insights, her experience says, and how we can all step into a life of greater wellness no matter what we're facing. And before I get to Karen, those of you listening, do me a favor, because it's one of the first things I'm going to ask her before you get into the book. Good. Karen did Mint.com, That's DIY man. Karen Dedmon dot com. So when I bring up the one question, you'll know what I'm talking about. I said, Hey, you don't care. 

Karen Dittman 2:29
Good. And let me just real quick, It's actually Karen, a debt mint.com. 

Rich Bennett 2:34
Oh, I did, miss. I did not. 

Karen Dittman 2:35
Yeah, because if you go to Karen, ditto Incom, you'll find an artist in Texas who has beautiful work. But it's not me. 

Rich Bennett 2:42
So you don't want to. You won't care. And Ed.MSNBC.com. 

Karen Dittman 2:44
Yes. 

Rich Bennett 2:46
Wow. I'm glad you pointed that out. 

Karen Dittman 2:48
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 2:48
I see. This is what I for not wearing my glasses. 

So before we get into the book and the big question I want to ask you about your website. Tell a little bit about Karen, which I know is also in the book, 

Karen Dittman 3:06
Yes. Yes. So, yeah, there's a lot of stories about me and my life in 

Rich Bennett 3:11
Right. 

Karen Dittman 3:11
the book and other people who have shared their stories with me. But yeah, I am a mom in my fifties and a grandmother. I actually grew up in Maryland, not far from where you are, rich. I have I have three kids who are actually my kids. When people ask me, How many kids do you have, I often say, Well, it depends how you count. 

Rich Bennett 3:39
Amy, do you consider Michael as one of the kids to. 

Karen Dittman 3:41
No, no. He is very, very adult and very self-sufficient. So he is not considered one of the kids. But now I have two kids who are in their mid-twenties now. We adopted them as babies. I have surprise, surprise, I got pregnant in my mid-forties and now I have a ten year old. 

Rich Bennett 4:01
I saw that on your website. I'm like, No. What? 

Karen Dittman 4:05
Yeah. Yeah. We're that family. That family. Adopted kids. We were sure we were done. I mean, my kids were 13 and 15. And guess what? Mom's having a baby now was. 

Rich Bennett 4:20
Before you go further, I have to ask with with both you and your are those of you listen, Michael is her husband. What was when you found out? What was your first reaction? 

Karen Dittman 4:33
Well, the reality is he suspected before I did. We had been on vacation in the summer. I was like, I'm just not feeling great. I'm run down like you guys made me eat ice cream every day. So I just. I just not feeling great. And and so and so. Then one day he looked to me is like, Do you think maybe you should take a pregnancy test? And I said, No. No, 

Rich Bennett 5:00
The. 

Karen Dittman 5:00
he said. Are you sure? I was like, Okay, fine. Let's just set your mind at ease. You can run over to the store. I was just down the road. Grab a pregnancy test, I'll take it, and then we'll move on with life. And so I see that they come up positive, like, Oh, my God, I was. 

Rich Bennett 5:16
Tell them to go get another one and take it again. 

Karen Dittman 5:18
Well, I think it might have even been a two pack, but I wasn't so much shock. But it was also just so much joy and delight. Our younger child at the time, our daughter was like she had always wanted us to adopt more kids. She was hoping and praying that we would add to our family. And when we told her, No, God's not leading us to adopt again, we've really seriously thought about this and God has said no. And so we told her, This is the answer to your prayers, girl. So yeah. 

Rich Bennett 5:53
God surprised us to. 

Karen Dittman 5:54
Yes. Yes. Yes. 

Rich Bennett 5:56
That is amazing. I mean, with and you're hearing more of it today that, you know, women in their forties are getting pregnant because before it was unheard of. But were you scared at all? 

Karen Dittman 6:09
I was. I mean, there are very reasonable and normal fears that can come up with a pregnancy in your mid-forties. And especially having never been pregnant before, I didn't know what to expect. And there was one day my husband was looking at some stuff online and said, Do you want to see what I'm hearing about 

about, you know, pregnancy over 45? I was like, No, no, I don't. And he said, Oh, wait, I have to tell you this one thing. It's okay. What said All of the experts are saying it is virtually impossible for a woman over 45 to be pregnant with her own eggs. When you hear about it with celebrities, it's always with donor eggs or something like that. I'm like, Well, God has done something different here. It is a miracle and absolute miracle of the experts say it's impossible. The expert said it was impossible for us to get pregnant in the first place. So. 

Rich Bennett 7:03
That's amazing. 

Karen Dittman 7:04
So it's a good thing. 

Rich Bennett 7:06
Wow. Okay, now. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. Go ahead. 

Karen Dittman 7:08
Yeah. So. Yeah. So anyway, so we've got the three kids. I have a six year old granddaughter that we're raising. I have another three year old granddaughter who calls me Mom. For a while we had a teenage foster daughter. So, you know, technically I have three kids and two grandkids, but there have been as many as what, six people have called me mom. So. 

Rich Bennett 7:31
Wow. 

Karen Dittman 7:31
Yeah. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 7:33
I've never had that habit. I just had. Kids call me uncle, but never mommy. Well, of course. 

Karen Dittman 7:37
Well, I hope not. 

Rich Bennett 7:38
Dad. 

Okay, So up something with your website. 

Karen Dittman 7:43
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 7:44
I have to ask you this. The hamster wheel. How fast is your hamster wheel spinning? Explain that. 

Karen Dittman 7:52
Yes. Well, you know, as mom, grandma, building a business, writing, looking, you know, building a speaking career, all of this, there's just so much going on in my life. And I know that there are a lot of especially moms who are like trying to balance everything and like, you feel like I got on this hamster wheel and it's spinning and spinning and spinning and I want to get off, but it won't stop. And how do I find relief when I am stuck on this hamster wheel? A lot of us and we always think, Oh, I just need to get a break. I need to get off so that I can have some self-care. But what I am learning, what God has shown me is he is there with me on the hamster wheel. So I've got that quiz. How fast is your hamster wheel spinning? That's on my website. And it's just designed to help you identify what's going on. Do I already have some habits that are helping me with finding some relief while it's still spinning? Or do I need to try to find it to do something different? But for me, I found God met me on the hamster wheel instead of telling me we're going to stop it and you can get off. 

Rich Bennett 9:09
So I'm going to everybody make sure you take that. I'm going to try it. 

Karen Dittman 9:13
Thank you. 

Rich Bennett 9:14
Yeah, I know. 

Not. But your website, I mean, is great because you have, you know, devotionals on there, meditation. What else am I seeing there? 

see a blog? 

Karen Dittman 9:33
I don't. 

Rich Bennett 9:33
No. Okay. The interviews and teaching links. 

Karen Dittman 9:36
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 9:36
Okay. Which is great. But you don't do your own podcast. Do you? 

Karen Dittman 9:42
Not yet. It's kind. Not yet. I see eyes lighting up. 

Rich Bennett 9:49
Yes. Tell us more here. What do you mean? 

Karen Dittman 9:51
Yeah. So, you know, right now I got some other things in the works. Right now I am working on a because February is Heart Health Month. I'm looking at how do we care for our hearts in like the spiritual emotional sense and planning a three day thriving on the hamster wheel challenge that's focusing on ways to to really care for our hearts. 

Rich Bennett 10:17
Really? 

Karen Dittman 10:18
Yeah. And then that's coming up Lent leading to Easter. So March, April, I'm going to be putting out some content related to Lent. Calling it letting go for Lent and just, you know, what are the things you know, we always think of Lent, especially if you've grown up like in the Catholic or maybe even Orthodox tradition you think of, I'm going to sacrifice something, I'm going to give up something for Lent. But what if, instead of thinking about taking away, you know, my chocolate or my indulgence, what if I think about letting go something that is in the way of me really connecting with God in my life? What if I give up? You know, what if for Lent, I let go of what I call panic prayers. You know, like, things are going crazy. I'm like, Oh, help. What if for Lent, I give up 

my. 

My anxiety? 

Rich Bennett 11:17
Ooh, I like that. 

Karen Dittman 11:18
You know, so things like, you know, what if for Lent, I actually take a look at what is under my fears. And instead of just letting my brain spin with the what ifs, I surrender to God with the even if's. 

Rich Bennett 11:35
Oh. 

Karen Dittman 11:36
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 11:37
So how could people find out about this challenge? 

Karen Dittman 11:40
Yeah. So through my the quiz on my website, there's a way to sign up for that. Thriving on the Hamster Wheel Challenge. 

Rich Bennett 11:49
Okay. 

Karen Dittman 11:50
And then also you'll get on my email list, so I'll be able to send you information about Lent and I'm planning to keep updating the website with some of this content too, so that people will be able to find links to join this. All of these. 

Rich Bennett 12:06
Okay. So crazy. Well, it's not a crazy question with your email as well. Yeah, we'll getting into the book here. 

Karen Dittman 12:14
That's okay. 

Rich Bennett 12:15
But with your email, it's because I think it's important. I think a lot of people missed the boat when they'll ask for subscribers to an email list, but they never sent an email. We're not. Any plans on. Also, unless you're already doing it like morning prayers or anything. 

Karen Dittman 12:31
Oh, that's a good idea. What I try to do is a just a weekly Monday message, I call it. 

Rich Bennett 12:39
Just good to. 

Karen Dittman 12:40
Yeah, just sending out just sort of some thoughts to be aware of, you know, things that God has brought to my mind that I will bring out and just, you know, share with people what's going on and what I'm thinking about and hopefully inspire them to to grow closer to God themselves. 

Rich Bennett 13:00
Mm hmm. 

Karen Dittman 13:01
And of course, when I am selling something was, you know, having as having a business, I will do occasionally, 

Rich Bennett 13:06
Yeah. 

Karen Dittman 13:07
you know, there will be like the Black Friday's Friday special or if I've got a sale on something or if there's something coming up, I will put out, you know, some opportunities. But it's I don't look at my email list as people that I'm trying to sell stuff to. 

Rich Bennett 13:21
Right. 

Karen Dittman 13:22
I look at my email list as people that I'm trying to serve and just 

Rich Bennett 13:25
Yeah. 

Karen Dittman 13:26
inspire them in their lives. 

Rich Bennett 13:27
Which is good. Yeah. So everything you just mentioned there is that would you when not if when you start your podcast, is that what the focus is going to be as well. 

Karen Dittman 13:39
Yes. So the podcast plan and this'll lead us back in to talking more about the book, I think. So the plan for the podcast is actually to start walking through some of the things that are in the book to help people understand the grief cycle that's in the book, to help people understand what it looks like to find, to move, not necessarily fine, but to move closer to wellness 

Rich Bennett 14:01
Uh huh. 

Karen Dittman 14:01
in the seven areas of our lives that we wrote about in the book. So I've got this plan laid out and I will probably mostly record my own things for the podcast and then a few. 

Rich Bennett 14:13
Right. 

Karen Dittman 14:14
Bring in an expert or somebody who can speak to some of these different areas to. 

Rich Bennett 14:19
I was nearing there thinking, I know when you start it that that will take all very well. 

Karen Dittman 14:26
Thank. 

Rich Bennett 14:27
Very well. And if there's if you guys have any questions, any help with anything. Feel free to reach out to me. I'm all I always love helping other podcasters. 

Karen Dittman 14:37
Great. Thank you, Rich. 

Rich Bennett 14:38
I do not charge for that. I consider myself like a mentor. I. 

Karen Dittman 14:42
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 14:43
I feel if I see a podcaster succeed and I help them, that's my reward to see them succeed. Okay, so the book. Because this is what your second book. Okay. 

Karen Dittman 14:56
It is the second book. Yeah, the first book was our co covered project. So. 

Rich Bennett 15:01
That was written during COVID. 

Karen Dittman 15:02
It was written during COVID. Yes. Yes. 

Rich Bennett 15:05
And that was the fruit of gratitude, Right? 

Karen Dittman 15:07
The fruit of gratitude. Yeah. So my husband, part of our story that I share a lot is that right at the beginning of the whole pandemic and lockdowns, he got sick with COVID 

Rich Bennett 15:20
Oh. 

Karen Dittman 15:20
and he got sick in this really exciting window between when you could get a test and when you could get a test only if you were dying in the hospital. So but we had to 

Rich Bennett 15:32
Karen, 

Karen Dittman 15:32
he talked 

Rich Bennett 15:33
I 

Karen Dittman 15:33
to the. 

Rich Bennett 15:33
have to admit, I've never heard those two words put together COVID an exciting window. 

Karen Dittman 15:39
Yeah, I use it ironically. Right. 

But he talked. He had two doctors who confirmed you've got all of the symptoms. This is clearly COVID. But he got sick. And the way his body responded, he went through six weeks of feeling horrible for several days and then started to feel better and, oh, maybe I'm better. And then he would like go out for a walk and the next day he's down again. 

Rich Bennett 16:06
Wow. 

Karen Dittman 16:06
He'd be sick for a few days and then start to feel better. And maybe I'm over this. Great. And then boom, it hits. So for six weeks, he was at home working from home. And one day he said, You know, as long as I got this extra time while I'm at home, is there anything I can do to help you with your business? And I said, Well, I really would love to write a gratitude journal and but I don't want to be just a typical journal that's like, list all the things you're thankful for. I want to know what the Bible teaches about gratitude. And that just lit him up because he's the kind of guy who, if you ask him, what does the Bible say about fill in the blank. He. 

Rich Bennett 16:50
Uh huh. 

Karen Dittman 16:51
Dig up everything on that subject and then organize it and synthesize it. So he did all of the study and dug out these verses, and then we together like put it together into the journal and we kind of organized. So it's a very simple journal. Each day for six weeks you've got a scripture passage and a time to just pause and meditate, and then a question that may or may not speak to you, but you can 

Rich Bennett 17:19
Right. 

Karen Dittman 17:19
write whatever you want in the journal because it's your journal, right? So yeah, so there's six weeks of scriptures and it doesn't start with the Bible says be thankful. So you should be thankful. It starts with experi ence, God's love experiences, goodness in your life. And then very naturally and organically, the gratitude grows from our connection with God. 

Rich Bennett 17:44
So those of you listening, that means you have to purchase both books. Not just thriving in Grey's, but the other one as well, which I know you're going to love that as well. So I mean, it's written during COVID. Wow. And I love the title, The Fruit of Gratitude. 

Karen Dittman 18:02
Mm hmm. 

Rich Bennett 18:03
So how did you guys come up with that title? 

Karen Dittman 18:05
I think we came up with it as we were doing the studying and we began to realize that gratitude is a natural fruit of our relationship with God. 

Rich Bennett 18:19
What about thriving in Greece? 

Karen Dittman 18:21
Yeah. How do we come up with the title or just talk? 

Rich Bennett 18:23
Yeah. How do you go about the title first? 

Karen Dittman 18:26
Yeah. And originally that one was titled Survive and Thrive because we were in a place where we were feeling like we were in survival mode, but we were trying to also thrive and trying to experience, you know, all of the things that we had learned as we worked on. And we have gone through these books ourselves. Haven't just written them. We have lived them. In fact, I've got the fruit of gratitude sitting by my bedside table and I'm working through it again even now. So it's something that is just completely it's changed our lives. So as we were going through the surviving but through a really hard season in our lives, we I had somebody say to me, You're not just surviving, though. You're also thriving in this. And I was like, Yeah, But I kind of felt like, you know, that's kind of a very. 

I don't know. I want to say almost a trite kind of phrase. So I started 

Rich Bennett 19:21
Yeah. 

Karen Dittman 19:22
just kind of getting some other ideas and brainstorming. And so came up with several titles and people really liked that one. So that's what we went with. 

Rich Bennett 19:33
Okay. So this survival that you were going through is that when you started writing the book? 

Karen Dittman 19:38
Yeah, it was it started we started writing that book in November of 20. 

Rich Bennett 19:44
Oh, I. 

Karen Dittman 19:44
And so 2020 for us wasn't just pandemic COVID sickness lockdowns. It was a lot of the other you know, I've talked about, you know, you already mentioned the fives, the anxiety. 

Rich Bennett 19:58
Right. 

Karen Dittman 19:59
That was coming up in our daughter, who was now. Oh, gosh. So she was 19 at the time. 

Rich Bennett 20:08
School. 

Karen Dittman 20:09
Hmm. Yeah. Am. 

Rich Bennett 20:11
It's still in a school and they took school away from her. 

Karen Dittman 20:13
So. Well, so she was out of school, but. 

Rich Bennett 20:16
Oh, okay. 

Karen Dittman 20:17
My kindergartener at the time came home for spring break and never went back. And then when she did go back in the fall because she was going to a Christian school and they were like, we're going to reopen. But to keep everybody safe, we'll have a no symptoms policy. So you get a runny nose, You can't go to school. 

Rich Bennett 20:37
She's. 

Karen Dittman 20:38
You get a cold and you get over it, but you still have that lingering cough. You can't go to school and all of these things. And then she was also battling just enough anxiety through her, you know, with school and some social things. 

Rich Bennett 20:57
Yeah. 

Karen Dittman 20:57
That then we would be driving up to school and she says, My stomach hurts. And it's an anxiety response. She's not sick. She walks into that school and tells her teacher, My stomach hurts. They're telling me to come back and pick her up. 

Rich Bennett 21:12
Yeah. 

Karen Dittman 21:12
So, you know, so it's just so that fall was so hard for her with school because she missed easily half of the semester. So I pulled her out in after December and started homeschooling her. But yeah, so we had her and the school struggles. We had my older daughter was really dealing with anxiety and she was also in an abusive relationship at the time. 

Rich Bennett 21:42
At 19. 

Karen Dittman 21:43
At 19. Yes. 

Rich Bennett 21:44
She. 

Karen Dittman 21:45
Yes. 

And her boyfriend was like, 

Rich Bennett 21:50
Mm 

Karen Dittman 21:50
you know, 

Rich Bennett 21:51
hmm. 

Karen Dittman 21:51
she and her boyfriend were both like, paying way too too much attention to all of the wrong news. And so they were like, afraid, you know, a helicopter flies over and they're like, is the you know, are we having war? Is what's going on? Is the military coming to lock us down? You know, and it was 20, 20. I mean, none of this had ever happened in any of our lives. We had nothing. To prepare us. So we had no way to know what could happen. So anyway, so her anxiety and then. 

Rich Bennett 22:25
Oh. 

Karen Dittman 22:25
With the relationship. Her boyfriend was started using drugs and drew her into that addiction. 

Rich Bennett 22:35
Oh, God. 

Karen Dittman 22:35
So as we're in this, you know, we had started writing Thriving in Grace and. Things were hard enough and they just kind of kept spiraling downward until the point where one day, the following summer and we didn't know that they were using drugs together, we they were really, really good at hiding what was going on. 

Rich Bennett 22:57
Lot of them are. 

Karen Dittman 22:59
Yeah, they are. They are. And very you know, and an addict is going to be extremely manipulative to get what they want. And that's all they know to do because the addiction is driving them. 

Rich Bennett 23:11
Yes. 

Karen Dittman 23:12
Right? Yeah. So that summer, she there was a day that she said to us it was right after her daughter turned three and she said, Hey, can you watch my daughter overnight? I'm just going to go out with some girlfriends, going to spend the night at the hotel. We're like, okay, sure, that's fine. And then she didn't come back. 

Rich Bennett 23:30
White. 

Karen Dittman 23:30
And yeah, she just, you know, days later, you know, she's texting and she starts texting every few days to maybe every week or so, like, Yeah, yeah, I'm coming back. But we didn't know when we discovered we, we had discovered that her boyfriend was using drugs at our house and we told him, You are not welcome to come back. 

Rich Bennett 23:49
Oh. 

Karen Dittman 23:51
And we didn't know that she was also using drugs. So she followed him and she went with him. And they were, you know, living on the streets in. Yeah. Outside of Dan. 

Rich Bennett 24:06
But you still had the baby, right? 

Karen Dittman 24:07
But yeah, 

Rich Bennett 24:08
Good. 

Karen Dittman 24:08
but we had, we had her daughter 

Rich Bennett 24:09
Mm. 

Karen Dittman 24:10
and she always, you know, through this whole process, she was willing to let us file for guardianship. She knew it was in her daughter's best interest to stay with us. She did not try to take her daughter with us, which is such a blessing because. 

Rich Bennett 24:27
There. 

Karen Dittman 24:28
You know, terrible things could have happened to that sweet little girl. 

Yeah. So she eventually did come back a couple of months later and came clean and told us the whole thing that happened, asked us to help her to get into rehab. And at that point. 

There's this whole rehab relapse cycle that happens. 

Rich Bennett 24:48
Yeah. 

Karen Dittman 24:49
So unfortunately, she wasn't able to get and stay clean at that point. She since has totally 

Rich Bennett 24:57
Good. 

Karen Dittman 24:57
by the grace of God. But so we're writing the book and I'm dealing with now I've got another child in my home that I have to take. 

Rich Bennett 25:04
Mm hmm. 

Karen Dittman 25:05
And home homeschooling a first grader now. And I think she was even going into second grade at that point. So home schooling, raising my granddaughter. All of the fears and anxieties over what is going on with my daughter because I'm like. 

Rich Bennett 25:23
God was really testing you. 

Karen Dittman 25:24
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean. 

Rich Bennett 25:26
Wow. 

Karen Dittman 25:27
You know, she walks away and says she's spending the night at a hotel and then she doesn't come back. I'm like, She's been trafficked. Oh, my gosh. She's been trafficked. And, you know, and so what can I do to help her? How can I get her out? How can I rescue her? And so all of this stuff. So it was just so crazy that season. 

Rich Bennett 25:47
So when you were going through all this. 

Did you lose faith at all? 

Karen Dittman 25:54
You know, I didn't. 

Rich Bennett 25:56
That's good. 

Karen Dittman 25:57
Yeah. Yeah, I. 

Rich Bennett 25:59
Would have. 

Karen Dittman 26:00
Yeah, I was really, really blessed to be surrounded by some other women who had walked through addiction with other family members, not necessarily a child, but other family members. So there were other people in my life who got it and reached out 

Rich Bennett 26:15
Right? 

Karen Dittman 26:15
to me and supported me and said, you know, whatever you need, if you need us to pray, if you need us, you know, just to talk or whatever, just give us a call or give us a text. I actually formed like a little text group with my friends, and so that was really helpful through it all. And I think at that point I knew through so many things I'd been through in my life anyway, 

Rich Bennett 26:41
Yeah. 

Karen Dittman 26:41
that God, when we go through these hard things, it doesn't mean that God's walked away from me. 

Rich Bennett 26:48
Right. 

Karen Dittman 26:49
It means that God is in it with me. I mean, Jesus suffered on the cross. He knows our God is a God of redemption. 

There were times when I would say I could not for myself hold on to hope for my daughter's recovery. 

Rich Bennett 27:08
Mm hmm. 

Karen Dittman 27:08
And I leaned on other people to be praying for her and to hold on to that hope, because if I kept holding on to it, I couldn't. Let myself be disappointed yet one more time. So I had to let go of that hope. But. 

Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 27:27
Which is good. The faith was strong. But as far as how is everything between you and Michael, because that's a that's a lot on a couple. 

Karen Dittman 27:34
It is. It is. And that's one of those other things when you have especially a child, an addiction. 

Rich Bennett 27:40
Yeah. 

Karen Dittman 27:41
You know, if you ask them, of course, they don't want to destroy their parents marriage, but the way they're behaving to get what they want and what they feel they need, they will come in the middle and try to. So we really were very aware of that potential. We stood strong. And it got to the point where I had to say. 

I had to be aware. And we were working with a therapist for a while too, who supports families who are going through addiction or who have a loved one who's addicted. And so I had to say, I am aware that everything I keep doing to try to help is not helping. It's enabling. And so I took everything and I just handed it to him. I said, You be the one to communicate with her. You be the one to you know, if she's calling somebody just because she wants a ride somewhere, she talks to you, not me. In all of this, I just had to just say, talk to Dad, talk to Dad. And so that was really good because it gave him the place to step up. Not that he hadn't stepped up before. I don't want to 

Rich Bennett 28:52
Right. 

Karen Dittman 28:52
say. But it gave him the place to step in front of me and make sure that we weren't just continuing to enable her addiction, but that we were 

pushing her into the place where she needed to be so that she could. You know, they say that an addict has to hit rock bottom, and it's awfully hard as a mom to watch your child when you think you know what rock bottom is, but it's actually lower than that. 

Rich Bennett 29:24
Yeah. 

Karen Dittman 29:26
And so yeah, so she's so, you know it gave me the freedom to, to turn and focus on the two young girls in my home 

Rich Bennett 29:34
Good. 

Karen Dittman 29:34
and not have my attention drawn away from them anymore. So it was actually our marriage was stayed strong. 

Rich Bennett 29:40
Good. 

Karen Dittman 29:40
Of that. Yeah, 

Rich Bennett 29:41
The thing is, a lot of times when somebody is an enabler and an addict, they don't realize they are an enabler, that 

Karen Dittman 29:49
right. 

Rich Bennett 29:49
they are doing that. 

Karen Dittman 29:51
Right. 

Rich Bennett 29:51
You know, it's sometimes it may be somebody else step in and say, you realize what you're doing, and then you really then your mind opens up, say, oh, wow, you're right. You know, and it's addiction. Addiction is a 

it's. Well, of course, it's very dangerous. But every body is different. You know, because you hear about a lot of people who do the tough love and it doesn't work all the time. 

Karen Dittman 30:23
Right. 

Rich Bennett 30:23
You know, you hear about, of course, enabling and all that and rehab. Yeah, there's rehab. It's not always going to work the first time. 

Karen Dittman 30:34
Right. For most people, it doesn't. 

Rich Bennett 30:36
For most people, it doesn't 

Karen Dittman 30:38
Right. 

Rich Bennett 30:38
knock on wood. Some some people does. 

Karen Dittman 30:41
Hmm. 

Rich Bennett 30:41
And you hear the term cold turkey, too cold turkey 

nowadays. I don't believe in it. 

Karen Dittman 30:49
Hmm. Hmm. 

Rich Bennett 30:50
Because of all the different drugs out there, especially fentanyl. Yeah, 

Karen Dittman 30:54
Hmm. Hmm. 

Rich Bennett 30:54
it's. Yeah, it's kind of hard to go cold turkey. Okay, so during all this, it's 2020. You guys are working on the book. 

Karen Dittman 31:03
Yeah. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 31:04
Together. 

Karen Dittman 31:05
2021. Mostly he did the background Bible study and 

Rich Bennett 31:10
Okay. 

Karen Dittman 31:10
he formulated a lot of the principles that are in the book. And then I was the one putting the words on the paper 

Rich Bennett 31:18
Okay. 

Karen Dittman 31:19
or, you know, not on paper, literally, but on the screen anyway. 

Rich Bennett 31:23
Some people still use paper cans. 

Karen Dittman 31:25
Yes, I know. I even only put one space after my periods now and. 

That just feels so non. Gen-X. 

Rich Bennett 31:36
I actually talked to an author the other day, still writes on paper 

Karen Dittman 31:40
Hmm. 

Rich Bennett 31:40
to this 

Karen Dittman 31:40
Wow. 

Rich Bennett 31:41
day and then converts it over to. Computers are. Wow. You're listening in on the conversations with Rich Bennett. We'll be right back. 

Are you looking for a place where voices from all over the world come together? Well, look no further than the Chesapeake podcast. We've got podcasts in every genre, from comedy to health interviews to news. There's something for everyone. And for all you podcasters out there, it's free to join. Plus, we're more than just a network. We host monthly virtual networking meetings where you can connect, collaborate and grow with fellow creators. So sign up today at Chesapeake Podcast Network AECOM and get ready to join a global community. So in the book, it's it's not 

guess in a way it's a guide book. But you're also telling the stories in there about what was going on for you guys. 

Karen Dittman 32:44
Right. Right. So. 

Rich Bennett 32:45
And you mentioned all these levels. Explain these levels. 

Karen Dittman 32:51
Tell me what you're asking about the. 

Rich Bennett 32:53
Okay, so you are. Let's start from the beginning. The. The miracle approach you got, you know, bearer of the curiosity. Curiosity? Man, I am not speaking right today. Connection in Greece. 

Karen Dittman 33:09
Right. Right. 

Rich Bennett 33:10
So go over those for first and then we'll go into the seven elements of wellness. 

Karen Dittman 33:15
Okay. Yeah. So para is a Hebrew word. It's actually the word used in Genesis one one. In the beginning, God created the heavens and the earth. 

It is used throughout the Old Testament in a sense of emptying something so that it can be filled with something like the Israelites when they didn't have enough space. They were told to clear land to create space so you can build homes. So the concept that we teach in there is 

emptying ourselves of things that are holding us back, things that are in the way so that we're making space for God to fill us with what is good. So it's kind of a foundational principle. 

Rich Bennett 34:05
Right. 

Karen Dittman 34:05
Curiosity and connection are two really important tools that we need to use to 

just enter into change transformation in our lives. If we're not curious, if we're not aware of what's going on inside, then we can't. We can't know what needs to change. We can't know how we respond to things that we try. We've got to be continually engaging. Our curiosity as we're trying to make changes in life. Connection is the importance of being connected to myself, to God, and to others for support. And then. 

Rich Bennett 34:42
Which comes first with connection. 

Karen Dittman 34:45
Hmm. I don't know that one necessarily comes first. They're all important. 

Yeah, but, you know, and some of us, I think might struggle with different ones like. 

Rich Bennett 34:57
Yeah. Oh, yeah. 

Karen Dittman 34:58
Some might struggle with the internal connection with myself and understanding what's going on and being aware, but be surrounded by other people. Some of us might be very intuitive, very in tune with ourselves, very connected with God and be pushing others away, or just not have others in our lives that are supporting us. So I 

Rich Bennett 35:18
Right. 

Karen Dittman 35:18
think. A matter of and curiosity and connection kind of go hand in hand. So. 

Rich Bennett 35:23
Yeah. 

Karen Dittman 35:24
We've got to be curious about that, too. 

Rich Bennett 35:27
I love that. And my favorite, which is my daughter's name. Grace. 

Karen Dittman 35:32
Grace. Yeah. 

Yes. Grace is actually my two granddaughters. Middle names. 

Rich Bennett 35:39
Really? 

Karen Dittman 35:40
Yes. 

Rich Bennett 35:41
Oh, wow. Okay. I got to tell my 

Karen Dittman 35:44
It 

Rich Bennett 35:44
daughter 

Karen Dittman 35:44
has. 

Rich Bennett 35:44
that I was talking to somebody. I had two other graces. That's become a common name lately, too. 

Karen Dittman 35:50
Yeah. It was also my grandmother, my grandmother's middle name, and. 

Rich Bennett 35:54
Really? 

Karen Dittman 35:54
And so my like my nieces and nephews might not in my nephews, but several of my nieces have got the middle name Grace. And yeah, so it's kind of. 

Rich Bennett 36:06
So. 

Karen Dittman 36:06
Anyway. 

Rich Bennett 36:07
Anybody in the family? Anybody in the family named Grace think that they that you wrote the book about them? It's 

Karen Dittman 36:13
Nobody has said that. Yeah. No. No, I haven't heard. 

Rich Bennett 36:18
I would have. 

Karen Dittman 36:19
Yeah. So. 

Rich Bennett 36:21
Thanks for writing this about. Sorry. Go ahead. 

Karen Dittman 36:25
Yeah. 

So the the idea of grace is I did I in this one, I actually did the study like I looked at the word grace throughout the Bible. And then I went back Michael's like, am I getting this wrong or am I onto something? Because what I what I saw and when you look at the entire Bible, not just Paul's letters, which is where we usually get this definition, that grace is God's gift of salvation to those of us who don't deserve it. I've understood Grace is so much more, and I outline it all in the book, so I won't go into all of the details. But the grace is how God is working in the world. Overcoming impossible obstacles, overcoming the boundaries so that He can accomplish his good purposes. So of course that includes includes salvation. But when we limit this understanding of grace to only salvation and only this gift of salvation, we're doing God and ourselves a disservice because God's grace is so much more. It is, you know, by God's grace, I got pregnant at 45, you know, by God's grace or 46, even by God's grace, all of the things that are humanly impossible are the things that he does in the world. 

Rich Bennett 37:54
There. 

Karen Dittman 37:56
So it's it's just a beautiful understanding that just opens up my understanding of God and how he's at work in the world and in my life. So, you know, the things that are impossible for me to change when I surrender, when I invite him and his grace in, that's when I can let go. I mean, it is totally by God's grace that my daughter is off of drugs and healthy. 

Rich Bennett 38:26
And recovery here. 

Karen Dittman 38:27
Covered. 

Rich Bennett 38:29
With that today, especially with a lot of people. Why do you suppose they are hesitant to invite God in? 

Karen Dittman 38:43
Well, I think that a lot of people are hesitant to invite God in 

because here's here's where I think there's a big, big problem in Christianity. We have been saying for decades, it's not a religion, it's a relationship. And then people say, okay, I'll buy into that, and then we treat it like a religion. 

Rich Bennett 39:09
Oh. 

Karen Dittman 39:10
Okay, here's what you do now. God, Jesus saved you. So now you turn around and you serve him. And you give him your life. And you do everything you can to show God how grateful you are for that salvation. 

Rich Bennett 39:26
Wow. 

Karen Dittman 39:27
If I got married to my husband and I turned around and I said, Oh, he was so kind to marry me and provide for me and give me a home. So I am going to spend my life cleaning his house and serving him meals and taking care of all of the things and just serving him. That's not a relationship. 

Rich Bennett 39:53
No. 

Karen Dittman 39:54
We are not engaging in relationship that is transactional. But the way we have approached Christianity is transactional. If God did this for me, so I need to spend my life working to pay him back, which I can never do anyway. So I've just got to keep giving back and giving back and giving back. 

Rich Bennett 40:12
Right. 

Karen Dittman 40:13
God wants us to love him and He wants us to experience his love. 

He doesn't want us to just spin our wheels swerving. I mean, there's nothing wrong with serving. Some of us are really wired that way. 

Rich Bennett 40:30
Right. 

Karen Dittman 40:31
When it's that transactional attitude. Who wants in on that? I want I want a real relationship. 

Rich Bennett 40:39
I love the way you explained that too, but I never even thought about it that way, especially the relationship and and religion part. But yeah, you're 100% right. It's. Wow. Wow. Okay, so on to the seven elements of wellness. 

Karen Dittman 40:59
Right. Right. 

Rich Bennett 41:00
Those of you listening, I hope. I hope you're taking all this in. I know Kerry's not going to give everything away because otherwise you won't buy the book. We want you to buy the book. So. 

Karen Dittman 41:11
Well, you know, if you buy the book, even if I gave it all away and, you know, the time that we have left, you wouldn't be able to highlight anything I'm saying, Right. 

Rich Bennett 41:20
Well, 

actually, with with this. I usually wait till the end. But I think this is important because you guys are self-published, right? 

Karen Dittman 41:29
Yes, we are on Amazon. 

Rich Bennett 41:31
Any plans on. I know it's on Kindle. Any plans on doing an audible version? 

Karen Dittman 41:37
That is in the works. It has already been recorded and it's in the editing process. So, yes, I spent a couple of weeks in December recording the audiobook. 

Rich Bennett 41:49
Is it just you or you and Michael? 

Karen Dittman 41:51
Just me. Yeah. I just recorded it myself. 

Rich Bennett 41:55
I'm sorry, but you mean to tell me that you can do your own voiceover on a book that you write? 

Karen Dittman 42:04
You know, And I actually. 

Rich Bennett 42:05
I'm being sarcastic here. 

Karen Dittman 42:07
And I did 

Rich Bennett 42:07
Yeah, 

Karen Dittman 42:07
I did hire a company so that because, you know, I probably could have gotten through the recording part. But working with a director who helped me through it was huge. 

Rich Bennett 42:18
but. 

Karen Dittman 42:19
And then I don't have to worry about the editing out all of the random, you know, noises or whatever. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 42:27
But if you would have hired somebody to do the voiceover part, it would have cost an arm and a leg. 

Karen Dittman 42:32
Hmm. Hmm. Hmm. 

Rich Bennett 42:32
And unfortunately, I know there are publishers out there that will tell authors, well, no, you need to hire somebody. 

Karen Dittman 42:39
Hmm. Hmm. 

Rich Bennett 42:40
You know, if it's a novel, that's one thing, because you have to you have to portray different characters. But if it's something like this, even a memoir, you now use your own voice. 

Karen Dittman 42:51
And I think that having my voice as the person who wrote the words. 

Rich Bennett 42:56
Oh, yeah. 

Karen Dittman 42:56
People understand the 

Rich Bennett 42:58
Yes. 

Karen Dittman 42:58
context helps people understand. 

Rich Bennett 43:02
It's just like your business. You know, with your business, you're putting your face out there because you are your brand. Well, the same with with your book and even a podcast. Your voice is your brand. Put it out there. It makes sure you have a voice that people can listen to. 

Karen Dittman 43:18
Thank you. 

Rich Bennett 43:19
So. 

Karen Dittman 43:21
And I've had many people tell me things like that. So. 

Rich Bennett 43:23
It's it's it's peaceful, it's relaxing, which is something that that you want. You don't you want somebody covered it or. No, no. You don't want that. I'm sorry. Good. Good. He cared. 

Karen Dittman 43:36
So. Anyway. But. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 43:38
I'm glad of that. I'm glad there's going to be an audible as well. 

Karen Dittman 43:41
Yeah. Yeah. So the seven elements of wellness we talk about for that are like the core of who we are. It's our physical self, spiritual, mental and emotional. Jesus said, Love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, mind and strength. That's how we define those four parts of ourselves. And then we have three areas that, as Michael is doing the study, he was understanding There's ways that we relate to the world in our relationships, our vocation, and through our finances. And so these are all things that are like we call them the connecting three. It's how we we as you know, our as humans interact with God and with the world around us and and with our with our society, our culture. 

Rich Bennett 44:35
Okay. So with the you have the core four, right? Go spiritual. Was it mental? 

Karen Dittman 44:42
Mental and emotional. 

Rich Bennett 44:43
And emotional wellness. Okay, so how can someone actually develop a sustainable wellness routine that integrates all four of those elements without feeling overwhelmed, especially because of mental, you know, mental health? 

Karen Dittman 44:57
Right. And I would say so. One of the elements I didn't even talk about much about the gray cycle, but it's a a formula for transformation. And one of the steps of that is to just work on one thing at a time. I call it one simple change. But, for example, say, I'm aware that my mental health is the area that is really needing the most work. 

Rich Bennett 45:23
Right. 

Karen Dittman 45:23
So instead of worrying about everything all at once. I'm going to step into what's one thing I can do to help improve my mental health. And it's different for everybody. We're 

Rich Bennett 45:35
Right. 

Karen Dittman 45:35
all unique. So again, we all have to use our own curiosity. But maybe it looks like I'm going to make a point of starting my day with gratitude. Or maybe it looks like I'm going to. You know, Paul wrote about taking every thought captive. Maybe there is a specific thought pattern that I need to begin to become aware of. And every time I notice that, I need to say, Hmm, that is not true. And what is the truth about me or about the world that I need to replace that with? And being very intentional. Just about one simple thing at a time. 

Rich Bennett 46:19
But. 

Karen Dittman 46:20
And then, of course, as we improve our mental health, then emotions are going to improve or and, you know, it's all you know, we separate these four core parts of ourselves, but we're also very aware they overlap and they interact and they influence each other. Maybe my mental health is a struggle, but I'm aware that if I just get out and exercise my body for 30 minutes every day, it's going to make a big difference. Right. 

Rich Bennett 46:49
It will. 

Karen Dittman 46:50
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 46:52
It definitely will. So with you mentioned the grey cycle. 

And a lot of people struggle to extend grace to themselves. So what advice would you give to someone who battles with self-criticism or even perfectionism? 

Karen Dittman 47:11
I battled those things myself. So I can. I can. 

Rich Bennett 47:15
Okay? 

Karen Dittman 47:16
Yes. So the one thing I would say to begin with, I've actually moved away from this phrase give grace to myself or give grace to others, because I 

Rich Bennett 47:26
hmm. 

Karen Dittman 47:26
have become aware that grace is too big for me to give it. I have to receive it. I can't give it. Grace can only come from God, real grace. I can give myself and others understanding, compassion, things like that. 

Rich Bennett 47:41
Right. 

Karen Dittman 47:42
So, you know, and it's just mostly a semantic thing, but still. So for somebody who is battling self-criticism and like, why don't I get this right yet? Why why am I still stuck? 

I would just encourage you to come to a place of acceptance for yourself. And that's, again, one of the steps of the cycle. Usually when we're like, okay, something in my life needs to change, you're like, okay, I'm going to go into battle mode. I'm going to fight it off. It's all wrong. It's all bad. But there's always a story under it. If I need to change something, there's a story under it. And I need to make peace with the past so that I can make a new choice for the future. So if I am criticizing myself, maybe it's helpful to step back and say, Was there a voice I heard from outside when I was a young child that spoke so much criticism that I internalized and as I got older. And how can I make peace with that? Because I can't change the past. I need 

Rich Bennett 48:53
Right. 

Karen Dittman 48:53
to accept this and then move into. What does the future look differently? And then start taking that thought captive? When I start hearing that, why didn't you get it right this time? I'm growing. I'm learning. I'm changing. God loves me. Does that help? 

Rich Bennett 49:15
Yeah. And I'm sure they're thinking because with I love self-help books, and technically this sounds a lot like a self-help book. As well 

are there. And if you tell me you're already doing this, I'm just going to be blown away. Any plans on doing classes or whatever that or even webinars that go along with the book? I know you had a companion, which I want to talk about that too. 

Karen Dittman 49:45
Yeah, we have done a few. And 

Rich Bennett 49:48
Okay. 

Karen Dittman 49:49
that's, you know, like this challenge about heart care thriving on the Hill. 

Rich Bennett 49:53
Yes. 

Karen Dittman 49:53
All that I have coming up in February. This is taking the gray cycle and applying it to how do we engage in self-care in our lives. 

Rich Bennett 50:03
Mm hmm. 

Karen Dittman 50:04
So it is such a huge, broad topic. I'm very aware of that, that for me. So I, I love to do like I did last October. I did a webinar about and I think I've even got a teaching I did on my website, but I did something about unanswered prayers. So like when you're stuck because you're praying and praying and praying and nothing is happening and you feel like it's just bouncing off the ceiling. Where's God in that? And how do you find God and how does the grace cycle change your perspective for these unanswered prayers? 

Rich Bennett 50:43
Who? 

I have a 

thought about that. 

Karen Dittman 50:51
Okay. 

Rich Bennett 50:52
Because because we've talked about doing a podcast about this. 

Karen Dittman 50:55
Mm hmm. 

Rich Bennett 50:56
Do you with unanswered prayers. Do 

Karen Dittman 50:58
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 50:59
you think those prayers are on the answer? Because people don't know how to pray, how to talk to God. 

Karen Dittman 51:06
Do I think those prayers are unanswered? 

Hmm. 

I. I don't know. 

I think that sometimes. God. 

So there is. And I'm kind of all over the place. That's a real. Good question. 

Rich Bennett 51:32
What is. 

Karen Dittman 51:33
And I think there's. 

Rich Bennett 51:34
Question. That's why I that's why it's an episode I want to talk about. 

Karen Dittman 51:37
Yeah. So I think that one of the things is we do need to seek what is God's will as opposed to what do I want? Like when my daughter was out of my house and I didn't know where she was and I didn't know what was going on and I was constantly praying, God, bring her home. God bring her home. God bring her home. And asking everybody else, Please pray that she'll come home. I wasn't asking God what he wanted me to pray. I was just praying for what I wanted. And and so those prayers, in a sense, weren't being answered. And then, of course, there was God, you know, when I was aware, God help her become sober. And and then it was she needed to walk through her own timing and process until she was ready to find sobriety. So I think part of it is 

needing to kind of pause and ask, God, what do you want me to pray in this? And part of it is timing. 

Rich Bennett 52:55
Yeah. 

Karen Dittman 52:56
And part of it is 

there's one of the things that I that I know I used to do that I think it's really easy to do. I call strategic praying. Where the idea is if I get enough people on my side or if I pray in just the right way, then I put, you know, it's the chess board and I put God 

Rich Bennett 53:19
Yeah. 

Karen Dittman 53:19
in check and he has no choice. He has to answer my prayer the way I want it. So. So like I had I was trying to get as many people as I could on my side to pray for my daughter the way I wanted things to work out. And God said, 

You need to learn to trust me and surrender. And so there were other things God was doing in me. As I was praying for her. So I think there's a you know, there's again, this kind of pat answer that sometimes the answer is yes, Sometimes the answers no, sometimes the answers wait. But I think that that when we start looking at our circumstances and looking at what's going on and we can just pause and we can look at God and say, what are you actually doing here that helps us to rest and wait And just like. You know, it's like he was calling me all along. 

Rich Bennett 54:20
Yeah. 

Karen Dittman 54:20
I know. You know, I do love your daughter, and I'm going to do something, but I want you to find me. And I want you to let me love you instead of being distracted by what's going on with other people. I want you and I want your heart, is what he was saying to me. 

Rich Bennett 54:41
Yeah, I think a lot of people give up too easily. Too. They. 

Karen Dittman 54:46
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 54:47
I'm thinking of like social media and text messaging today. Yeah. You said you sent a text to somebody. You expect to get an answer back right away. And unfortunately, I believe a lot of people think that way from when they pray to God. Well, a couple of things. First of all, when they pray to God asking him for something, I think they're expecting something. You know him the answer right away. 

Karen Dittman 55:10
Uh huh. 

Rich Bennett 55:11
My other belief is I believe too many people always pray in asking something for from God. Instead of thanking him for everything he's done. 

Karen Dittman 55:20
Yes. 

Rich Bennett 55:20
You know, I mean, that's what you you should be doing that every day. Every day? Without a doubt. All right. So explain the companion guide. 

Karen Dittman 55:31
Yeah. So as we were going through this, you know, Michael Rowe did all of this background Bible study that went into the book. And so as we were writing the book, we thought, well, let's have something that we can have like a little giveaway where people can kind of dig a little bit more into what the scriptures really are teaching, because they can read my words, they can read what we wrote, and there's scripture references throughout the book, of course. 

Rich Bennett 56:00
Right. 

Karen Dittman 56:01
This is. But then if they can, like, dig in and go, okay, so this is what it really says and they can understand the context and they can understand. So Michael started working on what we thought was going to be like this short little, you know, giveaway. And it turned into think it might even be longer than the book. It's this. Intensive ten week Bible study where each week you've got five days of studying and understanding. And what is God speaking to me about this and what can I do with what this chapter is teaching? And then small group discussion is part of it. So I took that and, you know, made it even where, you know, like just a little tiny pieces out of it and turned it into a reflection journal that you can download if you buy the book. There's a little QR code in the book that you can download the reflection journal. But yeah, but so it's this really extensive study that's designed for ideally to do with at least one other person because we believe in community and support and connection with others. Right. But 

Rich Bennett 57:11
I love it, though. 

Karen Dittman 57:12
yeah. 

Rich Bennett 57:12
I love it. And you were right. You were right. It is longer. I'm looking because I look at the book itself, Thriving in Greece is 183 pages. The study companion is 228 pages. 

Karen Dittman 57:30
Yeah. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 57:31
So it is a little bit, but I mean, I haven't looked at em, but I'm sure there's like space for you to take notes and everything. 

Karen Dittman 57:37
Yeah. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 57:38
Which is why 

Karen Dittman 57:39
There's 

Rich Bennett 57:39
it's. 

Karen Dittman 57:39
lots of space. 

Rich Bennett 57:39
Four pages. 

Karen Dittman 57:40
Yes, exactly. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 57:42
But the good thing is with especially now that you got the audible version of the book, people can buy the study guide and as they're listening to the book, go right along with it. 

Karen Dittman 57:54
Hmm. Hmm. Hmm. Hmm. Hmm. Hmm. 

Rich Bennett 57:54
So. Oh, yeah, man, I love this. And I think you're already if you haven't started working on it yet, I think you already have another book in the works about unanswered prayers, Maybe. 

Karen Dittman 58:07
I might I have got some thoughts about 

because like I said, the grease cycle is such a big thing and thriving and Grace is like, you know, it's huge. So. 

Rich Bennett 58:19
Yeah. 

Karen Dittman 58:19
I've got, you know, ideas for, you know, a book. You know, there could be a book about unanswered prayer. They can be a book about, you know, you know, grace in your unanswered prayers. There can be a book about grace for parenting. Grace for grief. Grace for overcoming addiction. Grace for, you know, so many areas of our lives. Where. God's 

Rich Bennett 58:44
Wow. 

Karen Dittman 58:45
grace is there. So yeah. So there's like. Later on this year, once I get that podcast done, that once I get that podcast underway, then I'll make some space and start writing some more books that are just going to help, you know, bring it down to some very specific areas of our lives. 

Rich Bennett 59:03
I love that, though. So those of you listening again, make sure you purchase both of the books, not just the one. Well, actually, I'm sorry. Take that back. All three of the books. Because you don't want to forget the first one. As she wrote The Fruit of Gratitude, Cultivate a thankful heart through awareness of God's goodness. There is no study comparing you with that one. And then, of course, thriving in grace, unleashing wellness from a biblical perspective, which is when you're going to be available on Audible. Do you know? 

Karen Dittman 59:35
I don't know. It should 

Rich Bennett 59:36
Okay. 

Karen Dittman 59:37
be sometime this spring. So. 

Rich Bennett 59:39
Okay. All right. So. Well, that's all right. Go ahead and buy the book anyways in either hardcover or paperback. And, of course, make sure you get the Bringing Great Home, a Bible study companion to Thrive in and Grace. And after you do it all, a couple of things. You all know where I'm going with this. Leave a full review whether it be on Amazon, good reads Barnes Noble wherever you can buy books and then it's don't pass it on because it's a guidebook. It's something that you you're going to want to keep by your side all the time. All of them purchase it for somebody else and something that I've said before to purchase because this is something I believe could be used even, you know, we mentioned recovery. Even in the recovery homes. So those of you that own a business, purchase several copies, donate them to some places as well because you're just you're helping people and you're spreading God's word. And that's very important. Karen, is there anything you like that? Before I get to my last question? 

Karen Dittman 1:00:49
I am just so grateful, Rich, for, you know, Yeah. For diving in and having this opportunity and for your encouraging other people. I really believe that this is something that most it's a different way to approach our, our, our lives and our relationship 

Rich Bennett 1:01:10
Yeah. 

Karen Dittman 1:01:10
with God. And so thank you for encouraging other people not just to buy it, to support me, but to buy it because it's going to change their lives. 

Rich Bennett 1:01:19
Oh, yeah. It's very important. And I just. I want to thank you because you're helping people. And actually, one of the things I never asked you, though, what is your. This is my last question. But what is your business? It's. You're not just an author, right? 

Karen Dittman 1:01:35
Right? Right. I have a business called One Fit Wellness. And when I started it, the idea is to have encourage people to pursue wellness in all areas of their lives, not just physical fitness. So through, you know, I do a little bit of one on one coaching. I am putting out, you know, these different things like the challenge and the Lent 

Rich Bennett 1:02:01
Mm hmm. 

Karen Dittman 1:02:02
devotional content and things like that. So yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:02:06
So that's on the same website. Karen, A debt mint.com, right? 

Karen Dittman 1:02:11
Yes. Yes. 

Rich Bennett 1:02:12
I remember DEA this time. Okay. So if you could go back and give advice to yourself at the beginning of your wellness journey, what would you say? 

Karen Dittman 1:02:24
I would say to myself something that I say often to to my kids, to other people, it's not going to be easy, but it's going to be worth it. 

And it's every time I now hit no like I'm in that survival mode. Like, I just just got to keep going and just got to push through. I stopped myself and say, Karen, Karen, you don't have to just be in survival mode. You can meet God right here, right here, in this hard moment. He is with me. And so just to say to myself, look for God, He is right here. Let him walk you through this. Let him speak to you. 

Rich Bennett 1:03:17
Karen, want to thank you so much. Thank you for everything you're doing. God bless you. Even though I never met Michael. Tell him I said hi. And God, your your story is just amazing. 45. 

45 when you found out you were pregnant. And that was your first and only pregnancy, too, right? 

Karen Dittman 1:03:40
Exactly. Exactly. 

Rich Bennett 1:03:41
Wow. Well, those of you listening, yes, she did blow me away because when she came on, I thought she was like, when I say late thirties, early forties. 

Karen Dittman 1:03:51
I think you did. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 1:03:52
Yeah. No, she's not. She's still younger than me, though. But, yeah, she's not, so. Thank you so much. 

Karen Dittman 1:04:00
Thank you so much, Rich. Have a wonderful day. 

Rich Bennett 1:04:03
You, too. 

Rich Bennett 1:04:04
Thank you for listening to the conversations with Rich Bennett. I hope you enjoy today's episode and learn something from it as I did. If you'd like to hear more conversations like this, be sure to subscribe to the podcast so you never miss an episode. And if you have a moment, I'd love if you could leave a review. It helps us reach more listeners and share more incredible stories. Don't forget to connect with us on social media or visit our website at conversations with Rich Bennett Dotcom. For updates, giveaways and more. Until next time, take care, Be kind and keep the conversations going.