#17 | Part 3 Elliot Awin - Growth Mindset Secrets For Achieving Life Goals + The Power Of Self Initiative

0:00:00 - Speaker 1

Previously in part two 3,000 miles in 44 days and one hour. Ideally, I wanted two summers in it, but only ended up with two months in it. Every stroke felt like a 150kg deadlift.

0:00:12 - Speaker 3

I'm really curious as to where this obsession with winning comes from. Have you always been like that? I don't know, mum and dad.

0:00:18 - Speaker 1

Yeah, no, not really, no, oh God, I have no idea.

0:00:22 - Speaker 3

And actually, like, as long as you remember, you can remember always wanting to win everything. You did Everything, yeah.

0:00:26 - Speaker 1

And also, it's funny, there's a great book called Mindset by Carol Dweck Really good book, and it talks about the fixed versus growth mindset. So fixed is I'm not good at Like. Growing up I was not good at English. Therefore I had a very fixed mindset through school thinking I'm not good at like. Growing up I was not good at English. Therefore I had a very fixed mindset through school thinking I'm not good at English, what's the point of me even trying? Therefore, I'm never going to be good at English because that is what it is. And also I went through school getting being proud of myself for getting E for effort, 1 for attainment in the subjects that I love and I was like therefore I am good at maths and chemistry and physics and therefore no point do I put any effort in because I'm already good and I think that in hindsight I would much prefer to have a bit more of a growth mindset growing up.

And so I worked a little bit on that philosophy piece of like. I'm not good at English, and then you just suffix it with yet okay, like I can't play the piano. No, yeah, you can't play the piano. Yet where was that shift? Uh, probably during the whole process of the road right yeah, as late as that.

And so I think also, if you have a fixed mindset, um, attainment is everything and therefore my obsession from winning probably comes as a I am nothing without that attainment okay, like that one for achievement or that that winning that match, and so because I valued effort less growing up, I've probably therefore valued coming second less okay, yeah, no, no, I get that, and so I get that not, not it's the taking part that counts, because obviously I still don't like taking the taking part that counts, but at the same time it is like trying to like sit and be more aware and conscious of the, the effort and and rather than the full attainment and enjoying the process and enjoying

the processing and I think that's something that's been quite a rude awakening, having come second in something that I probably will never do well, definitely never do again solo and never being able to like redeem myself. And I think that, looking at um test cricketers, for example, have a very high depression rate and I think it's probably because they're like their chance of redemption is so low. Let's, you're in, you're playing cricket, you get out for a duck you go away.

Yes, sit and watch everyone else, whereas if you like catch the ball in rugby and you knock it on there's a chance when you're like I'm gonna make a massive impact in 30 seconds time the next ball I get.

So I think where that chance for redemption is lacking, it's where there's like a huge like opportunity for depression to seep in. And so therefore, like reframing and using different metrics of success like I love the, the sort of analogy of absolute success versus relative success. Like crossing the Atlantic is absolutely successful, the relative success compared to the people in my race. I came second so therefore it's a failure relative to what I wanted to do, but actually, absolutely it's, that's, that's yeah, that's unbelievable that's awesome.

0:03:44 - Speaker 2

You said that was probably your biggest with that. Was that your biggest lesson you learned about yourself during the row was that?

0:03:50 - Speaker 1

I would take, I would, I would merge the row with all the preparation for the row as well, and so, like the journey that, like that, three years has been, I think that growth mindset, fixed mindset piece is it's more due to who?

0:04:02 - Speaker 2

you are, do that give you a ton of purpose, not just the wave wrangler stuff, but also for yourself knowing stopping rugby. You know rugby's your identity. In a way, rugby was my identity, rugby was, still is, your identity and it's I don't think people understand like it's it's a sport, but it's such a powerful thing, like it's your friends, it's your family, it's your community of people. Did you feel like that row gave you that sort of purpose again? And then also the social purpose with the charity to help other people.

0:04:32 - Speaker 1

Yeah, I actually think, my discovery of all these different tool sets and being able to, and hopefully being able to, communicate some of those two people, um, like I thought on the on the road, that I'm gonna write a book about all the like tools that I used and like you should, and uh, yeah, but so long story.

But so, for example, I work in a family business with my dad and I said to him, well, I'm going to take every Friday off to write a book. And he's like okay. So, like, brush down the rug Every Friday, organise a meeting. Like so, I'm like okay. And then I was like I'm going, he's like, oh, on this Friday, how important.

0:05:20 - Speaker 3

And he's like, oh, whatever's more important to you, and I'm like that's horrible, isn't it? Don't leave me with that question, yeah. And I'm like, well, it's smart, it's not, it's not smart, it's just, and so I'm like.

0:05:25 - Speaker 1

Well, what is more important to my mental health is whether that book ever gets published. It's essentially all the tools that I have used, as well as that identity piece to like right to my 25 year old self, who or the five year old who yeah?

0:05:41 - Speaker 3

or the five.

0:05:41 - Speaker 1

Yeah Well, yeah, and uh, yeah, yeah. And to to sort of use these tools as to like how you can consciously live a bit better, rather than just when you say your identity is this, you're that you're already like putting an identity on yourself or or joe or or me, when actually the values around, what we all enjoy about rugby is so different, like if you, it also like allows more people into that sport as well, so like, let's say, they see us three rugby player. We're pretty much at like we could be out of the same mold, right, and and that therefore just says, oh, that's what a rugby player is that cookie cutter.

Yeah, yeah, exactly and so like, oh, I can't play rugby because I'm not I'm not this, yeah, I am not.

I don't like going out for beers on a saturday evening or like I, I don't. I don't want to be the rugby player that the social norm pictures and therefore I don't want to be the rugby player that the social norm pictures and therefore I don't want to play a sport that that is what's associated with it. Whereas if the identity of rugby player is very diverse or we, like all and it's obviously impossible but all identify as our values and our thoughts and motivations, it's far more open to people coming in who share those values, rather than what society dictates should be a rugby player.

0:07:03 - Speaker 3

It's true.

0:07:05 - Speaker 2

How important do you think is having a purpose, as well as identity, as we've discussed, but actually having a purpose and something to pursue? How important do you think that is in life?

0:07:16 - Speaker 1

It's really weird because I didn't think that I'd have, like, the arrival blues, you know where. So you get to a destination and you're like, ah, it's not as great as I thought it was yeah so like the row is finished what now?

0:07:27 - Speaker 3

what now? And the number of people have asked me like what's now, what's my purpose?

0:07:31 - Speaker 1

it's like I do think that it's itelling that purpose and I love the concept of Ikigai and it has been kind of westernised to some extent, with a Venn diagram of course, with the idea of something you love, something you're good at, something that the world needs and something you can get back paid for, and that that sort of rolls into other theories of motivation and purpose as well. But the idea that if you can tick all those boxes like you want to do something you love, obviously that's like playful. If you, if you, if you enjoy what you do for work, you never work a day in your life kind of vibe and something that the world needs.

You feel rewarded for doing that job. So if you just love it but no one needs it, you're like, well, what's?

0:08:18 - Speaker 3

the point. What's the point in doing it?

0:08:19 - Speaker 1

and that you feel a bit like vacuous. Um, obviously you need to get paid for it because economical pressure, like we'd need to live and pay the bills, like sadly that is there's no choice, yeah, yeah and then something that you're good at, because if that comes into the enjoyment piece as well, because if you're, if you're not good at it, you just feel a bit hopeless and then if any one of those things is missing, you can replace it with something that might not be that thing.

So like you're like doing a day, day job and then running a podcast on the side. The podcast fills a few of those pieces like the world needs people to have these kind of conversations yeah, massively might not get paid for it very well, but we need to like have those.

Yeah, that's the day job yeah exactly, and so understanding why you do each piece of your, the the rich tapestry that is your day-to-day and your, your week, has to fill different places. So, like the day job or like, fill it. Yeah, earning, earning cash is obviously important and that, and you might just do the day job just for that. But if you can fill the other three things in your spare time, then it's a success and it drives purpose.

0:09:26 - Speaker 3

How's your wellbeing, mental health, been since the race itself? Has it been back to the norm and okay?

0:09:33 - Speaker 1

No, it's been bad. As I said, I've felt lonely at times, like I split up with my fiancee of 12 years in the july before the row, so I came home to empty house um that's hard, it was really hard.

0:09:48 - Speaker 3

Yeah, 2022, sorry, no, no, no 2023.

0:09:51 - Speaker 1

So like what nine months ago? 10 years ago. Um so, coming home to an empty house and I said that lonely piece of like, who do I don't to bother anyone like to be to go for a coffee on a Saturday or whatever, which is where like going to that discipline of going to CrossFit class is so important.

I bet, but I've. I know what is missing. I did therefore needed to just be really proactive into like what, to build up a support network for myself that allows me to not be so depressed like I've had like mates over every Wednesday for like steak and wine and then that's like yeah. I'm able to share stuff I love, which is cooking steak like local produce from dorking butchery that sounds good and and like wine and so like I love sharing, like my passion, with people and so therefore doing organizing a couple of those, for example, love that.

0:10:44 - Speaker 3

So do you find that, those boxes that you were looking to take earlier, do you feel like they are there at the minute? You think they're more so than they were, maybe a couple of months ago.

0:10:51 - Speaker 1

I think my autonomy is lacking at the moment, sort of working in the wine business and just trying to work out what the next where what the next. It's sad, but like what the next thing is and what I really want to be doing, and actually the thing I've now started to love is this whole motivation.

It's not motivational, but like it is, yeah yeah I love this this piece of analyzing what tools I used over the last three years to get to this point in time and the idea of being able to share that is really. I'm quite looking forward to being able to share that yeah, it's just how I share it. And what sort of journey I go on to say if I write a book, how do how do I make that? How do I make that? Wash its face, for example.

0:11:39 - Speaker 2

How do?

0:11:39 - Speaker 1

I develop what's important, and obviously fitness comes into it as well. I think there's a big crossover between mental fitness and physical fitness and the idea of potentially helping people in both areas with their motivation to be healthy rather than fit, even like that time when I had my heart rate was going 220 beats a minute for five hours. Had I had any like blockings of arteries or like, or weakness in arteries, etc. I would be dead, yeah, and it was only because I was healthy and fit that this unknown arrhythmia didn't kill me.

And so yeah, the idea of keeping healthy and helping people sort of stay in that bracket.

0:12:25 - Speaker 2

Amazing. What are your sort of aspirations going forward now? Obviously, we've talked about loads of stuff, but if there was one sort of goal in sight long term, do you have one? Or you just sort of take it day by day and figuring out a plan as we, as you go at the moment?

0:12:39 - Speaker 1

yeah, day by day and and the idea of I quite like this book, like yeah, I'm saying it now because like. It's like what's?

0:12:46 - Speaker 3

the first rule of doing a big challenge is tell everyone yeah, because you become like accountable to like now you're gonna be like next time you see me you're like elliot, have you started your book yet?

0:12:57 - Speaker 1

like, and because, like, yeah, you can be held accountable to someone, other people, if you know that some people are incredibly intrinsically motivated and I wish I could be that person, but I needed a pt for the road because I know my way around the gym, but I needed him to be like, chasing me, like, have you done this? Have?

I would have just done the stuff I like rather than the like boring it's a really good point I know I'm not intrinsically motivated to do stuff, so I needed to be held accountable to him, and so, yeah, if you're going to do something, tell everyone about it, and therefore you can't back it's spot on it's and I'll buy the book.

0:13:34 - Speaker 2

By the way, I'll just say I'll definitely buy it, get on it, head down and start writing this afternoon I like to end on this, and we always ask this question, but if there's one piece of advice you've learned or been given over your life that you'd like to share with the viewers and listeners, that sort of change your life could have molded the direction you've gone in. What piece of advice would that be?

0:13:59 - Speaker 1

uh, wow, there's so much um, I think it would be the a mindset, or one of my favorite quotes for the entire row is if you think you can or you think you can't, you're probably right. And that like flitch flicking, like binary mindset of the number of people who said I can't row the Atlantic. I've just seen you row the Atlantic. I can't, I couldn't do that. I'm like, yeah, you couldn't. If you carry on thinking like that, if you then switch your mindset suddenly to I can do this, you probably can. And so I think finding ways and methods and tools to flick your mindset from can't to can and that sounds so easy, but I used a number of different tools, like that analysis of purpose through Ikigai, that analysis of purpose through wicked guy, analysis of motivation through self-determination theory they are pieces of like tools that I self-help pieces basically. Basically that if you find them that relate to you, you should be able to like, change your mindset to.

I think I can do this and then that sort of growth mindset versus fix it's I can't do this yet, yeah, and therefore, and therefore, sort of changing that mindset and it's just that like can't to can obviously sounds easy, but it is literally just that. And then, once you can, you start generating feelings towards the can and like that manifest piece is like I can do this.

Therefore, you start resonating an energy that allows people to like get on board with your can and therefore sort of starts to help you. I think there was a. There was a great saying like if you, if you saw someone on the side of the road sitting in their car and they're broken down, has a warning lights on, but they're sitting in the car in the middle of the motorway and if they're sitting in the car, you're not going to get out and help them push, but if they're pushing their own car you're going to stop and help them push and that same thing is like I can do this and therefore everyone else is going to start helping you and that sort of energy that you are generating allows you to start and do basically that's huge, that's awesome.

0:16:04 - Speaker 2

Yeah, I love that.

0:16:05 - Speaker 1

One absolute pleasure thank you so much for coming on. That was really nice.