789: The COVID Pandemic's Surprising Silver Lining - Fueling the School Choice Movement

Brian Nichols  
A new landmark poll shows not just a majority, but two thirds of American parents are now open to supporting school choice, even if they personally are in favor of school choice for their families. It is a huge shift in the conversation as it pertains to our school choice conversation. So naturally, we got talking about that instead of focusing on winning arguments. We're teaching the basic fundamentals of sales and marketing and how we can use them to win in the world of politics, teaching you how to meet people where they're at on the issues they care about. Welcome to The Brian Nichols Show. Wow, hey there, Brian Nichols here on The Brian Nichols Show. Thank you for joining us on of course, on another fun filled episode. I am as always your humble host joining us live from our cardio miracle Studios here in lovely lovely Eastern Indiana folks in control of your heart health with cardio miracle specially formulated to help support circulation, blood flow and cardiovascular health. Notice more energy less fatigue and better rest. Transform your heart get cardio miracle today at Brian Nichols show.com forward slash heart use code T B and S to save 15% off your order. And oh by the way, folks, there's a 100% money back guarantee. So you quite have are quite literally that is have nothing to lose one more time. Brian Nichols show.com forward slash HeartCode T B and S are 15% off your order. Your heart will thank you and speaking of something thanking you I guarantee your kids will thank you if you decide to pay attention to today's episode joining me to discuss this brand new landmark poll helping show a huge swing in the overall opinion and sentiment towards school choice. Join me to discuss that from Yes, every kid Matt friend away. Welcome to The Brian Nichols Show.

Matt Frendewey  
Hey, Brian, great to have you. Great to be here.

Brian Nichols  
Great to have you on the show. Matt, looking forward to today's conversation. But first, you gotta do me a favor, introduce yourself and yes, dot every kid dot Foundation, what is the organization? And what's the great work you guys are doing over there?

Matt Frendewey  
Absolutely. So I've been working in education reform for better half of nearly a decade and a half now probably about 15 years. And yes, every kid we're devoted to unlocking the extraordinary potential of every kid, where we're really committed to the belief that every student has promised gifts and is blessed with talents and deserving of every opportunity, whether that's their local, public school, private school, homeschool, Co Op, microscale, you name it. And so really, we look at pursuing the belief that we need to take down the barriers that are holding families back and really unleash the great potential of individuals.

Brian Nichols  
Matt, what are when you're talking about this? This topic and it can get a little testy, right, because we're talking about kids, parents, their children get their kids education. Right. So this is a conversation that, of course, seems to you know, you're going on some very thin lines there, it seems. But there seems more recently. Now, I'd love to hear your context here. Much more of a openness to discussing the fact that maybe your kids education system isn't the best, maybe our kids education system isn't actually an education system. Let's dig into that a little bit.

Matt Frendewey  
Yeah, absolutely. Well, let's let's let's use the system's own benchmark, right, the nape score, which is kind of considered one of the gold standards of benchmark progress. And based on the nape scores, this system that traditional public school system is an abysmal state. reading scores are at all time low math scores have been trending down with significant drop after the pandemic, but if you will be even before the pandemic were trending down, and the pandemic, the COVID-19, schools shut down, shed a spotlight on glaring challenges and problems within the system and put it on the radar of parents who were otherwise trusting of this public school system that they had oftentimes bought a home into, to do the job that they had hired it for. And a lot of families recognized right away that if they needed to fire their school and hire a new one, and as a result, I mean, if you look at just enrollment numbers, traditional public schooling is still down significantly from pre pandemic levels. Those kids didn't disappear. They found new places to go learn. They've learned from new homeschoolers, micro schools, private schooling, traditional public schooling, you know, cousin charter schooling, and so you find all these other different other options. And so, in the course between parents being frustrated during the pandemic today What we're seeing is a shift in the conversation, a shift in perceptions, and a recognition that from parents, according to the YouGov poll, that all options are, are better than no options. And that even if I don't want to choose an option, I still think it's better and it's worthy of you to be possibly wanted. Choose it for your family,

Brian Nichols  
having choice is better than no choice. Shocking that what's interesting, Matt, that you you kind of articulate here and how No, I hate to even say this, but like, some good that came from the pandemic, is that I guess, parents finally open their eyes to what was actually happening in these government schooling systems. And it wasn't a matter of because you know, all sudden, parents were like, you know, what, we should really pay attention to what's happening behind the school doors, but rather, school doors came behind the closed doors, the parents, right, it came into the home, because all of a sudden, with the teachers unions, forcing kids to now take classes, regardless of whether or not they were at risk, or the teachers were at risk. Now, you're gonna have to stay at home indefinitely, to take schooling and oh, by the way, parents, you already strapped and open your eyes. Yes, open your ears, pay attention to what your kids are learning. Oh, guess what, it's bad. It's really, really bad. And that opened the eyes and the ears again, to so many parents to what actually was taking place. And now we're at a point where I'm actually shocked, Chris, that we are mad that we are at this point, fast forward, because I just think one of my buddies, Chris, and he was vehemently against the idea of school choice. And I was just talking to him last week. And he was like, you know, maybe, maybe that's something we should talk about. And he was completely off the the idea of school choice, because what you raised earlier, is property values, right? So something's happening, right? And it all stemmed from 2020. And it's a terrible thing that we all experienced the pandemic, but it's opened so many doors now. Because when we say it's in sales, once people see it, they can't unsee it. And way too many parents saw the truth of what was happening to their kids behind the scenes. Absolutely.

Matt Frendewey  
I mean, Emily Hanford has an award winning Docu series, our podcast series called as sold a story. And it talks about these families who assume, you know, Soon their kids read good schools assumed everything was going well, and their kids were at home now. And they were having to, you know, essentially, like, manage their career as well as manage their kids education. And it dawned on them suddenly, their kid couldn't read. And and Emily's story, it's like, in her soul story, podcast. It's story after story after story of these parents, who assumed everything was fine, assume their kids could read, and they couldn't. And that's just a snapshot, just a small snapshot into what unfolded across the country. And so you've seen a paradigm shift now, among parents, when you start to look at, like, just baseline support for school choice. Historically, we saw good numbers, most of more people were in favor than opposed. But now, I mean, just in the last year, we we did a poll recently in Kansas, 73% of families in Kansas supported school choice in Texas 74% support school choice, a state where they, the lawmakers are fighting tooth and nail to defend the status quo. In Georgia and other state where lawmakers have have defended the status quo in an oppositional parents 68% of families support school choice. And it's not just party ID, you have 70 80% among Republicans, oftentimes 65 to 70%, among independents, and very often well above, easily a plurality, but typically above 50% or higher among Democrats. And if you're a lawmaker, you know, it's only so long that you can withstand this until you recognize that you're not to stand against bad policy, you're at some point standing against bad politics. And we all know what happens lawmakers when they stand against those two.

Brian Nichols  
There were some numbers in this poll. I just wanted to quickly pull out so a majority of the Americans surveyed. And this is what you mentioned earlier, Matt, which is awesome, including most Democrats, independents, and Republicans indicate support for number one ending residential school assignment, which is obviously zip codes shouldn't determine education. 67% said, Yes, we are in favor of that. Expanding access to education savings accounts, ESA is 63% and expanding education tax credits. 66%. That's for Yes. Again, Democrats, Republicans and independents. And then there was one other thing I wanted to highlight as well. And that is where we saw the biggest improvements of percent support. If we were to make K 12 education more flexible for families. Do you think this would improve or weaken our net our nation's overall education system? You know, who had the highest? Some of the highest support is black and poor Americans 73 and 74%, respectively, and then it was Republicans then it was upper middle class. For higher than it was the middle class, then it was your independence. So this not only is beyond political affiliation, this is actually going towards the very people, Matt, who absolutely need this the most. Absolutely.

Matt Frendewey  
I mean, if I could do one thing it would we probably put Randi Weingarten on the on tour and have her go everywhere to talk about what a piece of work she gets. everywhere she goes, she makes the case for us, right? She talks about how important the system is where families are thinking about their kid, their setting about how important their kid is, when you talk even you talk to good educators, they're not even bragging about the system. They're talking about how how your child is doing. And you you turn to Randi Weingarten. And all she can talk about is System System System. And that's where they've lost family. So there's been a disconnect over the course of the history of our education system, where we prioritize this system to teach as many kids we could, you know, for those that really want to nerd out, this is the Prussian education model we have in America, and we, you know, important here, Russia has come and gone, but our education system has has has sustained, and families are getting to a point where they go, Wait, this is not working. Even educators really, if you look at the the vulnerabilities of educators, educators are tired of the system. They're tired of being of having their passion to teach, just basically drowned out. They're being, you know, required to teach idealogue, you know, topics and everything that had nothing to do with education. And you see educators every day quitting, and starting starting micro schools and coops and you. I mean, if you've noticed that attack recently on homeschooling, it's a systemic attack, targeted at trying to attack trying to attack this, this new out of system learning space, because they recognize the teachers union and the education establishment that a combination of parents having their funding given to them. And really talented educators who are like I'm done, I'm out and you marry those two, you could have 1000, flowers bloom, which is what what you're seeing, you're seeing microscopes pop up all over. And they look different. And they they're all founded by wonderful people who just have different mission oriented, and they only want to teach a few kids here or there. And really, like that's going to be the next Turning Point is gonna just just break the system wide open. Oh, yeah.

Brian Nichols  
to two of the most requested and purchased items over at my shop, Brian Nichols, show.com, forward slash shop? Are these two stickers, one, fun students, not systems, number two, zip codes shouldn't determine education. Like it speaks to me when I see that that those are the two most purchased stickers I have in my store. But to the point you raise out earlier, Matt, you know, this is something that we let me let me rewind a little bit. We have this Prussian schooling model that you mentioned. And I've talked about this a few times here in the show before as well. And you see that it was so structured, like we're gonna make good little workers, right, like good little factory drones, good little test takers. And that was the model. And I saw it like when I was in school, I would see the teachers, teachers I absolutely respected I admired who would be like, I hate this. I hate New York State Regents is why because I had to teach her the stupid tests, I can't teach you what I actually want to teach you. Because, believe it or not, folks in the audience who maybe didn't know this, a lot of teachers actually enjoy teaching their educators they like to educate. But they're not allowed to do that. More often than not, their hands are tied, they're taught, you must teach for this test. Otherwise, we will find somebody who can. And that rate there just speaks to how broken our system is. And yet, to your point, Matt, this system that is so inherently broken, at its core, is a system that's based on a country that doesn't exist anymore. What are we doing?

Matt Frendewey  
It's so backwards and so and outdated. I mean, if you really, if you're a committed, you know, like, you know, a true progressive, you should be shocked to your core of your peel back the onion, of what the term public schooling system was built on. The founders of the system, that committee of 10 that was laid out in 1894, by the National Education Association, they believed in inherited ability, this idea, which is essentially eugenics and racism, they believe that like certain kids were destined to greatness because of how who they were born into, and certain kids weren't. And so the education systems entire goal was to rank and sort kids determine who should go on to college and you know, who's the rest of the laborers and yet that's the system we have today that continues to Do that. And it's the rankings your kids figure out, you know, okay, you're a good lucky to go to college and you're the one that should go to trade school, which is such a mismatch of what families want what students want. And like you said what most most educators want. And so we're really at this at a turning point in this country, would we see it? In policy right now? Right? Oh, nearly 20 states have passed new school choice policies or expanded existing ones. And that's a result of like, you know, apologies to any lawmakers that might be watching but you guys are the laggards of like transformation, right? Like policy follows culture, culture shifted, and the politicians are running fast, for good reason to catch up, and to try and play, play catch up and create policy that families want, which is good, is why you've seen new policies in Kansas and are actually not Kansas. But in Iowa, Arkansas, you know, Arizona, expanded universal, Florida and universal. Now, the states that are on the cusp, it was what it is Kansas, Tennessee, Georgia, and Texas. Those are the states that now are going to have to chase down there, their peers who are breaking open the system and making families free.

Brian Nichols  
In shame on me for not saying his name yet front of the show, Cory de Angeles, he's been doing the Lord's work going around, and and going to these different state capitals talking about the importance of funding students, not systems. So thank you, Cory, for all the hard work he does. And by the way, folks, if you want to go check out some of the past episodes of the quarry. I'll include those in our show notes here, as well as if you're on the YouTubes. I'll make sure I include that right after we wrap up today. So you can continue your viewing pleasure. But yeah, this this is something as we're going towards the end of the show here, Matt, like, this is something we've seen it. I don't know. Like, if you were to rewind 10 years ago, there was a group of folks having this this dialogue. But it was it was a microcosm, right? It was it was a blip in the ocean, of education. And yet 2020, again, I keep on going back to that thing, we all experienced the pandemic 20 We all all of a sudden, were faced with the reality. And I think a lot of things that were broken, were exposed for being broken. And fast forward to today, we've seen a like a monumental shift towards this now being not just something that parents are open to what they're favoring. And that speaks to your point earlier about culture being the main driver of politics, because yes, politics is in fact downstream from culture. But it doesn't matter how good your policy is, if the culture isn't ready for it, and vice versa, the culture hasn't direct the policy, then good luck getting your policy to get the support of the public. So there is a very delicate Yin and Yang and Matt, we are at a point right now in our history where I think we are at a golden opportunity for the yin and the yang to to have a nice little synergy going on here. So paint the picture for us, right? Where do you see this school choice conversation heading as we move forward, not just into an election year in 2024. But obviously, you know, we are heading forward to the back half of the decade. So what do you kind of see this, you know, this this new landmark poll showing as we head towards the the future here as it pertains to school choice,

Matt Frendewey  
but I think it's indicative of a shift in the entire ad reform movement, if you will. And that's what has traditionally been called ed reform or education reform, where we're shifting from a reform system, mentality to a transform natality reform is, is historically trying to make what you have a little bit better transformers moving to an entirely new model and system. And that's where we're headed. That's what families want, is what would better serve students across this country. It's also where the policies are headed, where suddenly funding isn't just trapped, or shifted from one public school to just a private school, suddenly, it's given to families, and they have the power to customize it and personalize it in any way, shape, form or fashion. And that's where we're headed. And that's what families want. And so I am excited about the future. I'm excited about what comes next. I don't I don't see. Esa as the end all, be all I see that as like a stopping point in the in the transition to absolute freedom for every family. You talked about zip codes. And that's another area where we can break down barriers right now. Traditional public schooling is is one of the only publicly funded systems in this country that's entirely controlled by where you live. You know, public parks aren't that way public. hospitals aren't that way. And it's forcing families some families to to try and who don't have any other options where they don't have school choice programs, to try and use a family member's address to try and go to a better school and and the public schools to is hiring investigators to go after these families to track them down and know joke sue them for a quote, stealing of education. And so, you know, you said you're not far from the border of Ohio. And the most famous cases was from Ohio, where a mother just used her father's address for her kid. And they tracked them down, they had investigators tracking her down, like Pete taking photos of them, you know, trying to basically build a case against the family, because all she wanted to do was provide her kid a better education. And so we I think removing the idea of zip, zip codes as boundary lines that trap get kids into, quote, good schools and other kids, other kids into bad schools is one big transformational policy that's coming up. Those will continue to just break and otherwise closed system open.

Brian Nichols  
Matt, friend away, you guys are doing amazing work over at Yes, every kid foundation, you guys are truly not just helping change the conversation, but actually changing the way that parents are now helping raise their kids as it pertains to their education. This is the way we win. Right. And for my final thoughts, I'll say this, we don't win by pointing at problem and saying problem. We solve it by bringing a solution to the table. And that's what you're doing today, Matt, and frankly, that's what the other folks in this awesome movement. That is the greater school choice movement have been doing folks like you, folks like Carrie McDonald, folks like Cory de Angeles, you have all been leading the charge to help change the tide, the dialogue, change the conversation, and change the culture, right. And the fact that we are now seeing a culture change along the way, that's helped me make it easier for us to have this conversation and now to actually make policy changes. It's exciting, right? And for anybody who's on the I guess, you know, the more political right of the aisle. I mean, this is a huge win, celebrate, because this is our idea, right? That people are now embracing. So let's celebrate that. And let's see if we can get some more where you said 20 states, let's get to 25. Then let's get to 30. And heck, I would love to see maybe a constitutional amendment for school choice. I don't know maybe I'm stepping over my balance because that ninth and 10th amendment but you know, one can dream, I guess I don't know. But Matt, that's my final thoughts.

Matt Frendewey  
conversation of what a good federal policy may look like, or it's right absence of federal policy may be the best policy, but I'll leave that I'll leave it at that as the cliffhanger for a future conversation.

Brian Nichols  
What do you got for us are your final thoughts today, Matt?

Matt Frendewey  
Well, you know, I just I think that like you said there's a couple things that are just i right there sitting for families if you're if you're in a state that is on the cusp of transformation, just get involved get engaged because I promise you you're just like one session, one lawmakers courageous accent away from getting a transformative policy in your state. And if you're looking for someone to partner come find us we want to partner if you're an organization that's ready to roll come get us we're ready to partner with you and make this a you said a not a a 20 state solution but a 50 state solution where we're helping every state get across the finish line to open up their schools to open up their systems. So more families have freedom and more students can exceed

Brian Nichols  
math friend away from yes every kid foundation thanks for for joining the show. And folks, if you enjoyed today's episode you know the drill go ahead give it a share when you do please tag yours truly at B nickels Liberty you can find me on x.com as well as over on Facebook. Matt where can folks go ahead find you find yes every kid foundation and stay in touch? Yes

Matt Frendewey  
every kid.com Yes every kid foundation.com Check us out on Twitter. Yes every kid anywhere on the socials we'll just keep the conversation going as my monitor is always engaged so ping me and we'll get the conversation going.

Brian Nichols  
Don't hurt people don't take people's stuff you want to win this bumper sticker we'll go ahead enter into our bumper sticker giveaway five star rating and review over at Brian Nichols show.com enters you into win all you got to do is take a screenshot of said review. Email it to me Brian at Brian Nichols show.com Not only folks will you be entered into win this awesome bumper sticker but as I mentioned the Affer mentioned fun students not systems as well as our zip codes shouldn't determine education stickers plus more like our good ideas don't require a force snap back I have hoodies I have t shirts. I have all that and more over at our shop and you will be entered to win a $100 gift card for the shop if you enter are don't hurt people don't take people's stuff bumper sticker giveaway you're automatically entered for that. So how about that two birds one stone go ahead. Enter your five star rating and review today. Email me Brian at Brian Nichols show.com That's one final thing there. Then just in terms of where can you find the show, video audio version of the show? I don't care. All I appreciate is that you share the show you help bring more folks to the program. So where can you find the show to actually go ahead and share said show well We got video versions of the show over on YouTube rumble Ben swans, a sovereign spelled s o v r e n. And we're uploading our entire episodes to x.com as well. So wherever it is you consume your video content, just do me a favor, make sure you hit that little subscribe button, like button if you're ever on the YouTubes and the rumbles and of course, go down below in the comments. Let us know what your thoughts are. Are you in favor of school choice? Are you excited if you're a parent to have some options now for your kid? If you live in a state that's embraced school choice? Let us know down below. And also if you are joining us on YouTube, like I said, stick around because like right about here, you should be seeing my conversation with Cory D'Angelo is popping up. So make sure you stick around there. And then one last thing. That's right, Matt, over for the audio versions of the show, Apple podcasts, Spotify, YouTube music, wherever it is, you get your podcast. Just go ahead. Give us a some love. Hit subscribe, and also, hit download all unplayed episodes. Yes, we have over 790 episodes of the program. So I guarantee in the treasure trove of episodes, you're going to find at least a handful that will leave you educated, enlightened and informed educated, not like from those government schooling,

system software areas. I promise. None of that nonsense, Matt, any final words for us as we wrap things up today?

Matt Frendewey  
I love that that bumper sticker. We might have to do a I'm gonna have to drop a review and see if I can win one, two, I'll send you Yes, every kid that enemy of average, we want every Excellent. Well,

Brian Nichols  
I love it. Well, folks, go ahead and look for matzoh, Matt's five star rating and review there will have to hold them to his word, not just teasing, but seriously. Go look for it now, folks, thank you for joining us here on today's episode. If you enjoy the episode again, please go ahead and give it a share. But with that being said, Brian Nichols signing off here for Matt Fenway. We'll see you next time. Thanks.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai