Renew Your Marriage! Marriage Secrets for a Strong Marriage

[00:00:00] David Dowlen: Here's the million dollar question. How do men like us reach our full potential and grow into the men? We dream of being all taking care of our responsibilities, working, being good husbands fathers, and still take care of ourselves. That's the question. And this podcast will help you with those answers.

[00:00:20] My name is Brent and welcome to the Fallible man podcast. I am so excited today. I have my friend all Oliver Marcelle and his amazing wife, Denise, from relationship trade secrets on the show on today's episode, we're going to dig deep into starting your new year with a focus on renewing your marriage. It doesn't matter if you've been married for a minute 30 years, or if you're thinking about marriage, this episode is for you.

[00:00:41] Just because of that. My wife, Sarah is joining me on camera today because guys between your knees and all of her and us, we got like 40, some odd years of marriage. And guys, they're going to bless you so much in this podcast. I'm so incredibly excited about this Oliver, Denise, welcome to the show.

[00:00:59] Denise Marcelle: All right, guys.

[00:00:59] Thank you so much.

[00:01:01] We're honored here.

[00:01:03] Oliver Marcelle: Yeah. It's it's our pleasure to hang out with you guys. This good stuff. Good stuff. Thank you.

[00:01:10] David Dowlen: Now, Oliver, I've gotten to work with you before you came on the live stream and just shared incredible information on our live. And I'm really appreciative that Denise, this is the first time I've gotten to work with you.

[00:01:21] I'm very excited today. I haven't actually got sucky yet.

[00:01:24] Denise Marcelle: No, I'm excited about this too. I keep hearing about Brent and the fallible man. Listen, where are we going to get to meet officially to be here?

[00:01:36] David Dowlen: Now you guys been married for over 21 years, right?

[00:01:39] Oliver Marcelle: Yeah. Yeah. Just over 21. Yep. 21 years, knowing each other, knowing each other for about 26 or

[00:01:46] David Dowlen: so.

[00:01:47] Oh my goodness. And I'm in LA before I was getting ready for the show. I didn't know that you guys actually had a blog for a long time before you started doing the podcast as

[00:01:55] Oliver Marcelle: well. Yup. That was honestly, yeah. That's how we started. And, and to be quite honest, that was the only thing we had in mind. Yeah.

[00:02:03] So, so back when we started the blog, we would just, you know, people would tell us, Hey, you know, we love you. We love your relationship, man. And, and we're like, what are you talking about? Like we struggling just like everybody else. And so long story short, we're like, well, you know what, let's start a blog.

[00:02:19] And at the time we started it, I, I had no vision of where we are right now. It was literally. Tell our story via blog. If somebody happens to read it fine, if they don't, we'll go on with our lives. And that's literally how it started. Yeah.

[00:02:37] David Dowlen: I'll apologize. Our audience. This is the first time Sarah and I had set up in this configuration.

[00:02:42] So we're, we're learning this on the go.

[00:02:43] Sarah Dowlen: We're not used to being like this close while we're filming this. Isn't kind of new experience, not crammed

[00:02:49] on the

[00:02:49] dining room pinch anymore. That's true.

[00:02:51] David Dowlen: Upgrade our very first podcast together. We were jammed in this it's this adorable little, like two Cedar bent wooden bench where like kitchen tables and stuff.

[00:03:01] It's our girls much better than us. It's good for the kids. It's not so good for like we're, we're like hugging.

[00:03:10] We got really, really warm under the lights, trying to be smiling as we're like burning it up. It was in the middle of the warm part of the year. It's like, this is bad.

[00:03:21] Denise Marcelle: Yeah, it's pretty cool to see the progression though. Cause they say the same thing as like, man, look how it look where we started and look at where we are now and all the things that we're able to do now that we didn't even think to do when we first started.

[00:03:35] So it was really cool to see the progression and have something to talk about a laugh about

[00:03:40] David Dowlen: Oliver. And I have talked at length, you know, this I'm in the same boat, you know, you guys started with a blog and that, that was going to be it. Yeah. I started writing a book and, and 15 months later, um, it's just crazy where this has gone and what all we're doing.

[00:03:55] And uh, it was not on the agenda, but lo and behold, here we are.

[00:04:01] Oliver Marcelle: Yep. And, and listen, that, that just goes to show that there was a greater plan, right? It now here it's, it's coming in to, you know, into play. So I'm just, now we're at the point where we're just like, okay, you know, you know where people have faced, so, okay.

[00:04:18] God, whatever, you know, we got next, you know, we just we'll just see what happens.

[00:04:24] David Dowlen: That's all you can do is just kind of strap in. I, uh, I was not planning this and it was like, okay, God, I don't know what you're doing with this. I certainly don't know that I'm the right person for it, but this seems to be what I should do.

[00:04:40] So, okay. I gotta ask, you know, I, uh, you you've heard the podcast before. I don't do real introductions. So tell us who is Oliver, Denise. Marcel. And what are they about?

[00:04:54] Oliver Marcelle: Sure. I'll let you do that.

[00:04:57] Denise Marcelle: Okay. We are Oliver and Denise, Marcel of Denali, LLC, Denise and Ali Denali. And. We are just passionate about relationships.

[00:05:08] We're passionate about seeing them thrive and grow. And we love to help couples build the relationship of their dreams. However, that looks for them, help them to communicate better without frustration and judgment. And that is just our passion. We've seen, you know, we've been through a lot and we've seen what works for us and what doesn't work for us.

[00:05:33] And we know that a lot of couples struggle with those same things. And so we just are passionate about helping them out with that.

[00:05:41] Oliver Marcelle: Yeah. That's basic. That's basically what it is. In a nutshell, we are big on communication. Anybody who knows us has heard us say these three words. If you heard it, once you heard it, a million times have a conversation.

[00:05:54] So like, like, like Niecey said, communicating with our frustration and judgment, we're also big on increasing intimacy, oddly enough, in, in COVID time. Now mind you in 2020 was our 20th year of marriage, but COVID shook everybody up. And we realized that there were some things as it relates to our intentionality around building and maintaining intimacy.

[00:06:22] And so that has become a big focus for us as well as it relates to what we are doing. As we work with our couples to help increase intimacy and build and get them to where they want to be. And so that's us in a nutshell, man, passionate about seeing relationships thrive and as such, we are everything we do, whether it be sitting here with you, lovely folk or, uh, coaching a couple, or creating some type of content for social media, it's all for the purpose of enriching, uh, marriages.

[00:06:56] David Dowlen: That's very obvious looking. I, uh, I love since I follow you guys now on like Instagram, the other social media platforms, I look forward to your posts throughout the day. You guys have social games so much stronger than mine, but just the good content is

[00:07:13] Oliver Marcelle: thanks.

[00:07:13] Denise Marcelle: He's the, he's the backbone behind all of that.

[00:07:16] He's the visionary.

[00:07:17] Oliver Marcelle: And I'm telling you this it's listen. I appreciate you saying that because on this side of the fence, I'm always like, man, how do you keep up with this thing? Like,

[00:07:31] David McCarter: it is funny.

[00:07:32] Oliver Marcelle: You would say that. Cause I tell her that about you. I'm like, man,

[00:07:36] David McCarter: man, this stuff is

[00:07:38] Oliver Marcelle: always hot.

[00:07:39] David Dowlen: Yeah. I thank you.

[00:07:41] I, uh, social. It's so foreign, I'm more comfortable on YouTube or on the podcast. Yeah. Growing up preacher's kid being a former minister. I'm very comfortable talking to people. It has taken some time getting used to talking to a camera. Yeah. It's it's very, I don't care who you are. That's just weird. Like staring at a camera lens.

[00:08:03] Right. And talk to it. Like this person has just really weird.

[00:08:06] Denise Marcelle: It is very weird. We have this screen here and the camera here, and I have to remember look at the camera when you're talking. Don't look at the screen so you can see the people you see me in. It doesn't look like I'm looking. If it looks like.

[00:08:20] That's cause I'm looking at you guys on this, looking into the

[00:08:24] Oliver Marcelle: camera and that's why I asked you that question earlier. Cause we trying to get our monitor configuration. Right.

[00:08:31] Denise Marcelle: I'm still

[00:08:31] Sarah Dowlen: trying to figure out where to look there, but if I look there, then you're right,

[00:08:37] Denise Marcelle: exactly. And

[00:08:38] David Dowlen: then I kept hitting the table.

[00:08:40] We were talking about a difference in our setups. My so if I had to go two screens, one goes up and one's under because I don't have the arms to go wide on it because I have another arm over here. That's got some lights and stuff on it. Yeah. Um, so like the camera's right in the middle, we're looking slightly up at you in the camera and I'm looking down at the questions I have written down.

[00:09:02] So for all of you folks listening, you got the better end of the show. You guys on YouTube. I'm sorry. We're kind of all over the place. This is a learning experience for us. I'm

[00:09:12] Sarah Dowlen: trying not to make facial

[00:09:13] David Dowlen: expressions at the

[00:09:13] Oliver Marcelle: camera and that's what this all about. We're having fun.

[00:09:19] David Dowlen: Because now the crucial, crucial question in every show is what is your favorite kinds of ice cream?

[00:09:26] Denise Marcelle: Favorite kinds of ice cream? Ooh, mine is. I don't eat it so much anymore because if I do, I'll probably eat the whole tub, but mine is a Baskin Robbins, prey, liens and cream.

[00:09:42] Oliver Marcelle: That's

[00:09:42] David McCarter: a good one.

[00:09:44] Oliver Marcelle: That's a really good one. I'd have to say. Um,

[00:09:50] Denise Marcelle: yeah, you're a butter pecan guy. Okay. What's the difference between

[00:09:55] Sarah Dowlen: butter pecan and pralines and cream?

[00:09:57] Because to me, they kind

[00:09:58] Denise Marcelle: of sound like butter pecan. I feel like cravings and cream. The praisings obviously they're called pray liens because they're sugar coated, I think, or whatever. And the butter pecan is. Yeah. And the ice cream is a little bit more buttery to me. So I think the difference is the prey liens are sugarcoated in the screenings in green.

[00:10:26] Oliver Marcelle: No, no, no, that's fine. I was just saying, I grew up with that. My, that, that was my dad's favorite ice cream. And so there was always some briers like we didn't do a whole lot of sweets and here's a lot of stuff I didn't grow up eating, but there was some briars butter pecan in the freezer. And so I've taken that on.

[00:10:51] David Dowlen: Well, I screwed up the audio once already today. We'll see how this keeps going.

[00:10:56] Sarah Dowlen: We'll see if we have a

[00:10:57] David McCarter: podcast. So you cool.

[00:10:59] David Dowlen: You wanna take the next question

[00:11:02] Denise Marcelle: since I find it?

[00:11:03] Sarah Dowlen: There it is. Okay. Why would you say the marriage relationship is so crucial?

[00:11:14] Oliver Marcelle: Um, that's a great question. So I'll, I'll start it out and then you can jump, you can jump in.

[00:11:23] So there's a couple ways we can go with that answer and I'm going to go, because again, we mentioned this earlier with people of faith. So I'm going to go that route first. I believe that the marital relationship is it very much mirrors our relationship with God. So for those of you who are listening or watching, and God is not your thing, just, just hear me out for a second.

[00:11:52] Um, because that's who I respect that, um, there there's a certain dynamic for, for individuals who are people of faith, as it relates to how they relate to God. And I believe that that marital relationship mirrors that let me give you some examples. Um, we're supposed to be developing a personal relationship with God.

[00:12:13] I'm supposed to be developed, developing a personal relationship with my wife. There's some communication that happens in the development of that relationship. And there some, uh, relinquishing of my will, if you want to say it that right. And, and I can't be as selfish in that relationship. And so there's, there's a partnership that happens.

[00:12:36] And so I believe that the relationship is important. Well, first of all, I should've said this in the beginning. Even if you, if you want to be married, right? Because there's some people who don't want to be married, but, but for those of us who are married, I believe that it's important because it shapes us as human beings.

[00:12:56] It gives us the opportunity to learn how to serve somebody else, to learn how to live in a space where it duality is at the. And to learn how to, uh, meet somebody else's needs in a way that is beneficial to them. It causes us to be less selfish. It causes us to be more compassionate. It causes us to, to be more cognizant of, uh, somebody else's wellbeing.

[00:13:30] Denise Marcelle: Hmm. That's good. I, I also think too to add to, I w you kind of took my answer, but to add to that, I think that for, I think that God gives us desires, right? And so I believe that God either gives us the desire to be married, because that is the way to. Perfect our character that would not be able to be perfected in any other way.

[00:14:01] And then there are people, like you said, who don't want to be married. And I believe that God gives the gifts, gives those people the desire to not be married, but then there are other ways in which he has to perfect their character. But talking about the marital relationship, I think it's important because it's, it's one of the ways, if not our major way in that our character is perfected or developed, not that we'll ever become ever be perfect this side of heaven, but I believe that it's a way to chisel away at those things in us that would not be able to be perfected or removed or shaped any other way.

[00:14:46] Had we not been married?

[00:14:48] Oliver Marcelle: I agree with that. And let me give you the, give you the 15. Context for individuals. Cause I I'm, I gotta be fair. Cause there are some folk who don't believe they don't do the God thing. Right? So even if you don't do the guy thing and you hear what we're saying, the marital relationship is an opportunity for you to become something for someone else.

[00:15:09] It's an opportunity for just the, the unselfishness, the compassion, all of that still applies. Whether you are a person of faith or not, it allows you the opportunity to step outside of who you are. Step outside of that singular mentality and move into a mentality where duality reigns. And if you're really attempting to be what you should be for somebody else, it is going to, like you said, shape and, and adjust your character in certain ways to align with that.

[00:15:46] Denise Marcelle: Yeah,

[00:15:48] David Dowlen: we got a good chuckle for a second. So niece was getting her coffee. Oh, look, well-placed marketing ads, right.

[00:16:01] All by her own merchandise. Who else can they buy it? Right. That's right. Exactly.

[00:16:08] Sarah Dowlen: I wanted to note, um, from what both of you two are saying, I totally agree. Um, also I think marriage is a great opportunity for growth to learn, to think of somebody beside yourself and, um, as, uh, the majority of people after they get married after a while they'll have kids.

[00:16:32] And I think it's a great opportunity for growth of thinking about somebody besides yourself, because you have to do that over and over and over with your kids. It's a good opportunity to

[00:16:45] Denise Marcelle: start learning. Yeah. I agree with that 100% also good opportunity to exercise patience. Oh yeah. I got in there when you have kids, but no, the whole not thinking about yourself.

[00:16:58] Thing is huge. Even for people who are married and don't have kids because let's face it, we're born with that selfish tendency. And so when you put two people together who have, you know, never been married before, you know, they've never had to, like you said, the whole singular mentality, you can't think that way anymore when you're married.

[00:17:22] And a lot of times, those are the issues that we come across. When we meet couples and talk to couples and coach them. A lot of times, they're not going to come out and say, well, I'm selfish, you know, but what it boils down to is that there's a lot of things about themselves that they don't want to give up.

[00:17:41] And so it does force you to have to think about the other person.

[00:17:45] Oliver Marcelle: If you allow, if you allow it to the marital relationship will definitely do two things. It will bring to light the areas, the growth areas in your character. And it will also, like you said, Sarah allow you the room for growth in those areas.

[00:18:05] Right? Because I felt like I was a great person before I got married and had I not got married, I would have still done the same thing I was always doing. However, in marriage, several of those things didn't work. So I had to go back to the drawing board and be like, okay. Hmm. What is it that I should be doing, you know, on my own, you know?

[00:18:30] And, and how should I be readjusting if you will, my character to be able to successfully navigate this with someone else.

[00:18:43] David Dowlen: No guys, one of the biggest reasons I wanted to have you guys on, because I think I actually had this conversation for the rest of the night. Um, but I really want to get into, you know, what, what I really want to provide for our audience for all our listeners on this episode is, you know, it's the new year, right?

[00:18:58] January, a lot of people when they, I'm not big into like new year's Eve resolutions. Right. Um, I think if you're going to do it, just, just do it setting the default day that everybody picks never ends well. Right. Um, but with the new year starting, right, we've been married 20 years. Now, you guys have been married 21.

[00:19:19] I'm looking at it as, this is an opportunity for anybody. No matter how long they've been married are, if they're thinking about getting married, this is a fresh chance to start 20, 22 brand new and focus in on your marriage, on your relationship and just make it a priority because it will never Hmm.

[00:19:39] Often, we don't understand how much we need to prioritize our marriage. Right. We, we get gone. And, uh, I I've told all of her, Sarah and I were buried for years. It's only in the last six months or a year. We've actually started having date nights again, since our kids were born.

[00:19:56] Denise Marcelle: Yeah. Yeah.

[00:19:58] David Dowlen: You get busy, you have jobs, you have bills, you have mortgages, you have children.

[00:20:04] And all of a sudden, it just kind of starts falling on the back burner. You don't put the same care. You don't put in the same intentionality to the marriage that you did when you started out necessarily. And so what I want to share, I want you guys to share with the stay so we can get everybody started.

[00:20:20] So I'm going to ask you to share a five or six tips and I that are core the core foundational things. You need to focus on practicing in any marriage to make it a priority and make it stronger this year. I want 20, 22 to be a new year for everybody's marriages. Who's listening to just reinvigorate, reprioritize and make it stronger than it's ever been.

[00:20:44] Oliver Marcelle: So

[00:20:46] David Dowlen: give us what does tip numero UNO? What's what's the first one.

[00:20:51] Oliver Marcelle: I would say the first one. So we let's start. I hate, I don't want to use the word simple, but let's start on an easier end and then we'll go. We'll get deeper. So the first thing I believe we need to do is we need to take a moment, a few moments, several moments, and actually look back.

[00:21:15] What do I mean by that? I don't know of anybody. And you tell me, you might know somebody. I don't, I don't know anybody who hated the person they married. Right? I don't know anybody who was walking down the aisle like this. I don't, I don't know anybody like that. Right. So go back to the time, the period of time, where you were head over, heels you on the phone for hours and hours, we're just breathing.

[00:21:44] Nobody's saying nothing. You still there. Yeah. I'm still there. What'd you doing? I'm not doing nothing. What'd you do? I'm not doing nothing. Go back to that time. Right. Go back to that time and then pick out it doesn't have to be everything, pick out a few things that stand out. What were the, what were the things you were doing?

[00:22:04] What were the phrases that were being used, but what were the places that you were going, you know, what were the things that were making you happy and giving you that, that warm, fuzzy head-over-heels feeling and begin to reincorporate those things. So, okay. January, it's January now. Um, man, you know what?

[00:22:23] We used to always go get ice cream on Saturday nights. And that was just such a good time. We laughed and playing and joked around, you know what in? Well, January is cold. So I don't know if that's a good example, but you get what I'm saying, right. Whatever that is. Start in January, that first thing, and then add the next thing in February and go through there.

[00:22:43] That would be tip number one.

[00:22:45] Denise Marcelle: Yeah, exactly. Yeah. I would agree. Um, I don't know if you would consider this hard or not, if this should be tip number two or not, but I would say tip number two, um, start have a check-in with your spouse, have a check-in and be like, you know, babe, 2021 is done. We're in 20, 22 now, how did I do last year?

[00:23:14] Did I meet your needs? Did I meet your emotional. Was there anything that we should have brought up to me, maybe that I was doing that you'd rather I not do or anything that I wasn't doing that you wished I would have done. How can I serve you better in 20, 22 and then have that conversation? And then the thing about having that conversation is your spouse may say things to you and you may not necessarily agree that that's how you were acting or that's what you missed.

[00:23:47] But I don't think that that is the time to be like, what, no, that's not true. I didn't do that. Or yes I did. I think is really important to hear what your spouse has to say, it's their needs. And you can't invalidate their needs by saying, no, that's not true or that didn't happen. Or I wasn't like that. You have to validate where they are.

[00:24:09] And instead of saying, you know, negating or invalidating what their needs are or what they feel like they might. Ask a question, ask the question, how can I do better? Or what, how did I miss it? What would have made it better? How did I miss the mark? So I think it's important to start in the beginning of the year and ask, how am I doing?

[00:24:33] How did I do last year? Um, what can I do better? How can I serve you better? And then have check-ins along the way, maybe monthly, how am I doing? I'm trying to meet this need that you talked about, that you needed from me. How am I doing? Am am I measuring up? Is it fulfilling your need? Is there something I'm missing?

[00:24:55] Am I going overboard? So I think the, the first or maybe second point could be, you know, how am I doing? What did I miss last year? What needs of yours need to be met? And how can I serve you better?

[00:25:08] Oliver Marcelle: I like that question. How can I serve you better? Yeah. If you're, if you're willing to really listen to that answer, you'll be on to something.

[00:25:18] David Dowlen: Okay. And before I let you guys guys go farther on that, let's dig into that a little bit more. Um, so the first thing is a little bit of nostalgia go back and dig into things that were valuable to you early on things that were special to you early on.

[00:25:34] Oliver Marcelle: Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's and, and we've done that, you know,

[00:25:40] David Dowlen: 20, 21 years ago when you guys started

[00:25:43] Oliver Marcelle: man of a few things and you'll be, you'll be surprised for those of you are listening.

[00:25:48] You'll be surprised what comes out of that when you go back. Cause it might not be because like, for us, like we weren't five star dining and all of that stuff, you know, 20 something years ago, we're still not, we're still, let's be clear. Let's be clear. It was done not doing that, but there's, there's things that would happen like before.

[00:26:09] We were in Michigan when we got married, we were in Southwest Michigan, and we would take trips to Meyer. You remember, Meyer is exactly what I was thinking. Right? So, so for those of you that are listening, but people who are in Michigan know what we're talking about? Meyer is the equivalent to a Walmart.

[00:26:28] Maybe they sold everything pretty much in my grocery store, but they sold everything. It was it's, it's a humongous grocery store. So think the biggest grocery store you've ever, you can ever think of

[00:26:42] David Dowlen: just

[00:26:42] Oliver Marcelle: Meyer Meyer, just Meyer Meyer. And, and it was open 24 hours. So when nothing else was opened in that small town, we know that we could go to Meyer, walk around, grab a bag of chips.

[00:26:55] Laugh, you know, people watch because there will be other people in there late at night with us as well. Yeah. And we would take these trips to Meyer, you know? And so now that translates for us now into, it's funny, you know, you know, we're going right. We will go on date night and no matter what we do for date night, we end up in target.

[00:27:19] We could go, we could go out, we could go out to a nice dinner and have a great time and we will still end up in target because it's just one of those things that kind of just points back to where we were. So that's

[00:27:32] Denise Marcelle: why

[00:27:32] Oliver Marcelle: we do that. So that, so that's one thing just to give an example, but

[00:27:39] David Dowlen: I had to clarify, cause we have Fred Meyer out here.

[00:27:42] Uh,

[00:27:42] Denise Marcelle: Fred it's just Meyer. M E I J E

[00:27:47] Oliver Marcelle: R. Okay.

[00:27:48] David Dowlen: We're we're M E Y E R. Okay. Yep. Okay. So go back to little things when you started. I, I got admit, I might be a little hard pressed to remember when we got married. I was 21. His era was 19 and we were dirt poor and barely surviving. And, uh, there wasn't every way to cook top round man.

[00:28:10] Oh yeah. Yeah.

[00:28:13] Oliver Marcelle: And you know, what's crazy now they have whole restaurants that do it.

[00:28:20] David Dowlen: Right.

[00:28:20] Sarah Dowlen: Make sure they make their own

[00:28:21] noodles. At least I don't, I don't know. It's amazing. Yeah. It's uh, I think we, you know, like every young couple, right. Going through that, I think we came up with every possible way. You could cook top ramen in this house. Um, and then you said stop and like, actually ask now this is, this is a scary, loaded gun.

[00:28:44] I gotta admit I would be a little anxious asking Sarah only one. Yeah. How, how can I be better when does it right. Like that check-in is a,

[00:28:59] I think you'd have to really be committed to not weaponizing it. You'd have to talk about it beforehand, because I could see that getting weaponize with some couples really quickly.

[00:29:08] Oliver Marcelle: Yeah. And, and, and I'm glad you said that because we do walk couples through how, what the parameters are that you should put around that conversation.

[00:29:17] Cause you're absolutely right. That could go way left real quick. Right. Right. And so often what we do with couples is, is help them around the parameters. Right. And so there's certain things that are off the table. And one of those things that's off the table is what we call candles. Words or phrases. So it can't be a you always, or you never, or every time you, it can't be that kind of conversation.

[00:29:46] You got to go into the conversation asking the question that you asked, how can I, this, we know that we both want this marital journey to be this experience, to be a great experience. What can I do to help this be a great experience for you? And then the other person now is not answering in well, you never dah, dah, dah.

[00:30:11] The other person is actually saying, and I'm really glad you asked me this, because I was going to go into this, that the other person is using what we call the ice cream sandwich method. Now there's a clinical term for it, but people who know me know that I make up, I make up my own names for stuff. I just like it.

[00:30:30] So ice cream sandwich method is simply this, you know, ice cream sandwich has the two way. The ends and has ice cream in the middle. So the ice cream center was method is a acknowledgement and celebration expressing a need is the ice cream acknowledgement and celebration. Right? So how that looks like in a very elementary way is man, you know, I love it when you, um, when you kiss me goodnight, because I just feel, it just makes I just sleep better and, you know, uh, whatever, whatever I say, right.

[00:31:08] And then now I slip into need and it just hasn't been happening in the last couple of months. So I'd really appreciate if we could start, if you could start doing that again, because, and now going back into acknowledgement and celebration, because I just feel so close to you, you know, it's just, it helps me sleep better.

[00:31:25] I get to smell the, you know, the, the fragrance in the hair, your hair, cause you always put this stuff in your hair when you go, you know, you see what I'm saying? So now I'm not attacking. Yeah. Yeah. I, I, I made that up, like all of that,

[00:31:46] all of that up for the sake of example, but, but that's, that's keeps the conversation from going left. So when we set those parameters with couples and then we'll have the couples actually model a piece of that conversation in front of us so that they leave the session, understanding how that moment of evaluation plays out.

[00:32:07] Okay.

[00:32:08] David Dowlen: What do you think then?

[00:32:12] Sarah Dowlen: Well, so it sounds like it's more of a fact finding question to help you evaluate, uh, how you're doing.

[00:32:22] Um, I had another thought

[00:32:26] and it went away.

[00:32:29] Oliver Marcelle: Um,

[00:32:31] Sarah Dowlen: Sam, sorry, the

[00:32:32] sandwich method sounds.

[00:32:37] Oliver Marcelle: Yes. That's exactly. That's exactly what you do,

[00:32:41] Sarah Dowlen: softball and on a good note and his thing kind of reeling truth in them a nicer way. And

[00:32:51] I guess,

[00:32:53] Oliver Marcelle: yeah, because here's the thing, right? If I hand you, if I hand you something on a plate, you're more likely to either take it or say, no, I'm not ready for that right now.

[00:33:06] As opposed to me throwing the plate at you, that's going to get a whole different reaction out of you. If I brought a plate at you, you're gonna be like, dude, it's on you. Ain't gonna never do that again. You know what I mean? But if I hand it to you, you have the opportunity to say thank you. Or you have the opportunity to say, well, no, this, this I'm not ready for this now because, and whatever the reason.

[00:33:29] Right? So it, it, it lessens the, the, the chances of. Her feeling attacked. Right? When I use that method, because if you attack somebody you're going to do one or two things, they're either going to cower and try to protect themselves, or they going to come swinging back at you because they just ready for you at that point, you know?

[00:33:50] And so you want to be able to minimize as much of that as possible. And here's the thing. Can I be honest? Yeah. For those of you who are listening, the first one is awkward. Yeah. Let's be clear about that. We're not saying this like, oh, you're just gonna knock it out. The park. You might not, the first one is awkward, but it gets easier.

[00:34:13] Because you're able to establish a cadence because for every couple it's going to be different. So the way we do it might be different than the way you guys do. It may be different than the way a listener is doing is doing it. But as you establish a cadence, it gets better.

[00:34:26] Denise Marcelle: The first few might be awkward.

[00:34:29] David Dowlen: Yep. I can imagine I'm, uh, I'm not real good with the softball. It's not my strong suit when I try and be nice. I, uh, generally screwed that up pretty well. So that would take some practice for me to right. And I got to admit, right. If Sarah leads off with a. You know, honey, I really loved blah, blah, blah. My first question is what do you want

[00:34:58] to kind of write out for that one? Right.

[00:35:00] Oliver Marcelle: I can see that.

[00:35:02] David Dowlen: That's just me. It's not my wife. That's on her. I'm just suspicious. Yeah, me

[00:35:07] Sarah Dowlen: too. Because he, when he was describing it, it's like, well, and then you have those relationships where they do that, but they're totally being manipulative and that's just how they get what they want to get.

[00:35:20] And so it's like, yeah,

[00:35:22] Denise Marcelle: it would be, it

[00:35:23] Sarah Dowlen: would take some practice to hear what he's actually trying to say rather than hear what sounds like manipulation to me. Yeah.

[00:35:32] Denise Marcelle: And you have

[00:35:33] Sarah Dowlen: to be both in the same Headspace, the right Headspace for it.

[00:35:36] Denise Marcelle: I think

[00:35:38] Oliver Marcelle: I'm glad you said that too, because that's true. There is a other side to that.

[00:35:42] Right. Um, so yeah, that's, that's beneficial to know. Um, I would, I would. I would have managed admonished couples who are going to try this for the very first time to not go straight to the deep, you know, deep down stuff, keep it pretty surface level and, and, and practice with the surface level stuff. The stuff you know is not going to make you feel some kind of way when you walk away from the conversation or have you thinking, okay, what is he or she really trying to do right now?

[00:36:20] Start with the stuff like, and this is the example I use, right? If Brent and I were on a basketball team, if we formed a basketball team today, we'd lose our, our next, our next game tomorrow's game. If we started today is not going to be against the New York Knicks who are horrible and we would still lose.

[00:36:44] We would stay

[00:36:46] Denise Marcelle: alone at that point.

[00:36:49] Oliver Marcelle: You know, so we got to start where we, where we know we can start. So that's what I, that's what I would admonish couples that are trying to do that for the first time.

[00:36:57] Sarah Dowlen: So what kind of baby steps first make some easy ones and kind of work your way up to those really deep

[00:37:03] David Dowlen: ones?

[00:37:04] Yeah. I know with us hope, sorry.

[00:37:07] Denise Marcelle: No, I was just going to say also to the easy ones, the, the baby steps, smaller ones will also help your, helped you to build trust with your spouse. And they won't be suspicious. Like an ask the question, what do you want when you, you know, bring it up because it's a small thing and they must, they'll be like, oh, you know, it's, it's just this.

[00:37:30] She probably, or he probably doesn't really want anything. Maybe she's for real. So start with the small things. I agree with

[00:37:36] Oliver Marcelle: that. Yeah. Yeah. And I, and I'll say one more thing, cause I know, I know you want us to do some more, um, Don't be afraid to use extra words. This is something I had to tell a couple, a couple of weeks ago.

[00:37:49] Don't be afraid to use extra words to frame what's going to happen. So what does that look like, babe? I just want to talk to you about something. And I just want to say before, almost like a disclaimer, I just want to say, um, I'm I'm not asking you whatever, you know, your spouse might be apprehensive about.

[00:38:09] Right? I'm not asking you for anything. I'm not trying to get anything out of you. I just wanna, I just wanna pick your brain about this and just see what you think about what I'm processing right now, and then go into whatever you're going to say. Cause then now the other person is like, oh, okay, all right.

[00:38:25] I can put this sword and CEO down. Cause I'm not about to be in battle. You know? And, and so I tell couples sometimes don't be afraid to do that. Use as many words as you need to, to set up. What's about to happen before you actually dive in.

[00:38:40] David Dowlen: I think, uh, I think the pre-conversation like for us who are both naturally suspicious people in the way, uh, having that pre-conversation at least the first several times of let's put this on the calendar.

[00:38:53] And on this day, at this time, every other week, we're going to sit down and this, this schedule, and this is what we're doing. Right. So that way we, we put a place for it. So it's not, uh, in process of the normal day. Right. You actually prioritize having that conversation and you both know that that's what it's about, at least until it gets more comfortable maybe.

[00:39:15] And no one feels like you're

[00:39:17] Denise Marcelle: springing it on them. Yeah. It would be helpful

[00:39:19] Oliver Marcelle: for us. I would, I would dare say, even when it does get comfortable to still do that, to still schedule it, you know, for, for us, it's typically, it's typically at the beginning of the year. So although I know Niecey said potentially, you know, doing it once a month, Us being quite honest and transparent, it usually happens maybe once or twice a year for us at this point in life where we are right now for a lot of reasons, you know, some of it is, you know, just before you look up the year's done and we just haven't done it.

[00:39:57] And then sometimes we're, which goes, this is going to go into the third thing that I was going to say. But sometimes what we end up doing is setting the parameters at the beginning of the year for how everything's going to go. And then that way, coming to coming down to the like, now, you know, the end of the year and going into the new year, like we are right now, we can kind of evaluate, like you said, and then set that parameter again for 2022,

[00:40:27] David Dowlen: which is an amazing way to start the year guys where this being the beginning of 20, 22.

[00:40:34] Both of you raised the white flag, sit down together as a couple plan to do this and set it start from the beginning. Right? All of a sudden they check in maybe twice a year. This is a good time to start, have this conversation and get your year started off. Right? I guys, we're getting some amazing information.

[00:40:54] Uh, growing up, listening to my dad's do marital counseling my entire life. Um, I grew up getting to listen to a lot of great marriage counselors. And you know, I remember being in elementary school, sitting through marriage enrichment seminars. Cause that's what that was hosting at the time was somebody.

[00:41:08] Right? But guys, we were having some amazing conversations about how you can start your relationship over for the year. Whether you've been married for a minute are for 25 years. It doesn't matter. You can start this year and make a priority. Guys. If you're getting something out of this, if you like what we're doing here, you can jump over to patrons.

[00:41:28] Sports directors really are by me. So we can have more conversations for you guys like this, because I love bring you guys stuff like this, but for now we're enrolled at our sponsors and we'll be

[00:41:38] David McCarter: today's episode brought to you by the fallible man.com. That's right. It's us head over to www.thefallibleman.com and check out our blog updated twice a week with new content and links to all of our social media offerings.

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[00:42:15] David Dowlen: guys. And welcome back to the show. We're here with Oliver and a east Marcel up to Denolli, LLC, and the relationship trade secrets podcast discussing starting your near new year with a focus on renewing your marriage, making it a priority and intentional priority this year.

[00:42:28] It doesn't matter if you've been married for five minutes or for 50 years, because we are sharing information that will help you start planting 22 off, right? When it comes to your marriage, maybe the plane's gone out. Maybe you guys have just gotten busy with kids and with jobs, whatever it is. I want you to commit.

[00:42:47] If you're married to making 20, 22 your year for you and your spouse to just make it the best year of your marriage ever, all of her niece are sharing an amazing circus with us. So let's get right back in. All around Denise, number three, or we go on

[00:43:04] Oliver Marcelle: number three. So let me, let me do this real quick. I'm going to do a ten second to two B and then I'm going to go into three.

[00:43:15] Okay. Go to B and we can come back to it. If we need to, to be is to, if you have not already create a mission statement after you have that check-in conversation. If you already have a mission statement for those couples who have done that already, that's a good way to start your evaluation conversation is by looking, pulling out the mission statement and evaluating the mission statement, then that way there isn't, you know, stuff that's coming up, you know, we're focusing on what we put in.

[00:43:50] So that's the two beat three that I thought it was three, but I thought it was three, but I think it, I think it belongs with two,

[00:44:01] David Dowlen: well, my way for a second and explain mission statement because not everybody listening to this might know what emissions.

[00:44:09] Oliver Marcelle: Okay. So if you think about, and I'll make it real simple, if you think about your job or, well, most, I think most companies now have a mission statement.

[00:44:18] So if you work for a company, um, part of what was in the handbook was probably a mission statement or a charter of some kind, basically giving you an idea of what the company's focus is and, uh, how you contribute to that focus. Same thing with your marriage C and I get together. Hey, what are we? What is the focus for Oliver and Denise this year?

[00:44:43] What is the focus for Denali this year? What is the focus. Our family, like our kids are grown now, but when we had young kids, what's the focus for, you know, school and what's the different things. And that would out of that would be birth a mission statement of sorts. That was almost like a, uh, a guideline for how we were going to operate, um, everything from choosing a word for the year.

[00:45:08] So like our year, our word last year was first because we knew that in 2020, there were going to be several things that we would experience for the first time. And so how would we go about navigating all of these firsts that we were going to have in our life? And we crafted the mission statement around that.

[00:45:27] So that's kind of in a nutshell, what we're talking about, creating some kind of a manifesto, if you will, as it relates to what you want to see happen in your marriage for that. And how can each of you contribute to the success of whatever that thing is you come up with? Makes sense. So that's, that's what we mean when we say mission statement and that's, so that's why I tacked it on to number two, because they kind of go hand in hand for those who have never done it before.

[00:46:00] I guess that could be your number three. Um, and, and don't overthink it. Right? Don't overthink it. You don't have to go to a coach and do all of these different, like, there are people who are like, oh, you need to hire a coach to help you with a Ms. Now you don't gotta do that if you want to. That's fine.

[00:46:16] But you don't have to it's it's simply this. What are the goals for our marriage? Yeah, let's say the goal is, you know, we want to have date nights this year and we want to have date night once a month. Okay. That's going to go into the mission statement 4, 4, 4, whatever your last name is for the Marcel's.

[00:46:34] We are. We are planning on growing our intimacy this year. And in order to do that, we're going to Institute a date night, once a month. It's simple. Don't overthink it, but create something that, you know, you can kind of point to as a, as a goal.

[00:46:51] David Dowlen: Okay. So that makes sense. So that's, that's 2.5

[00:46:56] Oliver Marcelle: missions. Yeah, that's too.

[00:46:57] Yeah. We'll call it 2.5 to be right.

[00:47:01] David Dowlen: I'm throwing a break before three, then say, what is the single most beneficial thing you guys have done in the last year for your marriage that someone else could do

[00:47:10] Denise Marcelle: in the last year? Oh, I would say we

[00:47:18] increased our intimacy. Yeah. We increased our intimacy, like you were saying in the beginning, because. Um, when COVID hit and I was already home, I work from home. I've worked from home for maybe the past six or seven years. Our son is homeschooled. So we have always been home. And Ali was when he was in the corporate space was awake during the day for 8, 10, 12 hours a day.

[00:47:47] And so to have him home around us all day, every day, interrupting how we get things done. It was like, whoa, you know, we got to figure this out. You're kind of in my space, I'm trying to have conference calls and you're sitting at my desk and you're banging stuff around. I'm just not used to having used so much in my space.

[00:48:10] And so we realized that that, and plus just being around each other more. It was awkward and it was weird that it was awkward because we're married, but it was just like, you're not usually here. And we got to figure out how to be, we had to figure out how to be again.

[00:48:31] Oliver Marcelle: So, and, and, and you know what, Brent, you're a mind reader because you literally just set up a, uh, a softball pitch for number three, because

[00:48:46] what we had to, what we realized was that we weren't being intentional about building intimacy and maintaining it. And one of the ways that we noticed to answer your question, uh, along with what you say, what we did in the last year that others can do, we really honed in on one particular type of intimacy and it's experiential.

[00:49:10] So there's all different types of intimacy. You got sexual intimacy, physical intimacy spirits. Emotional intellectual. You've got all these different types of intimacies. We chose to focus in on experiential intimacy, and it's just what you think it is creating an experience. And for us, we tell our couples, the experience needs to there's only two criteria.

[00:49:32] One is the experience has to put you in the same place, both of you in the same place and both of you with a common goal. So the experience could be as simple as listen. Tonight is movie night, nothing else is happening. CNI, go sit on the couch. We're going to be hugged up and we're going to choose a movie and have, have a great time for the next two hours watching this movie.

[00:49:55] And what we noticed was as we began to create these experiences, All the other intimacies were positively affect physical intimacy. We're closer in proximity, emotional intimacy, we're having better and more conversations, sexual intimacy, intellectual intimacy, we're bouncing stuff, ideas off each other because now we're in that space where we're being intentional.

[00:50:20] And so that's number three, that literally was going to be number three. So you set it up perfectly is to create experiences that allow you to be in the same place and give you a common goal. And they don't, again, just like the mission statement. Don't overthink it, cooking a meal together, taking a walk together.

[00:50:38] There's some something she and I do often. We'll just literally get in the car, pick a direction like we're going to drive an hour north and then we're going to come back the scenic route and we're in it. We're listening to music, we'd laugh and joking about stuff. And it's an experience we're in the same place.

[00:50:58] And the goal is a common goal. We're driving an hour one way and coming back. So don't overthink it, but just make sure that you're intentional about being consistent in doing those things. You're

[00:51:09] David Dowlen: going to get me in so much hope I owed him a

[00:51:12] Denise Marcelle: lot. Oh wow. I'm

[00:51:14] Sarah Dowlen: the one that likes to see what there is to see in the area.

[00:51:18] And he just wants to get.

[00:51:20] Denise Marcelle: No, where we're going.

[00:51:23] David Dowlen: I'm a home body. I don't want to go anywhere. I don't want to have to go. I don't want to be in a car if I don't gotta be there. Like I'm a motorcycle guy. I hate being in an enclosed vehicle for any length of time.

[00:51:35] Denise Marcelle: You have to have

[00:51:36] Sarah Dowlen: a destination. Not just, let's go that way and go to that road.

[00:51:40] Yeah.

[00:51:41] David Dowlen: That's more of an OCD thing though.

[00:51:44] Oliver Marcelle: I, yeah, I understand. I understand. Cause I, I choose home. You give me a choice between home. You don't even got to say what the other thing is. I already chose it's home.

[00:51:59] David Dowlen: I have a slight OCD kick. Like I actually am so set on. I don't know if it's a control thing or if it's just years of being in the car because we always traveled via car.

[00:52:15] Uh, I, I need to know where I'm going. And I'm going to make the quickest, most efficient route there. And if you want to have a stop in there, I've got a plan that stop in there. Otherwise it actually like physically causes me like tension. I'm a direct, so there's, if you like, Hey, we're going to go here.

[00:52:35] We're to stop and have coffee there, then we're going to go here. But I got to know what the route is and I've got to plan out and

[00:52:42] Denise Marcelle: I just can't be

[00:52:42] Sarah Dowlen: lost. I know where I'm at. I'm fine.

[00:52:45] David Dowlen: She went, she was made for motorcycles. She always

[00:52:51] Oliver Marcelle: have a route. So, so you gotta, so now you've got to figure out what's the best of both worlds in that scenario. To, to meet both needs. Right? So cuddling on the couch,

[00:53:02] David Dowlen: watching a movie.

[00:53:07] Sarah Dowlen: I want you to leave the house

[00:53:11] David Dowlen: homeschooling our children this year. So she is experiencing, she's been at home raising the children, but at least last year when the kids were in public school or before COVID, the kids were gone for a little bit. So she'd get out, run errands. She is taking them homeschooling.

[00:53:27] So she's home a lot this year. So,

[00:53:30] Oliver Marcelle: and so here's the challenge, right? If we'll do, if we do a quick three B here's the channel, this will we tell couples. So think outside the box and venture outside your comfort zone for these experience, what that it does, two things. One, it stretches you. But too, you'll be surprised.

[00:53:56] And I'm saying this for myself. Cause there's some things that I did not want to do with her. Did I did. And after what I was like, oh, that was dope. I had a good time. Like, you know, so you, you, you experience some things that you probably would have never chosen for yourself. And then you realize, and I'm not saying this happens often because there's some things where you're like, Nope, we're not doing that ever again.

[00:54:19] So it's not always a win, but you do find some areas where you're like, man, that was too bad. Okay. Thank you for doing so suggesting that, you know, so, so think outside the box and stretch yourself a little bit.

[00:54:34] David Dowlen: Well, while we're, while we're here. So we, we were actually worked out a perfect date once, um, that we've had at this point and it was.

[00:54:43] Getting coffee. Cause we're both coffee nerds. We love our coffee, but getting coffee and taking the long runs out to the range and doing long range shooting. That's a perfect day for us. We would take the kids to school on my day off and I'd get coffee ready and we'd look and load the car and we'd go out to the range and, you know, pop off targets with the 3 0 8.

[00:55:06] So that was, that was it. So what is y'all's perfect date?

[00:55:10] Denise Marcelle: Oh, perfect.

[00:55:13] Oliver Marcelle: That's a great question. Well, we know it's going to end and target whatever it is. Let's just put that out there.

[00:55:22] Denise Marcelle: Someone told me the other day target is my love language. Um,

[00:55:28] oh gosh,

[00:55:31] Oliver Marcelle: that's a great question, Brent. I don't have any food. I don't know that it's probably gonna involve food.

[00:55:38] Um, it's gonna involve being outside of,

[00:55:44] Denise Marcelle: we'd like to look at model homes.

[00:55:46] Oliver Marcelle: Yeah. That's true. That's a good one.

[00:55:49] Denise Marcelle: Yeah. We like to look at model homes. Yeah. That's a good, that would be a great date for me

[00:55:53] Oliver Marcelle: anyway. So food and walking through some million dollar house and on and on. Yeah.

[00:56:00] Denise Marcelle: And then it's going to see what they come up with.

[00:56:02] Oliver Marcelle: Right.

[00:56:04] Sarah Dowlen: And houses and seeing what the new trends are. It's like, wow. I never would have thought, but

[00:56:09] Denise Marcelle: then the house they're doing now. Wow. Yeah.

[00:56:12] Oliver Marcelle: Yeah. That's a good question. I wouldn't, I, I hadn't thought about that. So yeah.

[00:56:17] Sarah Dowlen: They'll have a little home tours around here and I think

[00:56:19] David Dowlen: pre-kids, we go to like a manufacturer home dealers, all the remodels they have on their lot.

[00:56:25] Just, just to see the differences. Yeah. And mind cause they keep hoping that we're dumb enough to actually find out something through them for modular homes

[00:56:36] too.

[00:56:39] Oliver Marcelle: So, yeah, that's a good one. Um, and we're us, we're simple folks. I got to admit we're simple. We're simple folks. Um, so it's always going to involve, you know, something that may not seem significant to the other folks, but for us it's just something that we've always done.

[00:56:59] Right? So the drive thing, we've always done that looking at at homes, model homes, we've, you know, we've always done that. That's always been a great, you know, pass time for us, um, trying different restaurants and, you know, you know, getting a bite to eat has always been good. Um, just making a run just for the heck of it.

[00:57:18] 1, 1, 1 day during COVID we had had enough of being in the house, like, you know what, it's lunchtime, I'm going to go get some. Let's just happen in the car, go grab some sushi and we didn't even eat it there. We just brought it home. It was just a way to get out into sunshine, soak up some sun for a little bit tired of sitting at this desk.

[00:57:40] She started sitting upstairs. Let's just get out. So whatever it is, doesn't matter what it is for those of you who are listening, just create the experience and be intentional about being consistent.

[00:57:51] David Dowlen: All right, let's move on to number four.

[00:57:55] Oliver Marcelle: Number four, you got number four.

[00:57:58] Denise Marcelle: I think we kind of hit on it, um, through everything that you were saying, but I would say, and this is only for people, I guess who don't already do this, and I know that sometimes we fall off of this, but be intentional about date

[00:58:13] Oliver Marcelle: nights.

[00:58:13] Okay. So, okay. So that's kind of piggybacks off the last one. Yeah. That's why

[00:58:18] Denise Marcelle: I was saying, I would say be intentional about date nights, because it's really easy to lose yourself or lose your relationship. Into life because of life stuff happens. And before, you know, it weeks have gone by, and you haven't necessarily connected with your spouse and not talked about finances and not talked about what the kids need or what, where the kids got to go tomorrow and not talked about career, not even talking about your business, just to connect.

[00:58:52] So I think be intentional about date nights and date nights do not have to cost anything. They don't have to cost anything. You don't have to go anywhere. You don't have to pay for anything. A date night could be watching a movie together or eating, making dinner for the whole family, but then you eating dinner in the room, get some candles and set it up in the room and eat dinner in there, make it real special.

[00:59:18] You got to cook for the kids anyway, or whatever the kids are going to eat. Anyway, if you have to eat that as. Just make it a little bit more special for the two of you. And just find that alone time for a few hours, make, be intentional about that. If you do it weekly, some people do it monthly or however it is, but just schedule it so that it's intentionally set.

[00:59:41] I would say it makes a difference. It really does. I

[00:59:45] Oliver Marcelle: like that one. I like that one that, that definitely piggybacks off of the, off of the last one, um, to create an experience and that experience in order for you to stay consistent, a good way to stay consistent is to Institute a date night, um, to do that.

[01:00:03] And you said something about conversation and that it should not include it. Shouldn't be Shoptalk. Basically. It shouldn't be work. Shouldn't be about the kids should be okay. That's

[01:00:14] Denise Marcelle: hard to do. I got to admit because when we go on dates, I'm pretty sure that will inevitably start talking about the knowledge, at least Denali.

[01:00:24] Oliver Marcelle: You're right. And, and, but the reason why I touched on conversation and this, you guys may go into the next one, but the reason why I touched on conversation is because what we've noticed is that a lot of couples don't actually have conversations. There's five levels of conversation. And most couples we see are stuck in number one, which is hallway talk.

[01:00:51] Yeah. So if you think about if, like when I was in the corporate space, here's an example of hallway talk, I get to work and I'm headed to my desk and I stopped off to get some coffee. And there's a guy at they're getting coffees like, Hey bro, you saw the game last night. Yeah, man. That was crazy. Hit that sat at the last minute.

[01:01:13] Yeah, man. That's wild, man. What'd you doing for lunch? Oh, I don't know yet, man. Oh, I was gonna check out this new burger spot. Okay. You want to go? Sure. All right. Many of us get stuck there. And it's not, it's not our fault. We got kids, we got jobs or is it bad? Right. We got a lot going on. So there isn't a whole lot of time to go through the levels report or talk and emotional talk and all the different levels that gets you to the place where you're really being vulnerable and having a conversation.

[01:01:43] But I think that it's important in 2022, that we are intentional about having conversations. I need to be able to sit down here, her heart actively listened to her, have a conversation with her, um, allow her to feel acknowledged and heard and needed and accepted and valuable. So I would say that would be the next

[01:02:12] David Dowlen: I know that's a, as we told you earlier, we just started implementing date night and probably in the last six months for the first time.

[01:02:20] But Abby's was 10. So, you know, I'm almost 10 years. Uh, but you know, like you said, you get so busy with everything else, right? You guys shift into talking about Denali. I, this is, I live, breathe the foul man. And so we, we, when we first started, it was like, okay, we're not going to talk about the kids. Right.

[01:02:43] We're going to take a break from the kids. And that didn't, I don't think Nicole night, uh, the first time or two, and then, but it became a, Hey, well, this is the time we can talk about the business. Right. And so it's been that a lot of time, even the kids end up coming into it, or we start talking about the business or we start talking about the next podcast on.

[01:03:08] You know, what's coming up, you know, things like that with the business are in our schedule even, Hey, let's go visit this person or this person's coming up to visit or something like that. Right. We don't get into the deep us conversations the way we should. And it's just, you know, you know, when you're working full time and running a business and you have children and you've got a marriage and right.

[01:03:32] You get all those things, we all get buried under. Yep.

[01:03:36] Oliver Marcelle: Yep. That's true.

[01:03:37] David Dowlen: Being in conversation about us,

[01:03:41] Sarah Dowlen: I guess they'll be like, why don't we talk

[01:03:42] Denise Marcelle: about

[01:03:46] David Dowlen: trust? What are you going to talk about? All of this becomes a us.

[01:03:57] Oliver Marcelle: Yep. We know, we know it happens to us too. It happens to us as well, you know, or for us. To be fully transparent for us lately. It's been the, our grandson. Yeah, because he's, he's new. This is a new phase of our lives. Right. First grandchild. So we'll, we'll be at dinner and B, you're going to laugh when you say this, we'll be at dinner talking about, Hey, you know what?

[01:04:24] We should go get this thing for Colby at target.

[01:04:28] Denise Marcelle: Oh, we're showing each other pictures of them at this picture,

[01:04:33] Oliver Marcelle: you know, so yeah, we get it, we get it. And so, and it, listen, it's, we can't beat ourselves up if that happens. Right. We tell couples all the time progress is progress. The fact that date might have started back up again is phenomenal.

[01:04:49] We'll figure all the rest out, you know, as we can. Right. So, so I think that that's, that's, that's one and the conversation piece, having the conversation. Is, um, is definitely important and moving through those phases of conversation, not just staying at hallway talk cause here's, here's where we got stuck and why conversation is so big for us.

[01:05:11] We'd be like, okay. You know, um, w is Dustin doing anything after school today? Oh yeah. He's got to do this. Okay. You're going to pick them up. Yeah. I'll pick them up. What'd you want for dinner? Okay. We have to, and that's the, that's the bulk of our conversation for the entire day and we'll go weeks and months with just that level of conversation and then realizing, okay.

[01:05:32] We haven't learned anything about each other, like, you know, we're six months in the same place, you know? And, and so we try to help couples move through those levels of conversation, you know, report or talk, you know, we're Porter talk is just the facts. So did you have a good day today? Yeah. What'd you talk about.

[01:05:53] We had these three meetings and we talked about how are we going to move the company forward? Okay. That's cool. How was your day? Oh, my day was good. You know, just the facts, right. Then the next one is your feelings about the facts, right? And it starts to build the levels, start to build until you're actually having a conversation where I'm listening to her heart and I'm listening to, what's actually going on with her and I'm actively listening and acknowledging.

[01:06:17] And obviously we're busy. So I'm not saying that's going to happen like every hour of the day, but we should be intentional about carving out some time to do that. And what we had to do to give an example, because life was crazy. And so at one point we're like, you know what? Hold on. This can't work. We're going to carve out.

[01:06:37] I think, what did it start at? 10 minutes, 10 or 15? I think we're like, okay, we're good. We're going to carve out this time. We can. It's uninterrupted. If that's the only time we're going to get during the day, that's when we're going to sit down and. Even if we can look at each other, so we start talking, nothing can happen.

[01:06:55] Nothing else can happen in that 15 minutes. And that helped us at least to jumpstart something, to be able to build. So that conversation pieces is one for us.

[01:07:06] David Dowlen: I like that. Now guys, if you're getting something out of this, be sure and hit that like button subscribe and do all the good social media nonsense that I hate covering on the show because nobody actually wants to hear it.

[01:07:17] And you all know it anyway, but you know, let us know that you're enjoying this and who knows this may end up in a two-parter eventually we never know the guys, let us know what you think. Comment. We reply to all the comments, whether you're on podcast or whether you're on YouTube, whatever platform you're on.

[01:07:32] I love interacting with you guys in the comments. That's why I have a live show on Mondays as well. Be sure. And let us know what you're thinking, share your thoughts on this with us. We will pass them along to all of our nieces as well. So they get to answer them and see them and be sure and go over to their site and check that out as well and get to know them.

[01:07:49] These. Care about your marriage. I can honestly say there you care about your marriage. There are only a few people in this world who care about your marriage. These people do. So let's dig into number four in number four. We are,

[01:08:05] Oliver Marcelle: I think we're technically number five. So this, this is the last one, right?

[01:08:08] Okay. This is the last one, I think. So, so, so, so recap, uh, number one was, uh, go back, pull, pull. The things that you know were important to you, to things that were happening around the time that you were just madly head over heels in love, begin to reincorporate those things throughout the year, into your space.

[01:08:31] Um, do a check-in and, and the part B of that, you know, evaluating where you are, where you want to be, uh, creating a mission statement. That was two and then three. Is, uh, the date night and the experiential intimacy piece and creating experiences that allow you to be in the same place and with a common goal for is having conversation and being able to move through the levels of conversation that allow you to really learn and grow with your spouse.

[01:09:04] And then I would say the last one is, and there's many others, but we'll keep it. We'll make this the last one, um, invest in your marriage. What do we mean by invest in your marriage? If you think about your career? Right. Many of us that were, I was in the corporate space. My wife is in a corporate space.

[01:09:25] You have continuing education credits you have in surface in services. If you're in education, you have all of these different things that help you to further your career help to give you some tools, help to refresh the tools you already have so that you can. Be better so that you can grow so that you, it opens the door for more opportunity in your career.

[01:09:49] Often we get married, we go down the aisle. We say I do. And that is it. We don't do anything else. We don't do any seminars. We don't read any books. We don't look at people like Brent and Sarah's show we don't do any of these things. Right. And so I encourage you to be intentional about investing in your marriage.

[01:10:09] And I would, I would dare say, deuce, do something once a month, January, we're going to go to a, uh, we're going to go to a conference February. We're going to read this book, uh, March. We're going to, you know, look at this YouTube channel, you know, once a week, do things that are intentionally designed for you to grow your relationship.

[01:10:32] I would say that that, that is a key, a key one right there

[01:10:40] David McCarter: now.

[01:10:42] David Dowlen: I love the word intentionality, because I think we, I think we get lost sometimes and thinking, cause we're going through the motions, we're actually like engaged and intentional and achieving something in our marriage. Right. But too often we, we stick that in neutral or go into autopilot and just be like, I can coast for a while and just do this because it's muscle memory.

[01:11:10] Right. I know what I'm doing. I'm going through these motions and frequently we're doing things we've always done, but your heart's not necessarily in it. Your intention is not behind it. So I'm really digging the word intentional.

[01:11:24] Oliver Marcelle: Yeah, you gotta be. And it's interesting. You would say that. Cause I was just talking to a group of guys not too long ago.

[01:11:29] And one of the guys was saying the same thing. He was like, man, I felt like I was knocking it out the park. Cause I was still there. Like I didn't go anywhere. Um, I'm here, I'm, I'm engaged to some point I'm providing I'm protecting. It was like, I thought I was killing it. Nope. Finding out there's so many gaps, there's things missing.

[01:11:51] Intimacy's not where it should be. And the conversation is not where it should be. We hadn't done anything about investing in our relationship to grow it. We did exactly what you just described. Brent. We're just kind of going through the motions and because I'm still standing beside you, I'm like, okay, we're good.

[01:12:10] David Dowlen: So old joke. What was that? Uh, we used to hear all the time growing up. Like I told you, I loved you. Once woman, I changed my mind. I'll let you know

[01:12:19] Oliver Marcelle: exactly.

[01:12:22] David Dowlen: I don't, you know, it's a, it's a joke, but I think too many men like heard that and took that to heart sometimes.

[01:12:31] Denise Marcelle: Yeah.

[01:12:33] Oliver Marcelle: Yeah. Yeah, cause that's, that's, that's part of, and I won't say for everybody, but for, for a lot of us guys, that's part of what we saw.

[01:12:40] So those of us who are older, I'm a little bit older, right? I'm 50. So those in my generation, our parents and grandparents, we saw some very clearly defined roles, right? The moms and grandmas did certain things that Dan has and grandads did certain things and they, they worked hard. They weren't around that much.

[01:13:00] My, I can tell you right now, my dad, at one point in my life was working three jobs. So he would come home, sleep for like two hours and he'd be gone. So obviously no one could bother him while he was sleeping. So there's no interaction there. Then he's gone again. And then you have maybe about a seven hour span of time before he was gone again.

[01:13:24] So he had to sleep for at least five of those hours. Right. So there's very little bit of time, but that was in those. That was a successful husband. Oh yeah. As he was providing, he was putting food on the table. He was taking care of the kids when we need to choose, we got shoes. So that was a successful husband.

[01:13:48] David Dowlen: Sorry.

[01:13:49] Oliver Marcelle: Why is this going to say? But you know, we're realizing now that there's more to it than

[01:13:55] David Dowlen: that's what I was going to say is guys, I want you to take note was a successful husband. Okay. And it may have been easier in our parents' age. I don't know. We could debate that there are different issues, different concerns, but just showing up is not being a husband.

[01:14:14] Uh, the worlds have changed. The time has changed. Right. We have different expectations. We know, um, that we have a higher capacity than that to be real with. Yeah. I had a great conversation with a gentleman from Australia and he has a ministry doing marriage like you guys do. And that's one of the things he focuses on with his men is increasing capacity, increasing work capacity, because it's not enough to go to work and make a paycheck, right?

[01:14:44] Not enough to just be in the home. You have to be emotionally there. You have to be mentally there. You have to spiritually there, you have to be engaged with your spouse. You have to be engaged with your children. So some people would argue that it's harder at this point than previous generations to be a good husband.

[01:15:01] I would say that they just didn't know any better. I don't know that it was harder. It was just different. Right. But guys, it's not enough. Yeah. Yeah. Let me, let me ask what is next for Oliver and Denise and Denali, LLC?

[01:15:16] Oliver Marcelle: What is next for us? Um, well, a couple of things. We really want to get more heavily involved in community work.

[01:15:29] So you may not see that if you follow us on social media, you may not see a lot of that, but for those of us who are in maybe the Baltimore metropolitan area, because that's where we are, hopefully you'll see more of us, um, in the community in 2022, that's a big one. We're also launching a YouTube show. So for those of you who are not in the Baltimore metropolitan area, you'll be able to, um, catch that show.

[01:15:59] There's the YouTube channel already exists. And there's a whole lot of other tips that you can get, you know, to help you throughout your year on that. But we definitely want to focus in on that a little bit more this year. Of course the coaching will still, uh, will still happen. That's a big part of, of what we do, but I'd say if I had to pick out two things and you could, you could piggyback on that if you have other.

[01:16:22] The two things we've been thinking about is really getting into the community and doing some work with men, doing some work with couples, um, and then growing our YouTube channel.

[01:16:34] Denise Marcelle: And then also we are finishing up our 52 week devotional.

[01:16:39] Oliver Marcelle: Yes. As well. Yes. That should be out. That'll be out Valentine's day.

[01:16:45] David Dowlen: Sign me up on the pre-order.

[01:16:47] Oliver Marcelle: Absolutely awesome. Appreciate you. We'll do

[01:16:51] David Dowlen: now. I'll see if I got the right screen here. I waited. Nope. I had it. I messed up at a screen just stream. There it is. Yay. Now, if you're listening on air guys, what you're not seeing right now that I have on our screen, that you can check on the YouTube channel.

[01:17:07] If you want is denali.org. And it sounds, it's really spelled. It sounds guys D and O L i.org. Now, is this the best place for people to find you? I said earlier you have, you're killing your social media game. I love you guys on Instagram. I feel lazy compared to you guys and your YouTube channel. I go over and watch some of your videos and try and catch some of your lives and stuff.

[01:17:35] Uh, and you have some great tip videos. I enjoy those. They're good, short, little, very digestible chip tips on YouTube. They're just amazing. And it's a quick fix where you guys can just check in and spend five to seven minutes on your marriage very easily and just go, wow. Okay. You know, investing an extra five or seven minutes into your marriage every day would be huge or a couple of times a week.

[01:17:59] So I think you've got some great stuff going on there. This is your website. Is everything tied back to here?

[01:18:05] Oliver Marcelle: Everything. Yeah, everything is tied back to the website. And I got a little joke for those that are watching on YouTube, right? It's literally changing as we speak. So after you watch this video, if you refresh the Nale that org it's going to look different, right?

[01:18:27] Yeah. That's a funny little joke. And, uh, but, uh, but yes, to answer your question, this is, this is the central hub from here. You can get to the blog, you can get to the podcast, get to YouTube. You can get to anything, uh, that we will be doing. You can get to the store, uh, merge all of that. You can get from that central location.

[01:18:50] David Dowlen: Let me ask this for a second. Uh, on your website, you have an interesting giveaway.

[01:19:05] For all of you listening. It's denali.active, hosted.com forward slash F four slash three. And guys, all these links will be in the show notes. So don't worry about it if you can't remember that because, Hey, I'm going to have it for you in the show notes. Ah, can't hit the right buttons today. This will happen.

[01:19:27] Sarah usually hits the buttons over my head right now. This is Sarah as part of the show. I don't know how to do this.

[01:19:39] And there we go. And if you're watching on YouTube, this is what it's going to look like when you get there. And you can put in your name and email and tell me about five habits that happily married couple.

[01:19:51] Oliver Marcelle: So in, in that, um, in that piece that you'll get from putting in your email, you're actually going to get a little bit of what you heard.

[01:20:01] I don't want to give away too much of what's in there, but you will get a little bit of what you heard. And in addition, we will add, um, a couple other things that you didn't hear, but it's basically in a nutshell what we did today, right? It's, uh, five areas that you can concentrate on and it doesn't take a whole lot of over-thought five areas that you can concentrate on, that you can implement right away.

[01:20:25] After you read that to begin seeing some changes in your relationship.

[01:20:32] David Dowlen: So guys is the, in-depth more in-depth version of this conversation, right? Because we have to keep it within reason if it's a podcast, but this is if you want more on what they were talking about today, if you heard something that you love, something that really registered with you, okay.

[01:20:50] That just sounded in your mind. Go give him your email. I promise you, they aren't going to spam the world out of you. They're not going to give away your email or sell it or anything stupid like that, but get this free offering guys take this free opportunity to dig in. Like, I, I used to be a minister. I have lots of books on marriage and they aren't cheap.

[01:21:11] Usually investing in your marriage. There's always a price. Like they said, Hey, invest in your marriage. Right. It's the beginning of January. Grab this free book from them. Okay. Ebook, PDF. Yeah. Yup. Grab this free PDF. Okay. And this is step one of investing in your marriage and it's not going to cost you anything, but this is a great way to start January, 2022.

[01:21:37] And to start your marriage on a solid foundation this year and move in a positive direction. Marriage has been in trouble for a long time. The rates are staggering, they're horrifying. And we want your marriage to be solid. We want 20, 22 to be the year. We reverse that and start moving towards marriage, being a foundational element again, and strengthening marriages.

[01:22:05] And you can make this the best year of your life. Guys. We're going to have all of Oliver and Denise's links down in the show notes. I want you to go spend time with them, invest in your marriage with them. You can, if you're watching the videos, you can check out the cool t-shirts they're wearing. I own at least one of those already.

[01:22:23] I've got another one on the way. So guys, I only, I only wear my own brand anymore, but I believe in what they're doing enough. I bought three t-shirts from them. So, thank you, blessings on you. What they're doing. I can tell you guys as a, honestly, growing up a preacher's kid, I grew up my whole life going to marriage regiment kind of stuff.

[01:22:44] Um, Sarah and I had been on some amazing marriage retreats. Over the years, Denise and Oliver are offering you guys solid gold on their podcast, on YouTube. They are fighting for your marriage and giving you the tools to do that, to make it the best possible marriage. So guys take advantage of it. Don't miss this opportunity investing in your marriage, and it's not even costing you to do so.

[01:23:10] Whether you get their download, whether you check out their YouTube, whether you listen to their podcasts, guys, I can't thank you enough for starting out the year with us and for being on the podcast today. Thank you so much for being here and taking the time with us.

[01:23:23] Oliver Marcelle: It's our pleasure. Thank you.

[01:23:29] David Dowlen: Guys as always be better tomorrow because what you do today and we'll see you on the next.

[01:23:34] David McCarter: This has been the

[01:23:35] fellow woman podcast, your home, everything man, husband and father, be sure to subscribe. So you don't miss a show head over to www.thefalliblebain.com for more content

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