310. The Secret to Lasting Change: Transform Your Subconscious Mind - Krishna Avalon

 [00:00:00] and welcome to the Meditation Conversation, the podcast to support your spiritual revolution. I'm your host, Kara Goodwin, and today I'm joined by Krishna Avalon. Krishna is a licensed acupuncturist, certified holistic health coach, psych K facilitator, pranayama breathwork guide and somatic practitioner who's guided over 26,000 patients and clients. To achieve their life and wellness goals for more than 20 years. She helps clients to become their best and most empowered versions of themselves through a simple process of transforming the subconscious mind. Her work has currently expanded into. Subconscious [00:01:00] transformation coaching, which helps clients make changes they wouldn't have been able to make through talk therapy or other styles of coaching that only work with the conscious mind. 

Krishna gives great insights on healing in this episode. She works directly with the subconscious to clear out old programming and to help people to step into a new reality. We get into some really interesting territory here, including getting some welcome insights about muscle testing and using a pendulum. I've never really been able to use either of those tools very reliably. So I was really happy to explore that a little bit. This is another one of those episodes that I hope is helping you to see that when it comes to healing. There's so many facets and options beyond what we focus on in the mainstream here on earth. I hope you're empowering yourself on your own journey to explore things that don't require a prescription or years of dedicated therapy and including some less traditional approaches [00:02:00] in your healing mix. And before we dive into today's episode, I've got something truly special to share with you, our stress sleep issues, or anxiety holding you back. Well, I've discovered a game changer. That's about to transform your life. Let me introduce moon bird, your personal breathing coach. Picture this sweet little companion in your hand, guiding you through rejuvenating breathing exercises, moon bird turns meditation from abstract to accessible making calm breaths, a seamless part of your daily routine. Shaped like an avocado moon bird. 

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Kara Goodwin: So welcome Krishna. I'm so excited to be with you today.

Krishna Avalon: Thank you so much. 

Kara Goodwin: I am very curious about the subconscious element to your work. Can we start by talking, can you talk to us a little bit just about the difference between the conscious and the subconscious

mind? 

Krishna Avalon: I love that. I am obsessed with the subconscious basically, ever since I started learning about it. But the subconscious is where we hold our programs. Right. So it's 97% of where we create our lives from. So if we were to compare [00:04:00] ourselves to computers, which I don't love to do, but that's what my teachers do, they say, you know, we're all programmed.

So which programs are you running in that 97% of your mind? Where we hold our habits, our beliefs, our memories, our autopilot, our feedback loops. So for all running programs, . Which programs are we running and how contracted or limited or self-sabotaging are they? And for most people, they're pretty contracted just based on what we are, taught through society, parenting, peers, media, and so we'll try to talk ourselves into something with the conscious mind that is maybe responsible for three to 5% of how we create life.

But I. It's a lot harder and it takes a lot longer to make changes when you're just trying to do things or rule the world with your conscious mind. So the conscious mind is like the keyboard [00:05:00] feeding information into the deep subconscious, which is 97% of how we create lives.

Kara Goodwin: I love that. And you're so right. I mean, I completely agree with the programming and like you, it is a little bit like squeamish to think of, compare ourselves to, to, computers. But what's amazing when we start thinking about the subconscious mind to me is that. There are things that we just take for granted that we think is just how things are or how life works, or what reality is like because that subconscious programming is so sneaky and it's such a part of who we are that we can just take it for granted That. We think that's how it is so we can be telling ourselves these self-sabotage was the example that you gave. But the, we can be telling ourselves this story for years and years about who we are or who other people are or what, how the world works. And we don't even [00:06:00] maybe see it as a belief system.

We just think it's. What it is or that it's just fact or whatever. And so it's really empowering to then be able to even just understand oh, there is part of me that is beyond my conscious awareness, beyond my choice, my conscious choice that is contributing to how I see the world, or how I, how I see myself and so forth. So it's really

Krishna Avalon: It's fascinating and there are different ways to work with your subconscious. So the subconscious is like a very trending . Topic or word right now, but most people don't have the tools to work with it. the process that I was trained in is very simple, and unlike other processes, which didn't necessarily work for me, you get to create a new perception.

Perception. So just to your point, it's what lens are you seeing life from? What is your experience? And in this kind of work, we can create a different belief so that we have a different perception [00:07:00] and a different experience.

Kara Goodwin: Hmm. Now, would this type of, self work be appropriate for everybody? Or is there a certain type of person that's, that would benefit from working with subconscious reprogramming or however we wanna call it, more so than

Krishna Avalon: Yeah, and that's such a great question and . Like my favorite people to work with are the people who have been in talk therapy for such a long time, but they're still triggered. They're still stuck, they're still repeating the same patterns, and it's because you're just conscious mind processing and that work, and you're perpetuating the same stories often over and over because you're just talking about this stuff.

and you're not having that tool to be able to peacefully UNT attach and move on. You don't have the neuroplasticity tool with conscious mind processing to have a new experience. And so I would say that this work is for [00:08:00] anybody who does feel stuck in the past or stuck in a feedback loop or a stress they can't let go of, whether that's from the past right now or in the future.

I. And then for people who do love to grow, they don't understand why other people can create life in a certain way and they haven't been able to. It's because they're contracted in those beliefs, usually around self-worth or deserving. Whether it's deserving of healthy relationships, money being inspired, trusting ourselves, feeling safe to be seen, like those are some of the big foundation ones.

That I get to work with people. I get to help people expand their self-worth and deservingness around those things so that it's so much easier to create life than from that way. And then there are other things you can do habit wise to reinforce your new expanded belief and perception. [00:09:00] But I wouldn't say

It is just I've been an acupuncturist forever too. It's not like acupuncturist for everyone. I think that subconscious expansion or transformation, yes, could be for everyone, but not everybody's ready to change and not everybody's ready to have a new experience. Some people, they're just gonna stay in their familiar comfort zone because that's what's safe, even if it's not healthy, even if it's not true.

I am obsessed with this work and I love it, but I would say that it's more for the people that are like, they're just ready to grow and move on and be an empowered creator of their life.

Kara Goodwin: I love that. So how is this different to traditional talk

therapy? 

Krishna Avalon: So the process that I was trained in, we can talk as much or as little as we like, right. and then we do balances for the subconscious mind. And the whole goal of the balance is to get into [00:10:00] what's called a whole brain state. And so that's when the left and the right hemispheres of your brain are communicating clearly.

And it's very simple. There are different ways to get there, depending on the balance, but it's from this stuff called brain gym. And you're conscious the whole time. It's not like hypnotherapy where we're getting into the subconscious through a, like a trance-like state. No, it's very simple. And you're conscious.

And then we're using that depending on your goal. Are we trying to peacefully unattach from a stressor trauma so that you can move on, so that you can look at that stressor trauma and be like, oh yeah, that's super shitty that happened, but also I'm not triggered, I'm not panicking, I'm not avoiding, like I can just look at it and be like, oh yeah, that sucked, but now I can move on.

Or . There are other balances, but the other main balance I use is a goal statement balance, which is for creating that lens or that perception that we wanna have. So you can imagine that creating a goal statement of, I trust myself, or I feel safe [00:11:00] to be seen, or I'm worthy of support court and being held, or, I'm worthy of healthy relationships, or my boundaries are crystal clear.

Like that, that stuff changes people's lives. In a really simple and subtle, but often just super powerful way. Often, it's just very powerful when you're just out in the world and all of a sudden your boundaries are clear and you don't have guilt for saying no . It's a pretty big difference in a lot of people's lives, whereas talk therapy does save people's lives for sure.

But from what I understand and what I've seen since pandemic, everybody wants to talk therapists seemingly. , they're hard to find. They're expensive. Sometimes it's not even that helpful. Or people, again, are still stuck, triggered, anxious, angry, avoidant. And so while it saves lives, eventually people do need to like have other tools to be able to move on and that's what I find and that's what [00:12:00] I hear from all of the people who come to me is that exact thing.

Like they're in talk therapy and yet . They're still on prescriptions, they're still super anxious. They're still triggered by like everything, and it's not a judgment, it's just what I'm seeing. Come to me. I was trying to find a somatic practitioner for my teenager. It was, it took me months of reaching out

to therapists and her sliding scale therapist, who was great, but he's like this white guy, straight out of college, and his sliding scale was like $250.

for 40 minutes.

And so to me, because I've been a practitioner forever, because I usually have a lesson come through for myself that I need to work through in the shadow and then embody and integrate, and then without a fail ever, it's exactly what starts showing up in my clinic or my practice, is people who are trying to move through that shadow or lessen themselves.

[00:13:00] That's what people need. Just this simple way to do the heavy lifting and deep digging in the subconscious, and then you can use other things to reinforce this new perception that you have, and then that would just take so much longer trying to work with a conscious mind, and it might not even happen.

Kara Goodwin: Yeah. I love so many points that you made, one of them being the whole brain, integration and but what you just said about how things will show up for you and then ultimately that is applicable to, how you need to help people. And it's as you were talking about that whole bla whole brain integration. I was, I thought back to, two days ago. when, because this will happen to me too. Sometimes it's on the podcast, sometimes it's in my work with people as individuals, but where something will show up for me and then it's like, oh my God, that is exactly relevant to what just happened. But [00:14:00] my finger, my index finger. Was, has the last few days just been kind of moving on its own and not all the time, but it's like an involuntary reaction where it'll just flutter a little bit. And two nights ago when I was starting to fall asleep, I was in, was just intuitively focusing on both hemispheres of my brain and having them both be active at the same time. And. there was something within me that was like, because my finger wouldn't stop moving, and it was like, get both of your, both sides of your brain working together and see what happens. And when I could hold that, it stopped completely. And it's something that like, because I was in that very relaxed state going into the theta state going, it was like my, it was the only thing that I could con needed to concentrate on at that moment. And I was like, oh, I wonder how easy I'll be [00:15:00] able to do this tomorrow on the fly if this starts happening again. And it was harder because, you know, if I'm just going about my day and I'm doing other things, it's harder for me to really tune in and be like, okay, now my whole brain is, is working together.

There's balance and wholeness in there. but it was fascinating because it was like, if anytime I could get into that state, my finger would completely stop And, now here it is where you're talking about the importance of that whole brain and how it can help us overcome everything, emotionally and, and trauma and everything that we're trying to work through, but in, and my experience was even physical, even with physical things that whole brain, Working together is so helpful. So do you use, I'm wondering, 'cause you mentioned Brain

Jim, 

Krishna Avalon: it's a book and that's where, 

Kara Goodwin: oh, it's 

Krishna Avalon: it's

a book and I forget the author's name, , but the site K process is a combination of a [00:16:00] couple of things, and one of them doing, they, it does include exercises that get into that whole brain state and they come from brain gym, but then we also use muscle testing.

There are some balances that are like kind of energy work related in your higher self. So it just depends on the balance we're doing, but mostly it's muscle testing and then the whole brain state process, and then we muscle test again to make sure there's been a shift.

Kara Goodwin: And do you have? I love muscle testing and I feel like I'm not great at it. I feel like my intellect gets, or my own like conscious desires get in the way and I'm sure that's something that people deal with all the time. So are there any suggestions that you have in terms of effective. Effective muscle testing that we can trust a

little bit better 

Krishna Avalon: love asking that. No, I love that so much because, many years ago, somebody [00:17:00] did it to me, I think it was a naturopath checking supplements, which is often how many people have experienced muscle testing. But in psych K we're 

Track 1: taught 

Krishna Avalon: that we're doing it together. And so yeah, our body's relaxed. Our chin is parallel to the ground and the eyes are looking down.

And make sure you're hydrated. So we're never necessarily, we're not testing wrong, but we might be testing inaccurately. So when I learned this and then I was like, oh, this is actually accurate. 'cause you can't lie to the muscles and you can't lie to the subconscious. And so that's what blows people's mind.

When I am in person doing, I can do these sessions virtually or in person, but in person, when I'm muscle testing, I'm pressing on a person's arm. While their body's relaxed, chin, parallel, eyes looking down. And what blows their minds is that like they're trying so hard to have a response and they cannot, because it's the muscles and the [00:18:00] subconscious, which you cannot lie to.

So it's pretty cool.

And then when it's virtual, I'm just asking to muscle test on someone's behalf like a surrogate, 

Kara Goodwin: Mm-hmm. 

Krishna Avalon: not like channeling your energy or anything like that. It's just super simple, super clear.

Kara Goodwin: And are there things that, like a person, if they're, if they want to learn to muscle test themselves, are there, is it just like what you said, where you relax and look down and, you know, shift your eyes down and keep your chin parallel to the floor?

Krishna Avalon: sometimes people will test inaccurately, I've noticed if they haven't drank enough water, and so if they're testing like weak, for instance, which would be no to their own name. Which doesn't usually happen, then I'll just have them take a drink of water and then we'll muscle test again. And then they're strong, which is, yes, my name is Christian.

And then you're testing strong. sometimes if people come up and they're just like, so caffeinated. One of my clients yesterday had a ton of coffee. [00:19:00] She wasn't testing inaccurately, but I did have to have her drink water a couple times. So it could be like too excitable, but mostly it's really accurate.

Kara Goodwin: Mm 

Krishna Avalon: And it's so weird and hard to trust sometimes because it's so simple. Like even for me, I have a very skeptical like mind. And so it took me a while to be like, is this really, that's all we had to do to expand this incredibly contracted limiting belief about myself that I've had all my life and has been incredibly self-sabotaging, but it has repeatedly worked for myself and for others, and even knowing

Absolutely 100% intuitively that I wanted to train in this process. And it was already changing my life through the trainings. I still wanted to offer that transformation, a stress balance to probably 15 of my patients just to see what would happen. Because I'd been an acupuncturist already for 20 years and it was like this thing I could do with a blindfold, like really well.

And it was just this well [00:20:00] oiled track, right? And I just had to have more proof. And then the.

The feedback that I was getting without even asking was so incredible that I was like, oh, okay, now I can trust it all the way

Kara Goodwin: Oh

yeah. 

Krishna Avalon: I mean the muscle testing just as basic, 'cause we start with that to establish a clear communication with the subconscious mind to get that clear.

Yes. And know. And when people can't, they cannot control the yes and the no. 'cause we're talking to the subconscious. They're like, what?

Kara Goodwin: Mm. that's really

fascinating. I, I've just noticed, I, I started with a pendulum again. I, I pick it up and put it down type of thing. And a, a pendulum, I feel like is a very similar. Concept. And I, I, have a hard time with it because I know that I can influence it, even though I'm perfectly still. I can tell 'cause I've tested it where I'm like, what if I just wanna make it go? Yes. Or what if I intend that it goes clockwise [00:21:00] and it'll just start doing it, you know? And then I'm like, okay, now counterclockwise, and I'll wait a minute. And then it just starts going counterclockwise. And I'm like, so while I'm waiting for it to do something, I, I have kind of a guess about what I think the answer is, and it's really difficult for me to like put that aside but also get a response. You know what I mean? Because I feel like I withhold my energy so much not wanting to influence it, that then like nothing's happening with it, you know? So it's this balance that I'm having a

hard time 

Krishna Avalon: Hmm. 

I get that because I love pendulums too. And I have a couple that I never use, but I love them and it has tested inaccurately for me. I do get what you're saying, but it's so cool how you can just be sitting there and be like thinking in your mind. Yes. And it's going in one direction and then you're like, stop.

And it's stop. You know? That's crazy.

But it has given [00:22:00] me wrong answers before

Kara Goodwin: Yeah. But so you found muscle testing to be a lot

more accurate, it

sounds like. Mm-hmm. 

Krishna Avalon: And I don't know how you do it, but I like to do this one or some people do this one, but like for me, I'm just using this. 

Kara Goodwin: Okay. So that's two insert just for anybody who's listening, um, and not watching, but the, uh, so you like looping your fingers together and then you try like

your index And thumb,

Krishna Avalon: cool. Yep. And then I'll just pull and be like, my name is Krishna and I'll pull and it's strong. But if I say My name is Dylan and I pull, it's weak and my fingers come apart.

Kara Goodwin: Yeah. Oh, that's

fascinating. Okay. Super, super amazing. So, So, then you've got the whole brained part to the psych K and working with the subconscious. so that's kind of like, I guess the foundation of making change is getting brain, both hemispheres of the brain working together. And then in terms of like [00:23:00] introducing the new program, or the, the higher the the we're wanting to change are, is that more affirmations or how, are you helping people in, in the reprogramming. 

Krishna Avalon: Yeah, that's such a great question as well, which is where I think it is . Super valuable to have a person who sees you and hears you and is very intuitive because there are many things you could come up with as your goal statement, and the best statement for you is actually is gonna be the most impactful.

So we would talk about what you want, and then through

that I would reflect back to you and come up with the best words that you feel the most connected and resonant with. Like when I read it back to you, you're like, yeah. I'm like, is that what you want? Yeah. And I can tell when people light up or I can tell if they're like, yeah, mm, let's keep playing with the words because words are alchemy.

And that's, I believe, [00:24:00] where like some of the magic stuff comes in because, I did psych K with my teacher when I first heard about it. I looked it up. There was one practitioner in Portland, it was my teacher, and I went and saw her and I honestly didn't notice any difference. And I just believe that we have space holders and we have people who facilitate us.

And when we feel safe and when we feel seen, that is hugely healing. She was my teacher and she taught me all three levels. I'm gonna do one more level in November specific to health and wellness, but, she just wasn't my facilitator. And so I, I just know being a practitioner for so long, like there are a bazillion acupuncturists out there, but

like I know my gifts are in space holding and being intuitive, and so that help, that does help people feel safe and heal quicker, get to their goal quicker.

Kara Goodwin: Yeah. Are you still doing acupuncture as well?

Krishna Avalon: I am a little bit , 

Kara Goodwin: Mm-hmm. 

Krishna Avalon: but I'm really, going into [00:25:00] subconscious therapy. That's what my direction is for how I want to . Guide my practice and guide the people that I want. I mean, it's just where I'm the most inspired and I felt oh, maybe it would be really helpful to people if I got a mental health certification or training.

And so I am also about to study this thing called Internal Family Systems.

Kara Goodwin: Oh yeah, I'm familiar

with that. 

Krishna Avalon: Yeah, Again, it's just like another lens for helping people identify parts. They call it parts of themselves. and where we're fragmented or burdened, a lot of it is about where we are, like creating protectors or managers or firefighters, basically as protection for the parts of us that have been exiled.

And so we wanna

unblend some of those attachments so that the, they call it the self capital L Ss, can lead. Can come through. And so using that with [00:26:00] subconscious work, I believe is gonna be so cool. And just having that alternative to traditional talk therapy, which a lot of people are just really wanting to make these changes and don't know how.

And I believe it doesn't have to take 20 years because I know how much I've been able to grow in a short amount of time. this is the kind of stuff I've been waiting for all my life.

Kara Goodwin: Yeah. Well, and when we talk about the subconscious and working with the subconscious for healing, it also makes me think about Hypnotism or hypnosis, I should say. So, are there similarities with hypnotism, with any of this or just two separate modalities?

Krishna Avalon: There are, and I tried hip, I tried hypnosis also. Like a few times. It was nice. But then one of the first times I was unconscious and I didn't like that

she made a recording for me. But I like to know what's going on . 

Kara Goodwin: Yeah. 

Krishna Avalon: So like I believe in healing in my sleep and I love meditation and the theta of state is so powerful, right?

It's where we're the most [00:27:00] influenced easily.

But for a healing process, I would love to be conscious. Not to say that falling asleep during a massage isn't very powerful, but, 

Kara Goodwin: Mm-hmm.

Krishna Avalon: Yeah, hypnosis, you're often unconscious 

Kara Goodwin: Yeah. 

Krishna Avalon: so deep in a theta, whereas this is very conscious and very simple and I tend to like things that are very simple.

Kara Goodwin: Mm-hmm. 

Krishna Avalon: to me, acupuncture, yes, it's this ancient medicine, but it's about the flow of energy. And so that was my first love and it would've taken something super special for me to switch paths. But like this being as simple and powerful it is as it is,

Kara Goodwin: Mm-hmm.

Krishna Avalon: part of what drew me to it.

Kara Goodwin: Yeah. Yeah. That's beautiful. Well, can you talk little bit about neuroplasticity and the importance of that, and the role of that in your, in your work? I. 

Krishna Avalon: Yeah, absolutely. And that's what it's all about is creating the brain's ability to have a new experience. So we all have those like paths [00:28:00] in the forest in our mind that are very clear. That we've been down a million times. It doesn't mean that it's the best path for us. It just means that's what we've taken as the path a million times.

And what this kind of work does is it creates neuroplasticity, that brain's ability to change. So you really can teach an old dog new tricks if that dog wants to change. And so that's a beautiful part of this work. And again, unlike other subconscious processes, , which might help you peacefully, unattached from things or uncouple like E M D R would say uncouple, hypnotherapy again, just to have a different experience in this work with psych K.

Kay. I love that we can create a goal statement, like the lens that we want to have and create that belief in the subconscious mind so that it's possible and through that process of the whole brain postures, creating that neuroplasticity so that we can have that experience.[00:29:00] 

Kara Goodwin: Okay. All right. And what is for, if there's somebody who's listening and they're like, wow. This sounds like it's exactly what I need. What sort of process is it for people? Like how many sessions, how long per session, like how long until they start to see some change? What can you say about

that? 

Krishna Avalon: Usually people see a change right away. Sometimes they don't notice the change until. All of a sudden, a couple months later, they're like, oh my gosh, I'm just walking past that place. That was a big source of contention for me, and I'm like not even thinking about it. I. So really change happens right away.

It's just a matter of are you aware enough to notice that some people just do a session with me and they'll tell me a year later, oh, I'm still like, I still am integrating that very powerful session that we have. Other people will sign up for 10 sessions [00:30:00] and they'll do 3, 4, 5. . Weekly and then spread them out because that will get to all areas of your life.

And 10 sessions is really not that much for anything, but for people who wanna work with all aspects of their lives and do big excavating, basically, 

Kara Goodwin: Mm-hmm.

Krishna Avalon: that is the way a lot of people go. So you can just check it out for one session. You are definitely gonna notice change. some people will do three, and then there's.

Other people that are like, this is it for me. Let's do 10. And then I bring in things too, like I bring in practices for people if they need it to, connect what their body is experiencing with their brain. So like a somatic practice or a meditation to reinforce what we're doing with the psych k.

Kara Goodwin: Mm-hmm. . And they're individual sessions.

Krishna Avalon: Yeah.

Kara Goodwin: Mm-hmm. . Okay, great. And if people want to find out more about working with you, how would they do that?

Krishna Avalon: I mean, definitely just my website. And then there's a resource [00:31:00] page on there with some free practices. So some somatic meditations, some breath work practices, neuroplasticity

practices.

Kara Goodwin: put

your, I'll put your website in the show notes, but in case anybody's just listening and they're, they're, can you say what your

website is? 

Krishna Avalon: Yeah, it's just my name, krishna avalon.com, and then that's my handle on Instagram. I'm there when I feel like it, often I post in my stories, like people's testimonials or like a goal statement that someone had for the day and, how powerful that's been for them. People do like to read about those.

but those are the main places. I like to have that resource page just so you can get more of a sense of me and how I work. But

Kara Goodwin: Beautiful goodwill. Thank you so much, Krishna, for talking to us about psych K and the subconscious. This has been really beautiful and very informative. I appreciate you being

here. 

Krishna Avalon: thank you so much, Kara. It was fun. 

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