Uncovering Hidden Truths: Conversations with the Other Side With Suzanne Munson [PART 1]

Transcript

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he roams the halls of Congress that once were sacred and he sees corruption, self interest, greed, and, um, lack of ethics.

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she'll say sometimes that I'm surrounded by light or that I'm very busy or whatever.

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she said that my, our guy, we all have guides on the other side.

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my guides are.

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That she's hearing something about me, but they're saying, that I'm a metaphysical historian.

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welcome to the new age human podcast.

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I'm your host, John Astacio.

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Our guest is Suzanne Munson, who is an author and historian who has broke new ground in her concept of metaphysical history from traditional biographies of traditional founding fathers to connecting with the afterlife.

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Suzanne's work is a real eye popping, eye popper, eye opener.

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So stick around for the whole episode because we do mention her transition from a traditional historian to a metaphysical historian, communicating with the late Thomas Jefferson's thoughts on today's world including confirming conspiracy theories, real life ghostbusters.

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Just gonna leave it at that.

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And at the very end, overall advice on what to do with this information.

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Now before we begin, if you like the show...

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Share with a friend, hit that like subscribe button on YouTube, and if you want to join the conversation, you can always go to Telegram, and if you want to communicate with me, you got some questions, you can either do in the community on Telegram, or just shoot me an email, just go to newagehuman.

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com.

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Without further ado, let's get to the show, and get crazy.

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cool.

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Um, so I think it's really cool to have you on the show.

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So thank you for being on the show, Suzanne, welcome to the show.

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you.

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I'm excited to talk about your story and your experience as going from a traditional historian to a metaphysical historian.

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And I'm not used to hearing metaphysical and historian together.

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So it's interesting.

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Like, this is like something that I haven't dove into and I'm excited to talk about it.

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So, where to begin, right?

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Can we talk about, first, why you went from a traditional historian to a metaphysical historian?

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So that the audience can understand, like, that leap.

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Sure.

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Actually, I'm still both.

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I still write traditional history and I still complete, I won't say write, complete metaphysical history.

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So I try to have a distinction between those two.

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Well, it all started with the death of my husband about ten years ago.

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Um, and also leaving the working world.

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I finally decided I could do that and stay home and write.

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And so I was just, the day I handed in my resignation, I said, I can finally write this book that I've been dying to write.

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And it was a biography of a founding father, Thomas Jefferson's mentor, George Wythe, and it's titled, uh, Jefferson's Godfather.

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So anyway, I went to work on that as soon as I retired.

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Uh, but then around that time, my husband died, and that began my metaphysical path.

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And, um, I wanted to know where he went, you know, I, I would go outdoors and I would say, you know, or look at the stars and I'd say, where are you?

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I'm not hearing anything.

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All I was getting was like crickets, you know?

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And so, yeah, literally.

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And so, um, I've always been curious about.

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Spiritual matters.

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I don't like to use the word spiritual, uh, because it has a heavy religious connotation and I try to stay away from religion in my metaphysical studies, although the great truths are embedded in the great religions that I did find that out, but about love and the divine energy that rules the universe.

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All that.

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But, uh, so anyway, um, yeah.

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So I wasn't hearing anything from my husband.

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So I went to a writing retreat up in the country.

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And, uh, those who had published books were encouraged to put their books out for others to see.

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And so I saw this book and it was called, um, Friends in High Places.

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And it was written by a ghostbuster and a medium.

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There's also a poet who had published a number of books, she's very well regarded.

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And, um, so, I was really lonely then, it was only six months after my husband died.

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And so I said, um, Katie, you're a medium.

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She said, I'm an amateur medium, I don't get paid for it.

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And I said, um, do you, could you channel my husband?

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And she said, yeah, probably, what's his name?

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So I just gave her his name.

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I didn't say, give her any details.

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She went in her room, came back about a half hour later and, uh, described him perfectly.

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You know, she had never met him.

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She'd never heard me talk about him.

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Um, so I came home and told my children about it.

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And of course they thought I was nuts.

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And, um, you know, they were incredulous.

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They were not going to believe.

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Um, so then some time went on and I belong to this organization called the Institute of Noetic Sciences, founded by astronaut Edgar Mitchell to bridge science and spirituality.

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And so we had a, uh, an author speak to us who had written a book about seven readings that she had gotten through a medium of readings with her late mother and late friends and others.

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And so she wrote this book, uh, with publishing the readings and it was, um, it, it won some national awards.

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It was very well regarded.

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And I thought, well, um, if this medium is so good, maybe I should call her.

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So, um, my.

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It was odd.

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It was an odd thing for me to do.

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She lives in Indiana.

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I live in Virginia.

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And I had to get my courage up to make an appointment because it was, you know, still in the weird category.

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And, um, so, uh, the way we handle our sessions is that You can buy a half hour of her time or an hour and always go for an hour.

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Um, she starts the recording right on the dot.

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She calls right on the dot.

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Starts the recording when we're ready.

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And then we have an hour.

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And then I, uh, I...

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Um, the first person I asked her to access was my late husband, and he came through really, really well with, with things that she could never have known about our family and our background.

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So, uh, that went on for a while.

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I didn't overdo it.

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I would, I would like go maybe twice a year.

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I'd have a session.

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Can I pause real quick?

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When he came through, he wasn't talking through her.

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It was more of like a dialogue with her with him.

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How did that happen?

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I never hear the person on the other side.

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Uh, I ask questions and, and the person on the other side hears them.

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In real time.

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And then, you know, immediately she's translating what she's getting, um, telepathically.

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Hmm.

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And I've talked to enough people on the other side that I know she gets their rhythms.

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Their little peculiarities.

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Um, and their speech patterns.

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Got it.

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Did that help you with closure?

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With, um, how everything happened?

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And like, connecting with him?

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In that way?

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Oh, very much so, yeah.

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My children still don't accept it.

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Even though he's been giving them lots of signs, he, he gives light shows to my daughter and really freaks her out.

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But,

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How does that work?

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A light show?

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see, all this is new to me, but I have learned that spirits can manipulate electricity to some extent.

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They can flicker lights and so on.

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And, uh, he's been giving her lots of light shows, but it just freaks her out.

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She just, you know, can't accept it.

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And everybody's like, no, it's just poor electricity.

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Like everybody's having electricity problems.

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Like it's not, what, what about the other kids?

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Um, what type of messages has, can you give an example?

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I'm very curious about the messages he gives them or like, does he, does he move stuff?

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Is it something beyond a flickering light?

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Oh, it's just with my daughter, uh, I don't think he does.

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I think with, with my son, our son, uh, if he sees that our son is very stressed out about life and business, he says that he tries to like whisper in his ear, you know, try to help him as best he can from where he is, but he doesn't put on any shows for him just for our daughter.

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No.

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no shows.

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So your daughter is the only one that pretty much feels like something's going on and has that connection.

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Is she the youngest?

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Yes.

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Okay.

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How old is she, if you

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She's in her mid thirties.

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Mid thirties.

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Okay, cool.

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And, and so, I did hear that, Well, you know, when you're younger, you're more susceptible and then as you get older, it's just kind of wears off as far as that belief or the openness to it.

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So it's a, it's pretty interesting how she's like, she's in her mid thirties, but she's still young and um, she's, she's, she's the youngest and she's the only one like enjoying the show.

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Right.

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Yeah, well I think she, He's really put on a show for her.

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And I think she, she thinks there's something to it.

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She went in his closet, and I still kept a lot of his clothes, And her husband needed a tie, and they went in his closet.

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And, uh, she said, Oh, this was Dad's favorite tie.

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Why don't you wear that?

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And then the lights started flickering, and they never flicker, those lights never flicker.

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So,

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That's pretty cool.

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You just mentioned him and he's like, yeah,

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Yeah, oh

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your conversation.

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I'm in your life

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he's around, spirits are around, you know, if they, if they like their family, you know, if they want to be near their family, they, they, they're around.

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Yeah.

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All

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So, uh when in your writings retreat, I definitely want to go back and highlight Ghostbuster I don't hear that term too often if outside of the movie Did you meet them?

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Did you get any clarity on what they do?

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As Ghostbusters.

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I mean, they bust ghosts.

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I guess they trap them or something.

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Can you

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No, it.

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It's a very generous kind thing that they do.

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Um, I, you know, a lot of people, you know, pretty sane people feel that they have seen ghosts or felt ghosts.

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I never have.

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I've never had that experience.

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Uh, I don't really have any personal paranormal experiences.

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You know, I just go through the medium to do what I need to do.

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But personally, I have no gifts.

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Although I've been told that I can train myself to be.

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Do some medium work, but I, I'd rather work through somebody else than not go to all that trouble.

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But, um, anyway.

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Oh, so the Ghostbusters, at least my friend and her group, they're in a, they were in Lexington, Virginia.

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She's deceased now, but they would go to, um, places that well, like battlefields, um, Um, they went to a battlefield one time and there was, according to them, I'm just repeating what was told me, um, there was a young, um, confederate soldier who had died there and, um, somehow he was not able to leave this plane that we live in, there's a, we're in a densely physical plane and then there are various other planes of different higher energy as you go on.

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Um, and so he was in kind of the, he was stuck in the, But he wasn't getting where he needed to go, and that's in the higher planes where, uh, spirits are supposed to go.

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And so he still thought that he was in the Civil War and that somebody was coming over the hill at any minute to either rescue him or kill him.

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And so they released him.

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They said, um, you're dead.

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You need to go on.

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Yeah.

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And so what they do is, um, you know, ghosts are, from what I hear, I don't know anything about myself, but they're stuck here and they need to be released.

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They need to go on where they're supposed to go, to the better place.

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and that's a repeating, um, conversation and thought pattern and belief and understanding that, right?

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Especially the traumatic, traumatic, traumatic, traumatic deaths.

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It's...

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You're stickier to this plane, right, or to a lower level, and then, um, as you are more heightened, I should say, elevated as a person during your waking life, when you do pass, you have access to the higher realms, and I think you are more choosing to help or explore, right?

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Well, and through this group, the IONS group, Institute of Noetic Sciences, I've met a lot of interesting people.

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And one of them, I'm not going to call him a ghostbuster, I don't know what to call him, but, he's actually, he and other people are actually facilitating, releasing some of the people from Auschwitz, and those horrible places where

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Wow.

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a lot of spirits are captured.

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They need to go on.

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And, it's interesting because, I mean, that type of work, it must be really rough.

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Really rough to just to be aware of the why that person that soul is still there and there must be a huge want and need in a pole to help the spirits.

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You can be a veteran veterinarian and just play with animals.

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You know, there's a lot of things you could do.

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So it's interesting how people find their niche and and just go for it passionately.

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Meanwhile, the people are freaked out about it.

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Exactly.

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Yeah.

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Yeah, so we were, you were continuing on with your communication with the mediums and communicating with your late husband.

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Um, I remember before we had a conversation prior to this, you mentioned that you were able to get in contact with some famous people.

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Can you highlight on that?

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Well, here was my thought.

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This is during COVID.

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Okay.

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And I had the medium gives me a reading, um, about where I am.

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Somehow she can do that.

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I don't know.

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I don't understand all that.

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And so, uh,

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Wait, wait, wait, what do you mean?

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So it's a remote interview or a remote conversation and she gives you information about where you are physically, like what's next to you, if you have tea or

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No, where I am, um, In my energy level, like, um, She'll say sometimes that I'm surrounded by light, or that I'm very busy, or whatever.

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Anyway, uh, she said that my, our guides, we all have guides on the other side.

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That's one thing I've learned.

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That my guides are, that she's hearing something about me.

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That they're saying, um, that I'm a metaphysical historian.

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Well, I'd never heard that term either, you know.

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But I wrote it down, because I write, I take very, very good notes, uh, from my readings.

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Uh, although I get a recording, but I, with my family, I never want to go back and listen to an hour's worth of recordings.

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So I always just really, really write as fast as I can.

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So I wrote that down.

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Anyway, um, so, but I didn't think much about it.

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And then my next session with her, it came back again.

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She said, you are being seen as a scribe.

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Um, you're, you're being seen as writing down very important things.

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I said, that's interesting.

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I wrote that down, didn't do anything about it.

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But then a thought occurred to me, well, hmm, maybe I, I don't know, maybe I should think about this.

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So I said, well, if I can contact, connect with regular, normal people, why not somebody famous?

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If I connect with ordinary people.

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And, um, so I said, well, I've written this book about Thomas Jefferson, I know a lot about him, but I have a lot of questions about him.

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And so maybe I'll ask for Thomas Jefferson.

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So, uh, I got up my courage to do that.

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Uh, I did not give the medium any advanced notice about who I wanted to contact, but apparently again, what I've learned, I don't know any of this myself is there's kind of like a green light on the other side when spirit knows that spirits know they're being thought about intensely.

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And, um, So there was kind of a green light with Jefferson, and he said, and she, she didn't blink an eye, and, um, and she is not an historian.

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She's, she majored in elementary education.

00:17:26.827 --> 00:17:33.167
She didn't know anything about Thomas Jefferson except that he was president and wrote the Declaration of Independence, and that's all she knew.

00:17:33.862 --> 00:17:35.392
so she said she connected with him.

00:17:36.576 --> 00:17:41.707
So I asked very politely if he would like to participate in this project with me.

00:17:42.707 --> 00:17:49.037
And, uh, the words that came through were, uh, well, your heart is in the right place.

00:17:49.076 --> 00:17:52.317
You're not doing it to make a lot of money or to be sensational.

00:17:52.487 --> 00:17:55.217
And yes, I think we can cooperate on this.

00:17:56.204 --> 00:17:56.674
Nice.

00:17:57.457 --> 00:18:03.166
And, um, so I used to have this, I've always been fascinated by Thomas Jefferson.

00:18:03.652 --> 00:18:18.852
I honestly had this fantasy for years and years and years that, um, I could dig him up from his resting place, and of course I'd have to clean him up and everything, but, um, and put him in my car and drive him around the University of Virginia that he founded.

00:18:18.902 --> 00:18:21.011
I mean, this sounds nuts, but, uh,

00:18:21.174 --> 00:18:21.984
What a visual.

00:18:22.487 --> 00:18:22.676
Yeah.

00:18:22.926 --> 00:18:31.067
Well, let's forget that part, but you know, his spirit would be in the car with me and, uh, that I drive him around the university that he founded.

00:18:31.106 --> 00:18:33.166
And I'd say, look at all the women here.

00:18:33.557 --> 00:18:34.527
Isn't that surprising?

00:18:34.527 --> 00:18:40.287
And look at these people of color and these people from Taiwan and whatever.

00:18:40.606 --> 00:18:41.876
Look how huge this is.

00:18:42.416 --> 00:18:43.686
And look at all the new buildings.

00:18:43.777 --> 00:18:52.881
Anyway, I found out in my readings with Jefferson is that, uh, When they leave, they, they're not stuck in that time in history.

00:18:53.411 --> 00:18:55.580
Uh, they know what's going on here.

00:18:56.461 --> 00:19:00.500
And that's why my book, The Metaphysical Thomas Jefferson, is so important.

00:19:01.030 --> 00:19:05.351
Because these are his insights about what's going on in Washington right now.

00:19:06.040 --> 00:19:09.230
And in the institutions of higher education, religion.

00:19:09.840 --> 00:19:11.441
Very down on organized religion.

00:19:11.441 --> 00:19:13.040
He was during his lifetime too.

00:19:13.711 --> 00:19:14.431
But, um.

00:19:15.161 --> 00:19:17.971
Um, yeah, just, uh, amazing insights.

00:19:18.010 --> 00:19:31.691
And, and then the other thing that I had to explain in the book, the book is called the metaphysical Thomas Jefferson, and it's a result of eight recorded one hour sessions with an entity who is presenting himself as

00:19:31.805 --> 00:19:36.724
Presenting himself as Thomason to Thomason,Thomas Jefferson.

00:19:36.934 --> 00:19:38.214
Well, okay.

00:19:38.214 --> 00:19:38.664
Continue.

00:19:38.815 --> 00:19:43.164
Were you gonna highlight, um, what he thinks about what's going on today?

00:19:43.861 --> 00:19:47.621
yeah, but first there are only three ways to look at that book.

00:19:48.151 --> 00:19:49.871
And I have this in the introduction.

00:19:49.971 --> 00:19:51.471
Number one is I wrote it.

00:19:51.891 --> 00:19:59.421
I have the recordings that clearly show, and I can send the recordings to anybody, that I'm the one asking the questions, not providing the answers.

00:20:00.090 --> 00:20:02.911
Number two is, uh, the medium made it all up.

00:20:03.280 --> 00:20:09.070
Well, she's not a, she doesn't speak at all like the words that came through.

00:20:09.611 --> 00:20:12.671
She's a very nice lady, but she's not an historian.

00:20:12.855 --> 00:20:14.194
You're like she's not that smart.

00:20:14.204 --> 00:20:17.015
No, no, she, she's not educated in the history.

00:20:17.015 --> 00:20:18.125
She's educated in other things.

00:20:18.125 --> 00:20:20.025
So it's, it's like, you know, her background.

00:20:20.025 --> 00:20:32.424
So the cool thing is you, you laid out the groundwork where you're like, you know, she's not just pulling stuff from her knowledge and just for lack of better words, BS ing you, Right.

00:20:32.476 --> 00:20:33.105
Exactly.

00:20:33.425 --> 00:20:41.445
And then the third, uh, option is that we are hearing from somebody who's presenting himself as Thomas Jefferson coming through the medium.

00:20:42.365 --> 00:20:43.445
So, take your pick.

00:20:44.046 --> 00:20:46.205
Um, I don't write like that.

00:20:46.326 --> 00:20:49.086
You know, my style of writing is very different.

00:20:49.516 --> 00:20:54.875
Had I written Jefferson's words, I would certainly not have used modern terminology.

00:20:55.226 --> 00:20:57.405
You know, I would have faked it like 18th century.

00:20:57.776 --> 00:20:58.165
Cadence.

00:20:58.865 --> 00:21:00.635
Um, I know better than that.

00:21:01.296 --> 00:21:08.526
And so, um, he used words like cash cow when we started talking about collegiate sports.

00:21:09.476 --> 00:21:24.536
I was asking him about University of Virginia, uh, and he did speak about the school that he founded, how it was, there was still some people there who were adhering to his original principles, but they were getting away from that.

00:21:24.775 --> 00:21:37.815
I'm actually, what's coming to my mind is I'm thinking about, um, The audience listening and what they are curious about and there's a lot of turmoil going on nowadays.

00:21:37.835 --> 00:21:45.244
I'm not sure when the last time you spoke to Thomas Jefferson, but was he talking about anything that's happening in society?

00:21:45.244 --> 00:21:48.875
That's just causing a lot of drama that he doesn't like.

00:21:48.914 --> 00:21:51.674
Like we're going away from the Constitution.

00:21:52.125 --> 00:21:53.355
Um, how does he feel?

00:21:53.704 --> 00:21:59.595
Or, you know, can you kind of go in that direction and his thoughts and his, his feedback?

00:22:00.375 --> 00:22:06.855
the recordings took place, uh, in the first months of 2020, as we were under COVID.

00:22:07.035 --> 00:22:07.394
Hmm.

00:22:07.996 --> 00:22:10.205
Um, this was right after January 6th.

00:22:10.765 --> 00:22:11.115
Okay.

00:22:11.836 --> 00:22:18.826
Um, his views were, I did ask him about Biden and Trump, but I'm not sharing that.

00:22:19.265 --> 00:22:20.095
Oh, man!

00:22:20.615 --> 00:22:22.016
No, no, not sharing that.

00:22:22.445 --> 00:22:26.945
And, uh, cause I didn't want anything in the book to be topical, you know.

00:22:28.000 --> 00:22:34.621
I want it to be universal, universal truths and not, um, geared to any particular time in history.

00:22:35.240 --> 00:22:35.901
And, um,

00:22:36.015 --> 00:22:40.815
So, so Thomas has an opinion on Biden versus Trump.

00:22:40.825 --> 00:22:42.954
He literally has an opinion though.

00:22:43.830 --> 00:22:44.931
he's aware of them.

00:22:45.800 --> 00:22:46.151
Yeah.

00:22:46.260 --> 00:22:48.451
He's, he's, he's, he's watching

00:22:48.785 --> 00:22:49.474
can, you know how...

00:22:50.109 --> 00:22:51.640
People say, Oh, what's going on right now?

00:22:51.640 --> 00:22:54.779
Like people like Thomas Jefferson would be rolling in their graves.

00:22:54.779 --> 00:22:55.470
Well, he's not rolling.

00:22:55.480 --> 00:23:02.470
He's roaming around and just judging and, and now having a conversation with you, which is great.

00:23:02.630 --> 00:23:19.440
Oh, we got to get into some type of like what he thinks about what's going on, even though it may be a little politically dividing, but I have faith in the audience that they are thinking with open minds and open to just a potential.

00:23:20.275 --> 00:23:34.654
being that claims he's Thomas Jefferson saying something and just digesting it out of interest whether it be entertainment or potential fact so you you have you have the doorway just let you know

00:23:35.621 --> 00:23:38.050
Well, um, I'm a student of government.

00:23:38.605 --> 00:23:54.226
Uh, my first book, Jefferson's Godfather, was really all about good government, about the man who, who got America off to the right start, George Wythe, by teaching 200 of our first leaders, not just to be public servants, but to be ethical public servants.

00:23:54.355 --> 00:23:58.375
So, ethical conduct in government is very, very important to me.

00:23:58.375 --> 00:24:00.516
I, I follow politics very carefully.

00:24:01.056 --> 00:24:02.175
So, the first questions...

00:24:02.750 --> 00:24:09.611
Oh, by the way, well, I had a bunch of questions for Thomas Jefferson, and I have, you know, just a number of different chapters, different subjects.

00:24:10.040 --> 00:24:18.770
But what I did was I went on Amazon, and I found, uh, living authors who were Jefferson scholars who published books about Jefferson.

00:24:19.381 --> 00:24:20.901
And I emailed them.

00:24:21.250 --> 00:24:25.010
Most of them are attached to universities, so you could get their university addresses.

00:24:25.010 --> 00:24:28.181
And I said, I presented it as a class project.

00:24:28.621 --> 00:24:38.431
I said, I have taught about the Jefferson legacy at the Chautauqua Institute and at, um, numerous, um, at the university level.

00:24:38.641 --> 00:24:41.050
So I sort of presented myself as a serious person.

00:24:41.151 --> 00:24:42.490
I didn't say what I was really doing.

00:24:43.050 --> 00:24:49.111
And so, uh, I said, if for a class project, future class project, here's the premise.

00:24:49.131 --> 00:24:53.191
If you could talk to Thomas Jefferson, what questions would you ask?

00:24:54.070 --> 00:24:56.931
So about eight of these scholars provided questions.

00:24:57.431 --> 00:24:59.570
Not knowing, you know, what I was going to do with them.

00:25:00.361 --> 00:25:03.401
And, um, so I added my own questions to theirs.

00:25:03.451 --> 00:25:06.211
And, and they had some really good ones, too, that I wouldn't have thought

00:25:06.424 --> 00:25:07.204
smart move

00:25:08.151 --> 00:25:12.990
And, um, so, the first chapter is about government.

00:25:13.050 --> 00:25:15.500
Because that's what I feel very strongly about.

00:25:16.631 --> 00:25:21.550
That we need to preserve the government that our founding fathers wanted us to have.

00:25:22.070 --> 00:25:23.611
And that is in danger now.

00:25:24.500 --> 00:25:43.351
And, um, And so his words were, he roams the halls of Congress that once were sacred and he sees corruption, self interest, greed, and, um, a lack of ethics.

00:25:44.550 --> 00:25:47.721
Of course, we all know that he's not saying anything we don't know.

00:25:48.529 --> 00:25:54.109
And then we have other chapters on religion and higher education and use of the military.

00:25:54.140 --> 00:25:58.579
He was very specific about, we've been abusing our military.

00:25:59.400 --> 00:25:59.799
Um,

00:26:01.259 --> 00:26:07.638
how do you think he did you ask him how he thinks we handled the lockdowns

00:26:09.119 --> 00:26:10.670
we didn't get into that, no.

00:26:11.798 --> 00:26:12.229
All right.

00:26:12.449 --> 00:26:24.638
Well, yeah, as far as like roaming the halls, I'm pretty sure he was like a fly on the wall and just watching everything and not telling you about what his thoughts are.

00:26:24.638 --> 00:26:37.298
And did he give any advice as far as people, whether it be from education to mindset to hold, you know, like hold the for any, anything that you can give us that he said?

00:26:38.019 --> 00:26:41.650
Yes, he was so negative about government.

00:26:42.869 --> 00:26:46.210
And practically everything else that I asked.

00:26:46.359 --> 00:26:49.329
Um, because a lot of our institutions are.

00:26:50.454 --> 00:27:11.394
Are not exactly failing, but they're not living up to their potential, um, higher education certainly has its problems and the University of Virginia, and he wasn't just picking on the University of Virginia, but all of higher education, they've gotten away from a lot of their original, um, founding principles to, to educate leaders.

00:27:11.734 --> 00:27:19.575
And so, um, like he, I asked him about collegiate sports and he said, cash cows, and you know, that was.

00:27:20.539 --> 00:27:25.000
Student athletics were not, are not, today as they were intended

00:27:25.104 --> 00:27:38.634
he's saying like, so to, to paraphrase or to summarize what you're saying, he's, he doesn't like where our school system has gone because instead of, um, breeding or creating leaders, you're creating good workers.

00:27:39.099 --> 00:27:40.059
Exactly.

00:27:40.150 --> 00:27:41.319
Yes, precisely.

00:27:41.369 --> 00:27:42.789
No, he, he did say that.

00:27:43.289 --> 00:27:50.160
Um, and, um, so finally I said, after all this negativity, I said, well, what would you do?

00:27:50.619 --> 00:27:54.279
You know, um, you know, can't you say something positive?

00:27:54.750 --> 00:27:55.890
And so, um.

00:27:57.384 --> 00:28:02.464
I said, what, what about, what would you do if you're a president right now?

00:28:02.464 --> 00:28:04.375
Or a president of the University of Virginia?

00:28:05.325 --> 00:28:06.865
I posed both of those questions.

00:28:07.464 --> 00:28:13.825
And he said, um, that there would be very little that he could do now as president.

00:28:14.005 --> 00:28:18.776
If he came in, just plop down in the That he would need a following.

00:28:19.816 --> 00:28:22.645
Uh, because you can't lead without followers.

00:28:22.955 --> 00:28:24.935
And right now there were not enough followers.

00:28:25.431 --> 00:28:28.530
To do, create the reforms that he would like,

00:28:28.615 --> 00:28:29.875
Followers of him.

00:28:30.290 --> 00:28:37.320
followers of, of the mission that he would, for example, getting, um, big money out of, uh, elections.

00:28:37.371 --> 00:28:44.340
That was major and that's not going to happen without a new, a new crop of people up there.

00:28:45.641 --> 00:28:52.560
So he was saying, um, that he would start in Congress first and he would try to organize.

00:28:53.060 --> 00:28:55.401
Cir, what he called circles of integrity.

00:28:56.421 --> 00:28:59.961
He would try to gather around him, people who had not been corrupted.

00:29:00.201 --> 00:29:03.681
He said so easy to become corrupted in Washington.

00:29:04.161 --> 00:29:06.441
And he's not just talking about recent years.

00:29:06.500 --> 00:29:11.780
It goes back, you know, back to the 18 hundreds corruption in Washington.

00:29:11.931 --> 00:29:13.010
Nothing new about that.

00:29:13.760 --> 00:29:21.741
Uh um, and so he said that he would try to gather like-minded people with him who wanted to.

00:29:22.556 --> 00:29:46.335
Institute the reforms, get them through and then gradually the circle would enlarge, he would hope, and you'd have a critical mass so that you could, uh, affect reforms and only then could one of them rise to become president, but there would need to be a critical mass of followers and right now there is, there, that does not exist.

00:29:46.929 --> 00:29:47.528
Interesting.

00:29:47.568 --> 00:29:59.098
Even with, without naming names, there is a that's growing that sees the need for mass reform in the government.

00:30:00.078 --> 00:30:03.598
So it's interesting how you said there's nothing like that going on now.

00:30:04.058 --> 00:30:05.709
Maybe in the way that he would like to.

00:30:07.199 --> 00:30:07.618
Okay.

00:30:07.644 --> 00:30:09.035
He looks at it differently.

00:30:09.085 --> 00:30:15.474
I think a lot of those people are for big money in government because big money sways their way, their philosophy.

00:30:16.005 --> 00:30:17.194
It buys ads.

00:30:17.704 --> 00:30:18.875
It buys influence.

00:30:19.765 --> 00:30:28.541
Um, he wants politicians to, um, start shaking hands again, you know, go around and see your constituents, have town halls.

00:30:29.413 --> 00:30:34.374
I will have to say that, uh, I have, we have a representative here who I think lives.

00:30:34.374 --> 00:30:36.961
She lives up to Jefferson's ideals, Abigail Spenberger.

00:30:37.221 --> 00:30:38.881
You'll hear more about her in the future.

00:30:38.881 --> 00:30:40.540
She's, she's on her way up.

00:30:40.933 --> 00:30:44.874
Uh, but she is ethical and she's a hard worker and she's bipartisan.

00:30:45.423 --> 00:30:55.060

Uncovering Hidden Truths: Conversations with the Other Side With Suzanne Munson [PART 1]

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