Does Trauma Help Us to Ascend?

Will: [00:00:00] Karen.

Karen: Yes.

Will: Over the last three plus years, we've had a ton of fun exploring soul led topics, and that's not going to stop anytime soon as far as we're concerned, but sometimes we'll see. Sometimes you have to take a pause examine life's tough moments. And for that, things have to get a little bit more serious.

I mean, we're not gonna change who we are, but we want to take this topic very seriously because it is a very serious topic. See, today we're talking about how overcoming childhood trauma influences our soul's evolution.

Karen and Will: Wow.

Will: Yes. It's a deep topic. That is serious. So the question that I have is why do some of us have to go through this in order to evolve?

Or do we even need to go through this to evolve at all? And how do you overcome it in a way that satisfies our need to grow as 5D individuals?

Karen: And some people would say that our spirits choose to live through that trauma.

Will: That's where I'm headed to. So today we're diving in deep on this episode of the Skeptic Metaphysicians. [00:01:00] Hey there. I'm Will and I'm Karen. And if you're still with us, then that means that you understand the importance of this discussion we're about to have. Our guest is Susan Gold. Now she navigated a ferociously challenging upbringing while bravely moving forward as an adult to face ingrained, outdated and patriarchal programming head on.

on. She now shares a unique perspective in viewing life challenges as occasions [00:02:00] for transformation. Does that sound

Karen: familiar, Karen? It sure does.

Will: Now through her book, Toxic Family, transforming childhood trauma into adult freedom, Susan turns the standard paradigm on its head Courageously leading others through her own journey of abuse, addiction, and surviving narcissism all while creating a distinctly empowering personal and professional life.

Thrilled to welcome Susan Gold to the show. Susan, thanks for being here. Well,

Susan: Hey, Will. Karen. Really nice to be here and I feel privileged. I've been listening and love your content.

Karen: thank you.

Will: We are honored that you have been listening to us. We really appreciate it. And it's it's always a thrill to have someone that listens to the show on the show because now you know already what you're in for. So you've been warned. No surprises. It All right. Now I introduced the topic in a more serious note because this is a pretty serious conversation that we're about to have and nothing more serious than talking about past childhood trauma.

And I don't know that we could broach the topic [00:03:00] as completely as we could without at least touching on your experience. So can you tell us? What was your childhood like?

Susan: Oh, it was straight up hell. There, there

Karen: with a laugh. Yeah,

Will: yeah, Susan we like to be transparent here, so could you be a little bit less cryptic?

Susan: yeah, I used to look up to the stars and say, Hey, what's going on? There's a big mistake. Get me out of here. And I had a very different trajectory than my three brothers and sister. We all grew up in the same home, but we have a very different experience of it. I was very awake and from a very young age, I mean, I remember at 18 months, I was in the play plan pen way too long, tears streaming down my face.

And finally, when I was heard, it was not with love that I was received. And these episodes would repeat. I was the piece of the puzzle. Bringer and peacemaker. My parents, [00:04:00] God love them, had a brutal marriage and they came from brutality and abuse. It runs way back in the lineage and there's no mistake and it's often the case.

So they were abused children coming in, creating their own family, As abused children now adult children raising more abused children.

Karen and Will: Well, I am.

Will: So then that, that calls into question the whole thing about generational healing that needs to be done once from what I'm gathering, and I've not had the pleasure of reading your book just yet, but I hope to at some point in the future, it sounds like you have found a way to overcome these tragedies or these childhood traumas that you have that hopefully will break the cycle of generational trauma.

So why do you think? You were able to make that change when none of your ancestors were able to before you.[00:05:00]

Susan: Well, I'll tell you what I have been in Southern California for way too long. And the who we, that I believe is this is my mission. This is my purpose. I mean, like you, I had a very star studded career and had the opportunity to work with people that are household names. But that was not my mission, my mission, my purpose is to bring up this taboo topic of our toxic family systems and the lineage and clear it.

We're carrying around cement bags that don't even belong to us, most of us. And it's time to drop it and lighten up. Now, next time when I come in, I think I'm going to check the fine print a little more closely on that contract. Okay. That I agreed to, but once I could really understand it, and it's been decades of walking through some pretty tough stuff, but once I could see it from this perspective of you have an opportunity to clear a lot of crap that doesn't even belong and [00:06:00] shift the paradigm.

And I see it happening. I mean, most people don't understand why I have a story. Smile on my face. And when you were introducing me and saying it was going to be a serious show, I'm like, ah, come on. Well, let's have fun here.

Will: Well, it's a serious topic, but we are trying to have fun with it. Because it's just who we are. We can't change who we are. And it sounds like you are right along with us. You are part of our soul family. So, and the topic is so deep. Challenging that the really, sometimes the only way to approach it is with a sense of humor, because otherwise it is quite tragic.

Susan: Well, I didn't really even understand it. I mean, yes, it was horrific. My mother was in a relationship with basically a Peter Pan who drank to soothe.

Karen: Mm

Susan: His woes and his familial disappointments. Um, He was a constant philanderer and he was a genius astrophysicist. I'm talking about him like he's dead.

He's not, he's still with us. And he was a lot of fun. Like he would [00:07:00] take us on adventures and we were very close to the edge when we were with my father. And my mother had five kids to take care of. She was under 30 years old. She had put him through school, the Ph. D. And her turn for higher education was to come because she was brilliant.

I mean, she was equally as brilliant as my father, but her turn didn't come and she was saddled and she was angry and she soothed with food, which is not unusual. So here I have an alcoholic dad and a mom who's soothing with food. And back then they prescribed diet pills, which were straight Speed.

Karen and Will: Mm hmm.

Susan: So the platform for health was not very even and stable.

And my role was to get in between it and try to soothe it and settle it and calm it. And I was highly empathic. And I know you talk about that a lot on the show. I could go into any room and Pick up the tone, the tenor the temperament, the mood. And I was also telepathic [00:08:00] until it became too dangerous.

I mean, I would get complete thoughts and then spit it out 'cause it just came flying outta my mouth. And the adults didn't really like that very much. So I had a tone that down. And I was also a super manifester. I would watch Barbara Walters on my beanbag chair in the basement. And I wanted to go to New York and I wanted to be like Barbara Walters.

That's what kept me going. I was going to get out of this system and I was going to make something. And I did leave when I was 17, the morning after high school graduation, quarter to eight in the morning, the car was packed and I was pretty much out. And by 19, I was in Greenwich village. I had negotiated an internship in arts management and left school to work in the city and living my dream and went right back after school started working at ICM, which is a large Global talent agency wasn't making enough money and picked up a side hustle training people, as an exercise trainer, because it's another piece [00:09:00] of my story.

And Barbara Walters became my client.

Karen and Will: What? Oh my gosh. Oh, that's fantastic.

Susan: She was amazing. She would have loved you both of you. Yeah, she was totally with it and as intuitive as heck. And that's why she was such a good. interviewer. And one day I rang her doorbell at 7 a. m. and she's like, Susan, get in here. What's going on with you? And I had been sexually harassed in the workplace.

This stuff in my family, the abuse of every type that was slathered over every crevice that I swear would not repeat, did not leave me with a lot of self esteem and self worth. And It also left me with very porous boundaries and it also left me prone to addiction. And I saw the flags come up and I was addressing them.

But she said, after I told her about the abuse in the office and what had happened, she said, I'm coming to work with you this morning. We're going to [00:10:00] confront this guy together.

Will: Barbara Walters said that?

Susan: Or it's okay. I think I got this. And I confronted my boss that day, promptly fired me.

Will: Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. You had Barbara Walters willing to go fight your battles for

Susan: Yeah,

Will: thanks!

Susan: yeah,

Will: Oh, I would have been like, bring it, Barbara! Absolutely! Let's go! Dang!

Susan: she then offered me an assistantship with her then fiance who was running a very big film distribution company. But I was like, yeah, I can't be an assistant anymore after this. So I went it alone and I decided to match celebrities with brands and Donny Deutch, who's an entrepreneur and television host.

He's a bit of an icon. He was running his dad's ad agency then. And he said, we really want Andy Warhol to endorse the Pontiac dealers. It's a TV camera on camera commercial spot. Do you think you can get them? I'm like, let me try, cause I'm just out of an abusive relationship where the man held the purse strings.

I'm embarrassed to say, [00:11:00] and also not even 90 days. Living like in New York City on my own, and I'm going to make this happen. Nobody would answer the phone at the factory. So I took the subway down there and knocked on the door. Fred, Andy's business manager is yeah, okay, I get you. Come back tomorrow at the same time.

I'll let you talk to Andy. So I'm sitting in the foyer like and that empathic ability, that intuitiveness, who did that come back up in spades. The doors flew open, the studio's dark and Fred sticks his head out and goes, Andy, we'll see you now. And I thought, Oh my God, I'm going to walk into another minefield.

What's going to happen to me now? And in I go and this spotlight, this pin spotlight is coming down on this platinum hair going 17 different directions. And there he is with this colored pencils, scribbling. I shouldn't say scribble cause Oh my God, it's 80 million now. Um, I don't know.

Will: Those are very, very valuable scribbles. Mm

Karen and Will: hmm. Mm

Susan: Yeah. [00:12:00] And his three pugs, those dogs with the smushed up faces, like they were running around the studio.

So I'm in there, vamping, telling him why I'm here about this commercial. And all he cares about is the dogs. He's not even making eye contact with me, but I can feel his isolation. I can feel his need for attention. I can feel his desire to connect. And he's holding the pugs in his arms. And finally, like this was the longest.

I don't know. Maybe it was three minutes, but it felt like 30. He finally looked me in the eye and he goes, now really, why should I do this? I said, because you can have the dogs in the shot with you. And he said, okay, I'll do it.

Karen: Wow.

Susan: so that ability really helped launch my career. And I became known for matching celebrities to brands.

And that was a huge [00:13:00] skillset that led me into producing and this wonderful career. But the whole time that this is happening, I'm dealing with these issues. that are coming up being raised in this system. And it was not easy and it was not for the faint of heart. And it felt unjust here. I was like in my mid twenties going, dude, I never had a childhood fluff.

This sucks. But then like waking up to realize, yeah, I've got a responsibility. I've got a parent myself. It didn't happen the way that I wished it would, but there's got to be reason and purpose, and ultimately I found there really was.

Will: Well, so, but what I'm really, really interested in, not just how, 'cause that's really important, but also why, why did you have to go through that in order to get to the point where you are right now?

Susan: Well, before we even dive into that, Will, I would love to [00:14:00] hear you say the title of your show three times fast. Dare you?

Karen: You can do it. Go.

Will: Skeptic metaphysicians, skeptic metaphysicians, skeptic metaphysicians. It was

Karen: like close. The second one you flubbed a little bit.

Will: Skeptic metaphysicians. Skeptic metaphysicians, skeptic metaphysicians,

Karen: skeptic metaphysicians.

Will: There you go. Nice job.

Susan: Yeah. All right.

Will: Karen has way more, a better diction than I do, but the name of the show is meant to be one.

To take your time with because it provides that type of gravity. So if you're saying it too fast, you're saying it wrong.

Susan: Keep that in mind when I start promoting.

Karen: be skeptic, metas.

Will: You need to have that at the end of it. In fact, I need to record that at some point in the road caster, right? Okay.

Susan: back to the serious question. So why did I come in to experience this? Well, it's not [00:15:00] unusual for. Lightworkers, as they say, to come from these types of circumstances, really tough, brutal stuff. And I don't think it's my first round, and I don't think it's the first round for my lineage either. I mean, I'm from a line of warriors.

These people are tough, and I have For every one of them, I was dropped into the perfect family position with the perfect parents and they are brave and I, I appreciate the roles that they played to force me forward. And I feel like I came in with a layer of gauze missing. Because I was very cognizant.

I knew there was a different way. I knew there was something wrong when I sat in the pew and they told me I need a broker to talk to God. I'm like, I don't need a broker to talk to God, and a lot of the [00:16:00] guilt and shame that I would hear. I was like, this doesn't make any sense. And why my parents were brutalizing each other and us.

Was this necessary? Like I've always come. From a place of love. I always believe in redemption and I have incredible resilience and I do believe there is purpose and I think it got clearer as I went along, I addressed the addiction first and the remnants of my childhood, the clinical depression came next, which was a 10 year battle.

And I learned what that was. And I always had, I mean, my first suicide attempt, I was six years old. I pulled a knife out of the carving block in the kitchen and thought, if I could only just lance this through my little heart, all this would be over.

Will: Oh my God, Susan, that's awful.

Susan: but I'll tell you what. I've come full circle. I know how to handle it.

I was [00:17:00] going through the tail end of a nasty divorce from somebody that I absolutely loved, who really is living a tough life. I wouldn't want to be in his body. But I learned, I got suicidal at the end. I turned it all inward and set up a friend for every day of the week and checked in.

And if I was suicidal, I would call the next person on the list and say, Hey, I'm suicidal. I need to talk. I need help. And, I've learned a lot and I passed that along and it's kept other people on the planet. There is benefit in what I've gone through and how I've learned to handle it because this is all opportunity for growth and to break the chain.

So we don't keep recycling this abuse. It's unnecessary. It's unnecessary.

Karen: Well, what I think is incredible is how you do speak with love about everything. I mean, you're talking about people who abused you severely [00:18:00] and you're talking about them being strong and your ex husband and it's this loving expression or description of these people who did things that so many people would not be able to be so loving about.

And I think you can just tell that. That's how you'd live your life. And

Susan: especially listeners out there, if you're in a toxic relationship, if you're going through some kind of familial abuse, I needed to work through it. There was a three year period where I had to completely disengage from my mother.

completely and I held boundaries and when I do see my family, I am on a grounded place and I do have support in place and tools in place and I have a reality check. So there is a process that I went through and still use and go through and I didn't do it by myself. I mean, [00:19:00] so many modalities and the somatic ones were probably particularly healing when it came to trauma.

And abuse and by somatic, I mean meditation, running or going into the body and exploring that pocket of trauma that's in there. That took me so long because when I started, I barely knew the emotions of happy, mad, sad, glad I was shut down. My first therapist was like in there with that stuff.

And I was like, really, just give me a list. I don't have time for this stuff. I gotta figure out how to produce this next segment. I gotta figure out how to pay my rent next month. So we can just stop down with this emotional stuff, but that's what I've come to understand is so key. And the surrender of living from the outside in, which is the training that I received achieve.

on the outside. I mean, make it look good and do it. Doesn't matter the cost to self. Well, [00:20:00] really going through my divorce, then I call my ex husband, my greatest guru. Cause he was, as in teacher, he really taught me how to authentically find that peace. of light in my heart that is so worthy and that I do matter, that I'm not just a dirty Kleenex.

I have courage. I have grace. I have incredible abundance, amazing opportunities to manifest. I'm a connector. I can bring soothing and healing to others as a result of what I've experienced and I can take care of myself. And that was like, That was the perfect storm lesson. He really showed me that beauty.

Will: you bring up an excellent point that I'm glad you brought up because if you didn't, I was going to, I did see on your bio, the fact that you call him your greatest guru. And sometimes people are brought to us. [00:21:00] to help us learn things in a very weird way. And by what I mean by that is not every guru is is a Gandhi sitting on the top of a mountain meditating.

Sometimes the toughest lessons come from tough people, tough characters, tough personalities. And as much as I hate this fact that I've learned over the past, I don't know how many, three years doing the show, Growth is messy and difficult. And the biggest growth comes from the biggest challenges. So I would say those of us that had such difficult, traumatic childhoods growing up, we have been forced to chisel ourselves in grow in such profound ways, and it feels like that's exactly what you experienced.

My biggest regret, my biggest, like, why God, why is. Exactly that. Why? Why can't I learn without having to go through all the crap that [00:22:00] we have to go through? And I know the answer and I don't like it. So I would love for you to show me a different way, Susan.

Susan: Yeah, I've been there. Believe me. I know I wanted to crush that rock big time and the injustice, right? It seems unfair and unjust. I mean, here I was, I had bought my home from my family, maintained it. I was living in a partial conversion in our garage while my ex was in the master. It was insanity, but that was all to show me.

What I was surrendering to how I was valuing myself and once you're able to really open your heart, get rid of all those layers of, duct tape and glue and tar that we put over our hearts just by our societal systems that are finally crumbling in front of us. But once we're able to do that and take a look at it, wow, look at the gift this guy is bringing me and I can't get out of it.

[00:23:00] I'm locked in here. It was a year door to door till I could write him that six figure check and he could be on to his next victim. And thank God because it finally broke my denial. I always want to see the best in the other person. I want to bring the best. And that's so important. spiritual axiom, point one finger out, three fingers come back at you.

Fluff that, I want to break that one into pieces. You know what?

Will: did you just say fluff that?

Susan: I did.

Will: Love that. Thank you. Thank you for keeping us on a PG rating on Apple podcasts. We appreciate that.

Susan: We wanna get to everybody. Everybody. I'm gonna make t-shirts that say fluff, that I'm gonna try to start a trend. But anyway I just, it's been full circle. There's so many clients that come to me in such pain because they're stuck in that rut. They need reciprocity. They need the victimizer [00:24:00] to see.

What they did, they need to prove it. And I'm like, you can carry that as long as you want. And you're going to stay on that wheel of hell. You can jump off at any time. Appreciate that you're not in their earth suit. And understand that is your key to freedom. And that's why there's freedom in the title of my book.

And that's what I'm bringing to the planet. Freedom.

Karen: And that's awesome. And that's how you talk about these people being gurus, and it's not like they're like, let me give you this lesson. It's, you're like, okay, I'm dealing with the situation. And you're getting the lessons within yourself, the knowledge within yourself, learning the power and the strength that you do have to cope.

And that's where the lessons are. You're like, oh, okay, this person did this, but look at how I grew because of that. I figured out how to make money on the side. I figured out how to get out of this situation. And that is, that, those lessons you're getting from this person, but not from him, from yourself.

Like they're pulling these lessons out of you inadvertently. Right?

Will: [00:25:00] No, absolutely. Inadvertently. Yeah, that's exactly it. And they don't, I'm sure he doesn't realize that you call him or maybe he does, he knows now, but but yeah, the fact that you call him a guru, I don't think he would consider himself that.

And what's the cliche, whatever doesn't break you makes you stronger. I mean, that's pretty much the epitome of what we're talking about here.

Karen: But she's

Susan: Yeah. But next time we come in. Yeah. Next time we come in. I want a coogee. Well,

Will: Yeah. Well, it makes you think about those folks that I mean, when we talk about childhood trauma, I would say no matter how small quote unquote, the trauma is.

people believe your trauma to be. Any trauma is massive trauma to yourself. So just because I went through years and years thinking, Oh, I had a great childhood until I really dove into it and went, Oh crap. I had a pretty idyllic childhood in certain respects, but the trauma came in other ways that to me [00:26:00] changed me, changed my personality, made me someone I didn't want to until I looked at myself in the mirror and realized it.

And that's when I started going, wait, wait, wait, wait, where'd all this come from? And then started to look into it and realizing my child, my childhood was way, way more traumatic than I expected. And I thought it was, and I remembered it was until I dove into it and really thought about it as an adult, going back with adult sensibilities and went, damn, okay, now I understand.

And now I know what I need to work on. So it is the reason why I'm saying all this is because if you're listening to this and you think to yourself, ah, that doesn't really pertain to me, perhaps it doesn't. And I applaud you and I hope to God it doesn't. However, I would urge you to go back and really take a look because no matter how small you feel your trauma might be, it's really big inside and you need to work through it.

And I think books like the one that you have written, Susan, go a long, long way towards helping humanity. So thank you for the service that you're providing.

Susan: [00:27:00] thank you. Because a lot of times I think, what are you not saying? Like throwing your family under the bus. My, my original title was magical illumination, transforming childhood trauma into adult freedom. And my publisher, she's a New York times bestselling publisher. She's also a former producing partner of mine, and she's absolute genius.

Two weeks before we were ready to publish, she had her associate call and say, Oh, by the way, we'd like to change your title, the toxic family. I was like, Oh my God, because I too, I didn't want to throw my family under the bus. I do authentically have relationships with them. I'm connected with them and appreciate them as I've said previously.

But honestly the denial is strong. I mean, None of my high school friends knew when they found out, as somebody, I didn't understand when somebody tags you on Facebook and you respond back the podcast posts. So that's the way everybody in my small town found out about my book, which, oh my [00:28:00] gosh, nobody, my college boyfriend didn't know, I knew there was something wrong with my upbringing, but I didn't understand the extent of it because I didn't have anything to compare it to until I saw it.

Yeah, until I saw the things playing out in my own adulthood and like you, Will, thank God, were brave enough to step up and say, Hey, something's busted. Let me take a look at this.

Will: Yeah. And it's critically important because it's the act of doing that. It's the act of realizing it and making, taking steps to change it. That is the soul's evolution. So now we're bringing it all back, right? That is, I believe the reason why we experienced the trauma that we experienced so that we can evolve and become, I can tell you.

I'm a way better person now than I was three years ago, four years ago, way, way better person now. And that is because of the trauma that I explored and decided to change. So that gauntlet that we have gone through is, is the evolution that we are meant to go [00:29:00] through in this lifetime in order to help others understand that this is the same type of thing that they have to go through themselves.

Karen: But then here's my question to you. Will Mm-Hmm. , you're saying you're better because you understood the trauma and you've dealt with it. And that's your purpose for this evolution. But. What if you hadn't had that trauma?

Will: Well,

Karen: What was the point of the trauma? If, was it to give you something that you had to work to get rid of and start back where you were before you got the trauma?

Will: Uh, it

Karen: can get confusing.

Will: It's like, it's like when I said chiseling away at something, it is adding all this stuff so that the process of you finding yourself inside of it is what gains you the wisdom. to move forward in your next iteration.

Karen: Right. But my thoughts are the way that the changes you wanted to make were changes that you became because of the trauma.

That makes sense.

Will: Yes. And like Susan, I wish I had read the fine print in my contract before I came on board, because yes, these are all things that we've decided before. At least that's what the messages we're getting, right? That this, these are all things we've decided before we are incarnated, that [00:30:00] we're going to go through this so that we can find our way back to center.

by overcoming these traumas or these challenges because they make us stronger at the end of the day and make us better people at the end of the day. Imagine if you didn't have any, growth, right, happens at the edge of your comfort zone. Imagine if you didn't get uncomfortable at all, you'd be the same person, you wouldn't grow.

Karen: Growth also happens with love.

Will: Yes, but perhaps the fastest way forward

Karen: I think that depends on the person. See, a lot of people think, we have this podcast, we have the same mindset. We don't. We agree on a lot of things, but we also, disagree on several things. But it keeps it interesting.

Will: But the most important thing is to provide space for each other to believe in what they believe in and support that person because we are individuals. We understand that everyone's reality is different. We've learned a lot in the last few years. We have. All right. So Susan tell us about your book. We touched on it a little bit, but [00:31:00] now I think it's time that we've really introduced the topic really well. Why would someone benefit from reading your book? other than the obvious.

Susan: It's like being a fly on the wall and they're going to read something that resonates. Something's going to jar some kind of memory, emotion. I've been told my book is an activation. Like you could just have this book sit on your shelf and somehow your life is going to change because your heart is going to open.

Karen: Ooh.

Susan: The book is my story. It's my own experience. No one else's. My family members couldn't be a part of it because I had to write it from my own experience. And it is my own trajectory. And then there's, tools in the back that have helped me move through all this, because I'd really like you to experience what it's like to feel better as you move through this more comfortable in your skin, more abundant, more free, less afraid.

Karen: Okay. And that is so [00:32:00] wonderful and so brave because so many people have gone through abuse. The last thing they feel comfortable doing is outing their family. So the fact that you did this in service to help people is just incredible. So thank you for that.

Will: Absolutely. Absolutely. What, which curiosity, what was the reaction from your friends and your family when they read the book?

Susan: Yeah, so my friends were surprised. Because this is not what I portrayed to them at all. I was very compartmentalized and I was chameleon like, no one would ever know. And this went on for a long time. My family knew I was writing a book, but they didn't know the topic and no one asked. So if they didn't ask, I wasn't going to tell.

And then it was close to the time of the book coming out. The title changed. I went into. fear mode. And I confided in my sister. My sister read the book. She said, You know what? After I got through the childhood part, the rest of it was riveting. And she feels like she came from a very privileged [00:33:00] background.

She had, she just, our experiences couldn't be more diametrically opposed. Now I'm going to share about my oldest brother. He and I have the most abuse between us. I did a lot of work around that abuse. In my early twenties and did confront him and he said that didn't happen, but if it did happen, here's why it happened.

And sadly, most of his childhood is a blackout. So that's a traumatic response. And when I have been around my older brother, my son said, why you always, you're so different around him. You tense up, you shy away, you're cowering. So the book came out and he read it and I got a call from him and it was like I heard a voice of a nine year old boy and he said, [00:34:00] I am so, so sorry I was not a better brother to you.

I don't remember this, but I am sorry and I am so proud of the way that you have walked through this and who you are today. And that is worth the experience that I've taken on and that is worth his valor and his courage. And I love him.

Will: You, Have touched such deep nerve inside me that I'm having a hard time containing myself right now.

Karen: I'm seeing that

Will: My childhood was also almost a complete blackout. I don't remember anything. Only very vague flashes until I was well into my double digits. For obvious reasons we don't need to get into here, but I also traumatized my brother. [00:35:00] And to this day, we love each other. We do. We, and we, and every time we are together it's an incredible experience, but God, I was a, I was terror. I was a, he held onto that for a very long time to the point where, how long ago was it Karen? Two years, maybe three years

Karen: ago, I think two years ago we

Will: finally just sat down and talked it through and yes, I, it was my turn to apologize to him because I didn't mean to be that shitty of a brother.

I was just going through my own stuff. that he wasn't really conscious for, because he was too young when all this stuff was happening. So it was a really difficult thing. And that's why my question has always been, why? Why do we have to go through that? [00:36:00] Why do we have to hurt the people we love?

Karen: Who?

Will: This is unexpected. Anyway I thank you for bringing that story up because this has probably been the most impact I've felt during the show in a very long time. So thank you for that.

Karen and Will: Wow.

Susan: I love you so much. Yeah, I love you so much. I'm so proud of you. And that's why we're here. To transform all of that, to act it out, to experience it, to walk through it and then transform it. And that's the end of that in your family line. And that's the end of that in my family line. And so on and so on.

And I'm telling you, it's not just the three of our souls that you've touched. By your bravery, you've healed so many today, and [00:37:00] that's why we're here.

Will: I sincerely thank you for coming on the show and bringing this up, I, this was not at all what I expected to happen. Not at all. At all. But I think it was important for some reason we, when we do a pre taping conversations, we always talk about how we've got an idea. of where the conversation is going to go, but ultimately universe takes us in the direction it wants to take us in.

This is the direction that universe said is time for. So thank you for holding space for this to happen and for me to embarrass myself quite so profoundly. But is there anything that we haven't touched on, Susan, that you want to make sure that you get out to the audience?

Susan: Just if anybody feels moved everything's at SusanGold. us, one to one coaching, mentorship, free courses, it's all there.

Will: Thank you that I was gonna definitely go into that we're gonna add direct links in our show notes so that you can Connect with Susan at your convenience. All you need to do is go to skeptic metaphysician comm you'll see all the links laid in [00:38:00] there And then of course her book Toxic Family Transforming Childhood Trauma into Adult Freedom is out now and available for you to pick up because if you, if this conversation moved you like it moved me, then you know, that's a book you have to have in your library.

Susan, thank you so much for coming on the show. It's been a pleasure meeting you, speaking with you, and I hope that we get a chance to continue the conversation in the future moment.

Susan: Me too. Thank you. Thank you, Will. Thank you, Karen. And best of luck in your new environs.

Will: Thank you.

And a huge thank you to you. We know that there are tons of options out there and having you decide to come along on our journey of discovery with us is an absolute honor for us. We hope you've enjoyed this conversation as much as we have. If you did and you feel called to give back, we invite you to visit our website at SkepticMetaphysician.

com where you can donate to the show or subscribe as a member through our Buy Me a Coffee campaign. Your support will go a long way towards allowing Karen and I to bring you these [00:39:00] wonderful conversations and teachings in more and more robust ways. Well, that's all for now, but we'll see you on the next episode of The Skeptic Metaphysician. Until then, take care.