Chosen to Create: How to Renew Your Passion and Grow in Grace w/ Parris Bowens, Musician

 Chosen to Create: How to Renew Your Passion and Grow in Grace w/ Parris Bowens, Musician - The God and Gigs Show Episode 93

Parris Bowens: There are things that we want for ourselves that God wants more for us. But the problem is we think, Seek the first the kingdom of God means go away from everything I love to do. And what we don't understand is God is like I as your father want to give you these gifts that you want. But I got way more for you. So, I found a lot of creativity in my prayer time. When I go to pray, I'll take something like this a clipboard, and I got pencils and I'm sitting here sketching ideas. And God has given me stories and songs and news. I'm like, wait a minute if I've been doing this sooner, how much more would I accomplish? How much more wealth than missing out on all the things and a lot of us miss what God has for us because we think he just wants to be religious. He's wanting to be religious and deepen some kind of monk. And God is like, are you kidding me? I know the plans I have for you. They're good. Like I'm giving you all things to enjoy. But I don't want you to get them from ideology I want you to get it from me. 

Allen C. Paul: You've just heard the incredible testimony of Paris Bowens, a musician, composer, creative artists, and one of the most influential people behind some of the most influential music that you've heard in gospel R&B and beyond. And he shared his heart with us in this episode. He is an incredible member of the God and Gigs community from the get-go. But what he shares today is going to help you to live your best life to embrace the spiritual journey that you might be on, even if it has twists and turns, and realized that there's more ahead of you than is behind you. As a god-centered, creative. I appreciate him so much for his heart. And I want you to make sure you plug in and listen to every word of this interview. It's a life-changing kind of episode. Let's get right into it.

Introduction: Artists, musicians, and creatives of all kinds looking for help balancing your passion to create with your everyday life. Not sure if your faith can co-exist with your profession. Welcome to a place where real artists discuss real life. You're listening to the God and gig show visit godandgigs.com for show notes, links, and more information.

Allen C. Paul: Hello, and welcome back to our show. Thank you so much for making this podcast a part of your creative day. Whether you've been listening to us for years, or you're just starting, and this is your first episode, I appreciate you. I know there are 1000 podcasts, a million podcasts out there that you could be listening to and you chose this one, it makes my heart glad and I'm super grateful for you. If you're new to the show, let me tell you why you're in the right place. If you're faith-focused, creative, creating music, art, whatever discipline you're in, inside or outside of the church, but you have a spiritual foundation that you'd like to connect with your creative journey and your creative life. You're in the right place. We connect the dots between the spiritual, the practical, the creative, and the ministerial needs you have we are all about being integrated, and creating that place where you can feel at home. So, if you just heard me say something that resonates in your heart and resonates with you, you're in the right place. Okay, so make sure you subscribe. Don't miss an episode, especially because of episodes like this. This is why I tell people all the time, subscribe. Don't wait for Facebook or Twitter to send you a notice. Make sure you're subscribed to the show. So, when episodes like this are a groundbreaking type of episodes and interviews, you won't miss one. So, let me tell you once again, as I said in the open why this interview is a must and will be a cornerstone of both your creative life and your spiritual life. First of all, Paris Bowens is not just another musician. He's one of the most authentic musicians and creatives I've ever met. He was connected with us and I'm going to tell that story, but eventually became a core member of the God and Gigs book and he is an influential person in one of the most influential spaces as a member back in the 90s and 2000s of the soundcheck band, which was the backing band for gospel legend, Tye Tribbett. So, Tye Tribbett, it picked up Paris, and he'll tell you the entire story in his interview, and then Paris went on to work with so many other artists that you have heard all over the landscape from Justin Timberlake to Kira shared to music Soulchild to Timberland, to brandy, and worked with everybody on and on he is one of the most respected musicians and composers in the industry, but his heart is so authentic and so connected to God into his purpose that I can't continue to just talk about him. You got to hear his words for himself. 

So, here's what you're going to learn from this interview you're going to learn about the history of how Paris came to know Tye Tribbett how he made a promise to eventually play with them and how that became reality. You're going to learn how he became adjusted to the inner circle working with gospel legends like Thai bread, ham, and Israel, learning how he was able to deal with insecurity, intimidation, trust issues, fear, how he was able to overcome those situations, even as he was working at the top of the industry. He's going to share his heart about some of the struggles that he's gone through, even in these last few months as I'm recording in the pandemic, and how he's found his greatest blessing in unexpected places. He's dedicated his life to following his purpose and staying connected to God staying connected to his Christian heritage and his Christian foundation. I'm telling you, there's not a stone that will be Unturned in this interview, you have to listen to hear the quotes make sure you have some Twitter quotes ready that you can post and share with some friends that need to hear this, and then share this episode with them as well. And make sure you're taking notes that you can go back to after you hear this episode. This is when you're going to have to rewind a couple of times and mark some spaces where Pairs dress both either a creative, a business, or a spiritual nugget that you're going to want to hold on to for the long term. I hope I have explained it enough. Let's get on to this incredible interview with my friend, Paris Bowens.

Ladies and gentlemen, you have no idea how excited I am. Because this interview has been five years exactly in the making. And Paris, I'm going to drop some things on you right now. Like out of nowhere. Just to tell some people that are listening to this podcast, can understand how God orchestrates things. We just mentioned that my church, Michalak Church has a wonderful pastor Mary Alessi, who's our artists. And we also have a wonderful technical director who by the name of John Roman, and you may not even know this story, as I introduce you, I'm going to introduce you with this story and try to knock you off a little bit because I don't think you know this. So, John Roman comes to me and he says there's this keyboardist this incredible musical director in a Paris we're down, I think, is in Brazil, or someplace. And he said I think he will be a great connection for your book. Because as I just told you, five years ago working on this idea for God and Gigs, and I said I would love to talk to him, but I just don't know he's your friend. And he's probably busy and everything. When I said this man, sent me an email, which was a chapter, not an interview, a chapter. And I said I had to put this entire chapter in my book. So, ladies and gentlemen, one of the writers have God and Gigs. Parris Bowens, how you doing? Was that a good intro? That set you up? That's how it happened. 

Parris Bowens: Boy [inaudible 8:10] John. He drags on me so much when we were out together with Israel. That I love that guy. But he said the same thing. He made that connection like you guys together would be incredible and that was a blessing to be a part of what you were doing. First time being a part of something published. So, I thought that was amazing to even be a part of that and even be honored that even considered me. Because there are so many more amazing guys out there. But I'm great. That was awesome.

Allen C. Paul: I appreciate it. And again, I need to make sure I put you on the call right more often. I don't think I haven't put your name prominently enough because no, and I'll say this again. I know every time I do interviews; I feel like people just listen to his talk. But I think they need to know that these connections again, are God's kind of connections because I have so much respect for you. And I did not and I was going to be transparent. I have heard from you, but I had not heard from you. Do you follow me? I'd heard your work. But I was not one of those guys that liked like, I was scared of the inner circle. I was scared of following guys and trying to get to know their sound. So, I would just read the credits real fast and then just kind of keep it moving. But I knew that the people behind the music behind these great albums that we've grown to love and gospel and then obviously R&B with Anthony and all these people you've worked with. There's a sound behind it, and there's a spirit behind the sound. So as soon as you started writing and opening your mouth, brother and I spawned it started following you. I said this is where it comes from. And you had so much that you've already shared in my book, so I'm not going to bore anybody with trying to read your entire resume. But just for the people who have never met you. First time. They're meeting Parris Bowens. Tell them, who are you? What are you all about? What you'd want them to know and the first time they meet you?

Parris Bowens: First of all, I'm a child of God and I love the Lord. I don't people say that, but I do everything for him. I will give up everything for God, my career, everything as much as I enjoy love music. So, I always say that first. I'm a follower of Christ. I'm a father, husband, Minister as well, but my musical career started in Philadelphia, my mom, and dad, pastors, and we did a lot of street ministry growing up. He started Kojic, but dad decided he didn't want to be a part of the politics of all that. God called you and started a non-denominational ministry where we literally if it was someone outside, we have speakers and amplifiers and keyboards, and we minister to the community. So that was my upbringing. And then one fateful night, I saw a topic at 12 13 years old I saw a tied tribute playing with another artist before he was an artist. He wasn't on no mike; he was on keyboards hopping around just like he does. And him and my boy, Dana Sarang. That is trivet. Ryan Frasier Morin drums, they were playing for choir, and they were killed. I never heard that like it. And I made a vow to myself, I won't play with them one day and didn't know he was going to start a group. Five, six years later, started GA, all those years later when I'm about 18 years old, and he sees me and then invites me to be a part of the group. And then from there, at the time, the Philly scene [inaudible 11:41] was blowing up the Philly soul scene through a connection with James Poyser different people like that I met The Roots, Jill Scott, [inaudible 11:49], all of them and I begin to kind of cook like with both with Tye, I start kind of working in both arenas. Like while we work on our album, I'll be out touring with Vivian Green and some of those different artists and stuff like that. And then, when Tye's first song dropped single, No Way. It just seemed like the doors just crashed open in a gospel arena. And from there we went on the record, live album, victory life, stand out. But before that, we did something called concepts and ideas, real underground record.  It wasn't scientifically but that was something we did in a friend's studio all the Willingboro, New Jersey. And that kind of built some traction underground. People kind of got noticed that way. But I was with Tye for about 10 years. And through my connection with Tye, I met everybody else. Who's in gospel music, Israel, Kurt Franklin, Mary [inaudible 12:51] Walker, everybody in the gospel that I've watched as a kid, back when was VHS tapes, we would watch those live concerts, the framing pages are like that purpose by design. I'm watching John P. Kee Strength watching the show up all of that, I begin to be around those people. And it was weird, because where I'm from my family. We were kind of like the least, I hate to say it that way. But we weren't popular perse we knew a lot of people we had a lot. Because my mom and dad served so many people. they were known for their service. But we weren't like the hip in-crowd, so when I got into the industry. I wasn't used to the attention. 

Allen C. Paul: I'll ask you about that. Because as soon as you said that because when you mentioned meeting Tye and then saying, I want to play with him one day, then you said about five. Well, how many years later?

Parris Bowens: I started playing with time 98, I met him in 92. So, like six years?

Allen C. Paul: So, you're like still 18 - 19 years old? Basically.

Parris Bowens: Yes. Fresh out of high school. I worked one job before I started, it was just music after that.

Allen C. Paul:  Wow. So, you just want to start talking about your parents and this world that you're in the church world but like you said all of a sudden, you're surrounded by the people that are legends that you have followed all your life. What is that like? In terms of just the way, you approach your self-esteem because I've talked to some guys that said I didn't feel any different because it was just church and it was music and I loved it. Other people said I was intimidated. I didn't know if I belonged in the room. So, which one was it for you like how did you handle that going from like you said kind of outside the circle to be the circle like you are in the middle of it?

Parris Bowens: Culture shock for me. Extreme culture shock I've grown to be able to speak more like all of this is fairly the new phase of Parris's life, the speaking and being confident to do that. But I was a stream introvert. I'm the oldest of five kids, but I was always a loner. Stream introvert, quiet kept to myself, I'm comfortable going to movies by myself to kind of read comic books. I'm the weirdo. When it came when I went to school. I wasn't in the in-crowd, I was with the one Asian kid in my school, I was hanging with him, the one little white kid, I was hanging with those kids. I wasn't a part of the circles. So, I wasn't a part of the musician circle. Even though I played at my dad's church that weekend, I wasn't in that crowd. So, when I got with Tye wanted to see somebody who was one of your heroes recognize you, I didn't know he was at the gig. I'm playing with another artist, my friend, John Payton. And then Tye comes walking up. And I'm like this is the guy that I remember seeing when I was 12 years old. Tye is like the most popular musician in Philly. Back then Tye was doing everybody's record. He was the MD for everybody's records. He had a record and he was in Philly, Jersey area, to have Tye and his brother and they want to record was like this job to be lit. So, I'm the guy that will be at the concerts as if I was a part of a group that was playing for those concerts. We'd be the first artists that nobody even cared about. [inaudible 16:09].

We were the guinea pigs for the sound man. So, I was used to that. And nobody ever paid attention. You knew your circle of friends, but it wasn't like nobody was rooting for you when you were playing. When I got with Tye, I went from being relatively nobody in the audience when you're playing to now when you play with Tye people crowding around the instruments, and I'm like, what in the world is this and for me, it was a major shock to my system. At one point, I never forget when with Tye a couple of years in, I said I don't know how to handle this, a little bit too much, I'm afraid, because he will be up there on the mic singing and he will come running over to the keyboard, he will turn my keyboard up, because I'll be so free to be heard. That I would turn my volume down, he will be run over like No way. And he turned my keyboard up. And I'll be like, trying to have my keyboard behind the curtains on the stage. They broke me out of my shell. And I think the majority of my time would Tye I was under massive intimidation. Because he was also when he came out. He was so different from the industry. So, it was like we got pushed to the forefront. We will do concerts with artists that were the closing acts that were saying we're not closing after them, the headliner be like I'm not going after them. So, we're going to go and they'll go, so we will always the front. And with that, his band was the highlight of everything. So, we got a lot of tension. And I wasn't used to doing the keys, and I'm like, people looking at you to perform it. That's not how my Dad Mom trained me, they trained me to serve I wasn't used to all of that. 

Allen C. Paul: How did you start to navigate because I was going to bring that up, I love the fact that you went straight to the fact that even when you wrote in the book, I remember that you put that in capital letters that you felt fear like you had to overcome that fear. And Tye helped you to see that serving. I'm saying this myself. And hopefully, I'm reading it right for you. Serving at that point meant stepping forward, like to serve him and to be the guy that he needed you to be to serve those people and to present the gospel the way he needed you to step up. And that was you casting off the spirit of fear and taking your authority and all that kind of stuff. All those words. I kind of want to get to because I always think of the musician that's listening, right? I'm sure there's a musician that's listening to that said, I would love to have that problem. I would love to have that problem of having to navigate fear and dealing with intimidation on that stage. What do you say to the guy that's still dealing with that intimidation, and they're not on the stage? Like they haven't made it yet. They haven't made the connection and they're thinking, the reason why I can never make it is that I don't belong there. Like they're thinking you want to me so what would you say to that person who's like, probably listening to you right now saying, I'll never be picked I'll never be the guy even if I'm practicing even if I got the skill like he's the one that's singing in the back is not even going to touch the keyboard because of that, what would you say to that person?

Parris Bowens: Well, that's big. First, I always tell people well for one when I had to deal with Tye I went to him and told him I was afraid he said it's okay quit I got it, but so many other people who want to want the opportunity. So similar to what you just said. He said to me, and it sounds cold, but he knew what he was doing. He was like if you go ahead and quit. I got a couple of guys who want this, and he let me know that you're going to lose this opportunity over fear. He may be confronted. And, at that point, I had to make a decision. Am I going to let my fear take this opportunity from me and give it to somebody else? Or will I face it? And then move forward those muscles. So, I ended up making a decision and he was like no. So, it forced me to face it. One of the main things that helped me with that was preparation. I practiced a lot. And I learned some things so to the person who doesn't feel like they belong. And the first thing is, you have to ask yourself, are you anointed for it? Is this something that you're supposed to do? And a lot of times people want what they see other people have doesn't quite mean is what you're supposed to do. And I forget I heard, I think might be Myles Munroe said a tree doesn't eat the fruit that it bears and basically, apple trees don't eat apples to produce apples. They don't eat apples. Sometimes the thing that brings you inspiration is different from the thing that you create. So sometimes you have to identify, do you even have what it takes to get rid of Watford one of my favorite guitar players in a game? 

He told me, he said you got to start asking me what questions do you have what it takes and when you cast the fear aside, and things like that. But sometimes when you cast the fear side, ask yourself at the court, the love what you do, you have a passion for this thing. And I had to get to a place where I'll do this if somebody pays me or not. And if you have that, then you do have what it takes. And then what you have to do at that point is sometimes you can create an opportunity; what I would do is I would treat every opportunity as if I made it. So, before Tye came, one of the reasons why I believe Tye was even able to see that I was the person for the job was the gig that I had before him. I treated it as if I was in Madison Square Garden. I arranged the music out as if I was going to be on a big tour. I did rip the band in a certain way. We were a church in West Philly, West Philadelphia, born and raised we were in a church in West Philadelphia on a Friday night. It what many people there. We were playing as if it was Madison Square Garden. We treated it that way. And Tye came and saw me in that spirit. His faith is a major component of this thing. People ask me, how did you get what you got? I was like, Faith is the main thing. Practicing and doing what I do in that regard. That's the works to go to your faith. But do you have the belief that you can be on that stage, when I saw Tye at 12, I say I'm a play with him? I put that thing out in the atmosphere. And it turned around in my favor. But in that timeframe from 12 to 18. I'm preparing. So, I've put in works if Tye was playing somewhere and I could see him after that, mom and dad drive me I want to see Tye mom and dad drive me I will go see them. Back then it was tape recorders, I would tape-record what I hear him do and go back home and practice until our tore to tape up. Anything I get my hands on that he was a part of I study and practice Tye. So, by the time, it came time for him to hear me I was ready for I had already put the faith in I had put the work in to go with my faith, and then literally supernaturally turn around and I would have never known that I would have a 10-year career with him. Some of his biggest and most important records lost his career. No way I wrote that with him. It was something that I sat down on a keyboard one day, I am playing the idea out, and then he starts writing to it. And that became one of the first things that catapulted his career. So, faith is a major, I would tell him to have faith start declaring speaking certain things, but then not just that, have the corresponding action to go with it. If you believe you're going to do some preparing for the way you believe, so you can have what you say.

Allen C. Paul: You just nailed it. I knew your art again. That's why I love your spirit. Because there's nothing in when you share stuff like this even when the book and then whenever you're sharing even with other musicians, and I'm watching you, there is an authenticity to that, that only comes from the time you put in. I'm not going to shame younger musicians in that because sometimes we get on that we did it back as you said, we used to have a tape you already know what it's like to rewind and plays it again, got too much technology and all this stuff. We say the old guys, right? But it is something to that I think there's something to that mentality of, six years, seven years 10 years prepping for this moment. And I was actually on this new app clubhouse that got the new audio app this now that people are dropping in and all these different apps so I was listening to some people talk about RMB and by complaining there's no real music on the radio now so I go take him on gospel R&B, but any music, people keep saying, well, all I have to do now is just get viral, or get on a tick-tock and I'll become an influencer and I'll become good overnight. And what the guy the A&R rep on this thing was saying, is that he made a bunch of money in nine months, but now he's panicking. Because he doesn't know what to do next, because there's nothing behind it. And so, I love the fact that we're probably speaking to some artists that think at this nowadays, that viral and getting good and let's take the musicians getting on YouTube, getting chops, get on gospel chops and everything that's going to be successful, what I hear you saying is that that's not going to work, even now, you still have to do the work.

Parris Bowens: The principle remains the same. It's like, the methods and the technology changes, but you still got to maintain the same principles. And you can get a nice surge of a million views here. I've had videos that'll plague your mind if you fall into that cycle of the way the social media thing works. I have one video that could do 30,000 views, and then the next one you can't get 300 and then include your emotions in it and make you think it's about that. And really what I'm learning is consistency is the key in everything. Those who win, it's the ones who keep going, no matter what surgery the cycles happen, you just stay on it. But you have to stay consistent through it all. And I think a lot of older musicians those who came up as we did, they like you don't even know how to navigate these waters. I think you want one of the main things you have to remain a student, I think a [inaudible 26:38] in everything. I'm not just in terms of playing but in everything, I think you'd remain a student, if you're going to be in this industry, this business, or these climates, you need to learn enough to navigate. But I think we need to keep our core principles be diligent be consistent still practice. For me, one of the things I'm learning now, I'm going back to some studies like I'm going back to my Oscar Peterson studies, I'm going back to Art Tatum, I'm studying Latin music, I love Latin music, and it's something I've never really been able to play well. But I'm giving myself things to challenge me to keep me. And then I'm studying some of these younger musicians that's coming out that's killing, you can always learn from anybody. But those are core principles like stay inspired. Keep working towards something. And then I'm also in a place of giving back at that point. Like right now, one of the things that keep me inspired is talking to the younger generation. I love sharing my experiences, my stories, and you watch their eyes light up because you can imagine the days that we were coming up if there was a camera following us for what we were experiencing. See. They don't have any documentation of that stuff. Everything they got documentation for now, but they would have loved it. I would have loved to be in a room with Fred Hammond when he was working on Pages of Life. If I could have been in a room of Fred Hammond and see the behind scenes, I used to love watching DVDs. And watching the behind the scenes of oh my God just a little bit. What was the band doing? What we wish we had. They have an abundance of it. And so, one of the things that I get from a lot of people who want to talk to them online, they all want to know about that soundcheck error. I'm like that wasn't on social media. They didn't get to see me with Tye and me rehearsals on Monday nights at in [inaudible 28:32] Camden. For me, I cry sometimes I'm like those are some epic times.

Allen C. Paul: Did you realize it though? That's the key. Did you know that it was epic at the time? Or were you just at the moment? Because I think that's why we don't appreciate it and why now when you get back and you say that was the foundation of an error. But you just in a moment. I think sometimes maybe that's a God thing if you'd known how incredible that was, maybe you wouldn't have treated it the same? Or maybe you would have been too overwhelmed. 

Parris Bowens: You are 100% on it? Well, for us. And I'll say I can't speak for all of us. Sometimes we wish the rest of the band is here so we can all because as the older you get you like your mind changes and you process things differently like wait a minute, I always thought we all thought the same about everything. Because we were all in it together. But as we all get older, and when I hear they share their sides of the story. I'm like you're viewing this thing very differently than I was viewing it. And then immediately did appreciate it. But It was just like, that's what you took away from it. That's what I took away from it. But for me, when I was in it, I didn't even care about the stage. It didn't matter what made that season of my life precious. It had nothing to do with it. The gigs per se I enjoyed so much more the rehearsals, the hotel rooms I'm talking about when we were sharing motel rooms because they couldn't get us all roses too many of us. It was like 11 - 12 musicians. And then you got 20 choir members. We never could get a tour bus to be able to coach the bus the whole time. So, it's never really comfortable. But we were so close to everything that we built in that was genuine from our guys. It was family and me, I've had a chance to talk to Noah Hall. I worked on a project with him. He's one of my heroes. And I and him worked on for sure he was ready to get it and I sit in a hotel room with him and Eric Reid. And Jim Jones was telling us stories about Fred Hammond and I'm like, this is the stuff I wanted to know and when you hear from those [inaudible 30:56], everybody had a camaraderie and it was a relationship. So, what we see today with social media, a lot of it is opportunistic. That's what I get from it. But they don't have that relationship factor that we had. And for me right now my band spicy chicken. Everybody's cut from home but we're not quite together. 

You cut from North Jersey, you cut from there, but we're not close. We don't get to hang out when I was with soundcheck. We ate everywhere together we slept everywhere together if you had a girlfriend, we knew her very well she'd be mad at me because you rehearsing too much it was so many dynamics that came out in our music. So, there were times when I would get up one of our favorites like we love [inaudible 31:42] we could sit in the car [inaudible 31:46] had a Cutlass he had one of that Oldsmobile Cutlass. He had that thing for years. His dad gave it to him. And it was one of those cars that had the front seat. It was a long front seat. So, three people sit in the front. And soundcheck we're packing that thing. You have four or five band members in the back, three of us sitting in the front. And we just cranking out [inaudible 32:11] on a way to gigs and rehearsals, and then we will get to a gig. We never rehearse the practice this one of us to start playing a soundtrack progress situation. And then the whole band jump right in. But so that stuff lent to our people were like how much do I rehearse and it wasn't so much that we rehearsed so much as we were together. And all of that fit our sound and that's how we came up with the name soundcheck too because we will come up with ideas and soundcheck and then tie was signal say soundcheck as to say play, which I did in soundcheck. And then it comes out that way. And it just kept creating ideas people like you all rehearse that. No, we just set we didn't soundcheck, it would be what we would do the concert that night. It'll be 1000 something people out there and what we doing just jumping off a bridge is creating these ideas. And we just haven't but the relationship gave us the faith to do things like that. If we didn't have a relationship, I wouldn't trust Spanky. If I didn't know him, so let's just do raw ideas. 15,000 people out there, let's just do this idea, if [inaudible 33:22] if you can't do that. And that listening to what that sound was. So that was a very special time of my life. And it only happened. I don't even know that stuff like that happens more than once. That I'll ever get an opportunity to have a situation like that moment in history, and we didn't know what the impact was going to be at all. It hadn't done people in the audience, it had everything to do with our experience with each other.

Allen C. Paul: I won't tell you like number one, please say that idea. But the documentary, I just saw the document in my head. When you say to get the band together and talk about your experiences, please steal that idea and just make it happen. Because that would be incredible. For all of us again, because you can look back at Motown what was standing in the shadows of Motown, and all these other great new funk brothers, that everybody when you see them get back together, and you see the smiles and you feel and I'm so glad you touched on the relationship thing, especially number one, since we're recording during the pandemic, maybe people are listening hopefully when they're listening, we got the vaccine and we finally get to sit in the same room together. But I think that's one of the things we can probably touch on is now the number one social media has everything splintered we all think in our little bubbles, and now we're literally in bubbles because of trying to stay safe and everything. So, what do you do now to kind of keep yourself refreshed? You mentioned playing different music. I know you're an incredible multi-creative like you write you draw. You have so many things and then of course you've got your ministry. So how do you keep that fire burning now that you don't have those same relationships, what's driving you now, as far as creatively and, keeping that thing bubbling up. 

I hope you're enjoying this incredible interview. But I wanted to make sure I took some time to tell you how you can make sure you also find success as a creative going into the new year. As I'm recording, we're right at the end of 2020. And many of us have seen the most difficult and most pressing circumstances we've ever seen. But there are still new opportunities, still, new things that we can be doing in the coming year in 2021, that will ensure our success that will make us stop hesitating, and stop being frustrated and move into our calling with confidence. And I want to help you to do that. And I'm going to do so through a live event of live training that we're having on December 27. It's going to be 8:30 pm. Eastern, and you can sign up for this training right now at godandgigs.com/2021 training. Those are the numbers 2021 training, sign up for our webinar that we're going to be sharing how you can break out of frustration, break out of isolation, and break out of the hesitation that might have gotten into you and your creative life during 2020 we're going to show you the solutions that will make 2021 your best creative year ever. 

And I'm telling you right now the things you're hearing from people like Parris are the same kinds of things you're going to hear even in more detail during this live event, you're not going to want to miss it. If you're listening to this afterward, I apologize. I wish you could be there. But we're going to be sharing one of the most impactful lessons that we have learned and how you can make 2021 your best year ever so register right away at godandgigs.com/2021 training. Remember, it's the numbers 2021 training, go right now and register. So, you can be a part of this special event where we're going to give you the answers and the solutions you need to make 2021 your best creative year ever. Now let's get back to our conversation with Parris. I know you are an incredible multi-creative like you right, you draw. You have so many things. And then of course you've got you to know, your ministry. So how do you keep that fire burning now that you don't have those same relationships? what's driving you now, as far as creatively and you know, keeping that thing bubbling up?

Parris Bowens: Well, first, God, my relationship with him. With regular everyday life, you're so busy, we all love God, for the most part. But we can't give him the time he will need because he had to work tour all that. With everything slowing down. It gave me like, legitimate time with God that I'm like that hour that I wanted to take with you before. I couldn't now I do and when I do spend that time with God, he releases things to you. Why was I running from me so long, you're giving me downloading wealth, so, there are things that we want for ourselves that God wants more for you. But the problem is, we think Seek he first the kingdom of God. God means to go away from everything I love to do. And what we don't understand is God is like I as your father want to give you these gifts that you want. But I got way more for you. So, I found a lot of creativity in my prayer time, I will go to them my prayer time. And I keep a sketchpad, here go right here. When I go to pray, I'll take something like this a clipboard, and I got pencils. And I'm sitting there sketching out ideas. And God has given me stories and songs and news. I'm like, wait a minute, if I had been doing this sooner, how much more what I accomplished, how much more wealth that I missed, not on all the things and a lot of us miss what God has for us because we think he's once we are religious. He's wanting to be religious and deepen some kind of monk. And God is like, are you kidding me? I know the plans I have for you. They're good. Like I'm giving you all things to enjoy. But I don't want you to get them from ideology I want you to get them from me. And so, the Lord is like recenter my focus and start read due to season resurface vision. And I've let sit dormant, my cartoon, I've been able to do a lot more of it. Because I'm home now. And I'm in control of my schedule. At my Church, we record all of our virtual stuff, I record everything from here for the most part, and I do all my edits and track out send it out to the band, everybody records from home. We put it all together but I control my schedule my time, much better. And so now I allocate take this time to animation. 

I'll kick this Time to writing I allocate this time and ultimately my family, my wife, and my children, I get so much inspiration from just going and sit on the couch with them. Just that alone. That period of resting, allows you to rejuvenate, allows you to refocus, and then it gives you just pure joy. And so, it allows you and I for the record, I don't watch a lot of news and TV like I used to. This is where a lot of fear comes from, you'd like they don't know how to tell you no good news, it could be something amazing happening. And they refuse to tell you because you didn't get the ratings. [inaudible 40:37] had to shut all that off and spend more time with my wife. I pick and choose what we watch and what we see. And I get a lot of inspiration from my wife and my kids. And I've been more productive this season. And I have been in my entire career. And there's the stuff that I'm ready to release soon, me and my partner, we have a TV network that we just launched. And it's on Apple, Roku, all of that stuff, firestick we did a deal. I've been trying to get my cartoon on other networks. I'm like, let's do that. And we did a two-year deal with a dope company called 360 Wise TV. And you can get it all over the app is amazing. And it's like so bad on the show is launching. But I also have a show called worship [inaudible 41:22] live launching. And it's kind of like a new Bobby Jones-type experience. And there are so many things. And we've got other shows, and we're launching, I couldn't have done this though. Pre pandemic didn't have time. So, if you feed into the noise in the news, it'll discourage you and make you think the world is going to end. But if you are a person that serves God, you know that their seasons? it's going to pass. Question is, what are you sowing in the season? 

And they said, Jacob, so he sold in the time of famine, and he had more crop in that time than most people ever had. Because he did it in faith. And I think what you do in faith in this season, I promise you when this thing opened up, you're going to see more millionaires and I believe there's a wealth transfer happening for the kingdom of God, that's going to be incredible. If you take heed to what God is saying in the season, you're going to win. I can't tell you what I see for the next 10 years. But the Lord gave me a glimpse of it and I'm like, the elections that not so scaring me, none of. Don't bother me. It would have initially if I had not centered myself. But now I'm like, God has given me so much faith and hope like, stick with me your house is built on a rock you good. Is, like he just said, the recentering the ability for the church and individuals in the church’s kingdom, people in the kingdom to step back and say, there are so many verses where Jesus says, not only will I shake Earth, I'll shake heaven. That house on the rock thing. We've seen it in Scripture over and over. I'm speaking obviously, to the creatives out there that just had a call today with one of my best friends who are she's an amazing writer. She's out in Texas now. We were just talking about how so many even the multimillionaires are not sure what to do the people that we always look up all the tech giants and everybody else all those things, those you mentioned that like you know, we make them into idols, we make success into an idol. And so, all these people that we counted on, well, I just need to follow this guru or this guru or this person or even some of these pastors, some people that we consider to, unfortunately, we put them up on a pedestal, right? And then they don't have the answer. And then we look back, wait a minute, I had the answer all along. We have a Bible that told us that in this world you have tribulation but don't be afraid of overcoming the world. He's like we already told us. 

Allen C. Paul: I love the fact again, I'm speaking to creatives and taking the musicians, people who, again, I always try to go back to say, what does that person need to hear from you? And I think you're just a part of it, which is a step back. Use what God already put in your head. Use that prayer time use that recentering time to keep being creative because you're doing more now than you ever have before with all your gifts and talents. But I want to ask you also about this because I always like to think about Okay, you got to this moment where you could say you got your family you got your beautiful time where you kind of seeing what God has moved you, but always want to say, what was the low point? I always like to ask you, because I know some again, someone's listening. And they're like, okay, that's all-good Parris I get it, you are reconnected with God. You've got awesome things happening. I always want to say there's a mountaintop, but there was also a valley. So, if someone is listening right now is like, okay, that's not my story. Can you give them something where you have to also overcome that valley moment so that they can see that they can reach a place where you reach right now?

Parris Bowens: Yes, sir. Well, for me to reconnect with God, that means I had to be disconnected. And it this year this was like, this year was a catalyst to gear so for me throughout all this stuff that the stories, one of my main issues were pornography. Another one was depression, major, anger, bitterness, these are things that I struggled with, throughout my entire journey with Tye, these are the things I will deal with in those seasons, part of the reason why I was such a loner, and I dealt with a lot of regards, I got introduced to pornography, very young, you know back in the days, when was magazines, you find your uncle's magazines or something like that, and you see something useful to see, and you just can't unsee what you saw, and therefore you want to see more. And so that was a struggle that I've had for about 20, almost 30 years, I turned 40 this year. So, what happened was, I got to a very dark place last year. Everybody's talking about mental health and all that stuff. And I believe that there's a thing. But ultimately, because I'm a believer in Christ, I know that these are spirits that you're dealing with and so, as a Christian, you don't want to believe you deal with these things. You don't want to admit to it, the black community will do a lot of talking about these things. I believe some friends have gone on; I've had a friend who passed away because of suicide. I'm dealing with these things. And he was crying out for a long time, but none of us was listening, the white pay attention. And so, I was kind of coming into that place. I got to a point where I got so frustrated with the church. And I always get it I was against example, like crazy last year. Popeye's, remember when Popeyes had that surge within sandwiches? It didn't make sense to me, why is everybody tripping about this chicken sandwich? And I'll never forget hearing about it. And I'll never forget, after church, I've tried to go buy one and the line was coming over on the block and you couldn't get one by time, you got to the window oh we don't get any more. So, the next day, you won't come back earlier, you found out other people still had the same idea. And you just couldn't get the sandwich, you finally got the sandwich. I enjoyed it. It was not as good as I thought it was what everybody I made it to be. The point that I'm making this I felt that way about church like I'm coming to church. But the thing that I'm coming to get is not here.

I've got that I've been struggling with diabetes since 2012. And I've suffered for it. Number one, when I was diagnosed, I was wrongly diagnosed. It's now typed two; I was type one. So, for four years, I'm taking the wrong medicines and going back and forth to the ICU, and they beat me up. Why don't you do what you're supposed to do I'm like, I changed my diet, I'm doing this. And the medicines weren't working. Because my pancreas is completely dead. I would take it so I find a doctor ketch says you type one. You didn't cause this; this is a genetic thing. But you just had an occasion. And that occasion for me as I went through a lot of bitterness, I was going through a lot of anger and stress and bitterness at the time, the industry had led me down and I was highly frustrated. My son was born, the youngest one that was trying to come in premature back to school to secure my son, take him on life support, he's going have a good quality of life. So, all of the stress, and then he had to have three brain surgeries in his first-year of growth. And I felt my body change and that's when diabetes kicked in. From there, my life has not been the same. I've suffered things. My eyes are very bad. Just all types of stuff that came from it. So, I got to a point where you going up and you ask them for prayer and healing and nothing changes. In my Lord. I didn't cause this. So why do I have it? And I'm going to, it's like, constantly coming to the house of God, Where's this annoying thing. And so, I felt death a lot last year, I could feel like a spirit hanging off my back. I could feel like a wake up some mornings I feel like I was going die I didn't know if I was going live. And I got to a point where on top of the year, December coming to January, I remember just saying to myself, you know what, man? I'm done with this whole thing. I'm done with this walk with Christ. It doesn't work. 

There's no power, no anointing. It seems like everybody who is in any other kind of way they have success being sick or ill they're living it up.  I've turned out offers to do certain jobs because of my integrity and I'm watching everybody who doesn't have any ounce of integrity, they just prospering but I'm suffering. So, I decided in my heart. I'm walking away from this thing. And walking away from the faith, I'm good completely. And I felt the Holy Spirit at that moment. Put it like this, like a hand on my chest. Let me know, you do this, you're not going to make it back. And I'm saying to myself, you'll never be afforded the luxury of being the prodigal son. You won't get the chance to go and live it out and then come back. To do this. This is spiritual death. And I felt like a man at the edge of a cliff right before I was about to jump off. And It's like I felt the wind in my face from the world. It was it was crazy. And it scared me to my I mean to my court and I fell and repentant before the Lord cried out. I said, No, God, I just needed your presence. You and your voice and I were missing you are like everything was just, everything we were doing in church we just coasted. We're not going deep in you. There's no anointing, there's no power, nobody's being healed. My son, He's nine years old but he can't walk. He got cerebral palsy. Where is your power? At that moment I repented and came back to myself, the LORD begins to at that point, start speaking to me. And this is right before everything happened with COVID. Because I came to that moment and place, I think, had he not arrested my attention at that moment. I don't know what would have happened to me during COVID. I don't know that I would have not been out in the streets writing and acting crazy. But then at that point, the Lord starts to recenter my focus, this something I just learned this year, and I've been a follower of Christ for about 20 years. I've been in church all my life. Well, I remember going to the answer, give my heart to the Lord, about 20 years ago when I was about 18. But I learned that you can be a follower of Christ and not be converted. It's possible to be a follower of Christ, and not be converted. And well, the reason why scripturally I found that when Peter, a Jesus at the theater, he said when you were converted, stressing your brothers and he told us to Peter, Peter was what would you mean? He's not going to use it for three years; you saw all these miracle signs and wonders. Do you mean to tell me that man was not converted? No, he was a follower, but he wasn't converted. And Peter after he denied Christ, then he encountered after he was converted. 

But I found out I was falling God all these years, but I hadn't experienced a real conversion. I had become a new creature. And what happened was Palm Sunday when COVID got announced, we got shut down. I fell into an almost dark depression. And I'm like, God, it just felt like the end of the world. Oh, my God, they sport, they're shutting down music tours. I never thought I would see it. In my hope just completely just went dark. And I remember, Palm Sunday, we knew we not going to do Easter like waiting what It's the biggest time for church? Never in my life thought I would see that. And when Palm Sunday came everybody's we had the service virtual service and I was depressed after the service. Like this is crap. I just went into a dark moment. And one of my best friends. He went live on Instagram and he was preaching but I was listening to him cause I trust his spirit. After he finished preaching, I didn't care about the preaching side. I was over it. It was so much it was more his spirit. After you finish preaching. He said any you all got any good shows to watch it's Sunday night? And he said if you haven't checked out the Chosen, and I was like, The Chosen, he was like, is to show us a serialized show about Jesus say what I say documentary he said no, is like something that's on HBO. He said the quality is there. He said, they made a real Jewish man, BG wasn't like just a regular white guy who, l was grabbing for straws. So, I said, I need to check it out. And he sent me that I went to the app. And I watched the first episode, and I could, every time I talk about this, I get emotional. If you see the show, you understand what I'm talking about. But the whole shows the whole episode. I'm like, Where's Jesus? He wasn't on the whole. He wasn't in the show. And I didn't know that the show was about the people who were following me it was more about the people's perspective of Jesus, who will call by Jesus. And so, you're watching. You're watching Simon. You're watching Mary. You're watching Matthew, and you're watching Nick edemas. But I'm like, Where's Jesus? So, it gets to a point at the end of the show. The woman who played Mary was going by a different name. She had mad demons. It was so well-done music, everything and I'm waiting like When we will get to Jesus, the show was good. But I'm like, Where's Jesus, it gets to the end of the show. 

And she finally gets to a point where she's done. She wants to drink she by the go drink, drinks this demon out, she tried. And Jesus shows up, touches her hand, and tells her that's not for you. And so, when Jesus shows up, her demons get riled up, she goes running out of the bar. And as she's running out of the bar, slow mode, Jesus follows her out of the bar. And while she's running, he calls her name, but the whole show they've been calling her Lilith. He calls her, he says, Mary, and when she hears her name, she stops. And she turns around, and he says, Mary of Magdala. And when he called her name, he said, I called you by name. When I heard him call her name, I didn't hear her name, I heard Paris. Well, and at that moment, she turned around, and he came to her and grabbed her. He pulled her and hugged her. And you saw her delivers happened right there. And at that very moment, my deliverance happens. Depression fell the anger stuff that I had been struggling with my entire life. I sat there and cried. And at that moment, I became a new creature. Something different happened to me. I didn't know what was going on. The episode went off after he hugged her, and I was on the ground in tears, as if he had called my name. And something broke me and when I say from that moment from Palm Sunday, I was not under I have not been in depression, something I've struggled with my entire life almost. And then shortly after that, he delivered me from pornography. And I have struggled with that for 28 years. 

And I'm telling you it just changed everything. And my life has been complete, the Lord just reintroduced me to my purpose to who I was into. And I just begin, instead of me running support, instead of me running to entertainment. I begin to make him my secret. Where I would spend time in those places, I was spending it with him and the Lord started teaching me, I start right I've been writing books out he got me right. He has been pouring into me the things that he used to deliver me he's like now and give back to the church. So, when you hear me go online, you can be precise in saying certain things after that shortly push George for you the whole thing happened with him, right? It just was a stern uproar. And a lot of people wanted to know how I felt about everything. Now like I said, before that moment, had you caught me I probably been out there crazy riding going crazy. He will ask me how I feel about that I was mortified man to see that video just completely crushed me to see another human being that's another human being. But I wasn't angry like, I would have probably had been, I was sadder and I saw from God's perspective, one of his children killed another one his children. And I was like the Lord start changing my view. Why wasn't looking at things from the ground up, but I'm looking at everything from heaven down. And my compassion hurt, not just for black people. But for the white people. He changed my whole capacity to love in a way that to forgive in a way that I could not do in my strength before. And from that place, the way you hear me speaking now, I've always been a man of faith. But conversion is different. At some points, I was doing things among strip, but now it's not in my strip is by His Spirit that I'm living and it's completely changed everything. And so that was a very dark place for me like this depression and pornography and anger and bitterness and even my marriage. This is the best ship my wife and I set Sunday for 16 years in September. And you've been married for a certain amount of time. You all know how to fight well.

Allen C. Paul: You're preaching to the choir. I'm hitting on a 24 I think next month. We know how to draw the battle lines and when to go to our corners and when the Bell's going to ring it's learning how to fight the right way. I guess you could say cause you're going to fight. I want to go back before you talk about anything else cause I just heard your whole testimony, two things that popped into my head again, I just go off the cuff here. And I love you as a brother because now you're speaking to me. We got to talk after this and just get-go before the Lord. Because we are peas in a pod in this situation and what we deal with as men, as Christian men, as fathers as people, and again, I'm so glad you started from the very beginning. We start talking about it, that it's we look for this in the church and we're not bashing the church, by the way, anybody's listening. We have people listening from all walks of life and all kinds of faces. We're not bashing Christianity. I think one of the things that we get in trouble with as musicians and as people in the church use those quotes, is that we become so dependent on the culture that we missed out on Christ, we missed the culture of the church is a different animal, then the actual person that we are worshiping and so what you're saying, I remember you're talking about when the pandemic happened, and we couldn't go to church, we couldn't go in. So now the culture that we depended on for all of this self-identity is gone. So, who are you when you can't play the amen? Who are you? I think a lot of us, not just you, me, a lot of us creatives, musicians, any walk of life where people are like, are used to that. We found out who we are. Because God's like, the temple, I don't want to go here. Because I don't want to get in trouble. All my three lenses are like, leave it alone. But I'm just saying when the temple is gone. 

When you can't get in? Well, how can we sing when in a strange land, right? So that's what I heard in my spirit when you were talking about that. And then the ability for us to admit and go to that place where we have nothing God is broken us down. And I've been there, trust me, there are so many times I've been crying in that car. I don't want to even go there. Because I'm again, this is the podcast, I want people to see your heart, I hope to hear my heart hope they hear at the heart of men that are willing to face the darkest parts. And then God is still there with the light. God is still there with that light in the darkness. And so, if you're listening to this, let's just say right now, number one, we're praying for you, Parris, we may have to close this out with a prayer. I don't ever do this on the podcast. But I feel like already is moving in that direction. But we need to let these people know that is listening to men and women, that there's light at the end of that tunnel. And the only reason you're in that tunnels because you're walking in the right direction, you think you're lost I but you are going to wore, the light and it just and the enemy's only job is to try to keep you from walking forward. That's all he's trying to do. And for you to see that movie. The other thing that popped in my head might add some shooting off or for you to have someone who created a movie, same thing, put together the actors and did all that and walked out in faith and created a movie that was your pathway for God to speak. If any creative thinks that is done that what you're doing is not important. They need to rewind that part. Because that movie was what God used.

Parris Bowens: I was blown away. I watch that show every week, it's eight episodes working on a season two.

Allen C. Paul: I want to go find it because I've had a friend of mine told me now, I have to watch it. Now I don't watch it.

Parris Bowens: I'll say this to go back. For the record. Even when I was going through my dark season. I had an amazing pastor. My pastor is incredible. I'm my pastor, my church is incredible. They're some of the most sensitive people. But that's still sometimes when you're going through some things. Even people who do mean well who are genuine, who are the real deal. They're not my Savior. And sometimes we put more faith in the preacher in the pastor than we do in Jesus. I think what Jesus wanted me to do was I had always now one of the biggest issues in my life is I always made an idol out of my leaders. I made out of my dad, Tye, Israel, what happens you make an idol out of these men and they disappoint you because they're men. What happens is then you think is all God Oh, this whole thing and working. And God wanted me to get past that. So, my pastor [inaudible 1:03:56] Finn is incredible. Such a good friend you talk about someone who sits and listens when I go to talk to him and prayed. So, they were praying for me. And I do believe that these prayers that were going up were part of what helped break me. But even though you could have people around you praying for you to be the dark place. You still got to find Jesus in it. And it was the Lord himself that was like, your passes, not going to do it. Your wife isn’t going to do it. Your friend isn’t going do it. It's going to be me. And when I got to deliver it, it was like doing a lockdown in my home. Inhabit the altar at church, like I thought it should happen. It didn't happen in front. Some apostles, some Bishop, it didn't happen. It was directly from the Lord. And it was crazy like you said from a movie. The whole show I'm like, where is Jesus? And then he shows up at the end. The last three minutes of his show. He shows up, and it was so powerful and potent. And the funny thing is, I go back and watch the episode. I'm like, maybe it was just me that first time I was vulnerable and emotional. Maybe It only happened then. Every time I watched that thing, I bought it like a baby. Every time I watch it, it takes me back to the moment. I was like, oh my God, Lord, whoever did the show had the Holy Ghost. So, and then I went on to watch the rest of the show and experience more breakthroughs as I watched the show, the whole eight episodes, blew my mind. So, for the record, my pastor, I have an amazing church. My pastor is amazing. And I believe because I wasn't in the right environment in terms of the church. God was still a spare me I can probably wait a week off left if I wouldn't care.

He was shielding you that's what I feel like. It's like, we're going through it. But we don't know what's on the outside of what it got to us. Have we not been in this empty shield? Exactly, of those prayers and things of that going on around you? This has been so amazing. I don't know how long we may go for two hours if I'm not careful I had to watch this clock. And do a part two, but really quick, you've mentioned it. I love you so much man, very few people dare to be as vulnerable on a public forum like this as you are. So, thank you, number one. Number two, I never like to finish in the valley because obviously, we go back to the mountaintop. So, you give me a valley. Now give me one of those mountain tops. I couldn't believe I got here. It could be any tour, it can be any experience any musical thing, it doesn't have to be musical. But just tell me one of those moments where God kind of puts you at the mountain at the top of your head, like, you know, praise God, I had no idea that was possible. I know, there's got to be dozens, hundreds. But just give me one so that people can hear again, how things turn around so quickly, and you can like to save one moment. You saw how much it could be blessed at that time.

Well, again, where I come from, kind of at least didn't expect to be in this industry like this. I thought I was going to be doing Disney and the animation for it. I'm doing music got kind of interrupted that. But the top of this year was a highlight a major highlight. About September last year, I was with Kira I was in Detroit working on this album that's out now. And I remember being in my hotel room and I get a DM from Nord on my Instagram. And Nord is basically like, Hey, we love your videos, we love what you post, we would like to invite you to play 2020 now. And I'm like, excuse me. Now. I've been in this career for a long time. 20 years with a lot of people, but I've never done any endorsement type thing of that nature. I think I try one time to roll into something but I never cared much for that type of stuff. It wasn't a big thing for me like I like playing so I like getting an endorsement means you're going to be stuck with one instrument.

 So, I've never really chased the endorsement thing. People always wonder why they would see me over time like okay when it was that motif and Triton season, I was on that. When I got with Israel it became all Rowling's because that's what the band was using. But what happened was when I got with Anthony Hamilton when I was a predict predominant Ox, Oregon guy, so they needed me to have an Oregon we try we had a rolling BK seven Oregon, that was not my favorite. So, nobody like that sounds I remember going to the store and I found my Nord electro for [inaudible 1:08:38] and they had a nice organ engine and just sounded authentic. So of course, when I bought it. I love posting with it wasn't thinking anything about it, I posted on Instagram all the time. So, I had no idea. No, it was even didn't care. So, they inbox me and say complete 2020, we went through the whole particulars and doing my set. And I never forget I'm hearing that when I was with Kira. I was like, wow. When I finally discussed with Nora people. You would think okay, they're endorsing me because of all of my credentials and what I've done at that time, I wasn't on no tours. I wasn't on any major gigs. I was just at my church. So, I'm not in a tour wave season. I'm not in a visible, I'm not on no real particular records anything of that nature that's pushing me out front. They simply wanted me for me, for they saw on Instagram, and they found out later on that oh my god, you got a crazy resume. I never forget getting to [inaudible 1:09:46]. And you know if you've ever been in [inaudible 1:09:49], that's crazy. It's like 150,000 people throughout that whole situation are huge. 

Every musician you can think of from around the world. Famous not famous just there, so I never forget getting to [inaudible 1:10:06]. On the first day and you walk up to the booth. Nora had a nice big booth, and they always have a really big booth. But this time, they had a nice size booth. And you see the huge banner, and to see my name up there. I'm used to working with artists where I walk up and list their names on a banner. And you walk up and I just had tears like, Lord, it's not what people think it is for me. I'm a kid that comes from a small neighborhood. I've been molested, bullied, robbed, I've been through so many things that should have taken me out. And the fact that the Lord would honor me, and allow me to sit up there and play the music that mattered to me, that was my that was nobody else's. It wasn't my name behind someone else's name. And then not only that, he gave me favor with the company. Now my other keyboard interview everybody like you got mad notes. I've never seen about with that many notes. I got like three or four notes. But it's not about the endorsement. To me, it was about God, saying, Parris. This is not about Tye, Israel, Anthony Hamilton. This is you; this is for you. And it was like for me I can tell other people if you are somebody who comes from where I come from. I even told the people that know it. When I got here to do my show. I grabbed the mic. I said, for those of you guys who don't think you could ever be up here, I'm a testimony for you that you can be. I'm not supposed to be up here. I flunked theory; I can't read music. What am I doing here? I want to create a performing arts high school for visual arts. And I do in my career is more successful than most people who went to school for music. So, I'm like, this is a God thing. And I testified about that. I said, if you have faith and you believe in God, all things are possible. It'd be possible. And so, this is this has nothing to do with the endorsement. It has anything to do with what God is keeping his promise to me. Parris, I see you, I got you. I can take you places you never thought you can go. And in that place, I met so many people make so many more relationships, that we're not trying to get me to do another artist thing they like for you this Parris you. We want you I'm like God, I don't even like being upfront. I'm even like attention. But God will still he will put you in places you don't think you deserve to be in if you trust him if you have faith. I've had other stories of highs and been a part of Grammy Award-winning records and things of that nature. But to me, this one was more valuable because this wasn't somebody else's name on the marquee. This was my name. The Bible says God will make your name great. And I'm It's not that I made my name. Great. He made my name. And I believe that he has that in store for you guys as well.

Allen C. Paul: So beautiful and the verse again, I told you that I feel the spirit all over this podcast. And again, I'm very I hate to say it I'm very careful. Because I know how deep this can go. And I don't want anybody to get like I didn't know was attending church what else but that's what it is right? Without saying it. That's what we're doing. We're imparting deliverance and freedom just by you sharing your story. And the verse that pops in my head was immediately it was that he the basis the Prophet gives grace to the humble and he exalts to humble and the humility that you've shown again by being so transparent, sharing your story and then number two, and the way you served, and all those other capacities under Tye with Israel and everything. You've never made it about you. And let's just be honest, let's just point out for a second it's always good to be caught up put the Counterpoint there are a lot of musicians that make it about them. And maybe that's why they're struggling because why can I get on there and maybe it's because instead of you making it about you, you made it about God and about your people you're serving. And I'm just putting that cap on. That's what I see. I see God-exalting you. Because you are always about exalting him and serving others rather than exalting yourself like that in all the history I've read and now knowing you feeling like you're my brother just because I get us talking without talking through Instagram and stuff. I sensitive and more than ever so, I have never done it before. As we close out, can you just say a prayer for any of those musicians that are facing What you were facing what you've overcome shows this is the first again this is the first guys anybody listens to his podcast, we did 80 something episodes with Spirit-led people?  I'm not saying any of those people didn't have spirit. But this particular episode is the first time if you don't mind. Let's just say something to God, for these people who are listening right now.

Parris Bowens: Absolutely. Father, we call you father because you are our father. You didn't leave us you're not impersonal God, you are very personal. You love us. You know, each one of us individually, you know those who I don't know, I'm speaking to God. And you know what the need is God, you know where their hearts are that I honor would have magnified. Because you are an amazing father, you're an amazing King, you are good. Jesus said, there's nothing good for you. And so, we lean on the good father. And I asked God that the way you found me and my dark place, the way you rescued me when I was about to walk off a cliff, and I was about to make a bad decision, to walk away from you. You put your hand on my chest, and you stop me. And I ask that anybody's at the end of themselves, God, that you would rescue them that you would stop and that you would speak to their hearts. And that you will continue to let them know how you feel about them. How much you love them, what sacrifice you made for them, and that they're more than what they think they are, that they're greater than they think they are, they may be forgotten, they may be left out. They may be the least in their circle. But the Bible you said, Lord, the greatest in the kingdom of God is the one who's the servant of all, if they will just go back to that place. And they were served. And I remember you that their service is not on demand but unto you, That God that you would favor them, that you will give them grace, that you will prosper them, that you would exalt them. In due time you say that to at first not to be weary in well doing for in due season we shall reap if we think not, and Lord, you know that the presence of things that we that we're going through is not worth anything compared to the glory that shall not just be revealed around us but in us. So, lean your trust you got to restore the faith. I pray that this interview helped them to be more restored, that they've got good encouragement from it, that they're not the only ones that listen, there's somebody out there who's been through some stuff, and made it through. If you are in a dark tunnel right now, keep walking, do not stop do not give up. You're going to find the light. You're going to find it as long as you do not quit. And I think you've got that you heard our prayers you always hear my prayer not thank you for doing this for me all we have as a friend. For them God in Jesus name I pray, amen. 

Allen C. Paul: Amen. Wow, brother. I don't want to get John and Roman any more credit because he's listening right now. He's going to be like it was on me.

Parris Bowens: No John no.

Allen C. Paul: Both say a man of faith himself. I love him to death. But again, just Thank you, Brother, I cannot thank you enough. This cannot be the last time we have way too much to talk about and so much more revelation things again, both music and spiritual, that you again, and the reason why I knew this was a good connection from the beginning is because of what you just shared. And just, I pray that God will continue to double the blessing on your life because of everything you're sharing. And I hope you're going come back and do it again on this forum and because of your family that's all I can say.

Parris Bowens: I love it, Thank you. I just appreciate your heart. And what you're doing, when I first heard about what you were doing, I was like, thank god somebody is doing it. 

Allen C. Paul: Like you said I didn't feel worthy did it scared still doing the scared. But God's given me grace and people around me that are blessing me like you. So, thanks again, brother. This has been amazing. 

Parris Bowens: My pleasure.

Allen C. Paul: My friend, I cannot tell you how much this meant to me. I can tell you that. We've never as I said in the interview. We've never really created a space for a moment like that, that you just heard. But it was a God thing. And I don't apologize for it at all. I believe that this was exactly what you needed to hear in faith, no matter when you're listening to this, that this reached you at the right time. And you heard what you needed to hear Parris shared so much about the history of what he went through and how he became the man and the musician he is today. But more importantly, I think this is all about moving forward. What this is going to do for you moving forward and what you can do in your creative life and your life around the people that are in your influence your sphere of influence, who can you impact with this kind of teaching this kind of knowledge, this kind of perspective, if you do the inner work and work on yourself and make sure that your faith and your creativity and your life and your testimony are all linked together. And just dig deep and find that place where you know that you're doing what you're called to do. I believe you can be just as influential as Parris has been both in my life and the life of so many other people around him. And so, with that, make sure you follow everything Parris is doing his links are in the show notes for his website. His music and all the things he'll be doing in the future and social media that you can follow. Make sure you connect with him and stay connected with him. This is not the last time we'll have Parris, sharing in this community, but you got to stay connected with us to find out when that will be. So also make sure that you follow along with us on all socials as well. All those links, once again, are in the show notes. But there's nothing else I can add to this. We're recording this at the end of 2020. So, we may be not seeing you or hearing from you for the next couple of weeks, maybe you're going to be taking vacations or spending time with family. So, I wish you a Merry Christmas and a very Happy New Year in that case. But if you are going to be checking in, we're going to do a couple of episodes, short episodes just to close out the year and give you kind of like a recap of all the amazing stuff that we have learned from our community of artists, creatives and faith-focused freelancers. But no matter what continues to become creative, you were created to be, keep pushing, keep striving. We're praying for you, we love you. And I want you to be next on the list of the people who are going to be celebrating success in 2021. Okay, so with that, have a great day be blessed. See you next episode.

Outro: Thanks for joining us here at the God and Gig show. Please leave us a review on iTunes, like our Facebook page, or visit godandgigs.com and tell us what you thought of this show. We'll be back soon. In the meantime, go create something amazing.