Episode 187: PR Hijack!

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Adam Curry: podcasting 2.0 for
August 2 2024, episode 187 pr Hi

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Jack. We're early but hey, you
know it's Friday. And if it's

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Friday, that means it's time for
the official board meeting of

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podcasting. 2.0 everything
that's happening in broadcasting

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all over the globe, you don't
need to go anywhere else. You

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got to be right here we are, in
fact, the only boardroom that

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has no gavel or meeting notes.
I'm Adam curry here in the heart

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of the Texas Hill Country. And
in Alabama, the man who can set

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up a studio in your hotel room,
say hello to my friend on the

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other end, the one the only Mr.
De Jones.

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Dave Jones: Welcome to our first
day of podcasting.

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Adam Curry: First day of
podcasting.

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Dave Jones: Yeah, where we learn
how to do a podcast. Oh, man,

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Adam Curry: there's so many
moving. There's so many moving

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parts when it comes to doing the
live stream and everything would

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have been fine. We're not for
we're doing this show the board

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meeting an hour earlier. So I
thought, well, I have a backup

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stream. I'll just do that. And
let's make sure to put the right

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URL in there. Well, no. And make
sure you have am set instead of

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PM Well no. Although I have
actually did that right after

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the last board meeting when you
are Nashville I set it up and so

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it's been broadcasting the the
incorrect time for a week.

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Dave Jones: We should have some
kind of monitoring service like

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you know uptime monitoring for
your API. Oh, I have a hearing

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service that says this is hey,
this new time you just put it

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Adam Curry: broke. Are you sure
that's right. This stream

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doesn't seem to work. Are you
sure that's right. Yeah,

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wouldn't Oh, good. Spurlock I'll
put another split for you for

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that service.

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Dave Jones: Yeah, like a
sentence. That's part sanity,

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sanity.

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Adam Curry: Sanity service. PSS
Exactly. Yeah, I should be

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podcast monitoring service and
we could call it PMS.

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Dave Jones: Sorry. That would.
That would. Yeah, that's great

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marketing. No, no, no. So well.

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Adam Curry: Apologies for
getting everybody into the board

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meeting earlier. Hello, board
meeting. We see you there. My my

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issue. Tina and I are flying up
to Frisco, Texas. Today. We have

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been invited to some kind of
cool dinner with all kinds of

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crazy people including Charlie
Kirk. General Flynn. Neighbor,

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neighbor, Laura Logan. Oh, Lord.
Oh yeah. Oh lord is right. To be

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a hootenanny. We're like you
know as like, we actually can't

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turn this down we've got to go
it's just too funny. So I have

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to

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Dave Jones: go you have to go
what's one of those things you

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gotta go to just because like
you need to be able to say that

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you went like

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Adam Curry: Yeah, exactly.
Apparently this 500 People there

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so I have no idea I mean,
there's someone bought a table

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our friends it's like oh, you
should should join us. And while

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there you get us to show
material Exactly. So I'm flying

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up myself. We got instructor and
bringing in the the Cirrus G six

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turbo with parachute I always
have to add with parachutes So

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Tina feels better about it. She
hates throwing in these things.

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Dave Jones: She hate flying
period.

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Unknown: I love it.

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Dave Jones: I mean 100% hate it
I just do not like anything

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about flying I never have good I
mean like it just makes me I

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don't know I don't like the I
don't like the experience of of

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setting it up where you're where
you're like the boarding the

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ticketing I don't that cancel
the waiting if you're gonna get

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delayed or

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Adam Curry: no i don't i don't
like in fact if I can fly direct

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within the United States I will
I'd rather flight not fly then

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then have to transfer somewhere
and if it's under 700 Miles I'll

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fly myself because it just
faster it's just faster. Now you

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just I mean the airport is five
minutes from our house the way

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this flight school is set up I'm
technically a student which I am

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and so I you know 65 bucks an
hour for the instructor and and

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he does the radio up in that
busy area. Because I don't you

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know, if you don't practice
enough and you're up in the

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Dallas area and you go I'm on
the radio immediately he's like

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okay, why don't you fly 30
minutes that way we'll talk to

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you later.

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Dave Jones: If you're not like
them that you're like the soup

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guy from Seinfeld or with

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Adam Curry: no routing for you
know vectors for you.

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Dave Jones: You Paul's you're
toast.

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Adam Curry: I want to thank you
Dave for giving me some good

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advice, which is you advise me
on a replacement laptop for the

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for the studio machine as you
know I had that horrible boy Oh,

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everything blew up. Everything
crashed. Everything's all toast

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and gone and no good.

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Dave Jones: And you get the one
that that I recommended. Yes, I

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Adam Curry: got the ThinkPad
Lenovo ThinkPad G three l 13. I

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got the lighter one, the, the
one that was lighter,

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Dave Jones: that we enter in
light weight light weight was

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yeah, 2.4

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Adam Curry: pounds or whatever.
Now what I've not done is I

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really was on the fence, like,
should I clone my studio drive

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and then clone it to that and
like, you know? Because you

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said, Well, it'd be easy. You
just have to load the drivers

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from a USB for the network. And
then it all pops up. I'm like,

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No, I don't think so. But

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Dave Jones: you already see
okay. You already recently wiped

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and start this thing. You
started from scratch, like just

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a couple of weeks ago. Yeah.
Right. So this is a relatively

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clean dry. Yeah. Now it's a
recent build is what I'm saying.

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There's not a bunch of crap
where I didn't like five years

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of bloat on it. No, but this is
a clean clone, man, I'm

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Adam Curry: afraid and also
there's one other thing. Just

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afraid Dave I'm afraid there's
one other thing is that the

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studio machine has let me see
the studio machine has a long

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way to go up to this PC has a
256 gigabyte drive

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Dave Jones: Okay, the one you're
cloning from

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Adam Curry: Yeah, and the one
I'm cloning to has a terabyte

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but then there's no problem. No
problem but then you just you

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doesn't show up as an extra
drive instead of giving you all

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that extra free space. No,

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Dave Jones: no. Okay, so you I
mean, your your method here is

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download Clonezilla Yeah, and I
got put it on a boot. Yeah, put

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it on USB drive with Rufus.
Yeah. Then get you then get a

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Rufus

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Adam Curry: and Chaka Khan.

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Dave Jones: Yes. Rufus
Wainwright is the last name of

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the Rufus boot thing that nobody
knows. If you boot it with

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Rufus, then or excuse me, you
attach an external drive. Yeah,

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sort of like external USB drive.
Boot it with boot with

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Clonezilla. Yeah, doing it do a
device to image clone. Yeah,

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pointing it at the at the your
external drive that you plugged

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in, yes. And then save it as an
image file, go to the new

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machine, boot it with with
Clonezilla. Choose Image to

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device, then pick it out, and
it'll clone straight to your

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straight to that new drive. Then
when you boot into Windows, what

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you'll see is a partition on
windows that does not fill the

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entire drive. So what you'll do
is you go into Disk Management

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and right click on that
partition and say expand and

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it'll fill up the whole drive.

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Adam Curry: Oh, so scary. So
what gears? I'm scared. Yes, I'm

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traumatized. Yes. Correct.
You're

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Dave Jones: scared of what
you're scared of is that if you

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Clonezilla to this new machine,
it's going to get you out of the

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factory install of this new
machine in such a way that

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you're not going to be able to
get back to anything for that

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user, or that weird

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Adam Curry: things are going to
happen because it has all these

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bells and whistles that it's
expecting to load. I don't know.

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So, so the question is, will the
Dell drivers work on the Lenovo

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out of the box? Or will I have
to go and then download because

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I went to the download site for
the Lenovo drivers and says this

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is out of date. This is
unsupported, this is no good.

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You're a loser, loser, loser
loser. And it's freaked me out.

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Dave Jones: You're the most some
of the drivers will work most of

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them will not. And most likely
the network driver will not

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work. So you'll go before you
start this process or from a

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different machine, you'll doubt
go to the download page from

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Lenovo for the for the drivers
for that machine, the new one,

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download the network card
drivers, stick it on the stick

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it on the Clonezilla flash
drive. And then when you boot

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when you boot up the image
machine on the on the Lenovo

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install, the first thing you do
is install those network drivers

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you'll get network running
immediately. Then you'll go to

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that then you go to support that
will never come on that machine

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and install it and let it just
auto install all the

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Adam Curry: other drivers it'll
recognize and just start doing

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that.

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Dave Jones: If you go to it in
Chrome, it'll it'll prompt you

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to install a little like a
little stub app that will that

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will give an infinite it's like
a

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Adam Curry: you said stub and
immediately I got chills up my

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spine. It's

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Dave Jones: like prompts us is
the Lenovo service bridge. Okay,

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let's be you do that and in
order to texting machine says

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here here's

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Adam Curry: here's all your
drivers. So Chrome Bing edge

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Dave Jones: no not edge Chrome
for some reason the Lenovo

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support that will never service
bridge will not install. So

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notch ray

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Adam Curry: will either not
brave it has to be no, no this

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See, these are things I wouldn't
it's not in your instruction

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manual.

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Dave Jones: Lenovo does not
understand that anybody uses

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anything but Chrome.

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Adam Curry: Yeah. All right.
Well, thank you, I appreciate

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it. Maybe when we get back from
Frisco, I'll give it a shot.

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Dave Jones: The The other thing,
the other thing to do is before

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you start Clonezilla, the Lenovo
to the to the, to the external

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drive as well. Oh, just in case,
just in case and you can revert.

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So like, when you click
Clonezilla a big thing, it'll

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only a big drive, it'll only use
the space. If you tell it to

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there's an option in this A to
only use that used space. So you

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may click clone a terabyte
drive, but the file in the image

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file it produces may only be you
know 100 gigs. Right? Right.

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Right. Okay.

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Unknown: Thank you. Yes, please

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Dave Jones: don't do this until
you get back. Well,

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Adam Curry: and the whole point
of me asking you is so that if I

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run into trouble I know I can
ask you for help. Because you

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know, I just want to know if I
deal with these every single

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day.

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Dave Jones: A client we clone
hundreds of these. Yeah, I have

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Adam Curry: to say I really
liked the job board on that

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machine. It's nice.

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Dave Jones: It was a good
machine. And it

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Adam Curry: still has the pistol
has the OG little rubber nub.

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Dave Jones: Yeah, and I mean the
the Chinese make a nice machine

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for

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Adam Curry: Chinese. Hey, man.
So last time we spoke was in

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this capacity was you're in
Nashville and now I got calls

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from radio guys saying how do
you how did you do that? How did

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you do that remote? I said well,
we sent an advanced team out a

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week ago and they ordered all
the lines and they set it all up

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and they tested Lytro satellite
truck tested the studio we had

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Westwood one with the shoot the
bird for us. I said no basically

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basically, I pulled up the
fountain page from the from the

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venue and I pulled up clean feed
and it all worked in somehow

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Dave put someone in the bathroom
and shuffling people about apt

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chyron in the bathroom. It was
good. I mean it really it really

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is amazing. I just want us all
to stop and realize I mean I

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come from a place of steam
gauges in the airplanes and this

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kind of nonsense in and doing
remotes you literally had to get

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extra engineers you had to you
know you had to you know

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schedule stuff and people and
and all kinds of things and now

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we just like oh we just we just
do it and doing boosted Graham

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ball live was a was a blast,
man. I had a good time doing

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that. Even though it was fun,
even though it includes video.

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Dave Jones: A little weird for
me. It kind of annoyed annoyed

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me a little bit because I mean
this was nothing that well.

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Okay, so I finally met James and
Julie Costello. And I guess Jim

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I'm sorry, not James. Jim and
Julie great. I mean they're just

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like amazing people they're so
you're so nice. And just just

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like nice, insincere people you
know, and I just really enjoyed

223
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getting to meet them and all
that and then so they they were

224
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the ones putting on the band's
Bitcoin but we could this is not

225
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any This is not Jim's fault
because they had to do a

226
00:13:54,840 --> 00:13:59,550
soundcheck before just loud came
on and he's about I don't know

227
00:13:59,550 --> 00:14:04,590
about 10 minutes before this
grand ball ended just loud is

228
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just like killing it in the in
the room so we couldn't hear

229
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booster Grand Ball at all like
10 or 15 minutes just loud

230
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Adam Curry: is kind of like a
prince perfectionist type guy.

231
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He got to have everything just
right you know Yeah, I noticed

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he

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Dave Jones: brought his own
sound guy he brought his own

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sound guy up there sound good.

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Adam Curry: Gotta hand it to him
gotta hand it to him. That's

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what you do. And so you couldn't
hear the end of booster Graham

237
00:14:29,670 --> 00:14:30,600
balls while you're saying

238
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Dave Jones: oh, it is fun

239
00:14:34,410 --> 00:14:36,000
Adam Curry: how did it look?
Because you know what I did was

240
00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:40,980
I put my my Mr list up on the
screen I had the split kit

241
00:14:40,980 --> 00:14:44,070
change in the album art I had
myself and a little window to

242
00:14:44,070 --> 00:14:47,490
that look at anything that was
okay. Yeah, look great. I

243
00:14:47,490 --> 00:14:51,990
Dave Jones: mean, the screen
there's not it wasn't a good

244
00:14:51,990 --> 00:14:55,290
setup for a huge screen but they
had a decent sized screen there.

245
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Like it would have been cool if
there was like a like a sort of

246
00:14:59,250 --> 00:15:02,730
like a projector. Same type
thing with a bigger image now

247
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but they had like they had a
screen set up the one that was

248
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showing like the leaderboard and
all that that big screen setup

249
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and I walked over there and just
was watching because I've never

250
00:15:12,480 --> 00:15:15,240
seen your in mirrorless setup so
I was watching that is really

251
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cool. Isn't it fun

252
00:15:16,170 --> 00:15:18,780
Adam Curry: how that works when
when I when I hit the song The

253
00:15:18,780 --> 00:15:24,420
album marked changes you see the
you see the split kid go active

254
00:15:24,420 --> 00:15:27,660
and the booster grams coming in
and all that stuff. Yeah,

255
00:15:27,660 --> 00:15:32,790
Dave Jones: it was so cool. And
like Jim made Jim knows how to

256
00:15:32,790 --> 00:15:35,940
run a tight ship man. Like yeah,
I mean that he was getting him

257
00:15:35,940 --> 00:15:39,150
he was getting those artists on
and off and soundcheck in, and I

258
00:15:39,150 --> 00:15:43,200
mean, like, it went so smooth.
There was only a couple of

259
00:15:43,200 --> 00:15:51,300
hitches and one was. So right
before those two things

260
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happened, so owns Friday. Who
was ill his or her before was

261
00:15:59,190 --> 00:16:05,250
playing. So herbivores plan, and
they they started with just a

262
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few people in the house. I mean,
it was like maybe 20 people by

263
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the end of their set. It I mean,
that place was wall to wall. I

264
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don't know how many people there
wasn't there wasn't that?

265
00:16:17,670 --> 00:16:20,610
Adam Curry: Well, I thought they
can hold 400 like 400. I thought

266
00:16:20,610 --> 00:16:21,240
they could have

267
00:16:21,840 --> 00:16:25,080
Dave Jones: if I guarantee you
there was every bit of capacity

268
00:16:25,080 --> 00:16:29,970
in there. Really? I mean, it was
yes, it was, it was a lot, which

269
00:16:29,970 --> 00:16:36,810
was awesome. But so half or so
but about 15 minutes into their

270
00:16:36,810 --> 00:16:43,500
set. Okay, Julie said room cap
was 650. I mean, it's he knows

271
00:16:43,500 --> 00:16:45,930
horror, really hard to tell. But
I was having trouble kind of

272
00:16:45,930 --> 00:16:49,800
moving my way through the crowd.
So many people there were. So

273
00:16:49,800 --> 00:16:56,940
about 15 minutes into the set, I
guess. The I tried to boost to a

274
00:16:56,940 --> 00:17:01,710
boost of 50,000 SATs. And then
about a few minutes later, I

275
00:17:01,710 --> 00:17:06,390
tried to boost another 50. And
it just the page did nothing.

276
00:17:06,480 --> 00:17:12,630
No. And so I kept trying.
thinking, why is it showing

277
00:17:12,630 --> 00:17:13,110
issue? You

278
00:17:13,110 --> 00:17:15,450
Adam Curry: boosted a million
SATs in total? Because you're

279
00:17:15,450 --> 00:17:16,710
just boosting and boosting?

280
00:17:18,030 --> 00:17:21,900
Dave Jones: No? Well, let's talk
about that too. Because this was

281
00:17:21,900 --> 00:17:24,360
an interesting setup the way
that way they had a role in the

282
00:17:24,360 --> 00:17:25,230
way Dobby does.

283
00:17:25,290 --> 00:17:28,140
Adam Curry: Well, we had about
eight different pages to look at

284
00:17:28,140 --> 00:17:31,350
which was interesting by itself.
The

285
00:17:31,380 --> 00:17:35,670
Dave Jones: the way that it was
in, in the in the concert in the

286
00:17:35,670 --> 00:17:40,740
venue was you had a on the
screen, you know there was a QR

287
00:17:40,740 --> 00:17:44,580
code, you hit the QR code, it
comes up to a essentially a page

288
00:17:44,580 --> 00:17:46,950
where you can fill in the
booster ground, you can put in

289
00:17:46,950 --> 00:17:49,590
your message, how many sets what
your name is all this kind of

290
00:17:49,590 --> 00:17:56,340
stuff, just add an HTML form.
You do that? And it gives you an

291
00:17:56,400 --> 00:18:02,160
A bolt 11 invoice you pay you
pay it in rice,

292
00:18:02,730 --> 00:18:04,530
Adam Curry: which was kind of
cool. By the way, that was kind

293
00:18:04,530 --> 00:18:06,720
of cool the way that worked.
Yeah,

294
00:18:06,960 --> 00:18:09,060
Dave Jones: it was it was really
neat because it what it

295
00:18:09,060 --> 00:18:12,750
generates the bolt 11 in the
background using an lb wallet,

296
00:18:13,530 --> 00:18:17,340
and then pay it with all the
details, all the TLV record

297
00:18:17,340 --> 00:18:21,870
details and the splits recorded
then then you pay that in that

298
00:18:21,870 --> 00:18:24,900
invoice, and then the Alby
wallet takes care of do is

299
00:18:24,900 --> 00:18:27,780
sending out all the different
shares to everybody. So it's

300
00:18:27,780 --> 00:18:31,980
like a it's almost like a little
bit like an escrow thing. But it

301
00:18:31,980 --> 00:18:34,410
worked awesome, because you
didn't have you know, if you're

302
00:18:34,410 --> 00:18:36,840
in there and you're new and you
don't even know anything about

303
00:18:36,840 --> 00:18:39,420
2.0 You could just you could
just do a scan,

304
00:18:39,450 --> 00:18:42,960
Adam Curry: scan the QR codes
and your SATs and I get to Adobe

305
00:18:42,960 --> 00:18:46,320
dot set that up the split
forwarding system? I'm

306
00:18:46,320 --> 00:18:50,490
Dave Jones: not sure I thought
he did. I think he did. But I'm

307
00:18:50,490 --> 00:18:53,520
not sure maybe somebody can
correct me. I'm pretty sure he

308
00:18:53,520 --> 00:18:59,400
did. Yes, he did. Okay, so the
what happened was I went to send

309
00:18:59,400 --> 00:19:05,700
another 50,000 and it didn't
work so I can't so I was like

310
00:19:05,700 --> 00:19:10,440
okay, well I'll try 25 and then
25 worked from Okay, was there

311
00:19:10,440 --> 00:19:13,920
something to limit or something?
So then add 100,000

312
00:19:13,920 --> 00:19:16,800
Adam Curry: sets at one point.
So I saw it working at

313
00:19:16,800 --> 00:19:21,570
Dave Jones: that level. And then
I tried and then I realized what

314
00:19:21,570 --> 00:19:24,990
was happening we there was some
sort of limit because it would

315
00:19:24,990 --> 00:19:27,510
only work if you sent
progressively smaller and

316
00:19:27,510 --> 00:19:33,600
smaller boosts. And so out what
had happened was the the lb

317
00:19:33,600 --> 00:19:36,600
wallet that this stuff was tied
to on the back end was choking

318
00:19:37,140 --> 00:19:42,720
had a 24 hour set limit on it.
You can only do so many

319
00:19:42,810 --> 00:19:46,590
transactions. It was like 2
million or something or 1

320
00:19:46,590 --> 00:19:47,160
million that's

321
00:19:47,160 --> 00:19:49,950
Adam Curry: like trying to
trying to think and you have a T

322
00:19:49,950 --> 00:19:52,500
one and you're actually on a 56k
dial up.

323
00:19:54,420 --> 00:19:59,190
Dave Jones: Yeah, so So who am
like Hey, who is this thing is

324
00:19:59,250 --> 00:20:03,060
this thing exactly? likes it was
weird. So he put in some logging

325
00:20:03,060 --> 00:20:06,330
saw the code saying that there's
a limit in this way. So either

326
00:20:06,330 --> 00:20:09,480
when it switched over to his own
personal Alby wallet as the

327
00:20:09,480 --> 00:20:14,760
escrow wallet, and everything
started working again. Okay,

328
00:20:15,360 --> 00:20:20,130
that was that happened on Friday
then on Saturday, getting ready

329
00:20:20,130 --> 00:20:25,170
for booster grand ball. The the
saw the live socket for the

330
00:20:25,230 --> 00:20:32,760
wallet switching? It would not
it was rejecting the attempts to

331
00:20:32,760 --> 00:20:35,460
connect to it from that side
because of course,

332
00:20:35,580 --> 00:20:40,380
Adam Curry: cohorts of cores of
horrors that happen. Yes, of

333
00:20:40,380 --> 00:20:41,250
course. Yes,

334
00:20:41,550 --> 00:20:46,470
Dave Jones: of course. And then
we're like, okay, we're trying

335
00:20:46,470 --> 00:20:50,940
to get in touch with Stephen B.
And we're getting Stevens had

336
00:20:50,940 --> 00:20:53,580
radio silence going on. So we
were like, Well, okay, crap. So

337
00:20:54,030 --> 00:20:57,510
I took the chat that podcast
index.org, which is like in

338
00:20:57,510 --> 00:21:04,050
limbo and never used any more. I
took that and set up an nginx

339
00:21:04,050 --> 00:21:09,090
reverse proxy on it to basically
proxy those WebSocket from Dobby

340
00:21:09,090 --> 00:21:10,050
dasa site,

341
00:21:10,080 --> 00:21:14,910
Adam Curry: calm man, to Steven
bass. Oh, wow. Awesome.

342
00:21:14,910 --> 00:21:15,630
WebSocket.

343
00:21:15,960 --> 00:21:18,870
Dave Jones: And it were like a
charm, man. I mean, is is crazy.

344
00:21:18,870 --> 00:21:20,250
So we solved that when like,

345
00:21:20,850 --> 00:21:22,860
Adam Curry: you did a reverse
proxy. That's what you did.

346
00:21:23,520 --> 00:21:24,420
Reverse proxies

347
00:21:24,420 --> 00:21:27,870
Dave Jones: and nginx Yeah, it
can nginx can can reverse proxy,

348
00:21:27,870 --> 00:21:30,150
a WebSocket connection. Yeah,
that's what you

349
00:21:30,150 --> 00:21:32,580
Adam Curry: do. And you're
behind a NAT firewall, you also

350
00:21:32,580 --> 00:21:34,050
can do reverse proxy, right.

351
00:21:37,530 --> 00:21:39,450
Dave Jones: Now, this is a
little different, because what

352
00:21:39,570 --> 00:21:42,480
so what a lot of people do is
they'll have a web application,

353
00:21:42,900 --> 00:21:47,760
running on localhost, and let's
just say port 8888. And then

354
00:21:47,760 --> 00:21:51,900
you'll set up an nginx, reverse
proxy in front of it. So running

355
00:21:51,900 --> 00:21:56,430
on 443, and an ad. And then
you'll take all the incoming

356
00:21:56,430 --> 00:21:59,820
connections, and then just send
them to localhost. You're sort

357
00:21:59,820 --> 00:22:02,940
of brokering the connection back
and forth, right. And that so

358
00:22:02,940 --> 00:22:07,500
you can protect your, your
application using using an

359
00:22:07,500 --> 00:22:11,400
engine, proper web application
firewall, so that but it'll also

360
00:22:11,790 --> 00:22:16,140
nginx will also do the exact
same thing with WebSockets. Not

361
00:22:16,140 --> 00:22:21,120
just HTTP. So we just use that.
We just came in clutch on that.

362
00:22:21,180 --> 00:22:25,470
Nice. Anyway, it's it was it was
fun. It was fun. Just sort of

363
00:22:25,470 --> 00:22:28,650
like seeing all that and seeing
what the real world problems are

364
00:22:28,650 --> 00:22:31,590
and chatting us solving them. It
was it was it was really great.

365
00:22:31,650 --> 00:22:34,860
Adam Curry: I can tell you that
for boosted Graham ball from the

366
00:22:34,860 --> 00:22:38,910
27th. Until What's the last
entry here? July 30, because

367
00:22:38,910 --> 00:22:45,570
it's been no more boost since
then. 1,184,464 sets of the

368
00:22:45,570 --> 00:22:46,200
artists.

369
00:22:47,010 --> 00:22:49,650
Dave Jones: Wow. That's amazing.
Yeah.

370
00:22:50,820 --> 00:22:54,150
Adam Curry: I have no idea. I
guess that was added to the to

371
00:22:54,150 --> 00:23:01,410
the total. I don't know. I mean,
I obviously I put a split in

372
00:23:01,410 --> 00:23:06,210
there for RSS blue. So the Dhobi
Gus WDS could set it up on his

373
00:23:06,210 --> 00:23:08,340
thing. So I don't know. No,

374
00:23:08,340 --> 00:23:11,640
Dave Jones: ideally, Julie said
the border and she said no, that

375
00:23:11,640 --> 00:23:13,020
that wasn't added to the total.

376
00:23:13,110 --> 00:23:18,180
Adam Curry: Okay, let me give
you that total again. 1,184,464.

377
00:23:19,110 --> 00:23:20,430
Not bad people.

378
00:23:21,120 --> 00:23:24,660
Dave Jones: I feel like my my
rough sort of like guessed the

379
00:23:24,660 --> 00:23:32,370
math was somewhere around $3,500
I think went through this system

380
00:23:32,370 --> 00:23:35,550
total. That's just kind of
worded the way I felt it was

381
00:23:35,550 --> 00:23:42,030
going adding together that's
adding together. Vinyl lounge

382
00:23:42,030 --> 00:23:45,990
bands, bitcoins all three days,
this green ball, I mean, all of

383
00:23:45,990 --> 00:23:46,170
it.

384
00:23:48,060 --> 00:23:51,750
Adam Curry: So cool. The whole
thing was great. And do we know

385
00:23:51,780 --> 00:23:55,440
do we sign up new artists? Did
new people come on board? Were

386
00:23:55,440 --> 00:23:58,590
people interested? I mean, what
was the general vibe in the in

387
00:23:58,590 --> 00:23:59,220
the house?

388
00:24:01,200 --> 00:24:04,650
Dave Jones: I mean, I don't know
about that part. I don't know

389
00:24:04,650 --> 00:24:07,230
about the artist part. But I
know there was a lot of people

390
00:24:07,230 --> 00:24:10,950
there that there's a lot of
people there with like names I

391
00:24:10,950 --> 00:24:13,740
recognized and some that I
didn't they felt new to me

392
00:24:13,740 --> 00:24:16,620
whether they're actually new or
not, I don't know. But

393
00:24:16,620 --> 00:24:19,500
Adam Curry: now all those zaps,
they also went through the Dhobi

394
00:24:19,500 --> 00:24:23,160
das System. And then we're
transmogrified into split.

395
00:24:24,360 --> 00:24:27,390
Dave Jones: All the ones that
came from the venue itself or

396
00:24:27,390 --> 00:24:31,830
from the live stream web page,
okay, the ones that came, you

397
00:24:31,830 --> 00:24:35,400
know, and then of course, you
got to add to those, you know,

398
00:24:35,430 --> 00:24:39,630
the ones that went through the
podcasts and 2.0 apps directly

399
00:24:40,140 --> 00:24:43,080
if you're listening live on
podcast guru or fountain or

400
00:24:43,080 --> 00:24:45,120
something like that those were
different.

401
00:24:46,740 --> 00:24:48,990
Adam Curry: But that's that's
very valuable if we can ever

402
00:24:48,990 --> 00:24:51,810
make that work without it being
a money transmitter, which of

403
00:24:51,810 --> 00:24:54,060
course I think it always will be
I've no idea.

404
00:24:55,740 --> 00:24:59,970
Dave Jones: I mean, it shouldn't
be, you know,

405
00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:04,350
Adam Curry: No but yeah you
don't know. And unfortunately

406
00:25:04,350 --> 00:25:08,580
though because I was I was
looking at the I was bouncing

407
00:25:08,580 --> 00:25:13,320
back and forth I watched a lot
on podcast guru was just does

408
00:25:13,320 --> 00:25:19,560
video just just does a video
fine and I think I I popped in

409
00:25:19,560 --> 00:25:27,960
for a second to checkout true
fans and but a lot of my you

410
00:25:27,960 --> 00:25:34,200
know my main screen was the
fountain screen. And so I tried

411
00:25:34,200 --> 00:25:37,200
to get the nostril chat working
but I never could I mean, I have

412
00:25:37,200 --> 00:25:39,660
the nostril extension and all
that I just couldn't get it to

413
00:25:39,660 --> 00:25:43,920
work. I don't know what's going
on. I don't understand it.

414
00:25:44,580 --> 00:25:48,120
Dave Jones: I got man to work
but it was not my that I had to

415
00:25:48,120 --> 00:25:51,660
log in to fountain to get it to
work. Like I couldn't get it

416
00:25:51,660 --> 00:25:55,560
with just the extension that I
did. But then you know, then of

417
00:25:55,560 --> 00:25:57,330
course now then it's not my
right?

418
00:25:58,380 --> 00:26:00,450
Adam Curry: You're just some
some rando.

419
00:26:04,110 --> 00:26:04,890
Unknown: A plebe

420
00:26:06,270 --> 00:26:08,790
Adam Curry: but you know, for
me, it really showed once again

421
00:26:08,790 --> 00:26:14,130
that I have no idea of how many
people were watching or how many

422
00:26:14,520 --> 00:26:18,120
streams we generated. I have no
idea. I don't think anyone has

423
00:26:18,120 --> 00:26:21,960
any idea. And nor does it really
matter. Because, you know, music

424
00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:27,930
Mama says 6 million SATs total.
So that's pretty good. Six sets?

425
00:26:27,930 --> 00:26:32,280
Yeah, about $3,700 I guess just
a quick back of the napkin?

426
00:26:33,180 --> 00:26:34,770
Dave Jones: That was my thought
too. Yeah. Yeah,

427
00:26:34,770 --> 00:26:40,380
Adam Curry: that makes that
makes sense. You know, I was

428
00:26:40,380 --> 00:26:45,690
listening today I heard was a
pod news. That Patreon. They say

429
00:26:45,690 --> 00:26:49,980
they paid out I'm not sure.
There was like podcasters made I

430
00:26:49,980 --> 00:26:52,200
don't know if that means that's
what they made, or that was the

431
00:26:52,200 --> 00:26:55,290
payout. Or I'm gonna think it
was the total number before

432
00:26:55,290 --> 00:27:01,230
Patreon cut etcetera. $350
million last year. I mean,

433
00:27:01,230 --> 00:27:04,020
that's, I mean, it's a version
of value for value. I don't like

434
00:27:04,020 --> 00:27:09,150
it. But it's a version of people
supporting podcasts, with the

435
00:27:09,150 --> 00:27:13,470
value they feel is is
appropriate for whatever value

436
00:27:13,470 --> 00:27:17,490
they're receiving. And this
really tells me something you

437
00:27:17,490 --> 00:27:20,700
know, that's that's where that's
where the money is. Now, I'm not

438
00:27:20,700 --> 00:27:23,640
saying Patreon but getting
people to support you directly.

439
00:27:25,050 --> 00:27:28,080
Dave Jones: Did they get a saw
that number? I saw that story

440
00:27:28,080 --> 00:27:33,330
too was? Did they give a count
of how many podcasters that

441
00:27:33,330 --> 00:27:35,670
Adam Curry: included? I don't
think so. No, cuz I thought they

442
00:27:35,670 --> 00:27:39,090
did. And I gotta wonder. Maybe
thought it

443
00:27:39,090 --> 00:27:43,710
Dave Jones: was like 40,000 or
something. Really? That's also

444
00:27:43,770 --> 00:27:44,430
that's good. Let

445
00:27:44,430 --> 00:27:47,790
Adam Curry: me see. Let me see
the most recent pod news.

446
00:27:51,690 --> 00:27:54,930
Unknown: Where is here we go.
Patreon. Let me see.

447
00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:01,170
Adam Curry: I don't see it in
the Oh, yeah. 40,000 podcasters

448
00:28:01,170 --> 00:28:03,930
are earning income on Patreon.
As they build and grow their

449
00:28:03,930 --> 00:28:04,560
business.

450
00:28:05,250 --> 00:28:09,300
Dave Jones: So said they paid
out 350 million to podcasters

451
00:28:09,300 --> 00:28:13,050
businesses 40,000 creators are
earning they, you know,

452
00:28:13,080 --> 00:28:15,840
Adam Curry: yeah, that's that's
sketchy. That's sketchy. That's

453
00:28:15,840 --> 00:28:16,500
sketchy.

454
00:28:16,680 --> 00:28:19,290
Dave Jones: I don't know what
that any of that means. Yeah.

455
00:28:19,320 --> 00:28:21,930
Adam Curry: I mean, I find that
sketchy. Because

456
00:28:21,930 --> 00:28:24,690
Dave Jones: if you just do that
math, which I don't, obviously,

457
00:28:24,690 --> 00:28:29,010
but you know, not ride me your
joke about like nine grand per

458
00:28:29,010 --> 00:28:31,950
podcast or don't? That's a lot.
That's a lot.

459
00:28:32,670 --> 00:28:35,340
Adam Curry: That seems high. To
me, there's going to be a few

460
00:28:35,340 --> 00:28:38,250
who make a lot more. That's the
way it always is skewed to

461
00:28:38,250 --> 00:28:40,800
Dave Jones: the top. Yeah. And I
want to talk about that too,

462
00:28:40,800 --> 00:28:43,920
until like with, with AD
skipping, and downloads and all

463
00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:44,130
that kind

464
00:28:44,130 --> 00:28:48,570
Adam Curry: of thing. Why don't
you want to take it away? Well,

465
00:28:48,630 --> 00:28:50,670
Dave Jones: I mean, I did bring
a PowerPoint. But

466
00:28:52,290 --> 00:28:54,510
Adam Curry: let me turn on
screen sharing for you, Dave.

467
00:28:57,030 --> 00:29:00,180
Dave Jones: But I did want to
say I do want to follow up and

468
00:29:00,180 --> 00:29:06,360
say like, I didn't meet a lot of
great people. In Nashville, it's

469
00:29:06,390 --> 00:29:12,180
awesome to see people's faces.
You know, you, you talk to

470
00:29:12,180 --> 00:29:17,610
people for years, online, and
through chats and forums and

471
00:29:17,610 --> 00:29:21,930
such, but you see their face and
you talk to them for five

472
00:29:21,930 --> 00:29:25,800
minutes. And it's like you like
you've known them forever. Yes,

473
00:29:25,800 --> 00:29:32,160
yeah. You finally have a, like,
a real sense of who the person

474
00:29:32,160 --> 00:29:36,510
is. in it. It was great. I mean,
there's so many of me, you know,

475
00:29:36,720 --> 00:29:40,200
every peepee and Macintosh and
dirty Jersey whore and

476
00:29:41,520 --> 00:29:44,790
Adam Curry: nobody does. In
Dobie das and the Costello's

477
00:29:44,850 --> 00:29:47,910
Costello incorporate Lowe's.
Oscar

478
00:29:47,910 --> 00:29:52,890
Dave Jones: and Nick from
fountain I mean, like Zach from

479
00:29:52,890 --> 00:29:59,550
indie hub, Michael and Michael
and Sam from wave Lake. Saw

480
00:29:59,550 --> 00:30:05,910
wrote, you know, Of course, Roy
and TMK were there. I mean, like

481
00:30:05,910 --> 00:30:10,050
there was just so many pay in a
coastal car in a car and so I

482
00:30:10,050 --> 00:30:14,130
room I split an Airbnb with
chyron over there and then he

483
00:30:14,130 --> 00:30:19,890
wrote, he wrote back. He wrote
back with me to Birmingham. So

484
00:30:19,890 --> 00:30:23,220
realize, Oh, cool. Yeah. Yeah.
He wrote back with me because he

485
00:30:23,220 --> 00:30:27,690
was flying out of Birmingham on
Sunday morning. So he just he

486
00:30:27,690 --> 00:30:30,960
just flown, rode back with me
and crashed on my couch Saturday

487
00:30:30,960 --> 00:30:35,910
night. And then I took him to
the airport Sunday morning. In

488
00:30:36,780 --> 00:30:39,510
the car is just a beautiful
person. I love that guy. Yeah,

489
00:30:39,540 --> 00:30:40,740
he's so he's so great.

490
00:30:40,770 --> 00:30:42,660
Adam Curry: You don't have a
guest room in that policy.

491
00:30:42,660 --> 00:30:44,670
Yours. We do, but

492
00:30:44,670 --> 00:30:46,980
Dave Jones: it doesn't have like
a it doesn't have a bed. Okay.

493
00:30:47,280 --> 00:30:47,640
Yeah.

494
00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:50,520
Adam Curry: All right. Everybody
booths booths for Dave's bed.

495
00:30:54,180 --> 00:30:59,550
Dave Jones: Tiny Tim can't
afford a bed. But he's been. So

496
00:30:59,550 --> 00:31:06,930
he. On the way back. We had to
stop. And, you know, I gave him

497
00:31:06,930 --> 00:31:10,200
the full because he's never been
to the US before. This is first

498
00:31:10,200 --> 00:31:14,730
trip to the US. Oh, wow. So I
had to give him the false se

499
00:31:14,730 --> 00:31:23,640
experience. So we stopped at
buches. All right, filled up the

500
00:31:23,640 --> 00:31:29,040
tank and bolt in Boston nuts,
some buches nuts. This is what

501
00:31:29,040 --> 00:31:31,410
we're gonna send you home with
as your first United States

502
00:31:31,410 --> 00:31:39,240
experience is buches. Beaver
nuggets? That's you? Yeah, there

503
00:31:39,240 --> 00:31:41,610
was there? You know, he's is
that exactly what I was hoping

504
00:31:41,610 --> 00:31:43,680
for? Wall to wall fat people.

505
00:31:45,090 --> 00:31:48,720
Adam Curry: On electric carts?
Yes. Exactly. Beautiful.

506
00:31:48,780 --> 00:31:49,770
Beautiful. Anyways,

507
00:31:49,800 --> 00:31:56,400
Dave Jones: it was great. Yeah,
I guess what? I've been watching

508
00:31:56,400 --> 00:32:01,050
this. And I think, gosh, we got
so much to talk about I know

509
00:32:01,050 --> 00:32:02,130
where to start? Well,

510
00:32:02,130 --> 00:32:03,960
Adam Curry: you had a lot to
talk about in the last show,

511
00:32:03,960 --> 00:32:06,630
which we didn't get to. So I'm
just I'm just leaving it up to

512
00:32:06,630 --> 00:32:09,660
you. I mean, the only thing
obviously, I'm still

513
00:32:09,690 --> 00:32:16,170
anticipating and excited about
is Oscar's demo of the bolt 11

514
00:32:16,200 --> 00:32:19,410
of the new Bolt 11 system that
we're we're hoping to implement.

515
00:32:20,730 --> 00:32:24,810
And hopefully he'll get his
stripe API stuff sorted out.

516
00:32:27,060 --> 00:32:33,030
Dave Jones: The I am trying to
resist jumping in to do that.

517
00:32:33,030 --> 00:32:36,120
Because I've got I've got this
laurelville side project that

518
00:32:36,120 --> 00:32:36,600
I'm working on.

519
00:32:36,630 --> 00:32:38,250
Adam Curry: No, no. He said he
was going to do it.

520
00:32:38,970 --> 00:32:41,160
Dave Jones: Yeah, but he's
having trouble with his account

521
00:32:41,190 --> 00:32:42,630
thing. Well, when

522
00:32:42,630 --> 00:32:44,490
Adam Curry: I account does he
want an account? You can use my

523
00:32:44,490 --> 00:32:47,400
account? I'll give him my
account. If

524
00:32:47,400 --> 00:32:50,760
Dave Jones: that if that
detachment from the mint. Yeah,

525
00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:52,980
I didn't detach it from the man.
But I turned I turned the mint

526
00:32:52,980 --> 00:32:56,250
off. By the way, if you had, if
you still have funds on the

527
00:32:56,250 --> 00:32:59,040
mint, I mean to talk about like
three people. If you have funds

528
00:32:59,040 --> 00:33:02,280
on the mint, just tell me I'll
send it back to you. Because

529
00:33:02,280 --> 00:33:05,310
it's deactivated right now. No,
it's not running. Dave

530
00:33:05,460 --> 00:33:06,690
Adam Curry: fed Jones.

531
00:33:08,280 --> 00:33:11,220
Dave Jones: Is a random Mexico
with your money. What

532
00:33:12,270 --> 00:33:16,440
Adam Curry: do you know? So I
saw that breeze implemented

533
00:33:16,440 --> 00:33:19,050
liquid? Do you know anything
about liquid at all? It seems

534
00:33:19,050 --> 00:33:21,630
like, you know, the marketing of
it is well, here's another way

535
00:33:21,630 --> 00:33:26,850
to do with lightning. And it's
and it's much easier, but it's

536
00:33:26,850 --> 00:33:29,820
not really yours. And is that
something that you'd want to

537
00:33:29,820 --> 00:33:30,360
look at?

538
00:33:32,520 --> 00:33:39,630
Dave Jones: I talked to Roy
about it a little bit. And he he

539
00:33:39,630 --> 00:33:51,120
said it would work. But an add
on ROI was so ROI was so down he

540
00:33:51,120 --> 00:33:54,150
was in. He was in we're all
screwed mode.

541
00:33:54,510 --> 00:33:57,510
Adam Curry: Oh, yeah. Well, he
because he read the 8000 word

542
00:33:57,510 --> 00:34:01,890
Whitney Webb article, Whitney
Webb art. I'm like bro, calm

543
00:34:01,890 --> 00:34:05,790
down a little bit. I mean, you
know Whitney Webb Okay, sure.

544
00:34:05,940 --> 00:34:10,080
She's with her everything leads
back to Epstein. It's like every

545
00:34:10,080 --> 00:34:15,600
everything is is Mossad
blackmailing you for for for

546
00:34:15,600 --> 00:34:20,070
weird sex you have is like he
calmed down. Now. What do you

547
00:34:20,100 --> 00:34:24,330
because I had a long chat with
him over a signal. And he's

548
00:34:24,330 --> 00:34:28,920
like, Well, their dollar rising
everything like well, you know,

549
00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:32,520
is it all really a bad thing? I
mean, we still determine what we

550
00:34:32,520 --> 00:34:38,130
want to do with Bitcoin. I mean,
if if Senator Loomis thinks that

551
00:34:38,160 --> 00:34:43,380
you know that it's a good idea
to stack SATs and overtime pay

552
00:34:43,380 --> 00:34:47,610
off our our national debt. Okay.
I mean, I don't see that as

553
00:34:47,610 --> 00:34:52,860
necessarily wrong. The problem I
do see is the stable coin play.

554
00:34:52,890 --> 00:34:57,510
I mean that it became very clear
to me when I heard President

555
00:34:57,510 --> 00:35:02,310
Trump talking about stable coin
OST stable coins stay stable

556
00:35:02,310 --> 00:35:06,930
coins, stable coins. You know
what stable coins are? I mean,

557
00:35:06,930 --> 00:35:10,170
that's that's your money
printing right there. You know,

558
00:35:10,170 --> 00:35:12,690
they're the guys buying all the
short term Treasury paper.

559
00:35:14,610 --> 00:35:18,870
Dave Jones: Have you seen how
much this? This is a deep cut

560
00:35:18,870 --> 00:35:23,310
here, but have you seen how
much? How many Treasuries are

561
00:35:23,310 --> 00:35:24,420
owned by tether?

562
00:35:24,540 --> 00:35:27,330
Adam Curry: That's my point.
It's it's their range size of a

563
00:35:27,330 --> 00:35:30,210
country. Yeah, yeah, there's
soaking it all up and at a

564
00:35:30,210 --> 00:35:34,140
certain point, people gonna be
like, Oh, is that is that thing

565
00:35:34,140 --> 00:35:37,710
really secure that stable coin
that tether thing where you want

566
00:35:37,710 --> 00:35:39,330
to add a little bit coin in
there?

567
00:35:39,780 --> 00:35:43,020
Dave Jones: It's kind of
terrifying. It's I mean, really,

568
00:35:43,020 --> 00:35:46,590
if you think about it, it's kind
of scary to think that a private

569
00:35:46,590 --> 00:35:53,100
company owns that much. US
Treasury bonds. Yeah. As well

570
00:35:53,100 --> 00:35:53,610
freaky.

571
00:35:53,640 --> 00:35:57,180
Adam Curry: Make no mistake.
Trump understands macro

572
00:35:57,180 --> 00:36:00,330
economics. He really does. And
so when I heard him say, this is

573
00:36:00,330 --> 00:36:03,570
like the new steel. This is like
oil. What are you drinking?

574
00:36:04,800 --> 00:36:08,820
Dave Jones: Oh, crap. This is?
Waterloo, lemon lime.

575
00:36:08,850 --> 00:36:11,400
Adam Curry: Oh, that's good.
Yes, Waterloo is good. Yes. It

576
00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:13,320
has quote unquote natural
flavors. Don't

577
00:36:13,320 --> 00:36:15,690
Unknown: worry. It's all
natural. It's all natural.

578
00:36:16,890 --> 00:36:19,410
Adam Curry: Be I when I heard
him going, like, yeah, you know,

579
00:36:19,410 --> 00:36:23,580
he, he sees it for what it is.
And it is. I mean, there was a

580
00:36:23,580 --> 00:36:30,120
great what Bitcoin did that
Peter McCormick did with some

581
00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:34,320
dudes who sound like they know
what they're talking about. It

582
00:36:34,320 --> 00:36:38,700
was but I was just like, oh,
this look for sure bitcoin is

583
00:36:38,700 --> 00:36:42,960
doing something as evil or
people are showing up for it. So

584
00:36:42,960 --> 00:36:46,020
it can't just be for the for the
Bitcoiners who are out there.

585
00:36:46,020 --> 00:36:47,610
It's got to be for more you
know.

586
00:36:48,780 --> 00:36:51,450
Dave Jones: It's not it's not
just for the it's not just for

587
00:36:51,450 --> 00:36:52,980
the loud music. No,

588
00:36:52,980 --> 00:36:53,910
Adam Curry: no, no.

589
00:36:54,240 --> 00:36:58,620
Dave Jones: Well, you know it I
guess kind of on that note a

590
00:36:58,620 --> 00:37:05,820
little bit before I get in this
ad thing. The Bitcoin Conference

591
00:37:05,820 --> 00:37:13,230
itself does this people are tone
deaf man. They don't you had you

592
00:37:13,230 --> 00:37:21,030
had this giant usage going on?
Right outside your doors? Oh,

593
00:37:21,030 --> 00:37:27,870
yeah. Yeah, this bugs me too.
And of, of lightning. And like

594
00:37:27,870 --> 00:37:33,150
real this is the real list of
real world scenarios of actually

595
00:37:33,150 --> 00:37:39,570
using Bitcoin to, to transfer to
transfer money. Without

596
00:37:39,570 --> 00:37:42,180
intermediate. I mean, this is
everything they talk about.

597
00:37:42,210 --> 00:37:46,200
Yeah. And they end because?
Because because nobody was

598
00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:51,330
paying for a session. Yeah,
exactly. You're for a stage that

599
00:37:51,330 --> 00:37:53,700
not a single mention of it. No,

600
00:37:54,090 --> 00:37:56,820
Adam Curry: no. And if they even
know about it, they all think

601
00:37:56,820 --> 00:38:01,800
it's either only noster or only
fountain because no one actually

602
00:38:01,830 --> 00:38:05,130
does any any investigation. I
know. I know. It's what it is.

603
00:38:05,160 --> 00:38:07,560
Dave Jones: They're so concerned
about getting politicians to

604
00:38:07,560 --> 00:38:11,490
speak and in fun that you know,
in big financial players, that

605
00:38:11,490 --> 00:38:16,410
they completely just ignore
every every bit of like, Grant,

606
00:38:16,410 --> 00:38:17,820
you know, ground boots on the
ground.

607
00:38:17,820 --> 00:38:21,360
Adam Curry: Well, there they
are. There. A conference

608
00:38:21,360 --> 00:38:25,260
organizer? Yeah, that's what you
do. I was looking at someone,

609
00:38:25,320 --> 00:38:30,240
someone Eric pepper sent me
every back issue of Wired, going

610
00:38:30,240 --> 00:38:38,910
back to 2000 through the mail.
Weird, very, very, and in like

611
00:38:38,910 --> 00:38:44,670
2006 I don't have it in front of
me. There was this the new music

612
00:38:44,670 --> 00:38:46,890
business, it's all going to
change. It's all going to be

613
00:38:46,890 --> 00:38:50,580
fantastic. We got drone
audiences. And this is before

614
00:38:50,580 --> 00:38:56,160
Spotify and all that stuff. And
in general, nothing in Wired

615
00:38:56,160 --> 00:38:57,930
Magazine ever plays out.

616
00:38:58,200 --> 00:38:59,820
Dave Jones: None of it ever.

617
00:38:59,880 --> 00:39:04,650
Adam Curry: None of it. It's
amazing. Even they hadn't even

618
00:39:04,650 --> 00:39:10,350
2002 ai same promises in 2002.
We have 22 years later, none of

619
00:39:10,350 --> 00:39:13,800
it's happening. Except chatbots.
Got Chatbot.

620
00:39:14,550 --> 00:39:17,640
Dave Jones: Alex sent me this
thing. Twitch is doing like a DJ

621
00:39:17,640 --> 00:39:19,110
streaming thing. Did you see
that? Yeah, I

622
00:39:19,110 --> 00:39:22,620
Adam Curry: looked into that
what a bunch of hooey. So only

623
00:39:22,620 --> 00:39:23,250
like via

624
00:39:23,820 --> 00:39:25,380
Dave Jones: the subsidy program.

625
00:39:26,550 --> 00:39:28,410
Adam Curry: I don't know about
what's the subsidy program?

626
00:39:29,610 --> 00:39:31,680
Dave Jones: Well, it seems the
best we could figure out was it

627
00:39:31,680 --> 00:39:36,240
seems like what's going to
happen so they're available.

628
00:39:36,240 --> 00:39:39,300
It's it's kind of like tick
tock. It's C is C it reads this

629
00:39:39,300 --> 00:39:44,730
way. For anybody on the platform
can can stream licensed music.

630
00:39:45,480 --> 00:39:49,230
And if you actually make money
from it, then they're going to

631
00:39:49,230 --> 00:39:51,120
start to do a rev share. No,

632
00:39:51,330 --> 00:39:52,050
Adam Curry: no, no, no

633
00:39:52,050 --> 00:39:52,620
Dave Jones: labels.

634
00:39:52,650 --> 00:39:55,950
Adam Curry: No, I look I looked
at this. Okay, so it's only

635
00:39:55,950 --> 00:39:59,520
music that they have licensed
for you to play. It's not like

636
00:39:59,520 --> 00:40:02,640
you can just tell Make any music
and start playing it. So it's

637
00:40:02,640 --> 00:40:05,880
only from the library they make
available, but I don't know how

638
00:40:05,880 --> 00:40:08,520
much that is or how limited it
is that depends on what they got

639
00:40:08,520 --> 00:40:14,100
the blanket license for live
only, so you can't record it, it

640
00:40:14,100 --> 00:40:16,770
can you can't go back and look
at one can only be in live

641
00:40:16,770 --> 00:40:19,110
streaming. That's that's how
they're doing it because that

642
00:40:19,110 --> 00:40:24,930
fits under the, the auspices of
certain licenses that are kind

643
00:40:24,930 --> 00:40:30,240
of already out there and
available. And the monetization,

644
00:40:31,080 --> 00:40:34,710
it runs all through them. And so
they have something called bits,

645
00:40:34,710 --> 00:40:38,760
which is like you get a bid for
someone who signs up, you get if

646
00:40:38,760 --> 00:40:42,450
you can, if someone signs up to
the Twitch, you know, gaming

647
00:40:42,450 --> 00:40:48,360
supreme service, then you get
you get some money for that and

648
00:40:48,360 --> 00:40:52,230
it's different per country. And
they take the they give the

649
00:40:52,230 --> 00:40:55,230
revenue, the I don't even know
if you get if you get an

650
00:40:55,230 --> 00:40:58,260
accounting of it. They give
revenue to the to the labels

651
00:40:58,260 --> 00:41:01,650
before you even see it. And it's
not like a rev share, trust me

652
00:41:02,400 --> 00:41:04,830
is not a rev share. It's

653
00:41:04,830 --> 00:41:07,350
Dave Jones: a rev share in
reverse because yes, share some

654
00:41:07,350 --> 00:41:08,460
of the revenue. Yes,

655
00:41:09,270 --> 00:41:11,400
Adam Curry: exactly. You get and
they literally call them bits

656
00:41:11,400 --> 00:41:17,070
here's a bit for you got a bit
so now it's dumb is dumb.

657
00:41:18,150 --> 00:41:18,960
Unknown: This dumb well.

658
00:41:20,340 --> 00:41:23,850
Adam Curry: I think it's dumb,
whatever. It's fine people. I

659
00:41:23,850 --> 00:41:27,360
mean, there's been enough about
the the Twitch payouts that's

660
00:41:27,360 --> 00:41:30,030
been you know, it's been chopped
in half. And there's all kinds

661
00:41:30,030 --> 00:41:33,000
of stuff going on there. And you
really hold on to a company that

662
00:41:33,000 --> 00:41:36,120
can kick you off at a in a
heartbeat. You know, if you do

663
00:41:36,120 --> 00:41:40,020
too much of one artists, if you
you know you have you can't be

664
00:41:40,020 --> 00:41:42,810
like a jukebox. So you can't
take requests. I mean, all kinds

665
00:41:42,810 --> 00:41:43,740
of stuff you can't do.

666
00:41:45,210 --> 00:41:51,600
Dave Jones: If so, what that
gets me some we need to talk

667
00:41:51,600 --> 00:41:54,270
about. Let's do namespace real
quick.

668
00:41:54,840 --> 00:41:57,090
Adam Curry: Let's do namespace.

669
00:41:58,590 --> 00:42:03,420
Unknown: And now it's time for
some hot namespace talk. Yeah,

670
00:42:04,560 --> 00:42:06,960
Adam Curry: it's been a while
but we're back in the saddle.

671
00:42:12,030 --> 00:42:16,800
Dave Jones: So the the thing I
did last night was added the

672
00:42:16,800 --> 00:42:25,740
content link tag to be also you
to be also a child of the item

673
00:42:25,740 --> 00:42:30,360
tag. So before it was only used
as an it was only possible to

674
00:42:30,360 --> 00:42:35,280
add the content, the podcast
colon Content link tag, to a

675
00:42:35,280 --> 00:42:42,270
podcast colon live item tag. Now
you can add it to a normal item

676
00:42:42,270 --> 00:42:48,480
as well. Oh, okay. So, I mean,
this is this is really just, you

677
00:42:48,480 --> 00:42:52,950
know, the content link is there
to allow you to link out to

678
00:42:53,160 --> 00:42:58,890
external content that's outside
of the app. So like a YouTube

679
00:42:58,890 --> 00:43:03,720
link or something like that.
This this, so that's gonna,

680
00:43:03,780 --> 00:43:06,240
that's gonna make that's gonna
solve some problems like for

681
00:43:06,240 --> 00:43:12,030
Todd with his alternate
enclosure, troubles and that

682
00:43:12,030 --> 00:43:14,700
kind of thing. And also Nathan
has a lot of use cases for it

683
00:43:14,700 --> 00:43:23,130
for episode so I found the one
I'm looking at now. Is podcast

684
00:43:23,130 --> 00:43:25,140
follow podcast colon follow?

685
00:43:25,620 --> 00:43:26,310
Adam Curry: Yes.

686
00:43:27,000 --> 00:43:30,870
Dave Jones: And we can probably
talk more about that next week.

687
00:43:32,910 --> 00:43:37,950
The but the licenses by I feel
like we need to talk about this

688
00:43:37,950 --> 00:43:42,450
because I want to get that tied
up. Hopefully this weekend,

689
00:43:42,480 --> 00:43:49,500
okay. To do is the is the music
license. So I'm trying to

690
00:43:49,500 --> 00:43:52,860
understand where we are on that
is, here's here's my license and

691
00:43:52,860 --> 00:43:53,790
in music, here's

692
00:43:53,790 --> 00:43:56,760
Adam Curry: my understanding. My
understanding is that the

693
00:43:56,760 --> 00:44:00,060
Costello's have worked on and I
think they did a lot of it with

694
00:44:00,720 --> 00:44:07,140
Sam Sethi on what they're
calling a music license. And I'm

695
00:44:07,140 --> 00:44:11,940
fine with that. But I would
really maybe you can do to a

696
00:44:11,940 --> 00:44:16,500
main copy it and then call it a
remote a remote license or

697
00:44:16,500 --> 00:44:20,790
whatever because just calling it
a music license you're setting

698
00:44:20,790 --> 00:44:25,500
yourself up for trouble because
there is no difference between

699
00:44:25,560 --> 00:44:31,470
an mp3 That's a song and mp3
that's a that's a mix an mp3

700
00:44:31,470 --> 00:44:34,740
that's another piece of a
podcast and any remote items can

701
00:44:34,740 --> 00:44:38,700
be all kinds of things. So I
personally feel we should call

702
00:44:38,700 --> 00:44:42,870
it you know, remote item or
something and not limited to

703
00:44:42,870 --> 00:44:46,500
music. But if people want to
call it music, I'm fine with it.

704
00:44:46,560 --> 00:44:50,370
I haven't seen the final final,
but I'm sure I'm going to be

705
00:44:50,370 --> 00:44:52,770
fine with it because we went
through enough iterations of it

706
00:44:54,510 --> 00:44:58,260
Dave Jones: wherever this thing,
so this the music license is

707
00:44:58,260 --> 00:45:03,480
sort of like a It's sort of like
a unicorn. I've heard that it

708
00:45:03,480 --> 00:45:08,220
exists, but I've never actually
seen it in the wild. So if if

709
00:45:08,220 --> 00:45:13,980
somebody if if Julie horse or
Sam or somebody can like, send

710
00:45:13,980 --> 00:45:15,960
me a blurry photo of the unicorn

711
00:45:19,109 --> 00:45:21,179
Adam Curry: along with Bigfoot,
and we're good to go.

712
00:45:22,410 --> 00:45:26,460
Dave Jones: Yeah, if somebody
can send me a blurry image of

713
00:45:26,460 --> 00:45:31,320
this thing, I will put it into
the namespace. And also, so is

714
00:45:31,320 --> 00:45:35,430
there also a podcast license?
Because you're okay, here's,

715
00:45:35,460 --> 00:45:36,120
here's what

716
00:45:36,210 --> 00:45:39,660
Adam Curry: I think. thing
maybe, I don't know. Okay,

717
00:45:39,690 --> 00:45:43,320
Dave Jones: I've stayed out of
have stayed out of some of this

718
00:45:43,320 --> 00:45:48,210
discussion because it's outside
my lane, and inlet and other

719
00:45:48,210 --> 00:45:51,780
people deal with it. So what
I've seen referenced is a music

720
00:45:51,780 --> 00:45:57,600
license, a podcast license and a
V for V license. Right. I don't

721
00:45:57,600 --> 00:46:01,470
know which ones are those are
separate entities or they the

722
00:46:01,470 --> 00:46:02,820
same thing? I don't know. Okay,
well, we

723
00:46:02,820 --> 00:46:05,310
Adam Curry: have music mama on
the back bench in the in the

724
00:46:05,310 --> 00:46:09,120
boardroom, she says we're
consolidating. And we just need

725
00:46:09,630 --> 00:46:13,560
it to be a name. And I
personally really liked the V

726
00:46:13,560 --> 00:46:17,760
four v license. Because that's
what it is. I mean, you're

727
00:46:17,790 --> 00:46:23,910
you're sharing value back to
someone whose content you use in

728
00:46:23,910 --> 00:46:30,450
a value enabled situation. Now
if in the colloquial language

729
00:46:30,450 --> 00:46:33,510
that's called a V free music
license, that's fine. And by the

730
00:46:33,510 --> 00:46:37,170
way, I'm not a jihadist about
it. I'm just saying it makes it

731
00:46:37,170 --> 00:46:40,560
so much easier just to have a V
from V license and whatever it

732
00:46:40,560 --> 00:46:45,810
is, whatever that remote item
is, it's the value flows through

733
00:46:45,810 --> 00:46:49,230
to it through to the splits that
are generated by the remote

734
00:46:49,230 --> 00:46:53,880
item. Okay, and music Mama says
she thinks that we settled on V

735
00:46:53,880 --> 00:46:55,350
for v. So okay,

736
00:46:55,380 --> 00:47:00,300
Dave Jones: Julie, Julie, send
me send me what you got. And I

737
00:47:00,300 --> 00:47:03,120
will I will get everything
because what I did was I went

738
00:47:03,120 --> 00:47:06,120
through and took out the entire
long list of open source

739
00:47:06,120 --> 00:47:13,800
licenses yes like 300 that took
all that out and put it back in

740
00:47:14,370 --> 00:47:19,050
put only back in the Creative
Commons licenses and then

741
00:47:19,080 --> 00:47:23,130
whatever this this new thing is
going to be so it's just a short

742
00:47:23,130 --> 00:47:28,350
list in that list will seed
podcast hosting company you eyes

743
00:47:28,350 --> 00:47:32,940
and you know I cast upon you as
any anybody who needs access to

744
00:47:32,940 --> 00:47:36,030
this licensing niche have a can
base their drop down list off of

745
00:47:36,030 --> 00:47:39,900
this and you can just pick and
choose so I could if you'll send

746
00:47:39,900 --> 00:47:42,690
me what you got Julie? I'll make
that happen this weekend.

747
00:47:43,290 --> 00:47:45,720
Unknown: Okay, excellent. Good

748
00:47:45,720 --> 00:47:47,280
Dave Jones: if it's not right,
if we figure out something's

749
00:47:47,280 --> 00:47:50,520
wrong, yeah, we can change it.
Yeah, we can change it just like

750
00:47:50,550 --> 00:47:54,120
you know, this is a 1.8 V for V
license 1.0 And we'll change it

751
00:47:54,120 --> 00:47:55,650
to a 1.1 or something like that.

752
00:47:55,650 --> 00:47:56,910
Unknown: Yep. Yep, perfect.

753
00:47:57,000 --> 00:47:57,630
Perfect.

754
00:47:58,710 --> 00:48:03,840
Dave Jones: Okay I think all I
did with the

755
00:48:04,560 --> 00:48:05,310
Adam Curry: that's all you did
was

756
00:48:06,540 --> 00:48:08,850
Dave Jones: well for some of the
for some reason the face seven

757
00:48:08,850 --> 00:48:10,920
has been a real humongous pain
in the butt

758
00:48:12,360 --> 00:48:13,800
Adam Curry: we've been busy it's
been summer

759
00:48:15,210 --> 00:48:17,610
Dave Jones: he has been kind of
busy but it's also been like

760
00:48:17,610 --> 00:48:21,330
these things are some of these
things are like heaven required

761
00:48:21,330 --> 00:48:31,110
a lot of legwork like you know
like the the like the licensing

762
00:48:31,110 --> 00:48:34,860
thing is people have to do a lot
of stuff and then the keys like

763
00:48:34,860 --> 00:48:38,820
the keys end dress right
lighting interesting that took I

764
00:48:38,820 --> 00:48:42,540
mean that took a while took a
while yeah. of going back and

765
00:48:42,540 --> 00:48:45,090
forth and trying to just figure
out I mean it zoom meetings and

766
00:48:45,090 --> 00:48:48,750
stuff like these are just kind
of like annoying. This is the

767
00:48:48,780 --> 00:48:53,100
annoying phase. So if we can get
rid of if we can get through

768
00:48:53,100 --> 00:48:54,240
this one Sam

769
00:48:54,390 --> 00:48:57,450
Adam Curry: Sam just boosted in
with 1000 SATs as we call it the

770
00:48:57,450 --> 00:49:00,900
podcast license bill we're will
rename it to V for V license so

771
00:49:00,900 --> 00:49:04,170
we can include clips in the
future. Yes. Good. Okay, that

772
00:49:04,170 --> 00:49:07,080
Dave Jones: makes it makes
perfect perfect. Okay, cool.

773
00:49:07,080 --> 00:49:08,730
Says since in me things

774
00:49:08,820 --> 00:49:11,460
Adam Curry: yes. And he says
they send your things people

775
00:49:11,460 --> 00:49:13,740
send your thing is because

776
00:49:13,740 --> 00:49:17,100
Dave Jones: what's left on the
list is see what have we done

777
00:49:17,100 --> 00:49:20,580
already? We've added the case of
phase seven, we've added the

778
00:49:20,580 --> 00:49:27,570
publisher, medium and publisher
feeds those are thing now. acts

779
00:49:29,520 --> 00:49:37,680
as a chat, we added the chat
tag. And you know what I think

780
00:49:39,630 --> 00:49:42,120
category this is sort of
starting to feel like such a big

781
00:49:42,120 --> 00:49:42,600
phase

782
00:49:43,530 --> 00:49:47,730
Adam Curry: categories and tags
as categories if I recall. Yeah.

783
00:49:47,730 --> 00:49:51,150
Dave Jones: And I know we need
that really bad. I'm just man,

784
00:49:51,150 --> 00:49:57,000
that's a lot. I think they're, I
don't know. I mean, I hate to

785
00:49:57,000 --> 00:50:01,470
just keep this thing going
forever. I'm gonna have to think

786
00:50:01,470 --> 00:50:04,650
about that. I'm gonna think back
because I think I think we kind

787
00:50:04,650 --> 00:50:10,650
of know what to do. I feel like
I feel it, here's it, here's

788
00:50:10,650 --> 00:50:15,090
what it is. I feel like phase
eight is going to be just

789
00:50:15,090 --> 00:50:20,220
categories or tags slash tags.
And which is which is

790
00:50:20,220 --> 00:50:22,410
Adam Curry: big, which is going
to be a big one. That's not an

791
00:50:22,410 --> 00:50:23,370
easy one to do.

792
00:50:23,910 --> 00:50:27,750
Dave Jones: And if you mess it
up, it's bad. Yes. So one of

793
00:50:27,750 --> 00:50:32,250
them is that yeah, I feel like
we're gonna need to and know

794
00:50:32,280 --> 00:50:34,500
that it's a huge pain in the
butt. I mean, because it for the

795
00:50:34,530 --> 00:50:37,860
for music, especially we really
need some categories. Yeah,

796
00:50:37,950 --> 00:50:42,540
genres tags. What everyone cool.
But I feel like we just need to

797
00:50:42,570 --> 00:50:46,320
wrap this this other thing up is
getting lost in that shuffle.

798
00:50:46,320 --> 00:50:50,880
And I would say phase a really
almost needs to just be nothing

799
00:50:50,880 --> 00:50:55,080
but that Yeah, so we can all
focus on the one thing Yes,

800
00:50:55,080 --> 00:50:57,450
film. Exactly. Exactly. Yeah.
Cotton Gin, I think you just

801
00:50:57,450 --> 00:51:02,730
need to be on on phase. And
Eric's right film. Cuz we

802
00:51:02,730 --> 00:51:05,850
thought you know, because indie
hub. They're, they're sort of

803
00:51:05,850 --> 00:51:09,450
like the wave lake for video. If
you want to think of like that.

804
00:51:09,480 --> 00:51:13,320
Yep. They've started rolling out
RSS feeds. Oh, cool. I

805
00:51:13,320 --> 00:51:15,840
Adam Curry: was wondering how
that was going. Yeah.

806
00:51:17,910 --> 00:51:20,670
Dave Jones: I was working with
Zach and Dante on the backend

807
00:51:20,670 --> 00:51:24,150
for the last month or so.
They're excellent. Cuz they

808
00:51:24,150 --> 00:51:27,540
didn't know how to do HLS or any
of that stuff. And they've got

809
00:51:27,540 --> 00:51:31,380
all that working now. Cool.
Yeah. So they're going to need

810
00:51:31,380 --> 00:51:37,980
categories as well. Yeah.
genres. So anyway, that there's

811
00:51:37,980 --> 00:51:40,410
just I think, I think we just
need to put that in. In Phase

812
00:51:40,410 --> 00:51:45,180
eight, I'm just going to bump it
and Okay. Um, horses, we added

813
00:51:45,180 --> 00:51:49,590
the courses medium, I've just
still got to an Alex went and

814
00:51:49,920 --> 00:51:52,470
made the proper updates to pod
thing, I just gotta roll it to

815
00:51:52,470 --> 00:51:53,100
production.

816
00:51:56,460 --> 00:51:59,160
Adam Curry: But I just wanted to
respond, I haven't listened to

817
00:51:59,160 --> 00:52:03,420
all of it, just listen to a
little bit of Pardons weekly

818
00:52:03,420 --> 00:52:09,300
review. And I just want to
express my feelings. So they

819
00:52:09,300 --> 00:52:14,670
were talking about audiobooks.
And I truly believe audiobooks

820
00:52:14,670 --> 00:52:19,350
can work value for value. I
think you can start off each

821
00:52:19,350 --> 00:52:23,250
chapter with your pitch. I mean,
there's always to do it, I

822
00:52:23,250 --> 00:52:28,530
firmly believe in that. But I do
not believe and I just want to

823
00:52:28,530 --> 00:52:31,080
say it. So I know Sam's
listening, I just want to say

824
00:52:31,560 --> 00:52:35,340
the streaming SATs.
micropayments is not a model.

825
00:52:36,720 --> 00:52:42,030
It's you know, pay as you pay as
you go is not a model. In fact,

826
00:52:42,030 --> 00:52:44,880
we just talked about this one or
two weeks ago. So if I could do

827
00:52:44,880 --> 00:52:48,870
away with it, I'd be fine with
that too. Because it confuses

828
00:52:48,870 --> 00:52:53,880
people. Value for value is a
philosophy. And it only works if

829
00:52:53,880 --> 00:52:59,220
you ask if you receive and if
you think which is something

830
00:52:59,220 --> 00:53:01,260
that can be done even
dynamically. You can thank

831
00:53:01,260 --> 00:53:03,780
people, you know, at the
beginning of a new chapter,

832
00:53:03,780 --> 00:53:06,600
there's all kinds of things that
can be done. I don't have a book

833
00:53:06,600 --> 00:53:10,320
to do. But man, I can see how it
will be done. And I believe in

834
00:53:10,320 --> 00:53:15,750
it. I really do. I think it will
work quite well. But but there's

835
00:53:15,750 --> 00:53:21,210
this misconception. And I don't
I do not believe that you can

836
00:53:21,210 --> 00:53:24,420
say well pay as you go fill up
your wallet and pay for stuff

837
00:53:24,420 --> 00:53:27,930
you consume. That's not how it
will never work that way.

838
00:53:29,340 --> 00:53:30,930
Dave Jones: What do you mean,
what why not?

839
00:53:32,850 --> 00:53:36,600
Adam Curry: People will not move
to that I just I have no if

840
00:53:36,630 --> 00:53:41,190
there's no evidence that people
will move to a model of I'm

841
00:53:41,190 --> 00:53:45,570
going to pay as I go. I just
don't believe it. You need the

842
00:53:45,960 --> 00:53:54,210
value for value concept needs to
come from an ask and from a and

843
00:53:54,510 --> 00:53:59,070
ingratitude. It can't just be
I'm throwing this stuff up and

844
00:53:59,100 --> 00:54:03,090
you should use this app and pay
me it's just it. There's no

845
00:54:03,090 --> 00:54:06,960
reason for it to work. So it's
so saying instead of a

846
00:54:06,960 --> 00:54:12,480
subscription, or a paywall
model, you just everyone just

847
00:54:12,480 --> 00:54:17,460
streams for what they use. No,
it won't work. I mean, go ahead

848
00:54:17,460 --> 00:54:21,480
and try. I'm happy to be proven
wrong. But I don't think it'll

849
00:54:21,480 --> 00:54:24,570
work. People set value because
they understand the pitch. They

850
00:54:24,570 --> 00:54:27,360
understand what it's about. They
understand what they're

851
00:54:27,360 --> 00:54:30,690
supporting. It's not like
everything. I use everything I

852
00:54:30,690 --> 00:54:35,160
review on the web now I'll pay
one set per page. No. People

853
00:54:35,160 --> 00:54:38,610
aren't like that. That's not how
it works. People want stuff for

854
00:54:38,610 --> 00:54:42,090
free. I I was I was listening to
my stepdaughter still with us.

855
00:54:44,010 --> 00:54:52,470
She's 22 be 28 January 27. And
she was talking about she has a

856
00:54:52,470 --> 00:54:57,150
friend in New York. And he
turned her on to open source

857
00:54:57,180 --> 00:55:00,630
book readers. He says open
source is great Did I get all

858
00:55:00,630 --> 00:55:03,750
these books for free? I said,
No. I said, No, what you're

859
00:55:03,750 --> 00:55:07,980
doing, what you're doing is you
are using an open source

860
00:55:07,980 --> 00:55:11,550
program, which people worked on
which you don't recognize how

861
00:55:11,550 --> 00:55:15,480
many people worked on that, to
steal content from some other

862
00:55:15,480 --> 00:55:19,830
system that basically got
cracked. Yes. And I said, that

863
00:55:19,830 --> 00:55:25,050
is not open source, and that is
not okay. And I say, I'm only

864
00:55:25,050 --> 00:55:28,860
going to say this once. And
people all the time, say, Hey,

865
00:55:29,160 --> 00:55:31,980
you can hook into my Plex
library get everything for free.

866
00:55:31,980 --> 00:55:36,870
I'm like, no, no, no, no, thank
you. I pay for my content one

867
00:55:36,870 --> 00:55:38,610
way or the other, I pay for my
content.

868
00:55:40,170 --> 00:55:45,450
Dave Jones: It's just different
versions of Usenet. In 1999,

869
00:55:45,480 --> 00:55:51,660
downloading TV show episodes.
Yes. You know, or movies. Yes.

870
00:55:51,690 --> 00:55:54,570
You know, there's a it's not
it's not any different than

871
00:55:54,570 --> 00:55:59,250
that. I mean, it's not I think I
understand what you're saying

872
00:55:59,250 --> 00:56:02,070
about the, you're just say
you're just saying that the ad

873
00:56:02,100 --> 00:56:08,340
that if the ask is not there,
then that's the problem. Yes.

874
00:56:09,360 --> 00:56:11,940
Adam Curry: Be as you got to
explain yourself to you got to

875
00:56:11,940 --> 00:56:15,480
explain how it works. What
you're doing. Right.

876
00:56:15,900 --> 00:56:18,840
Dave Jones: It's the stream
because um, because the first

877
00:56:18,840 --> 00:56:23,490
thing I'm you know, thought when
you said that was last stream

878
00:56:23,490 --> 00:56:26,880
says to shows all the time, and
don't boost I mean, I stream as

879
00:56:26,880 --> 00:56:32,100
I'm listening, but it's because
that is because they do is

880
00:56:32,100 --> 00:56:38,190
because they ask yes. Yeah,
because like the shows, the

881
00:56:38,190 --> 00:56:44,820
shows I do that for our shows
that coder radio, Putney pod

882
00:56:44,820 --> 00:56:47,850
news, weekly review.

883
00:56:48,810 --> 00:56:51,000
Adam Curry: Yeah, I mean, I
stream to shows that I really

884
00:56:51,000 --> 00:56:54,210
care about 200 SATs a minute
standard fare, I don't care what

885
00:56:54,210 --> 00:56:58,710
the bitcoin price is. It's just
200 SATs a minute. But it's

886
00:56:58,710 --> 00:57:02,160
like, you know, if saying micro
payments will work. It's like

887
00:57:02,160 --> 00:57:05,370
saying, okay, so every person
who walks by the guy playing in

888
00:57:05,370 --> 00:57:10,350
the subway is guaranteed to put
money into the jar? No. No,

889
00:57:10,380 --> 00:57:10,740
well,

890
00:57:10,920 --> 00:57:13,560
Dave Jones: the reason true
fans, I think the reason true

891
00:57:13,560 --> 00:57:20,190
fans is not not on the audio
books. I'm thinking I'm just I'm

892
00:57:20,190 --> 00:57:21,930
not thinking about the audio
books. Right now I'm thinking

893
00:57:21,930 --> 00:57:27,330
about something like true fans
or fountain is because they're

894
00:57:27,330 --> 00:57:32,280
sort of interceding and doing
the ask to a certain degree on

895
00:57:32,310 --> 00:57:37,080
on behalf of the podcaster. Or
there's like a there's a there's

896
00:57:37,080 --> 00:57:40,920
an ask this being overlaid on
top of a podcaster, who's not

897
00:57:40,920 --> 00:57:45,450
doing the Ask agreed. So that
it's like that works to a

898
00:57:45,450 --> 00:57:49,800
degree. But then if but at some
point, the podcaster themselves

899
00:57:49,800 --> 00:57:53,190
really needs to, to integrate
the feedback loop or else that

900
00:57:53,400 --> 00:57:57,810
they just don't get very far. Or
at least that's the way it seems

901
00:57:57,810 --> 00:57:58,110
to me.

902
00:57:58,140 --> 00:58:01,680
Adam Curry: Yeah. Sam is is
boosting away like crazy. But

903
00:58:02,040 --> 00:58:04,920
the bottom line is, if you can
make it work, I'm happy for you

904
00:58:04,920 --> 00:58:07,170
to make it work. But now you
become a platform, and you're a

905
00:58:07,170 --> 00:58:10,500
platform where people come to
your platform to do things in a

906
00:58:10,500 --> 00:58:12,900
certain way. And that's okay.

907
00:58:15,210 --> 00:58:18,600
Dave Jones: Yeah, I mean, well,
the plat, the platform like,

908
00:58:18,960 --> 00:58:22,170
like in the, in the case of true
fans of fountain, the platform

909
00:58:22,950 --> 00:58:26,340
is the ask, as long as their
standard, you know, in their

910
00:58:26,340 --> 00:58:31,440
standard compliant with, with
open protocols. And that, you

911
00:58:31,440 --> 00:58:33,840
know, peer and peer to peer
payments and that kind of thing.

912
00:58:33,840 --> 00:58:37,860
So the, the platform becomes the
ask, because there's so many

913
00:58:37,860 --> 00:58:39,930
people that are just not asking.
Yes.

914
00:58:40,680 --> 00:58:44,850
Adam Curry: Yeah, I mean, if you
can create, and I think that

915
00:58:44,850 --> 00:58:49,050
Sam's vision, which is okay, but
it's not value for value, it's

916
00:58:49,080 --> 00:58:53,700
He keeps talking about a micro
payments model, okay. The reason

917
00:58:53,700 --> 00:58:57,180
why there's no micro payments
model is because it won't work.

918
00:58:57,690 --> 00:59:02,010
In my humble opinion. I've been
doing value for value for a long

919
00:59:02,010 --> 00:59:06,510
time. It's tough. It's tough,
and it's a roller coaster, and

920
00:59:06,510 --> 00:59:08,940
you got to keep reminding
people, I will just keep saying

921
00:59:08,940 --> 00:59:12,060
it. You got to keep reminding
people, that this is how it

922
00:59:12,060 --> 00:59:19,140
works. I've seen I've seen
books, you know, DeVore X set up

923
00:59:19,140 --> 00:59:21,870
a publishing company, and he
published his wife's book, too

924
00:59:21,870 --> 00:59:26,940
many eggs to too many eggs.com.
And this is and by the way, it

925
00:59:26,940 --> 00:59:30,210
won it won an award at the book
publishers fair or something in

926
00:59:30,210 --> 00:59:35,760
California, best cooking book,
and the book itself, which is

927
00:59:35,760 --> 00:59:39,360
not a cheap book. It's like 60
or 70 bucks, I think. And it's a

928
00:59:39,360 --> 00:59:42,990
huge hardcover book. It's I
mean, it's an amazing

929
00:59:42,990 --> 00:59:47,490
production, but they give away
the PDF for free. And it's some

930
00:59:47,520 --> 00:59:52,350
astronomical percentage like 85%
of people who download the PDF

931
00:59:52,350 --> 00:59:57,840
for free, buy the book. And they
just say it's value for value

932
00:59:57,840 --> 01:00:00,630
here. You can take this take me
I'll use it Whatever you want,

933
01:00:00,630 --> 01:00:03,570
but people like it so much, and
they appreciate the work, they

934
01:00:03,570 --> 01:00:06,810
come back and then boom, they
buy the book,

935
01:00:08,099 --> 01:00:12,389
Dave Jones: you know, in a very
early version of this was the

936
01:00:12,389 --> 01:00:20,909
Mises Institute. They, they were
doing this in like 1999. So what

937
01:00:21,119 --> 01:00:24,659
they what they did in there,
they're located down here in

938
01:00:24,659 --> 01:00:31,349
Auburn, Auburn, Alabama, they,
they start they made, they took

939
01:00:31,349 --> 01:00:34,709
all they would go to all this
trouble to find these old books,

940
01:00:34,709 --> 01:00:39,419
let's just let's just say, an
old book like barley bum Bobrick

941
01:00:39,419 --> 01:00:48,479
or, or Adam Smith, or like these
old works that were that had

942
01:00:48,479 --> 01:00:53,309
long, complicated copyright,
this hard to track. And they

943
01:00:53,309 --> 01:00:56,939
would do a lot of legwork to
find these to track down the,

944
01:00:57,419 --> 01:01:00,989
the who's the right current
rights holder, get permit, get

945
01:01:00,989 --> 01:01:04,109
the appropriate permissions, and
all this kind of stuff, which is

946
01:01:04,109 --> 01:01:07,769
a lot of work. And they would
get all that sorted out. And

947
01:01:08,009 --> 01:01:11,399
then they would make available,
they would, they would always do

948
01:01:11,759 --> 01:01:15,479
two versions, they would do an
ebook version that was free to

949
01:01:15,479 --> 01:01:19,079
download from their website. And
they do would do a hardcover

950
01:01:19,109 --> 01:01:26,189
print copy that you could order
from their store. And the same

951
01:01:26,189 --> 01:01:30,299
thing, almost people all tons of
people downloaded the PDFs, and

952
01:01:30,299 --> 01:01:35,849
the ebooks, but they always had
tons of sales on the store.

953
01:01:36,119 --> 01:01:36,449
here's

954
01:01:36,450 --> 01:01:39,720
Adam Curry: the here's the
pitch. It's actually $48 for the

955
01:01:39,720 --> 01:01:43,380
hardcover, this so they have
hardcover, $48 by hardcover, and

956
01:01:43,380 --> 01:01:47,550
then they have PDF, download
free PDF $0. And it says

957
01:01:47,550 --> 01:01:49,950
underneath that price should not
be a barrier to knowledge

958
01:01:49,950 --> 01:01:52,950
access, which is why providing
the PDF version of this book

959
01:01:52,950 --> 01:01:55,980
free to download donations to
support this effort provide free

960
01:01:55,980 --> 01:01:58,740
ebooks are welcome and
appreciate it. You can donate

961
01:01:58,740 --> 01:02:02,880
via PayPal or send cheques. And
I know that they did good money

962
01:02:02,880 --> 01:02:05,070
on it. I don't know exactly what
but I know that they're going to

963
01:02:05,070 --> 01:02:09,480
do more books, because this
model works. And that is that is

964
01:02:09,480 --> 01:02:17,010
a pure value for value model
with an extra twist. Yeah. So

965
01:02:17,040 --> 01:02:21,180
anyway, I'm just saying I
believe in audiobooks. I really

966
01:02:21,180 --> 01:02:27,270
do. I believe though work and as
many ways to do it. But it's

967
01:02:27,270 --> 01:02:30,360
scary. It's scary. I'm gonna be
the first to admit value for

968
01:02:30,360 --> 01:02:31,560
value is scary.

969
01:02:34,890 --> 01:02:39,810
Dave Jones: So that goes over
into, into, as you can tell

970
01:02:39,810 --> 01:02:42,210
about ads skipping, you know,
because that's kind of a big

971
01:02:42,210 --> 01:02:42,930
deal right now.

972
01:02:43,680 --> 01:02:45,780
Adam Curry: Yeah, I haven't
really followed that closely.

973
01:02:45,780 --> 01:02:46,080
But

974
01:02:46,170 --> 01:02:48,210
Dave Jones: well, which is it's
the whole thing is funny. So

975
01:02:48,210 --> 01:02:51,870
there's new this new app came
out. That's No,

976
01:02:51,870 --> 01:02:54,600
Adam Curry: I heard this. This
sounds like a kid who has never

977
01:02:54,600 --> 01:02:57,120
even looked at podcasting.
Really?

978
01:02:59,490 --> 01:03:01,590
Dave Jones: I didn't, I did not
hear the interview. Oh,

979
01:03:01,590 --> 01:03:04,770
Adam Curry: I did. He's like,
Yeah, you know, people should be

980
01:03:04,770 --> 01:03:07,680
able to support podcasters
directly, they should not to

981
01:03:07,680 --> 01:03:09,150
take ads out welcome.

982
01:03:11,670 --> 01:03:17,700
Dave Jones: Yeah. ad load, like
ad load is a huge deal, like

983
01:03:17,700 --> 01:03:21,060
it's becoming is becoming more
of a problem to the point where,

984
01:03:21,780 --> 01:03:24,120
you know, it's gotten, it's
gotten bad enough to where

985
01:03:24,120 --> 01:03:28,890
things like this are going to
start to be a thing. And I

986
01:03:28,890 --> 01:03:32,490
guess, I guess, you know,
there's always this ethics issue

987
01:03:32,490 --> 01:03:36,480
that comes up around this, but,
uh, so I had a couple of

988
01:03:36,480 --> 01:03:41,670
thoughts. If you're down, sorry.

989
01:03:43,410 --> 01:03:46,560
Adam Curry: Sorry, someone if
you're downloading

990
01:03:47,700 --> 01:03:51,510
Dave Jones: is, okay, this goes
back to the beginning of

991
01:03:52,500 --> 01:03:58,470
podcasting. Pot trying to figure
out a swarm of thoughts, your

992
01:03:58,980 --> 01:04:07,170
podcast apps. You should always,
in my opinion, podcast apps

993
01:04:07,200 --> 01:04:12,510
should always download the
episode before playing it. I

994
01:04:12,510 --> 01:04:15,960
think what Marco did on the
recent release of overcast is

995
01:04:15,960 --> 01:04:22,770
exactly the correct right thing
to do. The some at some point in

996
01:04:22,770 --> 01:04:27,570
the game when bandwidth got
faster. Podcast apps started to

997
01:04:28,170 --> 01:04:31,950
emerge in I don't know if it was
stitcher or who was the first to

998
01:04:31,950 --> 01:04:34,800
do it, but they started to merge
in this concept. So you'd either

999
01:04:34,800 --> 01:04:43,290
have a download or stream and
the download like downloading is

1000
01:04:43,290 --> 01:04:49,140
what podcasting was supposed to
be. It was supposed to download

1001
01:04:49,140 --> 01:04:51,840
it ahead of time so that you
could listen to it later.

1002
01:04:51,840 --> 01:04:53,760
Adam Curry: Yeah, it was done at
the time for bandwidth

1003
01:04:53,760 --> 01:04:55,860
constraints for bandwidth

1004
01:04:55,860 --> 01:04:59,220
Dave Jones: constraints. But
that is the bird that is the

1005
01:04:59,220 --> 01:05:05,700
birthright of podcasting, first
ride is downloading the episode.

1006
01:05:05,970 --> 01:05:10,740
And then for later playback.
Now, whether that playback

1007
01:05:10,770 --> 01:05:16,020
whether that quote later
playback is like, three seconds

1008
01:05:16,020 --> 01:05:21,840
later, or three days later, is
sort of irrelevant. In the

1009
01:05:22,080 --> 01:05:26,130
street streaming started to
creep its way into podcast apps,

1010
01:05:26,820 --> 01:05:31,380
you know, a few years into
podcasting, and everything just

1011
01:05:31,380 --> 01:05:36,210
got super messy. Yeah. But
that's why that's why to this

1012
01:05:36,210 --> 01:05:39,630
day, the download, quote
unquote, is still the metric by

1013
01:05:39,630 --> 01:05:44,070
which podcasting is measured,
and measured by downloads.

1014
01:05:44,340 --> 01:05:48,210
Because that's been the
assumption from the beginning is

1015
01:05:48,210 --> 01:05:50,880
that there's going to be a
download, whether it's above

1016
01:05:50,880 --> 01:05:54,480
complete, full download, or
partial, whatever, the download

1017
01:05:54,480 --> 01:06:01,260
is still the flag that we all
plan on. So the, you know, ad

1018
01:06:01,260 --> 01:06:07,320
skipping to me, is almost
irrelevant. Because if you're

1019
01:06:07,320 --> 01:06:12,510
downloading the episode ahead of
time, you the from the

1020
01:06:12,510 --> 01:06:17,940
advertisers standpoint, the ads
been delivered. And you're never

1021
01:06:17,970 --> 01:06:21,510
you're never going to know if
they actually listened to it or

1022
01:06:21,510 --> 01:06:26,430
not. Because you can't there's
no such thing as playback

1023
01:06:26,430 --> 01:06:31,290
metrics on anything other than
Apple podcasts and YouTube, and

1024
01:06:31,290 --> 01:06:34,830
nobody, yeah, nobody reports
that they just report download

1025
01:06:34,830 --> 01:06:42,540
metrics. Yeah, a be compliant
download metrics. So if I don't

1026
01:06:42,570 --> 01:06:46,890
even see where ad skipping is, I
don't see the ethics of this.

1027
01:06:47,640 --> 01:06:55,110
Because prop download downloaded
episodes become opaque to the

1028
01:06:55,110 --> 01:07:00,360
advertisers anyway. So to me,
this is all like that, that

1029
01:07:00,360 --> 01:07:04,650
whole thing is just, it's kind
of like a non dual also, also at

1030
01:07:04,650 --> 01:07:05,820
least give me a non sequitur.

1031
01:07:05,910 --> 01:07:10,170
Adam Curry: You know, and this
is it. I'll concede to this. If

1032
01:07:10,170 --> 01:07:17,070
you're going to have speed
enhancers, audio enhancers, if

1033
01:07:17,070 --> 01:07:20,370
you're going to, you know, once
you've downloaded the episode,

1034
01:07:20,370 --> 01:07:23,670
and you're you're changing it to
listen to it the way you want to

1035
01:07:23,670 --> 01:07:29,400
listen to it. It's fair game.
Yeah. And, you know, I can

1036
01:07:29,400 --> 01:07:31,740
remember what app had it. I
don't know if it's still like

1037
01:07:31,740 --> 01:07:35,100
there was an app at some point
that you could say, Okay, for

1038
01:07:35,100 --> 01:07:39,330
the Joe Rogan podcast started at
three minutes and 50 seconds

1039
01:07:39,750 --> 01:07:42,870
into the episode because that
skips the the ads.

1040
01:07:42,870 --> 01:07:45,420
Dave Jones: Yeah, yep. I
remember I cast ematic does

1041
01:07:45,420 --> 01:07:46,680
that. Okay, so

1042
01:07:46,770 --> 01:07:49,380
Adam Curry: it's like, Yeah,
Ben, if, if we're all going to

1043
01:07:49,380 --> 01:07:52,830
be fine with with
transmogrifying, my beautifully

1044
01:07:53,040 --> 01:07:58,080
produced audio into something
that's faster, or that has

1045
01:07:58,590 --> 01:08:01,650
enhanced sound capabilities,
which is really what Marco

1046
01:08:01,650 --> 01:08:06,030
started with, that I'm okay. I
have to be okay with that. Even

1047
01:08:06,030 --> 01:08:09,000
though I think it's bad for your
brain, that's the main thing is

1048
01:08:09,000 --> 01:08:13,020
like, why you do that? Why would
you run past the Mona Lisa?

1049
01:08:14,010 --> 01:08:18,630
Well, so it's beautiful art. But
okay, if that's how you, you

1050
01:08:18,630 --> 01:08:21,000
know, some people throw paint on
the Mona Lisa, whatever you want

1051
01:08:21,000 --> 01:08:25,140
to do, or soup? Yeah, that's
fine. But then, yeah, ad

1052
01:08:25,140 --> 01:08:28,650
skipping is? And, and I don't
think there's any ethics to it

1053
01:08:28,650 --> 01:08:32,640
at all. And thank you for saying
it's the birth right. Because

1054
01:08:32,790 --> 01:08:35,670
what is always thrown back is
well, you know, advertising

1055
01:08:35,670 --> 01:08:39,210
supports this industry. It's not
an industry. That's your

1056
01:08:39,210 --> 01:08:43,830
industry. Yeah, that's not
podcasting. Podcasting is not an

1057
01:08:43,830 --> 01:08:50,310
industry. Value for value is not
an industry. It's a thing, it's

1058
01:08:50,310 --> 01:08:51,030
just the thing.

1059
01:08:52,229 --> 01:08:56,849
Dave Jones: Which leads me to
the sort of, sort of an idea is

1060
01:08:56,849 --> 01:09:03,509
why can't you? Why can't apps.
So we have this we have this

1061
01:09:03,509 --> 01:09:07,859
idea that you're going to that
have you know, the download is

1062
01:09:07,859 --> 01:09:14,909
the is the heart and soul of of
the metric. Why could you not as

1063
01:09:14,909 --> 01:09:23,609
an app, send a head request for
that enclosure? after the fact

1064
01:09:23,609 --> 01:09:28,619
when somebody hits its play. The
first time they hit the hit play

1065
01:09:28,619 --> 01:09:34,259
on the episode, you just send an
HTTP header request with with a

1066
01:09:34,259 --> 01:09:35,159
parameter

1067
01:09:35,279 --> 01:09:37,319
Adam Curry: or this like it will
ring like it was played like

1068
01:09:37,319 --> 01:09:37,529
hey,

1069
01:09:39,270 --> 01:09:42,300
Dave Jones: or a header.
Something in there either a

1070
01:09:42,300 --> 01:09:49,050
header or a URL parameter. This
says this was played well, bad

1071
01:09:49,050 --> 01:09:49,770
playback.

1072
01:09:50,250 --> 01:09:52,800
Adam Curry: I can tell you right
now that no one in the

1073
01:09:52,800 --> 01:09:54,450
advertising business wants that.

1074
01:09:56,670 --> 01:10:01,350
Dave Jones: Right, but I'm sure
you know why. Yes, exactly.

1075
01:10:01,620 --> 01:10:03,930
Because they don't actually want
to know how many people played

1076
01:10:03,930 --> 01:10:06,120
it. They want downloads, because
the download number is always

1077
01:10:06,120 --> 01:10:13,170
way bigger, correct? Yes. But
the that would be something that

1078
01:10:13,200 --> 01:10:16,590
that would be something that
apps apps could provide. If they

1079
01:10:16,590 --> 01:10:20,460
wanted to play back a true
playback number. Yeah, that

1080
01:10:20,460 --> 01:10:23,010
would be not, it would not be
bandwidth intensive, it would

1081
01:10:23,010 --> 01:10:26,910
just be a very simple thing. I
guess I started thinking about

1082
01:10:26,910 --> 01:10:32,610
all this in context of, yeah, I
saw that. I saw the ad rates,

1083
01:10:32,610 --> 01:10:37,260
James reported the ad, like the
advertising CPMs from advertised

1084
01:10:37,260 --> 01:10:41,460
cast or Lipson nazzer, whatever
they call it now. And, and I'm

1085
01:10:41,460 --> 01:10:44,550
combining this in the back of my
mind for months now there's been

1086
01:10:44,550 --> 01:10:50,490
this. If you look at the, if you
look at the, like the total

1087
01:10:50,490 --> 01:10:54,450
number of shows that have
published an episode, if you

1088
01:10:54,450 --> 01:11:01,440
look at that stat over time, it
has just been slowly eroding.

1089
01:11:03,180 --> 01:11:07,680
Not I mean, not massively. Now,
a couple a couple points. Yeah,

1090
01:11:07,680 --> 01:11:13,890
one or one or two percentage
points, you know, a month, it's

1091
01:11:13,890 --> 01:11:19,350
just been slow, just this ever.
So gradual decline is not

1092
01:11:19,350 --> 01:11:22,770
catastrophic, or anything like
that. But it has been a slow

1093
01:11:23,400 --> 01:11:30,060
erosion of the total number of
shows publishing an episode. And

1094
01:11:31,830 --> 01:11:40,170
it it's that met Okay, so that
metric is sort of misleading on

1095
01:11:40,170 --> 01:11:45,750
its own, because for a long time
for longtime free podcast hosts,

1096
01:11:45,750 --> 01:11:48,810
like Spotify for podcasters,
which used to be called Anchor.

1097
01:11:49,770 --> 01:11:52,710
There's other there's others
that do this, but anchor was is

1098
01:11:52,770 --> 01:11:57,660
the worst offender. For so long,
those those free hosts just

1099
01:11:57,660 --> 01:12:01,590
pumped out hundreds of new
episodes a week from people just

1100
01:12:01,590 --> 01:12:01,950
screwing

1101
01:12:01,949 --> 01:12:04,589
Adam Curry: around. Yeah. Which
is why Spotify in their

1102
01:12:04,769 --> 01:12:08,849
quarterly report claimed 6
million podcasts. Okay, yeah,

1103
01:12:08,879 --> 01:12:09,959
exactly. Sure.

1104
01:12:10,800 --> 01:12:14,910
Dave Jones: I just, I stopped
auto ingesting anchor podcast

1105
01:12:14,940 --> 01:12:18,480
feeds and Spotify for podcaster
feeds into the index like a year

1106
01:12:18,480 --> 01:12:23,820
ago. Oh, yeah. And without that
noise in the stats, you see a

1107
01:12:23,820 --> 01:12:26,370
more accurate picture of how
many shows are actually

1108
01:12:26,370 --> 01:12:31,920
publishing. And so that number
has been gradually declining.

1109
01:12:32,070 --> 01:12:39,150
Yeah. And the reason I'm
bringing this up is because the,

1110
01:12:39,780 --> 01:12:42,450
if you look at the rates that
were put that James published

1111
01:12:42,450 --> 01:12:49,290
the other day, his See, look at
this is for July, for July of

1112
01:12:49,290 --> 01:12:56,790
2024. The average CPM for 62nd
spot was $21.90. Okay, so if you

1113
01:12:56,790 --> 01:13:02,940
go, luckily, I save all my old
emails. So looked back from May

1114
01:13:02,940 --> 01:13:09,540
of 22. So almost exactly two
years ago, the average CPM in

1115
01:13:09,540 --> 01:13:16,170
Lipson ads was $23.77. So you've
had, you've had the CPM has

1116
01:13:16,170 --> 01:13:22,860
fallen by $2 per 1000, over two
years.

1117
01:13:24,090 --> 01:13:26,250
Adam Curry: And you're not
taking inflation and all that

1118
01:13:26,250 --> 01:13:29,820
into account. That's what I was
about to say is the valuation of

1119
01:13:29,820 --> 01:13:30,420
the money.

1120
01:13:31,020 --> 01:13:36,990
Dave Jones: You've had an 8%
drop in CPM. And about a 17%

1121
01:13:36,990 --> 01:13:42,870
rise in inflation. Yeah. Over
two years. What, you know, one

1122
01:13:42,870 --> 01:13:46,500
reason the podcast ad market
hasn't tanked yet is because

1123
01:13:46,500 --> 01:13:50,040
advertising, we advertise or
they're getting a bang up deal.

1124
01:13:52,260 --> 01:13:55,740
Right. They are. I mean, they're
their prices over their cost

1125
01:13:55,740 --> 01:13:59,910
over time for ads. There's going
going down. Yeah, but it sucks

1126
01:13:59,910 --> 01:14:03,300
for podcasters Yeah, so the ad
supported for ad supported

1127
01:14:03,300 --> 01:14:07,800
podcasters. It hits. It hits the
lower middle class of podcasting

1128
01:14:07,800 --> 01:14:08,460
the hardest,

1129
01:14:09,029 --> 01:14:11,489
Adam Curry: like, just like the
real economy. Yeah.

1130
01:14:13,050 --> 01:14:18,060
Dave Jones: Yeah, thanks fed. So
I mean, like a show with, let's

1131
01:14:18,060 --> 01:14:22,020
see, was a shirt like a show
with it's got 100 like 100,000

1132
01:14:22,020 --> 01:14:28,170
downloads a month. That would be
$2,300. Right? 100 times see me

1133
01:14:28,170 --> 01:14:33,660
100 times 23 per 1000. So that's
$2,300. So in 2022, if you had

1134
01:14:33,660 --> 01:14:40,200
100 for one ad for one ad, for
one ad, yes, for one ad for 1/62

1135
01:14:40,200 --> 01:14:46,680
ad. And a lot a lot of shows
only have one ad. So you had

1136
01:14:46,680 --> 01:14:50,610
100,000 100,000 downloads your
your you're bringing in 2300

1137
01:14:50,610 --> 01:14:54,390
bucks for the month that's 100
downloads 100,000 downloads

1138
01:14:54,390 --> 01:14:55,890
every month and that's a decent
sized show.

1139
01:14:55,920 --> 01:14:58,590
Adam Curry: That's that's no
agenda level. No, I'm sorry.

1140
01:14:58,620 --> 01:15:01,170
That's per episode. No, no, it's
was terrible. It's a 10th of no

1141
01:15:01,170 --> 01:15:03,810
agenda. So yeah. Okay, got it.
Still

1142
01:15:03,809 --> 01:15:09,629
Dave Jones: a very decent sized
show. Yeah. In. So in 2020 2020,

1143
01:15:09,629 --> 01:15:15,329
fours brez give me a 2022. He
was bringing in $2,300. That

1144
01:15:15,329 --> 01:15:18,929
same show with the same download
metrics and 2024 is bringing in

1145
01:15:18,929 --> 01:15:24,029
$2,100. They're licking $200.
Less. Yeah. So that show, let's

1146
01:15:24,029 --> 01:15:29,189
say that show is like a 90
minute a week podcast, maybe you

1147
01:15:29,189 --> 01:15:33,029
were paying, then you're maybe
you're paying like in 2020. And

1148
01:15:33,029 --> 01:15:36,149
maybe you're paying at somebody
like 100 bucks a show to edit

1149
01:15:36,149 --> 01:15:39,449
it, you're not good at editing.
So you pay an editor to clean up

1150
01:15:39,449 --> 01:15:44,279
your audio and stuff like 100
bucks per episode. Now 2024,

1151
01:15:44,519 --> 01:15:48,599
same guys charging 150 bucks an
episode because of inflation. So

1152
01:15:48,599 --> 01:15:53,369
your costs went up $200 a month,
and your income went down? $200?

1153
01:15:53,369 --> 01:15:59,609
Unless you took a 20% hit? Yeah,
so maybe, maybe you don't do so

1154
01:15:59,609 --> 01:16:03,569
many episodes. Or maybe you go
get a part time job. I mean,

1155
01:16:03,569 --> 01:16:09,599
like this is real. This. There's
a lot going on here. There's a

1156
01:16:09,599 --> 01:16:13,169
lot of erosion going on here.
And then I'm sure that that's

1157
01:16:13,169 --> 01:16:17,249
one that's one pot, you know,
one explanation. Another one is,

1158
01:16:17,849 --> 01:16:22,739
in some cases, you know, maybe
the rates the cake, the rates

1159
01:16:22,739 --> 01:16:27,569
had to come down to sell, like
in order to sell ads. You know,

1160
01:16:27,569 --> 01:16:31,829
we know that's happening. But
let's say another scenario is is

1161
01:16:31,829 --> 01:16:35,159
a big advertiser that used to
buy 75 shows in a particular

1162
01:16:35,159 --> 01:16:38,669
sector like tech, now, they're
only buying 50 of the biggest

1163
01:16:38,669 --> 01:16:42,959
one, the 50 biggest ones. With
that, you know, to save costs,

1164
01:16:43,199 --> 01:16:46,829
well, if that advertiser, if
those 25 smaller shows, then

1165
01:16:46,859 --> 01:16:50,429
they only have been the only
advertiser for that show. And

1166
01:16:50,429 --> 01:16:55,409
100% responsible for 100% of
that income. So now you got 25

1167
01:16:55,409 --> 01:16:59,399
shows that have just been cut
loose. In there, they're going,

1168
01:16:59,669 --> 01:17:01,919
maybe six months goes by and
they can't find another

1169
01:17:01,919 --> 01:17:04,619
advertiser, they're just gonna,
they may give up, they give up

1170
01:17:04,649 --> 01:17:07,409
Adam Curry: well, if you're
coming into podcasting to make

1171
01:17:07,409 --> 01:17:12,329
money, I advise you find a lawn
mowing gig, that's better.

1172
01:17:13,649 --> 01:17:16,589
Seriously, I mean, the
advertising ultimately always

1173
01:17:16,589 --> 01:17:20,519
leads to censorship is not self
censorship. We've got Garm now

1174
01:17:20,879 --> 01:17:23,669
Garm is and you know, even
Twitter is signed up to guard

1175
01:17:23,669 --> 01:17:27,329
we're not going to be brand
safe. It's like ah, that's okay.

1176
01:17:27,329 --> 01:17:31,229
You know, fine. There are lots
of products and companies out

1177
01:17:31,229 --> 01:17:36,449
there that are happy to support
you if you you do an in in show

1178
01:17:36,449 --> 01:17:38,999
read and talk about how much you
love the product, you know,

1179
01:17:38,999 --> 01:17:42,119
which you'll have to be
convincing and give a code bond

1180
01:17:42,119 --> 01:17:46,409
Gino code bond Gino? You know,
that's I believe in that stuff.

1181
01:17:46,409 --> 01:17:50,699
But we're talking about dai and
it's a scourge, it's a scourge

1182
01:17:50,729 --> 01:17:52,349
on everything? No,

1183
01:17:52,350 --> 01:17:57,060
Dave Jones: I think it's great.
Right? For the for the longer

1184
01:17:57,060 --> 01:18:02,340
term, because as every month
that that CPM rate just stay

1185
01:18:02,340 --> 01:18:03,120
stagnant.

1186
01:18:03,149 --> 01:18:05,519
Adam Curry: Yeah, that's, that's
the more erosion there is.

1187
01:18:06,060 --> 01:18:10,770
Dave Jones: That is further
erosion, which it pushes, it

1188
01:18:10,770 --> 01:18:14,010
pushes average, it pushes
podcasters that do want to make

1189
01:18:14,010 --> 01:18:17,670
money, which is I mean, that's
only a small, you know, it's not

1190
01:18:17,670 --> 01:18:21,270
a it's not the majority. We know
the majority of podcasters just

1191
01:18:21,270 --> 01:18:25,350
do it, because they want to. But
that section that does want to

1192
01:18:25,350 --> 01:18:27,840
make money podcasting, it pushes
them into things that are more

1193
01:18:27,840 --> 01:18:31,980
sustainable. Hey, look, here's
your value. You know, whatever.

1194
01:18:32,039 --> 01:18:35,339
Adam Curry: Here's a sustainable
model, pod news, pod news, very

1195
01:18:35,339 --> 01:18:39,209
sustainable model, it starts off
telling me who the sponsor is

1196
01:18:39,209 --> 01:18:44,189
today. And there may or may not
be some stories in there from a

1197
01:18:44,189 --> 01:18:47,699
sponsor from time to time
doesn't really bother me. And

1198
01:18:47,729 --> 01:18:50,549
then it ends. And sometimes
there's people who support the

1199
01:18:50,549 --> 01:18:55,019
show bronze, silver gold, they
get to mention his fine, it's

1200
01:18:55,019 --> 01:18:58,319
fine. And it's not a 62nd hand.
It's like this is brought to you

1201
01:18:58,319 --> 01:19:02,699
by you know, Magellan AI or
Magallon depending on where

1202
01:19:02,699 --> 01:19:07,319
you're from. And it ends that
way. And that's fine. You know,

1203
01:19:07,319 --> 01:19:10,589
it's a short podcast, so I'm
gonna hear the tag at the end.

1204
01:19:10,859 --> 01:19:14,249
It doesn't bother me. It's all
groovy. I take it into account.

1205
01:19:14,669 --> 01:19:17,939
If I hear a story about someone
who's also a sponsor, either in

1206
01:19:17,939 --> 01:19:22,349
that show or later I'm like
okay, now noted. And James

1207
01:19:22,349 --> 01:19:25,709
always says support us value I
think out if he says value for

1208
01:19:25,709 --> 01:19:32,399
ice cream, you know 200 SATs per
minute and you know, every

1209
01:19:32,399 --> 01:19:36,179
single day so that adds up you
know, I may be streaming him 30

1210
01:19:36,179 --> 01:19:40,859
bucks a month and he mentioned
that and he thanks people for it

1211
01:19:40,859 --> 01:19:44,819
and you know that that's a good
model that works but there's no

1212
01:19:44,819 --> 01:19:48,899
dai there's no you know, there's
nothing popping in before the

1213
01:19:48,899 --> 01:19:50,429
show starts or anything like
that.

1214
01:19:51,149 --> 01:19:54,899
Dave Jones: Yeah, I think that
that's the that's Is this the

1215
01:19:54,899 --> 01:19:58,079
thing that has to go away? And
that's where all this see that's

1216
01:19:58,079 --> 01:20:01,949
where all this CPM BS right Oh
she comes CPM erosion comes

1217
01:20:01,949 --> 01:20:06,089
from. Yeah, it comes from that.
It comes from that just broken

1218
01:20:06,089 --> 01:20:10,319
model. And I think the, the more
the more that the quicker that

1219
01:20:10,319 --> 01:20:14,159
whole thing can just collapse is
the better. Shall

1220
01:20:14,160 --> 01:20:19,020
Adam Curry: we play a song? Yes,
please. So the booster grand

1221
01:20:19,020 --> 01:20:22,680
bowl episode 23 that I did live
and was broadcast live into the

1222
01:20:22,680 --> 01:20:27,060
venue, their Embassy Suites in
Nashville was mainly produced by

1223
01:20:27,060 --> 01:20:30,120
Jim Costello. I said, hey, send
me a list of songs. Send me a

1224
01:20:30,120 --> 01:20:33,060
setlist man. Send me some songs.
Tell me what you want me to

1225
01:20:33,060 --> 01:20:36,240
play? Because I didn't want to
miss anyone who was there? By

1226
01:20:36,240 --> 01:20:38,250
the way. I think Andy
rock'n'roll. Breakheart is my

1227
01:20:38,250 --> 01:20:39,420
favorite new artist.

1228
01:20:39,900 --> 01:20:40,770
Dave Jones: That guy's awesome.

1229
01:20:41,819 --> 01:20:46,199
Adam Curry: And he boosted me
back. He boosted like 18,000

1230
01:20:46,199 --> 01:20:47,459
SATs back to me.

1231
01:20:48,149 --> 01:20:52,079
Dave Jones: Nice. Yeah. Seeing
him live was a trip dude. He was

1232
01:20:52,229 --> 01:20:53,819
rolling floor and

1233
01:20:54,809 --> 01:20:56,699
Adam Curry: he's got you know,
he's got the two feet going he's

1234
01:20:56,699 --> 01:20:59,399
got the tambourine and the drum
and you know, the drumstick on

1235
01:20:59,399 --> 01:21:03,059
one he's got the kick on the
other one. And just doing Chuck

1236
01:21:03,059 --> 01:21:08,369
Berry riffs at you know 1000
times speed fantastic. I love

1237
01:21:08,369 --> 01:21:11,939
that guy. But I'm not gonna play
his song. There was another song

1238
01:21:11,939 --> 01:21:15,599
that when I heard it, I'm like,
Oh my God. I just this is my new

1239
01:21:15,599 --> 01:21:20,489
favorite song in the value
verse. I want everybody to boost

1240
01:21:20,489 --> 01:21:23,189
if you're going to boost this
show, boost this artists and

1241
01:21:23,189 --> 01:21:26,399
please tell the artists you
heard it on podcasting. 2.0

1242
01:21:26,789 --> 01:21:30,419
There's something about this
jack holiday that I love. This

1243
01:21:30,419 --> 01:21:31,769
one is titled tiptoe

1244
01:21:32,130 --> 01:21:36,150
Unknown: baby let your hand down
a nother wishes. You pick it up

1245
01:21:36,150 --> 01:21:42,600
and blow a kiss Sinead given
your best and push there ha baby

1246
01:21:42,600 --> 01:21:46,470
here's a showdown you don't tell
her you're coming it's a mental

1247
01:21:46,470 --> 01:21:50,640
game you're running your ground
and mighty high again even look

1248
01:21:50,670 --> 01:21:53,160
them in the eye you feed in the
name

1249
01:22:02,280 --> 01:22:18,090
if you what's your what's your

1250
01:22:26,790 --> 01:22:28,200
shine your brightest

1251
01:22:30,479 --> 01:22:31,199
just tip

1252
01:22:42,930 --> 01:22:47,250
you can make the rules now whose
game you play? What are you

1253
01:22:47,250 --> 01:22:51,330
making? It's written in a storm.
Can you tell them who you are?

1254
01:22:52,980 --> 01:22:57,240
Take a good look now she who
sticks shop when you cross the

1255
01:22:57,240 --> 01:23:02,220
finish line who's still on your
mind run your races in huge

1256
01:23:02,220 --> 01:23:04,110
shine your feet in the knee

1257
01:23:12,990 --> 01:23:19,170
if you see

1258
01:23:37,529 --> 01:23:38,279
shine decide your

1259
01:23:39,869 --> 01:23:41,909
skill tip

1260
01:24:02,100 --> 01:24:03,930
Adam Curry: I mean the songs
just got everything he got

1261
01:24:03,930 --> 01:24:11,370
saxophone you got to drive a
baseline. obvious lack of auto

1262
01:24:11,370 --> 01:24:17,730
tune, love it. Love this whole
whole album of that. I really

1263
01:24:17,730 --> 01:24:21,750
could. I love that as a great
song. Kind of Macy Gray. Little

1264
01:24:21,750 --> 01:24:24,600
bit of Alicia Keys vibe and
their whole thing is good, man.

1265
01:24:24,600 --> 01:24:25,080
I like it.

1266
01:24:25,800 --> 01:24:29,820
Dave Jones: Oh, Julie, send me
the license. Hey. License

1267
01:24:29,820 --> 01:24:32,730
Adam Curry: is shooting. Oh, we
got a baller or sound like a

1268
01:24:32,730 --> 01:24:36,990
mini baller sound like a 10,000
baller. Let's see. Nice

1269
01:24:37,050 --> 01:24:39,750
anonymous podcast guru user
10,000.

1270
01:24:40,409 --> 01:24:43,109
Unknown: Oh, thank you
anonymous. Area is beautiful

1271
01:24:43,139 --> 01:24:44,069
that with a

1272
01:24:44,669 --> 01:24:47,009
Adam Curry: hand clap V for V.
Thank you very much. I went

1273
01:24:47,009 --> 01:24:50,519
straight to the artist. Love
that. That's how you got to do

1274
01:24:50,519 --> 01:24:50,789
it.

1275
01:24:51,810 --> 01:24:59,970
Dave Jones: Yeah, I think I
think we think podcast follows

1276
01:25:00,000 --> 01:25:05,850
Oh, I think we'll talk about
that next week. Okay. That's

1277
01:25:05,850 --> 01:25:13,290
another NASA Nathan gathright
proposal on the namespace uh, we

1278
01:25:13,290 --> 01:25:16,860
got it you know what I've been
remiss I've got to check out

1279
01:25:16,860 --> 01:25:19,860
headliners. News two point out
chapter tool.

1280
01:25:20,489 --> 01:25:21,539
Adam Curry: Oh, okay.

1281
01:25:22,320 --> 01:25:28,770
Dave Jones: So that they added
like a mischievous and had she

1282
01:25:28,770 --> 01:25:34,230
has to look at this that So
chapter feature, right yeah it's

1283
01:25:34,230 --> 01:25:38,040
like really similar to hyper
Capture Studio outputs is a JSON

1284
01:25:38,640 --> 01:25:42,630
and they integrated it into
their like their AI things so

1285
01:25:42,630 --> 01:25:45,300
that gives you it gives you a
bunch of like it gives you a

1286
01:25:45,300 --> 01:25:47,670
bunch of chapters to start with
and then you can go back and

1287
01:25:47,790 --> 01:25:51,120
edit them to be whatever you
want. And it's supposed to be

1288
01:25:51,120 --> 01:25:54,510
collaborative, like hyper
capture. So I've been meaning to

1289
01:25:54,510 --> 01:25:59,160
check that out. Yeah, they give
me max over there. Give me a log

1290
01:25:59,160 --> 01:26:00,930
in. I need to mark this

1291
01:26:01,680 --> 01:26:02,340
Adam Curry: beautiful

1292
01:26:05,130 --> 01:26:09,060
Dave Jones: mark that so though,
I just found this feature in

1293
01:26:09,060 --> 01:26:12,600
fast mail the other day that I
didn't know that this news

1294
01:26:12,600 --> 01:26:13,140
feature

1295
01:26:13,979 --> 01:26:17,699
Adam Curry: you can snooze a
person snooze an email. Oh, and

1296
01:26:17,699 --> 01:26:21,059
it'll come back. There's a pop
back up to the top of the stack

1297
01:26:21,059 --> 01:26:21,839
or what does it do?

1298
01:26:21,990 --> 01:26:23,550
Dave Jones: I think yeah, I
think so. Yeah,

1299
01:26:23,670 --> 01:26:26,070
Adam Curry: that's what I want
from my AI people that I'm

1300
01:26:26,070 --> 01:26:28,920
that's what I'm looking for you
fix my email. I'll believe in

1301
01:26:28,920 --> 01:26:29,400
AI.

1302
01:26:30,689 --> 01:26:33,359
Dave Jones: Did you see a
podcast Giroux? Is that pod roll

1303
01:26:33,359 --> 01:26:33,929
support now?

1304
01:26:34,770 --> 01:26:37,710
Adam Curry: Yeah, I have an
Android version. So I don't

1305
01:26:37,710 --> 01:26:42,420
think it's it's updated on
Android yet. But that's

1306
01:26:42,420 --> 01:26:46,320
fantastic. Let me see. I don't
think that that's

1307
01:26:47,219 --> 01:26:48,449
Dave Jones: let me see if it's
on mine.

1308
01:26:48,809 --> 01:26:49,469
Unknown: Let me say

1309
01:26:51,960 --> 01:26:57,030
Adam Curry: No, I don't see it
here. See? Used but that's the

1310
01:26:57,030 --> 01:27:01,050
stuff we need. That's what we
need. We need that we need a

1311
01:27:01,050 --> 01:27:03,030
wallet solution. Hello, Oscar
marry.

1312
01:27:04,350 --> 01:27:06,540
Dave Jones: Well, so we talked
in our Tata Oscar about that and

1313
01:27:06,540 --> 01:27:09,660
talk to Mike. Michael from
wavelike. I've talked to him

1314
01:27:09,660 --> 01:27:14,550
about stuff for a while. Westpro
we've probably talked for half

1315
01:27:14,550 --> 01:27:18,600
an hour. Oh, good. And just
about, about all the things

1316
01:27:18,600 --> 01:27:25,980
going on. And you know, oh,
Zebedee. Yeah. So that's how you

1317
01:27:26,040 --> 01:27:27,630
talk to the No, no,

1318
01:27:27,660 --> 01:27:29,040
Unknown: no, tell me. Yeah. I

1319
01:27:29,040 --> 01:27:33,270
Dave Jones: talked to a lady
from Zebedee. And she said that

1320
01:27:33,360 --> 01:27:34,710
she listens to the show.

1321
01:27:34,860 --> 01:27:36,480
Adam Curry: Hello. Zebedee lady.

1322
01:27:37,079 --> 01:27:40,229
Dave Jones: Yeah, I can't
remember her first name because

1323
01:27:40,229 --> 01:27:45,239
it was so loud at that, at that
top floor that have the vinyl

1324
01:27:45,239 --> 01:27:50,249
lounge that I can't miss and her
name every time she said it. But

1325
01:27:50,249 --> 01:27:53,039
I asked her to email me so that
would so that I would know who

1326
01:27:53,039 --> 01:27:55,709
she was. And I haven't gotten an
email from her. So

1327
01:27:56,520 --> 01:27:59,940
Adam Curry: and this is
pertaining to can we use Ebody?

1328
01:27:59,940 --> 01:28:02,070
For wallets? Yes,

1329
01:28:02,099 --> 01:28:06,329
Dave Jones: they they. She said
that they would be glad to offer

1330
01:28:06,329 --> 01:28:12,719
an lb like service to abs. Ah,
so she said Well, yeah, yeah. So

1331
01:28:12,719 --> 01:28:16,529
she said that there would be
dynamite she said that they

1332
01:28:16,529 --> 01:28:22,439
would be she's like their social
media person. Okay. And then she

1333
01:28:22,439 --> 01:28:26,849
said that she could hook hook us
up with the correct people for

1334
01:28:27,659 --> 01:28:30,299
for figuring all that out. And
like, the

1335
01:28:30,300 --> 01:28:32,730
Adam Curry: main thing is, can
they just do it with a fee and

1336
01:28:32,730 --> 01:28:36,960
not with not with a cost to the
app developer and then run it

1337
01:28:36,960 --> 01:28:39,270
off to the races there? That'd
be fantastic.

1338
01:28:39,870 --> 01:28:42,150
Dave Jones: Yeah, so I want to
work all that stuff out with

1339
01:28:42,210 --> 01:28:47,100
with with their people, but I
need somebody I need either her

1340
01:28:47,100 --> 01:28:50,880
or somebody from Zebedee to call
to get in touch with me. So

1341
01:28:50,910 --> 01:28:56,400
David, David podcast index.org
Because I don't remember her

1342
01:28:56,400 --> 01:28:57,270
name. Okay.

1343
01:28:58,230 --> 01:29:01,320
Adam Curry: Well, that would be
fantastic. And I heard Chris

1344
01:29:01,320 --> 01:29:05,550
over there Jupiter. On this week
in Bitcoin that he moved to the

1345
01:29:05,550 --> 01:29:09,030
Alby hub, and he seemed quite
pleased with it with the

1346
01:29:09,030 --> 01:29:12,510
transition and everything. But
okay, I gotta tell you, I've

1347
01:29:12,510 --> 01:29:16,770
looked at Alby hub and my eyes
glaze over I don't quite I mean,

1348
01:29:16,770 --> 01:29:19,620
I'm waiting for it just to be
simple and simply understandable

1349
01:29:19,620 --> 01:29:25,830
to me i don't know I'm waiting
for it to be available on my

1350
01:29:25,830 --> 01:29:28,770
start nine to be honest, that's
it I'm sure it already works and

1351
01:29:28,770 --> 01:29:32,130
everything but I just haven't
figured out the process yet. I

1352
01:29:32,130 --> 01:29:33,810
haven't really put put my brain
to it.

1353
01:29:34,829 --> 01:29:36,839
Dave Jones: Yeah, I've met I've
mentioned this before I just

1354
01:29:36,839 --> 01:29:40,769
want this all I just want some
sort of solution because it's

1355
01:29:41,699 --> 01:29:45,689
it's it's more than mildly
frustrating to think that you've

1356
01:29:45,689 --> 01:29:48,479
solved a problem and then you
have to go back and solve it

1357
01:29:48,479 --> 01:29:52,619
over again. Yes. And and we have
bigger fish to fry and yes, we

1358
01:29:52,619 --> 01:29:56,609
know that we do we we don't need
to be reinventing this all over

1359
01:29:56,609 --> 01:29:57,059
again.

1360
01:29:57,150 --> 01:30:00,300
Adam Curry: No, no, and we will
Oh auth will do for you. Pull.

1361
01:30:01,020 --> 01:30:01,470
Yes.

1362
01:30:01,470 --> 01:30:05,970
Dave Jones: And when you do and
when you also when, when you go

1363
01:30:05,970 --> 01:30:09,600
to one of these events like,
like the Nashville live event,

1364
01:30:10,770 --> 01:30:15,870
you realize how powerful this
whole thing could be Toya it

1365
01:30:15,870 --> 01:30:18,780
makes it it makes it even more
frustrating. I

1366
01:30:18,780 --> 01:30:20,550
Adam Curry: know what we're
gonna we're gonna get there, God

1367
01:30:20,550 --> 01:30:23,490
willing, we're gonna get there,
and it's gonna be in the cards.

1368
01:30:23,490 --> 01:30:27,600
But yeah, just take these things
take time. It takes time. And

1369
01:30:27,690 --> 01:30:32,850
someone wrote me today and or
sent me a link to see if I can

1370
01:30:32,850 --> 01:30:37,170
find it's actually worth
playing. Something that

1371
01:30:37,290 --> 01:30:43,440
President Nixon said. About
back. Yeah, big throwback. Let

1372
01:30:43,440 --> 01:30:46,890
me see if I can find it real
quick. Oh, here it is. This is

1373
01:30:47,850 --> 01:30:49,560
50 years ago.

1374
01:30:49,860 --> 01:30:51,540
Unknown: We all met in the
Lincoln sitting room, as I

1375
01:30:51,540 --> 01:30:54,630
recall. Just the one she came
down. Now. That's not the one.

1376
01:30:54,690 --> 01:30:57,360
This is the one. Here we go. I
think this is the one from the

1377
01:30:57,360 --> 01:30:59,370
23rd of July. Nope, that's not
the one.

1378
01:31:01,199 --> 01:31:06,119
Adam Curry: It was. It was very
specific about. Let me see. I

1379
01:31:06,119 --> 01:31:07,109
don't know if I can find it.

1380
01:31:09,840 --> 01:31:12,090
Unknown: Let me see. If I'm
lucky.

1381
01:31:15,779 --> 01:31:18,599
Adam Curry: May not be lucky at
all, just as someone said on my

1382
01:31:18,599 --> 01:31:23,249
timeline on. The essence was, of
course at the time this was the

1383
01:31:23,249 --> 01:31:28,799
Watergate scandal and which you
know, is now universally

1384
01:31:28,799 --> 01:31:32,639
recognized that he was
railroaded. He was railroaded

1385
01:31:32,639 --> 01:31:36,479
out of office with this
Watergate thing. And yet, here

1386
01:31:36,479 --> 01:31:38,849
it is, I found it. Thank
goodness, the greatest

1387
01:31:38,850 --> 01:31:42,270
Unknown: concentration of power
in the United States today is

1388
01:31:42,270 --> 01:31:45,870
not in the White House. It isn't
in the Congress. And it isn't in

1389
01:31:45,870 --> 01:31:50,400
the Supreme Court. It's in the
media. And it's too much.

1390
01:31:51,180 --> 01:31:56,370
Because it is too concentrated
into smaller circle. You have

1391
01:31:56,370 --> 01:32:00,150
for example, the Washington Post
owning not only the Washington

1392
01:32:00,150 --> 01:32:05,130
Post, but the major all news
radio station and a television

1393
01:32:05,130 --> 01:32:08,100
station in Washington and a
major national magazine

1394
01:32:08,100 --> 01:32:12,270
Newsweek, you have CBS with its
affiliates, you have NBC

1395
01:32:12,600 --> 01:32:15,000
controlled by one of the largest
corporations in the country, you

1396
01:32:15,000 --> 01:32:19,440
have ABC you have a curse
thymic. And everybody knows

1397
01:32:19,440 --> 01:32:22,680
their stroke with that
concentration of power. Let me

1398
01:32:22,680 --> 01:32:27,810
say, particularly in the
television area, in the

1399
01:32:27,810 --> 01:32:33,270
network's it's too much it's
power that the Founding Fathers

1400
01:32:33,300 --> 01:32:34,890
would have been very concerned
about.

1401
01:32:35,280 --> 01:32:38,400
Adam Curry: So I love this
because, you know, my answer was

1402
01:32:38,400 --> 01:32:42,630
well, yeah, but that power just
just like everything else is

1403
01:32:42,630 --> 01:32:47,310
eroding. Slowly, and then it
will go very fast all of a

1404
01:32:47,310 --> 01:32:51,420
sudden, because look at Joe
Rogan, you know, supposedly 10

1405
01:32:51,420 --> 01:32:55,860
million listeners per show,
maybe let's make it five doesn't

1406
01:32:55,860 --> 01:33:01,410
matter, Tucker Carlson. Now, big
numbers. There's lots and lots

1407
01:33:01,410 --> 01:33:04,710
and lots of people doing
podcasts. And that power is

1408
01:33:04,740 --> 01:33:09,000
eroding. And now you can't you
can't be a politician without a

1409
01:33:09,000 --> 01:33:14,370
podcast these days, it seems. So
you know, there's so for it to

1410
01:33:14,370 --> 01:33:18,900
take a while for us to remove
the centralized power, which we

1411
01:33:18,930 --> 01:33:21,510
effectively have already done it
we've removed the centralized

1412
01:33:21,510 --> 01:33:24,870
power of the music industry.
It's gone. We've removed removed

1413
01:33:24,870 --> 01:33:29,100
it, but it will take a while.
The erosion happened slowly. But

1414
01:33:29,130 --> 01:33:34,380
I saw 1415 How many different
bands and artists at at bands

1415
01:33:34,380 --> 01:33:36,630
had Bitcoin? They're gonna go
out and they're gonna tell

1416
01:33:36,630 --> 01:33:39,450
people hey, there's something
happening. And those people will

1417
01:33:39,450 --> 01:33:42,420
check it out. And then it'll go
on and on and on. It takes a

1418
01:33:42,420 --> 01:33:45,870
while everybody wants, we want
it fast. Want to go one on one

1419
01:33:45,870 --> 01:33:48,120
to speed it up? Well, I'm in it
for the long haul.

1420
01:33:49,590 --> 01:33:51,840
Dave Jones: Reminds me of this
at least saves the soul. I don't

1421
01:33:51,840 --> 01:33:57,090
know if this will work or not.
Resume this old? Obamacare? No.

1422
01:33:57,330 --> 01:33:59,280
Does that work? Do you hear
that? No,

1423
01:33:59,279 --> 01:34:03,449
Adam Curry: it's hard to hear.
can crank it sounds like it's

1424
01:34:03,449 --> 01:34:06,179
coming through your laptop into
your mic. Actually,

1425
01:34:06,570 --> 01:34:08,220
Dave Jones: it's actually going
through Bluetooth through my

1426
01:34:08,220 --> 01:34:11,130
phone into the road caster. You
got to crank it up.

1427
01:34:11,280 --> 01:34:13,740
Unknown: I know there we have
not all countries in this body

1428
01:34:13,770 --> 01:34:16,770
chair, this particular
understanding of the protection

1429
01:34:16,770 --> 01:34:22,500
of free speech, we recognize
that but in 2012 At a time when

1430
01:34:22,530 --> 01:34:27,330
anyone with a cell phone can
spread offensive views around

1431
01:34:27,330 --> 01:34:30,870
the world with a click of a
button. The notion that we can

1432
01:34:30,870 --> 01:34:33,720
control the flow of information
is obsolete.

1433
01:34:34,770 --> 01:34:36,930
Yeah, it's not

1434
01:34:39,720 --> 01:34:42,930
Dave Jones: you know, you just
reverse that and that's anyone

1435
01:34:42,930 --> 01:34:46,350
with cell phone the idea that
you can control these these

1436
01:34:46,380 --> 01:34:49,140
these new avenues is well sir
and

1437
01:34:49,139 --> 01:34:52,859
Adam Curry: so there's there's
the point. Social media Yes,

1438
01:34:52,949 --> 01:34:56,429
controllable. Absolutely
controllable. Even Mastodon you

1439
01:34:56,429 --> 01:35:00,599
know, this, like there's so much
going on with ads Millions of

1440
01:35:00,599 --> 01:35:03,839
instances, you know, the bigger
the instance the more the more

1441
01:35:04,139 --> 01:35:07,289
the the sense, the more powerful
the censorship is. When someone

1442
01:35:07,289 --> 01:35:09,569
says, I just don't want that on
my server, boom, you're done.

1443
01:35:09,839 --> 01:35:14,489
Podcasting, not so much. Not so
much. By the way, I made a huge

1444
01:35:14,489 --> 01:35:18,899
pitch for pod paying on no
agenda the other day. Yeah, I

1445
01:35:18,899 --> 01:35:22,889
was explaining it to Dvorak. I
was explaining that you know,

1446
01:35:22,889 --> 01:35:27,659
how wasteful Apple is. He says,
Wait a minute, so they can use

1447
01:35:27,659 --> 01:35:30,329
this for free said, oh, yeah,
I'm gonna explain you know, how

1448
01:35:30,329 --> 01:35:33,779
they're polling the feeds and
everything and, and, of course,

1449
01:35:33,779 --> 01:35:37,079
the punch line was and John it
runs on blockchain.

1450
01:35:41,250 --> 01:35:42,000
Dave Jones: That's when

1451
01:35:45,180 --> 01:35:47,100
Adam Curry: I actually I forgot
to credit a whole bunch of

1452
01:35:47,100 --> 01:35:49,770
people for the work that's done
there. So Brian of London

1453
01:35:49,770 --> 01:35:52,380
started but you know, obviously,
I should have mentioned Alex

1454
01:35:52,380 --> 01:35:53,010
gates and

1455
01:35:53,460 --> 01:35:57,240
Dave Jones: Moran started it and
Alex programmed it. Yeah,

1456
01:35:57,300 --> 01:35:59,220
exactly. We launched it. Yep.

1457
01:35:59,699 --> 01:36:01,289
Adam Curry: Shall we? Thanks for
the call some people here

1458
01:36:01,289 --> 01:36:02,729
brother. Yeah, sure.

1459
01:36:03,930 --> 01:36:08,700
Dave Jones: We've got Who is
this open? Blueberry? Our

1460
01:36:08,700 --> 01:36:10,290
buddies. Todd,

1461
01:36:10,470 --> 01:36:12,720
Adam Curry: you want me to do?
What made you the recent boosts

1462
01:36:12,720 --> 01:36:16,890
first? Oh, yeah, good. Yeah.
That came in during the live

1463
01:36:16,890 --> 01:36:20,670
show. Salty crayon. 555. Jack
Holliday heard it on podcasting.

1464
01:36:20,670 --> 01:36:24,090
2.0 He says beautiful going
right through to the artist.

1465
01:36:24,090 --> 01:36:27,660
10 1000s I said from anonymous
podcast guru user 10,000 with

1466
01:36:27,660 --> 01:36:34,080
10,000 St. Augustine bariga.
20,000. That guy's amazing. He

1467
01:36:34,080 --> 01:36:36,120
says perfect start for the
weekend weekend boosting up

1468
01:36:36,120 --> 01:36:40,680
podcasting. 2.0 I met him at the
no agenda Amsterdam meetup. He's

1469
01:36:40,680 --> 01:36:44,760
everything you think he is. Man,
what do you mean imagine a

1470
01:36:44,760 --> 01:36:48,780
Viking who's eight feet tall but
weighs 120 20 pounds.

1471
01:36:49,559 --> 01:36:51,989
Dave Jones: Oh, well. Yes. Like
it's like a beanpole.

1472
01:36:52,019 --> 01:36:54,869
Adam Curry: Yeah with a beard
and must the whole thing is

1473
01:36:54,869 --> 01:36:59,069
perfect sleeves. Yeah, as
amazing. Lincoln 3333 Wow,

1474
01:36:59,069 --> 01:37:03,539
that's good stuff. There. Sam
Ceci Sethi with 1000 SATs. He

1475
01:37:03,539 --> 01:37:07,529
says Why should apps give hosts
our first party data for free?

1476
01:37:07,799 --> 01:37:10,529
We will offer creators services
to see their metrics we might

1477
01:37:10,559 --> 01:37:13,499
aggregate listen time or value
paid. But why should we give

1478
01:37:13,499 --> 01:37:16,469
this data for free to host our
advertisers? I know for the

1479
01:37:16,469 --> 01:37:23,039
industry Sam. DS laughs comes in
with 1000 SATs glad to be

1480
01:37:23,039 --> 01:37:25,619
invited into the boardroom. You
mean Apple can use this for

1481
01:37:25,619 --> 01:37:29,729
free? Yeah, he says John was
funny about that. He said he

1482
01:37:29,729 --> 01:37:35,069
liked that 777 from Sam, we have
fixed the wallet and top up

1483
01:37:35,069 --> 01:37:37,949
subscribe to your wallet. Now we
need to teach people how and why

1484
01:37:37,949 --> 01:37:41,669
they should pay. I think the
podcasters need to teach their

1485
01:37:41,669 --> 01:37:46,079
listeners. But if you can do it,
and I'm all for it. Tone record

1486
01:37:46,079 --> 01:37:49,199
12345 Shout out to the value for
value musicians and artists

1487
01:37:49,199 --> 01:37:53,729
participating it last week
gathering in Nashville 1000

1488
01:37:53,729 --> 01:37:56,459
stats from Sam once you know how
streaming stats work, you don't

1489
01:37:56,459 --> 01:38:03,689
need to keep asking. Yeah, I
disagree. I disagree. My wife

1490
01:38:03,689 --> 01:38:06,629
all the time is like oh I didn't
check my wallet is empty. It's

1491
01:38:06,629 --> 01:38:12,719
been empty for weeks. Okay. 1000
SATs from Sam with audiobooks

1492
01:38:12,719 --> 01:38:17,429
users pay in advance with SATs
or Fiat or why not pay as you

1493
01:38:17,429 --> 01:38:20,129
read? Well there's all these
models I'm just I believe in a

1494
01:38:20,129 --> 01:38:23,249
value for value model if you can
make it work, I'm all for it.

1495
01:38:24,209 --> 01:38:28,469
And Sam another 1000 He's a he's
drinking his wine. We have

1496
01:38:28,469 --> 01:38:31,859
WaveLight categories working we
have event and film categories.

1497
01:38:31,859 --> 01:38:37,679
We are working with dis dystopia
we'll send you details. dystopia

1498
01:38:37,799 --> 01:38:42,869
that says it's probably just
topia okay good for phase. APIA

1499
01:38:42,869 --> 01:38:47,789
Dave Jones: is their is their
sister company. Yes for tipping

1500
01:38:48,390 --> 01:38:51,210
Adam Curry: 2222 from salty
crayon row ducks morning board

1501
01:38:51,210 --> 01:38:53,730
boardroom was trying to listen
to phantom power artists are on

1502
01:38:53,730 --> 01:38:57,300
true fans today and found out
it's it's pay to play. Not a

1503
01:38:57,300 --> 01:39:02,220
donation. I must pay 13,000 SATs
to listen to that particular

1504
01:39:02,220 --> 01:39:05,280
podcast and I see no option to
connect it back to the lb hub.

1505
01:39:05,460 --> 01:39:08,940
The only option is pay $1 per
day or $10 a month. Sorry I'll

1506
01:39:08,940 --> 01:39:12,180
donate to pod verse but I'm not
participating in more pay to

1507
01:39:12,180 --> 01:39:16,980
play what happened. Sad face
emoji. I don't this is new to

1508
01:39:16,980 --> 01:39:24,930
me. I was not aware of this. I
don't know. We have. There's the

1509
01:39:24,930 --> 01:39:26,640
delimiter. So over to you Dave.

1510
01:39:27,390 --> 01:39:32,160
Dave Jones: Now will we get Todd
and the girls and boys from

1511
01:39:32,160 --> 01:39:35,910
blueberry $300 says from the
blueberry team

1512
01:39:38,069 --> 01:39:41,729
Unknown: Sakala 20 blades on
Ambala.

1513
01:39:43,260 --> 01:39:46,200
Adam Curry: Yo brothers and
sisters over at blueberry Thank

1514
01:39:46,200 --> 01:39:49,560
you very much big supporters of
the index.

1515
01:39:50,400 --> 01:39:55,140
Dave Jones: Yeah, Julie said
maybe Sam's testing something on

1516
01:39:55,170 --> 01:39:58,650
ultra fast because I didn't see
that either. I mean, I was in

1517
01:39:58,650 --> 01:40:00,480
there over the weekend. I think
and Don't

1518
01:40:00,569 --> 01:40:02,639
Adam Curry: surprises me yeah
surprises me.

1519
01:40:02,940 --> 01:40:04,950
Dave Jones: I don't think he's I
don't know that he made it

1520
01:40:04,950 --> 01:40:09,300
paywall I don't know maybe you
can tell us what he did. Franco

1521
01:40:09,300 --> 01:40:13,680
Celerio or buddy for cast ematic
the Italian doctor who's built

1522
01:40:13,680 --> 01:40:16,080
the podcast apps on the side
$100

1523
01:40:16,109 --> 01:40:18,059
Adam Curry: The All right nice

1524
01:40:18,960 --> 01:40:22,200
Unknown: 20 is played on am
Paulo nice

1525
01:40:22,200 --> 01:40:23,940
Adam Curry: nice thank you so
much Franco.

1526
01:40:24,389 --> 01:40:26,309
Dave Jones: Yeah, thank you
Franco appreciate that. Thanks,

1527
01:40:26,309 --> 01:40:34,409
guys. We guess booster grams.
Let's see. Get pod home. Oh,

1528
01:40:34,409 --> 01:40:40,379
that's very very the podcast
guru he sent us 15,000 sets all

1529
01:40:40,379 --> 01:40:43,529
rock Yes, I'm so happy all of
you are out there and happy to

1530
01:40:43,529 --> 01:40:46,979
do my part in this podcasting
revolution. Such an amazing time

1531
01:40:46,979 --> 01:40:48,689
and technology. Good

1532
01:40:48,690 --> 01:40:50,430
Adam Curry: to have you here
brother. It's good to have you

1533
01:40:50,430 --> 01:40:53,880
native 2.0 Guys 20.

1534
01:40:57,689 --> 01:41:03,539
Dave Jones: From Steven Ishizu
22,514 sets through fountain he

1535
01:41:03,539 --> 01:41:08,039
says bro What an absolute
location Daxing is this? This is

1536
01:41:08,159 --> 01:41:10,259
the guy's room that we were
using.

1537
01:41:12,960 --> 01:41:16,680
Adam Curry: He sent us his room
number is room number and says

1538
01:41:18,840 --> 01:41:21,300
yes we're sorry we're sorry we
Doc's you but did you get any

1539
01:41:21,300 --> 01:41:23,970
champagne? Did anyone send
champagne to his room?

1540
01:41:25,170 --> 01:41:29,850
Dave Jones: Stephen is a he's a
really great guy. We we hung out

1541
01:41:29,850 --> 01:41:32,370
with him later after get some

1542
01:41:32,370 --> 01:41:34,770
Adam Curry: food and get all the
groupies right in his room. He's

1543
01:41:34,770 --> 01:41:35,880
like I can't deal with them
right?

1544
01:41:37,800 --> 01:41:41,940
Dave Jones: Yeah, he's he's a
really really nice guy. Amazing.

1545
01:41:42,030 --> 01:41:47,250
See 1500 SAS from RW Nash
through the through foundings a

1546
01:41:47,250 --> 01:41:53,250
solid show yet again, gents.
Thank you. Thank you. And light

1547
01:41:53,250 --> 01:41:56,940
on the booths today. We've got
to get the delimiter 24,000 SATs

1548
01:41:56,940 --> 01:41:59,010
24 grand from chemistry blogger

1549
01:41:59,010 --> 01:42:02,340
Adam Curry: Hello CSB. Now just
read it normal because he gets

1550
01:42:02,340 --> 01:42:03,570
all bent out of shape.

1551
01:42:04,199 --> 01:42:06,659
Dave Jones: Well, I don't I
don't do I don't do the grid

1552
01:42:06,659 --> 01:42:09,689
gravelly voice I can't do I'm
not I haven't earned that yet.

1553
01:42:09,689 --> 01:42:14,369
So I just I tend to go for the
dramatic, dramatic read the must

1554
01:42:14,369 --> 01:42:19,139
see movie of the summer read.
How do you Dave and Adam. I

1555
01:42:19,139 --> 01:42:22,139
would like to ask the podcasting
2.0 community to send booster

1556
01:42:22,139 --> 01:42:25,889
grants to the podcast, curry in
the keeper. They are in great

1557
01:42:25,889 --> 01:42:30,809
need of sets pigley Accompany
Tina and Adam curry. As they

1558
01:42:30,809 --> 01:42:34,019
delve into the realms of
existence, romance, and

1559
01:42:34,019 --> 01:42:37,529
libations discover their
experiences navigating their

1560
01:42:37,529 --> 01:42:41,519
relationship, spirituality and
religion along with daily

1561
01:42:41,519 --> 01:42:45,239
escapades with their beloved
canine companion Phoebe Oh,

1562
01:42:45,329 --> 01:42:50,039
visit www dot Currey in the
keeper.com Yo CSB.

1563
01:42:50,070 --> 01:42:53,130
Adam Curry: Ah thank you. So yes
be always promoting other shows.

1564
01:42:53,160 --> 01:42:54,390
I love that about him.

1565
01:42:55,829 --> 01:42:59,699
Dave Jones: Personally, we get
some monthlies. We get Pedregon

1566
01:42:59,699 --> 01:43:05,489
calvess $5 Thank you, Pedro. Jad
Pharaoh, Chad F $20.22. Thank

1567
01:43:05,489 --> 01:43:08,339
you, Chet and I didn't promise I
did not rub pull you on the

1568
01:43:08,339 --> 01:43:16,019
cashew men. I will send you your
1500 sat rug pool. Yeah, is the

1569
01:43:16,019 --> 01:43:16,979
weakest row. That's

1570
01:43:16,980 --> 01:43:17,700
Adam Curry: very weak.

1571
01:43:18,239 --> 01:43:23,999
Dave Jones: That's very weak.
Okay, Cameron Rose $25. Thank

1572
01:43:23,999 --> 01:43:26,129
you, Cameron. Appreciate it.
He's been doing domain forever.

1573
01:43:26,129 --> 01:43:30,359
Kevin Bay. He's He's a new
automatic payment profile new

1574
01:43:30,359 --> 01:43:33,449
subscription from base $5 a
month. Thank you, brother.

1575
01:43:33,479 --> 01:43:34,499
Adam Curry: Welcome to the
party.

1576
01:43:35,070 --> 01:43:38,160
Dave Jones: Thank you, Kevin.
Appreciate that. As we got Oh,

1577
01:43:38,160 --> 01:43:41,580
pod page, it was Brendan over
there. The pod page. Thank you.

1578
01:43:41,730 --> 01:43:44,700
$25. Appreciate that new media.

1579
01:43:46,079 --> 01:43:48,059
Adam Curry: You have to add some
stuff. And congratulations to

1580
01:43:48,059 --> 01:43:51,239
Dave Jackson now working for
with Brendan over there at pod

1581
01:43:51,239 --> 01:43:51,809
page.

1582
01:43:52,140 --> 01:43:53,040
Dave Jones: He got out.

1583
01:43:54,329 --> 01:43:57,749
Adam Curry: And I use pod page
for Korean zookeeper in fact,

1584
01:43:57,779 --> 01:44:02,579
and for booster grand ball and I
love the service and I'm very

1585
01:44:02,579 --> 01:44:06,299
excited to see what more will
come I mean, he's showing

1586
01:44:06,299 --> 01:44:09,869
chapters now we show and
transcripts, doing all kinds of

1587
01:44:09,869 --> 01:44:14,939
stuff. It's it's becoming a I
mean, I've always liked it. Just

1588
01:44:14,939 --> 01:44:18,779
because it's like here's the RSS
feed boom it shows up. Tina

1589
01:44:18,779 --> 01:44:22,049
designed carrying the keeper.com
and she found it and she's done

1590
01:44:22,049 --> 01:44:25,919
a lot of these things in her
nonprofit life. And, and she

1591
01:44:25,919 --> 01:44:28,439
loved the tool she thought it
was it was relatively easy to

1592
01:44:28,439 --> 01:44:31,709
get it all looking the way she
wanted. And it's got a it even

1593
01:44:31,709 --> 01:44:35,339
has like a they have a feature
where you can call and leave a

1594
01:44:35,339 --> 01:44:37,319
voice message. I've

1595
01:44:37,320 --> 01:44:39,240
Dave Jones: seen that on
different Yeah, I think that's

1596
01:44:39,240 --> 01:44:42,510
the thing with the few different
platforms now the voice message

1597
01:44:42,510 --> 01:44:43,860
thing. Yeah, it's kind

1598
01:44:43,859 --> 01:44:45,749
Adam Curry: of cool because you
know, people record a message I

1599
01:44:45,749 --> 01:44:49,649
can play it in the show. So I'm
happy to see Dave there and I

1600
01:44:49,649 --> 01:44:54,269
look forward to seeing what what
what knew what things I had no

1601
01:44:54,269 --> 01:44:58,829
idea that I know what I'm paying
them, which is you know, this

1602
01:44:58,829 --> 01:45:02,129
real money So I'm glad they're
doing well, because that means

1603
01:45:02,129 --> 01:45:05,309
they can do more and do more was
2.0. Very exciting.

1604
01:45:05,760 --> 01:45:07,890
Dave Jones: It's kind of a good
fit because Dave's a teacher,

1605
01:45:07,890 --> 01:45:14,310
and that's more like, that feels
more like a somebody who would

1606
01:45:14,310 --> 01:45:19,140
use pod page is probably
somebody who would be very, I

1607
01:45:19,140 --> 01:45:22,710
mean, not, it'd be very
receptive to, like learning new

1608
01:45:22,710 --> 01:45:28,140
things about how to make their
podcasts better. Like doing not,

1609
01:45:28,650 --> 01:45:32,070
yeah, not not just from like,
what do I talk about, like

1610
01:45:32,070 --> 01:45:34,950
hosting or whatever. But like
all the tools that go around

1611
01:45:35,760 --> 01:45:38,700
that thing, like, here's, I
guess what I'm saying is like he

1612
01:45:38,700 --> 01:45:41,580
does the future of podcasting
show with Daniel Lewis, which is

1613
01:45:41,580 --> 01:45:46,860
a great show. And so he's like,
he's teed. He's already teaching

1614
01:45:46,860 --> 01:45:50,100
people who don't know much about
the tech. So this is seems like

1615
01:45:50,100 --> 01:45:50,340
a good

1616
01:45:50,340 --> 01:45:55,260
Adam Curry: fit. And also, they
have a pretty nice mobile view.

1617
01:45:56,130 --> 01:46:00,420
I can see them adding V for V.
Oh, that'd be great. I mean,

1618
01:46:00,420 --> 01:46:00,870
becoming an

1619
01:46:00,869 --> 01:46:03,899
Dave Jones: app. What I could
see is them adding a thing like

1620
01:46:03,899 --> 01:46:06,419
Dobby das built for the for
bands that

1621
01:46:06,420 --> 01:46:09,630
Adam Curry: Bitcoin. Yes, yes,
exactly.

1622
01:46:10,080 --> 01:46:12,750
Dave Jones: Where you have a pot
where you have a QR code, donate

1623
01:46:12,750 --> 01:46:13,860
to the Show button.

1624
01:46:13,890 --> 01:46:16,440
Adam Curry: Yep, yep, yep. Yep.
With a forward Yep. Beautiful

1625
01:46:16,440 --> 01:46:17,550
with a forward that would

1626
01:46:17,550 --> 01:46:19,020
Dave Jones: be a great service.
Yeah.

1627
01:46:19,140 --> 01:46:21,840
Adam Curry: It's nice. It's a
good service. A new

1628
01:46:22,080 --> 01:46:25,380
Dave Jones: new meet as Martin
lindskog. $1. Thank you, Marty

1629
01:46:25,380 --> 01:46:29,580
Martin, Mark Graham. $1. Thank
you, Mark. And that's our group.

1630
01:46:30,149 --> 01:46:32,609
Adam Curry: Well, we our value
for value. We talked about it.

1631
01:46:32,909 --> 01:46:35,549
So there's the thank you
portion. Here's the please

1632
01:46:35,549 --> 01:46:38,729
support us version. Because
you're you're sending it to the

1633
01:46:38,729 --> 01:46:42,299
show. And Dave and I are happy
to conduct the board meetings

1634
01:46:42,299 --> 01:46:46,229
every single week. Dave doesn't
doesn't have on his lunchtime of

1635
01:46:46,229 --> 01:46:50,519
this should be a day off for me.
But I love doing this. I love

1636
01:46:50,519 --> 01:46:53,669
helping drive and move the
community forward. But it's

1637
01:46:53,669 --> 01:46:58,079
really for the index for
podcasts index.org You help keep

1638
01:46:58,079 --> 01:47:00,989
the machines running help keep
the infrastructure in place. And

1639
01:47:00,989 --> 01:47:03,389
when you boost us with a modern
podcast app, you're actually

1640
01:47:03,389 --> 01:47:06,869
supporting the apps and many
other people. Let's see, who do

1641
01:47:06,869 --> 01:47:12,989
we have in the in the feed right
now we have value for sovereign

1642
01:47:12,989 --> 01:47:20,369
feeds. Dred Scott, of course,
chapters. We now cut a bit to

1643
01:47:20,369 --> 01:47:25,769
pod paying. For Brian and we
also may see in the

1644
01:47:25,800 --> 01:47:28,920
Unknown: episodes, regular Alex
was in there. Yeah,

1645
01:47:28,920 --> 01:47:31,500
Adam Curry: we got we got Alex
gualdo. His node seems to be

1646
01:47:31,500 --> 01:47:34,440
down or disconnected. We got to
figure that out. Eric peepee.

1647
01:47:34,440 --> 01:47:41,430
And he's in there. reflex.io. Of
course, that's Spurlock. So

1648
01:47:41,460 --> 01:47:44,640
you're supporting the everybody.
But we also appreciate your pay

1649
01:47:44,640 --> 01:47:48,930
pals. Go to podcast index.org.
You'll see down at the bottom on

1650
01:47:48,930 --> 01:47:52,470
the homepage, you'll see two red
buttons to donate. We should

1651
01:47:52,470 --> 01:47:54,990
remove the tally coin if we
haven't already, because it goes

1652
01:47:54,990 --> 01:47:55,530
nowhere.

1653
01:47:57,210 --> 01:47:58,200
Dave Jones: Is a thought so

1654
01:47:58,229 --> 01:48:01,109
Adam Curry: we removed that. Do
we remove it? Let me say yes,

1655
01:48:01,109 --> 01:48:04,229
that's gone. Yeah. So it's just
one one big red donate button.

1656
01:48:04,739 --> 01:48:05,429
Dave Jones: Steven.

1657
01:48:05,610 --> 01:48:08,820
Adam Curry: Oh, we have
contracts, contracts, contracts.

1658
01:48:09,150 --> 01:48:10,020
Where does that go?

1659
01:48:11,430 --> 01:48:19,080
Dave Jones: It goes to Twitter.
Okay, here's how this works.

1660
01:48:19,140 --> 01:48:20,430
Here's how this works. Okay.

1661
01:48:20,850 --> 01:48:23,850
Adam Curry: Don't let me click
on that one. Let

1662
01:48:23,850 --> 01:48:27,030
Dave Jones: me explain to you
how things get onto the website.

1663
01:48:27,059 --> 01:48:30,839
Adam Curry: That was a pull
request, no doubt people create.

1664
01:48:31,230 --> 01:48:34,140
Dave Jones: When I say people, I
mean mostly Steven crater

1665
01:48:34,740 --> 01:48:39,840
creates it, but some others,
they create pull requests, which

1666
01:48:39,840 --> 01:48:44,190
then show up in my email from
GitHub, which I click on the

1667
01:48:44,190 --> 01:48:48,120
link it takes me to GitHub and I
immediately just hit merge I

1668
01:48:48,120 --> 01:48:51,270
don't even I don't check it

1669
01:48:51,270 --> 01:48:53,610
Adam Curry: this could have been
a porn site for all we know it

1670
01:48:53,610 --> 01:48:56,310
could have been only fans
account and it goes to a page to

1671
01:48:56,310 --> 01:48:58,710
do community we want to take
contracts in a new direction

1672
01:48:58,710 --> 01:49:01,560
requires us to move on from a
value for value services

1673
01:49:01,740 --> 01:49:06,090
Dave Jones: right even crater
all the ways what Yeah,

1674
01:49:06,120 --> 01:49:08,340
Adam Curry: well maybe we should
have that change that might be

1675
01:49:08,370 --> 01:49:12,330
might be handy. Thanks. But the
left hand button takes you to

1676
01:49:12,330 --> 01:49:17,400
PayPal and you can support us
that way. We got hijacked

1677
01:49:17,939 --> 01:49:21,419
Dave Jones: by I mean it's more
of a long way around hijack

1678
01:49:21,419 --> 01:49:25,409
because you actually submit a
pull request it we hijacked

1679
01:49:25,409 --> 01:49:27,029
ourselves that's what this is

1680
01:49:27,059 --> 01:49:33,809
Adam Curry: it's a PR hijack is
what it is. That's funny. Thank

1681
01:49:33,809 --> 01:49:35,669
you crater Steven Crowley

1682
01:49:35,670 --> 01:49:38,850
Dave Jones: edge pieces we
replaced tally coin with context

1683
01:49:38,850 --> 01:49:41,340
when tally coin died and now
context is going to

1684
01:49:41,369 --> 01:49:43,979
Adam Curry: well, what's the
next thing we can do that will

1685
01:49:43,979 --> 01:49:44,849
die? I mean,

1686
01:49:45,540 --> 01:49:48,210
Dave Jones: Lord have mercy we
need we need to stop every time

1687
01:49:48,240 --> 01:49:50,520
we need to start linking to
people because we're the killer.

1688
01:49:50,550 --> 01:49:53,130
Adam Curry: Yeah, that's like
the kiss of death. Who wants a

1689
01:49:53,130 --> 01:49:54,090
link from us?

1690
01:49:54,450 --> 01:49:56,280
Dave Jones: Yeah, no, no, no.

1691
01:49:57,869 --> 01:50:01,349
Adam Curry: All right, brother.
So no The regular board meeting

1692
01:50:01,349 --> 01:50:05,099
time next week, I presume. And
with any larger No, with any

1693
01:50:05,099 --> 01:50:10,529
luck, I won't be talking to you
in tears. This week as I, as I

1694
01:50:10,529 --> 01:50:15,059
work as I work on my, I'm going
to try it. I can do this. I can

1695
01:50:15,059 --> 01:50:17,849
do this. I know I can do this. I
know I can do this, this

1696
01:50:17,849 --> 01:50:21,299
complete merge this this thing,
I can do it, I can do it. Tell

1697
01:50:21,299 --> 01:50:21,959
me I can do it.

1698
01:50:22,470 --> 01:50:26,760
Dave Jones: You can do it and
you just need to make sure you

1699
01:50:26,760 --> 01:50:29,940
have an exit strategy, which

1700
01:50:29,969 --> 01:50:32,639
Adam Curry: a rollback or
rollback plan. Okay, I need

1701
01:50:32,639 --> 01:50:35,309
another yet another drive. Okay.
I'll wait until I get another

1702
01:50:35,309 --> 01:50:38,039
drive to do that. Brother. Thank
you very much, Dave. Thanks for

1703
01:50:38,039 --> 01:50:42,629
coming in early. I really
appreciate it immense and have

1704
01:50:42,629 --> 01:50:46,049
yourself a good weekend day to
everybody in the boardroom.

1705
01:50:46,049 --> 01:50:48,779
Thanks for being here, go
podcast and we'll see you next

1706
01:50:48,959 --> 01:50:49,589
podcast.

1707
01:51:06,510 --> 01:51:11,070
Unknown: You have been listening
to podcasting 2.0 Visit podcast

1708
01:51:11,070 --> 01:51:17,730
index.org. For more information,
go podcast thanks