Rob Grant: Kickin' It On Air

Tara Sands (Voiceover)  0:02  
The sound off podcast. The Show about podcast and broadcast - starts now! 

Matt Cundill  0:12  
I might have mentioned at least a few dozen times in the show that every year I head off to Spain to encounter food and football. Back in 2022 during the Copa del Rey in Seville, I posted on Instagram about how all the Valencia's were setting off firecrackers around Seville. Thankfully, there was Rob Grant from 101.5. Today Radio in Calgary to explain to me that that's just the way they say hello. They've arrived. And they're here. Rob does afternoons on that station. And we have a lot to talk about because he and I like a lot of the same things, politics, history, football, and radio. And over the course of the next 65 minutes, we're going to touch on all of them. And now Rob grant joins me from Calgary. Rob, how on earth did you ever decide to get into radio?

Rob Grant  1:03  
There's a long answer to that question.

Matt Cundill  1:06  
It's a podcast we have all day. We have all day, right?

Rob Grant  1:10  
So when I was about eight or nine years, my son is now I was sitting in my grandmother's kitchen, listening to the radio. And I was listening to a host called Dave Lee Travis known as the Harry cornflake in England. And he was doing a quiz on the on the radio. And I was immediately enamored with the whole concept of radio, and specifically the fact that that contest he was playing with played every single day. And there was a daily connection with the audience, which I thought was different to television. And I thought, Man, that seems so cool. You get to do that not once a week, you get to do that every single day. And I thought that's something I want to do. I want to do that with my life. And I want to spend, you know, the rest of my career or estimate my future doing radio. But that was a hard thing to do. I didn't end up doing radio until I was like 28 years old. But it all started that it started there as a nine year old boy, that Gosh, darn it was a hard slog getting into radio from there, it never really seemed like it was ever going to happen until it finally did.

Matt Cundill  2:11  
So would you do between the ages of say 18 and 28.

Rob Grant  2:15  
I went to university. I wanted to get into radio. But radio schools didn't really seem to exist. At that age. When I was in England, there was no Nate's there was no site, there was no Humber College, there wasn't a BCIT there was no Red River College. So I didn't know what to do. So I went to university, I studied politics and history. And I kind of did what people my age did, which was going to university and do a bachelor's degree. But when I got university, they had a student radio station. And it took me about two years to get the courage to go to the student radio. And I finally did it. And I was absolutely horrific at it. I mean, just terrible. I mean, it couldn't have gone much worse. And when I left, I went and got an office job and still wanted to do radio, but it just didn't seem to be something that people like me did. And I went backpacking when I was 2423 24. And I met a lot of people that just gave me a whole sense of confidence, you know, that maybe there was something in me that I could maybe perform, or do something in the entertainment sphere, I bet a stand up comedian from New Zealand, called Steve Wrigley who's gone on to do radio and such great things in New Zealand. And he gave me a load of confidence and a load of other friends did and when I came back, I signed up to do hospital radio. In the UK, I'm not sure if you're aware of hospital radio. For those that don't know, every radio station in the UK, as to every hospital in the UK has a radio station and is run by volunteers. It's not a bad standard to be fair for what is a completely charitable endeavor. And it's where a lot of people get their start. Because again, it's difficult to get your start in the UK, it's tough. There's there wasn't a lot of commercial radio, when I grew up, there wasn't a lot of schooling, what do you do just knock on the door at the BBC and say, Can I have a show? You know, it doesn't. It's tough to do. And from there, I started to think to myself, maybe this is something I could do. Again, I was terrible at it. There wasn't a huge amount of support I was getting in terms of success of hospital radio. But alongside all of this, I am in a relationship with a girl from Canada. And I'd met her when I was backpacking. I'd been in Canada backpacking. And she said, look, you've got we've got to make a move here if we're going to make this work, and I think you should move to Canada. And I said, I'm fine to do that. But I've got to do radio at the same time. I've just got to do it. It's something I've wanted to do since I was eight. I can't not try this. I've got to try it. And there was nothing pushing me to do that. As I say everything had been awful up until this point in terms of what I was producing in terms of output. But I wanted to do it. And she found me the course at Humber College, which in turn offered me an immigration path because I was a Canadian student, and literally the day that I walked into Humber College in 2008 It was like a light bulb went off. And suddenly the doors to radio opens. And it was a lot of hard work from 2008 to now. But everything I've been doing in England pushing against a brick wall since I was eight, suddenly at Humber, it was like, if you work hard enough, if you move, if you sacrifice, if you do your checks, if you go to all the small towns, there's a career here for you. And that's proven to be the case.

Matt Cundill  5:30  
So Humber College, that's some Sam Cook territory right there, right?

Rob Grant  5:35  
Yeah, Humber College. Yeah, Humber College was the place there really was Neil Mathur was my teacher. Nine months I was there nine months. But that was huge. That was absolutely huge for me. Okay,

Matt Cundill  5:47  
so we've heard hospital radio a few times on this podcast. What exactly gets said or done on hospital radio? What do we need to communicate to the patients?

Rob Grant  5:57  
Yeah, I mean, it was an interesting time, as I say, it was a lot more professional than I think people would give it credit for certainly more than student radio, I mean, student radio was just people just jumping in and there was some equipment and you messed around this, we had voice tracking, you know, we had a we had a format, we had music scheduling, which I thought was a pretty decent standard, because it is all run by volunteers. The shows I mostly did were the whole idea was to play requests for patients. And that's really the whole idea of hospital radio, is to go up to the wards and to speak to patients get requests and give them that level of connectivity and personalization. You know, obviously, things have changed back in the 70s. And 80s, there was no television on the wards, all you had was radio. But even so nowadays, there's a lot of lonely people in hospitals, people that are there for a long time, you know, there for months at a time, some people don't have family, and the only people they sometimes see either their nurses, their doctors, or the person coming out from hospital radio. Now, to be honest, did I also do it to try and do something creative and try and push my career? Sure, I did. And people do that. But you know, we had a we had a program director with a music director. You know, there was some weird radio going on, I gotta let you know, at the same time, like there are some people like there's, there's there's no guidance. There are some people doing some of the strangest radio I've ever heard in my life. But that was part of the eccentricity of it. And I think it's very British at the same time. It's a load of eccentric British people trying to make radio with a teeny little bit of structure, and then a whole load of nothing, and then trying to serve patients at the top. It's a wild world out there.

Matt Cundill  7:30  
So you go from the UK, whereby the way that you can we never really established where in the UK you were.

Rob Grant  7:38  
Yeah, I'm from Basingstoke, England, which is about 40 miles southwest of London, is a commuter town, basically.

Matt Cundill  7:45  
And the other thing we have to establish is what's your football club?

Rob Grant  7:50  
Ah, Tottenham Hotspur. Tottenham Hotspur Football Club is my third child and my third parents. So I love them deal. And that's a London based team. They are from North London. Yeah, my dad was a fan. cheered for them when he was a kid. And then passed on the affliction. I suppose I have to call it because they haven't won much. Since I've been alive anyway. But yeah, it's a great bond for me and my dad cheering for that team together. I

Matt Cundill  8:15  
know a lot of people who listen to this podcast, they'll understand maybe a little bit about football, but they know it from NBC has it on Saturday morning. So how many London based teams are there? They're about six I guess right?

Rob Grant  8:28  
Now, there's more than that. I mean, there's like five or six in the Premier League. But if you look at the entire I

Matt Cundill  8:34  
was only talking Premier League because that's all it gets shown on the tip. 

Rob Grant  8:38  
Yeah, nearly there's about five or six. But in terms of professional clubs, there's about 11 or 12 ministers a huge amount. I mean, considering most other towns have to you know, like Manchester Sheffield, Bristol have to Liverpool only has to London has a ridiculous amount of clubs considering when you look at even North American Sports that New York only has like, you know, two football teams and two baseball teams. It's insane how many football clubs there are in in London.

Matt Cundill  9:05  
Well, anyone can start one and anyone can take it all the way to the top. Right.

Rob Grant  9:09  
That is you know, and as Ryan Reynolds and Rob McElhenney are trying to show with Wrexham right I mean, it can officially be done. You can go from the absolute bottom to the top now, that used to happen a bit more often, you know, 4050 years ago. Nowadays you need an awful lot of money. But Rob and Ryan do have money and maybe on Welcome to Wrexham you'll see them achieve that. I mean, they're pretty close. They're only two divisions off making the Premier League right now. So they're getting close.

Matt Cundill  9:36  
Just from what I see though it looks like you get to this point and the money kind of get a becomes a wrecking zone where they are right now where you have to get from like three to one. The three in the two to get up to number one. It feels like it's going to cost a lot of money and you can really lose yourself in that zone. Yeah

Rob Grant  9:55  
100% I can talk about football all day long. This is a radio podcast but I mean, it's my as I say, it's my huge love. What you find when you get the division that, that Wrexham runner in Ligue one, if they get promoted, they'll get to the championship, which is one below the Premier League. At that stage, what you have. And the difficulty you have is you have teams in the Premier League being relegated. And when they're relegated and they come down and division. Financially, they get what they call parachute payments, which means the Premier League still give some money for three years. And that is what kind of sets off this hyperinflation in the league is that obviously three teams are coming down each year, you've got various amounts of clubs in the championship, probably about seven or eight, who are all still feeding off of Premier League money, and they're spending it because they desperately need to get back. And that's where a club like Wrexham comes in. They've not got anything close to that money, they're going to need it either from owners or from outside investment. Some clubs have done it clubs like Luton, have just done it in recent years. But it's incredibly difficult to do you meet this wonderful

Matt Cundill  11:02  
woman. And now you got to move to Canada. And so the deal is you got to work in radio. So where did you wind up working in radio,

Rob Grant  11:11  
I couldn't leave Toronto for a year because my wife was doing a master's degree at York. So I couldn't initially run off and do whatever I wanted. So I did street team work for Flo 93 Five, I worked very briefly at Virgin doing the same thing. And then worked at CTN. So that was about a year I did doing that. And I was desperately trying to apply for jobs in southern Ontario. But you know, that's a really competitive market, because a lot of people want to stay in Toronto and then commute to, you know, Berry or wherever it might be. And then once my wife graduated, and I got the all clear to apply further afield. I started sending out my my demo tape to all places. And you know, it was tricky, you know, I never lost comfort. I never I've never once worried about my accent and being English in Canada, because for me, I moved to Canada and becoming a Canadian. I'm gonna make this work. But looking back, it was tricky. It was tricky as a new, a newer immigrant to get that first job. But then one day, I got a phone call from Nesta Matthews, who said, Do you want to come work at the juice in Kelowna? And I said yes, before I put the phone down and got on a plane and we were gone within within three or four days, I think I mean, it was really quick how quickly we got to Kelowna. And that was that was what around this time, July June of 2010 was when I made my first move to Kelowna. And it all became real for the first time I actually had a proper radio job. And I was I was on the radio. That's not a terrible place to go. Kelowna. No, it's not could have been a heck of an I applied to all of them. Don't get me wrong. I was really lucky to start off in Kelowna, very lucky. I've been lucky with all my markets I've worked in, I've never really had to go to the you know, some of the more challenging rural markets that can be difficult. So I was up for it. It didn't really bother me where I went to be honest, only my wife probably because she's played on every radio move with me. I didn't meet her along the way. She was there from day one, you know, from before we even started to now. She's been on every single move. And every time I say to her, Hey, I'm applying to this job. And I've never sometimes thought about the sharp inhale of breath that she must have had some of the markets I was applying to.

Matt Cundill  13:21  
After you went to Kelowna, he did some stuff in Nelson. And that's an interesting place. What I know about Nelson because I had somebody who was employed here from Nelson, but I also know radio wise that my neighbor, if you're to Cooney, co op. So I know that Nelson has a very, I mean, they're very attached to their radio. I mean, if you go to something like Kootenay Co Op, in your market, people are attached the radio, but meanwhile you're doing things they're, you know, working at 1035 the bridge. So tell me about that station. Tell me about Nelson.

Rob Grant  13:57  
Nelson was a really eclectic town it was. It's a beautiful place. I mean, it's one of the most beautiful places in all of Canada. There's no two ways about it. It's very difficult to get to, you know, seven hours from Calgary and eight hours from Vancouver. I mean, it really is remote. But it's unbelievably beautiful. And they've they've kept their downtown in tax, they've put rules in so they couldn't demolish some of the great buildings. The people that are the very protective of the town. You know, you're not from Nelson until you've been there for like 25 years, right? There'll be people that lived there 15 years, thereby you're still new, you know, so as a guy like me that had been there long when I was only there for a year or so. It was difficult to kind of ingratiate yourself into the town. And I think the difficult part was is you know, not that I was blunt about this, but my plan was to get to a major market. I wasn't trying to put down people's faces, but my career was not going to end in Nelson. And I wanted to move on and people wanted you to stay in Nelson and stay long term and commit to the town because it's such a community driven town. And I think that I found that a little tricky. I found the remoteness of it quite tricky as well. But the people were, were unbelievable. I met some of the most unique and interesting people I've ever met in Canada. It was an interesting bizarre smorgasbord of people that had moved from not just all over, you know, Canada, but across the world. I've been there and the talent I was working with looking back was mad, like Drex Wilkins is my program director. He's, you know, clearly gone on to great things. Matt dubbers was our intern mornings at kiss him. You know, Matt Soper was our midday host. He's now doing so well in Niagara Falls. You know, TJ Conners was with us for a while he went on to have a great career and in Winnipeg and Niagara Falls.

Matt Cundill  15:44  
That sounds like an all star team.

Rob Grant  15:46  
It was crazy. I mean, at the time, you don't know, right? These are just your friends and family. You know, these are the people that work with, you know, they're talented, obviously, but you don't know the what's going on. It's only when I look back. I'm like, oh my god, we're in the middle of nowhere, with like, people that have gone on to have these amazing careers. It was just wild, absolutely wild. But we got to work with so many great people, you know, in such a small town, and it was all hands on deck, you know, although it sounds like a lot. We were running to stations category, Nelson. There wasn't a lot of us there. And it was the all hands on deck, get things done voice track, you know, record everything do every remote possible. It was a sort of, you know, learning curve, I think a lot of talent need in the industry. But yeah, looking back for people that were there, remarkable.

Matt Cundill  16:31  
And then you move to Edmonton afterwards. And I'm not sure if this makes your wife happy or sad. But

Rob Grant  16:39  
she had a mall close by in an airport that could get back home. She was happy for the move to Edmonton, for sure. Yeah, that was a big move for us.

Matt Cundill  16:46  
But I want to talk about the station there, which you know, back in 2012, in that period, you're working at 1023 now, and that radio station has legendary attributes in that. It's number one, it comes out with a big marketing scheme, it changed the market. When the market got sleepy in 2009 2010, they came in and did things. And I think this is a perfect fit for anybody with a personality. And a lot of the radio industry looks at that stage and goes, how do we replicate that here, a lot of people cannot do that. So tell me about 1023. Now your experience there in that era,

Rob Grant  17:25  
you know, working in now, and the people I worked for, eventually kind of gave me my voice and made me the host I am today. You know, up until that point, I still think I was playing radio, trying to get better, you know, reaching out to various people and getting our checks. But, you know, there was Mark Hunter that took a chance on me and brought me out to OpenSim. And I remember walking into that building for the very first time and meeting everybody that worked on the station. And I've never felt so intimidated in all my life. I mean, there's just talent everywhere. There's just amazing radio happening everywhere. No one's taking a day off. You know, all day parts sound like they could all be doing mornings, you know, wherever they want, you know, like, you might crash in Mars, to success that they've had is obviously you know, kind of speaks for itself. And the first person I met was Adam McHale, and you know, listening to Adam show you oh my god, this is on the days that this sounds like this could be hosting anywhere at once. You know, Rachel day on Drive. And you know, even though we have give me that time we were we ended up going on to have two or three swing announcers but the other swing announcer with us Fitzy you know, ministry was working when we are kind of seven till midnight show sounds fantastic. It was incredibly intimidating. And it was at that moment, it was like you got to sink or swim. You know, you've either got to make this or you're you're not gonna last very long here because the standard was just too high. And I thrived off that. Personally, I love that. And I love that feeling that I took confidence from it that my program director had said, No, we want you to be here. And I wanted to compete at that level. And I wanted to try and see if I could be at the standard that they were all at. And I got a huge rush off of it, which was awesome. And then working now you know for five years or so was just so much fun. You know, it really was I remember we have a couple of friends of mine would often say we that we would have to pinch ourselves and go remember these are the good times why this is a great place to be and we try to we try to you know, make remember, this is going so well. I went to having such great success and the radios clearly. So good. You got to you want to take a moment to breathe here and enjoy this. And it really was it was just a fascinating time.

Matt Cundill  19:33  
So this is going to be a question that I rarely get to ask. Because not everybody gets to go into Edmonton and then come out of Edmonton. And there's, you know, varied responses. How is the Edmonton market different than the rest of Canada?

Rob Grant  19:51  
That's a great question. How's it different? When I went to Edmonton, I mean, Evanson. I lived in Toronto and certainly in BC I mean, Alberta itself has Japan wrap. And I was like, Okay, well, I wonder what that's about Alberta, the North and what have you. When I got to Edmonton, I had nothing but great memories and Atkinson, nothing. And I think the thing that really stood out to me, and everyone kind of says this, but it's the people, it's the people there, the way they reacted to me and to my family on kind of a binary level was just unbelievable. They were so welcoming, made me feel like I was I mean, I became a Canadian citizen whilst I was working in openSUSE. And the way they just opened their arms and welcomed me, I mean, you know, people at the bar would come up and say, I've heard you becoming a citizen. Congratulations. You know, I mean, all towns and all cities have their people but they haven't sewn into them in the way they really so we, when we have my son when I was there, I became a citizen that will happen within like a year. It just really welcoming warm people. And I'll never forget that they treated me and my family extremely well. Yeah,

Matt Cundill  20:56  
I feel like we have a lot of similar experiences. So I had my kids as well and in Edmonton. Edmonton does not feel like Alberta. So whatever you hear that comes out of the news in Alberta does this operative is that it's not really a reflection on Edmonton. Oh, really? I mean, I played most of my football career in my 20s in Edmonton. I mean, it's at beer league level. Shout out to the comments, everybody. But there was a lot of ethnicity. We're playing a Portuguese team. We're playing a German team. We're gonna play an Arabic team, we're gonna play. And I learned that Edmonton had just more diversity than the rest of the province. And I go to Calgary, and we go to the stampede and I said, this is the biggest collection of trailer park trash ever assembled in one place. I never said that The Rock said that. He came out to do a wrestling match. But he was not wrong.

Rob Grant  21:50  
Right. I'm a big wrestling fan. Yeah, I know the Robert Wood cut that promo. The thing about Calgary that I found that is I mean, the biggest difference between the two cities is that I've noticed having lived in both and I've spent longer in Calgary that I haven't opened to is Calgary is an outrageously good city in terms of the infrastructure that is here, in terms of how the city is built, in terms of what it offers. I mean, this is a great city, that really is for me on a world class level. And Calgarians will not show off about it. They want they don't go on about it. Whereas I think Edmondson has a little bit and you know, people would tell me that when they're in Evanston, they'd have a chip on their shoulder about Calgary, they felt that Ralph Klein gave all the money to Calgary because of his connections there, etc. And there was a chip and I think that's kind of what made the people what they are, and made them what I'm very proud about Ibbitson and always want to sing I haven't since got it stuff. And that's the difference between the two cities. Calgarians just will not engage in that. You know, most cities kind of do show off a little bit Calgarians don't Calgarians feel very calm, relaxed. We've got a good city, we know we do. We don't need to get involved in that kind of intercity banter. I mean, sure, when the flange say the word is there's banter. Yes, there is but I don't feel that sort of need from Calgarians. And they kind of been more relaxed about it in that in that sense. And you know, that's what my friends are able to always say to me, whatever they say they always give me crap for being here now. But at the end of it, they'll go, hey, you've got a great city, you know, they'll kind of grudgingly tell me that at the end.

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Matt Cundill  24:00  
the way, wedged in the middle of all the Alberta experience that you have is your time in London. So how did you get to London? Because you did 97 fi, which is virgin radio and was at the time?

Rob Grant  24:11  
I did yeah, you know, short stint. I've been at now for three years. We've done really well. I was loving, I wanted to stay in our concern. I wanted to buy a house. I wanted to commit that. My wife at this point had done, you know, five years away from home. We'd had our son we'd got married. And then A call came in about going to London, Ontario, which was, you know, an hour away from where she was raised. My wife's from Guelph. And my wife said, I need you to consider this. This is going to be a big one for me. And we ended up taking it you know, I had a gut feeling that it wasn't the right move for me kind of stylistically. But I it was tough to say to my wife. No, we're not going to move back to an hour. From home with, you know, an 11 month old baby, and your grandparents round the corner. And unfortunately, it didn't work out, you know, stylistically it didn't work out the way I wanted, which is a real shame. Because it would have been great to have lived and spent some more time in London, London's a great city, I love London, I thought it was a great city, to have a lot to offer, who really love their radio. And I just, you know, it was the first time I'd never really, I hadn't really made a success of something in radio, which is quite difficult for me, you know, everything had been on the up and up until that point, and then you get there. And it's just not quite working the way you want it. And it's like, oh, man, I'll try and push through this. And it didn't work, which is something I had to accept and learn from, and eventually got let go. So it was there, my wife and I had to decide, well, what do we do next. And that was that was challenging for us very challenging, challenging for my wife, because we ended up going back to Edmondson. And I know that was difficult for her and a big sacrifice. And I think just goes to show many that those of us that have had real partners that have followed us through our career, some of the sacrifices they have to make in order for our careers to work. It doesn't get the respect that it deserves. We don't talk we should talk about it more, you know, because they do so much to make our careers work. And, you know, she certainly proved that in that case.

Matt Cundill  26:18  
Yeah, I feel like I should be interviewing her.

Rob Grant  26:23  
I'd say we always say I say this to my current boss, Jonathan, best radio waves, no radio, they know radio better than most consultants, boy, did they know radio, we will sit around and we'll be having a drink. And my wife, you know, she doesn't love radio like I do. She doesn't want to talk about it. But we'll be sitting around and I'll be talking about local gossip or something. And she'll just pipe in with a line or a word and say, the show's not bad. Their show is better than you think that show connects there. That show needs more time that show needs this. And I'll look at her and go really? I don't think so. And sure enough, it will come to pass. She'll be exactly right.

Matt Cundill  27:00  
So I started this podcast so that people could get great ideas. And so program directors, if you are listening to this, have some get togethers, invite the WAGs in case the

Rob Grant  27:12  
wives and girlfriends involved. They know so much about the biz. And I've listened to so much Matt, because they've listened to us, right? You know, when you come home, and I come home from work, the radios always on my kids and my wife Listen, right. And they don't mean they love radio, but they don't. They're listening because they want to listen to their dad and to their husband and be a supportive partner and family member. But they're also listening to the swing announcer that's on after me. And they're also listening to the midday house a song before me. And they're listening to promos in the morning show. And they become a huge focus group. Even my kids, my kids are obsessed today radio, which I currently work on, they can tell you so much about it. And they're going to become a great idea. You know, as they get older, they're going to know a lot about the business and I'm going to want to tap into them. As I unfortunately start to ascend towards middle age. I'm gonna need to know what they're thinking. Yeah,

Matt Cundill  28:03  
it's true. It's, it's like a hockey team or a football team, where the WAGs they're living this every day. So they're listening to the sports station, they're watching the games, they're paying attention to all the games, because their husbands are invested in this particular career. I don't know how much somebody like Gareth Southgate is going to pay attention to whoever Jude Bellingham is dating for a strategy on when to do the subs come this weekend. And as we record this, by the way, the Euro final is going to be England versus Spain. We've completely ill timed this, you know when we're recording this. But yeah, it's definitely something to pay attention to whether it's radio station or football club. Yeah,

Rob Grant  28:41  
100%. I mean, I say like, my wife has proven time and time again, and not just my wife, for that matter. I've spoken to other radio partners along the way. They have a good ear for the business. They know they know what's right, they know what's wrong. And if I was a program director, I would certainly invite them all round into a boardroom, but some pizza and some Mimosa or whatever, and run a little mini focus group. I think you'd learn a huge amount from them.

Matt Cundill  29:07  
So how did you get to Calgary?

Rob Grant  29:10  
So, you know, I've been I went back to now. And when I went back to now radio, because

Matt Cundill  29:16  
you went back to Edmonton, then you get the opportunity to go to Calgary.

Rob Grant  29:20  
I did. Yeah. And the reason why was I want we decided to go back to somewhere that we knew some of that because we're doing all these moves. And we thought and there were a couple of other opportunities that came my way after London. And I, there was some big moves. And I was like, oh gosh, they really wanted a young family. It's another uncertain move. Now kind of gave us some, some foundation, some security. We knew people we knew the radio station. But when I got there, management and I were kind of on the same path, but it was like eventually, we'll probably look to find particularly a daytime slot for us because I've been doing evenings and weekends at that point for a really long time. And I wanted to have a more Star But schedule with my son. At that point, I think my daughter was on the way or it was very close to my daughter being on the way. And we wanted a more established schedule. And it was shortly after I got back to now that our management team at now, we have been bought by Patterson media at this point through this whole process took over the Calgary operation for Patterson. And at that point, some opportunities came my way. And there was an opportunity to go and do afternoon drive. So I arrived back in now in March of 2016. And then I moved to Calgary in the summer of 2017. And through that process opportunities came my way and yeah, I mean, I've been here seven years now and I've been on afternoon drive for seven years like it's been it's been a long time. By the way, that's

Matt Cundill  30:51  
the best shift.

Rob Grant  30:53  
i It's honestly like, I love afternoon drive. I always have my favorite announced so growing up in England was Chris Moyles. He's kind of my hero really when it comes to radio. A lot of what I do on the show really harks back to bits that he did that I've taken and tweaked and stuff there's a lot of homage is on robbing friends that there is from Chris Moyles, because he influenced me in a way that I can't even really explain. And I remember, you know, when I first heard it, he was on afternoons, which is one of the reasons I like doing afternoons I like driving people home. I like being part of that moment where you get to go home and it's the end of the day. And there's that exhilaration that we're done for the day. And that kind of comes from Moyles. And my connection to Chris was he's here is so great. You know, I remember being at school for the first time we'd sit in assembly and usually at that time people would say, Have you heard this latest band or this you know, movie and it would go on to be huge pop culture icons of the 90s like a waste is so blur or Trainspotting. And then one day someone said, Have you listened to Chris Moyles? And I don't know who's Chris Moyles. He's on Radio One. And I was like, This is no radio. That's not cool. But Radio One was really cool. Like for a while there Radio One was absolutely just banging when it came to great radio. And I got in the car, listen to Chris Morris with my mom that was 1997 and listened to Him every day until I left. I mean, the guy was a huge inspiration on me. And even though he obviously you went on to have greater success and mornings and hosts a morning show now, I always remember that afternoon show that he hosted, which I thought was just the coolest thing. And in my own little way, in my mind feel if I'm paying homage to it every time I craft the mic in the afternoons.

Matt Cundill  32:33  
So I was working in Edmonton at that period. But I remember airchecks of Chris, and I remember one FM, and the imaging and pretty much everything on that radio station was so polished.

Rob Grant  32:45  
Yeah. And it was it just the standard of the stuff they were doing at that time was just absolutely wild. I mean, you know, some of the best hosts. So you've been started with kind of Chris Evans in like 1995. And at that point, Chris Evans was the biggest Television presents her in the UK and then came on to radio afterwards, which normally it goes the other way. And that was just the most wild thing. And then Chris kind of burned out. And Chris smalls came in and then there was so many others that came in and so much other just amazing radio that was happening. I mean, some really experimental radio like Chris Morris and BLU Jam, which if you can find on YouTube is the most bizarre radio you'll ever hear on your life. I mean, really kind of altruistic, kind of, you know, out there bizarre radio. It doesn't even have a format to it. It's just random music playing and then bits coming in and out of it. And this is happening on Radio One national radio station only it was happening lately. But it was it was some brilliant radio. Life

Matt Cundill  33:44  
travels fast time travels fast because I just realized that it's been seven years for 1015. Today radio, I still sort of think of it as sort of something new that Calgary has a sort of grew out

Rob Grant  33:56  
of Edmonton. Well, yeah, they launched in 2019. It's five years old. But the pandemic pandemic happened, right and took away like two years of our lives. So you're right to me today radio feels like it's three years old, because two years became one. But yeah, it's five years. It's been there a wine and cooler fan before that. But you know, people like tater Daniels and I were on that station before. This whole iteration has been kind of seven years or so. Yeah.

Matt Cundill  34:21  
And so tell me a little bit about the format and how it's received in Calgary. Because I know there's a lot of hand wringing and teeth gnashing and radio stations that want to emulate what happened in Edmonton at one Oh, 2.3. Now radio. Well, let's roll that out. And I sort of asked a lot of radio executives said why are we not rolling this out across the country? And this is back in the 2012 2013 2014. Why are we not rolling that out? And I got Oh, well. It's very expensive. The marketing budget would suck up most of the marketing budget for this company. We can't try to pour that in one radio station. That's currently a one share. That's a great idea. And now we get to this era 2019 2020. Okay, now we're gonna do it. So how's it received in your market? But how do you think the format? Well, first of all, tell everybody what the format is, and then say how it's received in Calgary?

Rob Grant  35:17  
Well, the format is, is interesting, we have a lot of conversations about it. My boss, and I, and I love talking about this, because you know, I've been doing this type of radio for 12 years, it is really the basis of my career. The format is essentially conversational radio, right, where we're having a conversation with the audience. And but it's a bit more than that. And I think that's sometimes where it's kind of misjudged by people that haven't worked in the buildings is that yes, we are having conversations with the audience, but really is based on two things. It's interactive radio, where we build a connection with our audience and try and build a community amongst our audience, give our audience the feeling that they can run and drive and own the radio station, give them some power and some agency in a world that sometimes feels a little bit one directional. Let's make this a two way exchange. And then secondly, and perhaps most importantly, it's personality driven radio. We want the personalities to shine. And that's what made now so great in Edmondson. And it's what I think the other radio stations that are rolling us out today being one, it's not just about the morning show, being the top of the ticket, and then the drive show, and then maybe you know, music and mid days and not much in evenings. It's about any time you turn on the radio, you're hearing big personality, you're hearing games, you're hearing bits, you're hearing features, and then you're hearing the audience. And that's really the focus of what it's all about. As regards to how Calgary has worked with it. I mean, I think, you know, the audience's kind of wrapped around really well to what today's tried to do. I think they've at first I think they were perhaps a tad apathetic, at first, when we first launched, you have to remember like, as I mentioned earlier, like, Cathy's got the mountains 45 minutes away, you know, it's this big city, people are working big jobs, you know, I'm not sure the connection was quite there at first. But I think when we kind of launched us today, and we realized, hey, we want you guys to kind of take over this radio station, we'll have an arcade, well, how does that work, and they kind of dip their toe in, and then slowly but surely, you know, we kind of won them over one by one. And I like to think now Robin friends, specifically the afternoon show my show, you know, we have a great connection with our audience, you know, to make them feel like their voice needs to be heard on a daily, hourly, minute ly basis.

Matt Cundill  37:34  
It says Robin friends, but like Who are your friends? Who

Rob Grant  37:38  
are my friends. So the idea is, is that I want the whole radio station to be represented on the station. So in Evanston, they call the audience the now family in a way again, to have that community feel amongst the audience. in Calgary, we call the audience friends, and try again. So it's not just hate audience members, there's a bit more of a colloquial feel amongst us. So Robin friends, initially, the whole concept was the audience would be my co host. And the mission statement of the show is to have an audience member on literally every break, right to have them on all the time. But the friends are also my friends around the station as well. And I have people that work on the show that you put huge amounts of effort in to help me kind of build as big a show as I possibly can. So right now, our promotions coordinator, Brittany Crouch is kind of a de facto producer of the show, and puts in a huge amount of effort helping me kind of grow and manage the show, and make sure the audience are involved. Our midday host, Shane Hill, co host with me an hour a day. And she and I have a little pocket of the show. And then there were so many others, our creative director, our promotions director, they're all involved in helping me bring certain things to the show. So that when you listen, there's as many people are is kind of borrowing a little bit of that zoo format again, back to Chris Moyles that he had, I wanted the show to sound as big as possible when we launched it. And in radio nowadays, we don't have what we had 30 years ago, I'm not a barrier of information anymore. I don't tell you when the next concept is don't tell you really anything of any import, you have it in your phone before I say anything. And what I can offer is entertainment is me as personality. And I want that to be as big as possible. And that's what we strive to do is to have the biggest entertainment platform we can provide in Calgary every afternoon. And

Matt Cundill  39:32  
also Winnipeg, because the company did fly you in to take a look at Winnipeg, and you are on the air here as well. So now you've got multiple markets to deal with.

Rob Grant  39:39  
That's right. We launched that in March. You know, obviously the the industry is under a lot of a lot of stress and strain and a lot of changes and the opportunity was presented to move to Winnipeg. And that was a great opportunity as well, you know, when it was presented for the show, is we now move into Winnipeg, and we're trying to approach that slightly differently as well. I made the pitch to management that I wanted to be honest that I wasn't there. I didn't want to pretend that I was from Winnipeg, I want it to be honest that, look, I am here with you. I am there. I'm answering every call. I'm answering every text. We are going to have a conversation. I'm going to talk about Winnipeg things. I'm going to travel to Winnipeg. And I'm going to come and see you. But I am in Calgary. And I wanted that level of honesty, which to be fair, I had seen happen in the UK. Right, the UK has national shows, because we're only one timezone and it's a it's a smaller region. But I've always felt for many years since I've been here that something similar could work in Canada. Difficult with different time zones, of course, but not impossible. And I think you know, it's tough to know, I think that you know, the now family, a Winnipeg or 94, three now radio, I think, are working with that, because I'm not insulting their intelligence, right? And I'm saying, if I'm not there, and I'm going to be honest with you, I think that's working for them.

Matt Cundill  41:04  
I think you and I connect, because you mentioned politics in history. Which of the two things that I have studied my whole life. So tell me why you love politics, and then tell me why you like history. And by liking history, like what's the most fascinating part of history.

Rob Grant  41:24  
When I was younger, I was incredibly politically motivated. I thought I was gonna become an MP, I was so into the actual game of politics, which is so funny, because on today, radio, specifically, we make a point of not talking politics, and I don't talk about it professionally. But privately, you know, I love my politics. When I went to university, I was so keen to get in there and be this young whippersnapper that was going to argue with my professors and take them on in debates and really thrive in that. And after about two years of studying politics and debating, it kind of got beaten out of me. I kind of found that debating at that level every single day, I found that I was being challenged in a way that I should have been. But I found that eventually, I started to lose a grip of what my politics were. And I wasn't entirely sure what I believed in and what I did. And that was tough to go through. And I kind of spent a couple of years I kind of retracted slightly from politics. But now I'm back into it in a huge way of where I've come back is, is kind of in a way I do on the show, in terms of although I don't talk politics, I love being inquisitive about people. I love learning about people. And that's my love of politics. Now. I love the story. I love the journey. I love the things that happen. I love seeing the storylines that come out of it in the history unfolding between our eyes. If I was studying politics now, I would 100% take a course on Donald Trump. The idea that a reality TV star became the most dominating figure in politics over the last decade is absolutely mind blowing, and how he's done. It is shocking in every way. And he's torn up all of the things that I learned about American politics. When I was at university, the things that we were told you can and cannot do as a president. He does, he does the opposite of and has seen success. And from an academic perspective, that's mind blowing to me. And back to your awesome what my love of history is, its 20th century history and specifically 20th century American history. I did a dissertation on Richard Nixon and his resignation as part of Watergate. And that was kind of my main thing. And that's kind of my main fascination now is I can get really into it is, you know, Nixon, when he was resigned, and he did the famous frost Nixon interviews, and then admitted that as President, if he did something, it wasn't illegal. And that was kind of the moment that got your moment, wherever went, Ah, he's admitting he did it. And that was the moment that America healed. And that was part of my dissertation. And now, of course, two weeks ago, the Supreme Court have effectively admitted that if you are president, you can't be tried for illegal, you can do things that are essentially illegal. If you're present. It's okay. It's amazing that that moment has come full circle, and mind blowing to me. There's a small part of me that says, I'm no good. If I was independently wealthy, I'd go back to school and study all this all over again. But as I say, I don't study it from wearing a rosette on my chest and kind of, you know, beating a political mind anymore. I study it more from the story. Yeah,

Matt Cundill  44:30  
and it's fascinating. You know, just watching it from afar. America is the greatest reality show ever.

Rob Grant  44:37  
Wow, isn't it? Yeah. I mean, just mind blowing, just watching how everything's unfolding right now, even as we talk right now, you know, the big story is Joe Biden and his mental acuity. And, you know, just mind blowing as well. You know, that there's the state that the country finds itself in. And as I say, what I find more shocking is what I was studying kind of 20 years ago, we used to say things in our class my professors were telling The last board president that's been elected was Eisenhower, right? You need to have a good head of hair. In order to run as president presidents won't have beards. It was this very vain, specific way to be a president. And now you've got these two options and areas running out there. And it's just mind blowing that how 25 years things have changed so much. This stuff fascinates me. This is the stuff I read about and love, if it fascinates anyone else, but this is the sort of stuff that I think to myself, well, this is a huge interest.

Matt Cundill  45:31  
I heard that if you want to be president, you should be tall. electability sort of lands on being tall, which is probably why dictators who achieve their status through a coup are short, Napoleon, for instance, right?

Rob Grant  45:45  
Yeah, right, for sure. It's so interesting to see, as I say, the look and the feel in terms of aesthetics of American politics, which completely seems thrown out right now. And I don't know if we'll ever get back to any sort of norm. At some point, you know, whether it be through getting a second term or whether losing this next election, Donald Trump moves on from center stage of Republican politics, that does tend to be how American politics comes. People do have their moments and move on, where they go back to any sort of normality or is this the new norm? These storylines? Yeah, fascinating, hugely.

Tara Sands (Voiceover)  46:26  
The sound off podcast,

Matt Cundill  46:27  
tell me a little bit about your sports tree. I know you're invested in football. How much hockey Do you watch?

Rob Grant  46:35  
Hockey was kind of the first North American sport I got into when I moved to Toronto, I got to spend an internship at am 640. And I got to work on the bill water show with Greg Brady and got to be a part of that and got to see what kind of Maple Leafs fandom can be like, which is much derided as it is across the country. It is a fascinating fan base to be a be around.

Matt Cundill  47:00  
Oh, this is a psychological experiment.

Rob Grant  47:04  
I remember the nights that NASM Kadri made his preseason debut for the Toronto Maple Leafs. And so for those who don't know NASM cadre seventh overall pick, he is not projected to be a top tier superstar, but to be a good player as he has gone on to be. And that night, you would have thought the Wayne Gretzky himself have reappeared on the ice to play for the Toronto Maple Leafs. And then the whole fan base was coming on glue at the great hope that wasn't as in Canterbury, and I'm sitting there going, but this guy seven, five, right? We know this guy's not gonna be a franchise player, he's gonna be a good player. And people were just obsessed to the hopes and the dreams. And there was something in a weird way endearing about that. And I found myself kind of getting connected to it. Yeah,

Matt Cundill  47:55  
so leafs nation is so full of shit. It's unbelievable. The fans are worse than the team. So the team feeds this shit. The fans buy it, the media, and you worked in it and saw it and just expressed it are actually a giant part of the problem by making somebody like cadre, the next coming of Gretzky. This is a cycle that just goes on and on and on. If you want to know why this team never gets past the first round, this is part of the problem. The fans are a giant part of the problem. The players and the management are part of the problem. Because they keep paying these people money, and they're not very good. And it just goes on. Basically, it's the Dallas Cowboys. So the leafs are the Dallas Cowboys. What is the football equivalent in the Premier League? Because I got to know I got to put a third team in here. So the Dallas Cowboys suck full of shit, never going to win. The leafs suck full of shit never going to win. And it's all the fans fault. It's all your fault. So what is the premier ship equivalent?

Rob Grant  49:04  
I mean, in two recent years, you probably could have said it might have been Liverpool might have fit that bill a little bit. You know, Liverpool, they've won trophies now since in the last few years on the Yarden club. They have a very strong fan base because Liverpool as a city kind of sees itself actually site as separate to England. There's kind of like a scowl separatism that goes on there, which is a whole different kind of political element that they would have been part of it. There's some element that might club Tottenham, are kind of similar to that as well. They're not the biggest club in a way that say the cowboys and the leafs are kind of the biggest fan base and the biggest market. They're not they don't have that element, but they haven't won anything since the 60s. The fans can often seem to be quite obnoxious.

Matt Cundill  49:48  
That's Buffalo Bills territory right there.

Rob Grant  49:51  
There we go. And that's kind of a theme throughout all of my my fandoms right, like I pick teams that start at the bottom to hopefully see the moment that they finally get to the top. So my teams are the Toronto Maple Leafs, the Toronto Blue Jays, Tottenham Hotspur, the Cleveland Browns. I mean, goodness me, what did I do when I chose them? That was mind blowing. And then England, right England as the national team, and in England have their game on Sunday, as we record this in the European Championship final against Spain. You love Spain. If anyone follows your social media, they know that you're there every year and you love your media. So you'll be cheering Spain on I'm sure. No, actually, you

Matt Cundill  50:31  
know what? Yes and no, really. So I was kind of there at the beginning. I was in Malaga, when the new Spanish team was unveiled. And they were going to say, this is the team we're going with and they'd sort of departed the small people. We have a new coach. They won the first game against Norway without Holland. And then they traveled two days later to go play Scotland and got boat raced by Scotland to nothing. And you know, the papers go nuts. And what is his team bow? And it's built from there. But here we are at the end. So the team is really built for this moment, which is coming up on Sunday, which is going to be England versus Spain. And while it'd be nice for Spain to when I go back to 1996 and I was in Cheltenham, when Southgate missed the kick.

Rob Grant  51:15  
You were there. You were in England at 96. I

Matt Cundill  51:18  
was in England because my friend Tim, who is in Calgary. He is a teacher in Calgary. So he moved from Cheltenham to Calgary just like you, you know, a very similar journey. And the Southgate missing, I said, Can this guy just get one, England can win, but I want Southgate to have his redemption because I felt so terrible for him in 96.

Rob Grant  51:41  
Euro 9096 is the most if I was to write a coming of age, John Hughes movie about myself, it will be about that summer, and it will be about Euro 96, which was the defining memory of my childhood. And I remember being in the pub with my dad, when Southgate missed and actually before that, which is you got to be really excited to know this. It was a sudden death situation and extra time I don't have that rule anymore. The alleged golden goal, the alleged golden goal, and the ball went flying across the goal line and poor gas line. All he had to do was just slide in and score. And he missed it by like nano by like a millimeter. And my dad jumped up and smashed his stall that he was sitting on his barstool and I'm standing right beside him as a 14 year old. Whoa. And then Southgate missed, and it was just an unbelievable time. And if I can just elaborate England and watching them win is the thing that drives me sports wise, it's the thing that I have to see in my life is the moment I need. And I arranged my whole summer around being here in Calgary my parents are visiting right now. So I could watch the semifinal and final with my dad, I had it manifested in my mind it would happen that England would win this time, and that we would watch it together. And then my vacation got canceled by the WestJet strike. And it's been rescheduled for this Sunday. And I will be flying during the final of Euro 2024. And I won't watch that with my dad. But I did get the semi final with him. And the last minute goal in the ship and anchor which is a great pop here in Calgary. And I got to stand beside him and my good friend Tim and Ollie Watkins scored that last minute goal and I did get that great moment. But I will miss the final which is I don't mind telling you people will think I'm just being exuberant. It is killing me that I'm missing this final. I've thought of every possibility imaginable. How do I make this final? And I can't make it happen that the universe has conspired against me. Wow, that's

Matt Cundill  53:40  
incredible. So I am pulling for England and why because Southgate needs his match. Now, Spain will always be there. I look at somebody like UML UML has got at least another 10 tries at this thing. So

Rob Grant  53:51  
I'll tell you now 16 years old. Yeah. I mean, my Southgate missing that penalty, you know he needs his redemption. I thought he was gonna get it three years ago he didn't. Honestly, I get emotional thinking of Southgate seeing beside that trophy. He's not been a particularly great manager for England. And yet he's had so much success. It's been so bizarre. Well, maybe

Matt Cundill  54:13  
because he might be a good manager. But why do we do this? Why do we bang on the coach all the time?

Rob Grant  54:19  
I just judging him by the evidence of my own eyes like where we placed back here two weeks ago it's it's the worst performance I've ever seen from an England team ever, ever. It was so bad and yet somehow last minute go from Jude Bellingham, a goal from Harry Kane extra time and we go through and this thing was Switzerland. We were terrible against Switzerland.

Matt Cundill  54:41  
Why didn't you look across the ocean. Canada got to a semi final on the same sort of it's not ineptitude, but it's just the path of slate unfolds.

Rob Grant  54:49  
That was a huge moment Canada making the semi final of copper America. I mean, that's unbelievable. absolutely unbelievable. They did that and the way they played it. I think it was slight there's a slight difference in how England play in Canada playing because I'm watching this team grow in front of my eyes. So sometimes I'll see them go forward and play like they're a top level international side. And then you'll see the goal they conceded, you know, against Venezuela and you're like, oh my god, you wouldn't see that on a wreck field anywhere in London. You know, the defending was quite poor. And that's kind of where this team is at right now. I mean, the same with against Argentina, that first goal for Julian Alvarez. I mean, those two centerback so far apart. I mean, that's, that's mind blowing. You bet. And then yet you'll see them do something upfront. You're like, whoa, Where's this coming from this quality? This program is going to grow over the next 10 years. Soccer is growing. We're seeing that with Calgary right now. I'm loving watching soccer grow in this country. It honestly it's one of the biggest passions I have, is seeing soccer grow in this country and it is growing. And it's becoming a bigger and bigger sports. I could talk about that for another hour. Like it's so much fun watching it grow.

Matt Cundill  55:56  
So I played football in Edmonton. And I thought, Oh, 99 Gold Cup. We won that. And I thought, Oh, this is gonna grow. But then I saw Michael Owen. He was playing in Calgary. And then he went and played for England. And I'm like, oh, and then I saw Owen Hargreaves. And he would play I thought, Oh, he's gonna play for Canada. And then he went and played for England. And I was like, oh, maybe we won't grow. Yeah,

Rob Grant  56:23  
I mean, you know what, I think we've got a different world now that we had them when you had the likes of the De Guzman brothers and various people that wouldn't even play for Canada. I mean, that was how bad things were. There were good players that just wouldn't play. I think things are different. Now. I think that the work that John herdmen did over the last kind of few years when the impact he's had on Canadian soccer, both men's and women's is phenomenal. That man is an absolute legend of the game. And now if we can keep Jessie Marsh, you know, I know that a lot of Canadians that kind of have a passing interest in football, but Jesse Marsh who's this? Just March has been a top coach around Europe, right? He's coached in Germany. He's coached in England, Premier League Bundesliga, guy knows this stuff. Leads, right? Yeah, it was at least for sure. Well, I'd have a huge amount of success there but still managed to the Premier League, the calendar to have that as their manager as their coach. That's a high standard. You're seeing some of the effects we're having now and some of the some of the players who've got I mean, Tayshaun Buchanan priest in Summerland. Alfonso Davies could be around Madrid by the end of this summer already is at by a Munich, Jonathan David is supposed to be being touted to Premier League clubs, Tottenham are interested in Manchester United as well. Karl Aaron's playing European football.

Matt Cundill  57:34  
He's in Majorca. Yeah, he's

Rob Grant  57:37  
playing a high standard, then you've got players like Jacob schafberg, who I think is the second best player in the entire team. He's going to be in Europe sometime soon, that guy is just too good as the Johnsons at Celtic, I think he's going to make a step up. And, you know, we're seeing more and more and more players now playing at a high level. It's not just the odd couple here and there. It's not just the Tebow Hutchinson on his own and a bunch of nothing. With all due respect to those players that played alongside with him. There's now a whole squad coming through. And what I loved about what Jessie Maher said, after they went out is he's putting pressure on the Canadian Premier League in the sense that, okay, let's find more young players and not to be disparaging to the Canadian Premier, they're doing a great job. And I love what they're doing when I'm such a supporter of that league. But it's just great to see a Canadian national team have a national league that it can talk to. And we're starting to have the building blocks in place now. We've got a national league, we've got a proper setup. It's got its problems. Canada soccer, as you know, supposedly in a huge amount of debt. It's got major problems, we've still got to work out. But as you do appointed about the Gold Cup, when 25 years ago, I think we're in a vastly different space to grow than we were then. And that as a fan excites me that my children will have a proper Canadian team to follow. Going into the 2030s.

Matt Cundill  58:57  
Yeah, I was in 98. I went to what was Commonwealth Stadium in Edmonton, and watch Canada lose to nothing. to Trinidad and Tobago. I was horrified. We promoted it, we gave away tickets. And I said you got to win this. I think it was Ashley Cole, who I think he part of the goal, but he you know, he dominated the game. It's Canada, we can't lose to toboggans.

Rob Grant  59:22  
Well, I mean, one I remember was when they lost to they needed to, I think get a draw with Honduras, to make the final stage of conduct Caf qualifying I think it was for 2014 or 2018. And they lost in 181 to hunt jurors. And I was like, my god. I mean, that's not just a loss. That's an absolute humiliation. And that felt like the deer, right, there's no coming back from that, that just breaks careers. And somehow, you know, not just on the back of Alfonso Davies, but driven largely by him. They have they have come back and they've now qualified for a World Cup in their own right they will be there in 2020 Six, it's easier to make well cups now, because law cups have expanded to 48 teams. And so there's every reason now that Canada hopefully can be copers if they continue to invite concert Caf teams and World Cups and, you know, see where this goes, because it's a hugely exciting time. And then hopefully those days that you speak rather of losing in 98. That's all behind us now.

Matt Cundill  1:00:23  
I kind of love watching places like the US and Mexico right now. They're rather delusional about where they think they are and where they need to be. And it's just, you know, super wide. And you know, shout out to Jessie Marsh, who was turned down for the job in the US and they didn't even make it out of the group stage. And now it's like, Well, I think we need to get rid of our coach and we probably should have hired this guy. And now they're coming back on can we still get him? No, you cannot get him.

Rob Grant  1:00:49  
I'm worried they might come in for March to be honest with you. But then I know that US Soccer is all over the place. I mean, you know, they apparently yesterday they were going after your yoke and clock, but you know, who's just left Liverpool. And so there's that in a million years as Jochen flop going to manage the USA, like that's never happening. Yeah, so Juergen

Matt Cundill  1:01:08  
Klopp is going to look at those players and say no, and nobody will acknowledge this, but I'll just say the quiet part out loud. And that's if you pay him $10 million a year, you're gonna have to pay the women's coach that same amount, and the whole thing will melt down. And they've already had multiple meltdowns over the last, you know, five to seven years over, whether it's equal payment, who gets money for what I mean? It's dysfunctional from the inside. And you don't have the players. So Juergen Klopp is not coming to coach you. They're not coming

Rob Grant  1:01:38  
to coach. No. And of course, you know, there's a whole conversation to be had about equal pay, you know, in terms of women's sport and men's sport, and that's growing throughout the world. And I think we'll probably see that probably go in a progressive direction would be my guess. But the problem that both were not the problem, but the the argument I think a women are making both in Canada and the US is their women's national teams have been wildly more successful than the men's teams, right? When the women have won, you know, three or three World Cups in the last 30 years, the Canadian women have won an Olympic gold medal. And yes, there's more money in the men's game, etc, etc. But I'm really excited about the growth of the women's game. I'm excited to see this northern Women's League I forget the name of it now off top my head was supposed to start next year Calgary has a team. You know, it's it's something I'm really excited about the women's game has grown hugely over the last 20 years. I actually tend to follow Canada more than I do England when it comes to that, because I've become such a huge fan of the Canadian Women's National Team. You know, we go to see cavalry play every week. We're season ticket holders here in Calgary, which is our local Canadian Premier League team for the men. But my daughter asks, you know, Where are the women, and it'd be cool to go and show her a woman's team down on McMahon next season, and go and see some games there. So it's such a thrill to see the game grow in this country. As I said earlier, I absolutely love it.

Matt Cundill  1:02:55  
That way, I hope it does. This time I really thought in the 2000s early on that it would take off and it just it didn't really happen. And we sort of like but here we are now and it's good stuff.

Rob Grant  1:03:05  
Who's your team? By the way? I know you like your football, we've spoken about on Instagram from time to time, but you seem to be extraordinarily well versed in the game. So who are your teams? I have no team. No team.

Matt Cundill  1:03:18  
I just watch. See, my life is tied up in the Buffalo Bills. And that takes up most of my energy. And so I'm not sure that I could get emotionally invested in any particular club to lose my mind over.

Rob Grant  1:03:32  
I need a club is it get into a sport? I need a club and in my team, I need my colors and my jersey.

Matt Cundill  1:03:38  
I mean, if you're if you're gonna make me pick, I'll take Barcelona. I think your first one is always the one so the Buffalo Bills from my first NFL NFL adventure. Been a fan forever. And you know, been through the heartache. I've seen most of it. It's sad. I have unusual meltdowns every year, based on their performance in 2018 was my first football match in Europe. And I saw Messi score three goals and I said no. Maybe this will be my team.

Rob Grant  1:04:06  
Where are you? I'm going to interview you for a second. Where are you out on the bills right now? I mean, they've struggled to get over the line. They've clearly got the talent in Josh Allen. They've made some changes in the offseason here. I think Stefon Diggs is gone. I mean, are they primed to make a move and in 2024, or they, where are you at with them?

Matt Cundill  1:04:23  
They're so close. They're perpetually closed, right? It's a missed field goal. It's as long as Patrick mahomes Is there, I think the task is going to be tall. Yeah. And so if you're going to win a championship, there's going to be a have to be maybe some extraneous outside things they're going to have to happen. Somebody may need to beat Patrick mahomes along the way to do it. And you know, we can talk about Tyler bass missing the field goal last year. It doesn't matter if he makes the field goal Patrick mahomes is still going to win that game. So I try not to get too dull. Losing all over the whole thing and the management, I'm just happy that the team is in good hands and the Gulas are taking care of the team and that we are contending every year. But the risk is that it becomes the Cleveland Browns and the Cleveland Browns in the late 80s 86 and 88. So close maybe should have Coulda, Woulda, and that's my fears at the Buffalo Bills just sort of sitting in that NFC AFC Championship tear, and never quite get back to the big game.

Rob Grant  1:05:29  
The difficulty that I found was similar with North American sport. I mean, in Europe, it's different to be in soccer. If our teams are bad, we might get relegated, which is a whole different proposition. And so you support them just as furiously as if they were going for a league title because you don't want the indignity of being relegated. We don't have that in North American Sports. And the banality of being awful is something I hate. I found it with the Browns when I first cheered for them when they won What was it three games in three years. It's just watches that is tough to watch. When the leafs tanked to go for Austin Matthews that genuinely affected my fandom. It took me years to get it back. Because watching the team lose night after night is just not have any interest and not competitive in the least. So I think to your point about the fact that bills are in good hands and the bills were terrible for a long time. Maybe I'm just a defeatist, but it must be good at least knowing that this season you are going to content you are going to make the playoffs you're going to be in with a shout, you will be for the next at least four or five, six seasons, however long that Allen remains will be longer than that, at least during the conversation. It's better than just knowing before you even kick a ball or throw a ball in September, that you're nowhere. Like that's a horrible place to be. Rob. 

Matt Cundill  1:06:46  
It's been awesome. Thanks for joining us. I appreciate it. Thanks

Rob Grant  1:06:49  
for having me on. I love chatting. Thanks again. I really appreciate your sound. 

Tara Sands (Voiceover)  1:06:52  
The podcast is written and hosted by Matt Cundill produced by Evan Surminski, edited by Taylor McLean social media by Aidan Glassey, another great creation from the sound off media company. There's always more at soundoff podcast.com