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Simon Sansome was born, raised and continues to live in England. He had what he considers a normal childhood except for the fact that he did have and has today dyslexia. As he describes it, reading even to day some forty-two years after he came on the scene, is extremely difficult for him. He does, however, write well. He will tell us about his growing up, going to a British college, then joining the workforce and eventually going to a university. Yes, college as he will tell us is different from university. In 2014 he was struck with a slipped disc. Unfortunately, the chiropractor who then attempted to fix the problem only made matters much worse and Simon became paralyzed from the waist down. Simon determined to move forward and went back to the university where he graduated in 2018 with a degree in journalism. Along the way Simon created a Facebook page and a community called “Snowball Community”. As the community evolved Simon and later others began posting information about accessible places first in England and then elsewhere as well. Today Snowball has received countless awards for all it is doing to promote accessibility and Simon tells us that they expect to have over a Million viewers on a regular basis. Snowball Community will soon be providing opportunities for restaurants, shops and other places to obtain in-person accessibility assessments and the ratings from those assessments will be available to promote the businesses that are evaluated. Simon by any standard is unstoppable and inspiring. I trust that you will agree. About the Guest: Simon sustained a life changing injury when he was 32 which left him disabled from the waist down. It forced him to take early retirement and he decided to go to DMU to study Journalism and pursue his passion for writing. In 2016, while at DMU, Simon set up a Facebook Snowball Community with the idea of raising awareness of, and improving, disabled access. His award-winning campaign has had a global impact and the page now reaches more than 20 million people a month. Simon is also an award winning film/documentary producer after his life story was brought by Amazon Prime and his film ‘Access All Areas’ won 16 international film awards including best film. Simon is also founder of Snowball Community a global disability app where you can leave reviews on how accessible a place is. Which is available on Android and Apple devices. The app has had 40,000 reviews in 12 months making it the biggest disability app in the world helping thousands of people daily. Simon has won a number of major awards he is widely considered to be one of the most influential disabled people in the UK. He was named in the top ten of the most influential people in the UK 2023 and this yeas won the Digital and Tech award at the Disability Power 100 and won the prestigious Santander X national award and will represent the UK at the Santander Global awards 2024. Ways to connect with Simon: https://www.facebook.com/FreezeSnowball https://twitter.com/FreezemySnowbal https://www.instagram.com/freezesnowball?igsh=MTl5ZHMxb3FvdzV1dA%3D%3D&utm_source=qr https://www.tiktok.com/@snowball.community?_t=8jKD9oRZmPw&_r=1 About the Host: Michael Hingson is a New York Times best-selling author, international lecturer, and Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe. Michael, blind since birth, survived the 9/11 attacks with the help of his guide dog Roselle. This story is the subject of his best-selling book, Thunder Dog. Michael gives over 100 presentations around the world each year speaking to influential groups such as Exxon Mobile, AT&T, Federal Express, Scripps College, Rutgers University, Children’s Hospital, and the American Red Cross just to name a few. He is Ambassador for the National Braille Literacy Campaign for the National Federation of the Blind and also serves as Ambassador for the American Humane Association’s 2012 Hero Dog Awards. https://michaelhingson.com https://www.facebook.com/michael.hingson.author.speaker/ https://twitter.com/mhingson https://www.youtube.com/user/mhingson https://www.linkedin.com/in/michaelhingson/ accessiBe Links https://accessibe.com/ https://www.youtube.com/c/accessiBe https://www.linkedin.com/company/accessibe/mycompany/ https://www.facebook.com/accessibe/ Thanks for listening! Thanks so much for listening to our podcast! If you enjoyed this episode and think that others could benefit from listening, please share it using the social media buttons on this page. Do you have some feedback or questions about this episode? Leave a comment in the section below! Subscribe to the podcast If you would like to get automatic updates of new podcast episodes, you can subscribe to the podcast on Apple Podcasts or Stitcher. You can subscribe in your favorite podcast app. You can also support our podcast through our tip jar https://tips.pinecast.com/jar/unstoppable-mindset . Leave us an Apple Podcasts review Ratings and reviews from our listeners are extremely valuable to us and greatly appreciated. They help our podcast rank higher on Apple Podcasts, which exposes our show to more awesome listeners like you. If you have a minute, please leave an honest review on Apple Podcasts. Transcription Notes: Michael Hingson ** 00:00 Access Cast and accessiBe Initiative presents Unstoppable Mindset. The podcast where inclusion, diversity and the unexpected meet. Hi, I'm Michael Hingson, Chief Vision Officer for accessiBe and the author of the number one New York Times bestselling book, Thunder dog, the story of a blind man, his guide dog and the triumph of trust. Thanks for joining me on my podcast as we explore our own blinding fears of inclusion unacceptance and our resistance to change. We will discover the idea that no matter the situation, or the people we encounter, our own fears, and prejudices often are our strongest barriers to moving forward. The unstoppable mindset podcast is sponsored by accessiBe, that's a c c e s s i capital B e. Visit www.accessibe.com to learn how you can make your website accessible for persons with disabilities. And to help make the internet fully inclusive by the year 2025. Glad you dropped by we're happy to meet you and to have you here with us. Michael Hingson ** 01:20 Well, hi there. This is your host, Mike Hingson, and you are listening to unstoppable mindset where inclusion, diversity and the unexpected meet. I love to say that every so often, but here we are once again, and now we are talking with Simon Sansome, who is over in England. So it is about 736 in the evening there, and it's 1136 where I am. So Simon, welcome to unstoppable mindset. Simon is a he's going to talk about snowball and I don't want to give that away. He also is a person with a disability. So again, welcome to unstoppable mindset. Thank you very much. It's Simon Sansome ** 02:01 a pleasure to be here. Michael Hingson ** 02:02 Now I am curious about something that just popped into my head. Do you all have daylight savings time over there that takes effect at some point? Yes, we Simon Sansome ** 02:10 do. Yes. Michael Hingson ** 02:12 When will that start? Simon Sansome ** 02:13 No idea whatsoever. It just pops up on my iPhone and changes itself 02:17 these days. Yeah. Yeah. I Simon Sansome ** 02:22 mean, best thing from working at home doesn't really affect me. Yeah, well, it's not like I lose an hour or gain an hour because I just stay in bed or get up, you know, get it when, when I need to. So, yeah, Michael Hingson ** 02:33 now I'm just really curious. I'm gonna look at my calendar. I think, 02:39 I think it's April. Michael Hingson ** 02:40 Is it all the way to April? Yeah, with Okay, over there, it's April. Well, here Daylight Savings Time begins. Oops, I'm sorry. Daylight Saving Time begins next Sunday. So you can tell we're recording this in advance of when it's going to actually go up everyone but daylight savings time here in the US, begins on March 10 so time Time flies. However, when you're having fun, I guess Simon Sansome ** 03:13 there is a rumor over here that Daylight Savings Time was actually created by Benjamin Franklin so we could play golf in Scotland. Is that what it was, apparently so, but obviously we've got nothing to verify that, but that's the rumor. Well, Michael Hingson ** 03:26 yeah, but it didn't get implemented all that soon. But you know, on the other hand, um, Benjamin Franklin is also one of the main characters in the new James Potter series, the outgrowth of the Harry Potter books. Oh, I didn't know that, because he is the Chancellor of Alma alaran, which is the American or US School of magic. So he's been around a while. This guy, Franklin, he's done a lot of stuff. But anyway, nevertheless, welcome to unstoppable mindset, and we're really glad that you're here. Why don't you start by telling us kind of about the early Simon growing up and some of those things. Yeah, Simon Sansome ** 04:06 of course, I grew up in a village called burst in Leicestershire, that for most people, nobody knows where Leicestershire is. Everyone thinks of Nottingham when they think of Les share because it's the cloak, because of Robin Hood. So Nottingham Sherwood Forest is about 40 miles north of Lacher. However, we have become more famous over the recent years. We won the premiership in 2016 in Leicester City, which went was was a fantastic thing for the city. And then Richard the Third interesting fact, it was found under my car parking space. Dickie three. I was working for social services at the time, and Dickie three under my car parking space. So that was fun, I know, but no grew up in a normal house, Mum, three sisters, went to school, was dyslexic, wasn't diagnosed. I did terribly at school, great at cricket, loved the sport, played a bit of rugby and. And, yeah, just, I suppose really, you know, I worked. I worked all the like, Saturday jobs, and worked in a fruit and veg shop from the age of 14 to 16, getting up at four, four o'clock in the morning, going to work for a few hours, then going to school, falling asleep at school before Yeah, and then going to close the shop up at night. And I did that for one pound 25 an hour, which was, you know, child slave labor, yeah? So really, your average childhood, nothing really exciting going on there. Michael Hingson ** 05:33 So did you ever go to Sherwood Forest? Simon Sansome ** 05:35 Many times it's a nice walk. Yeah, is it we go on a regular basis due to the fact that it's you can hire a they're called trampers over here. It's a big mobility scooter, and so you can go around Sherwood Forest in the mobility scooter. So we'll get there quite a lot, because it's a nice outing. What Michael Hingson ** 05:52 kind of trees? Simon Sansome ** 05:55 Big oak, okay, big ones, yeah, willows, oaks and lots more. You know, it's a forest. Michael Hingson ** 06:02 How big is? How big is the forest? Simon Sansome ** 06:04 Absolutely no idea whatsoever. It's big. It's a forest. Yeah, you know, it's a good few miles across, a few, good few miles wide. You're going to get lost in it, if you if there wasn't a path, yeah, yeah. Well, Michael Hingson ** 06:19 and it's nice that after all these years and all the reputation that it has, and Robin Hood hiding in it and living there, and all that, that it really does still stand and people honor it, which is cool. Yeah, Simon Sansome ** 06:31 I the best thing about Robin Hood, Prince of Thieves, if you've seen it, he arrives in Dover on by sea, and then by night, he's walked to Nottingham, which is about 250 miles, he's fast, Michael Hingson ** 06:47 and when you got to go after the sheriff, you know, you, you've got a mission, you got to do it, Simon Sansome ** 06:51 yeah? So fat place Walker, him and him and Morgan Freeman, Michael Hingson ** 06:57 well, my favorite movie is actually a slightly different one. It's called Robin in the seven hoods. Have you ever seen it is, Simon Sansome ** 07:04 is that the, I don't know if, no, I'm thinking of Robin Hood, many types. Yeah, Michael Hingson ** 07:09 Robin and the seven hoods, stars, well, the Rat Pack, basically. Okay, and so Bing, Crosby is no Frank Sinatra is Robbo. It takes place on the in Chicago during the gang times. So Frank Sinatra is Robbo. Dean Martin is John, or Little John. Bing Crosby was Friar, tuck and other people. Peter Falk was Guy Gisborne. Okay, you know, so they had all the characters. It was, it was really a cute movie. I've always loved to watch that movie. It's a lot of fun. So, and needless to say, it was a comedy and, and at the end, most everybody ends up behind, you know, in concrete. It in behind a wall, except for Friar Tuck who gets the girl? Fair enough. I think Robbo doesn't get walled up either, but it's a fun movie. But anyway, no Sherwood Forest. It's all on the south side of Chicago, okay. But anyway, so did you go to college? I Simon Sansome ** 08:16 went to college and dropped out and then moved when? Because I just didn't get along college. Well, the thing is, because I had undiagnosed, I was undiagnosed dyslexic, yeah, in the like, you know, 80s and 90s, it wasn't really recognized as a thing, no. So I really couldn't really write until I was 1516, so I didn't go to what you would I went to a college. But the college isn't what colleges in America, or secondary rather than higher education. So we go, we go primary school, high school, college, university, okay? And so I went to, I went to Leicester college to did, what did I do there? It was film, I think, yeah, for about a year, dropped out and then got a job in Scotland, and moved Scotland just on a whim and became a training manager in a hotel. And the idea was, is I wasn't going to be rich, I but I thought, if I could be a waiter, if I can be a barman, if I can be the head of the departments in a hotel in the catering industry, then I've got a job for life. Yeah. So I've got a backup plan. So because once you've worked in a bar, in a restaurant, or you've been a chambermaid, which I've done, or kitchen shoe chef, or whatever, you know, you can pretty much walk into any job anywhere, and just, you know, you're always going to have a job if you need to, you can find things. Yeah, yes, absolutely. And that was the plan, because I didn't have an education behind Michael Hingson ** 09:39 me. And then, and I'm amazed at the number of people, and I shouldn't be, because I understand the history who happened to have dyslexia or who were on, what we would say now is on the autism spectrum, who were never diagnosed. I've talked to a number of people here on on stop. Mindset who talked about the fact that they were autistic and didn't even know it until they were in their 30s or even 40s, and it was very freeing to figure it out, because they knew they were different, but they didn't understand what what was really going on with them, and then in the last 15 or 20 years, they finally got enough of a diagnosis, a lot of information. So they, oftentimes, they figured it out even before the medical profession did. Simon Sansome ** 10:37 Yeah, same thing that happened with me. It was late diagnosis, yeah. So, so after Scotland, I moved back down to moving with my sister to help her out, because she had a child, and she was struggling. She was single mother. And so I got a job working at British Gas in Leicester, which is in the call center, and I got and after a painstaking working a nine to five job in a call center, thought, I don't want to do this for the rest of my life. Yeah. So I returned to education. And I returned to Loughborough College, which is up the road, and my then teacher, my sociology teacher, after handing in my first assignment as a mature student, she went, right, you're dyslexic, have an assessment. And that's when it really Yeah, and that's when it changed. That's when everything changed for me. Michael Hingson ** 11:28 So what changed and why did it? Well, I can understand why, after the diagnosis, Simon Sansome ** 11:33 I got the support I needed, that I didn't that I didn't realize myself, that I needed so kind of support, extra reading lessons, extra tuition, how to read and write, how to spell, very patient teachers, and a lot more encouragement as well from the college, which then helped me go on to university as well. So yeah, so Michael Hingson ** 11:57 your your teachers helped you teach your brain to connect and be able to eventually really recognize, yes, so Simon Sansome ** 12:07 I learned very visually. I can't really read. Can't really read very well. However, I'm an excellent writer, which is ironic. And I was writing everything and everything because I enjoyed writing so much. But I couldn't read software. I couldn't read out loud. And if I would read, sit there and reading your book, I would have, I call them brain farts, but their memory lapses or something, where you can read a whole page, or three or four pages of a book, and you can read it absolutely fine, but I've got no idea what's happened in those three pages, the information just doesn't Michael Hingson ** 12:42 stay there. Yeah, the disconnect is still pretty strong. Yes, very much. So, Simon Sansome ** 12:47 so I learn visually. So I was, I mean, back in the day, I was a huge film fan, and that explains the reason why. Yeah, Michael Hingson ** 12:53 but, but you could write so you could, you could communicate. And whether, whether you, I assume, probably more often than not you, you wrote via a keyboard. Yep, Simon Sansome ** 13:05 very much. So I also used the dragon talk back in the day, yeah, Michael Hingson ** 13:09 but you don't. How did you do with like, writing with a pen or a pencil? No, I Yeah, no, I can do that quite well. You can do that quite well as well. Yeah, yeah. Simon Sansome ** 13:18 I kept my journal as well. I kept a diary, yeah, just because it helped me to write. So Michael Hingson ** 13:24 do you still use Dragon? No, Simon Sansome ** 13:27 no, God, no. It's atrocious. I don't I haven't used it for about 15 years, so I don't know where it is now. Oh Michael Hingson ** 13:34 gosh, it it is incredibly much better than it used to be when it was dragon. Dictate. Now it's Dragon Naturally Speaking, I use it a lot, and when I discover it has mispronounced, I can read or not mispronounce, but misrecognized or misinterpreted, I can correct it, and it doesn't take much in the way of corrections. But Dragon is so much better than it used to be. Yes, I use Dragon Professional and and I do type a lot and compose a lot, but I also find when I'm doing something that takes a while to do because it's long, it's much better to use Dragon to do it. Simon Sansome ** 14:18 Yes, No, I never really got along with Dragon. I used it, but a big fan of it. But however, the dictation on my Mac and my phone is absolutely perfect for me. We'll come to it shortly. But I'm a journalist as well now, and so I can write a story within 10 minutes, 500 or 1000 words within a few minutes. It's great, and Michael Hingson ** 14:40 you would find that that Dragon has that same level of accuracy, because I think a lot of the algorithms went from Dragon to other technologies, or the other way around. But Dragon is really great today. 14:55 Yeah, Michael Hingson ** 14:56 so, you know, I can't, I can't complain a lot about Dragon. And it really does help a great deal. It's a whole lot cheaper than it used to be, but that's another story. You know, of course, the original Kurzweil Reading Machine for the blind that read print out loud by being able to look at a page and recognize the characters. The original Ray Kurzweil machine was $50,000 and now you get free OCR on an iPhone or an Android device or or very inexpensive anyway, and optical character recognition is a common place kind of thing anyway. So yes, lot different than it used to be. The world does progress and move forward. It certainly does so you did eventually go to university. What did you do there? Simon Sansome ** 15:41 Yeah, so the first time I went to university. So I went twice, I did criminology. Oh, wow. Because I was enjoying writing so much, I thought I'd like to be a crime writer. What a waste of the time. If you want to learn about crime, you don't go and do you don't go and do criminology at university. So because it was so boring and so dull, I dropped out after the second year again. I mean, I was doing okay. I was getting about 50s, you know, so, two, two ish at university, but I really wasn't enjoying it, and I wasn't putting any effort into it. And so, yeah, I dropped out and looked for a job and went to work for the council. So Michael Hingson ** 16:27 the council being so, Simon Sansome ** 16:29 I worked for the local authority. Left City Council. Okay, yeah, the city council. Okay, great, okay, yes. So I, Michael Hingson ** 16:36 I that was different. It was, Simon Sansome ** 16:39 it was, it was very interesting, because I wasn't enjoying university, that was the thing, and so Michael Hingson ** 16:46 and so you decided to leave criminology at the university and go look at the criminals of the council, right? Simon Sansome ** 16:51 Pretty much. Yeah, I started off in housing. I worked as a housing assistant for a couple of years, working up there, and then, after a number of years getting a bit of experience under about doing some volunteering for youth services, um, I moved on to social services. And I was there till I left the council. And that was, that was an education. I did that for about eight years. And so, yeah, that and nothing prepares you for working for social services, going to see people intimate house you know, into their homes, their immediate environments, how people live, the poverty, the destruction, the drugs, the deaths you know, every you know, everyone's everyday life that you take for granted. And it certainly was an eye opening experience and a very worthwhile life education, Michael Hingson ** 17:43 yeah, at the same Yeah, it is a great education at the same time, when you do it and you care, you are also hopefully able to help people and make a difference, even if it's with one life that Simon Sansome ** 17:56 was the intention. So our specializing in adult mental health and physical disabilities by the time I left, and what you see every day is you try and get some positives from it, because you are saving lives and you're trying to make people safe, and that's your job. And at the end of the day, you get people who just don't care and just want to die and kill themselves. And yeah, it's people dying on you every day, especially if you come to the hospitals, that's interesting. I didn't I got transferred to one of the hospitals here in Leicestershire and but even before I had a case or went to see went to see a patient, to get them discharged from hospital, I had like, nine deaths on my table, wow. And so I got transferred back, just in case I thought I was killing people, even I hadn't seen anyone. Michael Hingson ** 18:46 So did, do you think you ever really did make a positive difference to any of those people who were really losing hope, or who had lost hope? Were you? Were you able to help? Simon Sansome ** 18:55 I mean, the thing is, is because you're the first point of call, so I was on effectively, emergency call outs. So you go and make sure that person is safe, you make sure they've got food, make sure they're okay, and then you pass it on to a long term team. So mine was the emergency intermediary department, like working with the police, ambulance service, firemen and so on and so forth. We would do joint visits. And so I really never got to see the long term effects. I was there to put the plan in place and then let a longer term, longer team, manage that person and the cash plan, or whatever was needed. So well, Michael Hingson ** 19:31 it's a it is a process, no doubt. So when did, when did you leave the council? What year was that Simon Sansome ** 19:39 that was? When was that that was 2015 Michael Hingson ** 19:42 Oh, okay, well, yeah. And then what did you go do? Because at some point after that, your life changed. Simon Sansome ** 19:48 My life changed. So it actually changed while I was working for the council. Um, so I became disabled in 2014 um. So I we're not 100% sure how the injury happened. I'll explain. So I was doing Ruby training at Victoria Park during that week, and I we also had a ton of bark delivered to our driveway because our driveway needed doing. And so I have this I slipped a disc, and I don't know if it's from the or it's from playing with me that I don't know, or rugby training anyway, not from cricket, not from Cricket. No, I have played cricket for a while, since then I played it as Michael Hingson ** 20:30 a lad. Cricket is very slow. Oh, cricket's amazing Simon Sansome ** 20:34 you. It's more technical than baseball. Yeah, Michael Hingson ** 20:37 I know. I understand. I When I visited New Zealand and listened to some cricket on the radio, and it was really hard to follow because it it generally does move pretty slow, so I know it's very technical, and I never really caught on to the rules. I did figure out rugby a lot more than than I was able to figure out rugby Simon Sansome ** 20:58 is 80 minutes. I mean, cricket lasts for five days. It's beautiful. Yeah, I Michael Hingson ** 21:02 understand, but you have to take the time to really learn the rules. And I didn't have enough time to really listen to the radio, I guess Simon Sansome ** 21:11 that's right. Anyway, yeah, so I had a slip disc. I've had a slip disc before, and normally I would take some ibuprofen, do my exercises, try and pop it back in. On this occasion, me and Kate, my new wife, we were going away on a honeymoon to Mexico, and so I went to see a chiropractor in the local area. And it was doing well, you know, I was getting better. I was exercising. What I was walking further. It was had I took a few weeks off work because it was really very uncomfortable, and couldn't really visit people in their homes when I'm really uncomfortable. However, on the fifth or sixth visit, this newly trained chiropractor decided she was going to have a go at putting the disc back in for my honeymoon, and she crushed levels three, four and five of my spine while doing that, and that hurt. I screamed. I didn't know what she did. I thought she slipped. I thought she she could. She warned me it was going to hurt, yeah, and it did. It really did okay. And I after I couldn't get my shoes on, so she was on. So she helped me get my shoes on, and effectively, she just threw me out after I screamed. I think she knew something that had gone wrong. I didn't know at the time. I just thought she put my disc back in because I was in so much pain. I collapsed outside where Kate was waiting for me in the car. And I went home and said, Look, I'm just going to go to bed. I'll sleep it off. And the following morning, I woke up, I thought I had a stroke because I had no sensation from the waist down. Yeah, Michael Hingson ** 22:50 yeah. My wife was a t3 para, so it was basically from the bottom of the breast down. But I understand exactly what you're saying, Simon Sansome ** 22:59 yeah. So it was a very unusual situation. I didn't know what to do. Kate had gone to work that morning. We lived in a cul de sac, a dead end road for you and me. Michael Hingson ** 23:10 Nope, no cul de sacs. Very well, that's okay, Simon Sansome ** 23:14 okay, that's fine. I wasn't too sure on the terminology for the American audience. Michael Hingson ** 23:18 It's it's a term over here, too cool, Simon Sansome ** 23:21 excellent. And so I was shouting for assistance. There's nobody there. I didn't have my phone on me. Phone was downstairs, and so I threw myself out of bed, did an army crawl, threw myself down the stairs, but naked, and I don't really remember a lot after that. I don't mean apparently my mom came round. Apparently, the ambulance came round. But I you know, but I don't remember a lot what happened. I really don't. What I know is, when I was taken to hospital, I had an MRI. Don't remember the MRI at all. Obviously, I'm under painkillers at this time, and there's a lot going on, and I'm in shock because I'm paralyzed from the waist down. And yeah, they they did an MRI. The emergency doctor said it was cordial. Quite a syndrome. Cordiaquinas syndrome is fully recoverable if you get an operation within 2448 hours. However, for whatever reason, and we still don't know the answer to this, the consultant overall, the A and E doctor, and said, It's not cordial Corona syndrome, and they put me on the ward for three months not knowing what to do with me, because they didn't know what was wrong with me. And by the time the by that time, the damage had been doing. Needed to do it within a 48 hour window to stop any permanent damage. But no, they left me there, and I was unfortunately left there to rot for three months. The damage had been done, and then I was paralyzed from the waist down for forever. I still, you know, I'm a wheelchair, full time wheelchair user. Now I. Yeah, Michael Hingson ** 25:00 yeah. By then it was irreversible and there was nothing you could do. Yeah, Simon Sansome ** 25:04 very much. So, Michael Hingson ** 25:06 so as a paraplegics, can you? Can you now? Well, I've summoned that. You then went through some sort of physical therapy and strengthening and so on. Yeah, Simon Sansome ** 25:17 absolutely. So I went through physio for a while. I mean, some of it has come back. Some of it did come back for a while. They said you probably going to get better for a while, but then it's going to deteriorate again. So the point where the first, after a year, I could walk, you know, 200 meters, maybe, with a walking stick and a frame. So I was getting out, you know, I could walk slightly. I could, you know, so that wasn't too bad, okay, however, then I got a drop foot, so that went so I couldn't really walk anywhere, because I got no balance. And then the other Association went to my legs, so I got to a point where I could walk slightly, a little, and then it started disappearing over the years. It's been 10 years now. So now I've while I've got about, in my right leg, I'd say about, ooh, 10% sensation. But my drop foot, there's nothing at all. Can't feel it, so you can drop it off, I wouldn't notice. And in my left leg, I've probably got about 10% usage. So I can move my legs, I just can't feel anything, and then my bowels and bladder have gone as well. So I've got a self catchpherized and stuff as well. Michael Hingson ** 26:25 Yeah, which? Which my wife always had to do. She was born with scar tissue on her spinal cord, so she's always been that way. We always been apparent. So obviously huge difference in your lifestyle going forward. And how did you cope with all that? What did you do? What did you decide to do? Because you strike me as a person who isn't going to let a lot row of grass grow under your feet, as it were. Well, I Simon Sansome ** 26:55 mean, we didn't know. Wow, this is the thing. We were stuck because I couldn't work, okay? And work made me take ill health retirement. They didn't want me back at work. Even though I didn't want to do that, I was forced to take ill health retirement at 32 we me and Kate. This is where me and Kate were very sensible. Is because Kate was earning a good wage, I was earning a good wage, and we brought the house. That was in case any of any of us lost our jobs, we could still afford the mortgage and the bills. Okay, wouldn't leave us with a lot of money, but we could just, we wouldn't lose the house, right? So if we, if we brought a huge because we had a nice three bed, semi detached, it was a really nice house, but it we could have Afford a House shovel the size, but if we did that, we'd be really stretching ourselves. So because we were sensible. That gave me the option to go and we needed to cover the mortgage effectively, because the bills were the bills and the mortgage were effectively case wage, and so we didn't have really any money to live on. You know, we're talking about 2030, pound a week after all, the bills will come out and the mortgage. So I decided that I was going to return to university to retrain, um, after pretty much the day afterwards. Uh, let's let city council told me how to take ill health retirement, and I applied to university to check do a journalism because I enjoyed Michael Hingson ** 28:14 writing. Did the health retirement then give you some income, Simon Sansome ** 28:18 very little. It was 134 pound a month. And it still is about, I think it's going to be up to inflation, like 150 pound a month. I get it after life, not much. Yeah, absolutely. Because, you know, I was 32 there's no money in the park for the ill health retirement, yeah. But what would happen is, is it would give us time to sort things out, and the student loan would cover any food bills, or, you know, anything we needed for that for three years. So it gives us a little leeway. So it gives us a little bit of an income. It takes the pressure off Kate and so I returned to university to train as a journalist, and that's again where everything starts to change again. So, Michael Hingson ** 29:04 but you could write, so there you go, yeah, Simon Sansome ** 29:07 um, couldn't spell. It still can't spell, but I could tell a story, yeah, so I can get it checked by Kate or my mom or whoever. So, yeah, it's, it was interesting. So yeah, I got accepted. And I was twice the age of everyone else there, which was a little bit embarrassing, but I didn't really care. I was more mates with I'm still in contact with them. Actually, I'm still, and this is like 2000 what, 15 until 18 I graduated. Yeah, I'm still in contact on Facebook and stuff with all my lecturers, not the people I went to university with, because, yeah, but all lecturers I'm still in contact with. Michael Hingson ** 29:46 So, you know, I want to come back and continue the story, but now I'm a little bit curious. Given the way things work over here, a lot of times, somebody clearly made them a. Stake in terms of dealing with your diagnosis and so on. Did you ever think about any kind of litigation or going after them legally and looking for funds that way, or anything like that? Simon Sansome ** 30:11 We had to. Never sued anyone in my life. Never wanted to. Yeah, but we're getting to the point where I you know, wheelchairs are expensive. Equipment's getting expensive. Mobility scooters are expensive. We need an adapted vehicle, brooches, medication. We need carers. We need, you know, personal help with personal care, adding confidence power, which was really expensive, and so we didn't realize at the time how expensive having a disability was. So we got to the point where we had to take legal action. And we saw a lawyer, we got recommended one, and after five years, they settled. They didn't go, he didn't go to court. And so that was put in a trust for my protection. Yeah, yeah, because I am going to deteriorate later in life, and the cost of that is going to be extortionate, so that is well protected. So yeah, Michael Hingson ** 31:16 yeah, it's unfortunate you have to do that sometimes my involvement in litigation was that I was thrown off of an airplane because of my guide dog, and we, we sued, we eventually settled years ago. Was back in the early 1980s it's an education to go through the process, and it did go to court. There was eventually a settlement. But it was even really hard to get a good jury, because some of the original people who were potential jurors worked for airlines, or new people who worked for airlines, and so they said they'd be prejudiced, and it didn't matter that a blind person with a guide dog was ejected from an airplane simply because of the dog. Yeah, of course, today that that couldn't happen, well, it could happen, but it would. It can. He Simon Sansome ** 32:10 still does. It does. It Michael Hingson ** 32:11 does and but the laws are, are more substantive, but even so, it lawsuits are, are really not an easy thing at all, and there's a lot of emotion that goes into it, and there's a lot that one has to decide they want to put up with. And you don't really know a lot about that until you're in the middle of it, unless somebody really sits you down and describes this is what's going to happen. I had a little bit of that, but I know how difficult it is to do people have told me I should sue the hospital that put me in an incubator when I was born prematurely, simply because that could cause blindness. And other people have actually sued successfully 20 and 30 years after they were born, they litigated, and I just felt, look, medical science had already started to be told that a pure oxygen environment could lead to what at that time was called retrolateral fibroplasia, which is now retinopathy or prematurity. But I think 2030, and 40 years later, suing doesn't accomplish anything and and so my parents and I talked about it a lot, and we all agreed that that doesn't make any sense to do, and we didn't, and I have no regrets about that, but your situation is significantly different than that. Yeah, Simon Sansome ** 33:44 we had to move house. We had to double our mortgage. We couldn't stay in the house we were in at the time. And yeah, it was, it was a painful experience. So yeah, we needed, we needed an adaptive property at the end of the day, and we simply couldn't afford one. So you found Michael Hingson ** 34:03 one, or did you build one? Or so Simon Sansome ** 34:07 we couldn't find one. We actually brought one off plan, but we had to double our mortgage to do it. Yeah, that was interesting. So that wasn't pleasant, pleasurable at all, but we managed it. So Michael Hingson ** 34:20 we had instances where we built a house from scratch. First one was a manufactured home, and then we we moved to New Jersey in 1996 and we built a house there because we couldn't find a house that we could relatively easily modify. And if you modify a home, the cost is so expensive because you've got to redo doors, you've got to redo counters, you've got to redo a lot of things. That's assuming you can find one that doesn't have too many stairs for a person in a chair, and that you can can ramp those but. If you build a home, there's really no additional cost other than the cost that we had in New Jersey, because it was in an area where they only had two story homes, so we did have to put an elevator in. So that was an additional cost, but that was the only additional cost, because, as you're pointing out, everything else was on plan and you you design it in, there's no additional cost for building lower counters if you're doing it from the outset. So we did that. But then when we moved to we moved back to California, we couldn't find a place to build, and so then we did have to modify a home and it and the problem is that you can't really put it in the mortgage, and it's a little different today than it was when we moved back out here in 2002 but we couldn't put it in the mortgage, so it was $150,000 that we had to find. And eventually it it worked out as you, as you pointed out with like with you. Then we moved here to Southern California. We built this home, and I am, I'm very glad that we did. It's, it's a great house. Simon Sansome ** 36:05 Yeah, we've got a lovely home now. It's fully adapted. It's great, you know, it's large. I can get around quite easily. So it's a it's very nice, Michael Hingson ** 36:14 all one floor, Simon Sansome ** 36:17 all one floor. Yeah, it's extremely long. Michael Hingson ** 36:19 There you go. Well, so you went back to university and and clearly that was a major commitment and dedication on your part to decide to do that, but you didn't. What was the university like? How accessible was the university? Simon Sansome ** 36:36 Oh, it wasn't accessible at all for me. So I had a manual hospital, manual wheelchair. At the time, I couldn't push myself around because of my spinal damage and the spinal damage that I've got. I can't really push myself well in a manual wheelchair, right? And we didn't have any money for a scooter, so the first year, I was really struggling because we didn't know what services we didn't know what services we could access. We didn't know what was available. I'm newly disabled. I'm new to this world, even my work for social services, and until you're sitting in the chair, what you know about the world is absolutely nothing. And so it wasn't until I came across Disability Services at the University who helped me apply for a grant with the snow interest in the UK, and they provided me with an electric scooter. Well, that was brilliant. I mean, oh my god, yeah, it's like I found freedom. Because obviously, you know, so my university is called, my university is called Democrat University. And although it's not on a hill by any means whatsoever. There is a slope going all the way down to the main campus. And it's quite, it's quite a long road, but the slope is very subtle school it helps, yeah, but if you're pushing yourself in a manual wheelchair up that slope, by the time you get to the main road, you're absolutely exhausted. You just can't push yourself anymore. Yeah, and it's about, it's about a quarter mile along the whole campus. And so, yeah, I was pushing myself backwards with my foot on the floor up the hill to get the classes and stuff. And I just said, This is ridiculous. This can't carry on. And so I spoke to Disability Services, and they helped me out. So, Michael Hingson ** 38:16 so what did you do once you So you went to the university, you you did that, and you were committed to making it happen and and there, there had to be times that they would have been tempting to give up, but you didn't. No, Simon Sansome ** 38:30 I wasn't really tempted to get up. I mean, I have side effects from my corticoana syndrome. I have, like, seizures in the legs, which can happen anytime, and that causes that knocked me out for a few days. Yeah, so I did get a few medical exemptions here or there, but, you know, the the lecturers were more than happy knowing that I was capable of doing the work, yeah, which is cool. Yes, very much so. But I did have to have a couple of exemptions here or there, but nothing major. But while I was at university, that's when I set up the Facebook page, which is now known as snowball community, and that's what brings us to it. So, right, yeah, Michael Hingson ** 39:05 so tell us all about snowball and yeah, and everybody should know that I teased at the very beginning. I said, Well, now isn't it time that we should remember that snowball was the name of the pig in Animal Farm. And Simon's not read Animal Farm, so I Simon Sansome ** 39:24 got red Animal Farm can't read, sorry. Michael Hingson ** 39:27 Well, go listen to it. Then, you know, it's not that long on the book. It's not that long. Simon Sansome ** 39:33 No. So when, when, after a year of recovery, when I was going to university, so I went. So we were going out for a meal. It was the first meal me and my wife went out following the injury, okay? And there's a really nice place in Leicester, Spanish tapas, and it was the first time out in the wheelchair for a meal, and we couldn't get in. Okay? We called up and the wheelchair wouldn't go through the door. There was a step. At the front. And they're like, can you step over? That went, No, not really. But what happened was, as well, they put a table in front of the disabled entrance as well. Oh, that was good. Yeah, they had a ramp that went into the road, so that was interesting. And then the disabled toilet was upstairs, and so it was an emitted, a mitigated disaster. It really was atrocious. And this, and we didn't know this, we know I've never paid attention to say what access, you know, it just something we'd never, you know, I've never really been in a wheelchair before, so why? Why would I, yeah, yeah, and only if Michael Hingson ** 40:42 you took an interest, but most people wouldn't think of that, yeah, yeah, exactly understandable. So Simon Sansome ** 40:48 yeah, we just thought, you know, what else can we not get into? And it turns out quite a lot. And so a couple of days later, I decided to set up a Facebook page. It was called Ability access. Back then. It's now, of course, now being rebranded snowball community. And you know, all it was, it wasn't anything special. It was a very simple Facebook page, and it was to raise awareness of disabled access in the Leicester area. That's all I wanted to do. I didn't want awards. I didn't want recognition. I didn't want any of that. But however, within like, I think it kind of triggered something in people. It's not mold. It snowballed. Yeah, exactly. And I'm not too sure why or how, but I started putting a post of pictures of things, of places I couldn't get into, and videos, and, you know, me being angry, and so on and so forth. And, you know, within a like, within a month, I had 1000 followers. You know, they went to 2005 1000. And just kept on growing and growing and growing. Then we got nominated for many the page got nominated for awards. He started winning awards. And that's when I, at the time, I decided I was going to create something, if I could, called snowball community, which was an app. I had the idea of a disability app, but I'll come to that in a second. And yeah, it just, it just would not stop growing at the moment, I think it's about 110,000 followers on social media, and in 2019 it became the most read disability page in the world because people sharing videos, people sharing stories. You know, we were reaching an audience of over 30 million people a month. At one point, it just got absolutely crazy. And I just mean, I couldn't carry on doing that. I mean that took a lot of time, that took a lot of effort. And we just said, Look, we can do something with this. We can use the audience we've got. We've got an audience who follows it on a regular basis, who comments on a regular basis. And I said to Kate, we could do something really special here. And so I just Yeah. Once I graduated in 2018 I graduated from university with, again, a two one with honors in journalism, and I was working as a freelance journalist as well, which is great. It's because I could work whenever I like, but really, ability access would now snowball, just started to take over my life on the social media pages. And I said, Look, we could design an app here and create an accessibility app, and it took years of design to try and get it right. It really did. We took, we took, we did consultations, but also we couldn't afford it at the time either. We had to raise money for it as well. That's quite hard. And so, no, it's at the moment. Snowball was launched last year, and we are looking to get 100 that it's won national awards. It's one we came back from Barcelona last week. Okay? It won funding at a global award ceremony. And it's really snowballing. It's, we're expecting 100,000 reviews on the app this year. Michael Hingson ** 44:04 So do you? So have you created an actual nonprofit organization out of it, like snowball.org or anything like that? Simon Sansome ** 44:15 No, I really wanted to. I wanted it to be a charity organization. Yeah. And the reason I wanted it to be a charity organization, because I had assistance from a charity organization in the UK while at university, however, um, here in the UK, there are very strict rules and regulations on what you can spend the money on if you're a charity. And I wanted to set up a fund to help students who have disabilities at university, so I can do that. But also, I wanted to give 10% of the profits to local businesses who can't afford to do their own adaptations. We're talking small businesses, coffee shops, you know, local cafes, bakers and butchers and so on and so forth, fruit and veg shops who simply haven't got the 1015 grand what's required to make their stores excess. Possible. So I still, I'm still ever have every intention of doing that, but I couldn't do that as a charity organization. The rules and regulations wouldn't allow me to spend the money where I wanted to and where I thought thought, see if it where it's needed to do so for the communities across the UK. So I actually set it up as a limited company with the intention of probably 10% of the profit aside for local businesses to apply for grants when we start making money. Michael Hingson ** 45:30 Yeah, well, but that is, I would still say that is exciting. You're, you're, you're channeling all of that, and hopefully you'll be able to do some major things to to help raise a lot of awareness. So what other kinds of things do you do to help raise awareness about disabilities and so on? Simon Sansome ** 45:50 Yeah, so we're launching a number of profiles, at the moment, a number of things. So what we're doing is, I'm sure you have it in America as well with you, probably for your restaurants and pubs and everything you have, something similar to a food safety hygiene certificate. Yes, I'm not too sure what you call it. Over there, we have a certain similar thing here. It's a rating from one to five, okay? And we're launching something called the snowball membership scheme, and we're taking our 70 staff over the next few months to cover the whole of the UK. And what we're going to be doing is we're launching a scheme where businesses, whether it's Frankie and Benny subway McDonald's, can sign up to the system where we will go out and basically view a disability consultation for 250 quid and give you a full breakdown of what you can improve on your business, but also gives you an access rating that you can promote on social media and say, Look, come to our business. We are disabled friendly, yeah. But what that does is that creates a huge opportunity for businesses and the snowball app, because we are creating the biggest disability app in the world, and it tells you where you can it tells you where you can access, where you can go, okay, where you can eat, where you can shop, but also, more importantly, where you can spend your own money. And I was doing some research earlier today, before this interview. And according to one, I think the valuable 500 is the disabled community in America has $8 trillion of disposable income right to spend on things like restaurants and cinema tickets and so on and so forth, to cafes and, you know, clubs and shops and whatever, per year. So $8 trillion is going unspent because the disabled community in America, which is 60,000,060 1 million, I believe, don't know where to spend their money. Michael Hingson ** 47:48 Well, when you think about the fact that it's the largest minority worldwide, you hear anything from 20 to 25% of all persons have some sort of disability. The The only, the biggest challenge that I see is the problem is that the disabilities aren't uniform. That is, it isn't the same. The needs that that you have, to a degree, are different than the needs that I have. The bottom line, however, is that even if you deal with it in that term that everyone has different kinds of disabilities. The fact of the matter is, it's still awareness. And while you need physical access to get into a restaurant, I need access to be able to to know what's on the menu and know what it's going to cost. And you don't have as much of a need for that, as I do, because you can lift a menu and read it in theory, but the fact is that we all have different challenges, and as I've said a couple of times on this podcast, we need to really redefine disability. First of all, disability doesn't mean a lack of ability at all. This isn't really the issue, because we do have terms like disciple, discrete, you know, they're not all negatives and and so disability is is really something different than what people have made it into. Disability is a characteristic that everyone has, and it manifests itself differently. I love to say that that the reality is, for most people, your disability is that you're light dependent, because most people don't do well in the dark, and they and Thomas Edison fixed it by inventing the light bulb, but it still is a disability, even if it's covered up, because most of the time you have light disability is a characteristic that everybody manifests. It's just that we do it in different ways. Simon Sansome ** 49:44 No, I completely agree. I'm hoping that the system that I've created will address that. So, because what we've done as well is not, it's not just the question of, oh, we're going out there and is disabled friendly, is wheelchair accessible? We're doing. Know, full disability consultation on the business. So, do they have Braille menus? Do they have a change in place facility? You know, is there a lift? Is there Braille on the lift, that kind of thing, and so. And we're also introducing something called the stimulation rating as well. And this is touch, touch, taste, sight, see and spell. And this is to give you an indication of what those things are at that place for people with visual impairments, for mental health issues and learning disabilities. Because, for example, if you go to the British Library, very quiet, you know it's going to be quiet. Okay. If you go to the Natural History Museum in London, well, some days it's really nice and peaceful on other days, because you've got 10 school 10 coaches of school children, absolutely chaotic. Okay, so it does vary considerably. And the whole idea is, is, while it's not a perfect rating system, because, like you said, there are so many different types of disability, not every disability is the same. Yours is different to mine. We're trying to incorporate a holistic approach to making sure that people feel comfortable going there, because they can relate to something that's on the assessment, and they can see what's there, so they get the full report, and therefore they can have an individual, independent, independent, independent decision on whether that place is suitable for them. So it's not a perfect system where it can be changed quite easily through feedback. It can be improved through feedback. It's like a moving model at the moment. It's like 16 pages long the assessment. But hopefully it will with the feedback we're getting and how it will grow. It will hopefully evolve into something absolutely fantastic for everyone to be inclusive everywhere. Michael Hingson ** 51:42 Well, and that's a cool thing, clearly, to do. One of the things that I know well is that you and I were introduced by Sheldon Lewis at accessibe. Sheldon is in the nonprofit part of accessibe in helping to find places that need Internet access and who are nonprofits, especially in the disability world, and helps provide accessibe for that. And I don't know whether you all are doing much yet with accessibe, but clearly it's a great place to get involvement in the whole issue of internet website access is is a horrible thing. I mean, we have so many websites being created every minute, and the reality is that none of the major internet website building companies, including Microsoft and Google, do nothing to insist that for website is being built, it has to be accessible right from the outset. So, you know, accessibe is a great, inexpensive way to help with all that, and I'm assuming that Sheldon and you are working on that somewhat. Simon Sansome ** 52:54 Yes, we are. We've had a discussion, and unfortunately, accessibe isn't available on apps at the moment, but that is something they're working on, and you introduce it soon. So I'm, I think once it's available on the apps, I will after, course, Michael Hingson ** 53:07 but it is, however, the reality is that restaurants and other places do create websites, and people go to websites, and so that's, that's right now, the place where accessibe can make a significant difference. Simon Sansome ** 53:22 Absolutely, I completely agree they should have it on there. Yeah. So Michael Hingson ** 53:26 that is, that is a that is certainly one place where, you know, we can help. And certainly every restaurant should have an accessible website and and if they're going to have menus on the website, then there are certainly guidelines on ways to make those accessible, and that is part of what needs to be done. Simon Sansome ** 53:46 Yes, and I completely agree with you. I support it, of course, Michael Hingson ** 53:50 yeah. And you're right, apps, apps today, that's a different process. It's a different animal, but it will come, and that'll be something that that we'll be able to see. But in the short term, Simon Sansome ** 54:02 yeah, I've told Sheldon, straight away, we'll get it on there straight away, as soon as soon as they've done the development for the apps, for access to be Michael Hingson ** 54:09 Yeah, but right now, well, okay, but right now for your app, it could be accessible. You just build it that way, but it's not the app. But every restaurant should have an accessible website, and that really ought to be part of what you look at when you're going to a restaurant, to explore what and how accessible they are. Having accessible and inclusive websites is certainly something that is very straightforward to do today. Yes, Simon Sansome ** 54:38 it is, but businesses are lazy Michael Hingson ** 54:42 well, but you know, they also that they are, but they also think that it's more expensive than it needs to be, and that's part of the whole issue. I mean, if you go to a restaurant and it's not accessible because you can't get into it, so they're still lazy. They didn't make it. Accessible right from the outset, and either they're going to where they're not, and it's a lot No no, no offense in any way intended, but it's a lot less expensive to make a website accessible than it is to modify an entrance so that you can get in with a wheelchair when there are steps or a very narrow door. Yeah. So it is yeah, laziness goes always Yeah. And Simon Sansome ** 55:23 hopefully, if they do have initiatives that hopefully snowball, can help me out with that, with the credit that we want to provide to small businesses, yeah, Michael Hingson ** 55:30 yeah. And I understand that most businesses are pretty small and don't necessarily have a lot of money to spend, but with websites, that's where accessibe can make a big difference right from the outset? Yeah, absolutely, which is pretty cool. Yes. So what's, what's next as you go forward with snowball What are, what's the future going to hold? Simon Sansome ** 55:52 Oh, my God, right. So, I mean, we're having a huge expansion, as I said, we're taking on about 70 staff to cover the whole of the UK. We're actually looking to franchise it as well across North America and Europe. We've also asked to be consultants for a number of governments as well. So it's going from strength to strength to strength. Every week, we keep on getting inquiries. We've got customers signed up already for the assessments, for the membership schemes. Loads in London. London's really taking off quite nicely. So it's where we're going at the moment is, I don't know, but in a couple of years time, I think we're going to be a major player in the app world for accessibility, because we already are the most that we are the biggest disability app in the world at the moment. Mm, hmm. By a long, long way, by, you know, 10s of 1000s of reviews. So nobody's really going to catch up with snowball, but we still need people to use it on a regular basis. That's the thing, because all the information we get is usually generated. Okay, in the UK, we're doing really well. In America, we need a bit more help. Yeah, but, you know, I was having a I was doing another podcast a couple of weeks ago in America, and there's a chap who wants to give us 10,000 locations of petrol stations across America where they went, because he doesn't know where to post it. All this information on accessible fueling stations across America, where they'll come out and help you to fill yes and you to fill your yes and stuff, and do help to pay for it. And he's just got no idea where to post it. So parallel, we think he's going to get we will win early stages of talks, and he wants to give us that information to help people to travel across America, and so they know where they can go and get their car filled up with assistance. So it's just we need people like that to leave reviews, to add places to use it on a regular basis, even if you go, even if you spot a car, you know, disabled car parking bay, you can have that. If you find an accessible toilet, add the accessible toilet. If you find an accessible restaurant, add the restaurant. Even if you find an inaccessible restaurant, add the inaccessible restaurant, because it will stop people going there and being disappointed. So all that information is extremely relevant to help people to be live a more independent life. So we need as many people across the world, including America, to download to to add reviews like you would on TripAdvisor. Is TripAdvisor for the disabled community. We just need more reviews and more people to use on a regular basis, and it will grow considerably. And therefore, once that's grown, we can start helping people more with like booking cinema tickets, booking airline travel holidays, and expand it that way as well. Because once businesses know that you're booking it through snowball, then they know you need extra assistance. So Sheldon, Michael Hingson ** 58:43 has Sheldon talked to you about access find? Uh, no, okay, access is again, right now, it's website oriented, but access find is a database that accessibe created of accessible websites, and any website can say, you know, we have, we have made our website accessible, and it's checked, but then, when it is, then they are included in access, find. And it might be interesting to explore that, both in terms of websites, but finding ways to expand it. So we can, we can explore that and talk about that one. So what? What motivates you? I mean, you're doing a lot. Why? Simon Sansome ** 59:28 It's the frustration of not being able to so, I mean, yes, remember, I for 32 years, I was fully independent. I could go anywhere in the world. I wanted to Okay, and it's the frustration that the world is not I'm not going to say it's not welcoming, because it's not that's not quite right. I'm going to say uneducated. And the ignorance of that everyone can access everything after having an injury like mine is very small mindedness, and I get. Frustrated that, because I travel a lot for work. I travel all over the world, and when we turn up to places, you know, we haven't got the right room, we can't access the hotel, we can't access the restaurant. It's got to the point where we don't choose where we want to go the place chooses us, yeah, and I don't, I don't think that's fair, no. And so I just want an equal opportunity world. That's what I don't like being turned away from places where we want to go for a family meal. I don't like being turned away from the cinema because the disabled seats so close to the screen. You know, it's, you know, it's just It frustrates me. And that's what, you know. I think that's what keeps up, keeping me going, but also as well, is when I was in hospital, because I got told I would never sit up again. I got told I was going to be on my back for life. Okay? And I'm very fortunate where I am. I mean, I know that sounds really stupid, because I'm paralyzed from the waist down, but I am very fortunate where I am, and I see, especially from a social services point of view, there are so many more people worse off than I am okay, and I just want to help them as much as I can. I want to give them choice. I want to give them a bit of independence. I want them to have that freedom of not being restricted to, you know, five, five places to go and eat, or, you know, the only place you can go to the cinema. I want you to the only tourist attraction you can visit. I want them to be fully inclusive. I want them to have a good life, you know. And I think snowball can help a lot of people do that. Michael Hingson ** 1:01:40 Well, that's cool. So if people want to learn more about Snowball or access the app and so on, how do they do that? And how do they reach out to you? Yeah, Simon Sansome ** 1:01:50 I'm on LinkedIn. Simon Samson, just send me a message. That's not a problem at all. Spell, if you would please. Yeah, S A N for November, s o m for mother, E for Echo, Michael Hingson ** 1:02:03 and first name Simon, s, i, m, o n, Simon Sansome ** 1:02:05 that's correct. You can also, you can also email us at support at snowball dot community, that will go through to the team. And yeah, you can also got, you can download the app. It's on Apple and Android. It's under snowball community. And you can also go to the website, Snowball assessment.com, and it's got all the details there if you want to interested in becoming an assessor, if you want, if your business wants to sign up to the scheme. And then it's got the apps on there as well, so and lots more information about me as well and the business. Michael Hingson ** 1:02:41 Well, Simon, I want to really thank you for being here with us and taking all this time to to talk about snowball and talk about you, and I'm glad that you are so open and transparent about all of it, and I hope people will take it to heart and that they will seek you out. They will learn more about snowball they'll learn more about you and what you do. And clearly, I think you have inspired a lot of people through what we've talked about today. And if there's any way we can help, you need to definitely let me know. But I really appreciate you being here, and I want to thank you all for listening to us today as well. So reach out to Simon. Snowball community, and you can, as he said, find the app and so on. So please do that. I would appreciate you giving us a five star rating wherever you're listening to unstoppable mindset, and I would love your thoughts and your comments and your opinions. Please give them freely. We appreciate it. If you know of anyone who might be a good guest, and Simon you as well, I'd love you to email me. You can reach me at Michael h i@accessibe.com that's m, I, C, H, A, E, L, H, I at accessibe, A, C, C, E, S, S, I, B, e.com, or go visit our podcast page, www dot Michael hingson.com/podcast Michael hingson is spelled M, I, C, H, A, E, L, H, I N, G, s, o, n, so Michael hingson.com/podcast but we really appreciate you taking the time to listen to us. And Simon, I really appreciate you taking the time to be here today, and we should do this again. Absolutely. You. Michael Hingson ** 1:04:25 You have been listening to the Unstoppable Mindset podcast. Thanks for dropping by. I hope that you'll join us again next week, and in future weeks for upcoming episodes. To subscribe to our podcast and to learn about upcoming episodes, please visit www dot Michael hingson.com slash podcast. Michael Hingson is spelled m i c h a e l h i n g s o n. While you're on the site., please use the form there to recommend people who we ought to interview in upcoming editions of the show. And also, we ask you and urge you to invite your friends to join us in the future. If you know of any one or any organization needing a speaker for an event, please email me at speaker at Michael hingson.com. I appreciate it very much. To learn more about the concept of blinded by fear, please visit www dot Michael hingson.com forward slash blinded by fear and while you're there, feel free to pick up a copy of my free eBook entitled blinded by fear. The unstoppable mindset podcast is provided by access cast an initiative of accessiBe and is sponsored by accessiBe. Please visit www.accessibe.com . AccessiBe is spelled a c c e s s i b e. There you can learn all about how you can make your website inclusive for all persons with disabilities and how you can help make the internet fully inclusive by 2025. Thanks again for Listening. 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