Gen Z Shares Hope and Skepticism for the Future

Heather Hester (she/her) (00:01.362)

Welcome back everyone. I am so excited to introduce three extraordinary people today and welcome them on to Just Breathe. And I have to have to say you've heard Grace before on the show and it's been so enlightening and exciting. And today she has invited two of her closest friends to join us for a really cool conversation and a look into how

this age group thinks about what's going on in the world right now and particularly thinks about this upcoming election and just what it's like to be college kids right now in this moment in time. So super, super excited to just introduce and welcome onto the show, Luke and Lars and Grace. And thank you so much for agreeing to be here on this early Sunday morning.

Lars Arlandson (00:57.592)

course. Thanks for having

Luke Peebler (00:58.726)

It's good to be here.

Heather Hester (she/her) (01:01.342)

Good to be back. Good to be back. Yes, I'm so happy. Good. Well, I'm going to just kick it off really quick because I think this is a big question that a lot of people are curious about, which is where do you get your news when you're learning things about what's going on in the world? What is your go -to? This is what I find to be the most reliable.

Lars Arlandson (01:29.0)

yeah, I can start. I get my news, mainly from three sources, NPR, New York Times, and the Wall Street Journal. NPR obviously is the national public radio. like, obviously that's, coming from the government. It came from an act in the seventies, I believe. So that, is a very reliable source. it's often been scrutinized, I think, just because it comes from.

the government, but there's a great NPR podcast that I like. listen to it a lot at the beach, to the dismay, of course, of all the patrons of the beach. And I'd say that, well, that's obviously more analysis, but where I go to just get like straight news is going to be more than New York Times, which is obviously probably the most circulated newspaper in the country, one of the most in the world.

It's an incredibly reliable source for good news. Of course, it's also incredibly scrutinized and a lot of people consider it a little bit left leaning of a source, but still incredibly reliable, incredible. And then the third source is the Wall Street Journal, which is great for news,

It was bought out maybe in 2013 by Rupert Murdoch, who is a big business magnet who owns Fox News and the New York Post. And he's had kind of a conservative shift go into the journal. So because of that, I think that it's important to take a lot of the analysis and editorial with a grain of salt. But I think that the straight news is still very good with the Wall Street Journal because it's also very...

famous and credible source.

Luke Peebler (03:24.062)

I won't claim to read the paper every day. And I don't think, I'm not like

How do you say, like I don't, I don't turn on NPR every day and like listen to the daily rundown, but I will say I find my news most often through, like Laura said, I read a lot of the New York Times. I find a lot of my news through social media. And what I find is that

will get pushed or, you know, I'll find an interesting article and then I'll do a personal more like deep dive on it to find more reliable sources. Cause obviously, you know, seeing someone's reaction to a, an interesting headline on Twitter, for example, is, you know, one thing, but it's not, it's not necessarily quality news. something I also have,

done like thinking about over the past few years really is I think a lot of people and myself included, you know, do watch or consume sort of like prime time media like news coverage. And it's important to me that I get my news from like, other places than just that. Because, you know, for for better for worse, almost all of that

You know, it's editorial work. It's, people sharing their thoughts on, on new situations. There's, there's moments that are very factual. but I find, you know, if I want to sort of come to my own conclusions about something, I, it's not the best place to go. You know, it's, I want to see, you know, what the facts are. And, you know, before I, before I hear

Luke Peebler (05:33.222)

people's thoughts. But it is nice to have, you know, things like that to to open up a conversation in lieu of, you know, having like a bunch of people at a roundtable to talk to you about various articles. So yeah.

Heather Hester (she/her) (05:50.312)

Right. Would you like to add anything? Yeah, I mean, I pretty much agree. always get, I get emails every day from the New York Times, which is super helpful and kind of draws my attention to some things that I can look further into. But finding a source that you trust, whether it is for just like a headline like the New York Times or someone that you trust to do a deeper dive if you have more questions.

Luke Peebler (06:01.907)

Mm -hmm.

Heather Hester (she/her) (06:19.932)

is really important. Yeah, I think that kind of goes to my my part B of this question, which is how do you discern really what is true and what's false out there? Like, how do you get to the bottom of which I think all three of you really answered already quite well, which dispels and I bring that up mainly because I think it dispels a lot of the thoughts out there that

your generation only gets your news from reading one headline on social media. That's probably TikTok, right? And which no shade to TikTok because I do love TikTok, but I love also what all three of you said, which is I see something and then I check other sources that I know are credible and reliable and well researched and to learn more, to figure out kind

what's true and what's false. I think that's, I love hearing the level of discernment that you already have. My gosh, you guys are just kind of amazing because I will speak for my age group and say that we did not have this level of discernment at this age. Some people don't even have it at this age. So well done.

I think that's just incredibly, well, there's lots of words for that, but I will go on and say, I'd love to know what issues are most important for you, not just specific to the election, but just kind of in general. Like even if there weren't a major election this year, what would be the most important issues to you and why?

Lars Arlandson (08:17.446)

Well, I definitely think for me and probably a lot of people in my generation now as we move into the workforce and into college, issues that have to deal with infrastructure and monetary issues are becoming increasingly more relevant to our lives. Just for me personally, I'm always kind of like the bigger issues for me are how can we get free healthcare in this country? How can we get affordable housing?

And how can we get free education or more affordable education and more student loan forgiveness and debt forgiveness? Because those are, like we're starting to see the price of college, the price of health care, the price of rent. so that's definitely going to be a bigger thing moving forward. Well, I guess that's already been a big thing for adults and people realizing. But I think that Americans

including myself, pay a lot in taxes and I'll always see a lot come out of that and they want to see more come out of taxes so that they can have that trust, that built relationship between government and citizen. So those are probably my big issues.

Heather Hester (she/her) (09:33.365)

I love that. I have kind of a follow -up question really quick for that, Lars.

think that is such a concern and a wise issue for you to be thinking about and really kind of pulling apart. And it's something that I know people of older generations are like, my gosh, free healthcare. We cannot do free healthcare. And for many reasons, they think that. And I don't agree with them, but I would love for you, if you have recommendations for it, this is why.

we're concerned about this. This is why we're thinking about this. This is why this is so important. And here are some examples of places that this has worked. Like this is because I think that's always the first pushback. Well, this doesn't work. This isn't going to work. Why will it

Lars Arlandson (10:28.3)

Well, I think, and Luke, you can chime in too, I think that we are, I believe, one of the only developed countries in the high development list that doesn't have free or extremely affordable healthcare. If you look all across Europe, they're always making fun of us for it. They're like, we can't believe you have to pay that much to get in the ambulance. It's always a conversation. And some of the reasons people won't think

will work are because of maybe concern out of private health care practices, the fear of anything that could possibly be considered more socialist and communist because of our American cultural heritage, and fears of that. Anything else, Luke?

Luke Peebler (11:16.944)

Yeah, I mean, so I wanted to, I'll save my piece and then I'll share my thoughts as well. But I, this is something that is so interesting to me because, you know, we, in America, for some reason, there's this sort of fear of socialists and like the word socialism, right? And I, I understand that people have heard this word in association

know like a whole lot of maybe bad things in the past, but it's really hard to take it seriously personally because so many of them are like what we so much of the biggest stuff that we see out of our tax dollars is like quote unquote socialist right like one of my biggest one of the biggest things that you really see out of your tax dollars is like the federal highway.

like the highway system, right? And it's like, you know, so we're all paying into a pot to provide a resource to, you know, to improve, you know, the quality of life, or, you know, there's like all these, all these things that we already pay into, you know, social security, it's literally in the name. It's like, we pay into these things. And, you know, for like,

You people have things to say about them, sure, but they there's no doubt that they improve, you know, our quality of life. And it's, you know, it always confuses me this argument with, with like, nationalized healthcare or like, you know, single payer healthcare that like, were that like your taxes will go up. And it's like, sure, your taxes would go up, but also you're, you're not paying for

insurance anymore. You know, it's not getting taken out of your, you know, your paycheck or you're not paying that you don't have to worry about, you know, the same, insurance is awful. It's so bad. And yeah, yeah. And, and also, you know, you know, Lars mentioned that the United States is one of the only, like, highly developed nations without

Heather Hester (she/her) (13:30.088)

Right. Well, like all the deceptible stuff and the, you know, what's out of and yeah, exactly. Great point.

Luke Peebler (13:45.726)

fear of reduced cost healthcare. this is something that, know, we have like pharmaceuticals are so expensive in the US and it's partially because we're the only country really that will that are dumb enough to pay like, you know, $45 ,000 for a pill, you know, every other country is saying, you know, hey, we're not going to do that. Or, you know, we're going to cover the costs on behalf of

you know, are our citizens, but the US is where they can go to basically price gouge, you know, the consumer and make them make their money back. And I don't think that's okay. You know, I don't think that that's something that we should be comfortable with. And it's only possible because, you know, and I hate to sound conspiratorial, but you know, these the insurance companies, the pharmaceutical companies, you know, it's all sort of when private interests

you know, really the key factor there, it's not going to be in the interest of, you know, saving us money or making us healthier even. It's about, you making, making a buck at the end of the day. And I don't think that that should be the motivation behind our healthcare. And I think that, you know, sort of moving to a more social system would be just better overall. Nothing else would take some of the money out of

you know, all of the healthcare system and maybe we would get less of those pharmaceutical ads on TV.

Heather Hester (she/her) (15:20.786)

Right. my, that's a whole other conversation. Well, I think too, like kind of to your points, which I'm just sitting here thinking, take that off the table and you make that easier for every human being, you know, specifically in our country. That takes away so much stress. So then you automatically increase the quality of life and all that energy that goes toward worrying about, you know, healthcare or

Luke Peebler (15:44.188)

Absolutely.

Heather Hester (she/her) (15:50.94)

you know, how am going to pay for, you know, this pill that I need next month, right? All of that energy can go into things that are positive or, know, and something that that person wants to be doing with their life or just, you know, whatever it may be. But a positive shift in energy, which I think is, my gosh, I just, so important. And I hope, I really do hope that is something that in your lifetimes that happens.

Luke Peebler (16:12.688)

It's so important.

Heather Hester (she/her) (16:22.609)

I hope it happens before I'm too old, but you know, that is the great hope. Is there anything that you would like to, anything that this has sparked for you? Yeah, I don't know. It's like bringing up the idea of, you know, people are afraid of socialism. it sparked in my mind the idea that

There are so many people in our country and just in general that are afraid of things just because they don't fully understand it. there's just, whether they don't understand it because someone's told them something different or because they've never looked into it fully, there's just a lot of not knowing and that causes fear and just more problems from that fear.

And sure there's a fear in knowing, you know, the more you know, the more you might fear, but it's more dangerous to be so uneducated, especially today. And, you know, just if I came home here to say one thing, it is to be as educated as you can and you will make, you know, at least you can say at the end of the day, whatever decision you come to,

it's backed by understanding and not fear.

Luke Peebler (17:55.634)

I absolutely agree. I think too, you know, like the fear of change is really something that as at least in our generation, it's something that we're, I don't know, like sick and tired of. It's, know, we definitely, you know, have grown up in an America that, you know, the status quo, you know, the sort of society that

Heather Hester (she/her) (17:57.246)

Bravo.

Luke Peebler (18:25.798)

that was so prosperous, you know, it's maybe was maybe, you know, a little bit behind us. And so when you're afraid to change and you're afraid to adapt and to, you know, like get with the times, you know, the status quo becomes where the status quo of the past becomes very quickly outdated. and I think it's, you know, it's important to stay.

like you said, stay knowledgeable, to stay educated, because if you refuse to see the world for what it is, I think that that can be very harmful for yourself and for society as a

Heather Hester (she/her) (19:13.844)

Absolutely. Well, I think you all have a very unique perspective in that you're post 9 -11 babies. have your entire school career has been in the age of doing lockdown drills and that being a very real fear. You lived through a pandemic. You, I mean, you've had some

extraordinary things happen just in the 18, 19 years that you've been on this earth. That many people can, know, other generations cannot say that they've lived through, right? And social media. I mean, you've been here for the birth of social media, you know, of all of these things that have just given you wisdom at a much younger age, have given you the opportunity to be able to see

So in such a greater way than ever before so it's such a unique perspective that you have and I think it's such a gift and It's one of the many reasons I'm just so excited about your generation because you guys are gonna be the one that you are gonna change all of this so every time I You know hear someone of your age speak or you know see I'm like

Like everybody listen because there's just so much wisdom and depth to what you all have to say. So I'm getting ulterior thinking about this. Sorry. Okay. So we're going to move on to the next question, which is which one I'm kind of excited about. So I'm excited to hear what you all think. So now that Kamala Harris is the presumptive nominee, not official yet, presumptive, do you feel

more hopeful about the future and why or why not.

Lars Arlandson (21:19.96)

well, I definitely think there's two conversations that I am seeing from Gen Z on the left. The first conversation, and I would say the larger one and maybe more where my beliefs lie is that there is a shift in the energy in this election and things are more hopeful and things look better for the Democratic Party than they did previously. And then there's a minority, but it's

prolific minority, especially on social media, that believes that Kamala is the same as, well, this isn't true, but they believe that Kamala is just the same as Biden, maybe even the same as Trump, the same as any of these evil politicians. She's not going to change anything and everyone's still going to be miserable and you should not vote for her. You should either vote for third party or you should write somebody else in or you should just...

give up and it's almost like they want this crazy revolution with a red army to start or something. It's like they, it's this belief on the far left that.

that everything, like that the greatest evil is capitalism. And so we can't take any steps beyond just uprooting the entire system. But I saw an interesting perspective on this. I wish I knew, remembered where I saw this from, but it was this idea that, well, in order to uproot everything, we have to send all of the most disenfranchised people in the country to the front lines and watch them get martyred for us.

Luke, you have anything to say?

Luke Peebler (23:06.586)

You know, I see this too and I... my screen is lagging. Can you guys hear me okay?

Heather Hester (she/her) (23:12.284)

It's okay. You're good. It'll be okay. You look totally good on this side. Yeah, you're

Luke Peebler (23:15.996)

Okay, I just want to make

I see this online a lot. You know, I, I spend time on Twitter. I have Twitter account, you know, I do a lot of reading on there and it's really interesting. You know, obviously definitely the energy shifted when Kamala, you know, was announced as the new, the new candidate. and, you know, there's been this huge sort of surge

energy into the campaigns. And I'm so excited to see that because personally, you know, I, you know, I was like, I wasn't that, you know, excited about the election. It's not that it wasn't, you know, something I was looking for, like voting wasn't something I was looking forward to doing. It's just that it was like, you know, like, I'm not super hyped. I'm not really

you know, excited to go and, you know, vote for this guy. I, I'm like, when Kamala stepped in, I was, you know, it's just, it's not that I, you know, necessarily, you know, am completely in line with everything she says, or, you know, that I like, you know, love all of her politics, but it's, it's just to me,

God, it's so good to have someone new in there for the first time in what seems like forever. You know, it's not, I very much remember, you know, back in 2019, I guess, when everybody was, all of the Democrats were trying to, you know, they were all running. They were all running and they were all, you know,

Luke Peebler (25:11.058)

vying for this spot basically to beat out Trump. it was just, you know, I had my thoughts on that. You know, I personally like, I was very invested despite not being able to vote at the time. but you know, then watching sort of the most, safest sort of candidate come out of that was

Heather Hester (she/her) (25:26.056)

You

Luke Peebler (25:40.528)

It was frustrating, because, like, I understand the circumstances, you know, the party needed someone that everyone could unify behind to sort of beat out this really great evil. But it still was just frustrating that like, okay, you know, we're, we got all these cool people who want to do cool stuff, and we're going to get like, the one guy who's just sort of, you know, the face of the party overall and not really, didn't really stand for much. Obviously.

He did a lot of great stuff. You know, we ended up seeing a lot more out of his presence than I personally expected. but you know, now that we have this sort of shift, I think the energy is really back, especially in my generation, our generation, like the, you know, people are, excited. I think that's so important. and I definitely have seen, like Lars mentioned, I've seen the,

online pushback to Kamala's sort of candidacy, I've seen this sort of rhetoric from the very furthest left that, you know, like on key issues, particularly Israel -Palestine, you know, that she's not

you doing the right thing, that they're all terrible and blah, blah, blah, blah. And my thing is, my personal philosophy on this at least, is sure, you know, they're not like, maybe they're not, you know, doing everything they want, like you want them to.

Luke Peebler (27:30.62)

My problem is like, can't like they're all the suggestion is yeah, vote third party or don't vote at all. And it's really hard because in the, the way that our system is set up right now in the U S barring, you know, some grand change that's let's face it, not going to happen before, you know, in the next three months, like we have a two party system and it's, it's hard, you know, you

because you don't necessarily get all of your opinions represented by, you know, the person you're voting for. But it's like, you got to get some of them in, you know, and if your choices are between like, one person who stands for maybe 80 % of what you believe in and one person who stands for none of what you believe in and stands against what you believe in, it's like, how are you going to come out here and say that you're not going to vote for, you know, the one

clearly more invested in fighting for you. I don't know. That's sort of what I've seen and what I've gathered from the situation.

Heather Hester (she/her) (28:40.67)

that's very well said. Yeah. I mean, I've seen very similar things where it's just the idea of people don't want to have to do the lesser of two equals, you know, and it sadly is like kind of where we are that you do have to pick. It's you can't pick that third option thinking that that's going to do something other

Like, it's just, it's not gonna do what you're wanting it to do. It really,

Heather Hester (she/her) (29:21.758)

People are upset at the current situation, but voting third party or not at all isn't gonna change the situation at hand. And it isn't gonna change in the next four years for the next election, you know, if you don't vote, you know, for who has at least some of your beliefs. And going back to something like you'd said, I guess like a

earlier in your statement, Luke. Yeah, was the beginning of this. I was so excited. I was like turning 18 and voting. was really excited. I was so excited to vote. And then, you know, as things like started to develop more, I was less and less excited because it was like, this is a lot of pressure. This is a huge first election.

and the circumstances of it where you're gonna be so stressed and it's like, okay, well it's still just my one vote and I don't wanna have to watch my rights and livelihood slip away from me, you know? And having Kamala become potentially the candidate now, I have

a huge change in tides in a lot of people where, including me, people are more excited and more interested in something that a teacher of ours always said is she always tried to get us super excited for voting and taught us everything she could and just the idea that we are lucky to have this right to vote. Use it.

You know, and it's a little, it's very privileged that some people are considering not voting, just considering, you know, how lucky we are to vote and just this, how much rests in the hands of this election.

Luke Peebler (31:42.63)

I agree. It's definitely, it's hard because I feel like we've been saying this for, you know, eight years. And, and I, I understand why people are tired of sort of, you know, this every election being the most important election. But it's like, it is like it is, it's hard because, know,

Heather Hester (she/her) (31:53.181)

it is.

Luke Peebler (32:11.634)

there's just such a, it's facing such an extreme sort of, you know, opposition. And that, you know, that's what makes it so contentious. And it's not like, you know, I feel like there's definitely been, you know, some presidential races that I've, I don't know, in my lifetime, maybe, that have

a little bit less.

Luke Peebler (32:49.906)

Like, you know, my rights will be determined by this. And especially because I think some more, some of our rights were, or some of, you know, people's rights were a bit more codified, but, you know, it's so it's hard because it's like, it's not, you know, you're not just voting for like your own self, you know, as much because other people's rights are at stake in this election. think more so.

than I have personally seen in the past. It's just like, you know, it's, is a...

it's about that you know it it it is greater than yourself is you know it's just your vote but it's greater than

Heather Hester (she/her) (33:37.064)

think you bring up a really, really good point, Luke. I was writing down some thoughts that you all were bringing up for me. And you're absolutely right. I was just thinking about the elections in my lifetime. And especially early on, mean, was definitely, it was kind of like people who were closer together. So I was like, OK, I happened to like this person's policy more. But it wasn't so much like

the vast separation between not just candidates, but parties. so I think that just makes it so much more glaring of, there are two very separate choices. I appreciate the fact that there's a certain percentage of independent voters in our country. And I think of that more as people who are just independent and not so much

I think they're like independent of like old, old days politics, right? Like not politics of right this moment in time. But I feel like there's so there's a couple of things that I would love your thoughts on kind of when it comes to this. And you can you can grab on to whatever resonates with you. One is, do you feel like this election is an election that's kind

looking at human rights versus policy. And then a very separate question that we can even circle back to, but talking about the two party system.

Heather Hester (she/her) (35:17.234)

Do you think that completely revamping or perhaps doing away with the electoral college would help in the way we look at the two party system and perhaps it not being a two party system? Two separate questions, so you can take whichever you want.

Luke Peebler (35:42.77)

I'm happy to talk about the second one, if you don't mind. I was reading something, it was probably on social media the other day. They talked about the way that the US electoral system is set up and how we have these two systems in place. The first one

Heather Hester (she/her) (35:45.534)

Sure.

Luke Peebler (36:11.998)

Our elections are first past the post, which means basically whoever gets 50%, or whoever gets past a certain threshold of the vote wins. And we also have a Senate system, so it's not parliamentary. And these two things sort of combined make it

it sort of sets up the precedent for a two party system because you have, you know, there's not really an opportunity for inter -party coalitions or, you know, for, you know, one sort of ideology to reign in a certain area and a different underbrain in a different area because you all have to sort

you know, it's whoever gets the most, the most votes. And, and so like, you're forced to sort of split into factions. It's the person said it more eloquently, of course, but it was, I just thought it was really interesting in the way that we sort of approach our party system. And I think, you know, it is, it is difficult, you

I know plenty of people who, you know, they maybe agree with like the Republican party about certain financial policies, but they, you know, don't agree with like the taking away human rights policies. and I, I, I wish that there were, you know, options. I wish that we could vote

you know, a party that like, love, you know, was like, their big thing was like healthcare, you know, like somewhat a place that was like, if you know, you live in an area with a lot of farmland, like, you know, there was a party that represented like the farmers, like there's all like, because of our system, we lose out on a lot of, of some sort of individual representation. And I think it would

Luke Peebler (38:36.606)

valuable to have that. Yeah, I mean, I don't know how I would go about changing it. It's definitely really ingrained, especially over the past sort of eight to 12 years, I think, like, how, like, your, your social circle and your identity and your ideology are all directly related to like who you vote for, you know what mean? Like, you very, like, it's very much

It's become very, very sort of isolated, I think, at least. so breaking that would be very difficult, but I do, I see the potential for better systems, especially in a place like the United States that has so many people, you know, there's obviously going to be different things represented. It's just, you know, whether or not we can actually get

Heather Hester (she/her) (39:33.62)

Yes.

Lars Arlandson (39:35.82)

Yeah, definitely I would agree with lot of what you said there. And it's hard. The Electoral College is embedded in the Constitution. So it would have to be an amendment. And that's going to be really difficult to have that process. Not necessarily impossible, because I think a lot of people on all sides are questioning the merit of this kind of system. Maybe moving towards.

Well, first and foremost, the president obviously has to be super overarching in their campaign. Kamala Harris is going to have to do a lot of campaigning in areas where her, where the Democratic Party doesn't necessarily have a lot of control, which feels a little strange to say the least

we have to go into these places where there's different niches and then we just have to try to convince them to join our side with like 500 policy issues that we care about on this exact specific way. And that is how it looks right now, which is kind of bleak. And I also think that just looking at our two party system,

I can sympathize with a lot of the far left sentiment that the conservative party is able to rally behind more extreme policy choices as one whole unit a lot better than the Democratic party is. The Democratic party, in my opinion, is definitely the more moderate of the two parties in terms of who they're bringing

as their presidential candidates, maybe not so much in congressional spaces, but I feel that sympathy that they're saying, wait, we have this pretty moderate person who's making all of these concessions and then they pick Trump who is very far right and they can all, despite maybe being just fiscally conservative as Luke was talking about, they're all rallying around him in

Heather Hester (she/her) (41:29.608)

Mm -hmm.

Lars Arlandson (41:52.526)

that creates hostility and contention in the Democratic Party, definitely. So it'd be nice if there were more subgroups so that we could see more representation that wasn't so extreme.

Heather Hester (she/her) (42:14.108)

Yeah, I think some of that circles back to what you were saying earlier, that the Republican Party, and I feel weird using that word, because I feel like that's not even what they are anymore. I feel like, you know, it's kind of the party of Trump. They are very good at using fear. And that's kind of like the center of the platform.

It's been fascinating to watch. I remember years ago before, you know, it was probably 2013 or 2014. I was having a conversation with a friend who was like, Trump's going to be the nominee. And I was like, what on earth are you talking about? Like, this is the most insane thing I've ever heard. Like, I remember where I was standing. I remember looking at this person thinking that they had three heads and now being in this place and being like, has this been, if, you

all of the things that are horrible, but standing back and just watching like how fascinating it has been to see them effectively use fear. the Democrat party needs to, you know, what is the counter of that? Like how, you know, what is the positive flip of that? And how is that? And again, that's not gonna be something that's gonna be figured out in the next three months. That's something like for the longevity of moving forward.

But I only bring that up as just kind of, you know, responding to.

to what you've been saying. It's just a fascinating thing to see how this is, and kind of fast. mean, in a historical sense, like this has happened very quickly. anyway, just my thoughts on that.

Luke Peebler (44:07.902)

Well, it's so true, like, sorry, I don't want to cut you off. Like, the sort of way that the, you know, yeah, like the Trump, like...

Like the way that they've sort of made that a personality, you know, it gives people more to cling onto than just political, you know, ideology, right? you know, you, I don't know, you wear the hats, you fly the flags, you're doing all this stuff. And it's like, you know, for whatever reason you're doing it, doesn't even matter, you know, what are you saying? You know, whether it's

hurt you as a, you know, as a, like a consumer or as a voter or whatever. Like, it's, I don't know, I think some people are just like, you know, once you're attached to that, you can't, you can't get away from it. It's, you know, I think we, were talking about this earlier with sort of the splits in the Democratic party about, you know, ideology and is this, you know, the perfect

president that represents all of our morals, like exactly. And it's like, you know, on the other side, it's like, it doesn't matter what he's saying, which I don't think is good, but you know, it doesn't matter what he's saying. You know, they're, they'll vote for him anyway. And it makes it very hard to, like Lars was saying, with these campaigns, and this ties back to the electoral college as well. But like, then the Democrats are just campaigning in the swing states. And so it allows.

Heather Hester (she/her) (45:48.584)

great.

Luke Peebler (45:51.358)

You know, it creates these like, these areas that's like, these areas are dominated by the Democrats. These areas are dominated by the Republicans and they don't really touch each other. And then, you know, there's areas in the middle and that's where all the funding goes. Like I think Pennsylvania, I was reading a statistic. I remember it was just this year or if it was over the past election cycle, but like they've had over $250 million of,

you know, ad spending for both parties combined. it's like, you know, if we didn't have to worry about like that, you know, we could be doing a lot more productive things. just, it all, it all sort of, the focus, you know, from the Democratic Party is always about bringing Republicans to their side. And I think that makes

the further left, the Democrats are further left, you know, upset as well. And it's like, you're constantly making confessions to bring over a voter base when, you know, they won the popular vote. You know, they have the voters. And so it's just like, you know, you're moving further right to win the electoral college. And I think that's, I know I am deviating from the original point I was making, but I think that that's something that's really frustrating as

Lars Arlandson (47:19.39)

And to just like we're talking about like human rights versus policy and subgroups within it who might be more socially liberal or have certain identities, there's definitely an interesting thing going on with LGBT conservatives, which is this subsect. I have had the pleasure of meeting a few and talking with them. And what I find is that it's definitely the sentiment

Well, I there was this famous tweet once that said the people voting for the leopards eating people's faces party. I never thought the leopards would eat my face. And it's kind of this idea that, well, I'm just going to vote conservative because even though I am gay, I, you know, maybe believe in certain fiscal policies or other things like that. Great. They have your vote. They're still going to take away your rights. And it's a little

bizarre and it probably comes from a place of entitlement and privilege that you think that you're somehow gonna avoid being the target of that because you tried to get an end with them early on in some way. But when push comes to shove, it maybe harkens back even to an earlier thing like the first they came for the socialist but I wasn't a socialist, that kind of poem, that kind of idea too.

So I think that just talking, I've been talking a lot with that voter base, LGBT conservatives, and it's just been.

Heather Hester (she/her) (48:55.699)

Wow.

Luke Peebler (48:59.858)

Well, it's also, it's,

Heather Hester (she/her) (49:03.156)

No, go ahead, go ahead.

Luke Peebler (49:04.976)

I, it's why I think part of the sort of recent messaging we've seen at a democratic party with describing like the Republican, they're like the Republican candidates as a weird, I think has been so, funny, but also like effective, right? Because it's like, you know, here's a guy, you know, saying that he wants like to lower taxes, but then, you know, you call them weird.

And then suddenly all this other crazy rhetoric comes out and it's like, this is like the candidate, it's not necessarily the people, you know, voting for it, but it's like, it helps to sort of shine a light on the fact that like this dude is spouting some like, you know, starts spouting some crazy like 4chan stuff. I like, can guarantee you before 2016, no one like no one in the public sphere knew what 4chan was. And the fact that

the Republican party has normalized us just knowing what 4chan is, wild to me because it is a crazy platform for crazy people. And it's not like, it's to me, I think it's so astute that people, that we're coming up with this sort of messaging because it's, just think it sort of highlights, there are people

believe in like policy stuff. And there's people who believe in taking away people's rights. And there's people who do both. and I think the people who are invested in the policy stuff are voting for people taking away rights, without maybe, I mean, I have to, I have to imagine they understand it at this point, but I hope that they don't, you know? And so it's like, you know, just like sort of getting people to understand

These people are not your, like who you want to be representing you as a Republican, as Republicans. These are people that you do not want to be representing you. like I think that that's so important, you know, because it's not, it's not just like, you know, we had like the tea party and we had like other stuff like that, but it's, it's just a whole nother level of like, this isn't really what I grew up knowing the Republican party as. and.

Luke Peebler (51:30.224)

I don't know if this was an inevitability. don't know if this was what it was destined to become, but it's just really like, it's weird.

Heather Hester (she/her) (51:40.838)

It is. That's like the perfect word. I love that. I think it was Tim Walz that originally said that, which is kind of funny and perfect coming from him as well. But it's a it's a great descriptor. And it like pulls away from there's the. Hateful, cruel, inaccurate rhetoric coming from the other side.

Luke Peebler (51:54.021)

Mm -hmm.

Heather Hester (she/her) (52:10.152)

when a word like weird is used because it's not actually talking about the person, even though in some cases it does apply, it's the behavior, right? So I appreciate that for so many reasons. Something, I feel like there's just so many thoughts, but I don't know. Something kind of interesting is like, you

There are so many subgroups of some people in this election and there's so many people that somehow we need to talk to before the election happens. like, well, two things right now, but that's kind of why social media is so interesting right now. Because, wow, Kamala, she can't be everywhere.

but we are everywhere. And, you know, she has a platform on everything, every social media, she has something there. And just in the past, you know, month, I guess, on TikTok, seeing just everyone's thoughts and just, you know, it's the cool thing in this day and age where people can campaign for other people.

almost. So, you know, starting to teach people and getting enough of a, you know, following, I guess, through that. So it's like she can, you know, campaign where she needs to campaign, but then also trying to, you know, campaign for her a little bit, I guess, which is really interesting. But then the other thing was, I think,

The idea that some people are just always gonna vote for themselves and they don't see the effects that it like, whether they see the effects on other people or not. It's the idea where this election will affect everyone. and I know we've talked about it before, bringing to their attention.

Heather Hester (she/her) (54:36.436)

how this is going to negatively affect them. Because there's so much in, you know, whether it's Project 2025 or... Agenda 47? There's something attacking everyone, you know, in a sense. And, you know, not everyone fully understands every single detail and that's okay, but like bringing to everyone's attention, like, to the group.

that just, you know, they don't pay attention to, you know, politics in any way and sort of, you know, closed off in a sense and, you know, innocent to the world. Great for them, but also not. you know, pushing them to, you know, you can't make someone who isn't empathetic empathetic, but you can help. You can start the process by pointing

This is how it's going to negatively affect you and then getting them to realize that and bring them to potentially think about others as

Luke Peebler (55:48.966)

I totally agree. I think it's hard, you know, especially because of how sort of wide scale the latest elections have been. Like, I don't really know when we got away from like door to door stuff. And I know like, it's not always perfect. But it, you know, there is absolutely like, I think this feeling that the election is very impersonal. It's not, you know, like,

I don't know, maybe it's just because, you know, of where we live, but like I rarely interact with like genuine like campaign people. You know, every once in a, like a blue moon, you know, we'll get someone from like the state legislature or like the house, but it's, it's not, you know, canvassing and in door to door stuff is not something that we really see anymore.

I, you know, it's definitely been sort of replaced by social media targeted advertising, but they're, it's so, it's so different, you know, and it, think nothing will, nothing would make someone listen more than talking to them. And it's, it's what makes it so hard because you can't like have a conversation when no one is, you know, letting you into have that conversation.

all. shutting down the talk and shutting down the conversation is such an important thing for the Republican party. I think it's why we've seen sort of a big push against various social media platforms. when you get rid of that conversation, you get rid of the chance to convince someone

Heather Hester (she/her) (57:19.998)

So.

Luke Peebler (57:49.35)

or do you change someone's beliefs? And, it's like, I, I hope we get back to, you know, having more of those conversations in real life, because I think it's, I think it's really valuable. and, know, just communication as a whole, like, it's not like TikTok bands and stuff. know that the, the democratic party supported some of them. but, you know, I think that's really because

they were pushed into a corner with the, I don't want to give them too much leeway. think that they shouldn't be supporting a TikTok ban, but I think they got pushed into a corner with sort of this narrative that, TikTok is owned by China and the CCP is spying on you. And it's like, that's a really good...

narrative to push if you want, you know, to force politicians into a corner. It's like, okay, you know, this, this social media platform is the enemy. And it's like, you know, if like, all that aside, you know, it's really, it's sort of interesting that this platform that's mainly used by the younger audience that's, you know, is, is, you know, what's the word?

Like it's getting people organized, you know, that this is like run by the enemy. It's like, why, why is this platform that's empowering young people, the enemy? I think that that's like, it's an interesting conversation. You're just shutting off forms of communication and how, you know, we see it, we see them trying to do it. It's not like veiled at

Heather Hester (she/her) (59:40.402)

And I think you see it, right? Your generation sees what's going on. And I think what exactly you're saying is they found something that sparks fear in so many, again, using fear as a very powerful tactic. But you all see that, right? So that is so incredibly huge. I think the other piece too.

And circling back to what you were saying about not seeing people out canvassing anymore, I think there's something behind that which you see in so many ways across the board is taking out the human element, right? So it's so much easier to be against something when there's no human element to it or you are able to actively dehumanize someone or a group of people.

they have found that to be very effective. So, you know, to your point, having these one -on -one conversations, right, puts the human element back in. And whether it's having a conversation with someone that you probably are not gonna change their mind, you still are having that one -on -one conversation, right? And then, you know, there are so many out there where their mind may be changed enough.

that it makes a difference, right? So I just say, you know, keep, keep putting the human element back in because that you've really hit on something that's really important. So I'm looking at our time and holy cow, this has been amazing conversation. I would, I don't want to take up any more of your time today though. So I just want to end with like a final question. And again, you can take both of these parts or just one of these parts, but I'd love for each of you to share.

what you would like either parents to know or politicians to know or both. That's either your personal message or a message of your generation that you just feel is so important that people understand.

Lars Arlandson (01:01:57.522)

I would say for parents, obviously this is the conversation among our generation is just the acknowledgement that things are much different, the acknowledgement that it is harder to achieve certain milestones that it was easier for them to achieve in their lifetime. And of course, millennials have been having this conversation with even boomers for a while.

a new conversation for Gen Z, but it's still definitely ongoing. That conversation is super important with parents, so making sure that parents can use their vote to align with policies of the future that will make the world's

or not, well, this country at the very least, a better place moving forward in for subsequent generations. And for politicians, especially on the left and people at the moderate left, just because we are voting for Kamala Harris does not mean that

Heather Hester (she/her) (01:02:48.712)

I'm done.

Lars Arlandson (01:03:15.382)

making further concessions to the right, we are going to empower Kamala Harris to push us farther to the left. And I want to see that start to take into effect. It's hard, probably, you know, definitely, but the people at the end of the day have still, and still now, some power over our politicians. And I think that Kamala Harris

Hopefully her future administration will know that our generation is the voice to listen to and we can kind of get out of this dark age. But we won't ever if we keep moving farther to the right because the people on the right will close ranks and they will just toe the party line forever and ever. Even if it's crazy and gets crazier and crazier, which it will.

Luke Peebler (01:04:15.578)

Yeah, I absolutely agree with everything you just said. You know, I think in terms of what I would say to parents, Lars, I agree with what you said. And I think to just being sort of understanding of the way in which our our circumstances and what we've seen throughout our upbringing has really, you know, changed.

you know, has caused us to maybe have a different outlook. You know, it's some of the, you know, pessimism that you see definitely demonstrated from Gen Z people, you know, it can be a little bit overstated, but it's definitely not worth brushing off. You know, like you said, you know, we've grown up in an America, at least, that's been very, very different.

from that of previous generations. And, you know, it's changed our outlook on things. And I think that, you know, it's worth listening to us and you know, what we have to say about it because it's, you know, it's what we grew up knowing. And also just the way in which our lives with social media, you know, has been so different. You we've definitely, our generation, think is definitely

the first generation to be like, I would say entirely connected. You know, we grew up with the internet. I think our generation was probably the first one to start getting technology a bit younger and really connecting from a young age. it's like that experience is very valuable as well in the future.

And then yeah, Lake Lar said, you know, for politicians, it's not, it's not over after the election. I think so often we see sort of a big push, you know, to, to vote someone in and then we see silence for four years or two years or however long it is until the next like relevant election ends. it's like, it's

Luke Peebler (01:06:41.572)

over. You you can't expect to be elected in on policies and then not push for them. We see it. We see it when you don't push. Like I said, we're all very connected. We know what's going on. you know, it's like, I have to say, you I've enjoyed

seeing sort of the with with Kamala Harris's campaign sort of the the marketing to Gen Z. But I want to see her represent us. And I want to see that, you know, come through beyond November. So, you know, it's just important to stay on your toes. Because, you know,

we're watching. And I mean that in the best possible way. Like we really care about what's going on. And I think, you know, it's just important that that you care too.

Heather Hester (she/her) (01:07:52.7)

Yeah, I guess what I would say to parents is to just, you know, continue to educate yourself. I think it's just so huge in, you know, everything to be well -knowledged and to

have an understanding, you know? So because things can have like words have so much weight, votes, decisions, everything you do has so much, like carries a lot of weight and you know, just, you know, go forward with knowledge and you know, you're

you can trust that it will be the best decision you can make at that point. And then guess to politicians.

Heather Hester (she/her) (01:09:02.45)

Yeah, your job isn't over once the election is won. And, you know, we're putting a lot of belief in you. Like, giving you our vote, there's a lot of belief. And you have to follow through in everything that you, you know.

promised and continue to pay attention to our voices. The reasons that we voted for you and the reasons we, what we're asking for, just continue to pay attention, I guess.

Heather Hester (she/her) (01:09:54.12)

Yeah, very good. I would just add one thing because I've heard this as like a thread and I want to say it very simply for parents, which is be curious and have a spirit and then.

Heather Hester (she/her) (01:10:13.992)

just be curious when your kids are talking because they know a lot more than what you think they might and ask questions. And I have to say that, and I've said this a million times in this podcast, so people who've been listening for a long time know this, just sheer volume of things that I've learned.

and that have made me want to learn more and question more and look into things more from my kids is extraordinary. So listen to them and be curious about what they're talking about and why they're talking about it. So that is how I will end. I wanna thank you three so much for being here today. This was such a fun conversation to have with all of you and really for me just to kind of sit back and listen. This

really such a gift. So thank you for sharing of your thoughts and yourselves this morning. Thank

Lars Arlandson (01:11:16.162)

Thank you so much for having us. It was a lot of fun.

Luke Peebler (01:11:20.123)

Yeah, thank you. It's been a pleasure.

Heather Hester (she/her) (01:11:20.551)

Good.