Relationships Lead to Clients with Fitness Coach and author Dawn Dimicco

So today with us folks, you are going to be doing some exercise with me. We're gonna get the jumping jacks going, maybe a little jump rope, pushups, you name it. But Don Damico is with us and she is a fitness business acceleration coach who works with personal trainers and nutrition coaches to start and grow an online business that gets their clients killer. And we all want killer results. So Don, welcome to the Sales Made Easy podcast. What's the good word? I am excited to be here and talk to you today. All right, great to have you. So we were chatting a little bit earlier. Just help me understand, Don, because you are coaching people and you've got your coaching packages, but has it always been that you've been around sales and it's easy to sell product for?

I haven't always been in formalized sales at all in any way, shape or form. I'm a talker, so I'm naturally just always selling something. But as far as actual sales, corporate, any of that, no. Okay. Good deal. So in mind, what did you learn? I mean, so sales, yes speaking is required, but what are some of the things that you've learned about sales over the course of your time being in business? Would you say Absolutely all about relationships? If you can connect with people, figure out what their problems are. And find out in creative ways sometimes how your solution fits their problem in a way that they can understand sales can be made easy. Yeah, I like it. So it's all about the people. So what skills then, would you say you had to develop then to get these relationships going and build on them? A lot of it's just really listening. And when you're a talker, that can be very challenging because you always wanna talk and share. But when you can get people talking about what's important to them, what matters to them, then you can figure out do you have a a solution, do you have a fit? When you can meet somebody on their level, you can connect, you can then figure out if working together makes. Yeah, absolutely. I love it. So as far as being a talker, were you one of those kids that was getting notes on the report card? If Don could only pay attention and stop talking so much? Yes. You would get better grades. I had an assigned seat. Every kid, we got to school first. First day of school, you pick your seat for the year, except for myself and one other kid. We always had a, a seat assigned right next to the teacher's desk. Yes, I was an s so normally the back of the class, but I ended up sitting at the front of the class, yes, very frequently because of similar traits. So tell me a little bit about your business as far as being a coach is concerned and you know, fitness coach. I mean, you're clearly into fitness. Has this been a lifelong passion for you? I was actually a dual sport collegiate athlete, so technically yes, fitness always mattered. I needed to always be in shape. I needed to always be taking care of myself after I graduated. College. I went through this terrible transition. I was one of those college athletes that put on 40 pounds in like a year and a half. I stopped working out. I started eating well, quite honestly. I was eating the same way I always had. I just wasn't working out anymore. I got depressed, anxious, started eating too much, drinking too much, doing all the wrong things, not taking care of myself. And went that way for quite a long time. I finally had my, you know, come to Jesus moment. Mm-hmm. I was sitting on the floor in South Carolina one day. I'll never forget it. I was making my bed. Hmm. I was making a king size bed and I got winded At 27 years old. I was an all-American athlete and I, I couldn't make my bed and I was, I was too young for that and I knew that something had to change and, you know, it should have been an indicator when I had to sit on the stairs to put my shoes. That I was headed in a bad direction, and so I really just jumped into the, the health and fitness world because I needed to, for me. I ended up joining. We talked a little bit beforehand Beachbody and I was, I became one of their coaches. It's a great system. You get a discount. I could follow a program. You tell me what to do. I was coachable. I'll do it. And it was a, it was a perfect system for me to get in shape and it was a way to earn a little bit of side money at the same time. And I absolutely, Oh my goodness. I can't, I mean, so is this a pretty common thing, just outta curiosity that ex-college athletes just stop working out and just turn into their mother, so to speak, or sometimes part of their father or whatever? My do, my biggest struggle was I had had a couple knee surgeries in college, which I actually had my knee replaced two years. And so when I was done, like my body was done. But for me, the bigger thing was I always had a, a trainer. I was always told exactly what to do, when to do it, how to do it, how much weight, how much rest. And when I was on my own, I didn't know how to work out. So I just didn't. And I just kept telling myself, well, my body needs a break. And once you get out of that habit and routine getting started again, especially when you're. And now being 40 pounds overweight, it was embarrassing to go to the gym. You know, I, I was an athlete and couldn't figure out how to, how to work the gym. That's amazing. Yeah. So it's really I mean, I think it hits home for a lot of us, like if you who are training pretty much year round. Now you're saying that you didn't know how to train without a coach. That's just, it was insane. Yeah. So that, this is probably why a lot of people go to the gym and they look the same year after year. What's your thought on that? Is that true? Is it because they just dunno how to work out? Some of it is they, they just don't know what to do. They do what they're comfortable. And then when it comes to figuring out dropping weight, you know, a lot of people work out cause they want to eat and so they don't adjust their eating with whatever their goals are. And so you can work out really hard, but not necessarily lose weight unless you're being conscious of both the nutrition and and the fitness aspect. Yeah. So I know this is a side note because, but I gotta ask because a lot of us, you know, we live in America, we probably, when you look at the American diet and you look at Europeans and people in other parts of the country, there is a common denominator with us Americans and we'll go into it. But I think we're mostly a little bit, we're carrying a little bit more than we need to. Oh yeah. So what would be, is there like, Some kind of, I dunno, there's no easy answer. There's no pill to take. I get all of that. But is there something that we should be cognizant of that could help us slim down a little bit, even if it's five or 10 pounds? What could help us get started on that? I mean, it's always more movement, right? You, you hear, you know, take in less calories, move. and it's just really finding the right balance for your body. That the thing that I worked on when I was coaching fitness and nutrition clients, it's try to get rid of as much of the processed stuff as we can. I mean, we know there's all the chemicals in that food, it's, it's causing a ruckus in our body, right? So if we can kind of have some less packaged stuff, make sure we're intentionally moving our body more often, we don't realize how much we sit, especially in this age of technology after Covid, how much time do we spend in front of screens? Even more so than. So getting that intentional movement and then just being aware of how much we're eating throughout the day, we mindlessly eat without realizing it. Hmm. I found, I, I find myself, I, I would wake up in the middle of the night to use a bathroom and if I was living in a place where the bathroom wasn't in, like off the master, if I walked past the kitchen, I would eat in the middle of the night for no reason, just because it was. And is that wrong, Isn't that like one of the, the five balanced meals we need to be eating? Of course. Always in the middle of the night. Oh my goodness. Nighttime eating. That's, that's the bane of a lot of us where we. You know, that's, that's definitely a struggle for me is trying to not eat after 7:00 PM or something like that, where I just, you know, if you're sitting down watching a Netflix show or mm-hmm. whatever, it's just like, I hear my name being called, it's inside that big metal box who's in there? Oh, I know. It's, it's salami and cheese. It's you know, cottage cheese, it's yogurt, it's something, put food in my mouth. So, anyway. So that's, that's definitely a challenge. And is that something that was difficult for you to overcome? Or did, was it kind of fairly easy for you based on your prior experiences? When I finally made a decision to make a change, and I had a plan and a system to follow, to do it, it came really easily for me because I had hit my rock bottom. I didn't have a choice. I had to figure it. And again, if you tell me exactly what to do, I'm gonna do it to a team. And so I was able to get most of that weight off pretty, pretty quickly and then maintain for years. Hmm. Yeah. Phenomenal. So tell me about the business side of this thing now that we know that your credibility is so perfectly established. So perfectly established, and I, I am in awe losing 40 pounds, man, that's like carrying, yeah, that's, that would be that's like a couple set of golf bags that I'm walking around with me. I mean, I dunno, but it's a, it's a big number. And so as far as your business is concerned, you started out. Getting into this Beachbody thing mm-hmm. And then as a multi-level marketing thing, was there a lot of sales training and coaching in that for you? Or was it just like, go sell product and Right. You know, a survival of the fittest? What, how would you describe that? Beachbody is a phenomenal company. They actually have a lot of training that, but it's on you, right? You're, you're an independent. Coach, you're an, it's an independent business. So whatever they offered, I always took, and then of course I sought outside training, outside education, just to continue to build not just my credibility, but ways that I could help people. It was a product that I believed in. I used it and I saw such value in it. But in that multi-level marketing, You know, the, the way that you really earn money is building a team and then getting a team to do the same. And while I did pretty well, I could never get over that hump. I wasn't trying, I wasn't building a team. I, I would hit sales numbers. I did did pretty well with that. But as far as building that team and generating, you know, income that I could just live off of, I struggled. And I ended up going through a divorce a little over two years ago and it was actually, actually, This month it would be on, on the 18th is when I hired my first business coach. Mm-hmm. and basically, I needed to start making more money. I had a personal training certification, and if you're just working in a gym as a personal trainer, you, you don't make enough money to live on. I was working at the Y M C A making close to minimum wage, but again, I, I didn't need the money at the time. It was really a hobby and a way to just meet people and, and practice what I was doing. And so I met this, this coach ended up hiring her, almost threw up when I hired her. I had to put it on two credit. Didn't know how much that stuff went for at the time, and she taught me how to sell high ticket, and it was the scariest and exciting and most life-changing experience in my life because I went from selling these hundred dollars. You get hundreds of workouts at your fingertips, hundred dollars for a full year to now selling my own program that I didn't actually have yet for, you know, 1800 to $2,100 for three. Wow. Okay. So I could buy 20 or so a hundred dollars programs. Mm-hmm. or one of yours? Mm-hmm. and yours. And you're saying less. Was Les came with it, but what came with your program that the other program may not have? Well, and that, and that was the part that blew my mind when I told my family, this is how I'm gonna make a living now, now that I'm divorced, this is what I'm gonna do. And they're like, well, why would anybody pay you that? Because my, my sister, my brother-in-law, they all use Beachbody as well. They're like, you lost all your weight using Beachbody. Why would they hire you? Mm-hmm. because people pay for. Somebody to help them implement what they're doing and transform their life in some way. And a hundred dollars might not be a lot, but if you don't use it, it's a waste of money. And a lot of people, I mean, how many, how many subscriptions or how many gym memberships maybe you've had in your life or your listeners have had that They pay for it and they don't use it. And so they're not, they're not getting that accountability. They're not, they're not getting out of it. What they want a lot of people with, with a program like. I explain it, it's like Netflix, right? If you don't have a plan to what you're doing, you, if you don't know what it is you're gonna do, you open that library or workouts and you just scroll and scroll and scroll looking for something to do, and then you're like, all right, I didn't see anything. And then you turn it off and walk away and you haven't done anything with it. There's almost too much at your fingertips. And if you're not disciplined and you don't, don't know what it is you wanna do going in, you don't get the results you want. It's not. Yeah, and I think there's probably a lot of us that are, you know, you try something for a while, you don't see the results fast enough. Mm-hmm. so it could be, I'm gonna go keto. I'm gonna go paleo if the keto doesn't work. Yeah. I'm gonna get rid of wheat. Okay, now I'm gonna stop drinking alcohol. Maybe I'll just do a water and soup diet with no no real food in, I mean, there's just so many different things. The grapefruit diet, the lemon diet. Just eat eggs. Yeah, exactly right. And so they're. Whatever. They confuse us. I mean, it's a shiny object syndrome and so you get in front of people and you're basically saying, what? I'm basically selling the result that they're gonna get. Mm-hmm. this is the problem. They have these, this is what they're wanting, this is what they're needing, and I'm gonna help them lose the weight and I'm not, not talking about. All the ways we're doing it. I'm not selling this feature and this feature. I'm not stacking all of these things on top. I actually sell less, you know, with the concept that I realized was happening, where you're paying me money for less on purpose. You're paying me to get you the result. You don't need all the extra stuff in the way. You just need the stuff that's gonna get you the result. You know, when I hired my business coach, it, everything was streamlined. She didn't gimme extra fluff and extra things that I didn't need. That just confused the. I was given exactly what I needed when I needed it, every step of the way. And so that's what I was offering my clients. And I had a method. I had a plan, you know, we worked specific nutrition. I had philosophies that we worked through, depending on the client, what they needed, because not everybody has the exact same needs. You know, while Beachbody works great for me, it didn't work for some others. And so by working with me, I'm able to make changes, tweak things based on their specific needs, their calendars, their. Fit this into what they're doing because honestly, the the most important thing, it doesn't matter the workout you're doing all the time. It doesn't even matter which diet you're following. It's what can you do that you're going to stay consistent and people don't stay consistent on their own. Well, when you have a coach that you just paid $2,100, guess what you're more inclined to do? It's that skin in the game thing. Absolutely. The a hundred dollars wasn't enough for most people. Yep. Right. I mean, I, my girlfriend spends that at Starbucks a month. Right? Like right. You know, it's not a, it's not enough. But when you have that real skin in the game and you know that we're gonna have a call once a week and you're gonna see my face and have to tell me how the week went, you know, you second guess that extra piece of cake. Hmm. You second guess skipping that. And then once we build that habit, once we get them into that routine, a lot of my clients actually, when they're done with me, we transition to Beachbody because they don't, they don't need me anymore. They've gotten what they needed, they've got their habits formed. Some stay on longer it, it really depends. But that's what they're getting through that high ticket. They're getting the result. They're getting the step-by-step, what they need when they need. And that was, that was huge for me. It was funny. We're talking about food. When I realized this, I pay more for less all the time. When I started paying attention to my fitness and nutrition, I would go to the movies and I would always have a plan of attack. I knew I had to decide before I went if I was having popcorn or not, and I decided on the size I was gonna get. Well, you know, the large is more economical, always right. Especially when you say a medium who buys a. Right. Me. Right. I buy the medium because that's what I wanted. That's what I was allowing myself. And they're like, but for 25 cents you can get like twice as much. And I was like, no, I don't want it because this is gonna get me the result I want. This is not. And then I started thinking about that as I was selling, as I was going through things I had purchased ClickFunnel. Package one time with Russell Brunson. I got sold at one of those 10 x conferences at the Grant Cardone and Russell was up there selling his whole package and I was mesmerized. And I, I don't wanna say I fell for it because I learned so much and what they have is so valuable. But they were teaching the stack, right? And they stacked so much into this package that I spent a fortune on. But I didn't have a coach that walked me step by step through this stack of stuff. So I spent, you know, $3,500. On software and programs and things that I didn't know what to do with. Hmm. And that's when I learned, okay, I would've paid even more for half of that stuff if I had the right person walking me through every step of the way. And that's what I saw as the value of that high ticket coaching. That's where somebody can get with that. And I felt, I felt guilty at first. I was like, how can I sell this? You know, you've got Shaunti. Tony Horton, both with Beachbody and somebody's gonna pay for my workout, like, how can I charge that? But that's when I realized it's, it's the result they get. It's the value that I'm giving. It's not the, the features, it's not the things, it's not my background versus somebody else's background. You know, is it worth it to you? If you lose 15 pounds that you're not putting back on, that you now know how to do by yourself and you don't need a coach, again, is it worth $2,100? And if it is, it's a no brain. Wow. So the, the people who are on whatever, they're on the CDs, they're on the websites, they may be more famous. Mm-hmm. right? They may be the creator of these incredible programs, but they're not face to face with someone like you and I are. Right. So, The, I guess the big difference then one of 'em is you can, I could shut down a computer or just, you know, hit the little X and you know, Tony Horton is gone or whoever. Right. They're gone. Yeah. And I could go back to eating my cheeseburger and fries and chocolate shake and wonder why I'm not losing weight. You on the other hand, if I did that, you'd say, so Harry, how'd the Did you stick with the plan We came up with and I'm like, well, kind of. And then what would you do if I gave you that kind of, well, I've, I straight up remind my clients how much they paid me. Yeah. I have no problem saying, do you remember how much you paid me? Some of them. Some of them. I'll even say, does your husband know how much you paid me? Why don't we get the results? So this is not an issue later. Yeah. But the other piece is, you know, things come up, especially fitness and nutrition. You're working together over the long haul. Well, how many holidays come up every quarter? How many vacations, how many kids get sick? Things get thrown off. And so by having somebody there, I can make adjustments as we go, that will still move them in the right direction. Yeah. And so that's what's been beneficial. And now I recently, I, I love coaching so much and. Now the need I see is I see so many really good personal trainers and nutrition coaches out there that they don't like to sell, so they're not helping anyone. Then you get a really crappy trainer out there that knows how to sell and they're the only one doing it. So that's who's working with people that really need help. So I wanna work with those, those those personal trainers and nutrition coaches. Really want to make a difference to clients' lives, right? When I say my clients get better results working one-on-one with me, because they're more invested in what they're doing. They paid the money and they have a different level of support and they're getting exactly what they need, so they're gonna get better results. And personal trainers, they don't make much money. I mean, people pay, you know, they might pay $70 an hour, but the trainer's not getting $70 an hour, and how much can, how many hours can you work in a day? You're restricted by what gyms have. You're restricted by people showing up and not, so I love being able to show personal trainers and nutrition coaches another way. They don't have to abandon the gym. They don't have to abandon that in person face-to-face one-on-one. But why not add another way to earn income to what you're doing and get more people? Yeah, so good. So do you have your ideal client? Is it just like all personal trainers or do you kind of look like at an ideal client profile or avatar? I have just been creating it. I just moved into this space, so I had my ideal. The women I was working with while I was fitness and nutrition coaching were those, you know, women over 40, possibly in that premenopausal phase. A lot of them were former athletes at some point. Or they hated working out, right? They just, they know nothing about working out. I didn't work with those gung-ho gym rat type women that are like, give me more, you know? I wanted to ease those other people and then teach them to start to like, to work out. As far as my business coaching, I wanna work with either that brand new, they've got their personal training certification, nutrition certification, but don't know what to do with it. Right? They got this piece of paper and they're ready to work with people. Getting in the gym door process is kind of a pain or somebody that's been working in the gyms for a while and primarily women. You know, I, I mainly work with women. We understand each other better. It's also that coach that, or that personal trainer that, you know, wants, that needs to earn more. I do have a client now who has, you know, she's been in the fitness space for a while. She's a, she's a unique individual. I'm looking to help people start and grow. I wanna help people get to that, you know, $10,000 a month pay. Now if there's somebody that's already in that space, they're making that $10,000 and more, I'm gonna send them to another coach that's gonna help 'em then scale it. But I want to get those people in that starting and growing phase when it's time to scale. That's gonna be somebody else IN'S area of. Yeah, perfect. With the ideal client mm-hmm. how does that help you prevent wasting people's time? Well, for sure if somebody's making. You know, if they're, if they're ready to scale and they come to me, I, I don't wanna waste their time. You know, they're gonna know right from the, the get go. This is mm-hmm. this is what this person does. You know, if somebody's ready to start doing a lot of paid advertisements, that's not where I'm at. I'm helping you start and grow organically, right? I'm helping you get your business started with, with a little bit of income so that you can start getting paid right away. So they're gonna know that right away. And then also, I'm gonna be that space where that new trainer says, okay, she gets it. She's been. She just did this. Right. I'm still in that, that phase where I know exactly what I did every step of the way. My third month with my coach, I made just under $10,000. Nice. I know exactly what I did step by step to get there, and so I am now able to recreate that for some women and help them generate, and a lot of the women that are, are looking to work with me. They're not, they're not looking to make that much. They're looking to make maybe two or $3,000 a month more. Hmm. That's life changing to their. And so that's really exciting to get the opportunity to expose people to a new way of doing things. Teaching them, of course, there's the sales process, changing their mindset on what they can do and their worth and the value that they have to add to people is just, it's exciting. This is, this is great, Dawn. So did you ever have to c overcome like some real disappointment that got you down as far as the sales is concerned in your new venture that, you know, people can take away and say, well look, Dawn does everything and it's just, just so perfect. She's such a natural. So was there a time where you just went, ugh, I'm not any good at this. This is, so, this is more difficult than I thought it would be. Anything like that in your past here in the past year or two? Well, of course, I mean, I'm at that, you know, in that starting and growing phase, so, you know, there wasn't that reoccurring income. You know, if, if you're not working and you don't sell that month, you don't bring money in. I'm, most of my clients are paying everything up front. So it was really exciting when I had that, like $10,000 a. It's like, yeah, I'm rolling. And then I had to get a client for like two months. It's like, oh, I'm not rolling And it's, it's that, you know, sales cycle. It's also then learning, okay, what, how do I start to generate that reoccurring income? You know, what are some of the things that I can do differently next time so that it's not that constantly chasing that next. Because my goal, I don't want a client to come and work with me forever. You know, they're, that's a lot of the gym model is you wanna keep a, you wanna keep a personal training client forever and ever. That's how they make money. Well, that's, that's kind of against what I wanna do. I wanna bring a client in. I wanna teach them what they need to know, do what they need to do so they don't have to keep spending money on somebody like me to help them maintain those. Okay. That's fair. So what did you have to do differently for the consistency. Really looking at what are the behaviors that I was not doing and running away from. And it's it's the connecting. I've got no problem if I get on a sales call and I don't do a sales call. Well, that's the other fun part. When you can connect with somebody, you can do the things wrong. If, if my coach ever listened to one of my, I mean, I've, I heard. Break down other sales calls, I'm like, oh, I did it all wrong. But when you're connecting and you're doing the right things, I was closing a higher percentage than a lot of the other people going through the program at the same time. But I was doing it still wrong, but it's because I was connecting. What would you say is something that you did that was wrong that you would probably work on correcting? Oh, I'm trying to think. Cuz I did a lot wrong. I definitely would catch myself talking too much, get, you know, it's not staying into that, that timeframe. Still respecting their time, but definitely getting off track. I did a pretty good job handling objections, but in the beginning I was letting people get off the phone without that next scheduled call, like they have to think about it without having that next scheduled call already, or in the beginning when I was first starting. And I would tell people how much it was. And then the next question is, okay, like, is that a payment plan or do you, you know, pay that up upfront? And immediately I was like, oh, I, I can break that down into payments, which is fine if that's the way I wanted to do business. And my coach's like, well why, why are you doing that? That's just a question they're asking. Can they not pay it upfront? Do they need the payment plan? So it's just some of those pieces. But yeah, just getting super chat. I probably was getting caught on the wrong pieces of the conversation, looking more into, okay, they've got, you know, these things that we can work with. You know, planning a little bit ahead that way with what programming I wanted to do before the sale was over. Yeah, this is, it's so funny listening to that, it's like, these are all things that you're just saying naturally without thinking about necessarily, how does that impact, you know, the potential here for the sale. Right, right. So yeah, totally get it. And on I think the thing to learn though, I mean for the listener, is that when you hear about the other person, That's the overriding factor. Absolutely. Right. That's the forgiveness line. Mm-hmm. is that the more you care, the more forgiveness there is. And sometimes I've looked at people over the years and say, how does that person sell anything? Mm-hmm. And it's really all about the concern. I mean, there are shady people that use manipulation, right. And guilt and all that nonsense. But for genuinely nice people. If you show you care, you're gonna get a lot of forgiveness and then you just get better. Yeah. And I just love, I love your attitude. Well, my favorite, so Don. Oh, I'm sorry. You go. I was saying my favorite call I had with a woman, and I initially thought it was gonna be a Beachbody call. She, we had followed each other on Facebook for a long time. It was, we were on the phone New Year's Eve during the early evening, and I'm doing a sales call for fitness and nutrition on New Year's Eve. I'm thinking, okay. This is gonna go nowhere. And we talked the program and the biggest key was we had built so much trust over Facebook. By the time she got on the the phone, she was already ready to buy. I didn't have to do all the things that we were talking. So we get to the end and I ask, you know, how does that sound? Does that sound like something that you wanna do? And she goes, yep, how do I sign up? And I'm like, well, do you wanna know how much it's gonna cost? Cuz that that hadn't come up. And she said, Whatever you tell me it costs is what it needs to be. That's what I need to pay you. And I was like, and then of course my brain went, well, how much am I gonna charge I was like, it should be a lot more. But it was because we had developed that before that sales call, it made it so much easier. Right? Yes. There's a line out there as charge as much as you can without cracking a smile, or say the highest number you can without cracking a smile. So, sounds like you're at the verge of cracking a smile on that one. Great stuff. So, Don, you have the floor. What is the, what does he wanna tell our listeners? I think the, the biggest thing is, you know, with sales, it's all mindset. And when I got away from what are the pieces and the features and the parts, and I started selling the value of what I had, I started getting really clear on what, what's the problem, right? I'm selling a solution to the problem. Once I got clear on that, it was so much easier. I see too many people that have too much to offer this. That are afraid. They, I mean, I was on a call, I don't know if you were on it through the Speakers Academy one day, where somebody like literally said on the call, they don't like selling so much that they, they refused to sell their program. Like if somebody didn't just come to them and buy, they weren't gonna reach out. And I'm like, but what you have can change somebody's life. It's selfish not to. People need what you have. And so when we can change that mindset to, it's not about you getting a sale, it's about what solution you have to offer somebody. Like it's, it's selfish if you don't sell it. Yeah, I, I'm certainly not gonna add to that. It's beautifully said. So, where can people find more of Dawn Damico, ladies and gentlemen? The, the easiest place where I spend the most time, I'm on Facebook, right at Dawn damico. Same thing with my LinkedIn and Instagram. Those are probably the best places to find me. Okay, and we'll put the links in the show notes. This has been a blast. Thank you. I am going to ignore the refrigerator, calling my name in the middle of the night. But yeah, this has been super helpful and appreciate you coming on the Sales Made Easy show. You made sales sound easy, Don. So thanks again. It's great stuff. Thank you.