Imposter Syndrome

If you are being judged with your fake personality, it's much easier than being judged for your real personality. So, we sometimes don't want to show our real personality. We very carefully prepare a mask. We analyze the person that we are talking, that we are interacting. We analyze it. We understand what kind of person they would like to see in front of them. Then after this understanding, we wear a mask prepared only for them, very customized. We can do it for many people. Everyone puts on a mask to some extent.

Don't they? We can't be like our role as a teacher, our role as a psychologist, can't be the same, our role as a mother, as a child. We all have different personas to different situations. Yes, yes. So when you're acting, do you disappear? Does Eski disappear? It's actually the biggest question of acting because there are very different views.

I personally don't and I think no one can. In acting world, there is this big question, very existentialist one, because you can either perform, you can either be. You can't perform and be at the same time. But in acting, you need to perform and be at the same time. So it is impossible, in my view, to clear yourself.

You can't disappear. You are still being. I am Ezgi. I am there. Otherwise, I can't respond to anything happening on the stage because not everything can go perfectly. Something will happen. Maybe I will just be clumsy and I will break something on the stage. And I have to respond it immediately. If I am not being there, if I am there only as my character, I can't respond. I actually...

For me, it's the worst type of acting. They do what they memorize, what they prepared, what they rehearsed for, and they're not genuinely responding to what happens. There are really different views on that, but I think it is impossible to disappear on the stage as a human being. You are being and performing at the same time. Yes, there are three personas, actually. There is Ezgi, there is Role, and there is Ezgi.

who is acting this role. So there is even the third person. So there's you. There's Eski playing the role. Yes. And what was the third one? The character, the role itself. Let's say Lady Macbeth. OK, Lady Macbeth. OK, playing Lady Macbeth. OK. Yeah. So there's there's three layers going on. Exactly. Three layers. Three layers. When you're acting.

Which may be the reason why so few actors have what we call range in acting. They tend to stay within like a range of characters for most actors, don't they? Like very few, I mean, Tom Hanks is an example of an actor that has played a whole range of roles and done them all very successfully, very believably. Which I guess is why he's hailed as, and Meryl Streep's a great example of that - an actor that's played a whole range of different roles over a long period of time. But very few actors can do that, correct? And is that true? In my view, if you're a true actor, you had that education, you should be everybody, every actor should be able to act this whole range of roles. Because it doesn't matter who you are, it's the matter of how you understand it. So I can. Yes be an evil person on the stage. I can be a very innocent, very naive person on the stage. I can be anything. But it's about your ability, your ability to observe the world, how those people might act. It's your ability to be being really brutally honest with yourselves. Like you must be your own detective and you must see and find your evil side.

You're very different side. So I think it's other ability. Yes. So what you're saying that for an actor, all of those different aspects are available and demonstrate them believably on a stage or in a movie here? Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. Yes. Yes. I guess the wider that character is away from you.

the harder it's going to be to access. Like if you happen to be a very gentle, humble, sensitive soul and you happen to be playing someone that's very violent and aggressive, it might be harder. Yes, some of them are harder to find, but we have different tools to find it. Let's say you probably didn't kill anyone in your life, but you probably killed a fly.

So maybe this is your starting point. This is like, how does it feel to kill a fly or how does it feel to be slightly jealous? And like then you can understand who is very jealous, who can do anything to just achieve something. So is it about intention? You're thinking, well, my intention is to be jealous. My intention is to be psyched. Exactly. Exactly. You consciously in

Tend to do it, yes. Yes. Yes. So are they imposters? They're not. In their life, most of them are. Most of them are. Yes, they are. They have to be. They have to be. They can't, of course, like if you are alienated on the stage, you are on the stage, you look at yourself, you are not satisfied with your performance at all. You say like, what I am doing here? I don't belong here.

maybe another actor would do a better job. So I don't deserve to be here. At that moment, an imposter can come to play. But otherwise, they can't feel like imposters. Yes. It must be interesting. I'm wondering, when you're acting in a role, you're probably not aware of the, what I'd say, the real Eski. You're attempting just to play the character. Yes. Yes. You...

It sometimes happens. You just really have a distance. You just see yourself from the top and you just feel like what I am doing here. What is this all about? Like people are there. There is audience. They are all watching me. I am behaving like someone that I am not. And I would do everything possible to make those audience happy. So.

I just feel like, what I am doing? Like, it's not normal, it's not life, it's not how life is supposed to be. But you keep doing it and you can't give any clue to anyone that you are feeling this way. Then you fake it. You try, you start to faking everything. Yes, yes. So, what got you interested in acting to begin with? It sounds like a huge challenge.

What I believe is that the people do things because it fills up a space. They like having filled. Yeah. For you, what is it? I always say I wanna live more than one life. One life is not enough for me. Not enough? I know we have like limited. Not enough, one life's not enough. Yeah. We all know we have limited time.

on the earth. And being one person would never be enough for me. This is also why I am changing my profession. I am changing my location all the time. I was an actor, then I studied psychology. I became a psychologist. I was in Turkey. I lived in another country. Now I live in another country. So I have to change. And not only my labels or my titles,

but my personality as well. I don't wanna experience only one person. I wanna experience other people as well. I think acting was the best way to do so. Then I discovered I can dramatically change my life. I don't have to do it only on the stage as an other character. I can change myself as well. When we think about imposter syndrome, we think, well, what is imposter syndrome?

Because we're all imposters, right? We're all imposters to some extent, to some degree. And that's healthy. You can't be the same version of you in every situation you're in. So the version of me when I'm a dad is different than me than when I'm a husband. That's different than me when I'm a friend. Different than me when I'm coaching or consulting or... There's different versions of me. And you're thinking, well, ideally there's something authentic.that grounds all those versions and they're not too different. So if somebody met me as a dad, they would say that's consistent with him at work or what he's consulting. Not the same, but at least it's consistent. It becomes an imposter when you feel like you don't deserve it. Okay. Let's say I would like to talk about in this like social context, also in working context.

Yes. In working life you feel like you are very deeply incompetent, unqualified and you fake everything. Let's say you feel like you are probably very high achiever because people who has this imposter syndrome are usually very high achievers. So you accomplished something and you got praise, you got like respect and everything. But you constantly feel like you didn't deserve it. You faked it. It was good luck. It was charm. It was good luck. It was anything, but not your competence, not you. It's not well -deserved. And one day people will notice that you are a fraud. You didn't deserve any of your success and you will be just thrown out. This is that. That's imposter syndrome. I've almost always had a problem with self -esteem. since I was a little boy. And my mother was someone that always encouraged me to get out there and to do things I was uncomfortable with. And I've had a career and almost every step I've taken, I felt like, who am I to be in New York talking at a conference? Who am I to be talking to people that want to win an Olympic bid? Who am I? But I just feel like, well, if I just try it and it works,

I still feel like now, I still feel like some imposter syndrome. I feel like I'm constantly striving for things that I don't think I can achieve. And when I happen to achieve them, I think, maybe it's luck. Maybe it's luck, or maybe someone liked me and they helped me up, or it's strange. I was wondering how you can distinguish between those two things. And myself?

I have a very high degree of imposter syndrome. Whatever I do was really good luck. I was on the right place at the right time. I didn't deserve anything. And like, maybe I deserved something, but it didn't have to be me. It could be anyone else. It could be better than me. Why me? Why is this happening to me? I don't deserve it. Yes. Just because.

It's like you are perfectionist. It's like you can't do things perfectly up to everyone's standards or up to very unrealistic, incredibly high standards. You do a bit less. You feel like it wasn't perfect. I don't deserve anything. I don't deserve to be promoted, to be appreciated, even to be loved. It's not only true in the work context. You feel like...

I don't put any value to my friends life. Why are they friends with me? They could be friends with anybody. I don't even deserve to be friends. I don't deserve to be loved. Yes, yes. Yeah. So I'm wondering whether that's where like self -confidence and imposter syndrome overlap. Because you think, well, there must be like an overlap there somewhere. There is very high correlation.

between lack of self -esteem and imposter syndrome. People who suffer from imposter syndrome, they lack self -esteem. And even if they have a bit of confidence, they achieve something which would boost their self -confidence, self -esteem. The opposite happens, actually. So the higher they achieve, the better they do, the worse they feel.

Because it doesn't add any value to their inner child. It doesn't add any value to their lack of self -esteem. It's just, they just feel like I achieved something bigger. Now the chances are higher that I am gonna be in cult. They will notice that I didn't deserve it. And many times they are afraid of success. And unfortunately, any achievements,

any success won't add anything to your self -esteem. It doesn't matter. It's because you feel like you didn't deserve it. Why would you be confident? Why would you be happy? So your self -esteem, self -confidence remains to be low. Because I think of every step I've taken since I was about 16 or 17, every single step I've been surprised I got there. Every step, every single step I'm surprised.

It's like, I'm surprised they said yes. I'm surprised I got to speak at this conference. I'm surprised I get to coach these people that I get to coach. I'm surprised. I'm surprised that they come back for more coaching. I'm surprised. I'm surprised she agreed to marry me. I still look at her, I'm surprised that she's my wife. It's bizarre. It's a nice surprise though, right? It's a nice surprise to have. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. So is that imposter syndrome or?

It is probably imposter syndrome because even though you were surprised, you kept going up. You kept doing things. You kept achieving more things. So you can't be really imposter. Like, let's be realistic. You would get caught already. Many times. If you're a real imposter, if you didn't really deserve anything, you would get caught already. Yes.

most likely have that imposter syndrome. And I feel the same way. Everything I get in the school, I am surprised. I feel like, okay, I was very lucky. I graduated. I am like, okay, something happened there. I can figure out what happened, but they must be very confused. I graduated. Like everything. Yeah. They must have missed your marks or like marked you up on an assignment that they shouldn't have, right? Yeah.

Yeah, yeah. It's okay. It's okay. And like, it's 70 % of people suffer from it, especially women. And like, this 25 % of them are very high achievers. And unfortunately, it's not us. It's what happened to us as a child. So we can't control it. We didn't choose to have an imposter syndrome. But it's most likely to be a trauma response. So it's okay. It's okay to have it. The report I read suggested that women suffer from it more than men. Yeah. Yeah. I think it's, I would attribute it more to society because when men fails, they are given another chance to try more. If they fail, they are just, they are just being said like, okay, you failed this time. You can do better next time.

But the opposite happens when women fail. They say, OK, you don't have another chance. You failed. You just you don't have any other chance. And we have to be always. Unfortunately, the world changed very quickly and probably many people haven't still adopted themselves being women, being very active in this world. They are working, they are leaders and everything and they still wait. There are a lot of people who wait for women to fail. So if women fails, they say, okay, we saw that coming. It was very obvious she was going to fail. She's not meant for that. So we are not going to other chance. If we fail, we fail. That still exists today. Sometimes, sometimes. Yeah. Okay.

It's hard to change the concept. Even though we show women that the world has changed, people are not waiting for them to fail anymore, they still have that. It's curious because on the big gender debate now, what direction it's going in, where there's no such thing as gender anymore. It's a very fluid process. Even I saw a documentary recently in the US.

which was entitled What is a Woman? And people couldn't, they couldn't answer the question, right? Yeah. It's like someone who identifies as a woman, is a woman. You think, well, that puts all genetics and DNA to one side. It will. We will eventually get there. I think in some years, we won't even talk about those.

We will accept the fact that we are 100 % equal and you can identify yourself however you would like to and no one has anything to say with it. But right now we still like fight. The fight is not over yet. The fight for women you mean is not over? Yes, yes, yes. Okay, okay. I think so. I think so. But we will get there. So do you think people think women are imposters when they're in roles?

 Like if a woman takes a CEO role or a senior role in an organization, you think that... No, because like until there, there are a lot of things society say. Some people might say it as well, but before that, they say, she should have been a mother. Why does she work so hard? Did she just not being a mother or woman, but she just strive too hard.

She just like sacrificed everything and try hard. poor you. Like society say that sometimes. But it's not my main point. I think like there are also another reasons, maybe some personality effect, a woman being more imposters or this is just society. Unfortunately, it's not well documented yet. We don't know for sure. They can sabotage themselves because as I said, if they apply, imposter syndrome is more evident.

When you are taking new responsibility, new role or something, and woman can say, if I apply and if I get the job, I won't feel dissatisfaction, I won't feel any better, and maybe I will feel worse. So why to apply? And if I don't get the job, I will feel worse. So they can say, okay, there is no point to apply for another job. I will stay like this. I will do my best and that's it.

So they can fix. And the organization and society loses because contribution she could make to that company or to that organization. Okay. Okay. So you think imposter syndrome is keeping women from applying for different roles? Can be, but also like this gap between gender when it comes to imposter syndrome is not that huge. So women have it a bit more, but...men still have it. So like, there is no huge gap. But yes, woman might say, I don't deserve it. I won't have it. Yeah. Yes. They just keep themselves back. So how do I know if I'm suffering from imposter syndrome? For someone listening to this conversation, and they could be wondering, well, maybe I've got imposter syndrome.

First of all, I think the first indicator is, you do something big or small, you finish something, you finish your task, you finish your day and you have almost no sense of satisfaction. You know this good feeling, you finish something, you have done something small or big, you just give taps on your shoulder, you relax, you breathe, you are happy. But when imposters finish something, they don't relax.

They don't breathe. They don't say, yes, I did it. They don't feel pride at all. They feel like I should have done it anyway. Anybody would do it. There was no other way not doing it. So they have no sense of pride. And when they start something, they're highly motivated by a threat. They are not motivated by a reward. So they worry a lot. There is a lot of anxiety. There is a lot of worry.

Whenever they are about to start something new. They just keep themselves back. They constantly worry. They feel very anxious and they feel like they don't belong there. If people are going to office every day or they just do something and they look at their colleagues and they feel like everyone here knows what they are doing, but I don't. Everyone else is good at their job except if they have those kinds of feelings, they might have imposter syndrome. Okay. And the other colleagues who probably got imposter syndrome too, probably looking at you, who think you've got imposter syndrome, they probably think, God, she's doing so well. She's so extraordinary. I'm the imposter of the room. Yes, exactly. Probably. That's the reality. Yeah. And they usually tend to downplay their achievements.

There's many people might praise them. You achieved something big. You did so well. And they say, yeah, I did something. Yeah. Yeah. Can't be done by anyone. Yeah. Yeah. It wasn't such a big deal. They tend to be like, as I said, they don't feel any sense of achievement. The better they do, the worse they feel. And they are like, the worry can't stop.

The worry can't stop, unfortunately. And as a result, they have low performance, they don't have job satisfaction, they can't take initiatives, they can't, they are having very hard time starting their business or making business decisions. And they don't display this organization citizenship behavior because they feel like they don't belong. So yeah, these are the other characteristics that imposters can have.

So I'm curious about if I can talk to you as a psychologist now and you think about the different personas that we exhibit. Like we have an underlying persona which is more the natural self, if you like, more DNA that we arrived at when we were relatively young, maybe only teens. Then there's an everyday persona which is how we tune things up or tune things down when we're at work.

Then there's an overextended or stressed persona, which is how we turn up when we're very stressed or like over anxious. I'm wondering if I change my persona or change who I am when I come to work, which I think everyone does. It's like very consistent feeling. So if you change your persona, if you are just displaying something different than your true self, it doesn't make you an imposter. 

By the way, I would like to mention the imposter, people who have imposter syndrome, they are very high in camouflaging behavior. They constantly camouflage their fears, their identity even, because this worry very likely to be their identity. So they engage in camouflaging behavior a lot. They go to work, you can see their anxiety, you can see their lack of confidence.

What you see is someone performing highly, someone is talking to people, engaging with them. So yeah, they camouflage, they shift their behavior, they just put a mask on, but that doesn't make them imposters. They follow the cues, they are very attentive to these social cues. They might not make friends quickly. They tend to be introverted because they don't want to be exposed.

But they are very attentive to social cues. Okay, if I just adjust my style to suit my working environment, I'm not being an imposter. And it's, in my opinion, it is very healthy. Your version of yourself can even change minute to minute. You saw your boss in the office, you behave differently. You saw your work bestie, you behave differently. It's like - Yeah, yeah.

We change minute to minute, so there is nothing wrong with it. Imposter syndrome is a very deep down and unfortunately can be devastating feeling. But like camouflaging it, like being attentive to social cues, like being okay and showing the okay part to your colleagues doesn't make you imposter. Okay, okay. That just means you're being polite or being professional. You are surviving.

You are surviving. I'm surviving. I can definitely tell you, real imposters probably don't have this imposter syndrome. They are just like, they say, I didn't do anything to achieve this. I got really lucky and they got really lucky. They know it and they don't have this huge devastating feeling that they didn't deserve it. They are happy that they achieved it.

So yeah, I think real imposters don't have that imposter center.

Yes, and they are happy with it. It happened. They wanted to get into that university. They didn't work a lot, but they still got in. Really, it was really luck. So they don't question it. They just enjoy the success. They say, I got it. Doesn't matter the reasons. Doesn't matter how it will go after that. I got it. I'm happy. But imposter syndrome people got into school, they worry.

They worry, was it me? If, was it my parents? Did I go to the right schools before that? Was that it? It wasn't me. It wasn't my brain. It wasn't my competence. It wasn't. Imposter syndrome with just low self -esteem. Absolutely. And many research correlated it. Yeah. Yeah. So I had a whack with what my real ability. Yes. Yes. You just don't realize it. Yes. Exactly.

Exactly. And even if you realize, doesn't matter because you are not worthy deep down and no success, no achievement, no career can change it. And you mentioned earlier, Ezgi, that your research suggests that a lot of imposter syndrome comes from like parenting or comes from like a childhood environment. So what sort of parenting creates an imposter syndrome child? Like if I...

If I wanted to create an imposter syndrome child, what would I do? Not that I want to, right? Parents. Of course they wouldn't, but parents, like if you want to be a parent who creates a future imposter, you would do. You just give the praise to child when only when they achieve something.

They got a straight A. You praise them. You just love them a lot. And when they don't achieve anything or they fail, you just say, aha, you don't say anything even. But you display love, attention, affection only when they achieved something. They did something good. So the children rotates around the caregiver.

They are really desperate for attention, love and they understand the only way they can have it doing good, being good, fixing something, getting good grades. That's it. It is very, very related to attachment style. Those imposters tend to be anxiously attached because they don't know the care, the love is not consistently given to them.

Okay. If I'm a parent of a child likely to develop imposter syndrome. I'm only going to praise them or give them a love and affection when they've achieved something to my standards, which is very high. Yes. Otherwise, nothing. Yes. Or you just appreciate the result, but not the process. So they get a good grade. You say, congratulations on your grades. They don't say congratulations on your efforts.

You worked hard and I saw you. I saw you working. I saw how hard you studied or how hard you worked to do that. Yes. And really appreciate the effort because it's the effort that gets the result right. It's not the result. Yes. Result is the I think the least important thing in that context. You might get sick in the exam day. You might get a C instead of E. But the effort, the process should be seen.

And should be appreciated by parents. It's interesting. I used to be curious about why I was learning certain subjects at school. I went to an all -boy Catholic school run by priests, right? And they taught us things like Latin, like ancient history, like a whole lot of subjects. At one stage, I remember I was about 13 or 14, and I said, why are we learning Latin? And the answer I got was because it's going to teach you how to think. It's going to teach you how to think about language.

Which I thought was a great answer. Absolutely. How many information we remember from our primary school, middle school, high school. We don't remember the information. We learn how to think. That was the point. We learned how to think and we learned how to learn. And if you learn, and that's what they taught me, they said, we're teaching you to learn how to learn. Yes, exactly. For example, like I am very curious about theater history.

Because I love it. And because of my history lectures in my high school, middle school, I've learned how to learn history. But I didn't learn theater history in the high school, but I learned how to learn. I think it's a very good point. Yeah. Yeah. You learn how to learn. Yeah. So, so if I'm a parent, I'm thinking encourage or even if I'm a parent of myself, because a lot of us,

We're parenting ourselves to some extent, aren't we? Having conversations with ourselves about what's good enough, what's not enough. We do. We think, well, so I'm going to be encouraging myself and encouraging the people around me and celebrate the process, not just the outcome. Exactly. Exactly. You celebrate yourself as a human being, not a doer, not a fixer. You appreciate the process, not the result.

You tell yourself that I see you. I see you. And that matters. The trick is the only parenting style that you saw is your parents. And you, we, I definitely agree that we are parenting ourselves, but we have to be very careful. We are not parenting ourselves in a way that we were parenting as a child. So we need to be different.

We need to be more compassionate towards ourselves. Yes, than our parents were. And the really curious thing is, King, is that our parents loved us and they thought what they were doing was the best for us in that environment. But so we're not blaming the parents. We're just, it's just how they raised us. Absolutely not. Yes, we don't blame the parents or family at all. And the childhood is not the only reason which leads to imposter.

There can be many reasons, but only the research suggests that the trauma, the attachment style, the parenting style is a very big indicator of imposter. Yes, there is like attachment style. If you are not attached securely, you can. Your lack of self -esteem, your previous success histories, like when you got a trauma as an adult, you got in somewhere and you because of your success, you were left alone. You weren't appreciated and you become afraid of success. So yes, it doesn't have to lie in the childhood.

So you've grown up and you've had healthy parents or parents that didn't raise you in a way that's going to create imposter syndrome. Let's say you got in a job and because of that job, because of that success, people around you,became jealous of you and then left you alone. It can be, it can be. I could list many examples or situations which can create this sense of I don't worth it. Or even if I worth it, success is something I should avoid. Yeah, I deserve the success but all the baggage that comes with it, all the attacking I'm getting, the friends are leaving me, I get abandoned.

I'm not sure I want to get that success because there's too many negative pieces that come along with it, even though I deserved it. Exactly. Yes. Yes. OK. OK. I think like the most important thing is being very honest with yourself, understanding your pattern, understanding the feeling and acknowledging that it's not the first time you feel like this.

Something happened. Nobody becomes imposter out of nothing. You have this imposter syndrome as a result of something. It means you felt that way before. And you survived. You survived. You can understand it. You can break it. You can learn to appreciate yourself. You can learn to love yourself, regardless of your sex, regardless of your career. Yes. I think this is the most important thing. It's interesting. My daughter had a huge issue. She stopped going to school. She had some toxic friends. A whole lot of toxic things were happening to her at the same time. And her self -worth was pretty much zero. She wasn't getting out of bed, she wasn't eating. She was with a really destructive group of friends.

And and I was the only one that had a relationship with her, if you like, that could talk to her or that she'd listen to more likely. And I tried lots of different things. And then one night we were having dinner together, just her and I, and I said to her, look, no matter what is happening in your life, just realize that you're enough. You're just enough. You don't need to be more than enough. You're just gonna be enough. You're just beautiful enough. You're just strong enough. You're just smart enough.

And that's all you've got to be is enough. You don't need to be more than enough. I don't need to overachieve, I just need to achieve. Exactly. I'm just enough. And that was interesting because that phrase really resonated with her. That you're enough. You're just enough. And that was enough to, that was enough. That idea that she was enough was enough to drag her out of the hole.

She started getting up out of bed, she started walking, she started eating, she went back to school, her friendship group changed, but just that one idea could turn a life around. Yes, sometimes it's simple as this. All we need to hear is that we are enough. We are enough. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I'm just enough. I don't need to be more than enough. Yeah, exactly. Exactly, exactly.

Yes, yes, yes. And you have to be enough for yourself, not for anyone else. Your standard should be yours. They shouldn't be anyone else's standards. It should be yours. Yeah. But like there are maybe I will mention the styles because like as a style, imposters can be superheroes. So they find this sense of virginist.

Only if they help everyone, they just run to help everybody and they fix everything. They need to get everyone's approval. And if they can't get an approval, they just break. So I think it's very important to know that you are enough. You don't have to be a genius. You don't have to be a superhero or expert on everything to get an approval. You are enough. Yeah. Yeah. I...

I think, and I think it's very important to understand the first person you need to help is yourself before anyone else. The first person you need to get approval from is yourself, not anyone else, not your parents, not your friends, no one, you. Yeah, because you're talking to yourself the most, aren't you, Eski? I mean, if you think of all the conversations you have in your life, for as long as I can remember, most of the conversations I have, in my life, I'm with myself, right? From when I first wake up, I start talking to myself, right? And that goes on all through the day and all, maybe I'm crazy, right? Aren't we? Yes, and like, if someone gives that harsh of feedback, the critic to you, you would just, you know, react, but you have no hesitation to give it to yourself. You wouldn't give that harsh to your friend. You would say, beautiful, well done.

But to you, no, you did almost perfect, but you did that minor mistake. That feeling, that bad feeling never ends, never ends. Yeah. We are our like harshest critics. That inner voice never stop, never stop. Yes, yes. So if it never stops, we may as well be encouraging you to give us like maybe balanced feedback is enough. Maybe not loving feedback, but just balanced. Like just not so critical, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's okay to call out when you make a mistake. You're not like wonderful, perfect, you're a god, you're a superhero, you should be in a Marvel's, like a Marvel movie. No, not like that, but so. I really love the concept of behaving yourself as you would behave to your best friend, like self -compassion.

Yeah, I don't. say be blind to your mistakes or just keep doing them. But like you point the mistake out, you say it's there. But other than that, you did those as well. See both sides, see both sides. And I love you no matter which way you go. I'm with you, which is you talking to yourself, right?

Yes, yes, yes. It will, it will. If you can get to that point, if you can adjust your self -talk and if the other people are willing to help you, they just don't sabotage you, but they help you in that process, you can definitely diminish that imposter syndrome. So if I think I'm someone suffering from imposter syndrome, I would say first of all, start with acknowledging you're not alone. Many people have it.

With 75 % of people that's most people right? Yes, I would say understand you are not alone in this. Understand you can talk about this to other people. You can ask for help. Because if you talk to talk to other people, they're likely to have imposter syndrome as well, right? So you can get better together.

And I would suggest, as you said, maybe even taking notes about the events or about everything, about success. They say, I did this talk today, there were good sides, I did those things well, and there were some mistakes there. And I see it on a paper, I say, okay, I did what I could. I can't go back in time right now, I can't change anything.

But this is realistically, what I did. So I would recommend being more realistic, being more compassionate, and they understand they are not alone. Yeah, not alone, because most of us have got imposter syndrome. Yes. Eski, I could talk to you all day. Yeah. Yeah. I love your energy. I love your insight. 

Thank you for being my guest today. Thank you so much for having me. And I wish you well. Thank you. Thank you so much. Me too. Thank you.