Transcript
Emma Tessler [00:00:00]:
That idea of seeing someone do it and knowing you can also achieve it was a really big piece for me personally. And I think the beauty of the way that the entrepreneurial space has advanced since 2018 is that we see people of every race, gender, age, you know, income level achieved things that seemed so impossible even 5, 10 years ago, and that was a big piece.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:00:57]:
Welcome or welcome back to Too Legitimate to Quit. Instantly actionable small business strategies with a pop culture spin. I am your host Annie p Ruggles, and my guest today is the sensational Emma Tesler. Emma Tesler is the founder and CEO of 95 Media, a digital marketing agency that builds results driven marketing strategies for scaling brands. She helps brands connect with ideal clients, build community, and convert audience members into paying customers. After her 1st exposure to the world of digital marketing in 2015, Emma identified that social media platforms were the future of marketing And the key to scaling a business in today's world. This inspired her to launch 95 media, and she has since doubled her growth year over year. Today, Emma and her team have worked with over a 100 clients in over 25 industries, helping them monetize their online presence and to see incredible results.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:01:57]:
With 8 years of marketing experience under her belt, she is on a mission to disrupt the digital marketing space for years to come. Emma Tesler, 95 media. I got a question for you, which is what do small business owners need to focus on this week?
Emma Tessler [00:02:14]:
You know, I think every small business owner should be focusing on their video content this week because video is, you know, video's not new these days. It is kind of mainstream in all of our lives. But I can't even tell you the amount of business owners and marketers who are still so scared of video content and shut
Annie P. Ruggles [00:02:36]:
up that like, get off my show. I will not have you come on here and attack me.
Emma Tessler [00:02:42]:
Personal attack incoming, but it is, like, so serious. You know? A lot of people are so scared to get on it. You feel like you need to do your full hair and makeup, you have to show up as your perfect self. And at the end of the day, you know, a lot of video content is successful because it's not perfect and because you show up, you know, imperfectly, you show up without your makeup on, you know, get ready with me videos on TikTok have absolutely blown up, and it's really because you show up, you know, acne, rosacea, everything that you normally don't show, and people are really relating to that these days. And so, you know, I think if you can focus on anything, it would be hitting record on your video that you have been putting off on your to do list for weeks and just getting it posted.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:03:26]:
I love when you're like, video's not new. What came to my mind immediately was video's not new. I've been procrastinating it for a decade,
Emma Tessler [00:03:34]:
like Exactly.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:03:36]:
A literal decade and and my relationship with video is interesting because I absolutely went through the awkward, like, vanity based right of passage of being like, but what if I have a booger up my nose and what if somebody says I'm fat? Well, both things have happened. Right? Like, I'm I'm still alive. So now in this form Of my business and and its current iterations still not doing enough video. Like, we're not I can see you. We're not according to this video right now, we totally could be, but we're not. But, you know, for me, it's not the shyness anymore, especially because, Yes. We are in the era of do it real, do it raw. Like, yes, what a glorious time to be alive.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:04:25]:
If people can film videos brushing their teeth. So fricking be it. Why not? But for me, it's like, I never my story is, at this point, as a more established business and as a constant content creator, My story is I don't know what else to say, which is a really goofy thing for a person to say when they're constantly talking like I am, but that's me. I'll be like, oh, my video has to have, like, a reason. Like, I have to have a, a show format. I have to, you know, have a running tagline. I have to have a blah blah. And you just reminded me already, like, a get ready video, a get ready with me video is not a fricking produced show.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:05:16]:
It doesn't have theme music, Like, calm it down, Annie. Calm it down.
Emma Tessler [00:05:21]:
Can be so simple. And, you know, like, what you're talking about is something that I think a lot of people experience is you feel like you have to think it all through and you have to plan it out and know exactly what you're gonna say at every point in the video and write out a script. And the reality is, like, that content could do well, but also it doesn't need to be that hard. Like, it genuinely can be, you know, I brought on a guest to my show a couple of weeks ago, and she said that some of her top performing content is literally just b roll of her doing her makeup. And she just sets up her phone to record herself doing her makeup, not talking. It's not a get ready with me. It's just like a sped up video of her doing her makeup, and then she puts text over it, and that's some of her highest performing content. And it's so funny because we think we have to put all this effort in, and, really, it can just be so easy.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:06:07]:
So when I think about the people whose videos I consume and consume and consume, I know inherently these folks are not hauling out the ring light and doing voice over and stuff. Like, my favorite Reels maker, A guy named Shabaz has a channel called Shabaz Says, and I adore him. And he does duets, normally making fun of, like, extremely rich people and extremely rich influencers or influencers, you know, pretending to be extremely rich, all of them. But every time he's in bed doing a duet, like, he's watching the video in bed, And he's responding to it in the moment. And now that he's, like, a a celebrity, I know more production goes into it than that, but that's how it started. He's doing duets in bed. Why? Because he's probably at home watching reels in bed. So I I love this idea that you're saying, Put your makeup on.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:07:01]:
Take your dog for a walk. Mike Mokalowicz is always freaking driving, which stresses me out, but it gets the video done. Why do we put Such a burden of complexity on our stuff.
Emma Tessler [00:07:17]:
Well, I think we all grew up and our early years of consuming content was very produced. You know, when you think about the early days of YouTube even back in, like, 2008, 2009, it everyone was super produced. You had the ring lights. You had the cameras, the digital cameras that we were filming on, and it was all you know, you had to put so much effort in, and we saw those videos and those creators do really well. And so I feel like it's just kind of in the back of our mind and this ingrained belief that we have to do x, y, and z in order to create, and without that, we won't be, quote, unquote, successful. But the game has changed. And the the creators that were creating in 2008, very few of them are still creating today. And those who are really successful today's, you know, kind of mega video influencers are TikTok influencers.
Emma Tessler [00:08:06]:
Right? And those are the people exactly like you're talking about, the ones who are recording from bed, doing get ready with me videos without makeup on, you know, filming their kid throwing up in the car, you know, like, the random stuff that happens in our day to day lives, and the reason it's successful is because it's relatable and it's entertaining. And that's really what we're all looking for more than anything today.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:08:28]:
Right. And you know what's really funny is that Back when I was, like, rebelling against reels when everybody started doing reels, and I was like, I don't want to do reels. I don't just wanna point and dance at things and pretend like it makes content. What I realized bugged me about early reels is that we were trying too hard to combine a video we thought people would wanna watch with, like, a layer of content on top of it, which is how we got everybody doing the point and boogie at their content, But, like, doing the same thing, and I'm like, I'm not doing the point and boogie. And then I was like, well, how can I capitalize on this? Like, how can I join this? And I realized it's like when I wanna dance along to something, I'm gonna dance along to something. And when I wanna teach something, I'm gonna teach something. Like, I it's okay. I can do both.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:09:25]:
I can have my let's watch Annie pretend to be a majorette and fall on her ass videos and I could be, like, look, a teachable moment. I didn't embarrass the shit out of myself like I thought I would. Right? Like and that could be the extent of it. Just as much as in the next video, I could be, like, here's 8 things you're doing wrong in a webinar. I'm not gonna dance through 8 things you're doing wrong in a webinar necessarily because that was trying to be overly complex. I was really trying to make 2 reels at the same time. Right? So how do we If we're taking this burden of production value and we're taking the burden of having this big complex, You know, beginning, middle, end, 3 part story, make the series, blah blah blah. If we're taking that off of ourselves, How do we know if our content's any good?
Emma Tessler [00:10:15]:
Well, there's a lot of data, right? Like every platform gives us the data from our audiences. And far too many people are creating content without looking at the data, which is a huge, huge mistake because that will literally tell you, you know, you might enjoy creating x type of content but your audience is really enjoying y. And it might not be as fun to create the y kind of content. But if that's the kind of content that's gonna help you see conversions, your time is a lot better spent on that type of video or photo rather than the x that maybe you enjoy 10% more, but it's not yielding you any sales.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:10:56]:
Right. We're not talking passion projects here. If you're like Right. I need to tell my great grandmother's story before she dies because it's important to me, and I'm gonna turn it into a really beautiful series of reels. Cool. Then take your time. But you're also not trying to get rich off grandma.
Emma Tessler [00:11:11]:
Yeah. Yeah. And I think there's a big distinction, you know, between does everything you do for your business need to be fun, or are you really approaching it like is Yes. And you say, you know what? I know this isn't, like, my favorite thing in the world to do, but I'm going to do it because it's going to yield the results.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:11:30]:
Yes. Yes. And it's cyclical. There are times you can lean more into fun and times you have to lean more into growth. And and sometimes growing is fun, and sometimes growing is not fun. Right? But at Quirkworks, at at my consultancy and I've talked to my dear friend Erin Baker who literally wrote the book on this called Joyful AF, The Surprising Business Strategy We're Afraid to first, Erin and I both agree, it's really important to think about what will be pleasurable at the beginning of a business, Then you actually have to go out and build the things, so you can't really focus on what's fun as much because you have to be looking at, you know, your ad spend and your list growth and your retention rate and your blah blah blah and your data and all that. And for a lot of people, that's not fun or At least not fun yet. I have a lot of fun with my data now.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:12:24]:
I did not at the beginning. Right? And then, once you find your footing, once you get more established, you can start to play in that space. Once you take up space in your lane, you can start to play again. Right? And then you're like, oh, I'm making a really good $50,000 business, but I think I want a little bit more. Okay. Well, what's gonna play to get to the next level? How are we gonna get to there In that spirit of joy and enthusiasm, okay, and then how are we gonna work to get there? And now we gotta turn down the volume on the play a little bit. Right? So I think that's so totally true because I think we're worried that I'm gonna be bored to death forever or life's gonna be a constant party. And it's like name a job that that's true.
Emma Tessler [00:13:02]:
Really though.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:13:03]:
Right? Like, I have friends who are wedding DJs who will tell you they literally bring the party for their job and it is not always a party.
Emma Tessler [00:13:11]:
Yeah, of course. You know, and I think a lot of the times we we start a business because we are really caught up in that passion that we have for it in the beginning. And then we get a little surprised by exactly what you just touched on where you have to go through I like to call them, like, push and pull seasons of, you know, sometimes you're pulling back on the fun to really push the the business analytics and ad spend and things like that, and it's not all going to be fun. And I it's almost like a little concerning if it is all fun because then, you know, you wonder, like, what am I missing here? Like, I think maybe it should be a little harder than this.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:13:46]:
They're I mean, I have the most fun, I think, at work of anyone I know. And I'm still a freaking workaholic with an autoimmune disease, people. Like, I still gotta, like, raise my rates and fire bad clients and negotiate with vendors that overcharge me, like, all that stuff doesn't just go away. Yeah. I just have a glorious time serving my clients and putting out content doesn't mean that, you know, we're recording this on April 6th, doesn't mean that I'm not, like, tax day. Of course, I'm like, ugh, tax day. I'm a business.
Emma Tessler [00:14:22]:
Yeah. Well, and that's the thing is if you find joy in the core of what you're doing, the core of your your job, of your company, then it does make everything else more fun than if you were, you know, sitting in your cubicle at your old job wishing that you could quit to do exactly what you're doing today. And I like to come back to that. You know? It's like I was so unhappy there because all I wanted to do was what I'm doing today. And so on those hard days where I'm like, I don't know if I can do this anymore because it is hella hard. You know, I like to think back and be like, you know what? I did this for a reason. I worked so hard to get to the point where I am today. Like, it, of course, would never be worth it to just throw it away because of 1 hard day or 1 hard week.
Emma Tessler [00:15:05]:
You know?
Annie P. Ruggles [00:15:06]:
Right. And it's not fixed. We're still going up, up, up, up, up. So as such, we're in a hard rut right now. We're in a hard slog right now. Cool. To your point, it's only one day that's a hard day or 1 week or 1 month, and and for those of us who have been doing this for years years, that is a blip. Right? But also at the same point, the when I was really sadly single back in the day and I would cry to my mom about it, my mom would say, If I told you that tomorrow you'd made the love of your life, you wouldn't worry.
Emma Tessler [00:15:40]:
Mhmm.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:15:41]:
Right? And I remember that really distinctly because my mom's point wasn't like, oh, it'll happen. My mom's point was like, you need to act as if it's already happening. Right? Because it was like, you know, today at point of recording is my husband's birthday. It's not like he fell out of the sky When I met him and he had never lived before, your clients are living their lives right now. They're there.
Emma Tessler [00:16:05]:
Yeah.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:16:06]:
The business lessons you're learning right now, you're learning right now. Everything around us, even if it feels like we're stuck, normally, the stuff around us is not stuck and, therefore, we don't know what tomorrow brings, so we may as well just do exactly what you said, look backwards, and say, here's why I'm here I'm here because I worked hard to be here. I'm here because I chose to be here, which is different than any other career path. Right? Yeah. And so Seriously. That's so huge.
Emma Tessler [00:16:37]:
Choosing it day after day too.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:16:38]:
You know? Choosing it. Yes.
Emma Tessler [00:16:41]:
Again and again.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:16:42]:
What does choosing it day after day feel like to you?
Emma Tessler [00:16:46]:
That's such a good question. I think for me, you know, it's the the dedication to that bigger vision that is like you know, it was the core of my vision when I was in corporate and I wanted to leave and build this, but then it, that vision, of course, you know, it changes and it molds year over year and even, you know, like quarter to quarter, it changes. So I always come back to that vision. And also I look at the team that we've built too, because that's such a shift in that I've always had a team pretty much, but today we have a team of ate. And so it's not just me anymore. You know, it's not just saying, oh, I I don't really feel like doing this right now. It's, like, no, you have, like, people's lives to support and think, like, a lot of pressure, but also it kind of motivates me in a way where it's, you know, it's not just you, like you have to think bigger than you and that is all related back to the, what is the business vision and what are we really working towards at the end of the day. So that choice to wake up earlier than I really should be and work later than I should be to get closer to that vision, I think, is something that really impacts my my choice to say, okay, we're gonna do this day after day, year after year.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:17:57]:
Yes. And you can cut yourself when you're overworking and slipping that's not attached to vision. Right? Like, the Q1 of this year, Thankfully, not the whole quarter. Let's say the 1st month and a half of this year, I just started taking out all this work, just nom nom nom nom nom nom nom, But it wasn't in line with my vision.
Emma Tessler [00:18:16]:
Mhmm.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:18:16]:
And so I'm, like, oh, I'm exhausted. And there are times where exhaustion is necessary, and there are times where exhaustion is workaholism and I looked at it and the difference is vision. Am I doing this Forward my vision or am I doing this because I need to keep working? And I'm like, I don't need to keep working. That's a good point. You know what I mean? Like, I don't Need us. And then also, I just wanna normalize the fact for our listeners out there that a team of 8 is a humongous company for people like us. Right? And I feel like when you go to business networking or you fill out a form or something, they're like, what's the total size of your company? And for a really long time you check a box that says 0 to 2. Mhmm.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:18:58]:
Right? And then
Emma Tessler [00:18:58]:
most boxes I see are 0 to 10. They kind of lump it all in one,
Annie P. Ruggles [00:19:02]:
they lump it all in and you're like, girl, what? Like, yeah, you know, oh, I you're a small business because you have under 500 employees. Yo, right? Make it a leap to having your 1st hire, your 2nd hire, your 3rd hire, each one of those is a leap and a team of 8, I mean, that may as well be a football team. Like, it's huge. Right? It's it's an empire. It's an it's a bus full of people. And I think We look at that too because now they're part of the vision. You start the vision solo, but then you share the vision. And even if you're growing the vision, now other people are supporting it.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:19:40]:
So similarly, when people like me are being really obstinate about vision, I think we also run into people who are very, very cautious about sharing their vision and growing a team. So as someone who has brought on a team, did you have some of that weirdness, or how did you navigate those first hires? Oh, my
Emma Tessler [00:20:01]:
God. Yes, I, this is such a good point because I struggled with this for so long. So when I first started, the 1st business coach I hired in twenty I started my company, like, 2015, but I didn't get really, really serious about it until about, like, 2018, 2019.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:20:18]:
That's right. I started in, like, 20 2009 ish got real serious throughout, like, 2012 ish. Yeah.
Emma Tessler [00:20:25]:
There you go. Exactly. So I hired my 1st coach in 2019, and one of the first things she asked me is like, okay, what's like your 5 year vision? What where do you wanna go? And I was like, excuse me? Like, I'm trying to get through the next week.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:20:40]:
You're like, I don't know what I ate for lunch yesterday. I don't know what I ate for lunch tomorrow. Also, what year is it? 5 years from now is what?
Emma Tessler [00:20:48]:
I Yeah. I have no idea what's happening. I was I was working, like, 90 hour weeks of the time just to, like, get everything off the ground, full time job, and it was it was insane. And so I she was like, okay, like, let's work on this. Like, this should be, like, part of our work together. And I was like, cool. Like, tell me what the heck this means. Like, I don't know what a 5
Annie P. Ruggles [00:21:07]:
year vision
Emma Tessler [00:21:07]:
means. And so we were kind of going through it and she was just kept, like, pushing back when I would say certain things. She was like, I just don't think you're thinking big enough. I don't think that you're actually being realistic about what you want here. And so I did a lot of work in my time with her, you know, obviously in just kind of thinking about like, where do I want this to go? And of course, that's changed so much over the years. But what I realized through that experience was that I was in a period of my life where I was actually It wasn't that I didn't know where I wanted to go. It was that I was scared to actually say it because if I didn't achieve it, I thought that would be like mega failure. Yeah.
Emma Tessler [00:21:46]:
So I didn't wanna set the vision because what if I didn't hit the goals, what if I didn't hit where I wanted to go in the next 2, 3, 5 years? Right? And so once I got has that hurdle of being, you know, okay, it's actually fine if you don't hit these massive, crazy, insane goals that most people never hit in their lives and that I actually have surpassed these goals in the last 5 years. But bigger than that, to go back to your point of how do you then share that vision, once you once you have embodied it yourself and once you have acknowledged that it's okay to dream really fucking big and have these massive goals that you probably will achieve because if you're an entrepreneur, you're probably an overachiever and you probably will yourself.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:22:32]:
Okay. Don't you dare come on my show and attack me. Right.
Emma Tessler [00:22:35]:
Never say something like that. But, you know, so many of us are just the kind of people where we hit 1 goal and then we're so fast to just look at the next one rather than even celebrate the accomplishment that you've just made. Mhmm. And
Annie P. Ruggles [00:22:47]:
so Yeah. Let's not speaking of which, let's not rush through that beautiful sentence. We're talking about you. Everybody right now, stop what you're doing and give yourself credit for the last thing you did because I guarantee 50% of you listeners out there have already forgotten about it and moved on to the next stress. I do it. Absolutely. Emma does it. I just met Emma and I know she does it.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:23:07]:
Right? So, like, let's slow down and value what I'm just said, which is slow down and appreciate yourselves and your accomplishments because they're not small.
Emma Tessler [00:23:16]:
Yeah.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:23:16]:
Hiring a team of 8 is not small.
Emma Tessler [00:23:19]:
Hiring a team of 1 isn't small. Exactly.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:23:22]:
Anyway, I interrupted you. I just didn't want him to miss that, but keep going.
Emma Tessler [00:23:25]:
Absolutely. No. It's such a good point. But then how do you share the vision with your team? Right? So now you've taken that step and you've hired a he and and that was another huge hurdle I personally had to cross because I was scared to even share, like, where do I want this company to go? What are our financial goals year to year? Where what kind of services we wanna add on to our, you know, suite and everything like that. And I in full transparency, I only started sharing that 2 years ago with my team because I was so scared to even, like, release it a little bit. And once I did, it was actually so great. It ended was nothing like the fear that I had it would be, you know, no one, one of the biggest fears I had was, you know, I'm gonna share financial goals are important to me as a company and, you know, it's important to most of us. And the team all contributes to that pie and that's how everyone gets paid.
Emma Tessler [00:24:15]:
And I think that sharing financial goals is an important aspect of that. And I had this embedded fear in my mind that, oh, I'm gonna share with my team our huge financial goal and they're gonna come to me and say, well, I want more money and I wanna raise. And I had that fear and it didn't come true. And that was kind of that little, like, reassurances along the way that you get when you start being more vulnerable with the people who support the company is really, really beautiful. And what actually happened was that the team started coming to me with new ideas and new concepts and ways that we can support our clients and ways that we can start hitting these goals that we have as a company. And it was a really beautiful transition. So if you're in that phase and you're questioning whether or not you should share your goals and the the vision of the company with your team, I really do encourage you to do it because you might actually find that they become way more invested in their role in the company than ever before.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:25:07]:
Yeah, it gives them ownership.
Emma Tessler [00:25:10]:
Exactly.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:25:11]:
Right? Corporate gives everybody an employee of the month plaque. We say we want your feedback and we want you to be part of what we're building, I mean, what you have 1 employee giving an employee as a month badge feels a little weird. Right. But but we can say, listen, I understand. It's kind of like what Southwest Airlines always says, like, we understand that you have many many airlines that you could fly, But we thank you for choosing Southwest. It's like, okay, you're a freaking marketing agency. There are many, many marketing agencies that people could work for, but they're choosing you And they're choosing your vision, so let them have some ownership of that and let them take pride in that, you know? And then, at the end of the day, if they're contributing and they come to you and they say, they want more money, they know that the company's making their financial goals because you fill them in on that, and then they can advocate for that because they know that they're contributing to that. But I think you're right.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:26:03]:
I think we're so shy about sharing stuff like that, that it it can harm our company's growth because we're being too tight lipped. Now y'all, we're not saying Open a vein and tell every single person all your business. Right? That's not what we're saying. But vision and goals and standards and values are important.
Emma Tessler [00:26:31]:
Very. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, and there's always gonna be those things that as a business owner, like you hold close to your chest and your team shouldn't know everything. I kind of look at it as like having a kid right? Like, I don't have kids, but I you know, you don't tell your kids everything. You're like, well, these things, they don't need to know. Like Right. It would cause more worry, etcetera.
Emma Tessler [00:26:48]:
But
Annie P. Ruggles [00:26:49]:
You can tell them that something sad happened. You don't have to turn on the news and make them watch it.
Emma Tessler [00:26:54]:
Like Exactly, exactly.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:26:56]:
Right. I mean, it's a need to know thing. Right? But I think it's so interesting because you were talking about vision and and you brought up when your 1st coach asked you About your 5 year vision, all of my coaches know I notoriously suck at vision Because I've spent so much of my life, a strategist that the second I let myself think bigger, I immediately Unintentionally, but immediately go well. Well, hey, hold on. How would I do that? What would I have to charge for that? How would I monetize that? Well, hold on, with that poach of the client. Like, I immediately get into not even strategizing, but, like, debunking the vision. Like, okay, that's not gonna happen Because da da da da da da and da da da da, and then that or sometimes I just immediately go into the rabbit hole of strategy for, like, strategy? There's a new word strategy for the positive, right? Where I'm like, yes, that's it. Okay.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:27:49]:
Let me pull this out and let me do math. Let me get a domain name and blah, blah, blah, blah, off the races. Right. So it's like, but even so that's not vision that's work. So I'm curious, did you have either the over strategizing your way out of it or the Overstrategizing your way into work version of vision, or were you not thinking that way yet maybe because you were still in corporate mindset? Why do you think visioning was so important and challenging for you early on?
Emma Tessler [00:28:19]:
I I agree. I mean, I definitely see what you're saying. I think there was a part of that because I it just everything that I could think of felt so unrealistic because I was trying to figure out how I would get there. And so, you know, at the time, like, you know, I was looking at my 1st 6 figure year and I was like, how in the world am I gonna make 6 figures? I don't make 6 figures in corporate. I was like 22. I was like, I don't Yeah. I barely make money right now.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:28:47]:
Right.
Emma Tessler [00:28:47]:
And I'm living in Manhattan. I was like, I have like $10 left at the end of the month. Like, I what do you mean 6 figure?
Annie P. Ruggles [00:28:53]:
Like, I'm already sleeping in a closet. They're gonna make me sleep with the broom. Like Yeah.
Emma Tessler [00:28:58]:
Yeah. So I think it was a lot of just feeling very the goals I wanted to have felt very unattainable because I had never seen it in action. In. Mhmm. And so once I started really, like, immersing myself in the, you know, entrepreneur online space, and that, of course, really, really blew up in 2019, especially like on Instagram
Annie P. Ruggles [00:29:19]:
Yeah.
Emma Tessler [00:29:19]:
And stuff like that, that that idea of seeing someone do it and knowing you can also achieve it was a really big piece for me personally. And I think the beauty of the way that the entrepreneurial space has advanced since 2018 is that we see people of every race, gender, age, you know, income level achieved things that seemed so impossible even 5, 10 years ago. And that was a big piece.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:29:48]:
Yes. And that goes back perfectly to what you were talking about with video, like, back in 2008, 9, 10 when I was starting, we were still very much in Early guru culture. Right? So we had we didn't even have Mel Robbins or Brene yet. We had Tony Robbins. We have the other Robins. We had Tony Robbins. We had some big time motivational speakers. And we were all still really reading Napoleon Hill Think or Grow Rich they could grow rich and maybe 1 business, but maybe we were all reading Who Moved My Cheese.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:30:21]:
Right? Like, it's not that the other things weren't out there, but it was not like all of this at all. And so it used to be I'm gonna be, like, the shiny glossy person I see on the stage. We didn't even have TED talks to aspire to really back then. Right? It wasn't like, oh, I wanna be the guy on the TED stage. It's like, I wanna be the guy standing next to Tony Robbins. That's what we had to model, or I wanna be one of the thought leaders on Oprah. That's what we had to model. That was it.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:30:49]:
Oprah was still on TV then. What? Like like on cable TV, not OWN, there was no OWN. Right? Like, Oprah had Oprah back then. So, you know there's this idea of I I have to wait until I'm ready to be on stage with Tony Robbins or interviewed by Oprah Or blah, blah, blah, and when I do, I gotta show up in a Versace suit and Manolos and freaking kill it, and it's like, woah, woah, woah, woah, woah, woah, woah, woah, woah. The point you just made, we're watching people, all genders, all creeds, all ages, all abilities do this shit. Think about when you're watching, dance craze and suddenly you're seeing it with amputees and multiple generations and little kids in a cancer ward in a hospital and football players and you're like, we are all living this experience, which is why something like a dance challenge is so appealing. We're saying we're in this together, we're doing this together. Look what we can all do, right? And the same thing with like, All the weight loss and fitness inspo, My Fitness Journey type things where you're like, look, watch one of my favorite things to do just because I love watching them strut, they're like, watch me strut my weight from 400 to £300, and I'm like, yes.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:32:04]:
I'll watch that. I'll watch that all day. Get out here. Right? Because it's like, look at her go. Look at you go. Business content can be the exact same way. We don't have to be Tony Robbins. We can sit there and we can be real, and to your point, that's what they want from us.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:32:20]:
They want modeling of, like, oh my god. That girl who cannot get her teeth to whiten no matter what she does Is running a multi 6 figure business and can help me grow mine, like okay.
Emma Tessler [00:32:33]:
Yeah, yeah, it really is the beauty of what it has become today where we have so many role models and I, it's it's almost the question of why would you want to be Tony Robbins today when there's so many other, like, ways you could be and when you could really just be more authentic to yourself. But it is, it is so incredible to have experienced the change in this space over the past 5 years even, it it has completely transformed. And so for the people who are kind of entering it today, it's a totally different landscape than you or I really started and especially you. I mean, you started a long time before I did. And it it's so much more encouraging, and I think there's just so much more opportunity out there now too because with TikTok and with, you know, Lemonade is coming onto the scene now and Mhmm. Shorts and reels, there's just so many things that you can do. So it's really all about, like, finding where your sweet spot is, find the content that really hits with your audience, and just go all in on it. Because something is gonna work, and you're gonna be showing up is you and your audience is gonna love it because of that.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:33:36]:
That's where the play comes in. Right? Like, let the data ground the work. But in the meantime, if you don't know what people wanna hear from you, then just get out there, film your life, and start having fun. And I need to take that advice more than anyone.
Emma Tessler [00:33:50]:
Yeah.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:33:50]:
Oh. Alright. Let's talk Netflix. Let's talk goofiness. So putting yourself out there, hiring, showing a vision, bringing together a team, I mean, I all of that already, it's so clear, but I wanna hear from you. Sharing a vision with someone, growing it, being on video, how letting people see you, what does any of that have to do With love is blind.
Emma Tessler [00:34:16]:
Love is blind. I mean, it has everything to do with it. Right? Like, What's so funny to me is that, you know, like reality TV started by or with people who are just looking to achieve a goal. Right? So Right. The 1st season of Love Is Blind, people go on, and it's really just because they wanted to actually find love and find someone and it wasn't based on how that person looked. Today, I mean, we're all very aware of the fact that people go on reality shows to become Insta famous or TikTok famous or whatever it is. Right. And it's very funny that people who are is typically a little vain because they're all about, you know, recording themselves, go on this show and are looking for quote unquote love with someone that they can't see until they get engaged with.
Emma Tessler [00:35:11]:
And it's just, it's extremely interesting to me because people from the show all become, you know, very big on social. Yeah. But this season in particular, the season that's, like, currently out right now or being released right now is really interesting because 2 of the girls on the show are, like, super mean girls. And I think all of our tolerances are just so low for mean girl behavior. And, they have both now obviously made social media apologies and talked about this behavior, but it's like, why you knew, you knew what you were doing when you were on it. Right. And then you knew this was gonna reflect on your performance and like your the the way people react to you on social. Yes.
Emma Tessler [00:35:56]:
It's it's a weird a weird season for sure.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:36:00]:
Also, like, weird flex. Like, I'm gonna have someone fall in love with me by being a total bitch. Like Yeah. The eighties called, they kinda want their gimmick back, like, What?
Emma Tessler [00:36:12]:
Yeah. It was it was rough to watch.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:36:14]:
And you're right. We don't have a high tolerance for mean girl culture unless those mean girls are really rich. Like, we don't wanna see basic mean girls. If I'm gonna see a mean girl, I need them to be a real housewife Kardashian rich, and even so, my tolerance is not what it was.
Emma Tessler [00:36:31]:
Yeah, exactly. And these goals were not that.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:36:35]:
No. And it's like, no, you're just a bitch. Like you're just a bitch. Yeah. And I feel that way that shows up in, on the online landscape too. Like not all people are your people and personal development for being a personal development thing and and marketing for making everybody feel shiny, look y'all, we got some bitches in this industry and it's okay. But what's more important is that our tolerance as a family for bitches is weakening, So you don't have to tolerate that shit. Right? Like there was a time in early internet where getting a hater comment was, like, the worst thing that could ever possibly happen, and I've gotten hate or stuff, and you don't wanna go in and just, like, you know, slap back at them or kowtow to them or whatever.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:37:23]:
But like we're seeing people now make entire videos based on the hateful comments they get, and they're hysterical and they're wonderful and they're owning it, but they're not being like, Oh, hold on. Let me just turn around and be a bitch to the Internet. Like, no one needs you to be a bitch on the Internet.
Emma Tessler [00:37:41]:
Well and, too, with hater comments, like, you are almost so it's very interesting. I love that you brought it up because we we do social media management for a lot of, like, really big brands who have big audiences, and like you're always going to get those people who are unhappy with your service or your product or whatever it might be. And we we have to kind of like train our clients on how to handle hater comments because everyone's first reaction is, oh, I'm just gonna ignore it. If I ignore it and I don't respond to you, like, it'll go away. Like, no one else will notice it, and that is so not the reality today. It's literally necessary, unless you're an influencer where, like, people are just commenting on, like, your eyelashes or your boobs or, like, whatever, some stupid thing, then, like, fine, obviously we don't need to engage with, like, trolls, but for a brand who's getting bad comments and bad reviews on products or someone's commenting and being like, I called your customer service 10 times and I've not gotten a response back, and then the brand says to us, like, oh, we just wanna ignore it. Like, don't No. No.
Emma Tessler [00:38:42]:
No. Like, that is the worst thing is to do
Annie P. Ruggles [00:38:44]:
Oh, okay. So important that you brought up. There is a big and this ties into love and it was fine too. There's a difference between hate and feedback And there's a difference between, complaints and customer service complaints?
Emma Tessler [00:39:02]:
Yeah.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:39:03]:
Right? Like, if someone's like, okay, so the meanest thing anybody ever said to me on YouTube was, why do I wanna learn sales from a fat girl? And I didn't respond to that. Right? But I'm also not, You know, this mug company not responding when I say my mug came shattered in 57,000 pieces and I can't get anybody on the phone. That you gotta respond to. Right? So for me going 1 to 1, if someone came on to my Instagram and was like, I bought your program and all the video links are broken, that I gotta respond to or if I really do a big mess up, if I misgender someone, if I, say something white stupid, which freaking happens, then I need to own that. If I make a mistake as a company, I need to own that, But I don't need to sit here and respond to every person that goes, she's got ugly hair. Okay. Cool. Thank you.
Emma Tessler [00:40:03]:
Right. It's like opinion or fact. Yes.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:40:08]:
Yes. Right? And I think that's the same thing as, like, opinion, fact, and perception.
Emma Tessler [00:40:13]:
Yeah.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:40:14]:
Like, what's your opinion? What's the fact? And what are you filtering? Like, what's your filter? Because that's probably what's standing between opinion and fact.
Emma Tessler [00:40:24]:
Yeah, of course. And I think the more that we're all on social today, the more likelihood we have of getting a hater comment and, you know, do you need to reply back to them? No. But like as a company, like, when they're talking about your service or your product, like, that does warrant responses. And, like, tying it back to love is blind, like, those girls did need to post an apology because their behavior was embarrassing and Yes. Like, just so unacceptable in 2023. So I think it was good that they posted an apology, but it also, like, their the their actions did harm their future of being influencers, because no one wants to like deal with that shit. And so it's just, it's a very crazy season but it's it's very entertaining, you know? That's what it's there for. It's the entertainment at the end of
Annie P. Ruggles [00:41:17]:
the day. I wrote down stretch yourself. Don't embarrass yourself.
Emma Tessler [00:41:21]:
Yes. Yes.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:41:22]:
I think that about Karen culture all the time where I'm like, okay. There's a way to go about this. And the way you're going about this is just making you look like an asshole, which, surely, is not the intent. Right? Like No. But no, I think that's so true. And, and so my question for you on all of that is like We in social media and and in our outreach and in our content, we are seducing our audience. We just are. We are allowing them to love us or hoping that they love us little by little so that they'll make a commitment to us if it's right for them in the future.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:41:59]:
Exactly like a love reality show. Right? So on Love is Blind, you've seen many, many couples go through this process and some of them stay together and some of them don't, and attraction is a big part of it was they see each other, but it's not the whole thing. Is there a rule, a rhyme, a reason, tip trick that we can learn from the best performing couples on the show about how to show up as yourself earlier even if they can't see you.
Emma Tessler [00:42:29]:
That's a great question I think it is just really being their true selves, like when they're in the pods, when it is audio only like this podcast, which is an interesting like, look at it because, when we look at business, right, like your podcast is an extension of your brand, just the just like the way that these people in the pods are an extension of who they are in real life when their their physical appearance comes into play and their hobbies and their family and, like, all of these extra little add ons. So the ones that are really successful are where they are true to themselves in the pod, where it's just audio and they say an act, the way that they do outside once they're everything else is involved, right? Yes. Because the ones that fail is like, oh, they come out of the pods and they meet in this like dramatic hallway experience. And then they're like, oh, like, you're just not who I thought you works, your actions don't line up with your with your words. And so Like how
Annie P. Ruggles [00:43:35]:
do I know if I'm being authentic? Authenticity is seamless. You're you and you're you and maybe you're facets of you, maybe you're different moods of you, but you're still you. No one's getting personality whiplash.
Emma Tessler [00:43:48]:
Exactly, and that's exactly it. Like, we always say to to brands we're working with, right, like if someone were to meet the version of you in the video that you push out to Instagram, and then they see you in real life, like, are they meeting the same person?
Annie P. Ruggles [00:44:01]:
Yeah.
Emma Tessler [00:44:02]:
And that is your like temperature check really on, am I being who I really am, or am I gonna be a surprise to someone because I don't have the filter on, and I'm not my most bubbly self as I am in the video. Yeah. In person.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:44:15]:
They'll find their own reason to be surprised. I'm very short. So that's what people are surprised out. They're not surprised about my personality. The personality is what they expect, but they're like, damn. You're short. I'm like, oh, I know, I surprised you. Alright, 2 more questions for you.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:44:28]:
The first one is Netflix comes to you and they're like, we are making, oh, God, A social media agency reality competition show.
Emma Tessler [00:44:39]:
Woah.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:44:42]:
What what does that even look like? What's the competition? You don't have to name it, you can, but like, what how are you competing? Who's competing? What are they competing for? What's the hook?
Emma Tessler [00:44:56]:
This is the most complex question I've ever been asked in a podcast interview.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:45:00]:
Correct. Correct. I ask the hard questions right at the end. Gotcha. Gotcha.
Emma Tessler [00:45:08]:
Okay.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:45:09]:
Where's all my journalism awards? Are you hearing this journalism gods? I'm asking the hard hitters.
Emma Tessler [00:45:15]:
You're basically saying, like, become a TV producer on the thought
Annie P. Ruggles [00:45:18]:
In a minute. Seconds. Yep. Exactly. Exactly.
Emma Tessler [00:45:22]:
Uh-huh. Okay. So I think the show should I'm not going to name it because I'm so bad at naming things. My company is literally named after the year I was born. Like I have zero creativity in naming. Yep. But the competition would be based on a combination of your sales skills, which no one likes to talk about.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:45:46]:
Duh.
Emma Tessler [00:45:47]:
And so, you know, in conjunction, the amount of clients that you're signing, kind of like I'm picturing top model, like, when you had to go to the agencies and, like, get some
Annie P. Ruggles [00:45:57]:
Yes. You have to do that look see day.
Emma Tessler [00:45:59]:
Yes. Yes. Yeah.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:46:01]:
Oh.
Emma Tessler [00:46:04]:
Yes. Plus plus then, like, your retention, right? So like, first off Yeah. Yes. How many sales are you making as an agent? Yeah. And then the service, and then do they wanna resign? Do they wanna stay with you?
Annie P. Ruggles [00:46:15]:
Yes. And that's the winning.
Emma Tessler [00:46:16]:
Not about
Annie P. Ruggles [00:46:17]:
how many clients you get. The winning is retention. Oh. Oh. Oh. It's like love them or list them, but it's like love them or keep them. Right? Like, love them or
Emma Tessler [00:46:27]:
keep them.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:46:27]:
Oh, I love that. Coming soon to a Netflix you hear you, reach out Netflix. But in the meantime, if our listeners wanna reach out to you and your team of fabulous 8, How do they reach out to you? How do they come into your world?
Emma Tessler [00:46:40]:
Yes. So our agency is 95 Media, named after 1995, the year I was born, obviously. And we are you can find us at 95media.co. That's our website for, you know, everything that we do. Our services, our team is on there, all the amazing things. I'm most active on Instagram, so our handle is 90.5.media, all spelled out. We also have our podcast as well, Stop Scrolling, Start Scaling podcasts, where we share a lot of like marketing tips and things, but definitely reach out. I would love to connect.
Emma Tessler [00:47:11]:
I think this is just such a fun, this is one of the most fun podcast interviews I've been on. So thank you for having me.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:47:18]:
Because I'm asking those hard questions. Those hard questions. Well, Emma, you've been an absolute delight of a guest. I'm gonna release you back to your glorious and very important day. But thank you so much for being my guest.
Emma Tessler [00:47:30]:
Thank you.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:47:32]:
Y'all, I will be back in just a second with my final thought and your homework for the week, but you can guess what it is. Well, hey there. Alright. So lately, I've been thinking so much about who is for you and who isn't for you. And I've been thinking a lot about reality TV. You kind of either love it or hate it. And sometimes it comes down to the show, like, I really can't handle big brother. It makes me anxious, but love after lockup is for some reason okay.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:48:13]:
We all have our own taste. And so today, your homework is to get repellent. Now I know that that sounds crazy and I certainly don't mean it in a reality TV way, you don't have to be mean or scream or shout or booger cry or destroy your own life publicly. No. No. No. None of that. But if we aren't being clear enough on who isn't for us, we're sending out too lukewarm of a message to the people that are for us.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:48:44]:
So today, I implore you, if there is a cause that is important to you, put it on your website. If there's a factor that's a big part of your life, a facet of your personality that you feel isn't incorporated, bring that into your personal brand. Put it in your work. Are you writing your copy like you? Are you talking about the emotional world that you were in when you were in their exact position, are you using their words reflected back to them So when they come to your website, you feel seen. Maybe love is blind, but websites are certainly Not. So let's make sure our online presence is consistent, compelling, and, yes, repellent. Can't wait to be back next week with another take on Love is Blind. Until then, go make money.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:49:43]:
Hey. Thanks for listening. If this episode kept you laughing and learning, I have 2 requests for you. 1st, make sure you hit that subscribe or follow button depending on your platform so you never miss an episode. And, also, more importantly, if you are looking for support, inspiration, networking, collaborations, Or just a chance to hang out with me, Annie p Ruggles, and our fantastic guests. Make sure that you are a member of our LinkedIn Community, the Legitimati. It is a weird and wonderful place. I can't even believe it's on LinkedIn, and we want you there.
Annie P. Ruggles [00:50:22]:
You'll find the link in the show notes. Big shout out as always to the fabulous dudes who helped me make this show, my producer and editor, Andrew Sims of Hypable Impact, my theme composer, Riley Horbazio, and my show art creator, Francois Vimeo. See you next time.
