Feast of Freedom: How to Become a Debt-Free Creative w/ Jade Warshaw, Entrepreneur / Financial Coach

Allen C. Paul: Ladies and gentlemen, I am so honored. I have been pursuing this interview for a while because this young lady I shouldn’t say this one half of power couple one half of the power couple, , is really showing us, number one, how we can connect the dots between better financial life, better lifestyles and better health, better everything when it comes to just money eating like she’s got the full package. So jade warshaw of. More feast, less famine. Welcome to The Guiding Gig Show. How are you?

Jade Warshaw: I’m doing so well. Thank you for having me. And thank you for your patience. Like you said, we’ve been trying to get this date nailed down for a minute now, so I’m glad we’re finally here.

Allen C. Paul: Look, we are persistent. I think there’s going to be some persistence talk here about discipline and stick. Come on. When things don’t work out right, rainy day plans and things like that literally raining outside, that’s a perfect example. So, yes, this is really, again, , your energy. Again, I’ll do the quick how I know you as a people care, but, , we are both South Floridians. , you are an amazing entertainer and creative, , who also attends and works.

Jade Warshaw: Ah.

Allen C. Paul: I believe you are on staff at Church by the Glades.

Jade Warshaw: Yeah, I do I do a lot of contracting with them, and, , , I’m on staff partially to help with a lot of the creatives.

Allen C. Paul: So that’s where we connected. First, I got to see some of the seminars that you and your husband Sam put on with some amazing people that came. I’m like, this is right down the street.

Jade Warshaw: This is crazy.

Allen C. Paul: And then Jay Mills, of course, the Mr. J mills who has been on this podcast, the Amazing Connector. Why aren’t you over there? So I’m just realizing this amazing resource of you and your husband are right down the street here in Broward County, and I didn’t even know. Like, you guys were so amazing. So we have to connect virtually here. But yeah, again, I’m so glad we made that connection with all that personal stuff out the side. , please tell our audience, just a 32nd elevator pitch. If someone had to come to you and say, who is Jade? How would you let them know? Just kind of what you do in the synopsis and then we can jump right into some deeper topics.

Jade Warshaw: Okay. So I would tell them, I’m just a regular person. I’m an entertainer trying to fight their way to that steady income that we all wanted. Right. And, , I started out with a lot of debt, which a lot of us do early on. And, , with the right plan, we were able to pay off that debt. We were able to start our business and entertainment first for us, and then translate that to other people and grow that so that other people could get gigs full time. And, , that’s what we’re doing to this day. And right now, it’s my heart to just help people basically overcome some of the things that we overcame and, , create that healthy lifestyle around their work, that healthy lifestyle around their money, and obviously what they’re putting into their bodies and that sort of thing. So it’s just kind of all encompassing, really.

Allen C. Paul: Gosh, and you say all encompassing and then again, there’s so many places where immediately my Add brain wants to go to it’s like, okay, what do we talk about first? We talk about health, do we talk about finances? But you just said it. It’s all encompassing. Now, our audience and you said it yourself, you’re a creative. Um, let me ask you first in terms of just your artistic life, I get the stories of people that started when they were five years old and they knew they were going to be a star. And then there’s the people that were going into accounting, and then all of a sudden they make a left turn and they become like, the most brilliant dancer in the world. So which one is it for you? Were you always going to be a creative or was it something that kind of came know, out of the blue?

Jade Warshaw: It’s funny because at the time it felt like it was out of the blue, but when I look back, I go, oh, it was there all along. I just wasn’t maybe nurturing it. So it starts from I can think about being in first and second grade. My sister was in piano lessons and she was like, fine with it. I loved it. I would go to all of her lessons, I would go to all of her recitals. I would ask her to teach me all the songs that she was learning. And I didn’t even think anything of it. The first tape, that tape was Amy Grant. And then the second tape I ever got was Anita Baker. And the third tape I ever got was Mariah Carey. And I learned every song, every lick, everything on those tapes. And so now I think back and I go, man, that’s not normal. To do that as a kindergartner as a second grader, it’s not normal. But I think for a lot of people, it kind of came out of the blue, though, because in high school, that’s when I started joining show choir, and that’s when I wanted to be a part of the productions. And so when it was time to round about your junior year, you start talking about college and maybe what you might want to major in. And I had been an athlete up until that point, so everybody kind of expected athleticism to drive my choices. And it wasn’t until my junior year that I started going, you know what? No, I want to pursue singing. And so I did end up going to school on a volleyball scholarship. I went to Tennessee State University HBCU, but while I was there, I was in commercial music as my major. And the second year, my second year into playing volleyball, my volleyball scholarship, my vocal coach, he said jade because I was coming into my vocal lessons horse from yelling and screaming at the matches and doing all that stuff. He says, you’re going to have to make a choice. And I chose music. And everybody was like, where is the Jade that we know? Where is the athlete? What are you doing? They couldn’t understand it, but I was like, this is going to be my bread and butter. I don’t want to go overseas and play volleyball. I don’t want to put the strain on my body. It’s smarter for me. And this is truly where my extended gift lies. And I think that that’s something that only you’re going to know when it comes to music. People might tell you, look, , whether they tell you you’re amazing and you’re really not, or they tell you that you’re no good, but you know, you’ve got it. You’ve got to have the self awareness within you to know what the truth actually is for you.

Allen C. Paul: Wow, what a great, , number one, I’m stuck on the fact that you said my bread and butter. Number one little food reference. My bread and butter is yeah, right. But yeah, I’m always I’m so I’m sorry. I catch the most random things. Sometimes it’s great, sometimes it’s awful. Ask my wife. Um, but the fact that you said your bread and butter will be music, you considered that the more secure because they’re kind of aiming at finance here. That to you was a better decision financially, career wise, that fit for you. Meanwhile, most of us hear music. How are you going to make money? How are you going to make an income? Are you even going to be able to survive? Aren’t you going to be out on the street. So let me ask you, was there in your head, since you’re making that pivot to music, did you start to think of, , wait, how do I make money? How am I going to make a secure income long term in this business that usually people don’t think it’s so secure?

Jade Warshaw: I’ll be honest. In the beginning, I don’t even think I got that far mentally. I think I just knew I need to start walking down this path.

Allen C. Paul: Okay.

Jade Warshaw: I didn’t know where it would lead. The way I grew up, my dad always told us, you’re a leader. You’re going to be the best one. I mean, he would tell us, you’re going to be the most responsible person in the room. You’re going to be the leader in the room. People follow you. Like, he put that into our heads. So I think somewhere in the back of my mind, it was, well, whatever road I walk down, I’m going to have to lead, and I’m going to have to create. And people are going to they used to tell us, people are going to be drawn to you. People are drawn to you. And I kind of knew that. I didn’t know what the path would be, but just a little sidebar. Parents, whatever you tell your kids, they believe, period. Um, what’s good or bad, they’ll believe it. If you tell them enough, they believe it. And so that was in my brain of, okay, whatever I do, there’s going to be a level of responsiveness, , to it. Um, and it wasn’t until college, when it was getting time to graduate from that degree, that I really started thinking, okay, what can I do to make a living? And that’s when we get into Sam. My husband Sam is amazing. Um, he brought another piece of the puzzle that I didn’t yet have. And that was, he has this ability that you can make anything happen. He has this ability that, oh, okay, we’re just going to do that. You want to do that? We’ll just do it. And so that was a piece of the puzzle that I was missing. He had a lot of open mindedness to ideas, especially musical ideas that I didn’t yet have. And so I think the two pieces that we both brought was like, okay, you bring this, we bring this. That’s unstoppable. Like, we’re going to go. And so it just so happened that we got married one week after we graduated from college. And it just so happened that we went on a cruise for our honeymoon, and we saw I don’t know if you’ve ever been on a cruise, but there’s so much entertainment out there. We see the shows, we see everything. And it was like a light bulb. Like, okay, we can do this. This is a place for us to start. I can get my feet wet, because up until that point, honestly, I had not had a lot of exposure and a lot of opportunities musically other than the typical stuff through your school and through your but I wasn’t gigging around town and doing all of this and all of that and rubbing elbows with people. I had no resume. You know what I’m saying? Sam did, but I didn’t. He had had those opportunities with Liza Minnelli and Natalie Cole. You need to have Sam on your show because he can tell you some crazy stories.

Allen C. Paul: Next time we have both of you.

Jade Warshaw: Yeah. And so that was where we got our feet. What we started in cruises and thought, okay, this is a good place to start, and it’s just the rest is history.

Allen C. Paul: Wow. Okay. So I love, again, that you brought the partnership of your husband having the two skill sets right, your skill set and his skill set, both musically and now sounds like business became a key component of both your relationship and how you’re going to make it for it. So I do want to kind of jump ahead a little because there’s this number that’s in my head, I don’t want to give it away. There’s a number that I saw on your website that now that you’re married, now that clearly you’re dealing with finances and issues with everybody says the number one issue in your marriage is going to be money. And that’s why 50% of divorces or whatever the stat is, right? So now you’re married. And now in my head, I’m thinking, where is the struggle? When did it hit you that, okay, we’ve got a business, we’re starting this entertainment lifestyle, but there’s something else that’s albatross that’s hanging around our neck. So when did that start to come in and how did you even start to approach it?

Jade Warshaw: Alan, there was a monster in the closet, bro, and let me tell you. Okay, so we were living in Nashville when we got married. Um, when we first started working on our first cruise contract, royal Caribbean. So we go out, we do this contract, everything’s good. Um, and when we came back from that contract, we were like, hey, we’re living in Nashville. It doesn’t really make sense we should move down to Florida. That’s where all the ships and stuff are.

Allen C. Paul: Yeah.

Jade Warshaw: So it was round about the time that we started the moving process that I really you know how it is. You’re going through your things, you’re going through your finances, because you need to know, can you afford to move? What type of apartment can you afford? Once you like it just brings up finances. And we had talked a little bit about things before, but now it was time to have the real deal conversation. I knew that he had student loans. He knew that I had some student loans. Um, I had gone to college on a full ride, but as many of us did, , the financial aid person suggested I take out student loans to live on. So by the time I got done, I had $34,000 of student loans just from literally buying groceries, buying clothes throughout college. So I knew I had that. We had some little store credit cards. Sam had he was the typical person, right? They put their gas on a fuel card. They have a Guitar center credit card. Typical musician. You got your bank of America credit card for emergencies. That was typical. But I knew that he had a good amount of student loan debt, but we hadn’t talked about the number. And that was when true numbers started coming out. And by the end of it, in the beginning, he said, yeah, I think it’s somewhere around, like, 120. And it just goes to show this is a whole other conversation, but it just goes to show when you’re 18 and you take out student loans, you don’t know what you’re doing. Because, , my husband, he was a Florida boy who went to an out of state school. He went to, um, Berkeley, , in Boston. So, private school, high dollar. So a couple of things happened. He’s like, oh, yeah, that was like, 120 ish ish right. But then from there, he transferred down to Tennessee State University, another out of state school. He thought there’s a whole lot behind that, but long story short, was paying more than he realized for that. So in the end, he was thinking, oh, maybe they’re like, somewhere between 120 and 160. All right. It’s like, okay. , but what we didn’t understand, again, is interest rates. What’s the thing that we all do when we graduate? Oh, let me put it on deferment for a while because I’m not ready yet. We didn’t understand that that interest was still accruing. We didn’t know. And so by the end of really looking at this, and to be honest with you, we really didn’t understand our full numbers until we got to the end, because we went back and looked at where things started and where they ended up, how much interest accrued. But by the end of it, we had paid off $460,000 of debt. And the majority of that, vast majority of that was student loans, because the house that we sold and broke even on, that was only like, 110 of that. , and then we had a couple of cars. One was 34,000, the other was 15,000. And a couple of little credit cards, two and 3000. So the vast majority of that, over 250 of that was student loans. Just his. And then you add my 34 on top of that. So we’re almost $300,000 in student loan debt, talking with interest, everything.

Allen C. Paul: Oh, my gosh. Okay. I am getting, like, as musicians, okay? Number one, this is where I shut everybody else out on the podcast and on YouTube. And it’s like, okay, my turn. My turn for Jay to counsel me as a musician who has, again, got married early. Let’s just talk real, okay?

Jade Warshaw: Yeah.

Allen C. Paul: 23 years old, exact same thing. Got married, I was 22. My wife was 20. Exact same thing. Two kids and a house mortgage right out the gate.

Jade Warshaw: Mhm.

Allen C. Paul: And like you said, what were we doing now? And I was like, you I had the full ride. I didn’t thankfully, I didn’t have the student loans. But my wife, God bless her, had the exact same advice that you got. Oh, well, just put it on deferment. Oh, you don’t think about it. And so as musicians and creatives everywhere listening to this, and not just creatives, this is everybody, right? This is not just creative. This is just our audience, but this is everybody that hears this same spiel of good debt or just, , what you call, , , points. Just get the points or just do whatever. And we live on this credit lifestyle. So I got to ask you, where did the shift come? Like, if you saw this as your husband, and you guys are on what most, , creative sizes of the regular income, what changed? What allowed you to get out of that incredible hole that was hitting you in the face now that you realize what was happening?

Jade Warshaw: That’s a great question. And, um, I always wish that I had a better answer, but this is the God honest truth. I think that you have to be at a point where there’s no other choice in your mind. I think that it was so overwhelming in such a big number that we knew we couldn’t we literally knew, like, we can’t live like this. We can’t have any of the things that we want out of life. From a financial standpoint, if we don’t clear this up, it’s going to ruin our finances. It has the potential to ruin whether or not we can have a family talking about kids. It has the potential to put an unbearable strain on our marriage that could lead to big problems down the line. And I think coming to the reality of that, when your back is so far against the wall or you’re so far, , in that pit, you don’t have a choice but to go, okay, I’m either going to surrender and this is it, or I’m going to fight, fight my way out of this. And there’s just this thing that goes off in your mind that’s like, if I don’t have a choice, I have to fight. It’s like fight or flight mentality, right? And, um, I think that that’s naturally built into us as human beings. And I think because I was like a cockroach on my back, there was nothing else. It was like, oh my gosh. One of our student loan payments alone was over $1,000. Just one of them. Just one of them. And then the other one was something like $206. Mine was, um, 200 and something dollars. And then I had another one. It was too much money. It was too much money. And like you said, as musicians, we already knew, okay, there’s going to be seasons where we’re earning more, and there’s going to be seasons where we’re earning less. What happens in the seasons that we’re earning less? Like, how will we live? And so I remembered, um, that I had heard a guy on the radio, Dave Ramsey, and I remembered some of his principles. And I said to Sam, I was like, okay, once he told me the number of debt, to be honest with you, and he’ll tell you this too. I wasn’t mad. I wasn’t judging. I just was like, okay, we have to pay this off. And he was like, Bet. And that was it. There was no bones about it. We both got on the same page, and I thank God we both got on the same page almost instantly. And it was like, okay, what is our goal? Our goal is to pay this debt off, no matter what it takes, as quickly as possible. And so from there on, and I say this, I know there’s people listening. Maybe you don’t believe in God, maybe you don’t believe in Jesus, but let me tell you, if it hadn’t been for the Lord, there would be no because he controls everything. He controls everything. There’s a verse that I like that says, the heart of the King is in God’s hands, and he has the ability to shift it.

Allen C. Paul: My sister, my sister.

Jade Warshaw: Oh, Lord. , when it comes to anything, but specifically when it comes to music, you need favor. When it comes to money, you need favor. Now, there’s plenty of practical things that you can do, and I’ll tell you about all of that. But one thing my husband does, he prays for favor every single day. Every single day. And so when we started on this plan, I believe that God honors that. When you want to get your money in order, you want to do things to the best of your ability, god honors that. And so when we got on a budget, when we started saying, no matter what, if the work comes, even if it’s work I don’t love, I’m, , going to do it. Because we need to get this right. We need to get this money right for our future, for our kids. And as we started down that path, doors started opening. And I’m not going to lie to you, the first few years, it wasn’t a whole lot of doors. But as we continued on what do they say, Alan? Most people give up. They’re 90% there, and they didn’t even realize it, and they gave up. Now, when I look back, I go, oh, my God. Because we could have given up in, , 2013. It was so bleak, and we didn’t realize how close we were, because a couple of years later, that was when everything started blowing up. And you just have to start and you have to be consistent and keep going down that path. Keep asking God for his help, for his guidance. And, ah, you just can’t fail with God. You just can’t fail. You can’t.

Allen C. Paul: Okay, so the fact that you just give a master class and a sermon all in the same time and I’ve still got, like, 30 minutes to fill when I literally could have just shut the tape off right there. Um, okay, let’s talk about this because this is just amazing. Jade, again, the fact that you centered on faith, and I’m going to jump real quick to something Dr. Evan tony Evans said in a study that we’re doing, talking about motion. I mean, this is so much about faith and motion and momentum. Right. Dave Ramsay talks about that all the time, about the small baby steps because of momentum. That the human mind. We need to see something happening. And you said it yourself, I think God not to be preachy, but you said it yourself, we’re not waiting on God. God is waiting on us. Right. So you took the step to actually say, we are going to do this. And God honored that faith and the works that you did because you didn’t just say it, but you were about it. You were actually taking steps. So, yeah, now that you are now looking on the other side, you mentioned the practical, and I am thinking about our musician friends, our creative friends, just out of COVID friends, because they’re going to say the same thing that I said and same thing I’m saying now, being very transparent. This is just too big. You know what? If we don’t pay it all off, it’s okay if I don’t get this, because it’s just too big. And you’ve already said the mindset is the most important thing, right? So if the mindset is the most important thing, especially for us creators, what are some of the first couple of things you and Sam did? Like, the first thing, was it cut this thing? Was it grab more gigs? What did God start to show? Like, you mentioned doors that start to open, that you active. I just want to give them that breadcrumb of, like got it. The very first thing that you start to see, where you start to turn your finances around.

Jade Warshaw: Okay. So I always tell people, step zero. Like, before we even get to step one, step zero, I can’t make this decision for you. You got to decide for yourself. And this doesn’t even have anything to do with what you have or what you don’t, , know. You have to decide. I’m not going to create any more debt, period. This is before you make payments. This is before you make a budget. You just have to decide. I draw a line in the sand. I’m not creating any more debt. Because you cannot solve a problem while you’re simultaneously creating it. If debt is the problem. You cannot keep creating debt, or you’ll never get out. So we have to stop that. That’s ground zero.

Allen C. Paul: Do not pass go. Do not go.

Jade Warshaw: Do not pass go. Hard. Full stop. No more debt. Right? And then after that, what we started to do, the next step is we did create a budget, and I think a lot of people think a budget is just listing your expenses. No, a budget needs to encompass all of those financial goals. Yes. Your expenses, fixed expenses, and variable expenses. And we’ll talk about the difference. Fixed expenses are things that never change for the most part, like utilities. Like, your light bill is your light bill. You got to have it every month, right? Um, your water bill, you got to have it. Right? Those are things that are fixed expenses. Variable expenses are things like groceries, things that have the ability to change. If you don’t want to spend that much, you don’t have to groceries, spending money on your hair, um, things like that would be variable expenses. But you also want to make sure that your budget encompasses things that, um, are important to you and that are necessary, like savings, making sure your savings is in there. Um, anything that gives you a little bit of joy, whether that’s planning for a date night, things like that. You need to include everything that you can think of that you spend money on in your budget. You start with the amount of money that you actually make, and you start listing those things out with the amount, and you’re going to see really quick, do you have enough money to cover the lifestyle that you want and the lifestyle that you actually have right now? And if you start getting filling out those numbers, you’re like, oh, my goodness, I’m running out of money. Now you see, okay, this is why I have credit card debt, because I’m living this lifestyle based on these numbers. There’s not enough money here to cover it. That’s why I have $10,000 credit card debt, because I’m financing the rest of this lifestyle, right? So that’s when you realize, okay, step zero, right? Don’t create any more debt. I need to make sure my budget lines up with the money that I’m actually making. So it’s time to make cuts. You got to make those cuts. You know what I’m saying? And so that was the first thing, okay? Not creating any more debt. Step two, it’s time to cut. Start cutting that lifestyle, and then you realize, crap, all right, I can’t do all the things that I want to do. How can I need to make more money, right? So step three, let’s start looking at how we can increase our income, whether it’s doing more of what we’re already doing a gig. Okay. I need to take more gigs. Well, maybe you kind of are tapped out in that area. Okay. I need to create a. Second income stream. What else am I good at? A lot of people, they’ll pick up, and I know I’m going fast, but I want to make sure I get all this.

Allen C. Paul: No, you’re doing good. And I want them to rewind. I want them to rewind and make sure they get all of it.

Jade Warshaw: A lot of people will take, , up side gigs that they don’t really care about. Like, okay, I’ll do Instacart. I’ll drive Uber. I don’t really have a passion for it. I’m just trying to make extra money. There’s a time for that. Yes. But I think that we will do ourselves a greater service if we pick up side hustles in an area that we’re already passionate about and we already have a level of talent in, because that means that there’s the potential later on that it could truly become a business for us. Does that make sense?

Allen C. Paul: It makes total sense. And, , go ahead, because I have a little piece that I want to make sure that we touch on, because that’s a huge thing about that with the creative side hustle and what we do that we don’t realize that we do.

Jade Warshaw: Mhm. And that’s true. Alan. As creatives, we have each person listening. We have that little thing that we know how to do. And it doesn’t have to be maybe it’s in art, maybe it’s not. Maybe you’re good at organization, maybe you’re good at cooking. I was good at cooking, so I started selling cupcakes and cakes, and I would take that money and throw it towards our debt. And it didn’t turn into my number one business, but there for a while, I had a little baking business. Obviously. Now we’re here. We are. I started with money because I love money. It’s a space I’m passionate about. And why am I going to give my money and time to Uber when I can give my money and time and intention to me? And I can truly serve a need that I care about. So I think that we can have a little bit more thoughtfulness when it comes to the side hustles that we choose. Um, so getting your income up through your main line of income or through side hustle is so important. And then the fourth thing we did is we use the debt snowball method. And maybe some people have heard that most people hear about two main, , methods to pay off debt debt snowball and debt avalanche. We use the debt snowball method because of what you said, momentum and motivation. With the debt snowball method, let’s say you have five debts. You start with the smallest debt. The interest rate doesn’t matter. You just want the smallest debt. Maybe it’s a little medical bill for $700, right? Then you’ve got up here, you’ve got a credit card for $1,000, then a student loan for $5,000, right? And then up here your car for $34,000. Right? You start with the smallest debt, and you pay minimum payments on everything, right? Because we don’t want to ruin your credit. We don’t want to not do what we said we’re going to do. We need to pay the people that we owe, right? So we’re doing minimum payments to keep that integrity. But any and all extra money that we have, we’re throwing it to this little debt until it’s gone. Because what do you get when you pay off that little debt? Suddenly, it’s like, oh, my gosh, why did I keep this hanging around for so long? It’s gone. And you feel good. You feel momentum, and then that makes you go, okay, now I can take all the money that I was paying to this one, and I can start throwing it at this one. And so you get some momentum there. And then when this one is gone, I can take all this money that I was paying on these two, throw it on the next one, and before you know it, you’ve got that momentum, you’ve got a snowball of a lot of money each month going to your debt. And that’s literally how we did it. All we did was try to figure out how we can make the snowball of money that we were throwing at our debt bigger.

Allen C. Paul: , so good. And the fact is that you did it again. The reason that we are alluding to Dave Ramsay, which is the baby step method, is that I think a lot of creatives, we do get ahead of ourselves. And I love the fact that you mentioned about the side hustles, like, okay, well, I just need to start doing Uber. I need to start delivering pizzas. And that feels so beneath us. It shouldn’t be, but it feels like it’s not. And the main reason that you just said because we’re not passionate about it, but if we are willing to say, okay, the reason I stopped you is because obviously with your platform, more fees, less famine, and my platform guiding gigs, these are both, at the beginning, not money making ventures. They are not like, oh, I’m going to pay up all my debt by doing podcasts. But you start to see, wait a minute. Like you said, number one, you’re getting your expenses under control. Number two, you’re saying, my time and my knowledge is valuable. And of course, creatively speaking, our, , entertainment and our talent is valuable. And you start becoming more intentional. That’s the word I’m looking for. You become more intentional about using it so that it’s not just, oh, well, I just want to do stuff to do stuff. Every time I get on a mic or I get in front of something, I’m looking for, what’s in it for me? What’s going to be? How is this going to get from A to B, to get this particular thing off my back or be more of a business owner? That just fires me up, because, um, by the way, I’m going to do a quick aside. This is, again, nerdy stuff for all the finance people. Have you heard of Profit First? The book Profit First?

Jade Warshaw: I have not. Oh, my gosh. Okay.

Allen C. Paul: Don’t go there, Alan. Okay, please go look at Profit First, because it’s basically a bookend to raid Dave Ramsay’s. But for business owners, it has revolutionized my business because basically, I am a Profit First by Mike Mcalowitz. Don’t try to spell it. Just look up. Profit first. Um, it revolutionized my business, and I’ll tell you why. Because I am a prodigal ah. Son of Dave. For years, having not ever gotten really through the steps, what helped me to finally start do what you said, which is actually be intentional and take the money and actually put where it belongs, is Mike Mccallowitz does Profit First, where he takes the first two to 3% and allocates it to Profit off the top. He says that because of what you just said, momentum. Once I see that every time I make a dollar, I’m going to at least get two cent of that to profit, period. And I get to play with that. Whenever I finally get a chance to play with it, it changes my mindset. And again, he says the second thing he says after that is, every other dime, go straight to debt. Pay off your debt. Pay off your debt. But he’s like, take a little bit that Profit First to remind you that at the end of the rainbow, there’s something for you. And I think a lot of us get caught up in that hole, oh, my gosh, we’ll be paying, and we don’t see the end result.

Jade Warshaw: Yeah. And that’s a good point. Alan, you said two things that kind of brought up thoughts to me. One is, with all of this, when it comes to debt, when it comes to all of this, speed is our friend. Right. We don’t want to be walking through this for six, , seven, eight, nine years.

Allen C. Paul: No, it feels like it feels yeah. That’s when like you said, when you start to give up.

Jade Warshaw: Yeah. For Sam and I, it took us seven years. Most people don’t have the kind of debt that we had. I mean, a lot of the studies I see, most people are able if they if they really get intense about it, most people are able to pay off their debt within 36, 48 months. Right. Um, and you said something that I thought, man, I got to speak to this. As musicians, as creatives, we want to show a certain type of facade sometimes. I made it. , I don’t struggle with money because gigs I got a call from. I was on tour with Enrique Glaciers, and I was on tour with and we like to talk. Don’t get me wrong. If it’s true, it’s true. But I think a lot of times in music, especially at the level that a lot of us are on, which is we’re trying to break through, right? We’re at a level maybe we’re making steady money, but we’re not Beyonce yet. We’re not JayZ yet. , we’re not the game yet. You know what I’m saying? We’re trying to get there or we have our goals or whatever. , we’ve got to be real with each other about our struggles, too, because if everybody’s acting like they got it together, if everybody’s acting like they got all the money in the world, everybody’s acting like, I don’t need who are we helping? Who are we helping? Let me tell you, some of my best friends are musicians. And it is so good sometimes, like 4 July or whatever, when you’re all hanging out to just hear, bro, I got to get more gigs, or they only paid me $200 for that thing, I got to get them up to $250. Just like, talking real. Talk so that other people can know, okay? It’s not just me. , okay. Because the way I hear other people talking, you all are talking like you just made two K off of that. I only made we need to talk for real so that people know, okay, this is normal. That’s normal. It is normal to struggle with debt. It is normal to struggle with consistency. It is normal to be frustrated because your spouse is here and you’re here. Talk real. Be transparent. Because not being transparent is not helping anybody. It’s not helping you. It’s not helping your peers. And one of the things that Sam and I have found is once we started just talking real and being, , real, I remember it was, like, not only a way off of us, but it opened up conversations that was like, oh, I remember the first time being out with friends, and they were like, oh, we should do such and such and such. And we were like, oh, it’s not on the budget. And they were like, did you just say no because it’s not on your budget? Yeah, like, we trying to pay our debt off. What? You’re trying to pay your debt off? Yeah, bro, we’ve got, like, stupid amounts of student loan debt. We got paid off, and it changed. Like, oh, ah, we can talk about that conversation.

Allen C. Paul: Yeah. Oh, gosh, there’s so much good stuff here. I want to say, number one, your point about musicians and hiding behind the facade? Oh, I just got on tour. I just had to put it because, again, I’m the homeboy local musician guy that doesn’t like playing strange or automobiles. Um, , but the amount of people that come off with tours that I’ve heard from different people that have done these big tours that come off and say, I’m coming home with nothing, I just played in Madison Square Garden, and either I spent it all or it’s already spent. Because, like you said, allocated to whatever that I had to pay. I’m not coming home with any of that that went to this and all those big checks and looking at you. So that’s a huge thing. Number one, to our audience who sees Instagram fame and all this stuff and followers and think that equates to real wealth. Like, no, clearly that is real.

Jade Warshaw: People who will talk real to you.

Allen C. Paul: Yeah. And get away from that whole, oh, I’ve got this many followers and this many gigs. That means that I must be doing well. So I have this facade. You said, that is so good. That’s worth the price of admission. And then the second thing I wanted to get to is you just talked about it, the honesty and the conversation, number one, between you and your husband. Number two, between different creatives when it comes to creativity, , and finances and stuff like that. And just how do we actually deal with life? Because that’s why I want to get to the lifestyle part that you also deal with, because clearly you found a passion for food and finance, which is so interesting. Like, when I saw your brand, I was like, that is brilliant. And why didn’t anybody else think of that? Okay, now, once again, I’m going to put myself in the equation, which I don’t belong, but my wife is a cook, a foodie. She’s literally getting ready for Easter dinner right now. She has got the whole thing. We, , have Jamaican, Puerto Rican household. Yeah.

Jade Warshaw: You know, the food is about to be busted.

Allen C. Paul: Look, I tell her all the time, like, there’s only so many stomachs. We don’t have all the stomachs. And, , you are clearly trying to get all the stomachs, and we don’t have them all. So tell me, how did you then because you mentioned the whole side hustle. How did even you get the idea of, now, I’ve paid off this amazing amount of debt. My husband and I have really taken control of our finances. But like you said, I want to have conversations. I want to help more people, and I want to connect it with this parent love of food and cooking. How did it even come to pass?

Jade Warshaw: So I’ll kill a couple of birds with 1 st here. So when we were on our debt free journey, um, like I said, Sam, he had that mind, more of the entrepreneurial mind. So, of course, we were working on ships, and we thought, okay, when we’re working on ships, we are part of, like, the cast and whatever, but there’s a ceiling of how much you can make. So this all birthed out of the idea of continuing to take the next step, whatever that is, and not feeling like, okay, I’m done. Right?

Allen C. Paul: Yeah.

Jade Warshaw: So we’re working in the cast that had a ceiling to it. So we said we need to figure out how to become headliners, because if we’re headliners, we can work way more and get paid at a higher level. So we figured it out how to do that. I can talk to anybody who wants to know about that, figured out how to become headliners. Then we thought, okay, there’s even a ceiling to that. As one person, you can only make so much money. So we said, let’s duplicate ourselves. Let’s start a talent agency. We can have other entertainers go out to work. We can take a commission. Perfect. Start doing that. So that’s starting to do well. And it’s like, okay, now we’re at some place that feels a little bit more limitless, right? Because you can make your agency as big as you want. You can keep bringing people on. You can keep bringing on recruiters. So getting to a place where you’re not within feelable limits, if that makes sense. And so we got to that point in entertainment where we wanted to be and where we’re still growing. Then I said, okay, I’m a person who I’m like, you need, like, streams, baby. Let’s make streams of income. So what’s another part of me that I can explore? Well, 2020 hit, right? We’re all inside. No one’s doing music. And it’s that birthplace, right? Necessity is the mother of invention. So you’re sitting there and you’re like, what else can I do? And at, , that point, I remember thinking, oh, my God, I am so glad that we took the time to get our finances in order when we did, because if we hadn’t, we would have been homeless on the street. Like, literally, we would have had to move in with our parents if we had not done that work. And I thought, people need to hear this message. Like, I have a story that I can tell, and I can help people with this. So that’s when I started more Feastless famine. And that idea came out of two places when I was a kid, no matter what, my mom made dinner every night, she made dinner. You know what I’m talking about. You’re talking about the Easter dinner my mom cooked. And no matter what the family was going through, we sat down at the table and we ate dinner. And that’s something that is deep in my heart. I care for that. And likewise, when Sam and I were going through our debt free journey, we had cut out so many of the little luxuries in life in order to throw that money at our debt that I, , made it a point when we sit down at the table at night, the food is going to be good. It’s going to feel like a reward, and it’s going to feel like I worked hard, I did my all. But I’m going to sit here and I’m going to eat this good food. I’m going to enjoy it. And we’re going to talk and continue to talk about our day, continue to talk about our goals, what we plan to do next over this meal. And so that’s how this all came from. More feastless, famine. And I called it that because what do they tell us in music? It’s feast and famine.

Allen C. Paul: Yeah.

Jade Warshaw: You’ll have times where you make all this money, and then you’ll have times where you make no money. You’re a starving artist. And it made sense to me. Like, there’s a correlation there, and then there’s so many tie ins. But the other tie in is that muscle, Alan, that we use to have discipline with our body, that we have discipline with our diets, with our exercise. It’s the same muscle, it’s the same discipline when it comes to our money. It’s that idea of, , I’m not going to sacrifice what I want most for what I want now. I’ve got to be able to put that cupcake down because I told myself I wanted to eat less sugar. And so I need to see the bigger goal instead of the smaller picture. And it’s the same thing with money. I said that it’s important for me that my kids don’t go into debt for college. So I’ve got to make sure, instead of using this money to buy a Gucci belt, I’m going to go invest this money in my kids 529 so they can go to college and not have the same college debt that I had. It’s that same muscle, right? And so more feast, less famine. That’s how it came about. I told you I started with Dave Ramsay and those principles, but I know a lot of people he says it himself. His name is a cuss word to a lot of people, you know what I’m saying? And I thought, I can package a lot of these same principles that worked for me in a way that people might not recognize it as Dave. They’ll recognize it as, okay, this is Jade telling us this, and if Jade did it, I can do that. You know what I mean? Because sometimes it’s like when you’re a kid, your mom can tell you all day, don’t do it, don’t do it, don’t do it, right? And then your buddy says abroad, don’t do it, and you don’t do it. You know what I’m saying?

Allen C. Paul: And then your mom is like, I’ve.

Jade Warshaw: Been trying to tell you, right? These are money principles that you’ve heard before, right? But now it’s your buddy telling you. Now it’s your girl telling you, hey, this is what you have to do. And suddenly, hopefully, you’ll take it and go, okay, if she did it, she’s a woman like me. She’s black like me. She’s an entertainer like me. , she’s got kids like me. Um, she was in debt like me. And suddenly, hopefully, you can go, okay, it’s not a gimmick. It’s not just to make a sale. She really did it. This is a real thing.

Allen C. Paul: That’s what I’m hoping for. No, it’s such a beautiful again, all encompassing vision for, number one, what you want to share, but then for somebody else to take that vision. Right? Let’s go biblically. Without vision, the people perish, right?

Jade Warshaw: Okay.

Allen C. Paul: So if you have a vision for your life and you’ve seen that, hey, I can be an entertainer. Number one, I didn’t want to gloss over the fact that you just talked about becoming an owner in the entertainment industry. Stepping out of just being in front of people, taking that, being on the stage and then walking behind the stage and being the mover and the shaker. Yes. We need a master class. I’ll ask you back to God and 60 our membership, you’ve got to do a master class on that. Because those are the people because people who pay pay attention. So I want the people who actually get that information to actually look, let’s just be real, right. We’re talking about finances. The reason that I know that you are in this position and my position now is because we paid the price, literally, for the information that got you beyond where you are today, where you were back then. So, yeah.

Jade Warshaw: Allen, you’re willing to serve it. That’s the thing. At some point, we have to serve.

Allen C. Paul: Yeah.

Jade Warshaw: We have to be willing to give free game. We have to be willing to take people alongside and show them. And I think I just have to say it. I think sometimes in our culture, we want to hide information because we’re afraid that if somebody else gets it, they might supersede us or they might take an opportunity from us. And as, , Christian people, as people, as black people, as people of color, we cannot be afraid of that. We have to share the knowledge that we’re given. Yes, sometimes it will be out of price, but sometimes we have to be willing to serve it for free. Because we need all of us to win and all of us win. If we’re keeping our contacts a secret, we’re keeping the secret recipe a secret all the time. It’s like, no, who did you talk to?

Allen C. Paul: Yeah, the openness, , you just talked about even when in terms of the finances and stuff like that, the taboo things. Same thing with the taboo of being connections. , and I appreciate you redirecting that, and I totally get what you mean, because this is service, even what we’re doing now, and creating these platforms where you have this instagram free information. But I think better to my point, I love the fact that we’re on this. This is good. Um, I think one of the reasons why I did immediately go to people who pay attention is because some people think it’s going to be so easy. All I have to do is show up. All I have to do is, oh, tell me, how do I get on? And then you tell them how to get on. And then you don’t get on. Because do the work that you just told them to do for free. And so I think it’s a dovetail, right? So we’re serving, and then sometimes we do have to tell people, like, no seed, no harvest. So we give them the download, we give them the free stuff, and we give them say, I’m serving you. I’m giving you everything I can. But you have to go out and do the work. And at some point, you have to put your money literally.

Jade Warshaw: Literally.

Allen C. Paul: This is so great, Jade. I could do this forever, all right? Because again, I could do for free. And then sometimes we actually get paid for it, which is amazing.

Jade Warshaw: I know, right? And that’s the other thing, Alan. That’s so true. Somebody told me they’re like, if you start out with the intent to help and to serve, the money is going to come. You’re going to sell the memberships, you’re going to sell the workbooks, you’re going to sell the course, you’re going to sell, , the tickets. Right. But it starts with, how can I create the best product that’s going to help people in the best way or move them in the best way? Like, I remember when we were spending more time on stage. My goal every time before I’d walk out on stage, I’d pray. I’d say, God, I pray somebody feels something today for the first time, because we can go through life not feeling, but whatever that goal is. God, I pray that whoever listens to this podcast, if they were on the fence, I pray they would m move. They would make the change to actually move today. And when you go in to your work, whether it’s your main job, your side hustle with a true want for people first. Yeah, you’re going to sell. The money is going to come. The subscriptions are going to come. And you should, like you said, profit first. Right. We trying to make money.

Allen C. Paul: Yeah. You got to take care of your own house so you can serve others.

Jade Warshaw: We try to make money, and there’s nothing wrong with that. Um, but there’s just that other added layer that’s like, okay, this is genuine. Like, this person really, they’re making money, but they also they genuinely want to serve, you know? And this is apparent even with what you’re doing here, so oh, thank you.

Allen C. Paul: And no, it is absolutely apparent. And I love again, these are the conversations I get that could have all day long. And, um, you and Sam, we’re going to get Sam back. We’ve got to get Sam’s perspective. We got to do the Marriage Married to the Music episode I’ve been talking about doing it for. We’re up 160 now. I still haven’t done a married couple, two married couples. Where my wife? Oh, Lord. And getting her on the podcast. Oh, my gosh. She’s done two episodes in the last two, five years. , and so this would be the third. If I can get all four of us in the same room, that would be amazing. I want to quickly get because, again, we have to open the door to this conversation even more than we can do tonight or today. But what I want to give you the chance to share is, , a couple of words just to the person who literally is where you were, because you’ve seen it. You stared at the bill. You’ve seen when your husband said 120 ish, which to me ish is like, okay, the ish turned out to be another 75% more than that. Just for a second, from your heart. You’ve already been sharing from your heart this entire time. And you’re so genuine, so authentic, and, um, so brilliant intelligent in terms of how you’re putting this together for families and for creators like us. So just tell them really quick what you felt and what you feel they can now feel, because, like you said it, you’d never felt it before.

Jade Warshaw: Yeah.

Allen C. Paul: Now just tell them, if you are where you used to be, what would you say to that same person who is where you are right now, who is where you were?

Jade Warshaw: M, from a couple of standpoints on the practical tip, mhm. You have to always tell yourself, the time is going to pass, regardless. Seven years is going to pass. Eight years is going to pass. Ten years is going to pass. So you have to ask yourself, am I going to wake up in ten years and still be here? Am I going to wake up in five years and still be right here? Or am I going to make the choice to start and really become intentional? Um, and just say, I’m going to make the effort. I don’t know where I’m going to end up, but I’m going to start. And then you’re going to look up, and in five years, you’re going to go, oh, thank God I started, because back here, I had $200,000 of debt, and now I only have $50,000 of debt. You will make progress. Make no mistake of it. You will make the progress. You may not believe this, but I believe that you will conquer it, because I know that the steps work. You don’t know that yet, because you’re right there in the pit, and you’re seeing the drama of it. But I know that you will overcome it, because I see it. I see it day after day. I saw it with my own life. You will overcome it. Um, you just need to follow a proven plan. I always tell people you need three P’s. This is very important. You need the right people. You need the right people supporting you, people who know the vision for your life, people who believe for you. I can be one of those people. I see it. I see the road to debt freedom. I see the road to financial freedom for. Each person I talk to. So you need that first p. Get the right people. You need purpose. By purpose, I mean, , a why if you don’t have a why deep within you of, , why I need to do this, why I need to get free. You’re not going to make it. So you need to spend time going, Why? Is it for my legacy? Is it for my kids? Is it for my marriage? Is it for me? Why? Is it because I believe this is what God wants for me? And then three, you need a proven plan. You need a plan. So the plan that I teach is a proven plan. I know that it works. Get those three p’s going, and I promise you, not only will you see, um, movement, and not only will you see improvement, but you will conquer. So that’s number one. And number two. Again, you may not believe this, but I believe this. God wants this for you. He wants freedom for everybody in every way that freedom can be obtained, whether it’s relational freedom, spiritual freedom, financial freedom, , cultural freedom. He wants everybody free. So if you pair with God and say, god, I need financial freedom, I have not managed my finances well. I have made mistakes. A forgive me because I didn’t know. Now I know. Help me. That is a number one. And walking through a journey, knowing, god wants this for me. God wants this for me. He wants me to be free, and I’m going to do everything I can in my power to make that happen. ,  people used to say I know this is an old phrase. They’d say, work like it all depends on you, and pray like it all depends on God. So I’m working as though no one’s going to help me, no one’s going to come to my aid, and I’m praying as though God is the only one who can make this work. Right? I’m doing those two things simultaneously. I’m telling you right now, you can’t be stopped. You can’t be stopped.

Allen C. Paul: Look again, I am charged up right now. I am ready to remember that I am more than conquerors, um, through Christ who loves us. I mean, that’s the verse that’s just ringing in my head. That doesn’t matter what’s come against you. Of course, the verse talks about death and power to sword, and then, of course, nowadays, it’s American Express, Visa, , Banks, whatever is coming up against you, you could be more than a conqueror.

Jade Warshaw: And that’s just empty in every direction, aren’t they?

Allen C. Paul: Yeah.

Jade Warshaw: After pay.

Allen C. Paul: Oh, my gosh. Don’t even get started with the micro payments. Oh, my gosh. Okay. Please tell them now that you’ve given them this smorgasboard look at my once again, I’m just with the culinary references today. Look what you’ve done to me, Jake. So now that you’re giving them this buffet of amazing inspiration, please remind them. I know some people are old school. Even though these will all be in the show notes and the links, if you’re looking either on YouTube or on your app, all you got to do is tap something. But tell them please, in person, how do they reach you and stay connected with you guys?

Jade Warshaw: Please find me on Instagram. Um, I am on there every day. I check my DMs, and I am always going to be putting content that’s showing you step by step what to do. I want you to click the link in my bio because I want you to get my workbook small by step financial freedom. It’s so interactive. It’s so easy to use. It’s not a lot of reading, right? You’re getting the idea, and then it’s action. It’s plugging in numbers. It’s really seeing what you need to do. Um, and for a lot of people, that’s like, okay, now I understand. Now I know what I’m doing. My money is organized. I’m able to budget from here. I’m able to start saving for my emergencies. I’m m able to invest. This is all in the workbook. Okay? And then you can also schedule one on one time with me. If you felt connected to what I was saying, let’s talk. Like, let’s schedule a one on one. I will personally help you with your budget because I care about this stuff, right? So that’s what I say. Find me on Instagram. Obviously, my website. Um, morpheaselessfamine.com. Um, instagram is at morpheathless famine. And I’m here. I’m a real person. It’s not just a handle. So I’ll be there for you.

Allen C. Paul: Gosh. I’m telling you again, I want to sign up right away, , and get more knowledge and more inspiration from you in this financial world that, again, impacts our whole life. It is not just, like you said, not just about the money, not just all about the Benjamins baby. Yes. Sorry about that reference. It is all about our lifestyle, really living as God wants us to live, like you said, in total freedom, financial freedom, spiritual freedom, and creative freedom. Because if you have no debts, you can just go do cool stuff like you do with Warshaw Entertainment and Sam and just go do cool things is such an amazing, amazing life that we could look forward to. Jade this has been one of the best, , hours of my life at this point. I want to do it again very soon. But until then, God bless you. Thank you so much for sharing with The Guiding Gig Show.

Jade Warshaw: Mhm. Bye.