Balancing Art and Business

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Hello, hello everyone, you are listening to The Success Palette,

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a place to discuss how creatives can succeed in every aspect of our lives.

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I'm your host Soda and today I invited Daniel Maluka to help me discuss how

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to find a balance between being your authentic creative self,

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but also tapping into that business aspect of being a creative entrepreneur.

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Daniel, do you want to start off talking a little bit about your artistic journey,

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how you got into art, poetry, all of these creative outlets that you have?

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So I've been writing and drawing my whole life, basically.

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I started at first because of Dragon Ball Z. When I was a little kid,

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watching that show had a pretty profound impact on me.

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I always I always wanted to draw as a result of that show, drawing the characters that I would see.

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I realized it wasn't necessarily just the characters that I liked,

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but it was also the branching storylines and how you were following the lives

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of those individuals in addition to the action and the animation and the cartoon aspect of it.

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But I got a little older and I realized that like you didn't necessarily have

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to use like animation or comic books to tell a story through art.

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Discovering artists like Salvador Dali, Goya, Francis Bacon.

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I learned that you could tell stories through your artwork through like one-offs

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or like a one-off painting.

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You can do a lot of like symbolic things that do tell a story to the viewer.

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So that's sort of like what I started to do. I really, really carried that sort

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of narrative drive throughout my whole art journey.

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Started with Dragon Ball Z, then later getting influenced by some of the old

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masters, some famous painters, Basquiat, Picasso, Dali, Caravaggio,

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Francis Bacon. They're all pretty big influences on me.

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And in terms of the writing aspect, similar to the drawing aspect,

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it was through Dragon Ball Z, right?

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Because I love those stories that that creator was telling.

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Toriyama was his name. I really liked the stories he was telling in his manga

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and his comic book and in his actual show of Dragon Ball Z.

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So I said, I wanted to make my own type of story.

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So I was always writing and drawing and writing and drawing and writing and

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drawing and writing and drawing since I was younger.

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It was only through university that I started to take just poetry more seriously.

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The reason for that being was...

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In the creative writing class I had, my poetry teacher would give me higher

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marks in poetry than in short stories or anything.

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And I had asked him why, and he had simply said, oh, just the poetry is more interesting.

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So that kind of planted a seed in my mind to sort of like allow myself to go

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down that specific poetry avenue.

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So yeah, that's sort of how I started with the two of them.

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And I love that you really focus on the story aspect of it, because that is

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something that is so important for me.

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My dad is a photographer on the side and he would always tell me how when he

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takes photographs, he wants to show a story just in that one image.

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And that was so profound because I come from an animation background.

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So I think of story as this whole big thing, but it could really just one phrase,

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one small poem. I'm getting into poetry right now, kind of transitioning from

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art to poetry and so many similar aspects to it.

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But I also understand that we have to really make something that doesn't just

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inspire us, but inspires other people.

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How do you find that balance between doing what you want to create,

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but also something that you could make a living off of?

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Yes, that is a very good question. For me, I would say that that balance,

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for me, it's happened sort of like accidentally.

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I've had things that I've drawn that I haven't really thought anything about.

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Just like something I'm drawing, like maybe at 2 a.m., just a random thing.

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And someone will connect with it so profoundly, which has happened to me,

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that they ask to get it tattooed.

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They buy a print of it. They ask to get the thing tattooed that I drew.

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And there are other instances where it's like, I have two artworks of mine that are the most popular,

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and both of them sell pretty well on my end because I was really,

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really surrendering myself to the creative process.

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I didn't put as much of myself into the work.

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I sort of let the creative spirit, that creative energy, I sort of let it take

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over uncensored and then I would create that thing.

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And those are my two most popular ones. And I think the reason why they connect

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with people so much is because I wasn't trying to tell something specific about me, Daniel.

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I was more so sort of like...

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Trying to tap in without realizing, trying to tap in more to the collective

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unconscious and sort of like say what we're all thinking, display what we're all thinking.

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There was one illustration that I did that was also quite popular.

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I did sell a few prints of it. It was titled Lockdown.

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And it was of a woman. It's in black and white. It's basically,

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not black and white, it's more so in grayscale.

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It's a woman lying down on her bed and she's melting. And I had drawn this during

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lockdowns, especially in my country in Canada, our lockdowns are pretty severe.

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So when I had drawn that and when I had put that out, a lot of people related

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to it, a lot of people sort of tapped into it because they were feeling that same thing.

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So tapping into that collective unconscious is one way that I'm able to access the business side.

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The other way that I've been able to access the business side is just through a lot of networking.

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I'm lucky I live in a pretty creative city.

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It's a pretty artistic city, the place that I live. So my mind is always in

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tune and looking out for calls for submission, paid calls.

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We need an artist to do this. We need someone to do this logo.

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We need this. I have this idea. I need someone to help me brainstorm.

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I'm willing to pick any of those sort of calls for submission.

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I'm really, really tuned into, and I often apply to them.

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I recently applied to one.

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I forget the name of it, but if you are one of the artists selected,

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they pay you about $2,000 and your art goes up on big posters in the subway.

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Now, the reason why I submitted something to them is because,

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let's say, even if I don't get selected for that,

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the fact that I'm getting myself into the habit of figuring out what the theme

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is, drawing something to the theme, creating new work on a timeline that's relevant

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to that theme, and also writing a relevant artist statement and to go with it.

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So even if I don't win or even if I don't get self-selected,

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I'm getting myself comfortable and used to the idea of commercial work.

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As in someone has a very specific idea, a very specific thing that they want

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you to do, and there's a specific deadline.

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And now I'm a lot more comfortable with tapping into that and sort of getting into that zone.

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But I still allow myself to do the other side where I'm just vibing,

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letting my mind wander, drawing whatever I want.

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So I would say getting comfortable with responding to specific art calls is

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how I activate the business side.

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The networking aspect, being in the rooms, being in the positions,

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knowing the people who are most likely to need an artist to do something.

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That's sort of how I access the business side as well.

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And tapping into that sort of like unconscious sense when I am making my own

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artwork for like prints and such.

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So I would say that those are the three ways, if that makes sense.

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That absolutely makes sense.

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And what really I connected with was where you talked about tapping into this

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connection, this overall human experience that we all have.

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What are some ways that you've been able to do that? Is it through talking with just observing people?

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Is it just more of a spiritual thing? How do you know how to feel what others

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are feeling and what they're able to, what they need in their lives through

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your art and your poetry?

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I suppose it's, I suppose to answer this question, basically depends on like

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how weird you want to get.

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Basically, I guess that's my question, right?

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I'm a witch, so you could go as weird as you want. But I just love to hear people's,

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because I think it's so important to understand what the world is feeling because

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I believe in that collective energy.

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So that's why I was very intrigued when you brought that up.

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So I would say, yes, talking to people, being immersed, speaking to other creatives,

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seeing where those conversations go, letting yourself be open, I would say.

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Let yourself be a transmitter for that sort of energy.

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And one of the ways that I was able to get into that zone was to be not as intentional

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about some of the artwork I'd make.

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I'll give you an example. There was a point in time when I was really,

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really got back into drawing after a while of not doing it.

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And I was like sort of stumped. I was intimidated by big white pages.

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Like I didn't know what to draw. I didn't know how to start.

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So what I did was I would spill coffee on a page, wait for that to dry, come back to it.

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Then I would let sort of the coffee spills tell their own story.

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Story, surrendering my intention.

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I want it to look like this. It has to be good. It has to surrendering that

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intention and letting the artwork lead itself.

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Right. So that's one of the ways because I let the artwork lead.

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I'm not as like ego driven in the things that I create. Right.

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And another way that it happens and I have like I've had like a theory on this.

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I think all All artists, and I know you would agree with this as a creative,

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all artists, all creatives, we are ahead.

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By that, I mean our tastes are ahead. The things that we're into are ahead.

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And usually we're so ahead of the general curve of what people like, what people are into.

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We're so ahead of what's in, what's popular.

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We're so ahead of what's going to resonate with people that usually people have to catch up to us.

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Whenever I go on Instagram and you see like those art aggregator accounts and

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they're reposting art from other artists whenever I click the artist's actual

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name to see the artist page themselves that piece of artwork that the aggregator

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account is reposting it's usually old.

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You usually have to go down a lot of pages to get to where the artist first posted it.

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But that aggregator is picking it up and it's so popular and it's getting reposted

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usually a year later, years later.

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And the reason for that being is I think that creative people are so ahead of

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the general curve, our tastes are that ahead, that usually others have to sort of catch up to us.

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So I think as long as you keep that in mind, as long as you as a creative are

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tapped into what excites you, what's an idea you had that you can't wait to draw?

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What's something, a sensation that came to mind that you can't wait to put into words in a poem?

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A feeling that comes to mind that you can't wait to show visually?

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Go down the avenue go

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down the path of those creative urges those

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sensations those fragments of inspiration that

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get you the most excited because those things that are getting you the most

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excited those are the things that maybe a year maybe two years later those are

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the things that are going to resonate the most i would say like my my most popular

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artwork is this illustration called The Black Rose.

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I first sketched that in 2017.

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But it is so popular now. It has been so popular over the more recent few years

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because I think that it's now in.

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When I had first drawn it, I was ahead. But now the collective taste is catching up to it.

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So I think that trusting yourself, having the confidence to know that any weird

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idea, any weird thing that you ever want to draw, that there's a reason why

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your mind is letting you go there. Listen to that inner voice.

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Don't censor it and really tap in. I think that's how you get to the point where

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you're not just creating things that are agreeing with the collective.

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You're creating things that people don't even know that they like yet, if that makes sense.

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They're going to catch up with your tastes eventually. eventually.

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That was beautiful and something I personally really needed to hear because

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a lot of us tend to put ego way too high up.

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We focus so much on how many likes that we have, how many are we keeping up with these trends?

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We're told to constantly keep up with trends, but by the time that we get to

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the trend, it's over what you are saying and focused on what can can I do that

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can inspire people to want to buy my art and so focused on that.

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And while it's important to make money as an artist so we can have the funds

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to live, when we focus too much on that, we kind of put our ego really high up.

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What are some ways that you're able to kind of humble yourself to not let your ego take over?

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Because when that's the art that tends to be most successful when you really

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are able to put your ego aside.

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That's very, very true what you just said. The art that's the most successful

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is when you put your ego aside.

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I think that every artist sort of like deep down feels like a bit of a fraud.

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Deep down, you feel that imposter syndrome. Deep down for you,

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as an artist, as a creative, it's insane.

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For me, for example, it blows my mind even to this day. This happened a few years ago, pre-COVID.

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I just drew something randomly at 3 a.m. My friend of mine connected with it

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so much, she bought a print of it, she got a tattoo on her leg.

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Like, that is crazy to me.

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Like, I don't know why she did that. I don't know why it connected with her so much.

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But I know that I drew that thing. It came from me. It came from my mind.

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But the things that I draw that resonate the most with people,

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they don't even feel like I did them, weirdly enough.

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I feel like I'm a bit of like a transmitter for something else.

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Else so for me my ego is always in check

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because the way that i feel is like the artwork

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that i'm the most intentional about that i'm being the most specific

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that's the most planned where i'm saying i want to give this i

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want to say this i want this symbol i want it to mean this

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i want people to feel this the one where i'm being the most heavy-handed

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and directed with it that's the art that tends

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not to be as popular the art where i'm sort of

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like giving up control and letting go

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and like sort of not leading with

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i want to say this daniel i want to like that's the

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art that tends to be the most popular so for me my

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ego is always in check because in the back of my mind i

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know man like i drew this by accident and it's very popular i did this one unintentionally

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and it's very popular versus the ones that i like feel are the most by me by

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daniel those ones tend not to pop as much however the The ones that I feel that are the most by me,

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that have the most Daniel in them,

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I have a personal connection with them.

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I love them more than any of the others.

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There's one that I drew, there's a self-portrait I drew because I was drawing

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a lot digitally at the time and I wanted to get that tactile feeling back.

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So I got this wooden block and I pinned a piece of paper to it and I was doing

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this on the actual page to draw the self-portrait.

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Like really, really like rapidly moving my arm around, getting that like sensation.

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Putting a lot of energy into the work.

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And that's one of my favorites, if not the favorite thing that I've drawn.

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Does anyone else like it? No. Do I care? No. I like that one because I know

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how I felt when I was doing that.

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I'd say that that's how the ego is in check for me.

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That's one of the ways that I know deep down the most popular ones that I've

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done are the ones that are not as directed by me.

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Another way that my ego is in check, it's just like I'm always looking at other

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art from other artists, and the technical level that some people are able to achieve is insane to me.

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My technique is okay. I don't think I'm the most technical, the most accomplished

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artist in terms of technique.

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I think that my concepts are a lot stronger than my technique, personally.

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But when I see artists who are able to draw in perfect perspective and do all

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of this and do all of that,

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and people who are able to render so well when they paint, and people who have

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these giant canvases, and they can do all of those things, that humbles me as well.

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That sort of reminds me, hey, there's a long way to go.

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This is a lifelong journey. And that's one of the things I always keep in mind,

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that I'm never going to reach a point where even 30 years from now,

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if I keep drawing, which I will, I'm never going to reach a point where I say,

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okay, yes, I'm now a master artist. Now I'm done.

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No, you're always going to be learning more.

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There's always new techniques to try, new mediums to try, new subject matter to explore. Lord.

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There's always ways to push yourself.

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And I feel if an artist feels as though they're now a master artist and their

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ego is out of control, I just think that you're being dishonest with yourself personally.

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Have you read the book, Ego is the Enemy?

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By who? I'm trying to remember. I've been reading it.

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So that's what a lot of these principles started making me think of because

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Because not just with the art and writing aspect, I'm sure it's very similar with your poetry,

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but I'm thinking of when with the financial aspect of how sometimes when we

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do get higher pay for an art or higher audience,

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higher recognition, obviously we want to be proud of ourselves when we do something well.

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But sometimes we get so obsessed with these numbers of prices and followers and everything.

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I'd love to hear some of the ways that you are able to kind of focus on that,

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understand that, but also understand that that doesn't mean your value is more

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significant than maybe someone else.

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I would say a good thing to keep in mind, especially for a platform like Instagram.

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Instagram is always going to show your post that have your face in it to more

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people than it is any artwork that doesn't have a face in it.

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The way that the application is programmed, it favors posts with human faces in it, for one.

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So I've got a lot more likes with a gallery post where I'm standing there next to something.

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And it's not because that artwork is my best one. It's because literally the

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algorithm is showing the post to more of my followers because my face is in it.

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So I think it's important to keep in mind the actual limits of the platforms that we're using.

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The other thing that I keep in mind that doesn't get me fixated on numbers,

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even outside of social media, I feel as though that life can feel out of control sometimes.

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We can't control our circumstances, right? We can't control where we were born.

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We can't control who our parents were. We can't control our cultural background.

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They're just things that in this reality were given to us, right?

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I feel as though writing, artwork, creativity, that's like the one realm.

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That's the one of the one arena of where we have total control,

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where we can do whatever we want. So it's like, I don't let myself get caught

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up with, oh, this one is selling.

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I should make more things that look like this. Oh, this seller should make more.

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Because my thought process always comes down to the baseline of,

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this is one of the only places where I can do whatever I want.

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I'm not going to let this sale or the popularity of this artwork or anything

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else influence the aspect that if I want to just wake up one day and for weeks

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just paint red dots on white paper,

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and that's the only thing I do for weeks, I have that ability.

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I have that freedom. I'm not restricted by anything.

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I'm not contained by anything. So because of that, all of the numbers and the

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algorithms and the likes and sales, it's not relevant to me.

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Because I know, like myself, I know that I would be drawing,

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I would be creating stuff, I would be writing, if no one was watching.

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If no one was interested, I'd still be doing it. Because I'm not doing it for anyone but myself.

296
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Right. Like maybe that's a bit selfish.

297
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I don't know. But if I'm not interested in the thing that I'm illustrating,

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if I'm not interested in the thing that I'm writing, I'm not going to do it

299
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because I have to be like I was saying earlier.

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I have to be excited to do it, excited to create, excited to go for it.

301
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And as long as I have that feeling, I let myself engage in that sense of play.

302
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So in a sense, I am a little bit in a bubble by design.

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For example, I don't know what is in the art world right now. I have no idea.

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And I don't care because I'm here to do whatever it is I want.

305
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Whatever weird pathway my brain wants to go down, that's sort of like what I do.

306
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So I think my whole creative process, it's not really tied to like external

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numbers or external validation, I'd say.

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And, you know, something I feel from you is that you have a genuine love for

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humanity and that you genuinely want to inspire people.

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And when you have that desire, then you have an unselfish way of creating,

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even if it's for yourself, because you want to bring joy to the world.

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And I think that that is so beautiful.

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And I know that your poetry, I'm sure, is a lot like that, too.

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Do you want to talk a little bit about how you got into writing a book for your poetry?

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Because you mentioned a little bit how you first experimented with it.

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But what made you want to write a whole book that I believe is coming out in

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June, right? Or July? Yes.

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June of this year, June 2024.

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It's called Unwashed. So since like university, since like 2015,

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that was when I started taking poetry a lot more seriously.

321
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Like a lot of people, I wanted to be like a fiction writer, like a short story novel typewriter.

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In all the creative writing classes I've taken, it wasn't really like the short

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stories or the novels that any of the teachers were connecting with.

324
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It was actually the poetry.

325
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That was where I would get higher marks in. That was the work that they found the most interesting.

326
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So I would say I was sort of encouraged to take it more seriously after that point.

327
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I started going to more poetry readings around the city.

328
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I started to read more poetry. I started to let myself enjoy the granular details of language,

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really, really letting yourself, when you're writing something,

330
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have fun with the descriptors and the imagery and the metaphors and the things

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that you can do to give your writing tactility, to put someone in a location,

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to put an image in someone's mind.

333
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I really started to enjoy that I fell

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in love with that aspect of it so I would be writing here and there I had a

335
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few like writing groups I was in but I was always writing poetry because they

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were something I wanted to say they were feelings that I was going through for

337
00:25:04,233 --> 00:25:10,453
me it's like if I want to my writing and my poetry I usually do it when it's like,

338
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if I don't believe I have the technical ability to like draw or paint the thing.

339
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Then I'll just sort of like get into it with a poem so that the image is in

340
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each individual's mind visually rather than seeing it.

341
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And it's the same thing vice versa, right? If I'm not able, it's rare,

342
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but if I don't have the language or if I feel that the sensation I'm trying

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to put across would be stronger and like a painting, then I'll paint it.

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Over the years, I was always just writing poetry here, here and there,

345
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here and there. I had a bunch of poems from like 2015, 2014 on my computer, just on my hard drive.

346
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And I always wanted to write a book. It was always like a goal of mine.

347
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And I had thought that it would be like a novel, but I had realized that like

348
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my creative voice was sort of more suited to poetry. And I had a teacher who

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basically told me that like the art form chooses us.

350
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But sort of like really, really believed in that. And I said,

351
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let me just give myself into poetry. So I went through all of the.

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Poems I had on my hard drive. And I basically found the ones that were the least

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embarrassing. I said, okay, these ones are good.

354
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And I compiled them. I think I had about 30 pages.

355
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I had a lot of mentors. I went to a lot of conferences.

356
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I was really encouraged. I'm pretty lucky, I'd say, for the poetry aspect.

357
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I had a lot of people who saw my writing and encouraged me and put a battery

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in my back and really told me to pursue it.

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So I met with George Eliot Clark at this one conference, and he read through

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my manuscript at the time, just that 30-page one,

361
00:26:55,831 --> 00:27:02,011
which was all the poems to that date, pre-COVID, all the poems to that date

362
00:27:02,011 --> 00:27:04,031
that were on my computer. I just put them in a Word document.

363
00:27:04,511 --> 00:27:09,171
And he was so generous with his time. He sent me a PDF, an email.

364
00:27:09,291 --> 00:27:12,471
He's just like, these are different poetic exercises and forms.

365
00:27:12,471 --> 00:27:15,671
And he told me, he's like, your writing is suited to this form.

366
00:27:15,831 --> 00:27:20,351
Your writing is suited to this form. He's like, you should really do those and experiment.

367
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And I was glad to get that from him because if he didn't tell me about those

368
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different poetic forms and different techniques to diversify your writing, I wouldn't have known.

369
00:27:30,811 --> 00:27:34,471
I wouldn't have done them. So it was through his feedback, through feedback

370
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of others that I created the actual manuscript.

371
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Once I had the manuscript, then it was just a matter of sending it out to publishers.

372
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I didn't have an agent, which is pretty typical for poetry. Poets tend not to.

373
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So I was just writing my own query letters, just emailing publishers.

374
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It was a year and a few months, a year and five months. I got about six or five

375
00:28:00,911 --> 00:28:05,491
rejections and one publisher who said that they were that they wanted to move forward with it.

376
00:28:05,651 --> 00:28:09,491
So that's sort of how it came. It came about. Yeah.

377
00:28:10,051 --> 00:28:14,071
I am so glad that you mentioned all that.

378
00:28:14,191 --> 00:28:21,631
I'm going through a similar transition right now from art to actually songwriting is my new thing.

379
00:28:21,631 --> 00:28:27,891
That when you said sometimes you're called to do something else with the way that you create,

380
00:28:28,231 --> 00:28:33,391
like that was so powerful for me because I've been trying to force myself to

381
00:28:33,391 --> 00:28:38,131
express what I want to express through my art and it's just not coming through.

382
00:28:38,611 --> 00:28:45,231
And I felt silly kind of switching to songwriting when I've spent my whole life

383
00:28:45,231 --> 00:28:50,111
studying art, but I personally really needed to hear that.

384
00:28:50,231 --> 00:28:52,931
So I appreciate that insight.

385
00:28:53,351 --> 00:28:59,591
What are some of the major themes that you have noticed in both your writing and your art?

386
00:28:59,711 --> 00:29:05,511
And do they kind of correlate with each other or do you tend to have separate themes for each?

387
00:29:06,531 --> 00:29:08,851
This wasn't even something that I had noticed.

388
00:29:09,872 --> 00:29:14,212
In my artwork, this girl that I knew who had been following my artwork and my

389
00:29:14,212 --> 00:29:19,872
writing, we were at a party and she had told me that she sees a lot of thematic

390
00:29:19,872 --> 00:29:22,632
use of the body, of the human body in my artwork.

391
00:29:22,912 --> 00:29:27,912
And I didn't really notice that because I guess this is maybe the downside of

392
00:29:27,912 --> 00:29:30,632
my creative process. I'm a little bit too in it.

393
00:29:31,152 --> 00:29:35,432
I'm too much like this sometimes, just like my head deep in the bushes doing

394
00:29:35,432 --> 00:29:39,712
my own thing, not really taking a step back and seeing it as a whole.

395
00:29:39,872 --> 00:29:43,892
So I couldn't see all of those references to the body over the years.

396
00:29:43,992 --> 00:29:47,492
But when she said that, I said, yeah, that makes sense.

397
00:29:47,632 --> 00:29:50,832
There is a lot of references to the body in my artwork.

398
00:29:51,392 --> 00:29:54,972
There's a lot of references to the body in my writing as well.

399
00:29:54,972 --> 00:29:58,932
Well, in my visual work, I tend to do things, right?

400
00:29:59,012 --> 00:30:03,372
Like if I want to give across a feeling of powerlessness, maybe the figure will

401
00:30:03,372 --> 00:30:05,852
have no hand, something like that, right? That I draw.

402
00:30:06,132 --> 00:30:10,952
And as well with my writing, I'm thinking of a few lines that I've written where

403
00:30:10,952 --> 00:30:15,552
like the body is referenced and it's like either the body's being broken down

404
00:30:15,552 --> 00:30:21,192
or like to make a thematic point or like exaggerate something happening to the

405
00:30:21,192 --> 00:30:24,912
body to give a feeling emotionally to the reader.

406
00:30:25,252 --> 00:30:30,052
So I think that there is that interplay between the writing and the art in terms of the body.

407
00:30:30,512 --> 00:30:34,712
And in terms of the writing, I'd say a lot of the other themes,

408
00:30:34,852 --> 00:30:39,452
it's more so centered on heartbreak, like sadness, like.

409
00:30:40,462 --> 00:30:46,342
My artistic voice and visual art, it's not as sad as my voice is in writing.

410
00:30:46,902 --> 00:30:50,302
I've never been able to write an uplifting poem.

411
00:30:50,502 --> 00:30:53,422
I'm just not capable of it. When I sit down to write something,

412
00:30:53,582 --> 00:30:59,402
it just comes out as either really intense or really, really sad.

413
00:31:00,022 --> 00:31:05,302
That's just where my poetic voice is with the actual poetry.

414
00:31:05,302 --> 00:31:10,922
But I'd say in terms of both of them, my brain tends to see them as separate.

415
00:31:11,462 --> 00:31:15,722
I have experimented in the past where I'll draw something, then write a poem

416
00:31:15,722 --> 00:31:17,962
for it or the other way around.

417
00:31:18,122 --> 00:31:25,802
But I don't know. I feel as though if you're just transcribing images from your

418
00:31:25,802 --> 00:31:31,862
poem and your artwork, my brain kind of thinks like, you've already done this. You see what I mean?

419
00:31:31,922 --> 00:31:35,842
Like you've already shown the individual, the image with words.

420
00:31:36,002 --> 00:31:39,462
Why are you now showing the image again visually, right?

421
00:31:39,562 --> 00:31:44,142
Like I feel as though you're, and this is in my instance, I'm taking something

422
00:31:44,142 --> 00:31:49,322
away from the poetry if I want to draw scenes from a poem.

423
00:31:49,802 --> 00:31:54,462
Because it's like the whole idea is like you're trying to get the individual

424
00:31:54,462 --> 00:31:57,402
reading it to conjure those images in their own mind.

425
00:31:57,602 --> 00:32:01,782
Like why are you then showing it to them? Like, why are you being so prescriptive

426
00:32:01,782 --> 00:32:03,482
to be like, oh, this is what it looks like.

427
00:32:03,502 --> 00:32:06,682
It's like, no, like, just let it live on its own.

428
00:32:06,942 --> 00:32:12,162
And I think I sort of view the artwork the same way, weirdly enough. Yeah. Yeah.

429
00:32:13,462 --> 00:32:19,542
And it sounds like you put a lot of soul into everything that you create.

430
00:32:20,468 --> 00:32:26,008
And I know most of us do. We put so much soul and so much love and effort.

431
00:32:26,188 --> 00:32:33,068
And when it comes to selling it, it kind of feels like you're taking part of

432
00:32:33,068 --> 00:32:34,748
your soul and monetizing it.

433
00:32:34,828 --> 00:32:40,628
What are some ways that you can still feel good about selling something that

434
00:32:40,628 --> 00:32:42,488
you put so much soul into?

435
00:32:42,648 --> 00:32:46,908
What are some ways to rethink that kind of philosophy?

436
00:32:47,768 --> 00:32:51,708
That's a really good question. And I totally understand how it can feel like

437
00:32:51,708 --> 00:32:55,608
that, that you're selling out, you're selling pieces of yourself.

438
00:32:56,448 --> 00:33:02,648
But for me, my thought process is, no matter how personal the work is to you,

439
00:33:02,888 --> 00:33:07,128
as soon as you put it out, as soon as it's made public, it doesn't belong to you anymore.

440
00:33:07,668 --> 00:33:11,468
It's now a part of the public ecosystem it's now

441
00:33:11,468 --> 00:33:14,288
a part of the public consciousness like it's

442
00:33:14,288 --> 00:33:20,008
there it's a thing it exists in the world right like as soon as i make something

443
00:33:20,008 --> 00:33:24,368
and i put it out it's not mine anymore that's kind of how i view it like it's

444
00:33:24,368 --> 00:33:28,748
not anything that i'm precious about because it's like yeah like i made it and

445
00:33:28,748 --> 00:33:33,248
it's done like i made it it's gone i made it like like it's it It came from my mind,

446
00:33:33,268 --> 00:33:35,328
went through my body, went through my fingertips,

447
00:33:35,488 --> 00:33:40,068
went into my pencil or paintbrush onto the page, and now it's gone.

448
00:33:40,688 --> 00:33:44,928
I did it like it's by Daniel, but like, do I own it now?

449
00:33:45,148 --> 00:33:46,668
No, I wouldn't say that. I would

450
00:33:46,668 --> 00:33:52,888
say that like, I'm not precious about it because it's not mine anymore.

451
00:33:53,068 --> 00:33:55,268
I don't know how else to say that, Beau.

452
00:33:55,888 --> 00:33:57,648
That really makes sense to me.

453
00:33:58,548 --> 00:34:04,528
Are there any specific situations that you have had to deal with where you had

454
00:34:04,528 --> 00:34:09,868
struggles with balancing the aspect, the business aspect and the creative aspect?

455
00:34:10,008 --> 00:34:13,428
And what are some ways that you were able to overcome that?

456
00:34:14,208 --> 00:34:18,828
Because I have a full-time job, right? Like I'm in a field that's not creative.

457
00:34:19,628 --> 00:34:24,208
That's how I make my money. But outside of that, I'm like always engaging in

458
00:34:24,208 --> 00:34:27,188
like art, making art, writing poetry, writing in general.

459
00:34:27,188 --> 00:34:35,148
So I'd say that what I do to avoid that feeling is I'm a lot better with how I structure my time.

460
00:34:35,708 --> 00:34:40,928
Last year has been the most fulfilling year for me artistically. It was amazing.

461
00:34:41,388 --> 00:34:44,068
I'm very grateful for everything that happened to me last year.

462
00:34:44,848 --> 00:34:48,288
And this year is the same. But with how busy things have been,

463
00:34:48,468 --> 00:34:55,048
I actually have to use a personal calendar now to schedule, okay,

464
00:34:55,508 --> 00:34:59,308
this day is going to be a day where I let myself make the artwork.

465
00:34:59,588 --> 00:35:06,388
This day, Sundays at around 3, 4 p.m., that's my art admin day.

466
00:35:06,528 --> 00:35:11,408
That's my portrait admin day. By that, I mean I'm doing all of the stuff to

467
00:35:11,408 --> 00:35:15,468
support the art stuff that are not creative, like sending out emails,

468
00:35:15,828 --> 00:35:22,468
applying for grants, applying for shows, submitting calls to submission, editing poetry,

469
00:35:22,948 --> 00:35:28,288
submitting poetry to different calls, trying to get into readings,

470
00:35:28,548 --> 00:35:30,808
trying to get noticed by, et cetera, et cetera.

471
00:35:30,968 --> 00:35:35,288
Like all of the stuff that's more the non-creative business side,

472
00:35:35,388 --> 00:35:37,368
I actually schedule that time out.

473
00:35:38,128 --> 00:35:42,248
So that my mind doesn't feel guilty when I am creating.

474
00:35:42,368 --> 00:35:45,188
Thinking like, oh, I should respond to this email because my mind knows,

475
00:35:45,288 --> 00:35:48,768
oh, I have a day set up for that. It's fine. When that day comes, I'll do it. Boom.

476
00:35:49,308 --> 00:35:54,648
So that's sort of how I separate them. But I'd say that there have been days

477
00:35:54,648 --> 00:35:57,128
where you come home from work and you're tired.

478
00:35:57,888 --> 00:36:03,348
And you have so many art things that have piled up, so many writing things that

479
00:36:03,348 --> 00:36:05,068
have piled up that you have to respond to.

480
00:36:05,068 --> 00:36:10,848
And it can feel like sort of like having two jobs it can feel like that right

481
00:36:10,848 --> 00:36:14,828
like i've definitely had days where i was just like why am i even doing this

482
00:36:14,828 --> 00:36:16,928
like what's the point like i'm not making.

483
00:36:17,768 --> 00:36:24,288
Money consistently from it it's draining my energy like why am i doing it but

484
00:36:24,288 --> 00:36:29,348
the thing that sort of keeps me balanced the thing that sort of keeps me consistent

485
00:36:29,348 --> 00:36:34,728
is realizing oh no i'm doing it because I love it. I love this.

486
00:36:34,988 --> 00:36:41,408
This is what I feel like I'm here for. This is part of what my purpose is.

487
00:36:42,288 --> 00:36:49,488
I love this so much that I'm willing to sacrifice time after work for it.

488
00:36:49,728 --> 00:36:55,288
I'm willing to lose sleep over it because I love it. And that love,

489
00:36:55,348 --> 00:36:57,228
that joy, that excitement from it,

490
00:36:57,954 --> 00:37:05,234
It's worth structuring your life around. That's how I feel. I completely, absolutely agree.

491
00:37:05,854 --> 00:37:11,714
And a lot of us do have to work full-time jobs while we write our book or make

492
00:37:11,714 --> 00:37:14,594
our music or create our art.

493
00:37:15,074 --> 00:37:20,074
And some people feel ashamed of that, that they aren't doing this full-time.

494
00:37:20,074 --> 00:37:29,774
How do you really embrace your inner artist when you do have to have that full-time

495
00:37:29,774 --> 00:37:33,734
job working something that is not artistic?

496
00:37:33,934 --> 00:37:40,454
And are there any ways that you could actually benefit from not being a full-time creative?

497
00:37:41,274 --> 00:37:46,774
I definitely think that there are ways you can benefit. There's a video that I saw.

498
00:37:47,214 --> 00:37:52,814
It's by this sculpture artist, this African-American guy.

499
00:37:52,954 --> 00:37:56,334
I think he's living in America right now. His name is Leonardo Drew.

500
00:37:57,194 --> 00:38:02,354
This video changed my life. Changed my life. It's just like a four-minute clip.

501
00:38:02,514 --> 00:38:06,534
I can find it and send it to you after. he was just talking about his traveling

502
00:38:06,534 --> 00:38:10,334
and whatever and he said that he used to be of the mindset where it's just like

503
00:38:10,334 --> 00:38:14,914
i have to be in the studio all the time i have to be painting all the time i

504
00:38:14,914 --> 00:38:20,134
have to be engaged in my artwork all the time allusion he used to be in that sort of like,

505
00:38:20,874 --> 00:38:26,134
all-consuming sort of mindset he said that he was on a plane in japan he said

506
00:38:26,134 --> 00:38:30,154
that he realized he's like oh he realized he's like i actually don't have to

507
00:38:30,154 --> 00:38:33,554
be in the studio all the time it's like Like, even if I'm not making art,

508
00:38:33,614 --> 00:38:36,734
if I'm playing with my nephews, if I'm on this plane,

509
00:38:37,014 --> 00:38:40,574
if I'm doing something, if I'm at work, the art is happening within me.

510
00:38:40,894 --> 00:38:43,394
The art's happening within my body regardless.

511
00:38:44,274 --> 00:38:50,194
Like, that insight from him changed my whole perspective because I used to be

512
00:38:50,194 --> 00:38:53,654
of that same mindset where it's like, oh no, you have to be doing it all the time.

513
00:38:54,134 --> 00:38:57,454
But you literally don't. Like, think about it, right? Like.

514
00:38:58,170 --> 00:39:01,450
I'm sure you can relate. You've probably had times in your life when you're

515
00:39:01,450 --> 00:39:02,550
not being creative, when you're

516
00:39:02,550 --> 00:39:06,290
not making things, but magically you always end up going back to it.

517
00:39:06,410 --> 00:39:12,490
It always comes back. And the reason why it always comes back is because this is your calling.

518
00:39:12,730 --> 00:39:18,090
This is your thing. So you don't have to always be tapping into the well and

519
00:39:18,090 --> 00:39:22,010
drawing every day and really, really grinding and going crazy.

520
00:39:22,890 --> 00:39:29,370
You're going to burn yourself out doing that. And I know that when I'm going

521
00:39:29,370 --> 00:39:31,910
to work, when I'm at work, when I'm dealing with clients,

522
00:39:32,270 --> 00:39:35,470
when I'm going for a walk, when I'm whatever, all of that life,

523
00:39:35,670 --> 00:39:38,910
all of that life experience that we go through, frustration,

524
00:39:39,370 --> 00:39:47,690
anxiety, fears, worry, happiness, all of that is creating an alchemical concoction

525
00:39:47,690 --> 00:39:51,710
within us that is building the art.

526
00:39:51,710 --> 00:39:55,110
The art has to come from somewhere, right? It has to come from something.

527
00:39:55,330 --> 00:39:59,830
If you were isolated, living in a tower and you had no input,

528
00:39:59,950 --> 00:40:03,010
you had no stimuli, what art would you make?

529
00:40:03,790 --> 00:40:08,550
Where would your inspiration come from? So I'd say what I keep in mind is I

530
00:40:08,550 --> 00:40:12,430
know that regardless of what I'm doing, the art's happening within me.

531
00:40:12,630 --> 00:40:15,030
The other thing that I keep in mind is I'm.

532
00:40:15,698 --> 00:40:20,878
It's this one artist, I met him here in Toronto, and we were at an art show,

533
00:40:21,058 --> 00:40:25,878
and he said that he tried going full-time to be an artist, right?

534
00:40:26,318 --> 00:40:31,118
And he said that it warped his whole mindset, because this was his livelihood.

535
00:40:31,958 --> 00:40:35,858
It became like, if he didn't do this, he wouldn't eat, right?

536
00:40:35,938 --> 00:40:37,418
If he didn't sell, he wouldn't survive.

537
00:40:37,978 --> 00:40:42,318
So he said that his attitude, even at shows, when people would ask him,

538
00:40:42,378 --> 00:40:46,478
oh, what is this painting about, whatever? He said whenever strangers would

539
00:40:46,478 --> 00:40:49,798
approach him, his mindset would immediately be like, what a waste of time.

540
00:40:49,898 --> 00:40:50,798
This guy's not going to buy.

541
00:40:51,498 --> 00:40:58,438
So already, his mindset is warping the interaction because there's too much pressure on it.

542
00:40:58,558 --> 00:41:01,418
There's too much pressure on it. and that's why

543
00:41:01,418 --> 00:41:04,818
like i wouldn't want to go like full-time because

544
00:41:04,818 --> 00:41:07,718
this is my baby like i love it

545
00:41:07,718 --> 00:41:12,158
like i don't want to fall out of love with it by forcing myself to put economic

546
00:41:12,158 --> 00:41:17,198
pressure on it that same artist he he stopped doing full-time he did interior

547
00:41:17,198 --> 00:41:21,698
design and then did his art on the side and he said it was perfect he said that

548
00:41:21,698 --> 00:41:26,138
like that was the balance that he needed and me and him are similar, right?

549
00:41:26,218 --> 00:41:31,978
Like I know myself, I would have that same attitude he had if I went full time with it.

550
00:41:32,398 --> 00:41:38,218
I'd approach every interaction with that same amount of like hostility because I would get frustrated.

551
00:41:38,678 --> 00:41:41,758
Just like, oh, I'm doing this, I'm doing that. This person's not buying,

552
00:41:41,858 --> 00:41:46,378
this person's not like, it's turning this thing that should be your passion

553
00:41:46,378 --> 00:41:50,998
into something where it's like, if you're not giving me money for it, then what's the point?

554
00:41:51,118 --> 00:41:55,998
So I think that like those are the two two things that I do to keep myself balanced, right?

555
00:41:56,058 --> 00:42:01,538
Like I protect it from the capitalist power structures that we live in.

556
00:42:01,618 --> 00:42:06,298
And I also sort of know that you don't have to be creating all the time to be

557
00:42:06,298 --> 00:42:08,618
creating and quotes, you know?

558
00:42:08,938 --> 00:42:11,918
I love that answer. And I completely agree.

559
00:42:12,478 --> 00:42:19,778
What is something that you wish every artist who's wanting to create an art

560
00:42:19,778 --> 00:42:23,438
business, Maybe in addition to what you were just talking about,

561
00:42:23,618 --> 00:42:28,698
would know that would help them become more successful as an artist?

562
00:42:29,438 --> 00:42:32,858
Not to get too meta, but I would say know what you don't know.

563
00:42:33,730 --> 00:42:40,350
Know the things you're not good at. In terms of like making a business plan, making a budget.

564
00:42:42,350 --> 00:42:46,250
Marketing, graphic design, advertising, I don't know how to do those things.

565
00:42:46,550 --> 00:42:48,030
I'm not good at those things.

566
00:42:48,730 --> 00:42:55,410
I'm not going to then force myself and bully myself and shame myself for not knowing those things.

567
00:42:55,970 --> 00:42:59,970
I'm going to, if you're lucky enough, to lean on people in your your life who

568
00:42:59,970 --> 00:43:01,970
have those skills and ask for help.

569
00:43:02,350 --> 00:43:04,450
I would say, know what you don't know.

570
00:43:04,970 --> 00:43:06,850
I know myself pretty well at this point.

571
00:43:07,430 --> 00:43:12,150
I'm not going to learn how to code my website. It's just not going to happen.

572
00:43:12,250 --> 00:43:13,530
I tried it. It's not going to happen.

573
00:43:13,950 --> 00:43:17,270
So I lean on people who I can go to for support.

574
00:43:17,590 --> 00:43:22,430
I would say being humble enough to ask for help, being humble enough to lean

575
00:43:22,430 --> 00:43:26,350
on people for support, and being wise enough to steal.

576
00:43:26,770 --> 00:43:31,810
By steal, I mean, if you know an artist And for example, like there's an artist

577
00:43:31,810 --> 00:43:34,190
I know, she has like a content calendar.

578
00:43:34,750 --> 00:43:38,350
What she does is anytime she has like multiple shows in a month,

579
00:43:38,450 --> 00:43:45,030
she'll post like an animated calendar and she'll circle and then note down what

580
00:43:45,030 --> 00:43:47,490
the shows are for each thing. That's brilliant.

581
00:43:48,130 --> 00:43:52,550
That's brilliant. That's an easy way to remind everyone in one go of all the

582
00:43:52,550 --> 00:43:54,110
things that you have coming up in a month.

583
00:43:54,550 --> 00:43:59,270
And I would steal that. I would do that too because it's smart. You know what I mean?

584
00:43:59,390 --> 00:44:05,190
So like lean on the people who know more than you and don't be afraid to steal

585
00:44:05,190 --> 00:44:09,110
if you see someone doing something that makes sense, I'd say.

586
00:44:10,126 --> 00:44:16,526
I absolutely do that. My main core group, my main support group is not an artist group.

587
00:44:16,586 --> 00:44:19,546
It's actually a networking group called Women Into Networking.

588
00:44:19,566 --> 00:44:26,306
And we are just all about sharing what helps us be successful and really learning

589
00:44:26,306 --> 00:44:28,266
from each other. So that was perfect.

590
00:44:28,586 --> 00:44:33,406
It's unreasonable to expect one individual to be an expert on everything.

591
00:44:33,746 --> 00:44:38,226
It doesn't make sense. I think that the smartest people, the most successful

592
00:44:38,226 --> 00:44:41,226
people, they know what their capacity is.

593
00:44:41,306 --> 00:44:44,966
And for things that are outside of their scope, they delegate. Yes, delegation.

594
00:44:45,246 --> 00:44:51,606
I think it's important to learn the very basics of things, the very basics of what is SEO?

595
00:44:51,906 --> 00:44:57,766
What are all these things? But you don't need to become an expert in them.

596
00:44:57,886 --> 00:45:02,286
And if you can't afford to hire an expert, there's always bartering.

597
00:45:02,446 --> 00:45:07,066
There's always ways that you can work with others who are expert and actually,

598
00:45:07,086 --> 00:45:11,006
for some reason, love doing social media things or whatever it is,

599
00:45:11,026 --> 00:45:12,146
building websites. sites.

600
00:45:12,426 --> 00:45:19,546
So that is what I want to see more of in the art community and the writing and music, whatever it is.

601
00:45:19,706 --> 00:45:22,326
So I'm so glad that you brought it up.

602
00:45:22,606 --> 00:45:28,166
And did you have any final thoughts? And also, what are some ways that people

603
00:45:28,166 --> 00:45:33,866
can find you, can find your book, can find any other social media outlet of yours?

604
00:45:34,666 --> 00:45:40,606
Okay, so you could go on danielmaluca.net. That's my website.

605
00:45:40,606 --> 00:45:48,686
Site, d-a-n-i-e-l-a-l-u-k-a.net, right there on my homepage.

606
00:45:49,086 --> 00:45:52,646
You can put your email in to get on the email list.

607
00:45:53,526 --> 00:45:59,406
Once I have any updates or info about the book titled Unwashed coming 2024,

608
00:45:59,926 --> 00:46:02,646
June, maybe later, but yeah, 2024 for sure.

609
00:46:02,866 --> 00:46:06,206
Once I have any updates on that, once you put your email in,

610
00:46:06,286 --> 00:46:07,746
you will receive those updates.

611
00:46:08,086 --> 00:46:13,826
I'm also on Instagram. My Instagram handle is whatdanieldrew,

612
00:46:13,966 --> 00:46:19,786
so W-H-A-T, the first name Daniel and the D-R-E-W.

613
00:46:19,786 --> 00:46:23,126
The book is coming out June 2024.

614
00:46:23,566 --> 00:46:26,706
It's called Unwashed. It's a collection of poetry.

615
00:46:27,066 --> 00:46:32,406
The subject matters on alienation, growing up, the immigrant experience.

616
00:46:33,006 --> 00:46:36,086
A loss of innocence, you know, all that fun stuff.

617
00:46:36,446 --> 00:46:41,326
So yeah, I'd say those are the best places to reach me at. Perfect.

618
00:46:41,446 --> 00:46:44,146
And I will put all of those links down below.

619
00:46:44,326 --> 00:46:49,726
Please check out Daniel. He has some amazing work and some even more amazing

620
00:46:49,726 --> 00:46:51,286
stuff coming up in the future.

621
00:46:51,466 --> 00:46:55,486
So thank you so much for meeting up with me today, Daniel.

622
00:46:55,486 --> 00:46:59,346
Thanks for tuning in to this week's episode of The Success Palette,

623
00:46:59,426 --> 00:47:05,046
where we talked about balance of being your creative, authentic self,

624
00:47:05,226 --> 00:47:11,086
your business strategy, and also how ego plays a part in all of that.

625
00:47:11,466 --> 00:47:17,746
If you would like to listen to more bonus episodes or check us out on social

626
00:47:17,746 --> 00:47:21,586
media, please go to thesuccesspalette.com.

627
00:47:21,726 --> 00:47:26,406
And please, let's make it a successful week. See you next time.