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In this Episode Jen + Jane welcome guest Suzanne Culberg (bio below). This is rather a sweary episode, so it is likely not safe for work or for kiddos.
Jen + Jane and Suzanne discuss the traps we can all fall into when we decide to ‘do some work’, the dangers of idolizing a particular person, method, or path, and how endless enthusiasm cannot stop the fact that the beginning is $h!t. They cover everything from over-giving and over-functioning to diet fails and relationship distress.
Enjoy the convo!
Guest Bio:
Suzanne Culberg is an international mindset coach who transforms bodies and minds. She is also a speaker and author (of The Beginning is Sh*t, an unapologetic weight-loss memoir).
Suzanne believes women often gain weight because they give too much to others. They over-eat because they over-give. This pattern of over-giving can also manifest in other areas of life, such as work and relationships.
Suzanne helps her clients deal with negative patterns of behavior, build confidence, and create lasting change.
She lives in Sydney, Australia with her husband and two young children who keep her both busy and entertained.
SOCIAL LINKS:
Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/suzanneculberg
Website - https://www.suzanneculberg.com
Additional Resources/Reading:
● Download the first two chapters of Suzanne's book The Beginning is Sh*t at https://www.suzanneculberg.com/book/
● Ira Glass Quote can be found here:
Questions for further guidance:
● Intention + Attention = Result
● Brene Brown - Clear is Kind
Disclaimer:
On the No Halos Here Podcast, we explore a wide range of topics broadly categorized as well-being. We encourage you to do your own research and make informed choices about your health and wellbeing. The information we provide is never a substitute for qualified advice specific to your individual needs. In listening, you take full responsibility for implementing any suggestions shared on the podcast and you agree to indemnify us completely against all consequences arising directly or indirectly from your choices.
About Jen and Jane
Jen Lang
Jen believes in the power and wisdom of women’s voices. She’s a guide for women who want to tune into and align their inner voice so their outer voice can shine; uniting physical, mental, emotional, and spiritual energies into a powerful voice ready to share your message.
Jane Stark
Passionate about energetic alignment and living life from a place of personal power, Jane is a heart-centered leader, certified health and life coach, and marketing strategist. She leads others to play bigger and feel lighter by helping them see and navigate their blocks and connect more deeply with themselves.
Continue the conversation:
Instagram: www.instagram.com/wearejenandjane
Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/No-Halos-Here-Podcast
Community: Keep up on all things Jen & Jane: http://eepurl.com/hk31JX
Download the Empowerment Playbook: https://www.wearejenandjane.com/playbook
Thanks for listening!
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This is no halos here hosted by Jen Lang and Jane
Jen Lang:Stark, the place to inspire a change in your consciousness to
Jen Lang:elevate the world. We're to heart centered business owners
Jen Lang:nourishing our inner rebels while growing our respective
Jen Lang:businesses.
Jane Stark:No halos here is the result of bringing together an
Jane Stark:opera singer turned spiritual mentor and a marketing
Jane Stark:professional turned while being coached to meditate daily.
Jane Stark:Together we unite physical, mental, emotional and spiritual
Jane Stark:energies into a powerful presence to lead heal and
Jane Stark:inspire. We love exploring the shadowed edges of life, the
Jane Stark:universe and beyond through honest and thought provoking
Jane Stark:conversations. Let's dive in.
Jen Lang:Hi, everybody. Welcome back to another episode of no
Jen Lang:halos here with Jen Lang and Jane Stark. Today we are really,
Jen Lang:really excited to have a fantastic person that I have
Jen Lang:known in the online business world I'm going to say for at
Jen Lang:least four years, probably longer. I'm welcoming, we are
Jen Lang:welcoming Suzanne Kohlberg from Australia to know halos here.
Jen Lang:Welcome, Suzanne.
Suzanne Culberg:Thank you, Jen. Thank you, Jane.
Jane Stark:Hello. So nice to have you here with us. I'm
Jane Stark:really looking forward to this discussion. We had a little
Jane Stark:brief, a brief meet and greet a couple of weeks ago and it was
Jane Stark:so juicy.
Jen Lang:It was it was and we actually have it's just kind of
Jen Lang:ironic. We have bonded over the word shit. Yeah, we kind of
Jen Lang:have, haven't we? Because, you know, one of our tag lines is
Jen Lang:own your shit. Not everyone else's. And Suzanne wrote a book
Jen Lang:called The beginning of shit. So you know, here we are. Here we
Jen Lang:are unpacking, unpacking this shit. So just in case you didn't
Jen Lang:get the memo, this episode is definitely not safe for young
Jen Lang:ears. We'll need to mark it as explicit language. Before we get
Jen Lang:into this. And Suzanne, I'm going to hand this over to you
Jen Lang:to give us a brief introduction about who you are, where you're
Jen Lang:from, and what you're working on. Now.
Suzanne Culberg:Thank you so much, Jen. I must admit the
Suzanne Culberg:introverted me dies inside when it's like Introduce yourself.
Suzanne Culberg:Thank you. So my name is Suzanne Kohlberg. I am an author, a
Suzanne Culberg:healer and a life coach. I call myself the accidental
Suzanne Culberg:entrepreneur because I was going to be a doctor. I did five years
Suzanne Culberg:of medical school, I was almost there. And my, my business
Suzanne Culberg:journey is quite long. I originally was a personal
Suzanne Culberg:trainer, because exercise was the answer for everything. And I
Suzanne Culberg:did that for just over a year. And then I trained to be a
Suzanne Culberg:teacher and decided that I didn't actually want to teach
Suzanne Culberg:people who weren't interested in learning anything. So six months
Suzanne Culberg:of that, then I worked for the government for a couple of years
Suzanne Culberg:in the call center, got the kind of call center but happening on
Suzanne Culberg:a chair. And eventually, I did. I was coached as a client in NLP
Suzanne Culberg:and other coaching practices released to Bhutan and weight
Suzanne Culberg:and become a weight loss coach. And I've recently really shifted
Suzanne Culberg:really into this focus of over giving, because I find,
Suzanne Culberg:especially women, we we give so much to others. And then we will
Suzanne Culberg:often say like nobody ever does anything for me. And we kind of
Suzanne Culberg:have this seething resentment that we would never publicly
Suzanne Culberg:admit to. But I believe that giving and receiving appeared
Suzanne Culberg:states like inhaling and exhaling. So when you give and
Suzanne Culberg:give and give the way that you receive, like an over giver will
Suzanne Culberg:over consume. And that could be eating, which is my history. I'm
Suzanne Culberg:a foodie. But it could also be overworking, over shopping over
Suzanne Culberg:scrolling, compare and despair on Facebook or Instagram, that
Suzanne Culberg:sort of thing. So we are receiving but in ways that
Suzanne Culberg:aren't actually healthy or nourishing for our souls. And so
Suzanne Culberg:that's the focus of my work now how to basically say no without
Suzanne Culberg:feeling like a bitch.
Jen Lang:How do I know if Yeah, the subtitle or the even like
Jen Lang:the next blog post? Or how to say no without feeling like
Jen Lang:yeah, that's brilliant. Thanks for the intro, Suzanne. And for
Jen Lang:an introvert It was spectacular. And it really told us so much
Jen Lang:about your journey in a way that was clear, relatable, and I'm
Jen Lang:sure that all of us listening have had related in some form or
Jen Lang:another to something Suzanne said whether it's that over
Jen Lang:giving and receiving piece or if it was the Compare and despair
Jen Lang:aspect of social media that infuses so much of our lives
Jen Lang:today. And interestingly, Jane and I were just having a
Jen Lang:conversation this morning about what was ever functioning over
Jen Lang:functioning under functioning. So it's similar a similar way
Jen Lang:and the way it like we were both reflecting on relationships are
Jen Lang:the relationship Yeah, yeah. And you know, it's like oh, I over
Jen Lang:function in this area, but um, maybe I might be too critical if
Jen Lang:I say I'm under functioning in this area. So there's that
Jen Lang:reflection piece but without getting caught in the the pit of
Jen Lang:despair. You know?
Unknown:Yes space.
Jane Stark:So powerful. Yeah. And I, I'm an I'm a recovering
Jane Stark:over funktioner. So what you talk about Suzanne, and you
Jane Stark:know, just sort of, I haven't read your book yet, but I would,
Jane Stark:it's on our list and I have the first two chapters because he
Jane Stark:has a great a great offer there where if you want to read the
Jane Stark:first two chapters of her book, is it just sign up on your
Jane Stark:website, right
Unknown:on my websites.com forward slash book, first two
Unknown:chapters is that does not put you on her newsletter. In fact,
Unknown:it does not add you to my newsletter, it's one of my pet
Unknown:peeves, you have the option to opt in after that, but I don't
Unknown:like implicit consent. It's like, no, if you want to join my
Unknown:newsletter, that's a whole different ballgame.
Jane Stark:I really liked that I really respect that. What I
Jane Stark:was going to share, though, on the over functioning, and what
Jane Stark:Jen was sort of talking about, too, and you might have another,
Jane Stark:I would love to hear what you have to say about this Suzanne,
Jane Stark:around, I was listening to something the other day about
Jane Stark:this. And how over funktioner is, by law of like, if you look
Jane Stark:at it almost like a math equation in a relationship,
Jane Stark:you're going to attract Putin and under funktioner. And then
Jane Stark:and then to your point where you're talking about the
Jane Stark:resentment that builds and all of the feelings, you're, you
Jane Stark:know, it's almost until you start to meet yourself and
Jane Stark:become whole and start to step into your worthiness, then then
Jane Stark:the equation starts to shift, but as long as we're over
Jane Stark:functioning, there's no room for another over function or to come
Jane Stark:in. Exactly, or to at or to get to that healthy space of I would
Jane Stark:interdependence is the word that comes to mind. Yeah, what what
Jane Stark:would you say on that,
Unknown:it's interesting, because everything is in a
Unknown:paired state, there needs to be a balance. So if you're an over
Unknown:functional, then by virtue, you will attract under functions, or
Unknown:you would portray them in that aspect. So I imagine you could
Unknown:have a relationship with to over functions, but you'd be over
Unknown:functioning in different areas, to say, for example, you could
Unknown:have one person who's like I'm, I'm in charge of the house and
Unknown:the kids and the other ones I'm in charge of making the income
Unknown:and it could kind of work but not healthfully that a word is
Unknown:now not in a healthy way. So and it's interesting, because when
Unknown:we have a push energy, like I over function in this area, we
Unknown:not and the thing is we're not conscious of any of these things
Unknown:until we get to the point where we are burnt out exhausted. And
Unknown:then we're get resentful and Blaney so it's, it's
Unknown:fascinating, the balance and owning our place in it, rather
Unknown:than falling into that victim archetype of like, nobody ever
Unknown:does anything for me, it's like because I don't let them
Jen Lang:Oh, that was me for a long time. And this idea that I
Jen Lang:wasn't open to receiving me to
Jane Stark:or it also, I mean, again, if I ever use this, if I
Jane Stark:use myself over function are also means I want control.
Jane Stark:Right? So Control Freak goes along. Yes.
Unknown:100%. And realizing that and, and letting go of that
Unknown:can be challenging, especially if it's something that we have
Unknown:developed as a coping mechanism like, and I think, in terms of
Unknown:over eating and binge eating, like, that's been my personal
Unknown:history. There was so much in my life, I couldn't control but I
Unknown:could control what I ate, and even over ate, because, you
Unknown:know, that was something that there's no passive eating like
Unknown:this passive smoking. I can't blame anybody else for that,
Unknown:except myself.
Jane Stark:So what was your journey? Can you share a little
Jane Stark:bit of your journey then to I mean, this is exactly what a big
Jane Stark:piece of what Jen and I talked about with that opening our
Jane Stark:shit, right? Like you just sort of said that you're the one.
Jane Stark:There is no, how did you say it? There's no passive overeating,
Unknown:or eating like this passive smoking.
Jane Stark:So you had to own it. So what what did that look
Jane Stark:like for you?
Unknown:Well, basically, the beginning the beginning and
Unknown:ship. When I was very young, my parents put me on my first diet
Unknown:so that the pattern that I inherited was from modeling that
Unknown:we die we start on Monday, we clean out the pantry, we'd be
Unknown:really good until Friday, when we fall off spectacularly and
Unknown:have you know, no holds barred binge fest until Sunday night
Unknown:when we clean the pantry out again. So that has what was what
Unknown:was modeled to me as a child. And I do remember going to visit
Unknown:people's houses like friends houses, and they're having like
Unknown:avocado, candy and avocados so fattening. In hindsight, I
Unknown:imagine there must have just been laughing at me as soon as I
Unknown:left or whatever. Anyway, I digress.
Jane Stark:Also kind of part. Sorry, wasn't that also kind of
Jane Stark:part of like, I remember there was a time when we thought that
Jane Stark:right and anything that was high fat was bad.
Unknown:I know. It's fascinating, isn't it? That's
Unknown:why
Jen Lang:prompted the whole margarine movement right? Oh
Jen Lang:yeah, that butter better be margarine like and then they
Jen Lang:discovered the whole margarine was like you're eating plastic
Jen Lang:worse than butter
Jane Stark:well or the whole low the whole low fat movement
Jane Stark:like I grew up singing in a household where it was skim milk
Jane Stark:and fat free sour cream and like fat free yogurt and all of those
Jane Stark:things and now it's it was very I'm taking us on a tangent here
Jane Stark:briefly I want to come back to what you were saying there,
Jane Stark:Suzanne. But it was an interesting exercise. As I
Jane Stark:started to move in, I certified as a health coach. And as I
Jane Stark:started to look more and more at what I was putting in my body, I
Jane Stark:you know, shifted to you know, even with my kids, I never moved
Jane Stark:them off full fat milk. And, you know, it was my mom was sort of
Jane Stark:like, not not judgy but just like this was so weird for her
Jane Stark:because she was so in that but it was which was a product of
Jane Stark:her time, right? Like,
Unknown:exactly, that's how it my parents haven't moved out of
Unknown:that. So they live in a different state. And when we
Unknown:visit, I always buy my own butter and milk, like full fat
Unknown:that we bring, I come here, I go to the shop and get the skim
Unknown:milk in the fat because I won't eat anything differently. And
Unknown:yeah, it wasn't it wasn't movement, but not for everybody.
Unknown:And like the people's houses I visit when they had like avocado
Unknown:or bacon or full fat milk, I'd be there in like horror. But
Unknown:this is the fascination of it because we would eat these low
Unknown:fat skim tasteless things. And then No, it's a little wonder
Unknown:were like binging biscuits and whatever, because like, hello,
Unknown:but then you just didn't see, like, even with clients I work
Unknown:with. It's fascinating to me how it's like I couldn't eat bread,
Unknown:like I can't eat toast breads bad. But I'll go to McDonald's
Unknown:and do a drive thru run. So it's like, if I'm going to, I'm going
Unknown:to go bad. I'm gonna get all the way. Thinking there. Anyway, so
Unknown:that's, that's how it started. And I moved out of home at 18.
Unknown:And I continued that cycle. And then I eventually was in not
Unknown:that much longer joined Weight Watchers. So the well known
Unknown:program, had a lot of success dropped 43 kilos, which is just
Unknown:shy of 100 pounds. And the thing was, this started, actually, she
Unknown:can read about in my book, I can, yeah, lots and lots of
Unknown:these things. But whenever I found the diet that was like the
Unknown:answer, there was like, I found the thing. But I was the fat
Unknown:lazy fuck who couldn't keep it up. So it was it was fascinating
Unknown:to me. Because like if these things truly worked, why do we
Unknown:fall off them? We give our power to the program and say Weight
Unknown:Watchers Jenny Craig Tony Ferguson insert the thing. And
Unknown:then I'm just like, I can't do this, there's something wrong
Unknown:with me, it sets us up for thinking there's something
Unknown:inherently wrong with us, when what really is wrong with us is
Unknown:that we think we have to measure every morsel and use apps and
Unknown:all this sort of stuff. So basically, that reached a point
Unknown:where I was like, there are people in this world who
Unknown:maintain their weight without punishing themselves depriving
Unknown:themselves measuring weighing all this sort of stuff. There
Unknown:must be something else going on here. I'm fairly smart person in
Unknown:other areas of my life, I kind of get together here. And that
Unknown:started this for me basically where I quit dieting entirely.
Unknown:And a lot of people say to me, Well, I've done that there's a
Unknown:difference between truly quitting dieting, where I'm
Unknown:like, I'd rather be fat forever, and then deal with this. And
Unknown:kind of kind of quitting it where you got half a foot and a
Unknown:half a foot out and you like doing it for a bit until you
Unknown:don't. So when you're like, I'm not going back to that this is
Unknown:it. I think you really start to relearn to tune into your body's
Unknown:wisdom who's like, actually, when I can eat as much cookie
Unknown:dough as I want. I don't actually like it, it makes me
Unknown:feel sluggish, I'm tired, I have no energy, rather than I got no
Unknown:self control. And I'm going to do this until I'm sick of
Unknown:myself. Like there's there's this clear distinction that
Unknown:you're really hard for people to get because half of them still
Unknown:in the next diet. But I wasn't I was like, I'm never doing that
Unknown:to myself. Again. I cannot physically mentally emotionally
Unknown:put myself through that. And I don't judge people who do use my
Unknown:fitness power or apps or heartrate monitors like you're
Unknown:new to you is one of my philosophies. But I don't want
Unknown:to be controlled by some external thing telling me what
Unknown:to do, ever again.
Jen Lang:And that, ladies and gentlemen, is the ownership
Jen Lang:piece of this program. Because it is owning your own responses
Jen Lang:and your own story and your own experience. So that you can move
Jen Lang:forward without being controlled by all these external factors.
Jen Lang:So giving up your power, so owning your shit is reclaiming
Jen Lang:your power. Yeah. It's not giving it away to all those
Jen Lang:external things like the diet program, like the app Like the,
Jen Lang:you know, maybe even a fitness trainer or nutrition coach who
Jen Lang:might, you know, you give up, you tell me what to do, just
Jen Lang:tell me what to do. You know, that's not empowering at all.
Jen Lang:That's giving up your power.
Jane Stark:Yeah. And that's what I found. So I trained as a
Jane Stark:health coach, four years ago. And I did it because I was
Jane Stark:really interested in the holistic health space. And, and
Jane Stark:my program was much more mindset based. But what I found through
Jane Stark:the program, was that, that was the part that didn't resonate
Jane Stark:for me, I knew deep down and I was like, I can sit and tell
Jane Stark:people all day long how to eat, you know, make sure you're
Jane Stark:eating this way, moving your body, all the things, but if
Jane Stark:they're not truly connected within and connected to
Jane Stark:themselves, and connected to that deeper place, they're not
Jane Stark:like, it doesn't matter, it's not going to work, and it
Jane Stark:frustrated me. And it was exactly what you're saying,
Jane Stark:Suzanne, where it's like, you know that, throwing that all
Jane Stark:away and finding our power and, and noticing like one of the one
Jane Stark:of the things that we learned was an exercise to connect to
Jane Stark:exactly what you're saying, like all of a sudden, hey, if you eat
Jane Stark:all that cookie dough, how do you actually feel, you know, or,
Jane Stark:and on the opposite side to have, like, you know, when you
Jane Stark:go, I know, you might not want to go out and move your body.
Jane Stark:But when you go and do it, how do you feel after and starting
Jane Stark:to actually reconnect those neural pathways to, oh, this
Jane Stark:makes me feel good, or this gives me pleasure, because the
Jane Stark:brain is hardwired for pleasure. We're always a pleasure. It's
Jane Stark:just gone on the fritz when we connect pleasure to sugar, or
Jane Stark:been hijacked by the food industry. Yeah, that was that
Jane Stark:that's a big part of what brought me on my journey into
Jane Stark:the mindset and the coaching piece. And now, moving away from
Jane Stark:that, I don't even like saying that I'm certified as a health
Jane Stark:coach, because I feel like people tend to go and think
Jane Stark:that, yeah, I'm gonna go into nutrition or fitness. And I
Jane Stark:don't
Unknown:think that's the thing, when you aren't happy with where
Unknown:you are, and you are looking for support. There's a difference
Unknown:between holding your own agency and getting support through
Unknown:that, and absolving yourself of your own agency and listening
Unknown:totally to someone else. And you can do this in whatever area of
Unknown:your life, your health, your business, your relationships,
Unknown:work. And what can happen is say, you're like, I can't stand
Unknown:myself anymore, I need to make a change. I'm gonna go and join
Unknown:this program, dietitian, nutritionist, personal trainer,
Unknown:whatever flogged me, make me work hard. part of us is happy
Unknown:for a bit because we're like, we don't need the responsibility of
Unknown:this anymore. I'm going to give it all to this other person. But
Unknown:then also, part of us is enslaved Ben, because it's like
Unknown:that person, this diet, this program says I must do this, and
Unknown:I must not do this. It's kind of like holding a beach ball
Unknown:underwater. At first, it's really easy. But then your arms
Unknown:start to hurt. And as soon as you let go, the ball shoots up
Unknown:hits you in the face. And part of you is celebrating because
Unknown:you have all your own agency back and you're not enslaved to
Unknown:this thing anymore. So part of us like yes, but the other part
Unknown:is like, I'm still unhappy. So it's like learning to balance
Unknown:between actually receiving support that is supportive of
Unknown:you, rather than handing over the reins to say, like you do
Unknown:this because nobody can walk for you, or exercise for you or even
Unknown:eat for you. And it's so funny, so many people, that the clients
Unknown:who are talking about the came to Ujjain would say, If only I
Unknown:was rich, I could hire someone to follow me around and slap
Unknown:food out of my hand. And I'm like, seriously? And they're
Unknown:like, Yeah, I'm like, you would just find their ass when you're
Unknown:in a total rebellion, you would find them eat all the things and
Unknown:then hire someone else. Like we're never actually going to
Unknown:have true change, if we're going to hand that over to somebody
Unknown:else on our behalf.
Jane Stark:Yeah, and that's the crux of it right? As long as
Jane Stark:we're so conditioned to outsource our power,
Unknown:but then we also outsource our thing, because
Unknown:we're like, Wait, what is this amazing Tony Ferguson's amazing
Unknown:Jenny Craig's amazing, and I'm the fat lazy five, who can't
Unknown:keep my shit together, where it's like, it's no, you, you're
Unknown:the problem. But you're also the solution. It's both. And then
Unknown:and then I think that's kind of added to by when we see before
Unknown:and after posters and success stories and things that we when
Unknown:we scrolling. We're like, I want that I want to buy that result.
Unknown:But then if you look at the tiny little asterix, it says results
Unknown:not typical. Why am I leading with that? Why are they
Unknown:marketing with the point 1%?
Jen Lang:Or Individual results may vary? Like yes, yes. It's
Jen Lang:the same way that they sell investment products. Past
Jen Lang:performance is no indication of future performance. Well, yeah,
Jen Lang:because none of us can tell the future but that is always in
Jen Lang:that little asterisk. You buy this product by this collection
Jen Lang:of funds, work with this person or buy this herbal product or
Jen Lang:buy this, like, I don't know, snake oil tin in order to. And
Jen Lang:again, it's still Another form of disempowerment and not
Jen Lang:actually taking responsibility in a, in a more holistic way,
Jen Lang:for all parts of your being. So you might have the agency say I
Jen Lang:have chosen to do this, I have chosen to give a portion of
Jen Lang:myself allowed a portion of myself to be supported. However,
Jen Lang:you've only done like 30% of the thing. It's the you like you
Jen Lang:talked about, is that equation. Suzanne, you mentioned, can you
Jen Lang:talk? Can you go into that equation a little bit more
Jen Lang:around? What you mentioned with the the balance and the equity
Jen Lang:of that receiving and yeah, peace.
Unknown:So I have, like, I call it the over giving cycle. So
Unknown:what happens is, we want to make a change. So we make plans,
Unknown:whether that be join a diet, join a program, you know, enroll
Unknown:in a course, we're like, Okay, we're gonna do this thing. And
Unknown:we're usually really excited when we make the plan or like,
Unknown:like, oh, okay, I need to buy all these weird ingredients and
Unknown:go to a fancy supermarket and like, What the hell am I just
Unknown:this cost? But no, this is gonna be the thing. I've got this. So
Unknown:we fill our fridge with, you know, all these fresh things.
Unknown:And we're like, yes. And then somebody asks something for us,
Unknown:Hey, could you just pick up my kids steal these cookies? Get my
Unknown:script, like, helped me move house? I don't know. So we ditch
Unknown:our plans to look after others we over give. This is where we
Unknown:can't say no, we're like, Oh, it's okay. I'll do it tomorrow.
Unknown:And then what happens is our fridge full of fresh things is
Unknown:wilting in the crisper while we go and buy cheap and cheerful to
Unknown:keep everybody happy. Because we've been so busy helping all
Unknown:these other people. And then we burn out. And we whether we
Unknown:admit it to ourselves or not, we can kind of start to feel a bit
Unknown:resentful. Like oh, she's always asking me to help her never
Unknown:occurs to us that we could say no. But we start to feel a bit
Unknown:resentful. Then we over consume in whatever way over eat over
Unknown:shop. Over work, maybe you know, you sit on the couch binging
Unknown:Netflix and chips and scrolling like the trifecta. Then we felt
Unknown:guilty, because we've got all this stuff spent this money on
Unknown:this program stuffs wilting in the fridge. So then we're like,
Unknown:Aha, must need to be a new plan. Like it never occurs to us. It's
Unknown:like, okay, we move to next thing, I wrote an entire book
Unknown:about this, this cycle, it's like, okay, and then the next
Unknown:plan is going to be the same thing. And we look for the right
Unknown:plan or the right to do list the right program, the right thing,
Unknown:when really the intervention point is actually saying no,
Unknown:without feeling like a bitch. Could you do this? Like no, and
Unknown:no being our whole answer, and then divorcing ourselves from
Unknown:all the over responsibility and the reactions to people seeing
Unknown:because the thing is, you only were talking at the beginning
Unknown:about a philosophy over functioning and finding under
Unknown:functioning people, the thing about people who are under
Unknown:functioning, if you say no, they will ask somebody else through
Unknown:evolutionary I know that people who are like, Help me, help me
Unknown:help me. You're not the end all be all and only person in the
Unknown:universe to help them they will find another. And I think that's
Unknown:what's so freeing to be able to say, or if you don't really want
Unknown:to say no, like, say, for example, says can you help me
Unknown:move house at 6am? Tomorrow? No, I can help you at 10am on
Unknown:Saturday. Oh, but the trucks coming? It's not my problem.
Unknown:Like schemes, we
Jane Stark:can I ask you a question or go into that a
Jane Stark:little bit? Can you unpack a little bit of this how to say no
Jane Stark:without feeling like a bitch piece? Because I think that is
Jane Stark:such a common feeling for especially women. But men were
Jane Stark:functioning over giving women Yeah, men to honestly, the whole
Jane Stark:genders worth. Yes, but I think but I will say women still more
Jane Stark:than absolutely,
Jen Lang:because it's expected of us, because it's part of the
Jen Lang:nice narrative. That's that's modeled for us. And yes, it's so
Jen Lang:much of social and how we're raised, but it's a Yeah, you're
Jen Lang:right. Okay, Suzanne, please. Yeah,
Unknown:so the the simplest thing for any listener, as long
Unknown:as you're not driving or walking, like literally grab a
Unknown:piece of paper, you can pause this or grab a piece of paper
Unknown:and on one side, right? Yes. And on the other side, right? No,
Unknown:we're on camera. So you can see mine. Here's one I prepared
Unknown:earlier. And the thing is, this was made by my son. But
Unknown:basically, when you have your piece of paper, if someone says
Unknown:Hey, could you what I invite you to do is hold it up with the yes
Unknown:sign facing them. Like yes, I can do that. And then what's
Unknown:facing towards you know, so having this little piece of
Unknown:paper is like life changing? Because when you say yes to
Unknown:others, what are you saying to yourself, you're saying no. So
Unknown:it's learning and it's gonna be challenging in the beginning. So
Unknown:choose your audience don't because the thing is when we
Unknown:have really loose boundaries, what we can do is go to the
Unknown:other extreme and have really have tight boundaries. And
Unknown:that's not healthy either. Because when you say no to
Unknown:everything and everyone all the time, then you're not open to
Unknown:receive. So it's learning to have the porous boundaries, a
Unknown:porous not porous. But like when to say yes and when to say no,
Unknown:and this will take time. But in the beginning, and then there
Unknown:will be some pushback, especially for people who have
Unknown:become used to you being the yes person and the doormat and the
Unknown:martyr. But for people who come into your life who've never
Unknown:known you in any other way, they will really appreciate it. Brene
Unknown:Brown says, And this quote, I swear changed my life. Clear is
Unknown:kind. So we often think that if we don't say no, or if we just
Unknown:like, but when we're actually really clear, so say for
Unknown:example, if you guys are like Suze, we're having a Tupperware
Unknown:party, would you like to come? In the past, I would have gone I
Unknown:hate Tupperware, by the way, I would have bought it, because I
Unknown:would have felt like I wanted to support you, and all this sort
Unknown:of stuff. So now I'd be like, thank you so much for inviting
Unknown:me. So you know, not being a bitch thing. I really appreciate
Unknown:the invite. I don't actually like Tupperware. But if you have
Unknown:another sort of party, like feel free to invite me because
Unknown:otherwise doesn't annoy you when someone says oh, yes. And then
Unknown:they canceled on the day, like I have baked for you. And then the
Unknown:later on, I find out oh my god, they didn't even like Tupperware
Unknown:had they just said. Whereas were so worried that people will hate
Unknown:us because we don't love the same things. But have you know,
Unknown:a little bit of honesty rather than sure and cancel at the last
Unknown:minute, which a lot of us who can't say no feel more
Unknown:comfortable with same for school, like my school has his
Unknown:fundraisers with chocolate. If I bring chocolate into my house, I
Unknown:will eat it all. Like, I know this. So instead, I'm like,
Unknown:here's 50 bucks for the school because I get all of it. Have
Unknown:fun, rather than giving me like 250 bucks with a chocolate to
Unknown:sell which you only earn 50 bucks from anyway because they
Unknown:get such a small commission. The school is happy, I haven't eaten
Unknown:my weight and chocolate. Everybody's happy. So it's like
Unknown:learning what's in the in the service of you. It will take
Unknown:time. It's not magic, okay, I'm gonna say no to everybody all
Unknown:the time, and dealing with the fallout because sometimes
Unknown:there's this Lexus. Another example I can think of is, say
Unknown:you, your parents babysit mine don't live close, but had this
Unknown:with a client. And she's like, my, I thought I thought I was
Unknown:helping them because I thought they wanted to spend time with
Unknown:their grandkids, that basically the parents were getting to a
Unknown:point where she was asking too much. And they couldn't say no.
Unknown:She was like, I would have been happy hired a babysitter, but I
Unknown:thought they wanted this. So this is all about being really
Unknown:honest and upfront with that communication and learning that,
Unknown:you know, there's going to be areas that are like, Oh, this
Unknown:really hurts. But I can move through it all actually is not
Unknown:that big of a deal. Because yeah, I can hire a babysitter.
Jen Lang:I want to that's awesome. I love all of this and
Jen Lang:seeing so much of people in my inner and outer circles who this
Jen Lang:would be so beautifully supportive and helpful for them.
Jen Lang:I want to just back up briefly to ask Suzanne to hold up
Jen Lang:because for our listeners who can't see us on video, I want to
Jen Lang:ask Suzanne to hold up her guests no sign, and I'm gonna
Jen Lang:describe it. So she basically has a popsicle stick or like a
Jen Lang:garden wooden stick. And she's got a big circle that says yes,
Jen Lang:on one side and glued to the other side is the big circle
Jen Lang:that says no. And so Jane is going to take a picture asked on
Jen Lang:her Instagram. Yes. So when you say yes to the other person
Jen Lang:across from you, the no is facing you. So it's reminding
Jen Lang:you that you were saying no to yourself? Or what are you saying
Jen Lang:no to in yourself when you say yes to that other person. And
Jen Lang:similarly, when you invert it and so when you say no to that
Jen Lang:other person, you are saying yes to yourself, and what can you
Jen Lang:say yes to in your life?
Unknown:Oh, we we are sorry to say we buy the program like we
Unknown:like invest in a program. This program is gonna be the thing. I
Unknown:run an online program and it's always fascinating to me how
Unknown:many people like you know, I didn't watch any of it I didn't
Unknown:like exactly like this is this is the thing and also the good
Unknown:girl perfectionist Enos is like we need to watch read, listen to
Unknown:every single morsel and apply it all or a failure. That used to
Unknown:be what what if What can you take so whenever I do anything
Unknown:now I look at the cost of investment. So my program is
Unknown:1200 I'd be like, what's my $1,200 idea? Like for the life
Unknown:of me not for this 10 weeks? What's the one thing I'm gonna
Unknown:take from this? That's gonna be lifelong compounding. And, yeah,
Unknown:I think it's so and and we do say I'll do it later. And that's
Unknown:why like, for me personally, I no longer run lifetime access,
Unknown:because how many of us buy things because I'll get to it
Unknown:one day, but we never do. Kind of like we have these digital
Unknown:dragons collecting dust of all these downloads and stuff, but
Unknown:we've never opened how do we leave it just in case
Jen Lang:how many Udemy courses Does everybody listening or had
Jen Lang:some what think like masterclass or masterclass, Gaia TV, all
Jen Lang:these other Hay House? For example, how many courses and
Jen Lang:programs? Do you have sitting around that you're like, Oh,
Jen Lang:I'll watch that later, or I'll rewatch that later. I'll take
Jen Lang:notes later, do it now people do it now, or goes through, you
Jen Lang:know, like, actually, I've been doing and I've been talking
Jen Lang:about NLP, because our last guest was an NLP master trainer.
Jen Lang:And I actually I have an NLP course on Udemy that I have
Jen Lang:never opened. And I was like, Oh, I can't go back and take a
Jen Lang:look at that again. But you're right, you're looking for that
Jen Lang:next thing, or in my case, it used to be the the qualification
Jen Lang:was tied to my self worth. I have another qualification. I'm
Jen Lang:worth more. I have another qualification. I'm worth more.
Jen Lang:And I'm unplugging from that now. I'm qualified enough. Thank
Jen Lang:you very much. I'm pretty fucking talented, actually. So
Jen Lang:you heard it here first? Nope. You heard it here for like the
Jen Lang:7,000th time probably would have been talking about this on the
Jen Lang:podcast. Every woman sitting here right now. In fact, I would
Jen Lang:argue that any every single person listening to this, as we
Jen Lang:talk about this is pretty fucking talented. But how long?
Jen Lang:Have you told how? How many times have you told yourself
Jen Lang:that?
Unknown:Have I tried to get to the cycle? It's a plan. It's the
Unknown:next course how many people are in the Warner printer line. And
Unknown:I don't mean any judgment from that because I was there. And
Unknown:it's like, when I get the next certificate. When I get to the
Unknown:next thing, this program has a business building thing. I don't
Unknown:know enough yet to start a business to run a webinar to you
Unknown:know, it's like, actually, you just need to ask people to pay
Unknown:you. That's too scary. Can't do that. Now the qualification?
Jane Stark:Yeah, that was that cycle, too. Right. And it I
Jane Stark:mean, it shows up a lot in the entrepreneurial space. But to
Jane Stark:your point, it's everywhere in anywhere, right? It's in
Jane Stark:relationships, it's in your relationship to food, it's in
Jane Stark:your parenting it's in. It's in everything, right? If when I get
Jane Stark:here, if like, yeah, that not if this, but when I get here, I'll
Jane Stark:have made it when I get here and the goalpost just keeps moving.
Jane Stark:And you never get you never get to it.
Unknown:And to that point for Jen and Jane, for those
Unknown:listening, I'll explain it on my desk here, I actually keep a
Unknown:little piece of fool's gold, so you guys can see it, but I
Unknown:actually have it on my desk, because it's for the if, if
Unknown:then, like, you know, when I lost the weight, then I'll be
Unknown:happy when I sign X clients, then I'll be happy when my kids
Unknown:go to school. And, you know, it's but then you get to the
Unknown:point. And it's like, oh, I'm still me, and you push the
Unknown:goalposts back. So this little fool's gold here is just to
Unknown:remind me that, you know, the time is now. That's why my
Unknown:programs called Why wait, people are slow. It was about
Unknown:bodyweight. It's about what are we waiting for? That's why it's
Unknown:W and the infinities, like your time is now what are we waiting
Unknown:for? Because now is all we ever have? And then once we have lost
Unknown:the weight, and we're still not happy? What do we do, we it's
Unknown:gonna used to be another five kilos, or I need to get toned or
Unknown:whatever the hell that means. Or in business. Once I have x
Unknown:clients, I'm still unhappy, I need more. I always have an
Unknown:offer of 10,000, or 20,000 needs to be 50,000. We're always
Unknown:pushing the goalposts back. When really, it's like why aren't we
Unknown:happy today? In this moment right now, rather than once I've
Unknown:achieved some external thing.
Jen Lang:Yeah, I heard that in the satisfied conversation. And
Jen Lang:just for people who are listening, I can't see, um,
Jen Lang:Suzanne was holding a how many X hexagonal? Yeah, hexagonal,
Jen Lang:hexagonal piece of pyrite, or fool's gold. And so it sits on
Jen Lang:her desk. And we will ask her to share a picture of that after.
Jen Lang:But it's really, actually had a conversation with someone about
Jen Lang:it this morning, earlier this week, around the satisfied piece
Jen Lang:where, you know, they're preparing work for a client, and
Jen Lang:they don't feel that their work is up to snuff, by their
Jen Lang:perception. But the client has said, we totally trust you. This
Jen Lang:way, you're amazing. And like they said, We trust you,
Jen Lang:whatever you come up with will be fine. And still, there's that
Jen Lang:underlying dissatisfaction. I don't have enough ready to show
Jen Lang:them yet. What have you done? Well, like, you know, there,
Jen Lang:there have this narrative around, you know, the client has
Jen Lang:provided some pieces or some documentation, but not
Jen Lang:necessarily the Create, the person has to create the content
Jen Lang:out of what the sorry, there's a really noisy vehicle, you're
Jen Lang:just gonna hear that on the recording,
Jane Stark:it's good to say it's hard to mute yourself
Jen Lang:when I'm talking so you're not just gonna keep
Jen Lang:talking. But the basically, what I'm getting down to here is that
Jen Lang:the person felt that, you know, they still have this underlying
Jen Lang:dissatisfaction. I'm like, Well, why don't you just, it's enough.
Jane Stark:Yeah, it isn't. Right is the question
Jen Lang:when is enough enough? And I
Unknown:think we can create that inadvertently. So I know
Unknown:before I can think of an example I was moving house, and this
Unknown:person was doing like fishway report. All right, that sounds
Unknown:awesome. I don't know anything about Finch way, but I'm about
Unknown:to set up my house. He's Ronnie, I'd like to report place. And so
Unknown:I think I paid her in October, I was moving in December,
Unknown:November, come and get the report, December come, didn't
Unknown:get the report message her. Oh, it's coming. And I was like, I'm
Unknown:moving now. So anyway, to cut a very long story short, I
Unknown:eventually got the report in April of the following year. And
Unknown:when I chatted to her, like, she was also a friend. And she was
Unknown:like, it just wasn't enough. I had to keep adding to add to it.
Unknown:I'm like, what you've actually created like, I am dissatisfied
Unknown:now and frustrated, because I've already moved my stuff. And I'm
Unknown:not moving again. Like I've got kids and all this other thing.
Unknown:But had she handed to me what she had done in December, it
Unknown:would have been enough. But we ended up creating that in our
Unknown:own perfectionism is not enough. It's not enough. It's not
Unknown:enough. Rather than for the people who are hiring us, like I
Unknown:don't know anything and another person I worked with who was
Unknown:doing numerology, I know nothing about numerology. So whatever
Unknown:you give me would have been amazing. But in our own compare
Unknown:and despair to our own people who were training us or people
Unknown:who are experts in industry, it's never enough. And then we
Unknown:create that dissatisfaction because we're not actually
Unknown:delivering on time. And it's got nothing to do with us not being
Unknown:enough. It's us delaying the handing overall for the item.
Jane Stark:Yep, absolutely. Yeah. So
Unknown:I was gonna say that, like, for my book, The imperfect
Unknown:book written and published, Trump's the perfect book I never
Unknown:put out there. Like, there's gonna be things in there that I
Unknown:read later and go, Oh, but that's what you do second
Unknown:editions full. So with anything that you're creating, if you're
Unknown:like, oh, it's not enough, I need another certification. i
Unknown:It's not perfect to the people that you're serving. It's
Unknown:enough.
Jane Stark:That's a really good reminder,
Jen Lang:to great reminder, I caught myself in it this
Jen Lang:morning. And I'm not saying like caught isn't a bad like a
Jen Lang:judgment piece. It was like I was genuinely conscious of where
Jen Lang:I had been resisting sharing about something. And I was like,
Jen Lang:Oh, well, that's interesting. And I was able to talk through
Jen Lang:it with someone, but it was very revealing, again, it was just
Jen Lang:another layer of where I was keeping myself unintentionally
Jen Lang:hidden or unintentionally small. Because I thought I was like,
Jen Lang:Oh, I don't have the right words, or my experience isn't as
Jen Lang:valuable as someone else's experience. And therefore not is
Jen Lang:meaningful. Who says that? Who says that all of our experiences
Jen Lang:are valuable. That's the that's the comparison, itis Gremlin
Jen Lang:that just takes a different form. So unpicking that is so
Jen Lang:powerful.
Unknown:And then I think there's also the fear, like fear
Unknown:of failure, fear of people's response, I ran a I ran a master
Unknown:class last week, it was so fun. It was just as I was getting
Unknown:sick. And I thought I'll be right anyway, had this tech
Unknown:hiccup I got kicked off, like totally, my computer just
Unknown:crashed. Two minutes after I started, and all the things I
Unknown:was telling myself, everyone's gonna be gone, I'm going to come
Unknown:back to crickets, whatever that was still just chat the bugs of
Unknown:sales in Zoom Room. So often like that perfection, mystics,
Unknown:the standards we set for ourselves that are so high, and
Unknown:it's like people get that life happens. And you know,
Unknown:technology, we do the best that we can. And when we hold
Unknown:ourselves to unrealistic standards, it's out. It's all
Unknown:internal, not the external. And the thing is, if you're gonna be
Unknown:like, I don't want to work with her because she has zoom issues.
Unknown:You're gonna probably have that with everybody, because everyone
Unknown:has tech stuff at some time.
Jen Lang:posts like that cute little meme that goes around.
Jen Lang:It's like has zoom meetings or like a sales. Hello. Are you
Jen Lang:there? Hello, can you hear me? Good. I think I'm feeling
Jen Lang:something.
Jane Stark:Oh my gosh, it's so fun. Suzanne, I just want to
Jane Stark:wind it back a little bit to what you were sort of saying
Jane Stark:about the beginning is shit, your the way you work with women
Jane Stark:your journey, somebody who resonates with what you've
Jane Stark:shared here on the podcast so far, where would you tell them
Jane Stark:to start?
Unknown:That's a great question. I guess. It's really
Unknown:with some self reflection of what are the standards that
Unknown:you've set for yourself that you're comparing yourself again,
Unknown:against which you know, perhaps unrealistic, and it's going to
Unknown:sound like cliche to start with self kindness and self
Unknown:compassion because people like, Ah, it's really hard to be kind
Unknown:to ourselves, because we do have these expectations that, you
Unknown:know, I want it to look like this. But there's this quote,
Unknown:and I usually remember it, but I can't get it at the moment. But
Unknown:it's like era glass. I'm probably pronouncing your name
Unknown:wrong. But it's saying that, you know, in the beginning, when
Unknown:you're trying to create something, you have really good
Unknown:taste. That's what gets you into the game. Like I want to have a
Unknown:business or I want to have a body that looks like this or I
Unknown:want this is the change that I want to make. And we're so busy
Unknown:looking at where we want to Be that we lose sight of where we
Unknown:are. And you can't hate yourself skinny, or, or do all the things
Unknown:to yourself, like live a life that you love to create a life
Unknown:that you love. There's, there's a disconnect there. So be saying
Unknown:to people to look at where you are now with a lens of
Unknown:compassion with a lens of you know, what can I do today? So if
Unknown:you're wanting to drop a bunch of weight, eventually you might
Unknown:want to run or you might want to say drink kale smoothies. I
Unknown:don't know why you'd want to do that. Because to me, kale tastes
Unknown:like I'd rather be fat, but you know you, do you. But instead of
Unknown:going, I'm going to change everything overnight has are
Unknown:what little tiny baby steps can you take? Like, maybe you do own
Unknown:running shoes and everything I say it's never to sound
Unknown:facetious or judgmental. But like, do you have the gear?
Unknown:Okay, cool. When can you fit it into your schedule? And what are
Unknown:you going to have to delegate ditch or release to make time
Unknown:for you? Because often we just try and shove that in amongst
Unknown:everything else we're already doing. So my actual starting
Unknown:point would be not to go and buy a program or anything, it'd be
Unknown:like, Okay, what am I doing that's no longer serving? What
Unknown:do I need to let go of to make time for me? And it's funny with
Unknown:my program, why wait, the first week often throws people because
Unknown:we don't actually do anything. Like usually when you sign up to
Unknown:do a plan, you know, where's all the things that we're doing week
Unknown:one, it's like we do nothing. And it's freaks people out. But
Unknown:it's like, Make space declutter clear make the time for you.
Unknown:This time, we'll go so fast, rather than adding in something
Unknown:it's already overpacked. So my first thing would be to people
Unknown:is to make space for you. As silly as it may sound,
Jen Lang:it doesn't sound silly at all. That's awesome. And I
Jen Lang:think you talked about Ira Glass is just the diff difference
Jen Lang:between having good taste and doing good creative work. Yes,
Jen Lang:that's the thing. Okay. So we'll post some of the links to that
Jen Lang:in the show notes. I think there's a YouTube, but it looks
Jen Lang:like you're,
Unknown:it's a quote, it will change your life. Because it's
Unknown:basically when you start something, you've got really
Unknown:good taste, which is what you've got what gets you into the game.
Unknown:But then when you start your things kind of shit. Our guest
Unknown:doesn't say that. That's Susan's, you know. You're
Unknown:comparing that shitness to how it's going to look eventually.
Unknown:And that's what gets you out of the game. Whereas if you like
Unknown:actually, any every master was once a disaster, when you look
Unknown:at somebody who it's funny, I've been running these webinars
Unknown:master classes. Now for four years, I had a friend come who
Unknown:went to my first one, and she came to this one where I got
Unknown:kicked off. And she was like, holy cow woman confidence in
Unknown:spades. And I was like, I was feeling so flustered, because I
Unknown:had been kicked off. And she's like, I forgot she covered the
Unknown:beginning. So and the thing is, like, what did we do to our
Unknown:beginning things, we usually delete them, throw them away,
Unknown:shred them, because they're so bad, keep them. I love watching
Unknown:my first Facebook Live, but I was totally embarrassed, I have
Unknown:my child in it. And I breathe into a paper bag, literally for
Unknown:an hour beforehand before I did it, whereas now I just walk up a
Unknown:hill with my hair in every direction, don't even know what
Unknown:I'm talking about. Because that's that's how you get the
Unknown:progress by the little steps instead of going, Oh, it wasn't
Unknown:perfect. I'm going to throw it out. You've got tasting whatever
Unknown:you wanted to create, and you're best at the time gets to get
Unknown:better. But it doesn't get better if you keep throwing it
Unknown:out all the time.
Jane Stark:Absolutely. I that's like a conversation I have with
Jane Stark:clients all the time is I have to remind them, it's the baby
Jane Stark:steps. And the baby steps add up to big things. But we can't
Jane Stark:Yeah, it's not reality to think that we can go from here, you
Jane Stark:know, A to Z overnight. And
Unknown:look at all those overnight success stories. Look
Unknown:at the fine print where it says results not too bad. And also
Unknown:how many likes to say for example, if you looked at my
Unknown:very last iteration of weight release, you know, 78 kilos, it
Unknown:did take three years, but it's kind of like I lost and regained
Unknown:and lost and regained in excess of 500 kilograms to get to that
Unknown:point. So the overnight success was 30 years in the making.
Jen Lang:That's so true, though, for for so many things
Jen Lang:in life. Were any any sort of overnight, we have this false
Jen Lang:perception of I've I've been really disliked. We all have our
Jen Lang:pet peeves about Phrases. I hate the phrase overnight success,
Jen Lang:because it literally does not exist. No, it does not. There's
Jen Lang:there is actually if you break down the words, literally. It is
Jen Lang:a success overnight. But like you said, Suzanne, it's been 30
Jen Lang:years in the making. So you've just just we've recognized the
Jen Lang:success overnight. But the whole winding road up to that point
Jen Lang:was not overnight. That was multiple, multiple years,
Jen Lang:multiple experiences and all the wisdom and experiences and
Jen Lang:encounters and creations that get you to that point. That's a
Jen Lang:turning point, but it's not the turning point. There's many more
Jen Lang:success points to note and to mark in your trajectory, whether
Jen Lang:it started You know, five minutes ago or it started seven
Jen Lang:years ago or longer? You know, I love hearing stories about
Jen Lang:people who don't hit their creative peak until their 70s or
Jen Lang:80s or 90s. You know, I think that's just fucking phenomenal.
Jen Lang:I'm like, yeah, look how much time I have to be even more
Jen Lang:awesome.
Unknown:Yes, I was chatting to a lady yesterday, and she said
Unknown:her grandmother was her inspiration. She ran her first
Unknown:marathon at 69. Wow, that's incredible. Yeah. Yeah, that's
Unknown:so often we think, Oh, we're too old too fat to this to that. And
Unknown:for every two we have, there's somebody who's who's done that.
Unknown:And it's kind of that that look for those inspirations, or
Unknown:create it yourself, saying if I want this thing I'm looking at,
Unknown:like my book came about in a very long way because I was
Unknown:obsessed with before and after stories, but they were all
Unknown:before I was fired, and my life was terrible. After I lost the
Unknown:weight, my life is magical. Do anybody was the only person on
Unknown:earth who lost and regained and lost to regain? That wasn't a
Unknown:story and I was like, maybe you're supposed to write this
Unknown:one yourself.
Jane Stark:Wow, that's cool.
Jen Lang:Yeah, that's awesome. So you go ahead
Jane Stark:soon, I was gonna I gonna ask you mentioned NLP. How
Jane Stark:do you can you just tell it touch a little bit on how that
Jane Stark:shows up in your work or how it showed up in your life and has
Jane Stark:helped you
Unknown:have so many certifications like when I say
Unknown:to people about it. I know Pete is one of them. I've got like a
Unknown:little flip folder. But basically how it showed up in my
Unknown:life was when I was like googling way back when Yeah, how
Unknown:to lose weight without dieting, or can I lose weight and still
Unknown:eat chocolate? I came across a lady who taught NLP funnily
Unknown:enough, the first person I found I didn't gel with, like I did
Unknown:NLP. And I was like, this is a watershed. And then I found
Unknown:another coach like a year later. And I started working with her
Unknown:she didn't say what her certifications or whatever were,
Unknown:and then we start to get her I was like, Is this NLP? And she's
Unknown:like, Yes, I'm like, Oh, I think I'm nothing if not really
Unknown:honest. Which gets me in trouble sometimes. But anyway, it was
Unknown:actually the best thing ever. Because with the first person
Unknown:she was so NLP is amazing. It's the best thing about see the
Unknown:dots. I saw sparkle. Whereas the second lady was like, perhaps
Unknown:you kinesthetic. Well, I'm a feeler. So I'm visual. I don't
Unknown:see anything. And she's like, and I think with anything, when
Unknown:we don't speak up, and those of us who are over givers don't
Unknown:want to say I don't see anything. I don't feel anything.
Unknown:Because we just people, please. Yeah. Feelings. Yeah, yeah. So
Unknown:when I got to the point was like, No, I'm not that I don't
Unknown:care or whatever. But like, I'm the client here, and I'm
Unknown:invested. But not to be blaming, but like, you know, when you're
Unknown:really honest, and saying, Actually, I don't see anything,
Unknown:then I can work with you, they can bring the resistant part of
Unknown:you because often is resistances don't actually want to change.
Unknown:So yeah, I had this fantastic experience the second time with
Unknown:NLP. And then she actually is also a trainer. So I went back
Unknown:and trained with her. But basically, what I love about it
Unknown:is, you know, we have the conscious mind, the conscious
Unknown:mind wants to change conscious mind, I'm never gonna eat
Unknown:chocolate again. And I mean it in this moment. And then two
Unknown:hours later, I'm eating content, like there's no tomorrow, like,
Unknown:what the hell happened? The unconscious, the programming,
Unknown:the patterning, the conditioning, rewiring that. But
Unknown:you can also do hypnosis, none of these things are going to
Unknown:work. If on some level, you don't want it. So it's getting
Unknown:to getting to a level of being really honest with yourself and
Unknown:saying, you know, like, I don't want it all the time. But like,
Unknown:what is the gain? For me not changing? What is the gain for
Unknown:me keep because often, when we have a weight loss goal, what
Unknown:I'm more interested in with my clients, and I think NLP helps
Unknown:with what's the goal beyond the goal, because so often it's
Unknown:like, I want to start a business or I want to leave my
Unknown:relationship or I want to do this. And we're actually more
Unknown:afraid of that. So we'll stick with it the easier pain. So it
Unknown:helps you to get really, really honest with yourself. And yeah,
Unknown:I've also done so many things. I don't know which one I actually
Unknown:use now I don't like or this is the modality
Jane Stark:beautiful. I mean, Jen and I think work in a very
Jane Stark:similar way, right? We both have a number of certifications to
Jane Stark:and haven't necessarily gone down the path of niching or
Jane Stark:whatever we want to call it of like you know, just one modality
Jane Stark:I think that's the beauty is that there's so many of those
Jane Stark:these modalities and it's not that one is better than another
Jane Stark:it's that we're all bio individual people and so some
Jane Stark:things work better for others and if that
Jen Lang:isn't the tool that needs absolutely the moment
Jane Stark:and or like you say the tool and the person together
Jane Stark:because I've had similar experiences to where I've worked
Jane Stark:with healers or coaches, and you know, it just doesn't click and
Jane Stark:then I've gone to somebody else. And it's like same modality but
Jane Stark:different person delivering it. It's like, oh, this just changed
Jane Stark:my whole life. Which is, I think,
Unknown:go ahead. And I think also too, for me, I don't know
Unknown:if any of the listeners so I will say this sometimes when you
Unknown:do go to you learn a healing modality or you go to a
Unknown:practitioner, it can kind of feel overwhelming for me, it was
Unknown:kind of like, okay, so I've got a journal, and I've got a tap,
Unknown:I've got to meditate. And I've got to do, there's not enough
Unknown:hours in the day for all of this. So if that happens to you
Unknown:like my suggestion, my advice is, all of these things are
Unknown:tools on your emotional tool belt, like you don't see it,
Unknown:it's invisible, that you were on your way. So it's like, in this
Unknown:moment, which one? So like I use all of these things, but I don't
Unknown:have like people ask them what's your morning routine or
Unknown:whatever? I don't have a set thing. It's like, which one do I
Unknown:feel called to use today? I do do a lot of journaling. That's
Unknown:probably my primary go to and meditating as well. And sound
Unknown:healing? I've got a couple of Gen soundbar. Yes, you do. I
Unknown:don't go okay. Because for anything for me personally, if
Unknown:it becomes a prescription, it reminds me too much of my
Unknown:dieting history, and then I'm attached to doing it to get the
Unknown:tick in the box, and not actually to get the healing or
Unknown:to get what I need from the process in the moment.
Jen Lang:And that is such gold for people. anybody listening?
Jen Lang:It's kind of also looking at, why are you choosing that
Jen Lang:particular tool modality or activity to address this
Jen Lang:particular issue, emotion or situation? Something that would
Jen Lang:be something else to dive into? It's like, I want to do this.
Jen Lang:It's like you talked about the ticking in the box. And you
Jen Lang:know, I have a morning spiritual practice, Jane and I both have a
Jen Lang:morning our own spiritual practices. And then we meet
Jen Lang:Monday to Friday, usually we have a 7am phone call together,
Jen Lang:where sometimes we'll have a podcast conversation, sometimes
Jen Lang:we'll talk about, you know, something, something that's
Jen Lang:happening in our social networks, or sometimes we just
Jen Lang:sit meditate for 15 to 20 or 30 minutes. And we don't do that to
Jen Lang:check off a box. We do that because it genuinely provides us
Jen Lang:a wealth of I don't know, like, it's we didn't do it for two
Jen Lang:months, and we was very noticeable. We will Oh, wow.
Jen Lang:Okay, so yeah, finding the tool. And then knowing the reason why
Jen Lang:your use is
Jane Stark:powerful, it connects to that pleasure, what
Jane Stark:we were saying earlier, where your brain you're hardwired to
Jane Stark:look for pleasure, and the things that feel good. And so
Jane Stark:we're connected in enough to know that that makes us feel
Jane Stark:better. And so, and like Jen said, when we stopped doing it,
Jane Stark:it was like, Oh, this is okay, this is the thing. And I've
Jane Stark:really found that through my life now where I can see now
Jane Stark:when things are kind of off, I can be as long as I can
Jane Stark:cultivate my own awareness and stop and get create the space,
Jane Stark:as you were saying, Suzanne, then I can usually look and be
Jane Stark:like, oh, yeah, okay, I've dropped this over here, or I'm
Jane Stark:not, you know, or look, the junk food is crept back in, or
Jane Stark:whatever the thing is, I'm not moving my body, and start to
Jane Stark:like, identify the thing and build up that hat. Like, I've
Jane Stark:built up that habit enough that I'm like, right, okay, that
Jane Stark:that, that neural programming is there, I just need to go back
Jane Stark:into that groove.
Unknown:I love that frame. Because then it's not ever from
Unknown:a place of guilt, or shame, or punishment. It's from a place of
Unknown:actually, I miss this, this thing was serving me in whatever
Unknown:way. And I think for a lot of people, when they do try healing
Unknown:modalities or things like this, you know, to create change, and
Unknown:they'll come to me or whoever else to go, I've done all that.
Unknown:If you've done it with the intention of the ticking the
Unknown:box, yeah. Or if you'd like to. So for me, meditation is one of
Unknown:my hardest to actually stop and slow down. And sometimes I'll
Unknown:sit there, you know, the 15 minutes and the whole time I'll
Unknown:be it felt it feels like hours. And other days, it'll be like,
Unknown:well, the time is gone already. But it's the it's the commitment
Unknown:to showing up for myself. However, it's coming up in that
Unknown:day and not making it right or wrong or good or bad. Yes. And
Unknown:you know, if some days you want to do something else instead, or
Unknown:you just skip it entirely, but not to guilt and beat yourself
Unknown:up but to be like I missed that and like you guys were saying
Unknown:you miss your morning connection that now serves you
Jen Lang:and provide so much it provided so much rich gold. So
Jen Lang:it was really what that what having that break taught us was
Jen Lang:a it helps our business to run more effectively when we have
Jen Lang:that morning connection time. Be mentally that meditation and
Jen Lang:that peace helped us really move through our days with our
Jen Lang:respective lives with more ease and more insight. And so we
Jen Lang:could connect the next day and be like, Oh, how are you
Jen Lang:feeling? Well, you know this happened. Oh, and then sometimes
Jen Lang:we'll do a spontaneous work for and with each other. So we might
Jen Lang:see something we because we're both human design projectors, so
Jen Lang:we see for each other where the gaps are where we can't see for
Jen Lang:ourselves, and then we can go Oh, have you, you know, we'd
Jen Lang:provide each other the invitation. It's like, are you
Jen Lang:looking for feedback? Yes, I'm looking for feedback, right? Oh,
Jen Lang:so this is my perspective. And we do this on Voxer, as well, we
Jen Lang:were both auditory processors. So we're both like button
Jen Lang:Illumina. No. Nobody else want to listen to our boxes, because
Jen Lang:sometimes they're like, 11 to 15 minutes long, and I'll like
Jen Lang:catch up on the dog walk, and I'll respond back. So the
Jen Lang:function of those conversations became super valuable when we
Jen Lang:didn't have them. And we didn't guilt each other for not because
Jen Lang:there's nothing to guilt, honestly, we were just life
Jen Lang:happens. Jane was sick. You know, we're like, oh, let's have
Jen Lang:a pause. But the reality was, we came to really recognize that
Jen Lang:that ticked a huge box, and provided a tremendous amount of
Jen Lang:value for each of us in so many facets of our areas of our
Jen Lang:lives.
Jane Stark:And I think the reverse, oh, I was just gonna
Jane Stark:say is true to have, it's important to look and go, What
Jane Stark:boxes Am I taking that actually aren't working for me? Yes.
Unknown:I was gonna say, I love that because it's the checking
Unknown:in, is it serving, it's having a break, and then you're checking
Unknown:in again. So my, my program used to be a membership, which is was
Unknown:ongoing. And, you know, in hindsight, or I got to the point
Unknown:was, like, there's never any time for celebration. There's
Unknown:never any time for up leveling, it's just kind of like when
Unknown:people stay until they leave, and they kind of sneak out
Unknown:quietly or whatever, we don't have this graduation and what
Unknown:should have been a graduation. And yes, kind of becomes a
Unknown:funeral if people stay too long. So if you're forcing yourself to
Unknown:do something, because it takes a box that you think that you
Unknown:should do externally. And then you're not actually checking in
Unknown:with yourself and having a season because we have seasons
Unknown:in nature. And we have seasons in ourselves. So now that's why
Unknown:it's a 10 week program we have artificial obviously because you
Unknown:know that season of spring, let's come together summer,
Unknown:let's do the work, autumn or fall, let's harvest and then
Unknown:winter, let's break in between. And you know, with whatever tool
Unknown:it is that we're using, is this still playing a functional role
Unknown:in my life? Or am I still just doing this to tick the box?
Unknown:Because I've always done it? And what could I do instead, and
Unknown:even with certain things like a really random example, but right
Unknown:now with Coronavirus, my husband can work from home, he can
Unknown:actually dropped the kids at school because he can have more
Unknown:than tiebreak at the time. So like how much time that freed up
Unknown:for me sensational. He gets some more time with the kids. But I
Unknown:just kept taking him to school because that's what I've always
Unknown:done. So to look at where in your life are things that you're
Unknown:doing out of some sense that you always have and what else is
Unknown:available and then giving it a go and if it doesn't work, but
Unknown:if it does, what does that free up for you? Because I wouldn't
Unknown:be having this conversation with you guys right now. Because it's
Unknown:morning time for me. In the normal school day, I'd be doing
Unknown:the get ready for school. Yeah.
Jen Lang:I think that's also that yes, no thing that you held
Jen Lang:up earlier with this popsicle stick, maybe we'll figure out a
Jen Lang:way to like make that like a download or an add on or just
Jen Lang:like yes, no, here's your get your popsicle stick,
Unknown:you can actually do it with just
Jen Lang:these two pages. Sticky Note, you
Unknown:know, like I actually I always have a sticky note with
Unknown:me when I go to an event or if I'm you know, away or don't have
Unknown:my popsicle stick. Because it's like where am I saying no to
Unknown:myself? By saying yes to others. There are there are times could
Unknown:you do this? I'd love to but there are times where it's like
Unknown:actually, no, I don't want to and by doing that, it means I
Unknown:can't listen to the program. Do my meditation go for a walk or
Unknown:whatever? Or are they up to adapt like you guys talk about
Unknown:boxer. I love Voxer because I can catch up with my friends
Unknown:while I'm walking. Yeah, we don't have to be in real time.
Jen Lang:Yeah, exactly. such it's such a powerful tool. The
Jen Lang:yet another perfect example. Like I just told Jane before
Jen Lang:this conversation that I'm in, I'm in a choir called Vox
Jen Lang:Humana. And we've just been getting back into rehearsals
Jen Lang:again, we have an upcoming concert, which I'm very excited
Jen Lang:about. I love the material. And then there's another follow up
Jen Lang:concert. And with the symphony, and I was you know, two months
Jen Lang:ago I was like yes, yes, yes. And now I'm like, No,
Jane Stark:it's funny, right? The spaciousness and when right
Jane Stark:when you said that right before this con. She told me I said no.
Jane Stark:And I was like, amazing. What do you say yes to? And it was that
Jane Stark:was like it's so I was thinking about that when Suzanne held up
Jane Stark:the sign because I was like Jen and I just had this
Jane Stark:conversation. Just have the conversation. So she you've
Jane Stark:opened and you don't know necessarily you're not saying no
Jane Stark:to that to say yes to something specific right now. But you are
Jane Stark:by saying no to that you're saying yes to yourself and or
Jane Stark:Yes to that next thing, and it's yes
Jen Lang:to spaciousness, that's why you've
Unknown:created space, because I think how many of us try and
Unknown:make a change and don't have success because we're just
Unknown:trying to jam in more into an already overstuffed lifestyle.
Unknown:So it's like by decluttering what it is that we're doing and
Unknown:committing to what are we making space for and even for a while
Unknown:just for rest?
Jen Lang:Yes, absolutely. No, like, I think part of that
Jen Lang:decision making gain was that I know, I have a really intensive
Jen Lang:April and yes, April includes, you know, five days away. So
Jen Lang:like I do get a vacation, I've got that rest space built in.
Jen Lang:But I know like I have some big things to deliver, and I'm
Jen Lang:excited about them. And at the same time, I know that I will
Jen Lang:want that space in May to reflect and to unsought recover,
Jen Lang:because it's not really, but I want that space in me to balance
Jen Lang:the output in April,
Unknown:big capacity backup, because you know, when we give
Unknown:and give and give that our capacity bank is depleted, and
Unknown:that needs to be replenished. And that's something that we
Unknown:don't often look at, because we think I'll just keep going just
Unknown:keep soldiering on completely. Yeah.
Jane Stark:Oh, so it's been such a great conversation. Yes.
Jane Stark:Where Suzanne, where can our listeners find you? And can you
Jane Stark:share a little bit more about your why weight program?
Unknown:So certainly, so they can find me at my website,
Unknown:Suzanne kohlberg.com, which I know you will link because I'll
Unknown:be fascinated if anybody can find it. So my way weight
Unknown:program, it enrolls four times a year, it's seasonal. So each
Unknown:round has all four seasons. So it's kind of fascinating. And
Unknown:it's about. So we have it's called Why wait, but it's not
Unknown:about physical weight on your body. It's like, what are we
Unknown:waiting for? What are we putting off? What are we going to do
Unknown:once we've achieved this? And how can we start today, and I
Unknown:talk about the full body, so physical, mental, emotional,
Unknown:energetic or spiritual. Because our thoughts and our feelings,
Unknown:so often we keep changing our action, hoping for a different
Unknown:result back to that over giving cycle. But if on some level, you
Unknown:think this is never going to work, doesn't matter what you
Unknown:do, you're going to create the results. It's about shifting
Unknown:those thoughts, shifting those beliefs, learning how to
Unknown:actually feel our feelings, which so many of us don't, we
Unknown:numb them out with food or working or you know, something
Unknown:else, like exercising, how to process a feeling. And it's 10
Unknown:weeks long. There is a lot in there. So my invitation for
Unknown:everyone is to pick your intention, because your
Unknown:intention plus attention equals an outcome. And then if your so
Unknown:called, there is future rounds. So the first round is $1,200.
Unknown:Australian, and then I have an alumni rate. So people can take
Unknown:a round off or many rounds and they come back. It's just it's a
Unknown:fantastic community because it's a place where you can actually
Unknown:own what's going on without guilt without shame without Oh,
Unknown:have you tried this? Because how often can you not actually share
Unknown:what's happening without somebody trying to fix it for
Unknown:you, but a place to be seen, to be witnessed and to share what's
Unknown:happening? And yeah, it's absolutely it's, it's been
Unknown:running for in this iteration a year. But altogether three
Unknown:years, we've had some people who have been there the whole time,
Unknown:some people who come and go, and whatever happens, you can show
Unknown:up, you can be you and create, you know, the next version of
Unknown:you in a container in a space where people can just be honest,
Unknown:and yeah, I absolutely love it. That's
Unknown:awesome. Amazing. Thank
Jen Lang:you. We will link to the show notes. And we'll put
Jen Lang:the link to the website in there. Definitely Suzanne
Jen Lang:kullberg.com. All right. Yes. Go visit.
Jane Stark:Yeah, download the first two chapters of her book.
Jen Lang:The beginning is shit. Because you know, frankly, for
Jen Lang:everybody, the beginning is shit. Yeah.
Unknown:Anything. We offer anything we give up too soon. We
Unknown:like oh, it's not perfect straightaway, what is imagined
Unknown:if we were all babies, and like I couldn't walk immediately. So
Unknown:I'm just not going to bother pulling ourselves up. Keep
Unknown:falling down a tree, you build the strength to be able to keep
Unknown:going.
Jane Stark:Thank you. It's a metaphor. Such a good reminder
Jane Stark:for all of us. I needed to hear that today. So thank you.
Unknown:Thank you both.
Jen Lang:Great reminder. Thank you, Suzanne, for joining us
Jen Lang:today. We are so excited to have you back again, when your next
Jen Lang:book comes out we which we haven't even talked about. But
Jen Lang:we you will hear from all of us again. And is there a timeline
Jen Lang:for that next book yet or
Unknown:so now I actually have to start cracking on I've got an
Unknown:outline. That's as far as I've gotten.
Jen Lang:So we will have Suzanne back on no halos here.
Jen Lang:And I've got some snippets of wisdom. I think we'll just wrap
Jen Lang:it up here. Anything else to share? We're good. Thanks.
Jen Lang:Amazing. Thanks, everybody. Have an awesome day. And we will see
Jen Lang:you next time. Hopefully you will hear us next time. On no
Jen Lang:halos here. Take care fi thanks for joining us for these
Jen Lang:conscious combos. If you're ready to dive deeper, head on
Jen Lang:over to Dr Jenn and jane.com to continue the conversation.
Jane Stark:If you love this episode, please take a moment to
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Jane Stark:at we are Jen and Jane and let us know what you enjoy and what
Jane Stark:you would like to see more of. We'd love to hear from you.
