Emerging from the Shadows: Ryan Gray's Journey from Addiction to Advocacy

Rich Bennett 0:00
Thanks for joining the conversation, where we explore the stories and experiences that shape our world. I'm your host, Rich Bennett. And today we're joined by Ryan Gray, a remarkable individual who has navigated the treacherous waters of drug addiction to emerge as a beacon of hope. A graduate of the University of North Carolina, Asheville, Ryan has channeled his experiences into Twilight in your work Volume one, a raw and real account of his journey through addiction, recovery and the power of human resilience. So joining us is Ryan shares his inspirational journey of overcoming adversity, His dedication to behavioral health as a peer support specialist, and the profound impact of encouragement and support on his path to recovery. So, Ryan, first of all, welcome. And I want to just start off right away by saying thank you, because being a peer support specialist is very important to helping others in recovery. And I've learned so much about, you know, that position. And you guys are making a difference. So I want to thank you for that. 

Ryan Gray 1:17
And thank you for having me. And I'm grateful to be here. And I appreciate that. Thank you. 

Rich Bennett 1:23
Oh, my pleasure. So I want to start from the beginning. You know, with the addiction, 

I two things. Number one, when did it start and what was it? Because a lot of people when it comes to addiction, it's either alcohol or marijuana. Seems like those are the two biggest ones that it started with. So what was it with you? When did start with me? 

Ryan Gray 1:50
It started with the marijuana. I would I would drink occasionally. I, I was actually my my life was pretty smooth until suffering or college. When I started smoking weed freshman year in college, I got straight A's myself. So, yeah, sophomore year I started when I started smoking marijuana that everything started to just sort of go downhill, that grades together with the mental health. 

I had a psychotic break, I think was partially caused by by the marijuana. Right. That was I was basically out of school for a few weeks. So I had the break and then I was and 

I was in a mental hospital for about a week. 

Rich Bennett 2:45
Now, is this when you're college in North Carolina? 

Ryan Gray 2:49
No, this was when I was in college. In college at Maryland University. 

Rich Bennett 2:52
Okay. 

Ryan Gray 2:53
That was right out right after high school in 2003. 

Rich Bennett 2:59
Okay. 

Ryan Gray 3:00
Wow. Yeah. 2000 and 2004. I started it was when I started to smoke marijuana and ended up leading to more serious drugs. I would I would do Adderall, too, at first, but then. Then that turned into a are dependent dependency, right? Oh, wow. 

Rich Bennett 3:26
So was that did did it ever. You know, I hope not, but you never know. Did it ever get to the point where you're doing opioids, whether it be heroin or anything like that? 

Ryan Gray 3:39
Not really. Okay. I, I think I might have tried 

cocaine like, one time. Right. It was most for a while. It was when I actually the first drug that really became, you know, like like to the point of being, okay, I'm an addict, I'm normal at this point. Was the they call it DSM dextromethorphan. Mm hmm. That became my drug of choice. And that's. That's what they put in Robitussin. Oh, yeah. That so? Because and I've been on other podcasts talking about teenagers. It's very easy to get Robitussin because you can you can steal it. Right. So I in my case, I was relocating a lot. I didn't know any drug dealers. I didn't have money anyway. So I would I just started to steal it from the from the drug stores. Right. It became a that's that became a habit. Became a daily thing. Hmm. And that, like, like kind of like with the marijuana that 

whenever I would use any kind of drug, my mental health 

just plummeted. I mean, got worse. Yeah, much, much worse. I think. I think I don't know if it's a maybe by a factor of four, like, you know, like somebody somebody who becomes dependent on a drug 

and, you know, things something some part of their lives kind of would kind of suffer to go downhill. But I think as a mentally ill person, I think my life went downhill faster, much faster than that. Somebody, you know, who isn't struggling with the right illness. 

Rich Bennett 5:43
Hmm. So were you. But you did graduate from college, right? 

Ryan Gray 5:50
No, I went back to school and graduated. I didn't. I dropped out of college. 

Rich Bennett 5:58
Okay. 

Ryan Gray 5:59
This period of time that know when when I started started to use harder drugs. Like I was saying right out, I think I dropped out in 2006. Oh, okay. Junior. Senior. And that was much later in 

much later where I was going back to college, which was which was a being a big deal for me because 

kind of like jumping ahead a little bit. 

My my drug use had me I had I was in a lot of different institutions. I was in a lot of halfway houses and I was essentially kicked, kicked out of all of those all of those places. And 

that's all right. So 

train of thought here. 

Oh, yeah. I'm sorry. College education. Yeah. You mentioned college. 

Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 7:13
Yeah. University of North Carolina. 

Ryan Gray 7:15
Yeah, that was. That was much later. Okay. So I think I was setting up to say that I had come a long way right from my rock bottom to having going back to college and getting a degree and getting a car and getting a job. 

Rich Bennett 7:37
And becoming an author. 

Ryan Gray 7:39
Yeah, Becoming an officer. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 7:41
Of supporting all of the things you mentioned. Robitussin. Mm hmm. So. And you're the first person I've talked to that I know of that that was their drug of choice. So what would you do? I mean, get it from the pharmacy, whatever, and just, like, drink a bottle of it. How did that work? 

Ryan Gray 8:03
Exactly. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 8:05
Okay. I was that way. 

Ryan Gray 8:07
Yeah. I mean, they have like, they've got a pill. They've got it in pill form, right? That 

they actually they make it taste really bad on purpose to deter people from doing that. Hmm. Originally saw. Yeah. They're going to say historically, it 

was sort of made it in a lab to have a some substitution for people because it used to be that if you wanted to buy a cough syrup, it would have codeine in it. Mm hmm. Opiate people are getting addicted to cold codeine, so they a 

they they developed the exam as as it's an opioid. It's a synthetic. 

Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 9:05
Man, that. 

Ryan Gray 9:08
So. 

Rich Bennett 9:09
I know there's got to be better medicines out there to help people with a cold or something that you figured. You figure something like that would have been taken off the market by now. But I guess. Yeah. 

Ryan Gray 9:20
Yeah, that that's I agree, especially with the factor I had mentioned about. Mm. Or have teenagers. It's so easy to get. Yeah. Codeine. They still, I think they still do do cough syrup with codeine in it. But the codeine is. Yeah. It's a, it's a prescription now. 

Rich Bennett 9:43
Right. So when was it that you actually realized that you had a problem and you needed help. 

Ryan Gray 9:54
I think. Well my parents caught on pretty quickly then kind of um, 

my basically the when I was still struggling at the University of Maryland, I had a basement room in a house and I had stopped. I was completely I mean, I was I was almost like I was almost mute. I wasn't eating or sleeping. 

Rich Bennett 10:25
Wow. 

Ryan Gray 10:27
Yeah. And things and this that the state of my living living arrangement was, you know, rotting food. There was broken glass on the floor. There's no food at all. It was an it was a mess. And I think at that point, it was pretty undeniable that I had a problem. But 

I personally didn't 

accept I didn't I didn't admit that I had a problem until it hit until I hit bottom. 

Rich Bennett 11:00
Right. 

Ryan Gray 11:01
And this this was, you know, a year or two years later, after the fact of when I was at Maryland 

and not just, you know, I got to the point where I was I was basically I was homeless. I was on and off the street for that's what my book I just wrote, Toilet Word is is about that time period where I was on on and off the street for, you know, I don't know, several months. Yeah. And that's another thing I sort of have to share with people, too, is what the reality of of homelessness. I'm still I'm still trying to answer your question. I didn't I didn't know that I had a problem into, you know, that I was sort of on my last limb. I didn't have any friends left to write, have had 

couches available. You know, they all most of my friends were also addicts. So they were they themselves are getting evicted from their homes. So I had basically gone from being on and off the street to a more permanent like okay, was solely homeless. Wow. Yeah. And when I when I got to that point, 

I sort of I could admit that, you know, something wasn't right. That right. And I you know, it I was really a it was really forced on me. I mean, because I didn't have made that decision to get to get clean a lot easier 

because I didn't really have anywhere else to 

turn. I knew it was right for homelessness or get help. So it wasn't like was kind of a no brainer. And unfortunately, a lot of the majority of addicts and alcoholics have to hit bottom to have any kind of change. That's that's just that's just I mean, and it's tragic. But yeah, that's unfortunately that's the reality. Doesn't mean I mean, I've got friends I've got friends in recovery that, you know, were able to identify themselves as addict or alcoholic or so. I mean, you know, like most, you know, held on to their marriage and their careers and where, you know, whereas hitting rock bottom, it's like you like like in my case, I had nothing left. I didn't have any money, crazy friends, you know. And like I said, my I wasn't seeing a psychiatrist at the time. And 

diagnosed as severe schizophrenic. 

Rich Bennett 14:17
Oh. 

Ryan Gray 14:18
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 14:20
Okay. 

Ryan Gray 14:21
So that was earlier. But yeah, when I when I said when I was talking about mental illness, my own mental illness, I sort of skipped that part. But the schizophrenia is, 

that's where that's, that's my 

biggest, you know, one of my biggest hindrances in life in general. 

Rich Bennett 14:47
I mean, this is something I've never asked anybody. We've talked about mental illness a lot, and I don't know if you can answer this or not, but what is the hardest part of being? And yeah, having a mental illness? 

Ryan Gray 15:05
I think that having to deal with it every day. 

Rich Bennett 15:11
Yeah. 

Ryan Gray 15:13
Every day, no matter, you know, how how good my day is or 

really it really doesn't matter what happens, good or bad, every day. Every day I have to deal with schizophrenia. And that's, you know, hearing, hearing voices, having a lot of auditory hallucinations, having two ongoing delusions, having to deal with that every single day. And I think. Awesome, amazing. That's hard about me mentally is that, you know, you can make a lot of progress and still end up 

in, you know, in a hospital like I had a sort of a anxiety like it was related to stress with my my job. Mm hmm. But I sort of had a breakdown. 

And that's another it's a long story and I can tell a story, but I think I was just saying the other thing that's hard about being mentally ill is, you know, one one minute you're. You're working, you're living your life, and then next you're kind of removed from all that. Yeah, I'm going to be in a in a in a mental ward or award somewhere. 

Rich Bennett 16:47
Hmm. Man, that. Sure. 

Ryan Gray 16:52
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 16:53
There's 

a the thing is of your story, because it's like you said, I mean, when you hit rap, you were homeless. You basically really had no help. No, no, no support system at all. Which, of course, thank God that has changed because now you're in recovery. And actually how long have you been in recovery? 

Ryan Gray 17:23
I just got out 16 years. Clean and sober. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 17:28
Oh, it is awesome. And congratulations. 

Ryan Gray 17:32
Yeah, the book, the book that I wrote is it's essentially a right now the first volume just came out and the second writing is finished, but it hasn't been published yet. But the but the end of the second volume that 

the story ends when, when I do get clean. 

Rich Bennett 17:55
Actually what compelled you to transform your personal journey into Twilight in York? The first volume? I mean, was there a specific moment that ignited your desire to share your story with the world? 

Ryan Gray 18:10
Yeah. The way that it started was I went back I went back to school at the university of North Carolina at Asheville Campus. Mm hmm. 

And I was a literature creative writing major. And we would have we would have these they call it a workshop classes where you have a writing assignment, 

some kind of fictional or my case, not fictional work. And then everybody in the you write the story and then everybody in the class would critique or read it and critique it. Our suggestions. And I think one of them for my one of my assignments, I sort of had the beginnings of what would turn into a book, two books. 

And then I just you know, I was just I was a positive 

reinforcement. You know, one person said, you know, and I and I always remember them saying this, 

you should take what you wrote and just stick with what you wrote, but go through frame by frame one, one each event one after the other as they occurred from beginning to end and just tell the story. And I just, you know, took over to their advice. That was good advice. 

Rich Bennett 19:46
Wow. So how long did it actually take you to write the book? 

Ryan Gray 19:52
Well, it took me several years, probably, I'd say, down to 

probably like I mean, from beginning to end, probably like six years. 

Rich Bennett 20:07
Okay. 

Ryan Gray 20:08
But 

six years, like, it probably took me maybe a year or a year and a half to, I would say, to write the book. And then years, you know, a few years after that of that. And there's a lot of there's a lot of rewrites. I think it takes longer to revise. Yeah. Revise than to compose, you know. 

Rich Bennett 20:37
And are you self-published? 

Ryan Gray 20:41
No, I have a I call it a hybrid publisher. Yes. Yeah. I wasn't able I applied to a bunch of 

traditional publishers. Hmm. And I didn't have any luck. I mean, this month. 

Rich Bennett 20:58
Well, your first book, too. 

Ryan Gray 21:00
Exactly. 

Rich Bennett 21:02
It's. That's one of the things I notice when I get a lot of authors on here. They're. You're lucky if your first book is picked up by, you know, a traditional publisher. And a lot of your publishers want you to have an agent, but a lot of your agents want you to have a publisher. So it's like you can't win either way. But here a lot of people are going the hybrid route, the hybrid route, and also self-publishing, and they're having great success with it. Yeah, I want to commend you because you're doing something that a lot of other authors don't do, and you're doing the podcast circuit talking about your book, which is important. I mean, that's great marketing right there. Yeah, a lot of people do do that, actually. And besides the podcast, how how else are you marketing your book? 

Ryan Gray 22:00
I think 

I've done some sort of been signing book signings. Mm hmm. I did a website. I've got a website and a and a Facebook page, and I try to update with like this. This 

when this podcast comes out, I'll definitely put a link in there. Right? But I also think the biggest thing selling books has been 

word of mouth. Yeah. Like, my my parents just know a lot of stories. No, people. So they help me with a you know, I've also I do a, a newsletter. 

Good everybody in a loop and having, you know, tell and telling people what the book is about or why they should read it. And sort of hoping, hoping that that word of mouth that, you know, if the person likes the book that they'll recommend it to others. And so I. 

Rich Bennett 23:17
Actually. Have you thought about contacting some of the recovery centers and giving it to them? 

Ryan Gray 23:26
Yeah, I have. I have I, I didn't have as much work with blogs, but I did like some recovery centers that had 

blogs on the, you know, ask me to just be a guest on the blog. And right now, I don't know. Real luck with that. I think 

I think recovery centers are a little bit more like 

restricted as to what. 

Rich Bennett 23:59
Yeah, that's true. 

Ryan Gray 24:00
We like to promote the promotional aspect might not drive that that that right. 

Rich Bennett 24:07
So who what when you finished your book, who was it that read it first? Besides you? 

Ryan Gray 24:14
Of course. 

Who read it first? I would say my and my family. 

Rich Bennett 24:23
Okay. 

Ryan Gray 24:24
I didn't read it as soon as it came out. I actually I Yeah, that 

probably my family, I would say. 

Rich Bennett 24:35
And what was their response? 

Ryan Gray 24:39
They were taken away by, you know, that it was that it was well written. 

I think they were also it was a it was a little bit tense because. Yeah, the book, it's it's creative nonfiction and it's about that period of time right before I got clean. So it has all of the things that I did like trying trying harder drugs, 

going, doing different drugs. The reality of the reality of the street lifestyle, you know, being around drug dealers and 

I think the I think they 

I mean, a lot of it they already knew knew about. But yeah, they actually read it like. 

Rich Bennett 25:37
A lot different when you read it. 

Ryan Gray 25:39
Yeah, exactly. Because it has, you know, all the details in there that you know. 

Rich Bennett 25:42
Yeah. 

Ryan Gray 25:43
Know though. 

Rich Bennett 25:44
Yeah. And I'm sure there's probably other things in there that they didn't know about as well. 

Ryan Gray 25:50
Yes. 

Rich Bennett 25:50
You know, and the other thing is, too, when people read books like this, it's your memoir. But I also look at it as an educational book for those people that really don't know a lot about, you know, mental illness or addiction. Yeah. And I think this helps them understand it a lot more, actually. Who is your biggest influence and why? 

Ryan Gray 26:18
Our biggest influence was definitely Kerouac. Jack Kerouac, for his his style of prose is consciousness. And he had a human consciousness and he had a spontaneous prose. I think that he was considered the 

like the chief, you know, the mouth 

creator of that, the spontaneous prose. 

And, you know, he was a use alcoholic himself and didn't get sober and died at a young age. But is. 

But I've been like I've been compared to different authors like Burroughs, whereas Burroughs, George Orwell, dry mouth, Charles Bukowski. Yeah I think Orwell because someone mentioned Orwell because he wrote a book called Down and Out in Paris and London. Oh, that was when he was he was on. He was living in 

a time when I was very hard to find a job. A lot of homeless people and the conditions were just, you know, not having just starving. Mm hmm. 

Being like, 

just the conditions were just terrible. Like the people being confined to I don't know how many square feet, but, you know, 

the I guess I guess the homeless, the equivalent of homeless shelters at that time. Hmm. So many people. And it's such a small, cramped space, 

you know, just trying to 

make it by, you know, selling your clothes to the pawn shops, seeking shoes. So has that brutality of being poor in that and in that book, I think I was comparative burroughs because he just this the brutal honesty of in the in the realism of the addict lifestyle and what it's like to be a quote unquote junkie. Right. And and then Bukowski because same thing just you know with his alcoholism 

he was on and off the streets and couldn't couldn't keep a job. 

Wow. 

Rich Bennett 29:16
Wow. So he 

or what was a book buy were willing in. 

Ryan Gray 29:24
A down and out in Paris and London. 

Rich Bennett 29:29
Oh I'll go have to get that now. 

Ryan Gray 29:30
I'm going to read I'm going to be taken away by the like literally, there are not jobs anywhere. And the jobs that were available were like, you know, 14 hours a day 

just 

and just living somewhere. People would just live in dirt poor. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 29:56
Yeah, man. So how has writing and sharing your story contributed to your own healing process? 

Ryan Gray 30:05
Oh, 

I just I don't really think I think of it as 

I think of the books that the two volumes that I've written, 

I am trying to reach out and and share the message. And some people are also I don't want it to be limited as as like a a self-help. Right. It's also, you know, like some kind of like some of these authors I mentioned. It's also, you know, it's a narrative, a narrative nonfiction. 

Other than that, I think I pretty much already share, you know, in in the recovery community and 12 step 12 step groups pretty much already share some 

share a lot of what I went through. But I guess the 

I guess I guess that helps me by I can't by carrying that message right. 

Because you know, like 

what is the expression? Like you can't hold on to it or holding on to it only by giving it away. Mm hmm. 

Rich Bennett 31:34
So with your book, you know, I've got to actually. Do you know when the second one's going to come out? Any idea yet? 

Ryan Gray 31:44
No, I do not. 

Hopefully, I would say as early as the middle of this year. 

Rich Bennett 31:52
Oh, wow. Yeah. Wow. So and I usually don't ask this, but when it comes to, you know, mental health and recovery, I think it's and it's important. And if you're not comfortable doing it, I understand is there a certain part of the book that you really like that would make an impact that you wouldn't mind sharing with the listeners? 

Ryan Gray 32:23
Of course. Yeah. 

So it's this is just some context. This is at the beginning of the book when I arrive at a halfway house in York, Pennsylvania, and I'm just now I'm just going to bed. 

So I just read this. When I finally went to bed, I lie there, the feeling alive, the sounds on the street carried in through the open windows, though it had died down into the late hours of the night, silent, but for an occasional drive car, having passed a drunk or horror yelling down the street corridors, shrill voices lamenting, undulating, penetrating through every open window for blocks cowering in dreams as the city slept 

outside the world was a light and an eerie bright orange glow from the street lamps. The old dirty windows blurred in refracted daylight accentuated, making the whole world orange. A breeze came in through the open windows and it felt cool and good. The sound of locusts were serene and in harmony. The balmy air had cleansed the funky and or stuffiness smell created by the three of us and the tight space and cleared away the mess. The musty smell sealed in the old house. And as the air filled the room, I fell asleep on a soft cloud of tranquility. 

Wow. That's. Wow. 

Rich Bennett 34:14
That. 

That is good. That is really okay. I can see this being a career for you now. Being an author. I'm serious, man. That is awesome. That is good. One of the things I love about a book is whether you're reading it or it's being read to you, if you can picture it in your mind. And as you're reading that, I'm just picturing everything in my mind. You painted the picture perfectly, which is what a good author does. Your words are the picture that was Wow, actually. Who is your favorite author? I know it's hard to have one, but. 

Ryan Gray 35:00
Jack Kerouac, the guy that I said was my biggest influence. 

Rich Bennett 35:04
Okay. 

Ryan Gray 35:06
Yeah, he wrote. He wrote on the road. That was his biggest his biggest or most successful work. 

Rich Bennett 35:15
Okay. Okay. So with the book, if there's one thing that the readers could take away from it, what would your what would you hope it is. 

Ryan Gray 35:30
Just that 

that they enjoyed the journey 

and and that they're able to take something hopefully some of the stigma of mental health and addiction and homelessness and sort of like inform that person and you know, 

I think awareness today is spreading. 

Rich Bennett 36:02
Yes. 

Ryan Gray 36:04
At first when I when I really was getting sick, my parents didn't understand. A lot of people still don't understand. 

I think a lot of people see addiction as something that's like selfish because we're doing something, you know, at the expense of other people just just to get high. 

Rich Bennett 36:28
It's a disease. 

Ryan Gray 36:29
Yeah. When? Yeah, when the reality of it is, is that the cravings are just so dreadful and overpowering. Mm hmm. And it can be great. It is a great challenge to overcome those obstacles. And, 

you know, like, I. 

I don't know. I think. I think to just. Just to tell this story. Yeah. And to bring bring somebody along with me in story and, 

you know, think. 

Rich Bennett 37:08
It's going to help a lot of people. 

Ryan Gray 37:11
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 37:12
Without a doubt. And speaking of helping people, how long have you been a peer support specialist now? 

Ryan Gray 37:21
I mean, I want to say, 

I mean, like a year and a half. 

Rich Bennett 37:29
Okay. 

Ryan Gray 37:30
But I'm not currently. I'm currently in between jobs right now. The the last job that I had, the peer support job that I had was it was just too stressful. 

Rich Bennett 37:42
Right? Yeah. 

Ryan Gray 37:44
This is a good you know, this is a good point to just remind listeners of what we were saying 

just because 

I was working, you know, I was working 40 hours a week. Mm hmm. It was a hard job and 

it just. It was too much for me. Yeah. With. With the mental health. 

Rich Bennett 38:18
It's not for everybody. You know, and it. But at the same time, somebody's in recovery. 

They're That's who you want to be. A peer support specialist. But at the same time, yes, it's not for everybody, you know, because they're it can be a struggle. Yes. It can be very stressful because you're dealing with people that were going through the same thing as you. 

So, you know, but the good thing is you you tried. You were doing it. Now you've found your true calling. You're what I like to term as a author, preneur Yeah. You're that's what you do. You love writing. You're a hell of a hell of an author. Just from that little expert that you read, you know, And I started reading your book because you sent me a copy of a book. And I'm telling you people, this Twilight New York Volume one, you have to get it. You have to have to have to get it. And something very important when you get it and you read it, make sure you leave a full review, whether it be all good reads, Amazon or wherever it actually is. Any plans on this becoming an audio version as well, or is it already out there? 

Ryan Gray 39:48
No, the audio version. I didn't do that. I don't know how much o cost it is. 

Rich Bennett 39:54
It's I know it's not cheap. 

Ryan Gray 39:56
Yeah, it is available in paperback and on e-book. 

Rich Bennett 40:02
Okay. Even e-book or Kindle or is that the same thing? 

Ryan Gray 40:09
It's it's like a epub. It's on. It's on Amazon. 

Rich Bennett 40:14
Okay. Okay. How could you say it's on Amazon? But something very important to because 

I want people to go here because you got some I think you're you're going to be doing blogging on your website right? 

Ryan Gray 40:31
Yes I'm a support It's a work in progress. I have a have. 

Rich Bennett 40:36
Okay, then that's what. Yeah, go ahead. 

Ryan Gray 40:41
I was just going to say that the website is relatively new. Mm hmm. How we got into the blogging at that? Yes, I do. I do plan on doing that. 

Rich Bennett 40:50
And that's why I like the Twilight and York dotcom, right? 

Ryan Gray 40:55
Yeah. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 40:56
See, this is what I love because it's a brand new website so people can follow you your journey just through that because they're watching you work on this as well. And as good as an author you are writing the blog post should come easy for you and I'll be just it could be something as simple as, you know, my my, because I'm sure you do different types of therapy every day. I mean, I know I do. Yeah, it could be, you know, something like today for I, I went out and I took a walk through the would I. Okay. I can not write as good as user. I took a walk through the woods, listen to the birds and all this stuff. Yeah. I helped people, you know, just the different types. So before I get to my last question, is there anything you would like to add? 

Ryan Gray 41:55
I don't think so. I was kind of looking at some notes 

I see here if there's anything else I wanted to say. Yeah, I just kind of wanted to just tell my story, which, you know, 

I've had like podcasts where I would tell really the story just But I thought we did that. 

No, I mean, to just some of the stigma, I think just challenging stigma and those three areas, homelessness, addiction and mentally ill. 

Because as a as a homeless person, it's hard to think that we sort of take for granted, like, for example, the homeless shelter. They had a daily chapel service every every evening and you have to attend the chapel service to sleep in a bed, even if it was like freezing cold outside. Wow. And and 

like, it's just it's harder than it looks. Yeah. So I think a lot of people kind of look at a homeless, homeless person on the median or whatever it is, and I give this person $20, they're just gonna put it in their arm or something. Or they if they really wanted to, they could pick themselves up. But I think especially with my mental health, it was hard to. That's like, what? So a chapel service that would that's like at the time it's a time and a place and an event. And you have to kind of put it together in your head. 

It's harder to do that, to be accountable and to hold responsibilities like that when you're when you're homeless and trying to just sort of worn out, you know. 

Rich Bennett 44:02
But there are a lot of people don't understand when it comes to homelessness. And of course, you have different types of type, different types of people that are homeless, but you even have families. I mean, I know where we live. I think I, I think I just saw the numbers over five figures, over 500 homeless kids that are enrolled in public school here. I mean, but that's just it's mind boggling because you wouldn't think it that much. But what a lot of people don't realize, a lot of people forget that during COVID, a lot of the homeless people were put up in motels and everything, housing, 

once all that went away, they're back out on the streets again. 

Ryan Gray 44:55
Yeah, I remember when I was at the as a memory of being at the homeless shelter and there was like a 

a line of people coming out of there. And so a lot of them were whole families. 

Rich Bennett 45:10
That. 

Ryan Gray 45:11
Line. And they had all their and all their belongings with them. And I don't think I don't think there was enough beds for them. No, they had a I think that homeless shelter had a like a full time. They had the basic homeless shelter, which was people coming in off the street. They needed a place to stay for a night. And then they also had the other side, you know, in a sort of a segregated area. They had people who, as I guess, live there. 

But right now I saw whole families of them just yeah, we end of. 

Rich Bennett 45:50
A unfortunately, I don't think a lot of your homeless shelters can take families in. It's usually individuals or maybe even a couple. But a lot of times when there's kids involved, it's sad, but a lot of shelters can't take them then, you know? Yeah, which is really sad. 

Ryan Gray 46:08
Yeah. I do not have good experience. I didn't know like the chapel service thing because it's kind of it's kind of the word is like 

it's. 

Rich Bennett 46:25
It's almost like, well it's saying if you don't, we don't care about you. You're not staying here on the street. 

Ryan Gray 46:33
But it's just very imposing. It's for like, why do I have to? You know, what if what if I don't have religious beliefs? And this right there sort of converting people almost. Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 46:47
Exactly. 

Ryan Gray 46:49
You know, stuff like I remember we to be out like 435 in the morning, and if you didn't get out of bed right away, they'd like, go in the shop, shine a light in your eyes and 

wow. Yeah. There were times that like, I'd show up late, you know, an hour, an hour late, and it'd be like, raining and stuff, and they wouldn't let me in. 

Rich Bennett 47:15
So she's 

that's a, that's a, that's a whole nother podcast there. But seriously, because I would have never, I would have never thought about all that, that, you know, they. Wow. So you said when we start before we start, you said you've done, what, ten of these ten interviews so far around that. 

Ryan Gray 47:41
Yeah. 

Rich Bennett 47:41
Okay. I always like the end of this question. And if you can't answer that, I understand because it's only been ten. Is there anything a host has never asked you that you wish they would have asked you? And if so, what would be that question? What would be your answer? And it doesn't have to deal with mental health or addiction, anything like that. 

Ryan Gray 48:05
Mhm. Something 

I feel I feel pretty good about covering, covering all the bases 

if there's anything like that. 

Rich Bennett 48:23
Okay. Well, well it gives you enough time to think of one for the next time you come on because you know you're going to have to come on again for the second book. 

Ryan Gray 48:33
Oh yeah. Now for sure. 

Rich Bennett 48:34
Without a doubt. Without a doubt. And actually, for that one, I want to make sure I have Wendy with me as well, 

you know, from Rage Against Addiction, because I know she she I know she will love talking to you as well. And somebody else. I hope she doesn't co-host, but I want to talk to them because they started a non-profit called Season Psych. And I know they would like to talk to you as well if I can get them to co-host. That's the next thing. Ryan, I want to thank you so much again, everybody listening. Make sure you get his book, Twilight, New York Volume one. When you do, if you read it, leave a full review because it's just going to drive the algorithm of it's going to help people see it more. It's going to help him sell more books and he's going to sell a ton of these to get ready for the release of volume two, which you are sure is going to be probably the middle of this year. So then by God only knows what. And I can see you write a lot more book. So Ryan, thanks a lot then. Take care, buddy. 

Ryan Gray 49:46
All right. Thanks so much.