Chris Robinson Part 2

00:00:00 Speaker 1: Question of Supreme is a production of iHeart Radio. Hey y'all, this is unpaid bill from Team Supreme. We're back with part two of our QLs interview with Chris Robinson. Part one. Chris spoke about growing up in Baltimore and cultivating a career as one of the biggest music video directors of the nineteen nineties and two thousands. He shared some secrets about working with Erica Baudou, Lord Terka, Peter Gunns, and el Cool James. He also discussed his new project, Shooting Stars, which covers the upbringing of bron James. If you haven't already, please check out that episode. Now here's part two. I want to hear if there's a way that you can give cautionary tales without compromising your position or your relationships and whatnot. But this is a theory that I have now at this stage of my life, which is I think when we turn thirty or forty, this is when we start to become experts. And I don't think it's more or less that we become experts more then I think in the first twenty twenty five thirty years of our life we take an assessment of Okay, this is pleasurable, and this is painful, and so we basically want to just do the greatest hits and just take a compilation of all the pleasurable things and then apply that to it, and then we become experts. Like we know that you know, if you touch the soave, you're gonna get burnt. You know, if you walk across the street without looking both ways, you're gonna get hit. So basically, you know it's a compilation of life lessons, and then that's how you're supposed to proceed on from forty and above. So for you are there never again moments for directing in terms of and I don't mean like I'll never work with this particular person again, but you already know that, Like all right, I can't double book that, Like what like what lessons have you learned that are like never again? That's a crazy question. Open my brain up. It's wanting the gigs so bad that you compromise what your vision is. It is never ever, ever, ever ever worked for me, right, And so you say, yester and artists before you even have a solid creative vision for it. Oh, I've definitely done that and that's worked out. That might be a timing thing right. What I what I'm talking about is like you have to you take this job, but you have to use this DP and you have to shoot in this city, or you have to use use this use either use someone or put a patina on it that we want it to be right now. Commercials are different, right because an ad agency works on that for a year before you ever get a phone call, so we understand their vision of what they're looking for. But when it comes to something creative, any time I've I've attempted to do it it it didn't work or it wasn't satisfying. So my advice would be, never compromise your your thought for the money. You know, it just doesn't work. I have a I have a dad thing. As I always tell my son, I go Okay. When I was on JV, I could kick, Like so we were just in practice and I was kicking booming the ball and the coach was like, Robinson, you could kick your alignment. I ain't never seen alignment kick. I go, yeah, I can kick, So he gives me the job. I'm kicking off. So before that, a coach comes up to me and he goes, hey, man, you're planning your foot all wrong. You gotta put your foot closer to the ball so you can get more lift on. So here we go our first scrimmage, canst our high school rival, and I go out into the coach, I plant my footway tells me. And the ball goes straight up and straight down, and I get fired. I'm no longer kicking the ball. And that, to me is the metaphor of when I'm listening, I'm in my flow. I know how to do this, I know the people I want to use, because it's a it's a business in an art form where you collaborate, but then somebody tells you not to do what you do and working for you, working for you, and the reason you called me right, because this is what I do, and I've done it a couple of times regretfully, because the opportunity was so big. And so when they come at you, when they go, hey, man, this opportunity is big, you're gonna do what we say. It's difficult to turn it down, you know, and if you have enough political acumen that you know how to twist it and turn it to still do what you want to do. Cool. I really don't have that gift. You know what I mean. I'm like, I'm true to whatever the thing is, so I would say, never ever do that. And I know it's a difficult thing, you know, because the opportunities are what they are. But I think that for me is the biggest one. Are you the type of director and I don't mean micromanage in that annoying way like always over your shoulder looking, But for me, I feel like the editing is the most important part of your presentation, like because editing can be I know for some would say, well, no, the story concepts the most important part. And some people would say no, it's actually the look of it, like the art, direction, the lighting. Some people can say the shots the most important part. For me, I fall in love with the editing. I mean a lot of you know, nine times out of ten, I'm working with footage that already exists already, so it's not like I have to shoot all my content. But in terms of storytelling, do you allow your lighting person, you your lensman, your editor, Do you give them free reign to do what they do? Or are you always over their shoulder from soup the nuts like micromanaging? What it is like I do in that I'm giving everyone the vision. I'm going, hey, this is how I see it, before we ever get out there on the playing field, and before we ever roll one second of zeros and ones. It's not film anymore. So I always like to meet. I like prepro I like setting down, I like looking at references, and I include the editor in that, right, I'll send the treatment. If it was a video, I would send the treatment to the editor before we ever shot, you know. And there were certain guys like Jeff sellis amazing dude, and he was like Scorsese's editor to me because I could give him, you know, when we were shooting two videos a week back in the day. I had to have trust, you know, to go, all right, here's this, I'm going to shoot this. When I get back, we'll talk in Jeff ninety percent of the time, you know, he would he would hit it, you know. So, But those kind of relationships are few and far between, right. So in videos, I work with like four or five different editors. When you were in the in the eye of the storm of video making, how many videos, well you said a week, how many videos a month would you book? Well, I know this for three years in a row I hit between forty eight and fifty for three years in a row, right, I noticed because that's when I had left part as in left HSI and I have my own company. I did between fifty videos a year to fifty. Probably the year I did the most videos, like fifty six, So that was doing about a video with and I had. I had three rotating producers who only worked with me. I had about five rotating editors and my executive producer Roseanne, which too early as wild. He really managed all that well. And it was go ahead, Chris, get on a plane, go and I would have to show up and do my job. And I you know, it was such a beautiful time that we were able to do it and still keep the integrity of the art right because I was big on that too. Vacation, No vacation Christo in three years. Let me tell you, I was upset if but wanted to take a vacation. I remember, listen, you are the roots. I had this guy, Michael Lucero. I don't know if you guys know, Yeah, Michael Sero was amazing. He's past, you know, rest in peace. Michael Lucero did ninety three till Infinity. Yes, he did busting dirty and when I when I first had a company interested in me, which is where I met Rosanne. She was the executive producer of his company was called What You See Is What You Get and they were in San Francisco, so I flew out from Baltimore to San Francisco, met them, and the whole nine. Well. He was such a good dude. He was kind of like a you know, one of these guys who climbed mountains and you know, kind of kind of that kind of dude, but an amazing direct day. Yeah, learned a lot from him, learned a lot from it, and learned how to write treatments. Was such a such a good man. But he every year he would take us on vacation and we would go in to Mexico. He would take the company on vacation. And the first year I was there, I wasn't really you know, getting a lot of work. And I was pissed that they wanted to take a vacation and he wanted to fly me and pay for it, pay for my room, and I did not go. And I was like, who's taking a vacation. We need to work. So I was a little over indexing I was sitting back then because I wanted it so bad. And you know, there's great photos that Robin Frank, who was my rep, has sent to me recently, like of that trip that I missed that I could have been at. You know what I was sitting down home in Baltimore convention about, you know, not working instead of on vacation exactly. So can you walk me through the process, because I'm learning now that in order to be creative, you should really dedicate, or at least for me, what works for me is a lot of silence, a lot of soulace, a lot of silence. I used to be the type of person that sort of reveled in chaos, but I realized, like, oh, like during the pandemic, then every idea came to me and suddenly inspiration came. So okay, so in the eye that storm. So all right, let's go to let's go to two thousand and five. Okay, right, Like, how long do you sit with And I'm going back to videos because I feel like video I feel like videos are harder than movies because you basically have four minutes to tell a story and really knock it out the park. So what is your process. How long do you sit with a song? Do you sit with a team of people and think of ideas? Do you look at the physics will build to the person? Do you do you get to know them and see if they're athletic, if they know how to run, if they know how to drive a car, like what they're in. Walk me through the basic like how long do you sit with a song before you suddenly see what it is? It from music videos? Man? It is it was. It's different. It depends on what the song. The song truly inspired me, right, So a script will inspire you, but the song really inspired would inspire me. For instance, you know when I heard you know, I received Noriega song what What What? What? What What what? Super Doug? I got super Thug. I wrote that in twenty minutes because I had had this idea about camels in the desert and it's been around for a long time in my head, is rolling around in my head. So I wrote that. And it's funny because my rep was like, this is the quickest treatment you've ever written. Are you sure you want me to turn this in? And I was like, yeah, this is it. Because I was a little notorious for sending in the treatment late because of exactly what you're describing or taking your time living with it. So when I did, I received you don't Know my Name from Alicia. I remember sitting in the house eight hours just listening to it, and I kept almost getting it. Then I flew to LA and I had an assistant. Her name was Nia Andrews. She's she's in music like her dad was in he wrote all freak Out like he's part of that legacy. So we drove around LA for eight hours. I remember we went to Malibu. We just were listening to this song on repeat. And then later that at night she called me and she goes, well, what about you know? And then the idea so she It would ping pong back and forth. So there's some things I would do toy solo. There's some things. Jesse Terrero used to be my assistant, good brother and one of my best friends, and he would he may come up with something. Neil Feldman wasn't assistant mine. I'd given the outline and do it. But about I'd say a good seventy percent of the time it would just me dipping out. You know. I got a house in Maryland sitting on the back porch and playing it in the headphones and just vibing, and sometimes that could take me two days, three days. And I just say, since you mentioned Alisa Key's video, did you have everything in your head even the casting of that video when you were thinking of the concept. You don't know my name? And did most steps show up on time? Listen? I don't remember, I listen. He's an artist, brother, he's a he never on schedule, always on time. But yeah, but did you think so in your mind? Is that did that come out the deck directly way you wanted into players and everything when that just came later most, however, I really truly can't remember how Most became involved. But Alicia's very she still is and she was she lives that whole, complete life, right, So she wasn't just down for some video model, you know, coming through. She wasn't down for people up all up in her mouth kissing her, you know, even no matter what the concept was. She was very focused on, you know, being authentic telling the story, but also being respectful in her life versus just just the art. And I don't I I've known most through my boy set Free Another Philly Cat for a minute that Free shout out to set Free, and I truly can't remember, but when he came through, I was so happy because I love the movies he'd been in, and he was down. You know. It was not a lot of money involved in it or anything like that. He just came through and represented. And you know, I still think that video I should create a movie. I love Frank Frankie and Johnny. I think it would be so dope to to, you know, do that. And we shot it pan Pan in Harlem, and Pan Pan's not there anymore, right, So that brother made the best pants. Yeah, Pam Pan was. Since you mentioned that, Chris, what's another video? You feel that way about this? You could have just continued on and it could have been a whole like Break Off, Christy, Break You Off? To its too many videos? Christ's so many videos? Was I forgot he did my video. I'm sitting there like, wait a minute, I think Chris directed the Roots video and I just oh shit, because when you said the wire I was like, wait a minute, A couple of wirecats are in my video for break You And then that's right. But I produced that video, Jesse, so I was there and we did the thing under the bed and the whole joy But it was yeah, that was no. I love that video. You know, the era of kind of the big budget videos just kind of pretty much evaporated. How did you and the other directors how did y'all transition during that period? Went to movies? Listen? Listen? What was that like? Man? Kind of seeing that that ecosystem just kind of dwindlem you are, man, it's such a great question. And is YouTube your Napster? Oh? Yeah, Napster's my napster because Napster is the reason the video budgets disappeared too. And I'll tell you man, I once again, I which I could say I saw it coming, but we did not. And we I remember literally there was there was like a week where the bottom dropped out. I think fortunately I had already like maybe started working with Kevin on Real Husbands or whatever it was, but you know, my bread and butter, it was chopped at the knees. And it was very much like almost thinking it was a joke at first, Like you know, labels will call and go, yeah we got X, and I'd be like, really, now we're okay, so what is it really? Because you know who you know this artist and what they you know, the budget you're telling me is what they need for their you know writer, you know, like what this artist is. So I think, you know, for me, it was just a it was just a very difficult switch. But I started to understand it, and I actually would call people. I'd call all the people I met over the years ago, like, Yo, what's going on? Like what's happening? Like I didn't understand the ramifications of napster and digital and that I was still going to the record store getting CDs. Yeah, you know, I think, well, you know, in the music business, many people look at Users Confessions as the last album of that era. I mean, it was the last album. It's the last brick and mortar album where it's sold ten million units. Wow. And then you know, like it came out two thousand and three, and then the age of ripping and all that stuff really came into play. But I also feel like I have a theory that maybe for the video world, even though it wasn't financially responsible, I kind of feel like the rock the Boat video really marked an end, even though other opulent videos were made kind of after. But I feel like the effect of the rock the Boat video and kind of what it represented, like just the whole thing with the Leah's death flying to other locations, private planes, that big boxes, dada on a boat, on a yacht, dada. I definitely remember a moment where that just kinda paused the whole entire industry for a second. So even though it wasn't like a direct thing where it's like, you know, like a nine to eleven thing that changes the world, or a January sixth thing like where you can literally see a tangible thing, but I kind of always wanted to know, like in the video world, was was that a moment that gave you personal pause, like like you your soul, like your soul was like put on pause. And I think we all had been moving at one hundred miles an hour for so many years and have had all these relationships and were so deeply entrenched and you know, going for excellence that we didn't realize the you know, how precious life is right because we were so indexed on working. An example is when the pandemic happened and I was home for three weeks and I was bugging out a little bit. I realized that I hadn't been anywhere for more than two weeks for twenty years, right, so I had to stop moving around. And I'm sure you guys went through that same thing. And to your point, you know, when that video happened and all those things happened, there was a real the party almost stopped, right, There was a there was a halt in because we all felt like a Leah was our little sister, a little cousin, and we loved it. It was a different kind of a feeling when that happened. And and you know, we're all jumping on planes and jumping on private planes and we're moving. You know, we've been to I've been to Brazil to shooting. We never really took We never thought about it about safety and what could happen. And I think, look, that's just something that happens in life. And I think it just was business as usual for us to achieve a great art form. I think we're hype. I think that video is beautiful, and I think, of course, like you know, you know, Hype himself as an artist wasn't only a music video director. He was like our north star, and he was tight with these artists and had relationships with these artists in a way where you know hy Williams video could change in life as a musical artist, right, And it just felt like all of our business, all of our craft, had took a moment to breathe in when that happened. So I agree with you, man, it was was tragic and beautiful at the same time. I always wanted to know, if you can name a name, what artist always makes you go back to the drawing board and read does like for me, I will say that I was in a situation when I know never to give the song that I want to give Jill Scott or Erica bad As the first song, like I actually create and sometimes terik like it's always it's almost like I had to do a horse and pony show, like all right, here's the song, and it's not the song, and I'll do a second song. All right, I tried hard, here's the song, and then I'll do the song really want to give you. All right, here's a song, They're like, yeah, this is the one. So is there an artist that always makes you go back to the drawing board to read I don't like this treatment. I don't like this treatment. Or will you have to explain to them like another way. Okay, well, I guess with the Honey video and you said Erica, you didn't say she's Micromanagi, but you know, I know, no, I am not saying she's Michael Manage. She is of an amazing artist. Yeah, we're going to recreate these classic album covers, which looks good on paper, but absolutely what artists like makes you always go back to the drawing board because they just don't see it in the paragraph that you're explain. Challenge. It's a good challenge. Yeah, no, no, an annoying challenge. I immediately No. Two one is busted box. A good challenge. That's a good chal is a visual. He you want to talk about somebody who's paying attention to the visual I mean, and wants to call you at two am because he's on that time as a musician in the studio, exactly exactly. I don't I don't understand why you didn't pick the phone up at two am like he is, you know, to his credit. I mean, look at I just on his tribute. I was looking at the Janet Jackson video and that thing is as crazy just buhat. Everything he does has a visual component to it. So what happens is he likes the first treatment too, But then you get there and he's in the details. He's going classic classic busted rhymes and bust I love you, my man, and we already know what it is, classics own. But but we did past the cavosier that was each set up was a conversation like he classically he didn't. He did. He's fight scene he felt was better than his fight scene, and he wanted to rechoreograph the fight scene to make sure that it's his video. So I get it. So we recoreographed that that fight scene in that room. Now at the time when the clock is ticking and you're gonna go into overtime, and you've written the treatment and you've done the costume design, and you've got all the martial artists who are going to be in it, and you have the moment that seems like a request that is gonna be tough to create, but it doesn't matter because we still did it. And when you when you look at that video, when I look at that video, I go wow, we probably had at sixty five percent of that on paper, sixty five percent of that plan. And what Buster will will do is he's not just making arbitrary request. He's so deep in it that he's pushing you. He's pushing for greater, he's pushing for better. So he's not the guy who just disappears and goes and smokes. He's on the set setting in the director's chair, looking at playback. And as you're moving through your data as a director, you you know there's certain time things you have to hit. But interestingly enough, I think we did shoot like an extra eight hours on that video. So do you already have overages written in the budget? Do you already have overages written in the budget? When you know that is what you try to do, right and like once again my executive producer, Roseanne Cunningham, that's what you try to do. But the reality is you cannot predict some things. Now, the tough conversation that I've seen many times is when the producer goes over to the you know, music video repping goes, okay, we're having this, it's this much time, or Chris wants a crane, the crane broke and we have to bring in another whatever that is. The record label has to sign off to say, okay, you know cost plus if the if the crane costs you another ten thousand dollars will pay for it. And usually that's where the power shifts, right, because the power because we already have a contract. So no matter what happens, I need to do what's on this treatment to fulfill the contract to get paid. Like that's just a reality of the business that it's really the only way that you can do it right. You have to make sure that it's done. But there's extenuating circumstances that I've seen over the years. But if the artist in the label like down with you, right, you can you can change things a little bit to accomplish the same goal. But you know, I think I think Buster is is you know, he understands it early. He understands like, Okay, this even if this treatment is a we've got to move quickly. So this treatment is a blueprint. We're going to get it where it needs to be once we get there, you know what I'm saying. Okay, I vowed to never do this on this podcast, but since you're here, I gotta know the politics of video Johns. Come on now. Now, there's entire careers and Instagram accounts that have made legends out of the right seven seconds and a video. I think, I don't think videos the Baxter, you know what I'm I'm like, I'm thinking of like so but the thing is that by this by this era, you know, even video models have just as much leverage as the artists themselves. And so is there how do you wrangle like and I'm not trying to objectify, like their product placement, but is it written ahead of time? Like Okay, I'll make sure that you know when you're wrangling with her manager whoever it is glor like dude that when when Grace was at job, like Grace was responsible for like hat from from Kareem all the way down, like all those videos. So but but she told me that she was there to rank, not only wrangle, but also to protect them, you know what I mean. And so, but I didn't realize that there's like negotiations where this particular artist has a certain cachet and she wants to be featured and da da da da da. Is that just decided or is it random or is it already pre planned at the gate? Like Okay, we'll make sure that you're the you're the featured and we're not going to feature your rival. That you might have beef with and said video or is it just like up to the artist who gets in or not. No, listen, in my experience, it's always been this is gonna be a boring answer. It's always been like casting on a feature film. Now, okay, you would think like, oh, that's kind of random. You know you or you look kid, you go, that must be random. Where did they get all those girls from a club? No, the answer is there's a casting director, Ulysses Tarero. Jesse's brother is one of the best that everyone and you know at that in that point, there was an error where those young ladies that were you know, video vixens or whatever you want to call him. It was a portal, right, so now you decide, you know, like there's very memorable moments of different video vixens in videos, right, so, but then it was it's literally a portal, like think about every actress who does stals. Shout outs to Melissa for I mean, you want to talk about the hype Williams and video vix like he was he was though that Jada Kiss video Knock yourself out like he's amazing. But but let's let's talk about her the portal now, she isn't another part of the business. Now she does podcasts, Now she's she she was, you know, part of that era with the magazine with Daytwin Thomas and you know what I mean. And then let's talk about Lauren London. The first thing she did was she was Paul Hunter's assistant number one. She was in Drop It Like His Hot, which is a music video. She was in Carell's video that and my assistant at the time brother named Carl Reid. They were friends and he goes, Chris, you should you should audition Lauren for ATM And I said absolutely, Now, no, I'm not. I'm not having I'm going I'm not having a video girl. I'm trying to be a serious filmmaker. But he was like, look, man, you gotta just be a good brother. Man. You gotta get restaurants. She wants to be an actress. And she came in and it's a great story because she came in and she was late. We had packed the film equipment up right. She came and she goes, I got a peek. I got a peek. Can I go to the bathroom? So she delayed us further. I have to go the bathroom okay. So I'm just sitting there looking a car like okay, and we said action and I had been looking for new, new for probably eight to ten weeks. Wow, and it was her. Wow. Was it true in at L that a lot of big boys lines that heat improv a lot of that or how did how did that? Because we got it? I wanted to ask about it. Let me tell you something. When he said you didn't do that money in my face was like, try not to let Big Boy is genius with his his ad libs. And the way Big Boy was moving was, you know, these big boys from outcasts. These he didn't really understand, you know, Oh it's a six am call, Yeah, to be there all these things. And he would come directly from the studio to set, not having slept or whatever it was. And every day I'd be worried. Every day he delivered every scene. Uh, you know he always added that extra that was beyond the script. Yeah, he had led a lot of that stuff. And he's how was it with TI? Because that was him. I don't think that was his first was that his first feature? It was? It was it was It was similar in the fact that he wasn't he didn't. He never worked on a set before, so you know, me and him, I done his very first video I'm serious before exactly, so so I was always like, man, this kid is dope, and Dallas Austin was like, I think t I could really play the scroll, so tip would I think? He came in the first day in a Rose Royce and he gave the set. He pulled up for the set, what is Rose roy and and then he had a big like you know, when it's a movie, it's Favorite Nations, So every actor has the same kind of a trailer, and he had he had his own Winnebago and all the other actors were in like a two bang. So you know, I talked to him and I said, brother, you know you're leading this like this is everybody's looking to you. You are number one on the call sheet, so I mean in our other world, in your music world. Because he's in the studio every night too. He's super popular. He's becoming the king of the South. I just had a conversation with him and we just got on the same page about work ethic, coming in being the leader, because we're all looking to you as the lead in this picture, and you know he. I think the hardest part for any artist is not being ti or being tipped to your audience. Being with Shod who is the high school a guy who just got out of high school, who is got to show vulnerability. But I think what we both learned for each other because both of our you know, you can never do your first movie again, right, so everything was bet on Tip for me. Everything for Tip was bet on me, Like, so we both had to. You know, we're gonna win the super Bowl. The quarterback and the receiver better be connected. All references, so, you know, we I think we did a good job. I think it's uh, you know, people still reference it and still love it. And I watched him turn into a superstar. That's the one human being out Watch turned from a really hot commodity into a superstar through that process. How did you know that Evan Ross was right for that role? Mhm, he you know what he came in in the audition. I didn't know who he was. I met him in Los Angeles and and I didn't know he was Diana Ross's son until we were shooting. That's really good, good, but yeah, I just was Evan as a restaurant out here Now, Evan's a good man. Evans what the restaurant Leona's Leona's okay, thank you, It's on Venture and he as a club called Warwick on Sunset. Then they didn't know that was his. See, people looked at Evan Ross and like what is he doing? Justscides being married to actually Simpson, that's dope counting. I have one more question about videos mhm, and be honest about the mind stated directors. I know you're saying I can only speak for myself, right, but half the time, do you guys already have treatments in your head or stock footage pre shot already that you're just waiting for the right artist to sell that one? Like? In other words, is every video of Bespoke kind of customize video? I'm only asking this because you know, I had a situation with I don't know, I don't know if you know who Sangi is. Of course he did far size pass me by yep, and a dude always wanted to work with Sanji and we finally got our chance to work with them on our Tipping Point record, and my manager was always like, m sum me right here, like what I've were like, hold up? We did the Star video. Oh, I was wondering which one okay? And Rich is like, why do I feel like he shot this video already and just basically sold us of it because the thing was we weren't there for when you talked about shooting your b shots without the artist first, I was like, wait a minute, that might be a sangy trick on which my it's my manager, Rich Nichols rest in peace. It's this assessment that we got got and basically like he had already shot the video already and sold it to us, and we just shot our shots like at the end for a day or whatever. But like, do you do stock shooting of stuff, you know, like neighborhood shots or just random things that doesn't have a home yet. Is that a thing? No? I listened in my experience. Now I'm just kidding. I don't how to go watch this video again, Chris, I think they look I think they're all. Everything is bespoke for every director. One reason is, you know, the label owns everything. So we would finish a video, you would see two thousand feet of it, but we'd send the whole twenty thousand feet of film to the label. So I don't know if they that's when we were shooting the film. But the label owns everything period, point blank. But yeah, but I mean, like right, okay, back in the day, like all my reels go to the label. But now if I turning a record, I'm just turning that record. They're not getting the demos and the stuff that didn't make the record, right, they're supposed to you. I always here's what's funny. I always talked about producer and I say, you know, we should do and it's exactly what you said. I said, when we shoot a video, why don't we have this car concept? Because let's say this, for every video you shoot, you wrote five treat there's five videos I didn't get right, I'm battling hype Benny, I'm we're all battling each other. So for every video I did, there were five concepts that are setting on my show. I always thought it would be a genius idea to shoot all the components of the video and then put the artists in it. But you never really could do it because everything has a certain vibe. Every song has a certain vibe. Like I said, I thought that would be a great, great idea and maybe artists would like it where you could go, hey, here's a video, and here's how we would in search you in it. I always wanted that, never had the opportunity to do it, but it's because I hate roots videos. Just rewatched it. I was like, wait, anyway, let's talk newdi I just wanted to know about New Addition as a director from your vision. First of all, what were the You have to have these things in place for you to direct this project. You have to have power over this, Like did you have any of those those moments we can I ask them to your question? Yeah? Please? All right? You remember the guy who did the bel Air thing, like actually pitched, hey, why don't we do it? Matt? And he did like a real or a fake trailer? Yes, there was once a fake trailer for the New Addition biopic that was like roaming on you in the early days of YouTube, like back in two thousand and six. Did you have anything to do with that? I did not? Did you do? You know what I'm talking about? Absolutely? Okay? I met and I met the brother. All right, I met the brother and let me tell you what else. He showed up on set with Maurice Star. Oh so look he uh look, God blessing, that's a Hollywood lesson. Man like we are. I've been the same way early in my career, like yo, I'm just going to shoot this sizzle and then they'll know that I'm a guy. I did it seven eight years ago. I shot at at L two trailer. I got everybody together, paid for it, and yeah, okay, we're trying to get we're trying to you know, create momentum. So you know, studio would say, hey, man, yeah we'll make it. You know, it just was it was an effort to you know, show all those people together again. So nothing has come of it as of yet. We hope that we can make a tail too. But I do remember that question. And I met that brother, and he was a young director and he was really dedicated to wanting to make that happen. And you know, I didn't have anything to do with it, but I do know that he he got so far as he showed up what star and what did they want? No wor star. Of course we invited him to set you to see to watch, but he was there with him and I actually had a conversation with him. His heart must be Lord, it's it's tough. It's it's tough, but that is a that is a Hollywood one oh one lesson that's hard to get. But I think he's still like, he's still pursuing the art, he's still pursuing directing, and and uh, I think he's I think, look, it was dope for him to do that, right, he had to love and he just kind of he came up with it and he goes, I'm gonna do this. The fact that he made that happen and I got to go back and look at it, but I remember thinking, this is pretty good, you know what I mean. Before I was ever involved in any any New Edition project, I kind of thought that was the impetus that allowed this to happen, because that thing was so viral that about a year or two later then it was like, you know, we're really going to make this happen. I thought he was a part of that. So no, you know what I knew about this project, Jesse Collins produced it. So Jesse, Jesse told me about this maybe seven years before we shot it, right, he had the project obviously, you know, he does BT awards and everything, and so he got with them. So you can imagine in order to develop it with all those human beings, to do the life rights and to come together. It took that long. So about seven eight years later. I mean, I remember the New Edition was my first concert fifteen Spectrum Philadelphia. I went to see New Edition Lisa, Lisa could Jim. I think he was a fresh fest and you know, stole the car from my pants, did the whole thing. So you can't just casually say that what what Yeah, that was my first concert as a kid, like I love the New Addition. At that point, did you get away with it? I did not? We Uh what was the punishment? I didn't steal the car. I took the car when they told me no, and I drove all my cutains up there. Worst it's bad. We got the car told one of my uncles had to drive from Maryland and Philadelphia to get was silence on the way back. It was worse than Vanessa on The Cosby Show. I was just thinking about that episode, literally, think about that episode. It was and Steve Good I watched the Cosby Show. It was, Oh, what was your question about? Oh did you get away with it? Oh? No, did not? Did not? But when I finally did it. I made sure my uncle and my dad got to see it, and they were like, Okay, it was worth it, you know what I mean. How long was your initial treatment because I'm almost certain it was the three part of right, three, three nights, two hours. I'm almost certain that you had enough content for almost an entire week, like your original vision. How long would it have been? Well, the script it was. The original script was one big script, right, It was like one hundred and sixty pages. And then Stephen Hill and BT said, look, we want this to be like an event. We want this to be three nights. So the writer ab Dul, who's amazing, we started that process. So so Jesse told me about it seven years Prior all those seven years, I was like, man, I wish he would I wish I could do that new edition movie. And then he asked me, would you be interested in doing this? I was like yes. So it's interesting because I was just I this was twenty fifteen, sixteen. I just decided to move back to the East Coast. So I at a house out here. The whole thing. We shut the house down, you know, gave up the lease and I was headed to the airport when he called me to say, would you want to do this movie? It's a green light with BT we start next week. So I had to change everything that I was doing, stay out there and but so then it happened, and then we worked for maybe six months before we started shooting. So I think the one of the questions was how did we pull all those actors and whatnot together? And that was a real casting thing with Robbie Reid. We'd have Robbie Reid, Spike Lee's casting agent for years and years on the show. Yeah, she's amazing, she's amazing, And it's just so for each person like wood Woody McClean, who's now you know, doing the thing. He's killing him. Yeah, he used to be He used to be a dancer for Chris Brown. Wait wait wait wait wait wait wait. He was a dancer for Chris Brown. The forty had ever acted in anything. So I had called for Tima Robinson to go, hey, do you know anybody who I'm looking for Bobby Brown? And she gave the reco for Woody. Then we saw Woody and wood was really like he was a dancer, so he wasn't used to act. He was rather shy, but he could dance his ass off, you could do all the Bobby Brown stuff. And we had the conversation and I just was like, listen, I'm gonna bring you back for like the third audition. Be bold brother, like he's not an actor, believe it. And then he's but look what he's done. That's what I always say, Like, you know, that's something that me and Jesse Terrell always said, like a lot of times we weren't able to work with the big actors in our career, like they weren't checking for us as directors, that they always looked at us as video directors. So we said, let's make our own start, right. And I'm glad that we, you know, had that that kind of blockade because it spawned other things because he was Bobby for a long time to the point where where he got to power. I was like, I don't know, but now he's came. He did new addition and then he did the Bobby Brown. He killed it. You feel I feel the same. I guess you must have felt very strongly about Algae in that way, the actor that played Ralph Tresvant, because you've sacrimented him back into a couple of projects right at least I know he was in Shooting Stars. Yeah, no, listen, it's always a curveball, right. I was like, I didn't I didn't see it. I didn't see Algae as Ralph Tressman because there were there were people that looked exactly, looked a lot more like Ralph Tresman, I see, and I didn't see it. But then Jesse really believed in it, and I was like, okay. And then when he came to the park to the audition where they would sing als, she can sing, and I was like, I mean, listen, I was torn all the way up until we were shooting, and then he just he did it like he killed it. So even free shooting, you weren't you still weren't sure. I wasn't sure. I wasn't sure because we had let this guy go that I'm talking about if there was a Ralph Tresman twin. But obviously Algae embodied the character like he had. He had a sensitivity, no funny h he had, he could dance, he could sing, and even the tone of his voice was just perfect. I need times specific from you, Chris. I'm so sorry, and as you're telling any stories about this casting, I need you to please tell the story why you casted Dustin Felder for Jimmy jam May he rest in paradise for fucking ever, like please, please, please please listen Dustin Felder is it was just he's He was our acting coach for the kid right coach, and his energy was it was just grounded and real, like the exact kind of person that I the way I wanted to communicate to the boys, and I would we would have sessions where I would just be in a corner, quiet, and the way he spoke to them and the way he talked to them about performance and being real. You watched them more because these were all guys who were kind of afraid, right, because not only is this material material tough, the real guys are visiting rehearsal like they did, like you know what I'm saying, And then what Dustin would do would be amazing. And we were looking for like Jimmy Jammy Terry Lewis, and I would look at him every day ago, man, you could be Jimmy jam you know what I'm saying, like you could do it, and we'd laugh about it. And then one day he wore for Dora and I go it's just him and all the boys were like campaigning for him too, like all the all the all the guys who were you know, played in New Edition, they were campaigning for him too, and it was a natural fit. Man. He's really coached some amazing black actors out of la Like there's a very a generation of black actors that have a lot to give to him. So I didn't even know that that's what's up, good brother. I heard a rumor that you were Were you one of the initial actors that I guess we're a long time both Will Smith and Kevin Hart. We're going to do Uptown Saturday Night. Should I not hear your name tossed in there as a director? I'm glad you're telling me because I heard about that project too. I think Will Packer was involved in it. And that's one of my favorite movies a long time, Wow, favorite movies of all time, and it a couple of years a few years ago, it was going around Hollywood that that was happening. I haven't seen a script yet, but yeah, I could just want to heard your name mentioning it. Thank you good because you might be in some rooms I'm not in. That's a good day. I love Lord. Speaking of script Chris, with the writer strike that's going on now, how with you as a director, how does that affect you? One? And two? How do you think it affects the future of filmmaking as a whole. Where do you think the game is right now? And where do you think? I think we're having a napster moment, and I think it's it's completely People can't imagine what that the that the industry would change, right, But you know, right or strike? For instance, right, I still get atl was eighteen years ago. I still received residuals from it from that, right, because the business model was Okay, we saw it in the movies. Now we see it on TV. Now, we see it in the airplane, now we see it in Africa. That's the way TV has always worked. Now it's streaming, so streaming for us too, for directors guilt where everybody is well, no streamer wants it to ever go anywhere else. It's a subscription model. We want this is only available here. So I think what we're looking at is going wow, like the business change, what is it? How do you figure it out? It's the wild wild West to a degree. And I think there are some streamers who've got it figured out at least the best that it can be, but it will never be what it was what it was, And I think, just like with videos, we it took a long time to go. Maybe I should stop making horseshoes because they're driving cars around and there needs to be tired. Right, There's it's a long way to look at how you the way content is valued. So what is that? That's just what I'm telling you is just a realization I had recently. Maybe you know, I've been so involved and so in the marketing and everything with the shooting stars and the edit right up until it came out that I wasn't even really on the page. But when I've been having some conversations, it's like I don't quite understand the answer yet or what it means, you know. So to answer quest question, the world is not my oyster, you know what I mean? I don't think the world is an oyster for anybody right now, because we don't know the opportunities are shrinking. Right. There's a statistic in the in the d GA that of every member that makes a feature film, eighty five percent only make one. Yeah, this is before any of this, right, So that tells you how difficult it is to make a feature and how slim the opportunities are. Eighty five percent of the union makes one feature film and not another one. It's the same. It's almost the same on the sack side as well. On our side you have your your tom cruises whatever. But then the other is, you know, people struggling to get commercials or whatever. You know, that's why to keep your ear to the street street because if you keep it in the bubble, you're gonna think it's sweet, but nah, it's it's people are out in la ship is changing and it's you feel it. Yeah, it's tough, you know, but it's interesting, right because that's the thing. The thing about the business, even if once you're in it for a long time, for me, is that every day there's the opportunity for possibility, right, and and that can that can that can keep your motivation flowing, It can keep your you wake up every morning there's a possibility of writing that script or moving forward. But I think that what we have to look at our great examples of the business aspect of you know, when we look at a mirror and how he does things. How we look at Tyler Perry and he does things, Lee Daniels, These guys who have ken you barrass these guys who have taken their talent understood how it works in business and how to play the game. And me personally, I've always been leaning more towards the artist side, right, and having reps and agents and things, and just happy to be able to be created because at some point, as a creative, you go, man, I couldn't live any other way, Like I couldn't have another job, you know what I mean? And that satisfaction of when something that you create connects to your audience. Right. But I think that because of the way that the world and the technology is moving, it's more of a there needs to be more of a focus on understanding the business, not even just from a Hollywood perspective, but from a Wall Street perspective. You know, how content is being valued, how the business mottle of of subscriptions are different. Yeah, how the streaming companies are kind of collapsing into one another, like with Max becoming HBO becoming Max and Time Going collapsing into Paramount. And it just reminds me a lot of what happened with major labels, like when you said naps the moment it reminds people the same thing to happened with label. Well, sir, thank you, it's long overdue. Next time we're in the landing together, I'll treat you to follies. He's in La, He's in Lamut. Time we're on a plane though, yeah, La don't count, you know, man, I just wanted to say, Chris, I really just appreciate your work man, and I love the way just to watch how you it's you a lot of the directors I follow my guys, Seeth Man, who I'm sure you know see, Yeah, the y C, Anthony Hemingway, just y'all brothers. Man, I'm just really proud to see y'all like you know, transition and just keep working. Man. I just love what y'all do. So thank you, thank you. That's what's up on behalf of Sick Steve and I'm p Bill and Fin Ticcolo and like you and the great Chris Robinson. I love your work. I love your songs that you do with your brother Rich and all the vics formula. All right, that was for Dustin. I just wanted to show it on the YouTube. There we that's right. We are on YouTube now. Damn congratulation. Yes, I still don't know how that works for us. We're still on our soft lunch anyway. Uh this great Chris Robinson and uh we'll see you on the next go around, y'all, My brother, Thank y'all. What Love Supreme is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.